Trump makes an enemy of China and the chairman of the Fed while the Amazon rainforest continues to burn, Trump gets a new primary challenger, and the next Democratic debate might take place over two nights. Then, Dan talks to Ben Wikler, the chair of the Wisconsin Democratic party, about the organizing that is already going on in the state.
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This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
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and Tommy are on vacation in berets making eyes with just ensure dough, while Trump watches DNA doing good her you, another Jetson Fund since Cross,
over its whether people- that's your true, that's your across her episode go to. It is
I don't know I didn't met about you go somewhere once and they show up in places. Yeah
I think so there was ALF wasn't gillikins I went into other ones. Are right, let's move on
They were gonna talk about new additions to terms long list of enemies, foreign and domestic. Now, as the chairman of the Federal Reserve Board J Powell, who definitely had a
Friday, will also look at trumps, escalating trade with China and its decision to skip a climate change, meaning that ETA tumultuous gathering at the G7 in France
then we'll cover the republican presidential primary, which is heating up dead. You think it's fair to say that is heating up
its hotter than it was before. So yes,
and the latest news around the democratic race plus will have dance interview with Ben Winkler. The new chair there was constant democratic party on bends efforts to organise in Wisconsin one of if not the most important states we can target in twenty twenty dantin. Oh there is one thing:
We wanted to mention sure so for all of our listeners who, in the bit, who are in the Bay area on September, sixteenth Halley in Ireland,
for racist with our friends from Serbian, be at their headquarters here, Cisco at that foreign resort, I'll, be interviewing hope fry who was one of the attorneys who has been visiting the immigration facilities,
its people, as in the pied. No racist
an amazing that is working to reunite the separate,
families an advocate for immigrants, particularly those who are suffering at the hands of the trunk administrations policies.
So for all everyone is an area hope you can join us. I will tweet out the invitation and more details later today, so go to that.
And then also on Thursday. I will be joined by Alison Master Monaco, who will be filling in four Dan on a very special Thursday pod, which should be fond, but let's starts with the latest on transfer
as trade, wars and twitter wars, because they're having very real consequences for the economy. Right now, you in John talked about it last Thursday about the kind of increasingly unhinge
musings of tromp around the economy, but on Friday it did get worse. We woke up to now
that China would be adding seventy five billion dollars in retaliatory tariffs. The FED chair J Paolo gave a speech were basically said that the trade war,
doing damage and the FED was not the right tool to fix. It. Trump found me perfect way to combine
These two news events he said quote my own.
Question is: who is our
Bigger enemy, J Powell,
were Chairman G Dan,
surprised to see the president's based
golly issue way, threats to the FED chair on shore
bitter, comparing him to a foreign adversary. It's I'm not even sure if it was a threat.
Pow, I guess, was a threat to jail. How also to China and both in
Haiti is. I saw that we and then I saw that it had been deleted. Like oh someone got tromp, they suggest that maybe it was a bad idea
China our enemy and make a suggestion about the FED share, but now he reposted moments later because he simply had a typo which is of itself. I guess shows growth from Trump: it was a type us, it wasn't a fit of peak
in a fit of peak. He went back and really made sure that he stuck the landing. It was an extraordinary. I do think it's look. I know we talk about from.
It's all the time, but it really is an extraordinary document because it contains
two very big parts of what Europe is doing it
once on the one hand, it is key
China, an enemy which is a big deal and then
the other hand? It is this personal politics of threats and harassment that he practices now against the
chair of the Federal Reserve, a position that is incorrect,
important in our economy, that, for a very long time, was treated as sacrosanct was treated as something at least in some ways: a political, whether or not that's true, because there was a recognition that there is a lot of
danger in getting our skies a partisan politics on the way the FED operates, given how important monetary policy is to the economies
each one at a time? Yet why is it a big deal for Trump to declare China an enemy
Yet it seems so quaint, like even thinking about this way, but there was this time or we spent all this time. Thinking in carrying
out the words that cannot allow the president's mouth but out of any person who could credit credibly be labelled as spokesperson for the United States government
that was J, Cartier, Josh, earnest or Robert Gibbs, or you know what to say,
impress Secretary in the White House in that anyone with
house in their title? Could cause market causing rational incident or markets to sink now
now. We know why, but the idea that
like we're very careful what we call other countries are you
and the people, and very specific with China to call it
There are an adversary or a strategic competitor, his enemies or the people go to war with an like weak
I'll decide that we don't care that Trump isn't so we should take seriously our littler either one but
people are China's see that didn't know. It probably is concerning to them that United States with the most power
military. The world's adds a Gazelle nuclear weapons thinks that
China is an enemy, and so it
like we, everyone has lasted off, we paid little attention to it, but these are the kind of things that have mattered before
we'll have to wonder whether they matter again. Yeah me there
This sort of now, though, with a system, seems to protect itself from trumps words, because we just don't take them as
seriously, but it does seem as though there was regret on the part of the Trump administration at the g7 trumped then struck a much more conciliatory tone and how he talked about China. How he talked about the chinese president, referring TIM, is being in a very capable
talking about the importance of making a deal. Now there was this sort of many kerfuffle, or
whether or not tromp had second thoughts about the trade war we can get to that. But do you think that, even in his forget the forget, the explicit discussion of second thoughts? Is there an acknowledgement that he went too far in just the way he addressed China during this meeting?
I think it. Yes, I think there is an acknowledgement, but I think he view
that the consequences of his statements, not in the context of U S, relations around the world, but in the
specific context of he knew,
its China to help him get out of this mess right. He is he banked. His
real action on this. These glowing assessments of the economy say he has given us the greatest economy in the world, even though the facts do not back that up by any stretch of the imagination.
And so he added he did it
where he pushed really hard
Sort of realise, maybe I went to forest or I'm gonna, walk back, but not because it's bad for the? U S, but because it's bad for Trump,
let's see where the other ways in which he seemed to escalate this feud with China. Over the weekend, he issued a series of tweets in which he quote here by ordered end quote. American companies to look elsewhere from China immediately
People were very concerned about what he meant by this if he meant anything at all, if it was a serious order, if there were some legal,
mechanism by which he could enforce this order. He then tweeted reference to
a law which he claims giving it gives him the authority to do things like this. It does
is there, someone made a mistake and teaching him the word here by cause. It seems as though here
added that to make it sound more
official? How big a deal is it Dan? That Trump is hereby
ordering american companies to look elsewhere of aid.
It says a lot about the moment wherein like it. When you talk about the specifics of the order there was
by given, by heavens, he doesn't have the authority to do this and no one seems to be immediately like shuddering their factories overseas, but his zeal like at sea a coupled ever dimension this. What is
is like. It must be noted that almost everything that Trump has ever sold with his name on it is made in China, and it still
to this day the chinese government is bribing the Trump family by granting trademarks to his daughter of Aachen drop, who somehow has a line of goods. There are still some China, while working
It has so there's just a general lack of self awareness there. The second part is, I do think we didn't like. I know he
can't actually order people to do it, but I don't know that
conversation around it in the media by other politicians fully grass the gravity of the moment, Amene Trump is at least a bare minimum. Trump is a thorough
Harry curious ahead. He hurry is ordering the american American companies, you stop doing business in China and word all this pretend like. Oh, he,
possibly have meant that it's not that serious. We're just go to ignore it, but if we don T like we are, we have gone to the point where we were neither taking trump seriously are literally and that's probably a pre,
bad thing for the country. Even if we just what it says about the person in charge of the country right now is that he slake he is the you're crazy uncle that you just dismiss what they say. The Thanksgiving dinner right there there is theirs to pieces.
I think, our why it's alarming, there's on there's the one
but you're describing which has just not taking what Trump is saying seriously because
Oh, the lie is murky, but once again, whenever tromp has sought to expanding
get a power in some way. This has been true. Around immigration has been true on a number of other issues,
There is immediately this look at the law and whether or not it's possible Trump treated out reference to a
that. He believes, gives him emergency powers to make these kinds of declarations over the economy, but the debate tensor terror.
