« Pod Save America

"Trump always shoots the hostage."

2017-09-05

North Korea conducts a nuclear test. Sessions announces the end of DACA with a six month delay. And Jon, Jon, and Tommy are joined by Congressman Adriano Espaillat to discuss potential legislation to protect Dreamers and reform the immigration system. Plus a discussion of a New York Times piece on rising economic inequality.

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This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
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you Know- look- it was a holiday weekend. There's a lot going on. Did I see an eight hundred and thirty calendar? Invite yes, but then I still in my mind, make it nine hundred o'clock. You bet I did you bet I did, but I like the wind guys. Tommy is joining us from SALT Lake City, where we were so, we can. Our friendship mcdata got married, so Tommy hanging out there you guys officiated, we did, we did Tommy, officiated, the wedding. It went very well by the power invested in Bros it's actually by the power vested in power vested. That's right. You know I because I had invested in Tommy Correct. That is where the ceremony I founded critical type. That is really yes and I'm glad you corrected me. I wish it had been on the podcast. I would, but it's done. Yeah well go! Okay, guys on today's show, so we will have New York congressman Adriano's Biot, who will be talking about Trump's decision to end the deferred action. For childhood arrivals program, which just happened within the last hour, Ok, let's first talk about other pods pod save the people is out today.
Tuesday, Dre is talking to former education Secretary Arne Duncan as well as the candidate. Georgia, Governor Stacey Abrams, that's great, I know me too, I would have on the spot and it's out right now. You can download the awesome Tommy who's on parts of the world this week, Doug Loot, who was who ran the Iraq and Afghanistan WAR for President Bush, stayed on with President Obama. We talked about what that was like what he learned with over five years in the military. Six in the White House in two years is the US ambassador to NATO so he's pretty a person who sees the whole fields and understand these issues like very few others. You will not want to miss it excellent. We will check that out Ok, so I want to talk about talk about. Let's start with N Korea, 'cause we haven't talked about yet and Tommy. We have you here, so I'm going to ask you all about it. On Sunday, N Korea tested a high in bomb about seven times stronger than the bomb that the US dropped on. Hiroshima is the country sixth nuclear test. This falls the N Korea,
launch a missile into japanese airspace on August 29th there's also reports that they may fire more intercontinent ballistic missile soon, as well lovely Tommy. I know we probably can't pinpoint this exactly, but what do I think Kim Jong OWN wants here. What is his game Plan, or at least what are some of the possibilities of what he's trying here literally no one knows I mean, there's a theory that they think having their weapons program and and having an icbm, ability where they could actually launch a nuclear tip, ICBM that could strike the United States provides them a deterrent that they think will protect the survival of the regime. There's uh to think that the continued development and tests of these missiles and the nuclear tests are an effort to by the alliance divide up the US and the Koreans. Japan and split us up and try to you know, create diplomatic,
Friction that would you help them sort get what they want, which is to get us to stop doing military drills with South Korea or to get the US to pull its troops out of south entirely, so I mean there's a whole bunch of different theories. I think the what I've seen on this is that anyone who claims to know what he's thinking is is probably lying or If they really really know you're deep in the bowels of CIA and you're, probably not going to say anything but isn't it, really dangerous situation yeah, it sounds like it. I, reading the Times New York Times. You know they have. The conventional wisdom thus far has been. Like you just said, it's a defensive measure. To prevent regime change, but then I thought that some, on the Trump administration are now thinking that it's getting little worse, which is potentially he can use this as blackmail. You know the worst case there would be. Let us invade S. Korea or else, will nuke LOS Angeles kind of thing, or at least going, try to get away with smaller military provocations now, knowing that they have this, this nuclear, and if anyone tries to fight with them right,
That's always been one of the broader concerns about proliferation of these weapons. Generally. Is that you could you don't necessarily have to launch a nuclear weapon to use it. You could give it to a terrorist group. You could you know sort of. With a mother, bad actor. You could use it as a as a cudgel that you hang over your adversaries that in increasingly Kostic step and you know do things that you not be able to get away with before so like a lot of scenarios here, none of them trend in a direction that feels for all of it. All of it is getting worse, and you know this was their six nuclear test, but it was by are their most successful one, it's not clear if it was actually, a hydrogen bomb. There's some. Some experts think that it was a boosted can actual nuclear weapon, which is it still bad. It's still a very successful task, but you know the hydrogen bomb we tested. The bikini atoll in the fifties was like one thousand times more powerful than what we draw
