The President sides with a murderous tyrant over advisors and allies, the Attorney General targets Trump’s political enemies, and the Democratic candidates fight for media attention in a crowded field. Then ACLU attorney Chase Strangio talks to Jon L. about the Trump administration’s most recent attempt to roll back civil rights for transgender Americans. Also – Pod Save America is going on tour! Get your tickets now: crooked.com/events.
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Welcome to POD save America, I'm John forever, I'm John mother on Tommy Retort, wherein the pod you'll hear love it's interview with Asia. Oh you attorney chase strange. You know about the trumpet ministrations most recent attempt to roll back civil rights protections for transgender people first
Take what the president's siding with the murders tyrant over his own advisers and our allies. His decision to use the powers of the presidency to go after his political enemies and all the latest twenty twenty new
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Let's get to the news during his trip to Asia over the weekend, Donald Trump, so that he sees things differently than those who believe that North Korea recently conducted missile testing violated a United Nations resolution. Those people are include Japan's Prime Minister and trumps own national Security adviser John Bolton. The president tweeted, the following quote: North Korea fired off some small weapons which disturbs some of my people and others, but not me some of my people and others benumbing. I have confidence. The chairman Kim will keep its promise to me and I also smiled when he called swamp man, Joe Biden in low IQ, individual and, worse, perhaps that sending me a signal cry sakes
how me before we get to the bible stuff? How concerning are those tests missiles and what is North Korea up to here? Well, so I mean, I don't know what trumpets seeing I assume a radar sees every missile the same.
And these are ballistic missiles according to his national security adviser in shooting off a ballistic missile is a violation of a bunch of you in Security Council resolution. So it's it is against international law. It is pretty scary if you live in Japan or South Korea or anywhere where you could be struck by one these missiles. His team is trying to play it down in this ongoing effort to resuscitate a completely dead set of negotiations with North Korea. It's been a complete failure, but I dont think you can really smooth over that stuff. With happy talk and pretending, you didn't see what is right before your eyes, which is a? U S, pretty council resolution violation and a missile test, so it it's just its ludicrous at this.
What actions or behaviour have we got in North Korea to change since the beginning of these so called negotiations there there were some swaps of remains of service numbers killed in the korean war. I mean, in other words, that the saga of the tragedy of Otto or beer, whose body was returns United States, but I mean basically
Kim has been enriching uranium and make more nuclear weapons for about a year and a half in and advancing. Is this a? Why do you think Trump would side with care
over all of our allies and his own national security team. Is he just that horny for a dealer? What what's gonna I mean he ignores intelligence when he doesn't like it pattern, and I think that he knows that he, if he dangles attack on Biden out there in the tweet. Even if you spells his name wrong, which is weird, we should just note that our president can't spell the last vice presidents name, that's trouble,
an incredibly the least problematic part of the tweet yeah be so we can dangle out that little cable catnip and he can play assignment editor for a bunch of journalists who then have to focus on this stupid attack on Biden, in distract from the fact that the policy as it is,
his. This is an area he knows is fruitful in terms of getting people to talk about what he said about his opponents. He knows that it is
the carried hee hee hee, instinctively
those that it's wrong to choose the side of the tyrant over an american
vision, but then he knows it also get some tons of a pay attention. So he's done it before not the first time.
Said. You know. I like this tiny makes. Are democrats like shit yet digital,
thinking back to bomb up like if Obama had gone to, Japan
There had been a north korean missile launch and the Prime Minister offered one view of what that means
in Obama offered another. It would be seen as a massive rupture in decades old relationship right or be seen as like. This met an incredible moments in the history of our two countries and Trump just kinda lies through
and insults through it- and you know I don't know why he thinks it's great- to highlight Northeast North,
in propaganda, remember they called him a mentally deranged? U s: doated dot
Donna long ago. So you know it's really weird and also the follow up to like we know this was in some errant tweet, because others Sarah could be Sanders, goes on meat, the press and- and she says well, you know, I think, that Donald Trump in conjunction agree in their assessment of Vice President Biden, like how, concerning,
Should that be the president. States is siding with a murderous tyrant over a possible political opponent and a former vice president. Instead,
I mean it's a lot less, concerning the fact that the negotiations with North Korea that are designed to deal with their nuclear weapons programme have completely failed, and I think that's the point that they can dangle this stupid shit out there and Chuck TOT asked ass, has to ask
two or three minutes about it, and we liberals get our backs up and we're like how dare you side with
Kim Jong on over Joe Biden in you know these people don't care, they lie
when he attacked us. They love any attacks. Democratic politicians at foreign toil at all,
norms are gone and broken, and I think we ve all long past moved on from you know any sort of concern that he would hold up those norm. Side alone, I just like fed up with the bullshit yeah me. I guess I'm I agree it's almost it's sort of this is not new right. We shouldn't be so surprised like this. Is our trump speaks about his opponents? I do think the bigger issue is the fact that in his
You know permanent nineteen, eighty negotiation of granite countertops. He thinks buttering up Kim Jong Earnest.
The right thing to do, and the only path forward on you know. In fairness to him, there is no obvious good.
Negotiation, give it another that fairness like there is a better way to run a set. Of course, Al Gore totally failed. Creates you sought on him on this front. I'm not
things are to understand the like, there's, no, it's like what he gate. He could say
rate. He could say incredibly critical things about Kim Jong only continue to say the most farcical and eat
things about him jungle by comparing into Joe Biden, we're still in the same bad place. We already negotiating we're in a worse place, be when you are able to split the present I'd states from his national security adviser, spread, split the? U S and Japan and
Korea right like that is how he's weakened our position in these negotiations and my in my opinion, that is like the fundamental policy failure. That's not getting surfaced because he's calling names it is so intends to go on twitter and speed,
John Boltons, an idiot yeah North Korea Monday called the Bolton, a warmonger and a defective human product. So you know there's a lot of my name calling had ass, yet broken clock ray. I am about to say way. Let's hear these people as we like. How should Democrats handle these sorts of attacks on me and in what kind of case should the presidential candidates be making against Trump on foreign policy in a broader sense like? Is there any? Is there anyway to connect the dots and what happened and with his comments on North Korea, in Biden over
begun to four of other instances. Yeah me. I think that the he hasn't deliver anonymous promises now. He said he would get us out of wars in Afghanistan and actually sent more troops. His
His team ran this play in Venezuela to put installed
Guido as a president, his completely failed. He did this big set of negotiations on North Korea and they have completely failed to achieve the directive. So, in all those instances he hasn't lived up to its promises and he seems to lie
spending time with these dictators and tyrants, and not reaffirming alliances with Europeans, Japan, South Korea, all the people who actually help us achieve the things are trying to use. I do think we should be making a case on foreign policy is just the aids. It's not as it's it's a little more complicated than just pointing out that he's a climate of iron ore like that is a terrible human being no look. I do think that last point that he is in foreign policy. He puts his personal relationships for political and financial gain ahead of the country's national security over and over again right. He signs with Kim Jong Boon when he attacks. You know a former vice President United States. He sides with Vladimir Putin over the entire community.