Solve too well
the sort of probably not it would end up in the courts and everybody just sort of goes along with that uncertainty, as if that's an acceptable way
to imbue a single, very unfit person with it
this amount of power. The other piece of it is what it signals about
the trade war and whether or not he views it as something that will end soon so he's in beer. It- and I love saying that he's embarrassed, because it's just a city I associate with like
rank in Hemingway adventures. You know, but I
his Enver rigidity, riddle, advertisers catching up rewritten
of his Hemingway's. He has a great time
jump to dive into the sun also arises sort of like be in the place while experiencing what it was like in another time. But but so, as an american traveller, you know the ugly American.
Where the greatest minded generation yeah anyway, he is
birds talking about how he wanted to resolve. He wants there to be an end. He wants it there to be a deal while he signalling to american companies for his own politics and made because he also views this as a
trade war that will go on for a long time to start looking to stop doing
as in China, because of how extensive this trade war is going to be, but it also attempt
a right which is he's out of options. He his places fate
and of the Chinese. He doesn't understand them. He doesn't understand what their calculus is in here
get that he's on a eighteen month. Timeline right now, I m
we'll never stand for election again, it can be ensured as long as he wants, and it is like. You have
it. Sort of the going back and forth between threats and flattery goes to a point that you have made many times, which is Trump views this
the negotiation with a guy selling a marble for countertops right, which is he thinks he'd like
doesn't understand, he's doing one dimensional negotiations, which is, if I threatened them flatterers than threatening the father or, though eventually do what I want when
like the Chinese, have a thousand different interests at stake here, and he hasn't even begun to calculate what what what would get them to. Yes,
right- and there is also just this inherent challenge-
have as a democracy which is they're playing on a much longer timeline. They have cut, they have greater tools at their disposal. You know trump bristling at the fair
Trump trying to order american companies to move their factories. It does go to be the problem
This trade war that many pointed out from the beginning, which is China, has a much different set of tools in the United States, does and now an but he, but he drove in because you never can.
It had it at all heating consider heating costs.
Are the long term implications of this vitamin considered very much of anything. He just did what he said. You know it's a it's a it's a view he's had since one thousand nine hundred and eighty five is afro,
frozen an amber. This idea that you need to fight China, trade. He beat it
that if I was a good turn because they can, if I was basically the year, he stopped learning things you can t you take back it
all of his views are sort of the views of an old rich guy in New York from the eightys. There is a way there is a bookmark. On page thirteen of the very last book he tried to read- and it is very
much where it was left in nineteen. Eighty five Dan before we move on there was a very important question-
That was apparently on the minds of many
leaders, this is what trump reports. The question I was asked most today by
a world leaders who think that the? U S is doing so well and is stronger than ever before happens to be. Mr President, why does
american media hate, your country so much. Why are they rooting for it to fail Dan? Do you believe it was Merkel who said that Mccrone who
Who do you think is the one who ass such a pointed and honestly
hitting question for all of us to consider wicked was
other most s question president Trump. Why are you so awesome
Oh he's such a bad wire, because he is
taken a why that is.
Though obviously not true, but he's also, there's only see
other people, the G7, only six other people who were asking the question. So I
the pretty easy to prove that he is full of shit. I mean, I guess, Boris.
And could have in some way asked? The question is not inconceivable.
Yes, I guess, if there
one person who would do it. It would be the other
authoritarian Wanna be anti immigrant world leader with bad hair of a once great nation. Let's talk about the g, seven for a bit the times as
I thought they'd delightful, delightful, writing out of the g7 ever so gingerly as if to tee.
And not to rouse the Americans, well known temper, the other group of seven
you're such a nudge him towards their views on the pressing issues of the day or at least register their differences, while making
short around them in a french crap of flattery, as they know he prefers, though I dont believe he has ever allowed a crape to enter his face.
Now, like a small child, he will lick the filling out man
Do you think that we talk about Trump too much like in our lives like deep? But what what do you think we would have talk,
bout for days on end during this period at Hillary Clinton one would we have had other Hobbes. Would you think we would have taken up
no painting archery. What do you think
of climate change cured cancer. Sir watch more better tv
here on earth? So so
there was a signal event at the G7. That's worth talking about that, I think captures this tension between the rest of the world and Trump. At this event, there was a meeting to talk about climate change and
The fires currently ravaging the Amazon in Brazil in part as a result of the populace government that has taken power there and their disregard for environmental rules to protect a part of the world that sucks up carbon dioxide and provides oxygen for the planet. So a big,
your trumps skip the meeting, claiming that he was busy because he had meetings
Other leaders, like Merkel, and
Modi in India. However, both of those leaders attended the meeting Dan. Why do you think Trump skipped the climate change, meaning because he scared
every day. He like this has happened a couple times at various geese.
In surgery, twenties or
or you eh General Assembly's, where the topic as climate change and the right
of the world agrees that climate change is real
It's only one half of our to procure stare virtue, party particles of America who refuses to believe the climate change
Israel, and so it it gonna be uncomfortable and he seeks to avoid confrontation, so we hit out in his room and washed and on a fox, if I assumed whatever was on Fox news at the moment and it probably
like it's kind of funny, that trunk is such a giant was an for. Someone who talk so tat you can even defence is indefensible. Views on climate change by the world is would, as you point out literally on fire. The role and with United can even show up to the meeting.
I mean it's like what is all said and done if we ever get trump out of here and reverse some of this policy to give her some executive orders, the the most damage to Trump will do will be the opportunity cost of the four to eight years of dealing with climate change for eight years. We don't really have and and the abdication
of american leadership. You know we saw Trump basically issue, bromides, encouraging Brazil to tackle the fires in suggesting we'd help as if this is a purely natural disaster, Brill. As Brazil as unequipped to fix, as opposed to something that the government
is actively encourage and we ve seen other leaders like like Mccrone in France and other step up to try to pressure Brazil into doing the right thing and the times reported that even as Trump
Talked about how much comedy there was at the g7 how well
countries were getting along by the way is always so uncomfortable how much he personalized
even these moments about how much basically describing it as a good
time is not so important. It's important! We had fun here and really really at a blast. We wanted the meeting to last longer we could have. We could have talked
another hours if that, that's as if these personal relationships or that important it's based on his personal affection for these people, but behind the scenes Trump administration officials were criticising the g7,
in France, for focusing on niece issues, one of those
These issues was climate change it s
the dish issue that matters to the entire fucking planet, so Dan. If there were an american president's
period if there was someone, if that, if that job was filled appropriately by a fully fledged full fledged functioning person, what would that president be doing differently about the crisis in Brazil? I think about this all the time, because when we work in the White House, your constantly face with crises in you all in you often have a limited set of tools at our disposal to deal with it, and we were working on these veto people than the government. The whales work on these things all the time,
just wonder sometimes what the people in the trunk White House or doing other than reckoning his tweets into policy, but I would like in this situation right, so you have what you have as you have a fire in Britain, the Amazon. This threatens the world right. It threatens climate change at the everything you have a corrupt, essential to simply a dictator in Brazil who see is unwilling or unable to deal the situation here.
With the United States to us it would have been not a meaning unites, escaped. It would have been a nice. I chaired the g7. The present would be on the phone with leaders,
around the world is with the other e g, seven nations, but also in the region. Marshall links uproar in putting pressure on Brazil to do something and instead were just sending tweets and it it
it is like this, like a lot of what's been going on in sort shrubs,
de meltdown over the weekend as justice really crystallization of what has happened to America's leadership role in the world under tromp ad.
The consequences of it are seriously assaults whatever this morning that Bethany Frankel of the real housewives of New York's of New York is chartering a plane to go like a tanker plain to go spray. The fight.
There is in some areas and right of indigenous people, and people are cheering the fact that she is doing it, because it is great
but also because no one else is doing it right, like we actually need people from the cast of Bravo. Reality shows to step in and do the things United States government would do, which is scary
I mean look, they are the real heroes. You know in a dark time. Well, it's also. You know.
Franklin forward in the Atlantic about the ways in which these fires are more dangerous than weapons of mass destruction that that, basically, this incredibly valuable global resource,
being threatened by this one government, and you can imagine a
order led by a by an american president. Who cares about this issue and cares.
