Sessions lies about meetings with Russians, and Trump snows the pundits with his speech. Then, former Republican operative Nicolle Wallace joins Jon and Dan to talk about Obama-Trump voters and the future of the Republican Party.
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This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
Welcome to bide, save America, I'm John Pharaoh Andean Pfeiffer, on the blood today we have NBC political, analysed and
we're communication structure for George W Bush, Nicole Wallace Tsar. First Republican
in the positive Merrick Dazed and
huge moment for the pod. Finally, getting your both sides get out of our liberal bubbles. Thicket. Yes, we're piercing the boy today. That's all we, my colleague and other coastal, wait right right
who, who doesn't like Donald Trump, perfect. Also, remember on pod save the world this week, Tommy interviews
good friend to the pod Heather Higginbottom about her time in the State Department Workin for John Kerry. For many many years also,
minder to subscribe to Honorary Cox's new podcast with friends like these this week,
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we were going to start with the transformative joint session that transform Donald Drums presidency two nights ago
very residential, very presidential, Mary Residential, these. It's it's a whole new ballgame. Now everything
he's done, that's bad before is wiped away, and we have ourselves a year
Mr President, on our hands very exciting
by us, though, we had a couple stories break last night which were
happy they broke less. I dare not during the pot I now
but you are things- are starting to move in our direction after a tough couple months and look,
we're only doing this part right now, because we know that just national probably refuse himself from the russian investigation Lauer according so I hope this is his. Why we're doing this will just keep Talkin until it happens. So, let's
with the New York Times story which,
is not about sessions, but might might end up being the bigger store in the long run,
This is a story, the tat the title is: Obama Administration, rush to preserve intelligence of russian election hacking.
Three by airlines, Matthew, Rosenberg, MIKE Schmidt, who else anyway. Basically
The story is, as the Obama administration came, to a close and learn more about the trump
Russia, russian intelligence, russian government people tied to the russian government. We wait
tried to spread the information to his many government agencies as possible to prevent trump.
The Trump administration from coming up, covering up or destroying the evidence. This meant that day Lowell
the classification of some reports, so that more people could see them
for the very classified sensitive information, they decided to put
like names of sources and stuff, like that, they decided to make sure that those were in places where people
Only the highest clearance could access them. So to avoid having
from political appointees trying to cover them up, and basically
they tried to leave a trail of bread crumbs breadcrumbs for investigators. I mean
this thing didn't sound like a fucking spinal, it's crazy, I couldn't even blue, knows reading it, but
perhaps the most explosive paragraph in the whole story, was the second one american allies, including the british and Dutch, provided intelligence describing meetings in european cities between russian officials and associates of Donald Trump.
According to three former intelligence officials, the intended,
occasions of russian officials within the Kremlin.
Discussing contacts with Trump Associates, the missing
information here is none
people that, when a background with the New York Times, no the content of those meetings think they do not know what was discussed between the
from associates and the Russians in the european capitals or what was
discussed in the Kremlin so that
still a mystery. I guess it could have again. It could just been Christmas greetings.
Between flan and carefully could just be
hey what's up hey, I look forward to working with you in the future may be just some above board business deals. I don't know what you think then I mean. Maybe there may be some sort of vodka for tackle ball exchange. I don T know who knows. Maybe they rely on issues that are being not just the content, but the actual
who are the associates? Are there the same people who were mentioned in
the dossier for
a few months ago or with zero wherever that was? But
who are they? Where are they talking about in? Why didn't times lead with it? That is a fair question to ask,
why did they lead with who the people were
or just the fact of the meetings right. The fact of the meeting seem to be
more newsworthy? Then the F
It's too propriety intelligence with is also very newsworthy year. The whole thing is newsworthy for sure, but you write, it seems like well
the big question all this has always been like. You know it
one thing I mean it's one thing: if
american intelligence agencies are no stuff for spreading stuff. For there's this whole milk spirit in is the deep state in intelligence services in America. Are they
they have it out for Donald Trump, but the addition of you know is: oh I've always been carries the addition of the british and the dutch intelligence agencies to like it's. There
hi, possibility that there are other intelligence agencies all over the world, specifically in Europe,
also know things
The contacts between the Trump campaign in the Russians?
and also I go back to work
I keep asking everyone this than I know like white. Give me just an inner
an explanation for all of this,
like so so we don't go down. The conspiracy wrote like what is the innocent explanation for not just wins, call it the ambassador, which you could sort of sale. Maybe that's just business he's talking about. You know that
funds with all incoming administrations and the people that are going to work with all over the world in the officials, and I work with all over the world fine, but it's like Flynn its man afford
its other. It's you know their investigating, Roger Stone. There invest Emma s just like there's a lot going on here, Jim via Lego, incidental s. It
that's exactly right eye
in almost by almost
by the floods
in calls to the russian ambassador being in the inn,
the realm of the normal course of business during the transition right click is
There are questions about violations of the local act, but
in general, I can buy the idea that the incoming national security adviser and
Officials from foreign governments would communicate in the transition period is odd that the Russians were the ones who spoke to the most as opposed to know. The british or the Canadians are others, but especially especially, not just because the Russians are some big
scary adversary, because
we know they had just interfere in our election to try to elect Donald Trump. Yes,
basically they exhibited a weed out their retirement country that had given it a cyber attack against us, but anyway, but anyway, I think it's worth going through a little just to put it all perspective, because it does
a hundred years ago, since we had the presidential election and we had an awful
apart from a risky basics and hunter and talked about these things, but so
Let's go back chairs a point.