When every piece of intelligent says that that that Putin sabotage our election and may do so again. He sides with the Saudis when they murdered a Washington Post journalist and has now decided to go around Congress and sell weapons directly to them. So it time and time again he keeps siding with these murderers dictators, because why
You know I envy them, I guess envies them and he sort of he wants the deal. He wants the personal relationship and its at the expense of our nationals.
Dirty over and over again, and I feel like some democratic Kate.
We most democratic candidates can go out there and sort of connect. All these doubts together can I actually I haven't heard anyone really do it's
there's a there's. A park has called doktor death in which a a insane narcissistic surgeon is going into people's backs like attach and schools, to the wrong place, making huge mistake,
and see on ongoing on the best surgeon in the world. I basically that sort of a Donald Trump
It should go shake hands like he gets in areas like on the fucking bastard and walk in. There were no fuckin charm, the charm, the Fuckin Missiles Office Kim Jong get those missiles, and then it is not going to get him. As I got. I mean and taken up by the day,
regulating crush it? This perception of Trump, as opposed,
Wars in the Middle EAST was very bad
She remembered morning doubts column, Donald, the Dove Hilary, the hawk. That was a big seminal thing. I, like your people, thought that Hilary was gonna, get us into worse. Trumpet get us out. The opposite has happened. They make their case. It's really, as we were constantly paying for the mistakes of twenty six, he obviously whoop country. Maybe the planet will pay for them. For the rest of you manage existence, but by tat there is a period of time or tromp was a pro gay dove
and here we are, as he is, laying waste to rules, protecting trans people and pursuing escalation in the Middle EAST and
and and and in South America and its like. Well so it just is just a betrayal of the country to its a betrayal of his own country, what he's doing with Putin and Envy S and Kim Jong Moon. He is betraying his country, he hates Democrats more then he wants to be tough on actual murderous tyrants all around the world, and it s.
She hates his perceive political enemies in opposition in this country. Ass, a thing that's, actually it's actually even giving him too much credit to suggest that he hates it such a thing. It's even more cynical than that right! It's here
he's value and taking this person about her son over how you take all about issues and indeed the question we should be asked.
Is actually less like. Can you believe,
That also trim said this. Can you believe that, once again, he chose to side with the dictator over Fucking Joe Biden, it's more, how sad the state of the Republican Party that an american president can say something like this about their power.
Hence, and there's just no outrage, nothing there's either Flint Digitech statement.
Here and there a republican congressmen have some, but not the kind of any part, because they know that due to Fox NEWS and the sort of
way in which their own base has been enough. The ties it there's just no cost for Trump to say something like this and that there's only costs to really saying the truth about Donald Trump when he does attack an American like us all about himself. It's all short term gain
So the president is now doing more than just tweeting about the people on his enemies list. Yeah on
Thursday Trump issued a directive granting Attorney General William BAR
the power to unilaterally declassify any government secrets held by our intelligence agencies and law enforcement, so he can investigate whether Robert Mothers Investigation was really just a deep state coup started by the Obama,
Ministration call Tommy. How unusual endangers is a move like this, so the decree,
Suffocation memo is a big deal. Basically, these did. The classification process in de classification process is governed by a series of executive orders and he basely gesture of rewrote that on the fly and inserted the attorney general above that process normally,
if you're the head of the CIA and classified Declassify things in grand people, access that information, he just slaughter the agee up on top and
Normally, I wouldn't be reflexively opposed to an effort to increase transparency and declassify things, except for the fact that bill bars running, and he has already shown himself more than willing to cherry pick, information to paint some deep state fever dream of a conspiracy to take down the president so
They are clearly trying to bring Biden into this in every way possible. It seems very likely that they'll look for like the next generation of the Peter struck text. Messages were somebody says you know, Donald
an idiot in some random email and in it was classified, gives some one of the agencies and some of the FBI, and suddenly it's it's part of this conspiracy. You know web were weaving, but it's it's like.
I think that I want to refer just sort of calm down
people that are like human
we'll die. You know you just hear that too much the good. The government cries well too much more time classified information by their bins reports that the CIA, some source close to Putin, who help this figure out the prudent personally green, lit the
the election appearance, if that name gets out there, that guy's toast
There are real sticks to this. This major change in its clear
we put aside, although what what does it mean for through into
officials and law enforcement officials who are out there. You know trying to get this information.
Yeah. I mean look of another country, your look,
and looking at us like we're insane for years right at me.
If you're a foreign intelligence service in a great white that you Eve, change the process to make it easier to release this information they. Why would we help you? Why would we, as a liaison intelligence service, provide you information? It is it's it's pretty, transparently, political.
Politicizing intelligent for me, yeah really does seem like bar, is becoming a more sophisticated version of Devenant us
yes sort of exactly colonel, like an imaginative imaginative, basically Devon Units is what would happen if sort of William BAR was walking your construction Sightedness Inner Box on his head, like that's what Devon Yunus event for a very long time
so now we're back to kind of now. Now we have a real sophisticated at the core of this as opposed to a bumbling twitter sewer. So that is very alarming, but you know it. It reminds me have been gauzy too in there
on any level. It is cynical and sinister right. The giving of giving bar this power to declassify things it carries grave risk is clearly a partisan effort. All that is true, but it is worth remembering that the core supposition of all
this is made up? It's me, I was just going to say, like what really drive me crazy about. This is why we have to continually relegate why the Russia investigation began. Let's do it one more time. Ok, just very quickly injured.