That working with allies on this issue coming up with a way to think about these really important questions about these incredibly precious global resources. At a moment where scientists tell us we're at a hinge point
as to whether or not we can address climate change. You could imagine american president leading not just on this one issue, but in thinking about these broader questions about resource use about about Agriculture
and by the way, the fact that there is a populist in Brazil is just another reminder to that, this scourge of right wing populism is
genuinely threatening the health of the planet. Its is
I mean there there's, obviously, connections between why we have a populist and Brazil. A populist in the United Kingdom have is nice. It's all the same time,
but it is this. You couldn't pick a worse time in: U s his in world history, to cede some of the most important, influential governments either
diplomatically militarily or in the case of Brazil bitterly
in charge of the world's oxygen supply to have these sort of knuckle heads at the switch you know at this moment. Yet it is worth remembering too, that this abdication of american leader
as many have pointed out as Joe Biden,
pointed out that if we can get tromp out of office, we can make this.
We have time an aberration, not because we don't not because we view trot
as an aberration bubble, because we can signal to the world that we recognise the mistake of tromp, but if we affirm him in a second term, the opportunity to send a message to the world is gone,
had a very critical moment. No one has ever be more popular than they first president who is it Trump at like the G20 or the United States,
sorry about your carrying a man, I'm one of those letters before we leave this climate discussion
there was one other story that I do believe we have to discuss. I will read from an axiom posts that I think come caught. The world by storm shall say
president drop as adjusted multiple times to senior homeland security and national security officials at the explore using nuclear bombs to stop hurricane
from hitting the United States it goes on.
During one hurricane briefing at the White House. Trump said I got it. I got it
I got it, I got it. Why don't we knew them according to one source who was there? They start forming off the coast of Africa as they're moving across the Atlantic. We drop a bomb inside of the hurricane in it disrupts it. Why can't we do that? The source added paraphrasing the
in his remarks as how the reaper reacted. The source recall these heads,
things are the effect of Sir Lucan to act,
are you can see you concerned am concerned
concerns about ay, ay and atomic hurricane?
Barreling down on the EAST coast
flooding our cities and leaving them covered in radio active debris?
As I am a little bit, I'm a little bit concerned is the word
it's. I did not realise, because I have never seen these films where this is actually the plot again. Apparently, I've also never seen shark NATO and shame on they create.
Of shark NATO who have painted a terrible idea into the minds of our feeble president. Am, I do think. Nuke
The hurricane capture something essential about Donald Trump as a person, because he doesn't believe climate change exists, but the worsening hurricanes Hetty
For us he does have a plan to make them radioactive and kill, kill more people. He did he
just try to put itself in the world where you're just you're a normal person you're reading Facebook going through
see what's happening in the world and you catch opposed from your uncle
subject. Who has this idea in response to some story about hurricanes coming
Do you immediately call a family meeting to discuss this post or like what like? What is the reaction to it and how concerned are you that this is coming
I'm a person who actually has the ability to watch said missiles, not just pontificate about the other does feel. I guess this sort of thing were several members of the family kind of speaking hush tones that you know it. You know I'm obviously you know he's alone, all the time you now Sarah Bath left, he just there
and I was just there alone saving these crazy ideas, I'm not sure what to do and how much we underwater means it and how much you mean that we need, if we just need a check on it more.
Because we're gonna, we're going to draw up a chart in one of us is a good go there every other day of the next month, just to make sure that uncle insane
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Flash crooked media. Let's move on to domestic politics, the republican primary has entered a new phase. There is a new competitor, his name is Joe Walsh and he is going to bring the fight to Donald Trump Dan. How worried do you think? Donald Trump is and should be about
former congressmen twitter persona. Previous quote, Obama is a muslim end, quote type guy running against from.
I don't think from should have any fears about losing their I'm. I don't think there's any chance that Joe Walsh is going to beat him may trump as a ninety.
Six percent approval readying whenever from republican voters, the Publican
hardy just to make sure that he wouldn't lose denomination cancel the South Carolina primary, which is the primary.
Beware: conservatives! You generally have the best chance to knock off and incumbent May was problematic for George HIV.
Rushed back in the day and so he's not going to lose the nomination and we shouldn't get. We shouldn't think that that's going to happen, but
I do think he should be more worried about some. Unlike Joe Wall should then either William Wild or John William Wealth is a do face. He is a government seduces. He was on the third party ticket last time,
but he has no constituency in America, let alone the product Party John K, sick is more, is an affable?
I guess guy he has some popularity. He did a few things that were not terrible in Ohio, he's a CNN contributor
but also no constituency in the National public library judiciously.
First person who is making an attack on trumped from the right and that at least I think it's interesting and could have some political consequences down the line that he was on.
Said the Sunday you honey BC this weekend or in the Sunday Show Circuit and he attacked from four, not building the wall and not making Mexico pay for the wall in
that? I think like I was intrigued by that image seeber. That goes because that could have that could lead to the subject of some political repercussions for Trump down the line
not in a primary but in the general election. So there were some effort on the part of walls to gets George Conway involved in this
costs and to me that signal that this is very much a publicity move,
for Joe Walsh, because obviously getting George Conway
involved is not about appealing to voters in swing states it's about finding some one who will antagonize Trump the absolute most. You know there is out there.
I feel like there's two conversations happening on Twitter about out Donald Trump facing a new report
in challenger, one was kind of it and are they
finesse, but at least a willingness to say. Well, it's good at this person is doing this. It is
good that a former right wing person, even a heinous right wing person, is willing to tell the truth about Trump, even if it's for their own purposes, even if it's to build a brand, even if it's ultimately to fund a right wing,
pain for the house, and then there was, I think, I'm more cynical take when I think
largely agree with saying this is it this is a pure.
We self aggrandizing move to help one person gain traction and find a way to make income in me, you know commentary economy we have built after we closed all factories
I take an even more cynical take on this lake, this debate, these sort of the ant thee.
Don't normalize Joe Walsh debate had earlier? No, they dont nor Maestro Walsh argument has been led by Shannon Watts of mobs demand to summon. We support a lot here.
Consumers can really like an. She is right. Job losses, disgusting, he is discussing human being, is a spouse. Disgusting races views. I think it was a one point: was a sandy hook, truth or offices and horrible things about Obama really discussing person, and we should not take his conversion to Anti Trump ism seriously.
We shouldn't like we have the same thing: anti skirmishing right. These are Griffith authors who find a market opening they
went to it to make money, and when that closer look for another one scar,
and scary movie wrote a book. He wrote a book about tromp a pro Trump book.
In October of twenty eighteen like it is why
thing to have a change of heart. You can
write a book and then
six months later, say the opposite of the book. It's too quick
like I can almost by someone who supported tromp in the election under
this idea that he would somehow be.
More serious president or would not like that was a student position to have them, but you
if you decided after a month or two of trumpets, president like this, is not a good thing. He is even worse than we thought neutral, but not that he was
just as bad. In September of two thousand,
eighteen October whenever Sir Majority, because he has
it was operative skirmishing drift to support trump and
network closed, he found another Griff was it was anti tromp right. It is a better way for him to get on television attacking Trump, then
Praising Trump washes the same way
even more cynical take on it, is I like I,
Joe watches disgusting. I do not take him seriously. I do hope.
That there are some segment of voters who.
Get to see your washes message right, who are
conservative, but have questions about tromp like you. Could
either the universe is of real,
Public and voters who could be driven,
away from Trop, maybe not to vote for a damn
rapid, maybe into a third party camper? They may decide to sit the election out if because, if they were
most to an argument about tromp, which no one is making in washes making, so I
like. I do think there are some political upside to it, but I think we need to
We should be this way with all of our the sort of never tromp universe right, which is just like. We may agree with what the crystal says about Trump now, but
every other part of bill crystals. Just because the broken clock has stopped in the right place for right now doesn't mean we should support these people. Nothing Joe Wash falls in that category, but
Like my imaginary, superpower would be completely above board and on occasion, anything but another. Imagine
or real super back. Who was showing some target universe of conservative or republican leaning independence, a conservative anti trump argument? Would it
Did you see what impact I can have an election? As always, we end this segment by wondering where
our billionaires are, with the delightful above board, super packs and less delightful. Subversive super packs that we see
We don't want, but secretly do one other note on what's taking place on the right trump has increased
we been directing criticism at Fox NEWS. I want to spend too much time on this, but what do you make of this? He has been
He was seemingly annoyed that Donna Brazil showed up on his television because he associates Donna Brazil with a.