In time where
during the excesses that
wasn't democratic convention where the rubber convention were Trump, how to Prescott
it's an told the Russians democratic democratically
and told the Russians to hack
peculiar glens, emails
he at the time, had a campaign manager who had worked for many clients in the Ukraine who are very close to Putin. He
at the public intervention they adopted the most pro russian platform,
in the history of the country, most Republicans of a convention. We like what are you doing? Why is the Trump campaign changing the platform? It's always it s about. Russia is an actual making. These changes and ah Joyce right
and then Russia
acts the election they,
the day and see assuage our democratic imagined. You forgot, you forgot one thing before that on August twenty first,
Roger Stone, tweets
on Podesta is about to spend his time in the barrel, run
stone, close, close associate of Donald Trump. That is
couple weeks before the demons hack, the hack is released of pedestrians email. Somehow he guessed the John Podesta. Somehow he gets. The jump at Esther is gonna, be in some trouble.
Closer associate a man
who refers to,
offers our quota rat fucker because of all the dirty political taxis, bald
been suggests, suggests that possibly ace
nothin and campaign official was going to have problems right before we're here.
Ex published emails hacked by Russians from said couldn't get beneficial
I'm not saying whether smoke there's fire by this doesn't look right
this would be the most smoke where there was no fire in history.
These animal drier of the smoke fire metaphor,
there could be no other tie where there is this much smoke in absolutely no fire.
And we also, I think you- and I can say this as
Senior officials I'd many campaigns. It's very fuck
the campaign staff members to be communicating with it
countries, with an adversarial position
words and adds the outward
Evans, even we're Darwin, said country
then interferes election to elect to to help all act. One of the two can
when winter and it's very odd, when you are already in the White House,
you go on foreign trips with the president. You are
for careful about anyone that you talk too, especially in certain countries, because you dont know if that person may accidentally be an intelligence official in that country.
It is always something that is on the minds of people who were in politics and people who have official roles too big.
Careful about what you say around over people to be have like operation
I mean this is yeah, so common wealth,
all of this brings us to
every bar guard sessions, the third, our attorney general XO.
Washing upholstery last night. Let splits back up and sort of walk through what happened here, during
his confirmation hearings under Oath L, Frank
asks and r L, Frank and Ass Jeff sessions quote. If there's any,
evidence that anyone on the campaign communicated with the russian government during the course of this campaign. What would you do? Jeff says
responds quote. I have
called a surrogate of that campaign from time to time and I did not have communications with the Russians and quote
sessions has now admitted to meeting with the russian ambassador while he was serving as a top adviser answer yet for the Trump campaign in September of twenty sixty. Now two meetings
sessions had with Kisyak the russian ambassador. One in his office
when she's trying to say is in
course of normal duties. As a senator on the ARM Services committee, sometimes
centres on the ARM Services Committee meet with foreign ambassadors. He just happen
forget this meaning, of course, under oath. That happens all the time. It also the case that they interview twenty other members of the
Armed Services Committee and none of them met with Kisyak during that time, just just
a sessions and aid
sessions had with Kisyak. Where was there? Was that meaning that meeting it was at the republic?
in national convention.
Why did Jeff sessions meet with the russian ambassador at the republic
national convention is that were armed Services Committee members meet with foreign ambassadors at a Democrat at a party convention.
Why was the russian ambassador at the republican outdoor convention at the?
at the moment that
The party that tramples
in the most pro prudent platform in history. Was he just visiting the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame and stumbled upon the convention was like? Oh there's, nobody just sessions. Let's talk about some business like one
It's insane! It's insane
why he clearly wide.
But here he gave false testimony that is beyond a shadow,
of again, I say it is
it is so revealing
due to the category of Donald Trump, is not the beginning and end of our problems that all
these fuckin conservatives are tweeting like well. You know, I mean
like Parson, the language. Did he really lie, or you know they ages? You didn't remember that meeting in those meetings are fairly common. It's like none are now do Wheatley
This is from the lock her up crowd visiting the people that we yelling lock her up when Hilary Benn was not. We after Hillary Clinton had been exonerated
and nine, in the F B, I decided not to even investigate or discontinued investigation of earlier, have an indictment or to prosecuted and do anything like that. There are locked
options everywhere be yet here we have Jeff sessions, clearly not telling the truth under oath clearly
whether he intentionally lied, whether he for
at the meeting whatever, but it is clearly not the truth. You don't forget. The meat
egg to meeting? That's, not a thing that happened. You don't forget to meetings with the russian better. I want that
meeting with an ambassador at a convention seems like something the wooden slope, your mind when you're under oath
and it's not wake
maybe he is bad.
Short term memory he's forgotten a lot of his sort of previous racism. At times
That's not is not what he wishes to act on the street by some dude. It was during a confirmation hearing where he did
I presume hours upon hours, are prep. What was the number one story in America when he was doing
Would he was going before the committee Russia?
involvement. The election, so
I September? Twenty a dizzying
could have like, oh that they knew. This was coming up
and he chose to beat it
honest about it in the quest,
That is why, because
would it be mildly painful. The just say I had these two meetings in the course of my business as
never centre on service. Many sure where there have been some headlines about it sure would still have gotten confirmed. Probably
but please workers, but so I mean theirs.
No more trade state
then it's not. That
it's the cover up because it also the crime rate, especially the elderly, but this is an example of he either.
In areas. Thank you stupid. They lied about, but he still wide, which is a crime
for which you could be quota quote locked up or
there is an actual thing there that he was willing to work risk perjury to avoid admitting to, and that's crazy
So the explanations for this explanation number one from
from sessions office is clear
He did not remember in detail what he discussed with Kisyak.
Second explanation from sessions himself device
carefully worded. I marry met with any russian officials to discuss issues of the campaign that there's
There is a specific intention in that statement and then
Then he said I have no, I I know I have no idea what this allegation is about. It is false tartu cited.
When fought call an allegation false when you don't know what it's about, but then,
John Harwood gets an explanation from a Trump Administration official who said
There were quote superfluous.
Your comments about election related news, so they did discuss the election
I mean I just I don't I don't know. I don't know how we can go on here I mean.
So what did you see shines by serious response this morning? Yes, yes,
I d did nothing wrong period, the like why fake news?
fake news to distract from the president's amazing convention. Amazing joint session address, so
We have a handful of democrats calling for
sessions to resign.