Live two thousand, and sixteen we find out that Russia has stolen emails and start disseminating emails from the Democrats and what happens on australian diplomat says. Oh, by the way I was with a Trump foreign policy aid who told me that the Russians told him they have a bunch of damaging emails on Hillary Clinton. If you are the FBI,
you don't open an investigation because of that you have not really fucked up and not to mention what happened.
In this apparent coup attempt there are two
Milton. Is investigations going on one of Hillary Clinton,
and one of Donald Trump. They keep the Donald
one, a secret till after he's, fucking president of the United States, while going on television to tell us just how close to
a criminal. Hillary Clinton was so this great coup attempt by fuckin
a colder and submit the powers really shut the bed and also with like spying on the term campaign Bob Ababa. Let's talk about the spying, it was one fucking person named Carter, page who was known as a potential russian asset before he ever joined the campaign and wasn't sir veiled until after he left the campaign and the application to conduct surveillance on Carter paid.
Was not some deep say plot was approved by multiple judges. Judges appointed by Ho Jon Republicans over ever get. That was it so if they were going to do surveillance on a Trump campaign, they really fucked up by only picking Carter paid and we I. I hope that we can get to the bottom of the sexy text messages. Perhaps we should be able to read them the text, messages that are the core of this. That reveal of this deep, say pot. Is there any way we
it will get our hands on these technologies other already released. They ve already been released are already was investigation, there's a reasonable conversation. We have about the size, of course, the foreign Intelligence Surveillance ACT courts. What is not
it was Betty had that this is nonsense. Is a lottery hohlakov relations that we had. This is trumpet also saying that he wants bar to scrutinise the role the Australians and the british government's played in this process.
Let me go out if you want to go after allies for trying to help him prevent a russian agent from a penetrating his campaign on aids deeper than you think,
goes deeper goes to the strategy. I guess relish the goes kangaroos that he's hop round, then, on top of that, any we ve never even really mind the fact that Rudy Giuliani was getting weeks from the FBI right before the campaign and was was talking on tv about that information. So I mean you can think that this is barges, appeasing trump and his crazy tweets, but it does seem like this is a broader, consistent strategy. Here during a press conference on Thursday and Bcg Peter Alexander said to Trump Sir, the constitution says: treason is punishable by death. Youve accused your adversaries of treason. Who, specifically, are you kidding of treason without missing?
beat trumps as well. I think a number of people, if you look at call me if you look at my cave, if you look at people probably higher than that, then why Omen Congresswoman was Cheney, said in an interview on Ebay, see on Sunday that the mother investigation quote could well be treason, former trumpet
key Corey Lewandowski says in an interview quote, I think we're going to see the Biden is behind the steel dossier that James Gummy, Andy, Mikhail, struck and page will be on trial for the crimes they committed against the fourth amendment and against this president, should we take us literally seriously or both you know it some, it's not the first time a reporter
given Trump the opportunity to say something truly and saying the kind of liked him up. So he says like alright, you want me to say the most crazy fucking thing I meant I'll say I'll, say whatever you want, fries and yeah kill them, kill them all. So you know I was thinking about this today because
really do feel like we're in this, in between space sort of there is the harbinger of the next step in american debt, like of in in in the devolution of our politics like we are hinting at show trials. We are here
at charges like this, we are like tilting towards it, and we also know that one of the reasons some of the more heinous anti american
a norm, violations that Trump sought like a resting. His opponents in pursuing his opponents were only stopped because people around Trump weren't willing to die.
So I don't think anyone knows the answer and on the one hand I dont want to say now is the time to
ring the alarm near trumps, about to put people on trial for treason,
but at the same time I think it's silly to pretend that Trump doesn't mean what he says you like
minds about we ve got a real way. My republic, five to it I mean this is intense, serious stuff.
And I would be great if we gonna wanna fuck Liz Chinese- says a word like treason- that the entire interview stops and pauses and focus on nothing. But that word for the duration, given that as a capital offence or you can use your life for treason
to be omitted. It's it's a big word. The Democrats and through our anonymous, should throw around its it. It's a significant part, also, even in the best case scenario where this is all just bluster from Trump in his goons fascism. For the cap it is, it is very difficult to see the consequences, the exact consequences of where this may lead right. Look, let's not forget that, a month before the midterm election, there was a man, a trump supporter who sent fucking pipe bombs to leading Democrats when Trumpeter rally in certain
about treason and the crowd start saying: lock them up, and he says the attorney general is gonna is eyes onto it. Don't worry, he's gonna, look at it. What do you think that starts telling people when they hear that they present aid states has to saying to them that Obama, administration, official law enforcement officials, Intel officials have committed treason.
Against this country, what is that, due to people who are already a bit unstable cannon, ring that
ashes bell. No, you got it some and its also to or minor that look. At least Cheney was Donald Trump before Donald Trump came along she's. Somebody who for years said
I need a one who she said. You know who side are they on about Democrats for a long time? She, like basically view Democrats as being disloyal to the country.
She was the one who led the charge against the ground zero mosque as they called it at the time. You know her political action committee, basically, Q, several justice form and lawyers of Al Qaeda sympathies. Remember that so you know it's worth remembering that this strain of vile kind of attack has been with the Republican Party for a very, very long time and
the only eight some their inviting their inviting everyone to follow the logical conclusion of what they're saying and maybe they'll do it for real, or maybe they just want the points, but but it's awful yeah and I also say the media has a responsibility here as well, because what happens when Bill BAR drops his big report, his investigation into the origin of the rough investigations a week before the election or on the eve of the Democratic Convention or-
it turns out to be entirely focused on Joe Biden for no good reason, it examined clearly binds being worked into this conversation. Music currently view him as the biggest threat. The double
right and will end how, in how seriously does the media take this because they didn't do a great job with the Devon newness release the memorable? No, they didn't do a great job. With these struck and dissipated text messages the came out, they all treated
big fuckin, breaking news. Look a serious accident do in our region with the fucking four page, Burma horrible job at the barn em. So out of winter. We get a learned that, like what whatever comes out of Bill Bars office about the origins of the russian restoration, should be treated like a fucking press release from the trunk campaign and no more serious. I think the real big story in big take away is that the office of the attorney general has been just fundamentally tainted and it is not going to be fixed until we have a new president states and it's something that tardy grapple with a political arm of the Trump campaign. That's what the attorney general's that's what the Department of Justice at the highest levels, as you know, in brain boiler, uncrooked outcome made this point. I think it's worth making look. I you know
he's been one of the people ringing, the Bell, the Bell Bank being banging the drum bells and drums saying that when that that the only logical step for democratic as impeachment and without impeachment, you leave your left open to these sort of specious investigations by bar etc, and I think that that is a debate worth having. But even apart from that Democrats in Congress need a plan to counter act would be.