in here Shima. So they have a ways to go: before. They are truly threatening. Like. China does or like Russia does, but it's they're moving they're progressing quickly, and that should be worrisome day. Everyone it clearly is to the Trump administration. I mean you when you read, gentlemen, this is comments when you read Nikki Haley's comments like people are seized with this. They're very worried. The problem is that Trump's response is not helpful, reading. Criticism of the President of South Korea just calling him weak for wanting to have a conversation. It is not helpful. Like floating that we're going to cut off all trade with anyone that does business with N Korea is not remotely feasible and is not helpful so like their these splits in the alliance that are developing their the direct So the things he's saying in response to these actions, but at the same time, what is helpful because we've had we've had several residents who aren't Donald Trump, who they tried the diplomatic approach they tried to threatening approach. You know from
the Clinton, Ministration, the Bush administration, the Obama administration, things have progressed and it seems like. Is there any hope for any kind? They change. It just seems like we're moving inexorably toward a nuclear N Korea as a defense, again regime change an they don't seem bent on stopping and we don't seem to have the tools to stop them. Well, I mean look. Now we ultimately resolve. This is the hardest problem in all the foreign policy, but I don't think it's hard to say that attack the President of South Korea, in the midst of all this, unhelpful thing to do. I don't think it's you know surprising, to say that, like threat, to pull out of the USS South Korea Free Trade agreement in the midst of all this is unhelpful like what what is been useful in the past, is getting all, the relevant actors in these talks and these processes on the same page, in approaching N Korea, with unanimity in going the Un Security Council to get more sanctions, unanimity and use diplomacy and whatever, the tools we have to get
You know sanctions or to try to with the Chinese to reduce exports of oil or stop selling them cold, I mean there's a whole bunch of additional economic pressure. Steps that we could take that get harder. When you have a president knighted states, that's seemingly are interested in tweeting criticize China or South Korea, then engaging them in a serious dialogue to try to get them to take the steps. We need that's sort of what I'm getting at yeah. I mean it's it's funny because in the outline I have let's talk about the Trump Administration response and then Trump first It's because insanely those two things are different, they're very, very differently. Like you were saying, Tommy, like his response, was to attack s Maria on Twitter and to sub cutting off the United States. Trade relationship with China, which is our biggest trading partner and like not just not feasible but like Comically catastrophic for the United States like Nikki Haley and Mattis
Kelly, have a have a snapchat filter that makes Donald Trump Mitt Romney so yet but like. If Korea was able to take a bunch of steps. The US in China into a trade war? That's a big win for North Korea. Loss for us right right right, I mean like there are biggest trading partner by far that would create at an economic catastrophe. So we we don't want that yeah so to the For the lesson saying step, let's say Nikki Haley. She was at the she said, she's trying to pressure the United States, the United Nations Security Council to cut off all oil and other fuels to North Korea, specifically trying to pressure China. She also said the time has come for us to exhaust all of our diplomatic means before it's too late. A you know, would this make a difference: cutting off all oil and other fuels to Korea, Korea, if China did this and an would China ever go for this, to know, I mean I think, ninety percent of North Korea's trade, basically and almost all
It's imported energy is from China, China's overall trade with the NW up in the last year, or so so there. There's some questions about whether this only hurt regular people in North Korea who need to take a bus from one town or the other, or need energy to heat their homes, because he's in the military is assumed to have stockpiles of of energy the last time a significant period of time, there's also concerned that they may lash out and do more so I mean, I think, there's probably risk you have to take to exert increase, more pressure on n korean under military. But there's guarantee like love. It was saying earlier that any of those things are actually going to work and solve the overall problem: zero S, Korea, defense Minister on Monday said it was worth reviewing deployment of american Tactical nuclear weapons to the korean Peninsula, to guard against the north. Does that mean? Is that a good or bad idea would that ever happen attacked nuclear weapon, is one that is