Diplomacy, Eliza Cummings.
a whole bunch of other Democrats, including Joe Mansion, who voted
to confirm Jeff sessions.
Have called on him to accuse himself
from the rush investigation, along with the following.
Well begins: Rob Centre report, men, Jeff Flake,
Jason, shape its own
James Looks, was always wife and daughter is in the eye again Jason in the house, and
Kevin Mccarthy, who called from the himself of a morning Joe and then walked back an hour later on Fox and friends. Now the person
court now brightest.
Coming up here to do the podcast. I saw on CNN
our friend, Paul Ryan Didn.
Join that chorus, Paul Ryan LAW
get it now, stop, can you take years? It's
It's so weird, because Paul Ryan is the intellectual darling of though
official Washington. You know that he's like a straight shooter,
he's, a man from US constant who likes it do p. Ninety acts in a strong and his biceps in his convictions that Syria is a serious politician that power I need to see one of the serious ones he's one of the grown ups. He said that these are the basically
from Should trumps, should not
a Trump accession should not reduce himself. Unless sessions is the target of the pro
such as putting out his reign, feel,
I would have right it ever bothers Paul Ryan that he is now one
biggest trump sick events, even within the Republican Party
eat out. He can just taste he can taste, but those
Scots for the millionaires there. So close, that's like it will enhance. He can almost reach tax cuts for minors. On the other hand, you can almost reached taking healthcare from poor people. This man has worked his whole life to do those two things, and he immediately I. Nevertheless he is not going to get a little perjury stand in the way. Now
millionaires need tax cuts when the doubts at twenty one thousand. Everyone says that
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guy we, so we don't know what will come of the sessions news, although we will probably have broken by the time you listening to this. Some kind of development,
let's move on to the
speech ever to be delivered by any president in history, including
this burg, address, including
and second inaugural
including you have nothing to fear but fear itself in Kennedys inaugural did insoluble
the first joint session
from Donald J Trump to just two nights ago
I think the question you have to ask yourself, John, is: has any pay
and ever sit up before the Congress before and use.
Complete sentences written for him,
I said anything racist and not called the media, the enemy of a man,
Is it ever happened before? Not that I can tell
that I glanced out, why this is seen as as one of the great pieces voracious in not just american history civilization.
I'm just I'm just in O bomber Kool aid drinking Rube right, so maybe I you are so jealous Stephen Miller, em so jealous Stephen Miller and his abilities. I mean
start with what how did it
the all too. It was weird
well I mean you know. We just had eight.
Obama joint sessions in her over the last eight years, how to feel watching this one, what that is
but there was no Obama was now weird.
Yeah. He it was it was. Where am I
the I will say,
so I worked on every one we do
through twenty fifty and my work on meeting, I just talked to you in Cody about it. I didn't chef de like but rewards the paper. I read it many times and
preparing for the state of the union. For the speech writers like the worst thing in the world is not awesome. Pretty when I'll see There- and so I appreciate it last year- having to do nothing more than just like
it once and then this year was lightened, it's kind of nice not ever think about it
but it is a got punch to have
they have the guy do the and the problem
and a president states, and have that be Donald,
tromp walk out there? For me, it was still it was weirder
let's be trump than it for not in for it not to be Obama, because I remember I watched most
bushes state of unions as well. You know, and it was we
I remember watching bushes, stay and thinking which has Nicole about this, but like they were always do
It is bad news about version Bush doing make up has a bad decisions that we disagreed with in Iraq and all that stuff in summer
which would still
go to the state of the union in a pretty good speech. You know I need have some good stagecraft and it like there were a few moments during some of Bush's speech is run. Like you know,
like the guy. I think he is destroying the country, but
right there he's trying to sort of bring people together. He's I appreciated the speech. Writing sometimes I thought like Michael Carson and that crowd like they did a good job with the speeches
and it just seemed like nor
it seems somewhat normal. George Bush's president, don't agree with them. Think he's doing a horrible job, but
president and feels normal Donald Trump.
Walking into the chamber was just
What the fuck is cookie operate here. It was
this brutal man yet, but I was
the best headline about the speech from
was that I was from my I remember, tweeted, those which was a typical
in addition gives typical speech that bad
to me is the fair analysis of Donald Trump speech. Is that like he, he got up there?
and he gave
A state of the union that was long fairly boring
more trade in cliched than usual, since all state of unions have a lot of cliches in them, but Donald Chumps was extra cliched. The writing
was just a little bit more terrible than most other, and I say that not about forget about Obama, because obviously unbiased, but worse than
These bees, George Bush's given worse than any speech, proclaim, has given worse than it, and I read a lot of state of the union's preparation for writing of others, and this is certainly one of them
written stated the union's that I've are worse written joint session speeches. That
ever seen any
Yes, it was better than any other Denny Donald any of some trumps other speeches. I now know what you think. I
yeah. I think that's right. It was fine.
Right. It was for this is the actual Roddy in dance.
yesterday I danced and works
Add we didn't work out
take him: how well it s just he got through without embarrassing himself
when a bad when it is in terms of their debt. Is you don't critique the name you just as the leader of the free world, yet one of a wish, you just say the dancing birthing since I think we last act, but let me keep in sixteen hundred days.
Or I would always say when a bare dances, you don't critique the dancing. You marvel
The fact of the bears dancing at all and
think Trump had some pretty bad dancing on Tuesday night, but yet
lotta people marvelled at that he was dancing at all
was the story of that transaction session like some of these summits,
lines that speech the torture.
Ruth Liberty and justice is now in our hands and we will use it to light up the world, the dreams that fill our hearts. The hope that stirs our souls every her
family can find healing. We all
The same blood
he also where one always. That is a true statement. One boy you're talking about his election goes like, of course he has taken what is election and he said eventually the chorus became an earthquake. I mean
you know: Tommy pointed this out in our lives dream, but comparing preparing yourself to a natural disaster is always the best move. I think
he s. A solid point that I really thought about. The consequences do isn't going what you want it? Maybe what,
it may be what Stephen at once, but also like. I
said, even though I'm out of the predictions business I said earlier in the day by on Tuesday, I wonder for you're gonna get a speech that was fairly standard with.