Eventually does and they need to be ready with the the fuller story when Barra Negative
releases some completely one sided document, accusing Democrats of malfeasance based on
a totally unfair reading of intelligence that they have access to that members of Congress have access to
I will say it's another argument for pursuing impeachment proceedings, because impeachment proceedings may be the one way to wrestle megaphone away from Donald Trump and Bill BAR and focus the country's attention on exactly what they're doing, because right now, it's pretty hard to get that megaphone and the investigations are doing it because there being stonewalled and the Democrats,
Dont have a single message on this and, like you said everyone's, it runs out there being in their own rumbling in their own bells, but there's no focused attention on exactly what's happening right now and weather,
they pursue impeachment proceedings or not. This is going to happen. The Trump campaign
and bill bar gonna run their play, no matter what so we can either. You know,
look at it and yell at it, or we can try to focus everyone's attention exactly what's happened, it's quite amazing thing to watch as they run the exact same playbook with actually some of the same accusations and allegations, but just cross out the names like Clinton or Obama just put the name by men and just
say it and say it and say it until it just one of two viewpoints which the steel does. This thing is. This is the funniest thing right like, but by the time the steel dossier was released, read it was like in the middle, the twenty sixteen campaign, Joe Biden, look like you're gonna go retire from public life could write like he was just litter, lumbering from the horrific
tragedy you had nothing to do? It's literally just putting his name in steel dossier in the same sentence. There's nothing else to do with it. It is lazy, but as the kind of thing to get picked you got
originally Ani right around Kiev with a magnifying glass lookin for fucking clue, yes, dressing for prints, Dorglums Watson, watson- oh I'm! Sorry, I'm talking to a second class, a scotch pots of merit.
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The movement artless over the twenty twenty democratic primary, which the president has decided to get involved in beyond just insulting nicknames that lead to entire New York Times stories.
On Monday night. He tweeted anyone associated with the ninety nine before crime bill. He's. He's he's really concerned
the crime bill now out of the blue on Monday night, anyone associated with the nineteen eighty four
crime bill will not have a chance of being elected. In particular, African Americans will not be able to vote for you. Joe Biden was so heavily involved in passing that bill. I, on the other hand, was responsible for criminal justice reform which helped fixed the crime bill.
What's trump trying to do your guy, it's it's! So it's actually very subtle and hard to sets out its. It seems to be for some people. He is trying to depress Democrat
turn out that these just trying to can do. They know he sees an attack from the left and Joe Biden about the crime veil and he loves, suggest dive into whatever
dream of being a fighting. He sees out there, I it's so cynical and so obvious yeah well, and I should say to because the reaction from some folks on the left has been well. This is an example of you know why we should nominate. By
because the the further left we nominates, someone the harder it's going to be for trumped tredah divide the parting attack that person from the left. You no vote for her. If you want the prime,
scrutinise everyone's records in the primary for sure if they had a bad vote in the past, talk about their bad vote but dont for a second think that Donald Trump won't be able to successfully do this to any one of the democratic candidates who become the nominee. He will find something with every single one. In this case, Bernie also voted for the bill, in addition to Joe Biden, so he could do that with him. He could find something with Elizabeth warrant. He could find something better work files on the people to get. You will find something with all of them. His purpose in the primary strutted divide Democrats against each other, and we shouldn't let him
do that the fund should be among ourselves. We shouldn't let Donald Trump do it for us. We have to see a bad faith attack for what it is and in just call it out. I mean look that there's no important debate to be had about the crime
yeah about their incarceration and the role it did or did not play. That's a worthy discussion. Donald Trump kick started yet mean job tried to execute innocent black teenagers because they were black and he wanted a headline so yeah, but some eyes in the press will he's trying to do here.
Trying to be the assignment editor for the primary yet, but the whole list, for he is oh, oh, my god he is. The world's Simon editor
your planet, elected him, the buck and public editor. The times governance,
public editor and the world replace them. Mcdonnel fucking try if it sees that I'm freaking
that's all you
to do is, and you know like we can debate whether at some brilliant strategy on his part or just like he saw something on the crawl foxen friend the deciding to tweet right like who knows that could be both by
He does something like this now. Everyone knew no narrow. It's gonna be jumping in talking about what he wants us to talk about. Well, he thinks he has a record on criminal justice reform is too they passed a bill that did just
absolute bare minimum in terms of addressing some federal sentencing problems which the administration
is now dragging their feet on implement yeah I mean to to make it worse. States preside over the bulk of the criminal justice system, but what
a longer discussion for another day. So while this was going on a Washington post, peace over the weekend reported that
like most of his democratic rivals, Biden took Memorial day weekend off and hasn't been campaigning as much your doing as many interviews as the other candidates. What do you think the strategy is here from the Biden campaign in and what do you guys make of? It
I don't know I mean I, I think it's always dangerous- to run
a campaign in which you are trying to avoid avoid being seen to avoid losing whatever kind of front runner status.
At the same time, which, basically in the peace Hillary Clinton, former camp
major Robbie monk admits right and, and yet it's also early- and you know-
I know we live in a permanent campaign. I would not be surprised to see a sudden ramp up of Joe binds activities and see him everywhere all the time as we get closer, so I'm not totally sold on the thesis. Yet they think Biden turn around
rose garden strategy. Right I mean aid is its memorial day. I think that it's just after moral that I think is safe to say that the election has officially kicked off, isn't funny. You think we used to say that the election started after Labour Day yeah, that's crazy!