Very overblown attack he levelled against currency and then for a long time around debate. Questions for Hillary Clinton during the primary, but it does see me, is in some ways frustrated with the way Fox has been covering him. Would you
Yeah, I think he is feeling anxiety about it. I think it's emits echo
like Yahoo. Tribe is finally being atomic anxiety that pundits have false.
Reject motors gets hit
He is so I think there is
these nerves and he is trying to circle the wagons, and this is
When is it he watches fox too much, because facts is so proud, tromp that you really have to watch it for hours upon hours upon ours too. Fine, a glimmer of anti Trump ISM add because he's always watching
he manages to find it. I would love to see some reporting on how the folks at Fox are reacting to this, because
They may have had their wagon to tramp in he and like it, help them twenty sixteen to get on board with from very early.
And I don't know where they would go if they left Trump by earth. Eight of these voters
Fox, but there must be like if inside you know, there is not a good new like an actual true news. Division
somewhere invokes the people who keep
when he flowing. I won't. I would love to know what their reaction is too trump attacking them like. Is it like? How nervous does it make them right? You know it, it strikes me, as you know, look he lashes out wherever he fell.
And someone who has said something that damages his ego in some way, whether at the head of the the FED or its fox
It does seem to me that targeting Fox is one of those places where he can actually be far more effective. I dont know what personally attacking the chairman of the fair.
We'll, do other than put up put a kind of battery acid panic and not in the you know in the stomach of his loved ones. But it seems as though he thinks going after foxes and to make them just a little bit more circumspect before they tell the truth to their on to the audience their respect. So very much. Ok, let's move under twenty twenty this week is the deadline to see who will make the September debates as of right now, ten candidates,
qualified one candidate Tom style is one pull away. That could be something he hits wilder recording could be something he doesn't hit if, if Tom's dire gets the qualifying pull the fourth pole
he needs hurry qualified on donors. That will mean a b c will go to a tuna debate with sick
on one night and five on the other Dan I dont will sometimes
I go back and forth? I obviously have a personal interest in there being a one night debate because love it or leave it as on Friday in New York that night, but
when I actually think about it. Whether or not there is a kind of lengthy year conversation over two nights among smaller group,
versus one night in which all the candidates are on one stage are not totally shore, which is better for Democrats writ large, where you think I
go back and forth to this to so once the Dnc like this has been this lingering question among a lot of people about. If it was eleven candidates, would they just add another podium and just do it in one night and the Dnc was
last week that they would make it too in my initial reaction was ugh. Like I
to see I want to see the you know the leading can
I'll say it. I want to see Warren in Biden on the same stage or worn and Harris on the same stage. Answer you
compare them, and maybe there will be some interaction by
that was my initial reaction and then there was lake I thought about
for a little bed and which happened,
and before I tweeted, and
I actually I die no data, they don't really writers yourself, hey hey you tat. We would ever you want without thinking in its two thousand and nineteen he had never laid. There are no consequences, but I
I now in hindsight think that my two nights would be better like it is September of the off here like this is not like. We don't need blood sport be where we have put the candidates onstage right now
one of the two front- runners walk without the Fucking Committee. Right like it would be interesting to see
we don't know what I meant.
Our committee is what is narrative if you're too,
reports for which I live. It's a classic eighties, cable, buggy.
I don't think I've ever seen blood sport all the way through. I only know it as a movie Donald Trump watches on his airplane, but fast forward to the fights the ship with the youth
Only like ninety minutes long, it is basically all its very eighties. It's all fights and musical montages. It's like an or any dialogue. Karate Katy dialogue he's gone, he's gone this head, but anyway
so I think it would be interesting to have five Fino five or six candidates. Honesty.
Together having a longer conversation, and hopefully
ABC. Could you know
extend the norm. Outta the length of answers or get more topics, and so I gotta think we
it just hearing more from the candidates now would probably be useful. A
So I re I received my original to it, but I will not delete it. Good,
and don't apologize ever
there is. I am shocked, but I think that
I agree now I, as I might my actual view, is it does
really matter that much ultra, but I do agree that I would rather
longer more substantive conversations over two nights, and I say that not because I think these substantive debate,
will mean there's some more likely shake up of who supported versus who's, not but because the kind of cattle called it
we ve been having don't seem to be moving the needle that much anyway, and so a good conversation is just a better outcome, because we'll just hear more substance will have a richer, deeper policy conversation as we move through these issues. The reason I say that is so John Harwood reported this in July. Actually, then, in late April a pole found
that just five candidates, Joe Biden, Bernie Sanders Elizabeth Warren Kamel Harrison peep outta judged you. Seventy nine percent of the democratic vote six weeks later before the first round of debates it through the same seventy nine percent this this was from July after the first round just before the second acquitted Viet poll showed that those few those five drew. Seventy eight percent and I
when in look today. That's basically where the vote share is now, but over the course of these several debates, the top five candidates have continued to be splitting around seventy five to eighty four eighty percent of the vote. Now things have moved about
between those candidates. But this notion that getting on the debate stage and finally, having adopted
unity to be seen by millions. More Americans will fundamentally
if the dynamics of the debate that just hasn't happened yet we're thinking about this, I think in the wrong way, which is worth seven eight nine months whatever it is not for me, I will carcasses and
like the debates, are part there there, the journey, not the destination, to a decision right so over,
The course of time they're gonna get to see these candidates. I think twelve times between now and I guess, through the early primary caught contests and people will get
they make the receipt like that, like their learning a little bit more, both good and bad about all these candidates, and then there will be an opportunity for the races chef like on Thursday when we die.
I have this conversation about how why the race hasn't changed. You know I went look back at the gallop at the polling from this point. Two thousand and three
which is probably the most analogous democratic. Primarily to this one and jolly rules leading in the polls. John Kerry wasn't forth into cup, was it
second or third, and so there was you don't like we're
still really early in this and people are learning and they will either
shift among those five or they will move to some want one of those other candidates at some point, and we don't need to think we don't need to debate in the summer of the year before to tell us who's going to be the nominee. We just wanted you to know who the Lord more information now. Another debate that has been taking place inside the Democratic Party is whether or not there should be a climate debate. This weekend, the Dnc held a vote, the climate debate
there will not be a climate debate according to the d and see Dan, this seems to bees or of their. The activists are furious about this in a lot of democratic voters are, are angry about this out of the candidates have come out in favour,
of a climate debate J easily, I think let that before he dropped out, let the charge on this because he was running on a climate platform. Why do you think the d, a and c is at odds with activists
I think, some of the more energetic and fervent parts of the base over a climate debate right now,
Thank you D. Dnc is throw
all of this doing the best in a terrible situation and so the from their respective. As I understand the argument against is not an argument against climate debate specifically, is an argument for an endless series of debates that take the candidates off the
the campaign trail and take it put them in a studio, because it's not just the two hours of the debate, its also the days approved for the debate and
they're trying to find this balance like when we ran in two thousand and eight there were like dozens of debates. It was a huge time. Saki was very bad for the campaign
in two thousand and sixteen there were not enough debates, they overcrowded and sixteen. So this is sort of thee, the just right,
approach there doing in their fear is, if you say yesterday
I'm at how do you say, no two guns right so, let's say all the activists who, after what happened this pass, we cannot pass over Dayton or any
I'll or Bob's demands were coming other and say we want to debate on guns. How do you say? Yes, the climate? No one guns, how do you say? Yes, the climate? No one of criminal justice
air, so they're trying to hold the wine. So I would make two points
on this one is the key.
Pains are acting as if they have no leverage here and if the front runners, not genially, who
Miss but had not. But if, by
war in Budapest?
Harris Sanders decided there was gonna, be climate debate. There would be a climate a bit like
in two thousand and eight the front running campaigns of Clinton Obama in Edwards, who was a person american politics at one time
and with the campaign manager, would help sort of navigate all the
forums in debates together, because the
If one of them did it all three of them had to do it, and if none of them did it, then it would happen, and so the firm,
could decide to have the climate debate, but they have decided not to do that and so
it's the Dnc's fall, but right now out of the campaigns want to have their cake and to say we are for Friday eight.