Whole bunch. Uphold has two lines, and so
whether they tested the lines or not
could tell us. I was watching that speech. There were a number of lines that would do very well with
swing. Voters and you know even non swing- voters right leg,
can let American it's great companies and workers be taken advantage of any more I'm
workers and six trillion dollars to the Middle EAST. All while our infrastructure at home is crumbled, I can tell you
because I'm as every politician that I've worked for his use, some version of that line that that thing Paul
was probably at ninety percent there.
But that was our John carries to say where opening fire houses in Baghdad and showing them in the United States of America is biggest applause line into doesn't taken too, as in four that's about reminded me of like they're they're, just so.
I don't think it's magic or
necessarily takes an incredible amount of talent, put a speech together where you'd
lines in there that are somewhat nationalistic in an economically populist sense
that are going to appeal to voters
across the political spectrum, and they did that so, like you, no good for them
It was also a speech that you could tell was like nominally fact checked like there were
truths in that speech. He said things that were false. That he'd said before just like, he always does, but
as a feat. There is some language. There was hedged here and there
till I get had gone through a little bit of fact checking, even though you know ensure got like four thousand Pinocchio, so they definitely like
tried to send the roughest edges off his usual speech.
In that seems I get there
That was certainly enough for the collective,
pundit world to just faint with joy. It I had to say
We we watch the speech at funny or die
we then went on and at our Facebook live stream. We answer
and I walked out of their feeling pretty good. I was like he gave his speech
We have good conversation, we get some great questions.
Gonna. Let myself be bothered by what I am hearing
your twitter cause? I was watching tv that all these points
sir violent all over themselves about the speech and seeing a presidential is, and then yesterday, the more and more I read about it,
thing, the angrier I got because like outlet,
I'm not saying that everyone should have that the way they should have cut from the speech to the CNN studio or on BC or on Fox and had everyone say that was her.
Verbal speech, Donald Trump, just gave a disaster of speech. He still a disaster programme now
we totally fined for people say you know that was
it's crazy as a normal Donald Trump speech. He made it through. The whole thing is stuck on prompter. He probably delivered a speech that might have been effective with her with some voters. But now the question is
Does he have any real plan? What are the details? Can he bring Democrats along to get anything done? Can he heal the divisions within the Republican Party over repealing and placing Obamacare figuring out an infrastructure bill, figuring attacks or form
these are the challenges that still lay ahead for Donald Trump. Also
here's a bunch of things that he said that were incorrect. Like that
would have been fair analysis,
starting to say that, like that was the moment, he became president and knocked out of the park.
Grand Slam and Reagan, ask and all the other shit you heard
crazy to me, yeah
You did tell you know we're on a text chain. You may Tommy our friends
begin. It had been roads and you can tell
you and Tommy were not
consuming as much news as Benny Cody, and I were because we re kiddies more and more worked up as the hours after the speech went by, and I know what I was doing. I worry your natural outrage, which is so unusual I know, must have been annoying sounds like as I'm not gonna, be upset about. That's why we, too, to the asterisk nice conversation with real people who asked questions the worry about it, and then I am, and I like satin Ben search engine, my twitter financing, lesser first, a stake now twitter and bad as an ordinary until Emily that should, she would agree,
political headline. Was this the trumpet could win in twenty twenty? It's fucking family.
If twenty seventeen. What are you writing that for
so mainly so, people look like all of you and I we all about it and then people will find it and click on it again. There are. Basically, there is a business plan when, for political either is what gives us all former.
And speechwriter wrote in the new Yorker
but the Washington Post, calling me address quote surprisingly. Presidential is like calling an F
performance. Surprisingly athletic. That's a great white like this idea, like he's
presidential is a is an adjective you use during a campaign about
candidate who has never been president, but something they do during the campaign. Think you think. Ok, that's presidential. You can't say that
can president is acting presidential. That's their job. Does
the head. This progress is surprisingly podcast like hears
here's a link this? This is Derek Thompson. Who is an editor at the Atlantic? Yes, this than I thought was
interesting. We sort of way
explains a little bit of the
gross overreaction here from the press, is the fundamental bias in poetry, is not towards quote presidential behaviour or against court. Resistance is more simply proper plot twist and then he followed up narrative. Ships are great for television, so great that is irresistible to manufacture them. In the absence of actual shifting narratives bushes,
actually write like this is what's a boring story. Trouble
What is an interesting story.
Huge shift is this: the new tromp pivot pivot beverage? You know, I, I think, there's something else that might be going on to resolve these folks judges
everything in Washington. All politics now pondered tree revolves around both sides. The both sides,
Narrative right, like you, ve gotta, be fair. He got
Parson ship into the way to sell partisanship is to attack both sides equally and to give both sides credit, sometimes and, as always, has to be this balance and because
of what Donald Trump has done and said throughout the campaign,
and through his first month and presidency, the balance has been severely off and most of the media has been,
We would argue and
Republicans argued rightly critical of Donald.
For mainly lying alot lot that he say anything that's true. Neither December's is administration on many many many occasions
and but you can tell a lot of this report as as Trump has attacked the press and attacked them over and over and over
but you can tell a lot of this report as as Trump has attacked the press and attack them
over and over and over again you know we're
the rafts it has made.
It subconscious- maybe it's not, but it has a psychological effect on you. Will you start thinking I gotta find.
I gotta find a moment to praise tromp because all I'm doing is criticising him and so I've gotta get my look
fair minded, I am, I spry pray
trump when he deserves at badge which you can then, where proudly around Washington, so then you can go back and criticise them like, and I dont
not saying this is the nefarious willing to have like iron, it's a very human feeling to have, but but to me
that's a little bit. What was going on Tuesday in it
I think, that's your. I also think I would separate the reporters for she wrote about the speech and the people who were equal.