That's not true at all any more I mean I don't think, there's really alot of value to
doing a limited schedule of campaign of ants and again need to be out there. You need me people, you talk to voters, take questions you get better at it, it just the keys. The reps yeah me. I think there could be thinking within the Biden campaign that the more you put him out. Yeah he's he's the front runner he his name identification is almost a hundred percent. Every single person
those who Joe Biden is? They have an opinion of him and the more you put him out there. The more is answering questions, the greater the risk there is for him to fuck up saying something church.
So we can get them into trouble Craig because Joe Mine is voting famously unless ecstatic I'd, better sort of Giza is a machine
if there is a concern, but I also think when you're running in this primary against you know, there's twenty three candidates running end obviously also bind the gonna get questions about. You know his age. Does he have the energy
did you look ass if I would be running everywhere all the time, making sure that I'm I'm fighting for every single vote and, like you so loved that very well could be the case in the next couple months
his fucking early he's only been erased from month, but it's something too
I actually think the more to me than I expected. That's what will happen. I dont know if your campaign as hard as some of the others who are just trying to if I can get there get up in the numbers before any votes were cast, but I didn't with them more interesting question. I have is what share of events is gonna be where he just comes up to them. Comes at the microphone, delivers repaired speech and leaves whether that's fundraiser public events forces. How often he takes questions. I would not be surprised to find a strategy that says you know what we're gonna stick to kind of hitting our points and working to avoid taking questions which, I think is a you know, a choice. I don't I don't over a good one, but I can see what they would make it yet I mean I just maybe the pieces overstated like it. I dont think that any campaign will run a fork. Horrors often seen in June that those debts not a normal thing, that's an example strategies.
Probably the truth that he's doing a ton of fundraising events and there's just I think, he's letting the press pool into them, but he's not taking questions at them. They probably realize that they're going to eat a lot of money. Like you got imagine mayor, PETE is going to put up a huge number. This quarter, like Bernie Sanders going to put up a Tuesday or the score
out of people that are gonna wow folks, with their fundraising and inviting Biden wants me to front runner, he can't deliver a number that gets doubled or tripled by someone else. Do you think it matters how many campaign events these candidates, these candidates do and how hard their campaigning like that that the peace notes that
since he announced a month ago, Biden's one thousand and eleven events better than forty four warrants on twenty seven Bernie's. One thousand and seventeen. Do you think it makes it makes a difference whether you're running around that
Matters in Iowa were primarily in New Hampshire, some merely states, because your meeting for literally meeting people are gonna caucus for you and your getting their information and then later organizing them and turning them into volunteers.
However, I do think a lot of the campaign is run through the media. These days, it is more so than before. Yeah, it don't have allowed to say two things, one. It does its also just given how much of how much our involves not just around support, but like deep support and being in front of people's really important, but and also just one other point to about answering questions it fun razors. It's also worth remembering that, as
If you ever democratic politician is going to make a gaff, you would be a smart Tibet. It happened in a fundraiser, always so I again and again and again so I can see why, especially in mitigation, religion, deplorable or laws on the less sure the crowd, the crazier than that's it. It's a wonder one easy matter: it's true San Francisco and LOS Angeles fun, razors yeah who-
we tell you stay the hell out of the question some of the questions, you're gettin in those fundraiser jets, then I guess they wear shit,
They lead you down a path
it's like my jade egg to be covered by my insurance. It's also it is what leads politicians to become sociologists when they can be. Politicians may like you're supposed to be there advocating on behalf of people talking about issues, but super rich donors tend to want analysis and ponder tree about the race, and so they learn the politicians into offering poetry and analysis but Thrace and when you are offering penetrate analysis and you talking about
how voters think you sound like you're fuckin anthropologist and you get yourself in trouble. So the flip side of this is all the other candidates without turbines name, I D, who were trying to break through the near Times TV critic, James penalizes wrote a grape he's over the weekend. It was stored, sorry about the better doc, but it got into Democrats
if I for media attention writ Large- and he basically says that all these democratic and its face too big challenges- one is
figure out what enticing news producers to show their clips and what lures voters scrolling their phones to hit play the second related to the first,
is to implicitly argue how they in a general election, would seize attention from a president who can risk
Today's news line up by tweeting, Amene, nickname before breakfast is really smart by the way. What do you
think about that, and what democratic candidates have been doing a good job meeting those challenges in Europe, and I think this peace was spot on ice.
Every Democrat from the ones running to the people and leadership in Congress have failed to pull the microwave Donald Trump and it just it's something we have not figure it out. I think several candidates have succeeded in different ways. I will say
I a signal moment for me was when Elsie was talking about raising the top marginal tax rate and Elizabeth Warren was
about her well tax, as both happened at around the same time and all of a sudden, it was part of the national conversation was question for peace
at a panel in Davos. It was something that all the sun was being pulled in, showing that actually not just Democrats but Republic as independent support policies like
so Elizabeth Warrant, I think, has success, will use policy as a way to get the microphone away from down
providing mayor. Peat has successfully used his contrast with Donald Trump and his decision to go on Fox NEWS, at least to have a moment where we're talking about what may repeat said about Fox NEWS. Some of the lines is used about his service forces. Donald Trump service have broken through. So many there's a few examples.
Like that. That show that there are still ways to grab the microphone without having to sound like him yet and the ETA hit. That's the most difficult balance, because I presided at one of the toughest challenges on any democratic and pain, and it was when we weren't campaigns must be infinitely harder. Now in this media age. Is you wake up every day? And you say how we gonna make news today, how we gonna break through and there's a future
additional ways of doing that. One is we're gonna roll out a new policy and your Right Elizabeth Warren has excelled at that, partly because her policies- it's not just she's, put now random policies every day. They are ambitious policies. They are all.