The Dnc you to hold me back that he is. He said we can't do anything, but they could do something if they wanted to write. It does seem right that the interests of the candidate is to be for every debate humanly possible, while hoping some other external for
prevents them from having to leave a trail again and again is also true that there is going to be a climate change forum, so that is also not,
today to hear all the different candidates on this issue at Length- but I do think you know
I think one of the problems we are having is that there is a kind of objectivity to the rules which I understand, but just feels quite frustrating to people that that wait a second. What are these qualification terms? Why? Why is why is Tom style able to get so close, but someone like Michael Bennet isn't like I understand these rules were drawn up before there were candidates, so that they'd be fair, but is it actually serving the candidates best giving over all the debate
Does this time has been working? What you think I just I don't really know
you're obviously flaws right, the donor, the grass
its donor threshold, will seem like a great idea at the time, but it has become
rule where the campaigns have had to spend millions of dollars at a loss.
Ass to try to meet these thresholds in so there.
Unintended consequences, although I just cannot come up with a better process
right. I don't know why it- ITALY, certainly just a
nine grass roots, don't donation number contribution number would be banned right. So were your reward people who raise money from large contributors? That would be
the pulling should manner in some way, shape or form because, like Robin
We have done what he would have been worse if there had been if there had not been a twenty candidate cut off for these first couple debates- and we had three nights of debates-
Did you just getting fewer eyeballs or less interaction, and so the I don't think there is it
ideal way to do this. I think this is the right way to do it. I would be cautious about tat,
do over correct for some of the criticism going forward to make it harder to get into the debates. Adding. That would be a mistake.
Or I will leave it there before. We wrap up another important developments, DEN shant chance by sir.
He was a White House press secretaries is a sort of us, is a job of great prestige. It is a job that
has been Lion Ized in film in television, the voice of an administration standing at the podium people worked really hard to get that job. They achieve its. They go onto to incredible things. Ah, do you think Donald Trump was being sincere when he praised Sean's by Sir for going on dancing with the stars
I too think Donald Drivers being sincere, and I think you tweet he sent that we because he knew
would make transmitters life harder and torturing.
HANS by Sir is other than golf and Washing Fox NEWS, one of trumps few poppies
I remember in the early days when she went transport,
It was with a wooden transmitter, still work there. In b, there was actually White House briefing that trumpet
clear his schedule watch
briefing in his office and then demand that chance by Sir come up there and then give him basically question by question critique.
It's all while making fun of tailoring of his suit.
This is why I would also I would take issue. I take issue with the phrase clear his schedule
here too dvr at least two fox shows at that time. So something had to give to make one zero
went about this very go though it is so. The one thing that was always fastening about chance by Sir is when he was pressing her Terry kind of war, his pain on his face and his tailoring, but there was a kind of grew
a gruesome expression- he would draw one standing at the podium because of the space between the person he thought he was going to be and the person he had to be by defending doll tromp. The kind of the distance travelled between being press secretary for different president and being press secretary for this president, and it was fascinating to cease by sir, cannot do this round of prayer
sang. I just think that should be a politics free zone because they're still, this desire on the part of people like Sean Spice are to be treated normally.
But that even now they're still this feeling like
they know deep down. That Trump is not a legitimate president in any meaningful sense that working for him at
have an asterisk that you're, not a press secretary or Trump press secretary, and it seems to me that the response he's getting
This is a reminder that as much as they want that to be true, that's just not the case. You can't evade response
ability and only take the parts you want like the fame and apparently the ballroom dancing. What do you think the calculus was and chance by sir
to do this right, like dancing with the stars, is a refuge for Beavis celebrities trying to resurrect it is where the Castle Jersey Shore goes. When Jersey Shore goes off the
and so like he, I presume shots by sir, just on the report
wicked speaking circuit selling access has
capacity to make money in other ways are used
that are you I don't know, that's what you're saying being
think about receiving about Amano going around Republika Politics leg yeah, but think about that Mart like
Who wants Sean spice or to come speak at their event, if you're just a
like normally administration right that there would be like trade groups non partisan organisations that might be
somebody from administration to come, give them the lay of the land in Washington people pay for their privilege. It is a long standing in this is basically
version of what Hillary Clinton dead. When she gave high paid speeches they they want the best person they can get to talk about politics, but you might not want chance by sir at your event, where you talk about the latest in, I don't know like retail, packaging or health administration, because
controversial? Nobody believes he has any influence. Nobody believes he still talking these people so
people trying to buy their way to trot they're, gonna Lewandowski, they're going to other people? I I wonder if it's not me
complicated than the book didn't sell, you know,
The book was interesting because he both men like he did,
it is like. No one has played their hand worse than Sean by syringes hold right like
So the people who got fired guide no showed
that Trump Super packs and are just making you know just getting wandered, cooked Alvarez put in their pocket just an outside this
Just be the reason why pay design India so trot, so they do that
or they wrote, and
I try way just so people no sort of dollars. I thought you man, I thought you might like. I dont you meant coke dollar
and I realize you meant coke dollars. You notice
Kayo seed. Annex K, K icy age, not maybe they're getting those ads.
Like or they either road. These like typical conservative selling books, are trampled tweet about the acute you know about the fake press or you know,
Russia, fake russian collusion and Witch Hunt, whatever else or they wrote tell us, enchants Miser managed to do neither he wrote and he did not write a book there.
Please that's wrong people, but he also was it didn't, have the courage to tell the truth either and so has been living in this area.
Sort of sad purgatory of he can't figure out how to get himself out of the box. He put himself
I believe it is very, I will be very clear. I do not feel sorry for this
Now is a growing sense, yet adult who bade a sea
of choices that everyone knew were wrong and he knew they were already made them anyway. Yes, it
is almost as if he's been sentenced to pushing his reputation up a hill
when it gets to the top of the hill at roles back down, so he walked back down to the boy.
What of the hill, and it seems like he may have to do that forever? Pretty good, I swear
all right. We come back. We we'll dance interview with the chairman of the Wisconsin Democratic Party,
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Flash Crooked Potter America's bright, but a cash was brought in by the cash app. You guys know about the catch up. Anyone got a good story. I gotta get sorry was that all right, so there's a woman named Jackie Brown. Ok, as is the movie Jacobin, though Netflix catch up,
ok. Well, here's the deal with it. I got one member that hold dust up the brouhaha, overpaying Travis back further the salad idea. He does let my
my transfer expire. You didn't set my money except by. Where did he
I don't. I assume that I shouldn't have assumed I'm sort of feeling, like he thinks he's better than me now that he is the internet
Definitely no nickname come on tug anyway. The point is down the catch up in the code. Pod, save the goats
answer the code Spencer, isn't real. You get five dollars: five dollars, Gaza donors choose which completed to Travis completed, which puts money into classrooms to buy supplies for children who are the future, treat them well let them. We, though I sat down with the cash I put in the court. Positive political Spencer couldn't could Spencer is real five. Those goes to you. Five rose goes to donors, choose hoping supply
from all over the country. It's a win, win, win, win, win, win. We are hearing studio and Sarah Cisco with Benwick lorries, the chair of the Scots and Democratic Party and a former senior adviser to move on dot, Org and, most importantly, or maybe not US
by a long time in front of the guy
You ve been on many times to talk to us about.
Tourism around affordable, correct answer which other stuff- and we are please talk to you now about wisconsin- very glad to be here
thank you answer. You are here in San Francisco at the Dnc meeting that I ask meeting house. Let me
going as the party, we read a reports in the news that perhaps the Democrats are hardly divided.
Have you sent that at this meeting, so there's an auto complete before them?
Fraid Democrats in disarray, and if it is your best d ye than just artificially the rest at the reality is everyone I'm talking do is totally focused on stopping Trump and that that is this descent
unifying, go there's a real sense that we have to fight for state legislatures. We have to fight for the Senate, we have to fight for the house, but it all connects to the big fight there all linked to each other. We know that the fate of candidates, Democrats up and down the ticket is connected to how we proceed,
the presidential fight and that there are reverse coattails? When you get local candidates, they pull out more voters said: is it
I think there's a real sense of shared mission and a lot of what's happening now. A year out is the kind of building blocks
of how we assembled the coalition that we need. How do we get the different structural pieces and
is how do we get organizers, trained
as an organizer myself, I think its existing and, I think, a lot of the conflict. That is
the yeah you I read about in the news misses the fact that mostly people just linnaean to do the work.