What analyzing on twitter or cable tv ethic, the reporting was, you know
a little settlers early involvement of surprise that he did not do something insane, which is five frankly, reanimate faint, which has taught me there and
relatively straight in, I think, pretty consistent with the way in which steadiness are generally covered. You get the benefit of the doubt in your state of the union.
We certainly did you look at
When put you back like the coverage of some of the ones that Bush did in the darkest days of his post Katrina
presidency, where he it's you
get to be president. You are treated as president and people kind of push aside. Some of that
the environmental political factors around you
What do you own the stage that moment
so I think there are some of that, but I do think
you're? If you are someone who analyzes politics for loving you,
for opportunities to not be seen as just
the partisan hack and this
At this moment you that what bothers me was the first
two things one,
the degree of this. It was so that there was a degree lots show exaggerated, didn't need an exaggerated. You could have said, like you said this is
surprising from tromp was unusually did on script without
resorting to these I mean it just is,
reminder to me and
I need a separate report has caused media hierarchy right.
Number one reporting
is essential and vital and a lot of people him doing outstanding job out right. That's an reporting number two:
opinion journalism voicing your opinion as long as you're being honest about your partisan biases. Here I am. This is what I believe, and I M going to argue the point. That's also valuable at the bar
the pile is useless. Ponder
co analysis which is severely broken. It is severely broken. I in the meteor it now and it's like the electorate
doesn't need to know
whether PETE pundits were impressed with
we'll trumps ability to not
if over himself- and you know his ability to read full sense- is on a proctor. What like what peep
I need to know when they watch a speech like that is? Was he tat
in truth, we could. His
plans and policies pass what is the path to making sure they passed, how what he said might affect their lives. The
that's actual people need to know when they turn to speak later,
to have other people guessing what they thought of the speech
that is a daily exercise, is what is
if you are, if you don't ever run cable tv or
a funny unilaterally. We use it as a part.
A person who has written many stated the union's Orchomenus day. The union's I know
he did. He accomplished the following things: you try to accomplish in a state of the union.
He did some well, I did some correlated them all one opera, like that's analysis, what
is a huge mistake is to say this for me:
the types Picassos included
to project how they thing, voters or the pub
well interpret it. I get
not your job and history in this election. Most particularly proves that you're not very good at it ourselves included, apparently
Anna, why you can analyze the the proof
This reform ads. You should analyse a substance first,
by. What were they trying to accomplish
do you think? I wish it? I think,
so fair for people who have worked in politics for a long time to analyze how they being based on some reporting discussion. How will they will respond to this day
you think he made any efforts to bring Democrats on board to his plans that help consolidate. Like that's good, when you start saying that this is going to
ex? That's just
guessing right and I'm
ironically, the use of time I intervened with them, going to voters at some bar and talking to them about what they thought, because, like that
asking a real people, what they think- and you know like I'm
I am sure that those who programme like the speech does allow them. Like all of our speeches, like you said, state of the union is an
Trinity, its softball over
that you can sort of just knock out of the park because it's like you get this
peace. You have time to prepare, for it, there's little room for error and a lot of them are very popular, the voters all across the spectrum. I there's no shock here that a bunch of people like that
each on my behalf, you know, but it was also a good,
it was a good lesson to me that way:
Donald Trump says or tweets some
at times the opposite happens of what happened on Tuesday night and every
all the pundits us included, and we did.
Lot during the campaign will say at the end of his presidency. He's done. He said and tweeted this crazy thing and voters are gonna handball by and then you know
gives a speech like those amendments, as other presidencies transformed everything's better like
matters, so much less what he says and
how he performs and what the optics are, the when he actually does and what the policies are and what the actions and decisions are. You know and we
need to remember that, both when something bad happens and when something good happens like what happened to him and on Tuesday night, and I think we forget that I mean it- was interesting, like its
like the engines was sort of.
Talking about why vengeance on the night of the Syrian and said you know, this is the night he became president period right he's one of those people who have got really excited about it. Now,
stay he was saying. While the reason I said that is because Democrat
need to be aware that if Donald Trump start
doing this all the time in giving these speeches all the time and and insults being, you know, rhetorically sane van. We have real problems and he could be there for eight years and we might not be them an endemic,
to realize like if we think
we think that we need Donald Trump too,
crazy shit. In order to beat him, then we,
throw in the towel anyway, because that we had the weight.
Beat him. Twenty is not to hope that he is always crazy. It is to attack the policies that are hurting average amount.
And there will be plenty those policies and if there aren't, then we're not gonna beat him, but if there are, we have to take him for that, and we just have to remember that
yeah he's not gonna be himself. I mean
to be overly harsh about it, but I was sort of some of the twenty six years,
Jim was stepped back. Let himself let himself on fire and
and a polarize world were Donald Trump will get. Eighty five
I prefer the Republicans. It's not gonna work that way
we didn't. We should talk briefly about Thea the big moment, the speech that everyone was talking about, which was here,
to tell the whole story? Chief, petty officer, William Ryan, Owens Navy Seal had died dirt
the military, military operation, Trump ordered and Yemen. A few
Ex Back month back over the
again, Ryan's father demanded investigation into a sons death earlier
early in the day of the joint session. Trump was asked about this on fox and friends. He said they.
The generals lost Ryan, which was
and then so then, at the speech.
The widow, Colonel
comes to the speech and Trump recognise
is her to sustained applause, is obviously tougher to be their their tears in her eyes and
No, it was this moment and then and then Trump said, I'm sure
smiling down as happy that he just broke a record because of the applause which is still weird trompe, ending to say to measure the whole thing basin applause, but anyway
everyone, one you. This was like his Reagan, ass, big sort, a moment and as just
as such. It also bother me because, like not from catlike,
from on one inside, like I'm glad she came, and I can't imagine what she must have been going through and like good for her
for coming and being strong and standing there and, like you, can't take anything away from her whatsoever. Husband was a hero and
You know it was like you know that it was an emotional moment. I wasn't me, no emotional, just watching your standing there, but
to sort of a sign, this trump seemed
Weird to me,.