in some ways? Small enough that it's seen as being able to be used on the battlefield so if there were a big tunnel. It was used to get forces from one point to another or I don't know some sort of like route that they were going through the you might be able to take out completely You could use a tackler tactical nuke. I think it sort of sounds insane on its face. I think now. These things you want to throw into a bucket of things that are designed to serve reassure the south korean government or military or people that were on their side. That will help them that will continue to escalate. But you you hear these things that are getting floated like requesting permission to increase the payload on south korean, missiles so that they can, you know, use them more effectively against n korean targets. I mean all of this: is so s Calatori in a region that is fraught intense
begin with. I mean none of it. None of it sounds good, like all these things were talking about our military solutions and their seemingly no diplomat got going on, and you have a president tweeting that talks are weak and that you talking is not the answer. You know. One thing I saw people talking about over the weekend is the larger context, this kind of diplomacy and people are noting that Libya, Iraq, that these are examples of countries where Kim Jong Moon can look at these countries and say, if I don't have nuclear. Ends. This is my fate. How much damage to our ability. Convince someone like him Jong Moon, that giving up nuclear weapons peaceably as step he can take for himself personally. Has american policy, Gime change caused. It's great question: I think it's I mean obviously a rock, was seen by most people as Disaster, I think, the more and more you step back from Libya and
here the way it's talked about in scenarios like this, you know with kadhafi sort of being literally killed in the streets because he gave up capability, it does make you step back and wonder and rethink I mean ultimately that was you know supposed to be a humanitarian intervention to save you know several one hundred thousand people in Benghazi from getting massacred by kadhafi's troops in forces and it it escalate ' it into a broader NATO mission that ended up toppling the government and leaving to regime change. But yeah I mean you know, it's a whole part of the list of unintended consequences that come from these things, so for all the ship, the Republicans have given Obama years about red lines, it seems like with N Korea. Trump is sort of draw and then erasing red lines. As this crisis progress is, it seems, The latest is matter saying that basically, the the the new line is, if we're threatened with attack- and I was sort of what does it mean to be threatened with attack like at what point does it seem likely that we would strike N Korea or some sort of military action yeah.
And confused by I mean it seems like apparently we're now defining red line is only one, you say, here's my red line, but it does appear to be shifting. I was not entirely sure what that meant either 'cause. It seems unlikely that they're going to say, hey here's the ICBM with the weapon on it we're going to attack you now and then you sort of right, after create issues, threats against us on a semi daily basis yeah they have the most over the top rhetoric in history. Well, I mean, at the end of the day like these guys have artillery pointed at Seoul where tons of american civilians live where we have one thousand five hundred US service members serving and there's also now apparently have the rain a while the range hit Japan so there's a lot of terrible scenarios where military intervention is taken really does seem like there's any good outcomes here: huh happy Tuesday, everybody no, I mean look at diplomacy,
won't necessarily solve every problem there was always seemingly some value to having an ongoing diplomatic process like talk in the Middle EAST between the Israelis and Palestinians, could sort of things. I think that was not necessarily the case in North Korea like there were talks, and then there are n Koreans. Were behind the scenes, and that was incredibly problematic but, like it's been no diplomatic track that we've seen, and I think that has made things worse, so just like one last thing on North Korea are there the hail Marys totaly out their policies totally new approaches that people are talking about. Normalizing relations doing something completely unexpected or you know that had been whatever considered unacceptable or not appropriate for a long time, because we're in this desperate, in which nothing we have done in the past seems to have worked the one I saw was Henry Kissinger is apparently been pitching an idea where we go to the Chinese and say we talk about
happens after the north korean state falls and we commit to them that we will pull US troops, out of South Korea, we'll get our guys off, Peninsula so view this is sort of american military, just creeping north, closer closer to their territory, that's sort of, like the. Kind of interesting, Hail Mary, that I've seen. I don't have an opinion on it, 'cause. What the hell do. I know but yeah, but that's your question that would be about. I think, China to do what they've been afraid do which is actually put the economic screws to North Korea to the point where the state would collapse. It would exactly a terribly punishing thing for the millions and millions of people there, but that would because that's Henry Kissinger, but that's one idea for something uh yeah I mean it would be terribly punishing in the short term. I guess he could make We argue that in the long term, not having to live under Kim Jong on right is beneficial, but I mean it's all about them, their overarching