Of a peace, either all about sort of economic inequality and the rules being broken the system, and there is such a speed at which is putting them out to rise. If you ve been to go in there,
The other way, but she's also found other ways to do it too, which is saying that she's not gonna, do a Fox news. Town hall,
when she found certain ways to do that, and I think mere Peters and too he really hasn't done it with policy at all. But he's done it by you know he's very. He he's excels at sort of like a democratic country strategy. What's wrong with the party. What can we do
better than that usually can make news as well. Yeah me an end and then of the eyes and the other. The other way to do it is just showing enthusiasm in big crowd. Events right, think of common values, first event where she got twenty thousand people in Oakland or Bernice rallies. Where he's gotten
Tens of thousands of people in some big cities mean, I think, unfortunately, the way you make news in a campaign often is by attacking your opponent and right now that will be democratic, democratic violence and that's not something we really want to see. It does depress the hell out of me to wake up and see the New York Times published an article inputs that is just a them regurgitating all the nicknames Trump has given to his various opponents and friends, and then people are asking Biden. What's your nickname for trumpet on these agreements? Com clownish think like that is one that indication that the press has not learned any
sort of lesson about how not to cover someone who treats politics like a sport for dumb people in two, like, I dont think that we should have a nickname for Trump. We should not call him clown or conduct.
Or some stupid thing? We should make a case. That is a little more substantive disagree. I thank God
are really cracked it with calm down. That's good
The apple of Troy
get in the news, interacting with Trump, in a way that doesn't go so often feel that you think it's a balance right like, I think the candidates who treat trump as someone who doesn't even exist ten to fall out of the new cycle, because this would run their own campaigner talking about their own policies. But you said you gotta get into the new cycle. Somehow you gotta be reacting to what's happening that day without looking like you're, too reactive has done so
but that there is a balance, their wedding, effigy? Look. What mayor PETE, I think has done for while that's really successful is actually a lot of the moments in which has broken through to me are moments where he's talking about Trump and talking about how to talk about Trump. It's interesting like that. I think that that that there is such a fascination on the part of journalists and also people who pay attention to politics who spread stories on Twitter and that big egg as Twitter is, as you know, along with troposphere Simon Inner for politics, that's a fastened.
People. How do you talk about tromp and may repeat often waxes incredibly eloquently and in a sophisticated and new way about what the way he thinks about Rob? I remember when he talked about. He talked about nicknames and punching back at Trump and what he said was in a strange way when you talk about going Toto
tromp and successfully beating him you're actually playing by his rules and in some sense seeking his approval, which was it completely?
novel release, public
in terms of the public conversation way to think about. Our tromp, I think, is one of the first moment people decided to give him like an extra hard look. I do think when, when Trump you know, does things like he did over the weekend with the binding
The North Korea thing you ve got to figure out a way to talk about that without
minimizing it without trying to reduce it to a hashtag game or an attack back on Donald Trump, but try to bring it to a bigger plain like into a big like you, you ve got you ve gotta be big while still responding to what have you think that's really hard, because I do. I do think one of the challenges has been that there has been a lot of energy,
about, whether it's you know, people tweeting like the writing, the federalists papers or everybody crossing the Delaware. There's been a lot of how dare you
This country was strong before you and it'll be strong after you, and I think I am
retired about I don't know, I don't know others.
We are tired of it, but I think that there health,
it's been a its. We keep it's. It's not
I love because he really is common and grabbing the sheep, but now ain't, but now
there is only a couple sheep left and we need it
The way to sound the alarm have to be able to capture the urgency of the moment. Yet you have to do and you right you can maybe toned down the language, so doesn't sound like your crossing, the Delaware all the time, but if you don't, if you dont rise at that level, if if your view of the moment is Hashtag Condon, that is small compared to what happened.
It now select rat. You dont want to be I rolling, but at the same time you wanna be big and let people know that this is urgent. Yap only go the trump doing. What he did to Biden over the weekend was a perfect opportunity for everyone to jump in and talk about his failed foreign policy record. Yes, the congressional research service has a report out today that shows that the republican tax law that past did essentially nothing for the economy. Literally, every single candidate should jump on that, because that will help us drive a message to the entire country notches democratic primary voters that President Trump is not enough, for you is therefore as big rich fact that donors and corporate friends etc, like we need to be jumping on those moments, not occasionally every single time they emerge and the key there,
That requires you to be incredibly nimble and to rip up your plans for the day. If something else happened, please tweeting stump speech quotes, everyone will death generally, but sometimes you may have a bid rule out for big policy in Europe.
Ready to do it and if trumps has something in and that's the news and that's an opportunity to really
show what you're made of, and you know why you should be present. You get acquainted kind of rip. Everything up at you know like dont. Go off your strategy should stick with your strategy, but sometimes you have to change your time.
Six last minute yeah. I do also think we're in this period right now we're we're talking a lot about trumps role,
in the administration, trumps role in our politics, trumps role, Visa be Congress, impeachment the inherent powers vested in Congress forces executive. What we
happen with bill bar. What will happen with the classifications, and I do think we are looking to a presidential candidates to find ways to move us back to the two healthcare move us back to the economy, move us back to health to to the corporate tax cut, even as we are pushing, as we are pushing Congress to focus on impeachment to focus on the crimes and corruption of the administration. But we also need to make sure that there are other flank people finding ways to make news or on the issues that are gonna die.
A lot of people to the poles. Ok, when we come back, you'll hear love it's interview with ACL, your attorney chase stringent pots of Amerika.
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Is it for priority joining us on the pod, he's a staff attorney with the Israelis, algae, BT and HIV project. Please welcome chase strategies. Thank for having me has gone. It's gone
right. You know it's new adventure every day, so the
the ministries in moved on several fronts last week in ways that can make this country less safe for transgender people. This time it was about healthcare and housing in homeless, shelters. Other steps taken by the White House. It concerned the military schools prisons, workplaces. How would you describe the philosophy? That's guiding the actions even distraction has been taken. Yet
since day, one. The tramp administration has put individuals in charge of federal agencies and other positions of power, and then, of course, from the president and ways.
Then, as well, who are committed to
dramatically, excluding transgender people from public life, and so this means that we are being policies from twenty seven
through the present dad
keep away at the ability of transgender people to protect themselves and basic ways, whether it with respect to housing, with respect to healthcare, with respect to access to employment, with respect to see more safely being held it in Berlin, the philosophy
is transmitter people don't to their legal protection, and we will do everything in our power to create legal norms that exclude transgender people from both formal legal protection, but also sort of basic act that allay necessities. So what exactly is the health and Human Services department seeking to do under
from you, treated that the effect of this rule could mean people like you are essentially erased. Bylaw debating two. I think that if you think that better that
critically important to know about. What's going on with respect to the regulation coming out of out of each of the first, is that its beak, you roll back them critical protection that were put in place.