Particularly since he then said Anne
De in matters told me we did get gain valuable intelligence from that raid
ten? U S! Officials yesterday said the opposite.
Tell why is I don't know, I've ever read a story with its went ahead, went and got ten officials from across governments are less away like?
You know the rules too to
who does like we're? Just gonna go we're just gonna. Stick the night it in and twisted into
look. I don't know what to think about the moment. I agree with your assessment, like my heart,
goes out too
Karen Owens Everyday emails
its heartbreak agents. You know I can't imagine, having a strain
this stand. There is she did I much
bothered me about some of the analysis of the moment? Was they'll
even that bothered by the weird record standing ovation thing. That's weird to me by fine
they to analyze moment without equal.
Two points, one that earlier that day trumpet pass the buck, got it right
Can you imagine if Obama had sat there have been like you know
Benghazi, wasn't my fault. It was the generals fall. There was someone else's fault and then invited Benghazi. Were there to sustained applause, and then no one mentioned that Obama had said that earlier in the day that he blamed the generals
and they did the weird thing to try to win an argument about the raid-
citing matter, especially hey matters other dry on it and with ease
and then the next day as we're still analyzing this moment it comes out the the
why does this considering a policy change which will move Trump
from the decision making process on raids like this, so he's gonna completely pass the buck where he can take
for our successes and be distance from all failures.
Before yet cynical quickly would
Think of the democratic response by former Kentucky Governor Steve Bashir,
I think he did as well as you can do.
A terrible environment. I went back and looked through all of the response,
this is the last like do you know
extend or so the union's aid is a killing fields of,
promising politicians have gone to do it and emerge diminished. You just can't compete with
the steady union so
in some ways, like a lot of people have said
Why did you pick a rule
Seventy rolled politician,
who deliver an especially one of our rights
stars and we have a rising star problem and I think the main things we did want to sacrifice our rising stars to
poorly in this, but every bisher did pretty good image. He was better in the format and ninety percent of people who normally do it yeah. I thought so too. I thought
I think, focusing on one issue as a whole.
Trying to launch someone's political career in
setting is probably the
idea at those like the people sitting quietly behind him in the diner was like a little weird, but yes, like a mannequin challenge, slyly little by little mannequin challenges. Ok, when we
back we'll have NBC
Article analysed Nicole, Wallace, responsive America stick around more great show, coming away positive move
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on the part of this today we have NBC political analysts and former communications director for George W Bush, Nicole Wallace Nicole, Welcome deposited America rank. He found her having man for a fair and exciting
our first Republican and the POD save America era. We used to have a bunch on cuban sixteen hundred, but for some reason we haven't
had a chance, so we're all in the Witness Protection programme.
Two Miller's hide. It has indeed been hiding out somewhere. I ve been trying to get him on, but he's a joint. So let's
Let's start with the news of the day? Do you think
more Republicans, will call for a special prosecutor for sessions to reduce himself and to appoint a special prosecutor. We ve seen a few this morning, but do you think this is impeded or what the tv refer economy? I think it's up to four right and they're, not where he Republicans like me, their hard core republicans like their eyes and robbed or men. So I think this is a. I wouldn't say that the damage broken that you guys a thinker and
four knave, frightened him in the dam is very strain were watching my things with White House handling you guys. Now I mean it is never the crime of the alleged crime saw you handle it, nor handling the question of contacts with Russia in a way
harming them. I he I keep asking everyone this, because I'm not
I don't wanna, be a conspiracy theories, because there's too many conspiracy theories floating around out there, but like Trinity,
especially with the New York Times story right about now entails
official saying you know, meetings between tromp associates in european capitals Right- and this is also from dutch and british, and tell as well as American until like what
You think the most innocent explanation of all these cut ex could be right.
Like as is getting harder and harder to imagine what it would mean that I think you can always- and I say this for myself- I wouldn't I wouldn't paint anyone else's brush, but one of the things that went wrong in our white, how you could chalk up incompetent? That's you
we the most innocent exclamation, but it's getting harder and harder to imagine how so many feet forget so many conversations with so many Russia.
No, I mean either the same thing like it's
there is your right this whenever something we go wrong in our White House and I had
and appreciation for things
I thought went wrong in the Bush way house after this being the way. Those four others years is that everyone always subscribes are scribes like nefarious motives, ray and a lot of times. I know you know
we were just someone was an idiot. Someone made a mistake, but
when you have this many there's only so many coincidence, as you can have before enough for you to start wondering if it's a little bit more than coincidence,
yeah and wiser, though in Russia I mean, why did my Flynn forget to tell pence about Russia? Why did that session forget to answer the question about Russia? Why is Donald Trump? Only we
Lattimer prudence in terms of you know, I mean he's so skeptical of NATO made up of all
of our allies and he so we'd to Lattimer boon its if it is so many inexplicable
The situation is an and put in a further at the root of all of it.
If you were to call if you were advised in some of these Republicans her up in twenty eight ten, how would you would you tell? How would you tell them to handle this
This question specifically address the general,
Russia ties? Does your you know you're, seeing people who are, as you said, calling for refusal. You people,
Paul Ryan, who are just right in this thing all the way. The end like what you waiting the best political strategy is now I'm in itself corny, but it's like finder north are I mean you know. I think that that their hugging up Donald Trump in terms of the things he talks about on the economic front and enforce it, is harder for Republicans and Democrats frankly, but starting to embrace some of his protectionist economic policies might make sense for some Republican, because that's where our party is frankly reports that your party
As you know, the footwear Democrats ended a burning for job, I'm covering two time of arm of others who voted for chomp and allow them sort of adopted Bernie Station along the way. I would advise them to be very supportive of Donald Trump economic policies where they agree with them, but to be very sceptical of these unanswered questions about Russia and what's travelling to me is that seventy Republicans can locate that that northern starry. Why can't you follow orders.