certain being that the n korean state collapses. Millions of refugees go over the border, or the pencil or unifies, and something american ally is right on their doorstep, as opposed to having a buffer of North Korea between the two. But I have no idea if they would listen to that or not. It seems like China has to become more concerned about a nuclear attack launched by Korea than they are about a refugee crisis, energy prices or the United States and S Korea sort of being at their border yeah. Luckily we have the dealmaker the great Trump able to deftly navigate these delicate issues. Wonderful, when we back, we will talk about another happy topic, Jeff sessions, announcements that Donald Trump will end the deferred action for childhood arrivals program. We will cover that as soon as we're back
We love Sonos, I mean I love, so this is now in our new house. There was another speaker we put in the kitchen, we have cool, we have a couple different ones that surround sound. It was it was the easiest thing to set up in my house, I treated myself every weekend. There is, I literally drove the store to get eyeglasses. So that I could play video games. Where does this when is coming, so I'm playing game called pray, which is awesome, and I it's over this on us. I have the play based on the tv is on that and there's a speaker in the dining room. So anyway we were talking about Taylor Swift put out, ended up her song and inflated over the sound system. Did you like the new one cherry at the juries out, I'm not sure about what Taylor Swift is putting out these days. However, however, I will say it's not so nice as well. It's not known as default No, it is not where I wanted to be, because it was you know you switched over playing music and I was like you know what enough music and then just with the click inside the app
I'm hearing my video game again and I'm battling the Typhon and it's all working out, so no offering listeners apply the american Ten percent off one order of twenty five hundred dollars or less. I like an immersive SAM, that's the kind of game I like for any product on Sonos dot com. This offer is available for a limited time only and cannot be combined with other discounts promotion. You tell the story, use the promo code PSA ten cap, PSA? One zero: it's honest dot com to receive this exclusive offer. The game doesn't tell me when to go to the bridge under the bridge when I want okay attorney General Jeff sessions made an announcement just now. The Donald Trump will be ending the deferred action for childhood arrivals program in six months. If you are currently a doctor's then you can renew your permit for another two years. So as long as your renewal is within the six months correct, but no new requests for permits will be acted upon. Trump was too much of a politically weak. Howard to say this himself and sessions refuse
to answer any questions about a decision that may lead to the deported? Eight hundred thousand young people who have lived in America for most of their lives just to review. So everyone knows what a Daca recipient is the average age they came. United States with six years old the age of them. Right now is two thousand six hundred and ninety one percent or employed one hundred percent, one One hundred percent have no criminal record. They pay five hundred dollars to renew this. Every two years, and that gives them opportunity to work in the United States and pay social security and other taxes I would say this is probably the cruelest decision that Donna has made since becoming president. Yes, I think just ending Daca is the cruelest thing that Donald Trump could do. It is true put a six month window on it and because it's trump we can't try, to do anything about it to successfully pursue a legislative strategy to fix it, but at the same time, clearly he could
and it outright today. If you wanted to so well, here's why that's bullshit I know that was a lot of the reporting leading up to this. I know. There's all the White House This is said, the Trump isn't not shore and- and I know Maggie Haberman at the New York Times and people politico also believe this that, at the end of the six months, perhaps he just quietly extends that, because you know he didn't really want to end it. I think of that. Case you would not have Jeff sessions I'm out today that statement said it is being rescinded. There is a letter sent the program is being phased out, it is done zero. They are giving you transition period, but it did not. Here by any means seems today that Jeff sessions the way that he made that announcement. What he actually said at the press conference is that Who is leaving room for this? We don't know if Trump would sign legislation that passes Congress to protect this program right, So there's no indication that that
yeah I mean this is the problem, one of the many problems with the Trump administration. You know he can instantly tries to use his innate cruelty as leverage, but is too confidence and undisciplined to Cecily do that, he's doing that with the Obama care exchanges and trying to sabotage them now to know and whatsoever. Given that the legislation is dead, he is now threatening one hundred thousand young people with Rocka, who now are panicked and terrified because they have idea if their status will. Can you, beyond this renewal period now, but the same you can see how this is. This is Trump as a worsen ruler version of where the Republican Party is where Jeff Sessions is where Tom Cotton is. You could imagine another republican president announcing a plan to phase out Daca as part of a strategy to get something out of Congress to get border funding to get a comprehensive bill now, because it's Trump