So you as I am met at the top your history and your background of politics, is in activism and organizing, but mostly from
side of the party structure and oftentimes in opposition to the party structure pushing the party interactions. It may not want to go. How is that background influence your approach to now being in a puzzle,
and now you have the term Democratic Party chair who you're inside oranges about his inside of the book at its. So I,
grew up in medicine. Where I live now in Wisconsin and growing up, I went.
High school, is to organise debates between state legislators about issues affecting teenagers, and this one
rapid always common when the debates and then she ran for Congress. My friends, I volunteered on her racin Tammy following on elected to the house, and now the Senate I work
and governors races. My godmothers, woman named a deer who became the first american indian woman to win a congressional primary. When I was eleven as the first reading,
onto your done, so I can have grew up in there was
and progressive tradition, both in activism, which had been a lot of and also electoral politics in
They must cotton, there's not much data,
between them there is. There is a tradition of me other folks. We are fighting for
for causes and social justice?
moving in and out of the electoral world, and I think I do
sensibility to the activism. I did, I think, one of the things that add
and move on we try to do, is
our centrally a an independent, progressive, grassroots group, but we try to be in constant. Cod
with elected folks. We understand where the battle lines are, where the pressure points are, and that kind of like the inside out to game was a big part of how
thus collectively one the easier fight
That was something we're having just really hyper
and pointed Intel about where Republicans could cracker. If there were thrust the democratic unity that allowed us do or most effective work. So as to
Party chair on the other side of that handshake, but it is still a handshake that, where we see ourselves in a party is part of an ecosystem and a movement, our working with amazing groups, with with organised labour with grassroots groups, irreverent from high school students, stir,
The group of the rating grannies of a thing is that so
Progressive events brow working on it together and we all get that the stakes you know they they ripple out from the political system to every person's life. So
Do it? It's not there's no silos in this business so
This concept is the centre of the political universe and twenty twenty. It is the state that all the data and a little types predict is the person who wins was causes most likely. We enact present
states yet, and so beyond the pressure they put on your shoulders, ending its worst Mineo over time examining how s cotton became at stake, because Brok Obama one was constituted an eight by thirteen points. He wanted by seven are almost seven points I believe in two thousand and twelve, it is a state to us in the twelve that Ababa was felt had such confidence would be in his camp that he almost in campaign there thriving. We went once at the end of my monsieur weaving, ran and add to the point where Pillar Clinton loses small margin, but loses what is happening with constant in the last decade. That has changed the politics of the point in one from another
add a blue state to a purple state that something sea to be potentially trending red, Scott Walker and the Koch brothers. And that is a bit there. A symbol of a broader apparatus on the republican side, funded by incredibly wealthy, often are those who are trying to protect.
They they build a kind of aristocracy in America who systematically
after and dismantled the pillars of progressive power. So everyone as about act, ten, that after Skywalker came it office. You was recorded
thing is led to divide and conquer, and he eliminated the power of public sector unions to organise at just giant cataclysmic fight with
thousand people outside the capital, but he pushed the law through. He then did right to work law that further
with a body blow to organise labour in Wisconsin cotton up. He put in extremely harsh voter Idee laws that made it way harder for people to be able to register about Anti Castro.
It's something people don't know is that he eliminated the ability of student governments too,
Be able to do mass registration dries on their campuses and change the voter registration rules. So, instead of being able to be steps
I state, why does a voter registrar? You have to get deputize by
even ass, a polity me of eating hundred and fifty two municipalities that administer there on election rules and was cotton just point after planet or any other one. He changed the camping finance laws to suit the profile of his specific donors, so
cotton? Very union? You can give twelve thousand dollars to stay party if an individual
make a limited contributions and there's a billion are named Diane Hendricks, Aurettes, literally seven figure checks to the Republican Party. All that, then, the State Party can make unlimited
nations to stay candidates so there and ended
gerrymander at the same time, to an all these wasted,
a progressive state. If you pull this contract about issues there very progressive and put it into shackles they, maybe they handcuff this
to make it so that democracy can work, and this the ultimate expression of this was
in our state assembly raises last year. Democrats got fifty four percent of the votes Republicans,
Chamber of our state legislature, they get be too over at super majorities, unlocking gerrymander for another decade, until my seven year olds, graduating from high school so
is in this election simultaneously we have to stop Trump and, if Republicans get three more seats needs
Member, the state legislature they get b to override super majorities, unlocking gerrymander for another decade until my seven year olds graduating from high school. So with it we have to fight with both hands
so she doesn't. Eighteen was grey run. The country also good Wisconsin right
Great Skywalker get sent home, and but it's
the note the numbers are interesting right that you obviously see. As you mentioned, the results of gerrymandering, which is the state legislative results, do not reflect the popular will of the people.
Content. But even then there are some warning signs in those numbers right, but there there isn't. There is an exception.
Warning signs in the sense that Timmy Baldwin younger, France's Highschool head, did in
doubly well right, and there is a large swathes of the sea.
Surprisingly large swathes, I would say of Baldwin Walker Voters, and so what do you like? What
It is either the profile that voter or what is the way to turn a Baldwin Walker voters or someone who pick Tammy Baldwin over tone it, but did not pick Tony ever serve your governor, like what is a profile of of that vote are, and how do we reach that? How do you convert Tournay? Ah, a bargain walker voter into a Democrat into twenty twenty or democratic
between twenty, so that they be keeping that, I think, is true. What continent is more true than people realize across the country. Is that swing, voters and tickets? Winters are not centrist their conflicted. They have a bunch of different ideas that don't coherent a perfectly polished gem of a video.
Consistency. They may have incredibly strong views in one way or the other on guns in a totally different views on healthcare, and
different views on unions, other human beings and their beautiful in bewildering complexity and in Wisconsin that the key thing
is showing up and speaking to and making most salient be near issues the people
about in their own lives. There lived experience that connect with progressive values, and so Walker was incredibly effective. At breeding resentment has divided
hocker strategy carried right through in and twenty eighteen and he was there
the two pull that often put a lot of voters towards him. Even we are ones who trusted the Tammy bottle.
He's gonna make sure that the Asia wasn't drift away. I'm Healthcare was a central giant issue
accident twenty eighteen and it was interesting as at the NASH
level. There was this fantasy that they could go after Tammy, Baldwin Fur
seeing Medicare for all and leave
there's a nurse and she talked about priest incandescent over time. But everyone knew because of the giant fight over Asia reveal that
one vote in the Senate could mean that their health care be taken away and they knew the Tammy Bottom is on their side. She also did a tunnel
often rural Wisconsin she's, been fighting tooth and nail z cheated adds about. Are you going
on milk because we make real milk in Wisconsin and people
get that we have a dairy graces and was gotten. You may not get out a scientist. Go live without your dear me, oh no. I will be out of this day by the side. This episode airs and I will defend. I will
and our dairy industry to the last. It was cotton and but by the way we have to dairy farms. Closing every Wisconsin was concerned. There been sixteen hundred
keeping given at sixteen hundred. Sixteen hundred dairy farms have have gone under since Trump him and office. It is just expressing a massacre, and that is all that is related to his policies. In what way, so one thing is the trade war, which is we ve, got retaliatory tariffs, it's making it real, really, tough and also farm equipment. All these things are, farmers need to be able to sell their products in and keep their firms running
are under threat. A second piece is he's bailing out and supporting, and not doing anything about. The incredible,
we'll consolidation big AG. Now we have this handful of arms that are buying up smaller ones, and it's tough to compete against them
his policies are all tilted towards a super rich, even the taxpayer allowed. These companies are now pull in terms of money and enable do just gobble up this that the smaller farms
people can tell in rural Wisconsin whose, on their side and Tammy, has been finding her whole life, she's fur,
she went? There was high school Madison like me, but she's shown up can,
still lay at every step of the way and people can see them
and I think that's one of our every one of our are openings with Trump is that people are experience
we are proud of their lives. They could see the trumpet spending all day and twitter not doing anything about the threats that they face and making you making a case in drawing the connections part of how we win. So we did a paw. Ah week or so ago of Wisconsin, I was appointed partly crooked media change, research, Polar Castro series. This was our first. We then a couple primary goals of the first general action when we think Wisconsin. For the reason I stated that it seems to be
the most important state and I think in underpin state. I think com. Is it your sense? You know you are quoted the near Times sand a general election is under way in Wisconsin, and I know you as it is with the party. Do a lot of organizing thrives on Wednesday? I wanna hear talk of that, but do you think the rest of the party infrastructure understands a how important this continent
my parents- are gonna, be just be invoked, met with authority and see by receiver attitude earth yeah they organise it wishes those ones too
that we cannot win most likely. Cannot when the presidency, without winning, do people get that fact, people get it
Are they acting on that fact their act together? I think the
is our coming into place and I would say we need a like,
in some way to push the accelerator through the floor. To make this happen, I met with a group of high school Democrats in Russia and they every time they log onto Youtube or seen trumpets, and what that tells you was the trumpets coming for ever
I'm in or they have tabled that boy they have. You haven't, I think, as part of the former that things other former em in, even if they have tabled a right now, they're using
they're using their digital, add campaign mostly to Idee people, to try to find every voter. They can actually don't have up a message to persuaded. All I, as far as I can tell trumps strategy, is ideal.