Any sort of the notion that John Mccain Lindsey, Graham R, and then I guess Now- dare Eliza and and rob Portman with the idea that you can still take off on one hand the number of people calling for more answers on Russia says
nothing really travelling about today's Republican Party, who is since it like the circular thinking rate, where
the Republicans in Congress sick with Trump honest. Almost everything
because you know he's got eighty five. Ninety percent are proliferating among republican voters.
And so, if your politician, you think, while this is where my bases I can't break with Donald Trump, and we can be in trouble with my base, but then you have to ask
I, as the base their right like the base. Is there because they see republican
addition saying: no, no, no, the Democrats or lying we're standing with Donald Trump. This is all fake news rate like I don't know what break the cycle there
well and nobody in the base is worthwhile jump because his knife, Russia, I mean right, but that this is a loser. They like him, despite the ability for Putin, its forehead scratch her and I ve been talking to voters another. They were happy to see MIKE flowing. Go. They were happy to see downtown dispense with someone who had
Had conversations and not disclose love, you have the political risk for saying we should get to the bottom of any ties between. Do you know
the Kremlin and an american election, the notion that any of them are in the defence of crowds about calling for more answers is really seeks due to the weakness. It explains why tromp was able to hijack conservatism so completely
The is? A republican farmer, so you you had an interview on the today show where you talk
from voters, and basically Michigan
like a lot of them like this.
Each from Tuesday night,
in your mind, are avoided if you had additional conversations with them. But what would what would it?
baked appeal, those voters away from tromp what what would make them disappointed about him? I would take a lot
interesting myself. I think the seven state I've been to that Trump flipped either for the first time is right,
I mean we ve been the Pennsylvania, Wisconsin and an Michigan now but or you know, states that the present Obama had won at an end,
really really in it to women
This guy, I mean they're in it, for the economic, revitalization mayor in it
or the sort of stripped down rhetoric I mean lately servant had all the hope and change
could and they are ready to hear from a guy who sought a crass am wind and you're. One of them said to me
They said he I like that. He talks the way I do he's home. He you, John F Kennedy, used to be further rhetorical model and and and eurobonds bomb I mean you know that we used to aspire for leaders who elevated dialogue- that's not
the case with wing voters in America. Right now they were looking for someone who they fell, communicated at their level, but
What it would take appeal them away would be someone who came down to their their very level and levelled with that. My maybe what they felt about our tromp was that he is telling them the true and it. So I run it because I don't know, there's a politician in modern times who has lied more than Donald Trump about silly thing, so it's a real,
I tried my brain in a knot in some ways. In other ways it further this phenomenon that was hiding in plain sight. I mean people have lost faith in institutions, so it makes sense that someone came in with a wrecking ball to everything that, before a cherish about political institutions was viewed as more trustworthy, then than people like TAT, Bush or like Hillary Clinton, who were from established political families and and and and organizations, but I think to purely voters away from him
He would have to come up short on his promises and I think they're gonna give him years not months. Do that you that's what I was gonna says like I in my mind, I can get. Why
a lot of them wanted to give him a chance right because of the unbelievable distaste with politics and distress of political institutions general and also politically,
went from leaders that sounds bullshitting right, but it's
point. It seems
he has to deliver people set on a pie cap on the on this one. You can you. Where are you want? We got
slither rating, so we are good to go. We hated Katy Corrick with swearing on this podcast, the other we concede tat. Thou know
guess, but that the question about the economic agenda has me wondering, because
you know you're saying you advise Republicans disorder stick with Trump on the economic stuff. Well,
you can imagine a Trump agenda where he is.
You know, sort of renegotiate NAFTA right already pulled out a t p.
It also seems like he would keep his promise not to cut Medicare social Security even
The cage re like you'd imagine and Obamacare replacement. That is still very generous to working class Americans who need help buying
of insurance. You wouldn't
in tax reform that offers a big
working to middle class tax got right. All these all the
policies that seem very much at odds with
the Paul Ryan might Pence wing of the party, and I'm wondering do you
Ryan and Pension and Republicans move.
Two Donald Trump or do you think it
to be tough to get something out of this republican Congress. I mean
heading four Ryan died, a thousand deaths are tonight I mean he's, not a
conservatives in the all of you know believing in free trade in them
leaving it in our economic policy is a sort of Hugh to the very traditions of conservatism. He's an architect of the modern version of policies. So you know, will move to Donald Trump and found them is a is a political calculation on his part, not a policy question. We know he doesn't believe in any of those things he did that the creator of power.
That are all rooted in the opposite: the loss of pay them Donald Trump, believes in and an arm and campaigned on and and plans to make. So so I in any way, but I would advise Republican along its, not because I believe in any those things I worked for a president who, who is still in a book towards this week talking about the perils of isolationism.
The native ism protectionism. But you know the political reality is that if you wanna get anything time, this is doll trumps moment. This is dollar trunks republican party. He he achieved this victory without any help from the republican establishment. The havoc and establishment was as uncomfortable with them, as the democratic astonishment was, and so he owes nothing
I want to get anything done. They are deaf going to have to move to him because he had no motivation. He has no debt to them and
and- and I just don't see him- I can't even imagined the conversation where they walk in and say you know you can't touch with
we'll start on sale. Ok, I mean he campaign on envy and converted lifelong blue collar Democrats to his calling for the first time since Ronald Reagan, adjusting Paul Ryan. You may find that five,
I can lose that by its own citizens and what is actually gonna fight. It.
Where's, you look as a veteran of a white house.
I was asked: how do you think the Trump Whitehouse comes operation is doing, but that's kind of remedies. Questions like what lay
we ve all dealt with weeks in our times the White House. We know how do you think that you know shouts by us or the trunk geyser dealing with that in what should they do differently? I talked to sign as we agree that he and say there is a really nice guy with an impossible job. I mean you know. I didn't work in a very leaky white house that it wasn't because we didn't have cell phone numbers of reporters. It was because we had a rigorous internal process. You know we could have screaming the hedges. There were a lot of them, but we can evaluate
fight and we could even take a bite of. We couldn't get an agreement for the president and and have him when and even if we were happy with with the outcome everyone sort of, though there was a ruin, rigorous process, first resort of make.