is no strategy. There's no one competent, but you know, there's a a general overseeing a bunch of goons who Ability to work with Congress of Anything Donald Trump has been a hindrance when it comes to working Congress. So it's terrifying because he's playing chicken with peoples lives. But he has no idea how to work the machine. So it's horrible on that front. Being said, we have a six month period in which Congress can protect these young people. I see Democrats today, saying: okay, you want you you say there should be left up to Congress Jeff session. I think that should be up to Congress. You know the we can talk about the constitutional issues and whether or not it's legal and you know the vast majority of of the legal scholar say yes, but it's an extension of presidential power. You want to debate that fine put it through. Congress is a clean bill or you want to talk comprehensive reform. This is your big play for immigration reform, even though you've not talked about that and you set out tax reform. Is the next thing fine, but like clearly, Donald Trump did
want to go out in front of the podium in a piece, is based on this thing, and that is a glimmer of hope on this issue. Tommy yeah, I second everything I said about the cruelty. I like, it also seems just pray an American to punish a kid for something there. Instead, when they were four or five years old, God help all of us, if that were, if that were the in this country. I find myself increasingly confused by the politics of the issue, because polling where this, like six thousand four hundred and sixty five percent of Americans support Daca, but Trump is throwing this back. Two Republican Congress and asking them to fix it. When nearly all of them, voted against the dream act in ten, so it doesn't, it doesn't seem like is a ton of hope there, because there's so much anti immigration sentiment in the republican base so mean in a weird way: you're seeing these soundings from members of Congress who are talking about there how concerned they are about this choice. I just wonder if any of them will muster the political will to do some
Think about it. I'm not hopeful, I'm not to hopefully there any right. I actually saw Paul this morning. That said something like eighty six percent supported people who came here and there five years old saying and when you get the teenage years, it's like eighty three percent you're right. It's overwhelming, I think, tommy- that the politics on this actually change in a very short time, because back and when Obama tried to pass this legislation, you not only had a bunch of republican or almost all Republicans voting against this Jon tester voted against it in the Senate. Joe mansion wasn't there for the vote but said he would have opposed it. So you had some Democrats even opposing this as well. I don't think you find any day rats today. Who would oppose this? I think the politics shifted and you Paul Ryan, Orrin Hatch, some others say we should fix. The president. Trump should do this and we should fix this legislatively in the Congress, but Weather I'll be able to do that or not is you know, we don't know as love
said there's a six month window. I don't think that six month window is probably that's up to now us activists to everyone else to put enormous pressure on Congress to do something about this John. What do you think Democrats should be doing right now. What should our position be? Our position should be introduced. Sing. Another version of the dream act or whatever the we're saying it's on Thursday there's a version of the dream act that Dick urban and Lindsey Graham introduced bipartisan bill. It's very good piece of legislation. It would protect all these eight hundred thousand young people and they should introduce and Democrats should be pounding the pavement on it every single day, so it should that should be. They should demand it. They should scream it from the rooftops yeah. I agree with that right, the politics have changed. Its Democrats have shifted to the left. There was this video circulating over the week. Which showed George Hw Bush Ronald Reagan debating. Basically this issue and both of them
getting over backwards to show that they were more compassionate, which is a totally reasonable- and you know reasonable thing to see and look at these are not you're not to people I think we're a particular compassion in their policies as president, but there you have it. It seems like the Republicans in a lot of ways. Shifted to the right Democrats are shifted, a lot of ways to the left this issue. Ok, so we're going to say, give us a way to make these kids, but statue of a six month window, let stay, and then, if Republicans haven't, for the for Paul Ryan says: let's have a legislative solution. Of course he voted again. Legislator solution when he had the chance right, o trump in the please come back and say we want border security. We want a wall, I mean what so we say that do we say will be for that. As long as the This project will be for that as long as you do something for these kids and the other millions of people who are here I mean is this: do we give in to this wall nonsense to try to get something through Congress, that's where I think the politics are so strange from the White House: it's because you have