Under the Obama administration that were part of the implementation process of the affordable care at an end, these protections thought you provide transgender people without explicit wave to protect again
how to care discrimination, whether that discrimination, when going to the emergency room and have been turned away because of a being transgender and then protections from exclusion from coverage on on healthcare related to being Trans, though out things like hormone, surgical care, account way related to the gender television and though, in a thin, the company penetration
have come into power. We ve seen you know that the damage
leading to the idea that they're they're gonna. Take me the way, and so this proposed rule not only thought of
eliminate all of the proposals to eliminate all the good Robot language back came through Obama, implementation, but then the second thing I die than ever, but we're thing across the federal government is it tries to define back in more restrictive and limited way. Is it not the rule that that that we had sort of thing
that had have been reported about New York Times that created its own regulatory definition of that's what it does is stripped away their protection than refers to
legal protection under other federal laws and those protection.
Under title nine, which protect would, in fact discrimination in in education,
elsewhere under better law are also being kept away by by the administration, and the Supreme Court is currently considering this very question, though we thought have this two pronged attack one view, take away protection that existed and then to the sort of implement across the federal government, a more restrictive understanding of how people are protected under under federal sex discrimination protection. So you don't. You said you.
This on twitter. Recently, you said, I don't know if I'm aware of a transparent and has it been turned away, mocked harassed or receive should care by health care provider because they are trans. So there you know even as
the administration is rolling back protections. What limited protections there are. It is still. It is currently difficult, not just because of of
its enshrined in law or not enshrined in law, but because of how people feel free to treat trans people, what what do you see as the
goal of the administration, not just around changing,
regulations, but about how the country sees trans people yet even as such and such an important point, because it because the eighty eight I forgive you
then regulations under the affordable care. Cried you create some legal mechanism for what had what
What is on the ground that sort of horrific that of discriminatory practices that
that people experience fabric in part from what them, though I may or may not bay, and though he had the lock and only in due time.
By then and that their violent, indiscriminate and attract people in health care. Professor, I think what aid programme
clearly concerning about whether the administration is doing is. Not only are they start, taking away the few legal protection that we have, that view sort of effort
normalized trans existence in ways that will overtime, increase back that the care and really truly lifesaving, wave, adding that the goal here not only to take away the formal protection but to really instrumental
an ideology that Trans people don't origin exist, and we know that that is very much the position
Many people that are at high levels of government
under the under the Tramp administration in Ivan litigating, in
Carolina bread for the past three years
and being North Carolina aunt, I try and why are they to be through an easy one for you, you and almost every per then that was involved on them that died of defending mobile, haven't senior position within the federal government now from nor Francisco, who Philip, in general view child again? Who is now a federal judge, upper lip
the head of the arbitrary civil rights. Andrei data that someone who has for
career folk, and I'm with you, you know
in my time has run out to be a few people and particularly tramp people, and that what we are seeing now is an effort to you, though I did then demands edge, nodded takeaway, formal protected within the methods that that transmit, isn't real
we're going to scare people into believing that we need to stop people from being Trans, and that is a really dangerous addition to the messaging that we're seeing and that part is certainly escalating. The rollback of protections in homeless, shelters, heals, quick, particularly cruel,
It seems really does seem rooted in cruelty. I know a lot of people say cruelty as the point, but that's not
internal logic right there. It's there there is, did
do they claim any other logic other than truly
eliminating the idea of trans people from our rules from our society like what is their rationale even to themselves having weekend
or of different rationale than all of them are sort of grounded and that of other core believed that tramples don't Orson exists. Sadly, but you know, I think that sort of on paper adopted the case and are false. Claims
leave be that somehow we lad Tran people into these areas that our thanks aggregated that baby will become
For my than we know that his country will, you know every bit of data that we have that it's a boat.
True and that the people who are at risk of violent
tramp people, no doubt the railway
about privacy, on the idea that a person's body a tramp, earthen pot,
These somehow inherently Breton the privacy of others, notably they data Biff question whether for the Supreme Court about whether protecting Tran students from discrimination and violated the constitutional, privately rape of non triumph dude.
The court today of rejected review in that case, which is that which is really actually important,
in for transport, and not with the key that had been brought by alliance, defending.
I am an organisation that is behind a lot of these policies and- and
and then in
we're being a new strand,
of arguments about you know thirty feet. Bathed objection to tramp existence,
and that is obviously coming into play here, but but whatever you want
strip away toward EV, whatever that had to be gathered his hand at bay. The goal is to be there
Mention be Tran. There actually saying that explicitly in a cave, but before the Supreme Court now, which is a case in which a tramp woman with fired by her employer
when he announced that he would be
me to work at the woman, the organisation that defending the the employer before the Supreme Court has publicly eventually stated that their acting out of the benevolent concern for her
being her authentic, true that somehow they think they're doing her a favour by trying to guide her back to her.
When on call biological back. So there is a sort of coercive couldn't conversion therapy about, though animating allow a lot of these policies- and I will note it all
What were thing where the military ban, for example the Justice Department and
the child administration are defending their transmit.
Harry by ban by being? No, no, you you, you can be transfer and you death can act
we live at the Trans Perth then, and though these reports
but these that are actually in almost gap, Whiting arguments,
by saying no, no, not discriminating against you didn't go, be somebody out,
Ok, I like it feels like a kind of
A new version of done asked him tat. They, of course you can serve you does it serve, as someone else can quickly
and get married when we began Marriage- you just can't married, but one of the things that zone
no. You mentioned this court case now that this this ruling to day- and you know, there's been a lot of question, but what's gonna happen with some of these rulings around health care?
You tell what what exactly the the lower? What what executive
court did today to uphold this lower court ruling and how do you think that
impact other attempts to stop the administration in the courts.