Every possible support to get them all the vote and suppress everybody else? And it's it's not a persuasion
it, is just getting people to vote for him or not vote at all, and you are
answer our response to that is a little more complicated like we certainly I will. I would make the case to a bubble.
In that trunk has betrayed their values, and now it makes you they should think twice about whether they actually want to cast a vote for
but we also we need to persuade and massively tonight are base at I d tons of people who have been bystanders to this whole thing, and you have you look in twenty. Sixteen Trump and Clinton both got fewer votes than five of the previous six presidential campaigns. It was content there, a ton of people who didn't Beaufort either them your point about fewer people, voting for Clinton and trumpet and previous nominees points to thanks right, appoints to people who didn't turn out right, but also
sugar people who voted. A third party writes a chunk of jostlers, but also the Stein voter margin
they, then our esteemed voters was larger than the amount trump wondrous can thrive is about thirty thousand verse about Twitter.
Here. What what's was counterparty doing to target both as groups, so first, not voters and a state where, as you point out, voter registration is incredibly challenging on purpose ends, but then also have you persuade somebody's third party voters to be democratic voters and twenty said the king and his cousins. You you treat, anyone is eligible as a potential loader, whether their registered or not, because we have simply ready.
Russian, that's the one thing that Republicans did not manage to take away. So if you find someone who might be able to vote might be kind of over you, you can start
conversation with him now as we're doing find out what they care about and keep up a conversation all the way through election day and frankly, you know you're you advocated for just to sustain digital persuasion campaign. That is a great thing to do.
It is also important to have a multi layered like to a conversation with voters, and that means you knock on the door. You follow, but a postcard fall by the text, a text back and forth. You make sure they're getting emails and and Digital adds that are tailored to the conversation they headed
and maybe with the same person, falls off with him right before the election make sure they're going to vote, that the takes a level of kind of organization and sophistication and data connected to your field program. That's that's what we're building at the state party at two hundred and eleven that it's inspired by the
tomorrow, for the Obama campaigns were we're doing this already
scale. It's never been seen before the state. We have hundreds of neighbourhood teens across the state right now, and if you, if you do all that yeah you disk, you have to break out of just tapping the Saint Peter
the men, had every time their doors were no Democrat has as ventured for a very
in time in the state in part, because you did a kind of
created over time, and you never want to mobilise people who get about for the other side. But right now, in its this early, you can talk to people.
And just find out who they are and what they care about and begin a conversation that can lead to a vote on the run. Is it a question of data deteriorating over time, which is a larger problem within the party?
Also, a misunderstanding: lessons for sixteen of shifting coalitions like lotta people beyond just was caught and talk about being asked to make phone calls in our mobile phone banks or mobile tax banks around the country on election day and getting a lot of trump supporters from
a democratic GEO tv universe in his coolly, even in Wisconsin, a group of people who know there's a chunk of Romany Clint voters who have moved into a different universe. Is it
Are you out there just re trying to just freshened data, hidden every door seeking it sends a who people arc, as you have the avenger starting so early there's, so the other the coalition's did shift,
any conversation like this? You have to remember that forty year, massive blitz campaign to poison people to hurry when there was the backdrop to everything that happened in twenty. Sixteen with easy to lose track of cause people like you're being Secretary of state. That, though, there are like people got freaked out when she question a pair
and that that peace is not on the table. This time they have not. They don't have that heads
with any of our democratic candidates and d, the goal that we haven't in terms of recalling the bridge building chemist, it's it's a deep chemist where we go and talk to people the doors I it's too yeah. It's it's a find out what issues motivate them find at which way the winning an end.
Let's not assuming not taking any one for granted, not running anyone not running any one off so in communities of color,
rural- was content in the Milwaukee suburbs like there are lots of people who
exact there are literally voters and counties that were Obama, Walker, Obama, Walker, Baldwin and Walker
Obviously, people have cast votes, we are one way or another or like different people, come out one way or another, and so we must concentrate on. This is gets into the with little. We don't have parties or other and tears
We do not have partisan voter registration so when you read
What about you dont register with the party we don't have.
Race on the voter file. So you have to figure out how people happy by that, if I racially and ethnically through other means and through talking to them, we don't have partisan primaries with open primaries. So you can tell based on with primary people, voted on, and we have
approaches that go on, but we have seen David destruction so when people register their their new and in the data system and all that means the quality of data in Wisconsin. If you're not actually talking to me
listening to them, it's easy to lose track of, of whose who and Republicans have been obsessed with building
really really strong data infrastructure. So that's that's an area where you know cause me and.
So many other people in twenty sixteen or knocking your calling, it was content to pull their hair out. We ve got a leap, frog them the cycle, and that's part of that is just the work of volunteers grinding now talking to people one at a time and and having actual conversations, there's nothing that replaces that you can't move.
Your way out of a problem like that, you have to talk to people. Have you seen in Wisconsin the obviously tremendous wave enthusiasm in twenty eighteen people out knocking doors a year more than a year out
the election has that sustained. Since thanks, I would say there is this Supreme Court race not long after twenty election, which saw things which them across loss, which was in it for solar, brutal loss over relative to the impact of a springboard seat in Wisconsin at source. All things shift backed away from the surge of enthusiasm. Twenty attain how's that working for you guys so the way think about his cousin Mamma. When twice we actually had trifecta control after two thousand and four, a hot second
a ten coat machine moved in Walker, yet republican trifecta control. They started dismantling our stuff. They were trying to make this continent actually read the state and they almost got us over the cliff and I think the like
huge. Uprising of people, organizing across Wisconsin, is like their able to grab a tree branch before they fell off the edge and
hold back up. We won the governorship by one point: one percentage points we swept statewide races for the first time since nineteen
too, but they still have a lock on the state legislature. They did it
special session a lame duck session to grab power away from the elected democratic government attorney general, including to stop them from changing how vote
dealers are administered in totally
and locking in their power would have.
In the spring of twenty nineteen. This bring. Is that democratic,
these yes M state high. We actually turned out more voters in there
bring Korea's this bring them. We did in the previous Ringwood Democrats, one by eleven points. We once room for racing twenty eight in by a blow out, and then we got more votes this time. A seven percent increase in turn out the republican side had a thirty,
send increase in turn out, essentially Republicans surged back onto the field. Their enthusiasm is going to be red hot, and I think this you know where
always looking for cracks in the Republican based they love drop. The republican bases as enthusiastic about em in the intensity of their support, is not as weak as the intention
for our that's one of our strengths, but it's not like there
We can bases fundamentally fractured he's consolidated
and part of the reason why a lottery
were variant way, sixteens. They thought he wasn't right wing enough. People forget that now there are like oh, he was to protect, so Security Medicaid looks good. Guy he's got them like these.