Bing Docious is very popular program funding a wall that people increasingly believe will not work in any way is not as pop program anymore. So I feel, like he's thrusting Republicans, into a very tough political situation where, as Democrats can just push for straight a straight three max type legislative fix right, yeah. Well I mean that we exactly time, because I love it. What you're saying is so hypothetical right now, because there is no unified republican plan. There is no plan on the table at all right. There is a few Republicans who said: maybe we get a wall. Payment in order and then pass a version of the dream act, but not every Publicans on board that not even a majority republicans are on board with that. Tomkat is saying: he'll only do it as the dream act. If you a curb legal immigration and lower immigration levels like in the plane that Steven Miller wrote, but that's only Tom cotton there's, some well, who would just do a straight dream act bill like Lindsey, Graham, so you don't have a republican position on this so Democrats,
no reason the Democrats to start negotiating and themselves already when there has not been the Republican Party broke. This and other public and party has to offer a plan to fix it. That's where we should start right now. Okay, I hear that yeah I this is. With trump problem, because you know Ben Smith wrote something in Buzzfeed the weekend, which I thought was good. He says Donald Trump He shoot the hostage right that he has this leverage right, Obama care. He had leverage over the exchanges on on Daca. He has leverage over these young people he's lever, and he spends it in this capricious and undisciplined way without any strategy, because there's no good around him. He was the ability to do this and he himself had. Absolutely no idea what he's doing and blacks the discipline resolved or values to care enough to see anything through the and wall. If he, if he went out there today and said, I believe, the, program is illegal and unconstitutional. I don't believe we should kicking out these but we have this huge problem of illegal immigration, and we've allowed this to go on for thirty years. Give me
security and we can figure out the immigration thing together if he was some. If he wanted to use this, he could do it, but there's no impetus. There's no goals to any of this. It's absolutely ridiculous. It allows me that you just made the point where, like that's, why your original point about how you think there's a clicking it through no but like there's like a glimmer of hope and all this stuff that he didn't really want to end it. No that's all fucking bullshit He really didn't want to end it. You don't send Jeff sessions out who's. The biggest opponent of this and says it is over. It is done with Jeff sessions. Do not urge Congre! acid solution, you didn't do anything right. So there's email to your brain open Jeff session. There is no public statement from the administration two day that they actually want Congress to fix it and they're going to sign it zero. If so, if Trump really wanted to fix it. He would have done exactly what you just said. Look right, but at the same time he is worried about his base and he does. It wanna seem like he's appeasing these people to his face. He sent out the most hard liner to say. I'm ending this thing, but that's, is not necessarily a single he does signal. He doesn't want a legislative fix again. We know,
I think any answers. Unknowable is Donald. Trump wants nothing right, but that's just because he sends out, as most of his most hardline person doesn't mean that a legislative fix is impossible. That's right, Tommy, but it's it's just so far. But you have this very hard immigration problem. Seemingly, the only solution being floated is a very expensive wall that no one thinks will work. Throwing this into the mix in the have a month or year, debt ceiling, fight and you're going to have a massive piece of legislation coming up to fund Harvey relief efforts and you have a cat. Forty five hurricane Irma down on Miami's like what are they doing? That There is no It's in my mind that Congress is going to be able to take on something this large in fraud and challenging I guess just speaks to the fact that the Stephen Miller is in Jeff sessions in the world know that by pushing this now it will it will Daca and that's ultimately work and they don't care if the process is messy and keep in mind that, for there will be a lot of
today about how Trump is cruel. Trump did a bad thing. Trump is incompetent, but this is a bigger problem of the Trump era. Here we only focus on Trump and not any other parts of the politics that are broken. If the republican Kong does not fix this program. Every single member of that Congress is as guilty as Donald Trump, absolutely on Daca they're. All they have it's not like they rubber. Donald Trump's agenda, blah blah blah like no, no Paul Ryan and Orrin Hatch, all the inland, your mother, some. If they cannot pass this, they are just as guilty and cruel as Donald Trump on DA, and everyone of them has made this argument about the league, the legality, you can concede that this is an extension presidential, like you can even uncomfortable with the fact that in extraordinary situation where we have this basically huge extralegal population, people that aren't Americans because they weren't born here. But I've lived in this country, all their life, and you could say the president did something extraordinary. It's it's an extension of.