Yearning for today's act in by the Supreme Court, while upholding a lower court ruling that eventually bad when in school they drag protect Trans dude and that they have every right?
that and that even violating the rights of the non transparent for that sort of wine version of the cases
We see in the context of ETA Transit Germany's indicators that are brought by the non transparent, challenging protection for Trans people, the other third brand. Okay, there are. The cases brought by try
people who have experience discrimination, arguing that the discrimination impact with Germany's them
I would end by federal law and that set of questions it before the Supreme Court soda.
Being brief now and will be argued next term,
really that the core of a lot of these admitted the lot of the actions of the men
it about sort. How and whether and how our elderly people
protected under a federal prohibitions on sex discrimination, so that question is very much alive and I will note that, for the past fifteen years, the lower courts have held that trans people are covered under federal law, prohibiting discrimination on the basis of facts or under
oh man, entitled fab in the question,
How can we protect Trans students? I think that back
that night review in that cave sends an important message to school.
I want to do the right thing: schools that want to ensure that students have equal access.
He's no opportunities that that means the good rulings band.
No counter Mina ruling than the lower courts in incomparable cases?
better than me. We won't any more, but but I think what we can:
away from the court action today. Is school employers
Oh I'm doing the right thing: protecting transferable from discrimination.
We're same almost there. As you know, we have state law, we have the constitution, we have lots of mechanisms for people to be protected on four
in ITALY, the court had taken up a theory, the question but implicate the rights of elderly people, and that will be decided next term
But I think no matter what happens there, what what we have to keep biting porridge
increase understanding of how dangerous it dangerous. It is fundamentally
try to remove people from the protection that the line from basic and fundamental ways. So
we're in this sort of strange moment? I think it's fair to say that there's never been
or visibility around Trans issues and around Trans people. I think that a lot of people
have come to learn a lot in recent years about the challenges facing trans people.
Trans in their own lives. How important these issues are? It's become something that democratic politicians talk about that that
is just part of the conversation in a way it wasn't before. We see trans actors in in in roles and in a way that is unfair.
It ended and yet, at the same time we seen him.
Restoration, launching an all out assault on Trans people at this moment of serve cultural progress.
My question is: how do you, how
you feeling right now about the state of of acceptance and progress on behalf of Trans people,
I must have a whole lot of their attention that once they mean there is obviously an increase in visibility. More people are dealing with and comfortable on farm level, too, were publicly as them above them. On that.
The progress you know being able to not hide a fundamental truth of who you are is essential for many people
rival, so God think is- is incredibly important, but with visibility, come of both in our directive be back
as well as interpersonal backlash, and I think that, although the moment that were end, that we really have to be responding to what one of the moment
in four things about last week with three background women were murdered and the response of our government.
Well, who I now as some of the most restrictive in our policies with her
that your hand, people and roll back than protection that will
absolutely ethically violence against the commission
work, who are most funneled and history by Tom I've into criminal economies and
sort of instability that then lead to increased on our ability to violent red hot, just not just targeting trans people. These are so. These are rules targeting the most vulnerable trans people in our society, people who have already
victimize by so much injustice that they either are living on this,
need or or seek
Help and homeless shelter is right. This is targeting people
already seen the consequences of such sit. Systemic injustice directed against them yeah exactly this is yes we're talking about a government that is invested in targeting in Seattle
at most vulnerable trans people, the people who are most likely to be killed and announcing now
a the week where we have three black hand, women who have been murdered and in the trauma
immunity of having the whole. That
while you know seeing crowned actors on television and seen Trans narrative, you no thought of in popular
Cora, thin and and and media is, is important. If not it's not leaving the Parthenon, the street at not dropping those acts.
You know interpersonal violence or governmental. Aggression, though I think we are
that directive. No, that MS ability won't alone leave us. I do think that the more we have cultural conversation that include tramp people and the truth of our story is the more we're gonna be trapped. People empowered view are felt b.
Indeed all the power and dropped the conversation I know for me, the Trans lawyer has been incredibly powerful to be there
Lee and vocal each hand in government faces and state legislature
in the court room in the positions, because that enough, it felt as a dirt disruption that perhaps I could not have done without all the ways people Kate who came before me were able to produce cultural content,
that allowed me to imagine myself in the future, and so I think we want
hold their value and not achieve that.
Law and even gonna feed people isn't gonna. Keep people from being homeland isn't gonna, make sure that we condemn rob but those acts of violence on the streets. So what
We will do it there looking to help with the fight. You know, I think, there's so much better
ok, you know everything start small thirty veto with your friend with your family.
And a challenge we will understanding about who turned
people are injured, start to include tramp people in conversation and then I think that something that
can really make a difference
and then in the next year.
Not only are we gonna pay the number of critical? Ah, you know better.
Elections are an state and local elections, but the Supreme Court is gonna, be answering some critical questions about our trans people are protected under a federal law that what we want people to be doing is really raising the profile
the issue of Trans survival as have not thought of french Quota court
Kennedy, politics issue, but really a core issue when we're talking
economic justice and ratios of death and criminal legal system reform.
How we conceptualize gender and bodily
upon me is always gonna be central to those questions, and if we, if we neglect,
pay attention to how trans people are treated and we are that can hear him
you can watch. It happened
think we're all gonna end up missing out on some important transformative.
Relations and accountability. J Strand ya, think
So much for joining us yapping family
all right. Think such a strategy for joining us today,
We can talk about with that pleaded
about the hilarious story on CNN about being trapped on airports. One without Fraga, who doesn't sleep, did look like hell,
What could you not adding these people deserve more Fuckin loggerheaded conference room with a diet, coke out fuckin, not far, whose document how coolly ass, he rode fox and friends in finding things, get all trip plunges sort of you. You put your cookies, put your chair and kind glance up
that fucking mug is staring down at you. It was trips are awful for a variety. I hope it turned it in
rob what? Yes, I always hear less login never lied and trotted there eating foxen friends over. That is the best punishment flying around airports, one forever with them
just how urgently thinking you're about to land. Like note where we clearly in the air a renewed refueling again, he must part of such a huge
for those ports that yeah, please don't act like that surprising to you. You know damn well at all. It is not surprising. I just didn't. I just didn't see, that's where we're going
what can I do.
Transcript generated on 2020-03-30.