Your Kazan, taking all the way, the President, if you lost you off to you, hope to win the next review. Larceny leak, you wouldn't make it back into the oval office to make your case next time, though, there was a process for airing your side and there were serve a promise that you know. That was that will continue to be the process that you get to air. Your your concerns about occurred,
strategy, and obviously my case, often with a communication strategy or decision to go to a banner not go, do in advance or damage
let my were involved in a series of speeches when public support for the Iraq war had sort of fallen out. The bottom had fallen out and we suggested a theory to seek is acknowledging the states in the military strategy and the diplomatic strategy
lot of opposition and we made our Kazan and leave Prevailed and and and only a think, you know two years later was an error- that there were some people that it had some questions about a bit. It never leaked out at the time that we were having a robust debate inside the White House about whether, after this
a big, so my point is leaks, are never the cause of anything there are sent them in. My guess is, is a symptom of the lack of any sort of process for having debates internally and the knowledge without resolve press coverage.
They all say something to the president's leakage may now who read it unites, ignored
current incarnation of the Republican Party, which is now trumps party in Trump ISM in general,
I always trace it back to
at least the first time. I noticed this sort of shift was you know Sarah Palin,
re done in two thousand and eight which, under your part of the campaign and very policy,
plenty of problems with it. But when you are
You are on that campaign. Did you sort of sea this coming in over their heads?
this might be where the party goes, or at least a big chunk of the party goes. I heard these at any time in January. About that
mean I was not aware at the time, but I should have been. I mean I was. I was travelling with both John Mccain. Sarah Palin enjoy Mccain's advance, remained you know, for the small by presidential political standards and her events were, like Obama, size rallies. I mean they were massive and people were.
People were were thrilled by her attack from the lame stream media by her ten from republican operatives and by the end she was openly attacking her own campaign of violence. It rally people dying crazy, which affected the first version of trumpets and where he thought of openly attacks. Other members of the republic and establishment of media, his brow- and so she definitely was, was troubled by now, and I think that you know that the efforts to try to turn her
to a more traditional politicians were so wrong. Headed, I mean he was certain to head of her time in a bizarre way, and you know that the problem with letting it rip was that she wasn't at the top of the ticket. John Mccain lies in so alternately round the campaign that he wanted run, but there the moment I think, he's remembered for for his candidacy was confronting one of his own supporters to called President Obama Muslim, and he said now now. We disagree that he's an American than a patriot and wages have different ideas on policy. While there were people shouting the same forces, things at Terrapin rallies and she never confronted that kind of native ism.
And so you know. I think that was the first time that the party had gone. Some are very different and and- and I think dark, the called you think. If meal people had done my John Mccain didn't Republican Party of the last few years, we might be in a different place.
After Mccain lost. It felt to me that we someone who was on the other end of these attacks and a lot of people are about working party.
Trigger the wants of the hill, what sort of just they wanted to ride this tiger is opposed to do anything about it. One I'd say that, after after John The can't love you know campaigner resort as an ex casualty of sort of
Weis Republican Party, and then it just became very primal and very tribal, and it's never. The fault of the voters know you don't blame the voters, they were
There was something they were. There was a deficiency and what they were getting from the republican establishment. This talisman grew so detached from space. They continue to champion free trade, while that's not with the base of the Republican Party was anymore. They continued to
you know advocated a foreign policy that heads would have exhausted the party in terms of being champions for intervening in far away wars. They had a means. The party had just changing, and it's not it's not the voters job to keep up with the establishment of republican establishments job to keep up with the voters and adjusted colossal failure to do so in an
lay baron and reveal during the republican primary when every week, another one did. The DAS Billina said one
after another establishment recover configure, viewed as
strong and viable before that contests was really under way. Tumbled
Emily Wizard away. When Donald Trump face them
One last question: will let you go what you, since you
talking to so many these voters,
ethically trump Obama voters.
A kind of what kind of Democrats do you think Donald Trump should be most afraid of. I think that if someone thought it emerges from this part of the electorate, disorder working class about are now working class politician
someone who is they not the sun, our daughter of a union marker, but an actual you marker themselves, someone who understands how you know we re in the political class fight about trade and NAFTA policy debate who lived it. They watched you know factories, you now that will once more, the glowing and sparkling just become wasteland and you with windows, dunker, replace and parking lot with no cars. I mean it needs to be someone that live that life. I think who further rises up and makes the economic populist argument with out all of the native ISM in tribal, examine and without all the ESA Siena, without protectionism, with with the understanding that we have to be part,
here we have to be a trading partner to other markets, otherwise, lettuce and tomato focus is sixty dollars. Each I mean you know. No one is making the case for capitalism in the Democratic Party or the Republican Party really
in a way that resonate with working class americans- and I think it also has to be someone that seeks a more inclusive sort of script
diversity. I think a lot of these voters felt insulted by the national conversations that ensued after further salmon. After some of the cases, the agreed just hurry back an unforgivable caters police brutality, but I think a lot of these voters experience them in a way that that that we as part of savage and politics and I'll eat media didn't understand. I think they felt, like all police officers, have been indicted in conversation that ensued after further saddened that wasn't having felt about the police. So I think that that that level than a leech started painting a lot of social problems with two brought up a brush and left many people out of the conversation, but feeling I couldn't didn't recognize the divide. So I think someone else that they themselves who lived economic despair, that these people live with and I think.
One that can speak about diversity in, and culture and social issues and awaited, isn't condescending and judgment all will be the kind of democratic we get. Our Trump Rumford money through their personal, be easy to find on the other line,
Thank you so much for joining us and please come back soon. Repudiated technical, ticker, Bobby
that's all for today, thanks again to Nicole calls for joining us. Remember tomorrow, listen to with friends like these honorary Cox has a new episode and
other than that, will touch on Monday by guys.
Transcript generated on 2020-04-03.