Then their justices he's given them attacks got. So we have to expect that they're gonna turn out
more voters, and they did last time not not fewer, even after all the horrors they ve committed. So I want to tell you that we have this
five fight plan. Yes, yes, yes, that after some suitably equipped,
five fights after these worries about the fight, and I want I want to take up their together. No books are there no upper whenever they noted on tattoo.
Preferment right. This is on to your customers rest or wherever people getting their political knows that dude so were. First, work
gearing up for the one you're out November, third of twenty nine,
It is up Packer him. Sorgen have a huge cognisant of every second you. Never one locked doors
Patrick, you know the people who might be business, cotton,
we're gonna do they pushed us all, but that gives us up for next year. So normally, if you look at the graph of activists
engagement, volunteer participation. It looks like a hockey stick. There's like this
long rumble and then this explosion at the end, our strategy,
Wisconsin is to use moments before the election to build up so much
more like asked me a series of steps with a curved stubborn metaphor
it looks at yelled out our medium. Just just imagine your mind, a wave that is
but up into the right. So the first thing is
presidential primary April. Seventh is also the date of our Supreme Court. Race
the spring and are local elections. Mayors,
bored, supervisors, school boards, all the stuff that Republicans I've been focused on,
democratic and letting slide for so long. We want Hunter
of candidates to run for office. If your listening right now, we want you to run for office in the spring of twenty twenty and we're gonna. Engage I've been talk.
The presidential candidates about engaging in our local elections and our Supreme Court election as they come to woo Wisconsin voters for the primary. It's a dress rehearsal for the fall. We want a full court
we're gonna, knock zillion doors were gonna. Make calls that text messages right, postcards to all the things figure out what works figure out, where a stranger weaknesses are max that out have a step change that were Ruth were looking like a fall campaign in spring second thing, we ve got the national convention in Wisconsin
and conventions are huge production their important nationally, but keeping for was content to leverage that make it a trampoline out of which come
this you'd sturgeon, new voluntary engagement, so one thousand
the people volunteering at the commission. We want all those people to commit to volunteering for the election and I think that a huge opportunity to
rain to get people to make commitments before they leave Milwaukee about what they're going to do in the phone so come out of that again with huge surge of energy, that's right! Number, two sorts! When the spring leverage the commission fight number three,
is our state legislature fight. They mentioned super majorities on the line and an gerrymander is online. The districts where Republic
are attacking us there, the Milwaukee suburbs, their places and western
content near Green Bay. So those are
areas where a thought the most democratic vote dense
but we have to contest every one of those words for the presidential as well as first legislative rights, and it focuses the mind, gets people to run for state legislature to know that this day,
in Wisconsin are gonna, be so vast, so faint over three is protect the governors veto with state. Let us
the local rights. We also undermine progressives for four prosecutor positions, Erasmus concept, so there's a bunch of great fight there by number four is stopping Trump and nothing,
this is the mind like holding the electoral college in your hands. Were
in the general election campaign without a nominee. This be yeah, there's always is
common advantage and part of that comes from having an extra year too
but to prepare campaign so, but the urgency
in twenty. Sixteen is it build a general election campaign before they knew Trump is going to be the nominee in Florida Bay at sixty two field office is open for more than a year. We're building that kind of campaign at the grassroots level, through our neighborhood teams in our field operation and building all that to stop Trump. That's right number for five number. Five. Is we do all this so that we're stronger for the future
two thousand and twenty two cannot look like two thousand and ten. If we win the White House this time, and then we have a wipe out in twenty twenty two, we lose the future of our state and Anna,
is everything you want to do your nationally ending in my, I hope there. For the long term, all of our statewide offices are up for re election, two thousand and twenty to live new maps for the house, the state Senate in the state assembly we have a Senate race, that'll, probably be open, run Johnson song about stepping down. So we've got to come out of twenty twenty,
just a finely tuned totally align machine to be able to fight the next night and if we, if we do, that, it might
just like we're too, but we can get if we get new maps. We actually have
Marcus. He was content, we could become a blue traffic, the state, and then we could make an inclusive democracy that such representing an and fighting for everyone. That's how quaint I now
It's it's amazing and we ve seen this example. Examples like New York this year,
Mexico, this year states they became actual kind of blue trifecta, is past almost the whole,
sort of agenda in one session. That's that's illegal, almost got so that we do that and
that's what Minnesota did after the big protected their. They had a democratic government. Twenty ten while Republic, Wisconsin elected Scott Walker, they had marked Dayton and then they got their effective control. Twenty twelve and twenty thirteen
other such restored in the past,
gender right away and their trajectories estate has been so much more hopeful and optimistic them Wisconsin's next door. It kills me that Minnesota has leap. Frog
content as a bastion of progressive as it was causes, withdrew the progressive state. So we want to get that back
and trying to light under the nation about what's possible. I always regretted the greatest rivalry in America's Minnesota was
I voted for it
that last question for you, as the there
petty party chair, I assume
assiduously neutral. You have all the candidates equally, so I would ask you to pay
great I'll, get you in trouble great by. I do
I ask you why you think is the profile of a candidate who can win in Wisconsin right like what it leg what it? What does it take because it was content, is a very
her. It's a hard stated is getting harder. For other reasons, you mention you, it is the protests
sample of you have to do both right. How you do the question of
we just from the base or to re persuade swing. Voters are bomber transfers, whatever else the only way to get there and was Constance Adieu both. So what is the problem of a candidate who can do both and therefore one was content, but I will describe our actions that I think the candidate should take in this matter for his father. Yes, I guess so. The first thing is showing up and in all caps, and
in the in the richest sense of the term. That means coming to more walking coming to medicine. Also coming to Northern Wisconsin coming to Western was content coming to the the Fox Valley going to all
Regions of our state were seen in Kinshasa, South Western, this yo every part of something and listening finding out what actually happening in people's lives, and I will say that there are cutting party whose content is here as a partner
of your presidential champions. Devereuxs listening right now we will work with you to make sure you connect with and here from the people that you need to hear from and be able to talk about the issues that their facing. I think the the the biggest fallacy in democratic politics is the idea that you come up with a message through introspection. You have come up with a message by thinking about what would make sense to you in your own. Had you do it by talking actual people, a learning be able to reflect back to them about what's happening. There lives people
there was caught in they listen and they connect, and they be. It doesn't mean trimming your sales ideologically or YO. Three for the fence,
Necessarily it means showing that your on people's site, it's a populist state, it's a state that has a kind of it and of an independent, almost puckish tradition that stretches back where that century, fighting Babo Fall is
the economist cousin he was. He had the progressive party he was like here outside the parties to her, but he fought for people. He fought for changing, offer farmers and for people in cities.
The sense of having a fighter who, who actually cares and actually incorrectly, comes through and lessons in and takes up the metal. That's that's the key thing. First, eight: that's what wins every time that were present Obama did in our state and I think it's the sense of distance or disconnection as the payment,
tells us the most. So we what we are really out the red carpet and I will also say anyone
listening right now can help make this happened so we're that the thing that is is most vital for us right now is people becoming recurring donors to the state parties we can actually higher and budget based on those contributions. I love big bursts of money, but if you got a wisdom that org slashed donate become a recurring donor makes
giant difference to build the kind of infrastructure. We need and then go to wisdom that excise volunteer, because, whether your interest
and are anywhere in the country. We're gonna need folks making calls to fill door to door volunteer shifts we're gonna need others. This text messages to follow up with people all that work is stuff the folks can do from across the country to support the organizing we're
in the state. This is, we are all on urgencies heads now. This is an all hands on Wisconsin moment, so I'm I'm, I'm ripple the folks get the urgency of it. We ve got to translate the anxiety.
You feel when you see this puzzle, it's on your phone into action to win the state. If we win this concept, we went away ass Ben. Thank you. So much good luck with everything, and I am confident we will be talking many times we now and when we are all waiting late into the evening on election, I for the votes. From August, I counted
thanks I'll ask them for what an interviewed in ITALY
It was a basic, join us on Thursday to be me and Ashram Monaco. What else
at the time at the time everyone wants. Finally, people are saying to themselves at the
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