Central power I don't support it? That's why Congress should act so do it? You'll have every democratic it can pass but Paul, but Paul Ryan is afraid to do it because he's afraid of the same people, Donald Trump, is afraid of, which is why he sends Jeff session out to do his dirty work, which, by the way they were afraid because they don't want to make a very simple case right. They know that the bright Barts and Fox Isn't everyone of the world was going to say they? Let a bunch of illegals in here in legal stay here in Boba an there, ignoring the fact that these people are american, american in every single way, but the pick- and it's it's almost weird- that we call talk about them as Daca recipients. With this weird acronym, like we do with everything else and within which we talk about them like there's a separate group of people, they are just like you and I they have been here since six years old. They don't have another country to go because they don't know many of them- don't have families in the countries they came from. They've, never lived there, they've never been there. They are you in LOS Angeles and Miami and all over the country, and they work here and they paid taxes and they study, and they defend
country in there in the military. It is unconscionable we're going to expel these people from their home country. For no reason it is a made up prices. It's a made up price that we are. We taught Review Martinez who works at leave UCLA. She was on love it or leave it talking about this and she's a Daca recipient, and she just talked about. Terrifying. It is an how heartbreaking it is an how Daca finally gave people legal status, not just sort of the technical paperwork, so they could legally get a job, but a feeling like they could plan for their futures and think about their futures, because They knew that they weren't going to be deported in the middle of the night and now fear, comes rushing back yeah in one of these young Americans is a paramedic who worked six straight days, rescuing Harvey victims. And we found out that one was killed. Trying to rescue during Harvey and the government won't even give his mother a humanitarian visa to come to Houston, so she can bury her son. So these are the stories we're dealing with. We should tell everyone if you want to stop this. Obviously congressman
call your senators office. I think we should start up everything we did during the fight to save the affordable care act and we can, you know, I know, there's activists we're holding rallies an there protesting and they're standing outside of the capital. Today, United, we dream is a good place to go. To find out what you can do to take action on this and we'll be telling you guys a lot of other places to go and to go help over there over the coming days and weeks. There is one thing we forgot, which is that that chairman of on car against the roof, the end of Dhaka, yeah, and I'm glad you could make that point because I'm sick of talking about those two 'cause they're useless fighting people, useless they're, useless all the fuckign moderates in the White House for useless. I want to hear about them. I want to think about them. I don't care about them, fuck them all cool. Ok, when we come back We will talk to New York, Congressman Adriano's Biot about this. Decision
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Biot congressman. You were the first make an American to serve in Congress you're? Also, the first member of Congress to an undocumented as an immigrant when you were a child. Tell us a little bit about background and what it was like to be. Undocked in America well like, yeah, the age of nine. I came with my parents on the visitors visa and we always stayed RV's, and then we have to go back to the deer. And get my legal residency. So that's the status of how we got here, but you know for some time we were done with that. Are documentation and we were able to. Finally get are being car the system. So you wrote a letter to Donald Trump recently asking him to save the deferred action program. Obviously, today attorney generals. Sessions said it's illegal and that they will be resending the program in six months. What's your response,
things that he lied to the dreamers and he lied to the american people when he said that the issue rest easy, and so again we see today how he turned his back on down the american people, I'm just really troubling time in America when the President says one thing and does another he's the six month window on this thing? Are you hopeful that Congress can act in the next six months to protect these young people well. You know we have a lot on a cable How do you text you some money for that? We a lot of initiatives that must be addressed? But I see in the house to have more priorities in this. So what do you think the prospects for passage of a dream? in Congress are right. Now. How do you go about getting some of your republican colleagues on board there
some republican colleagues that seem to want to assist the dreamers. In fact, even Paul Ryan has said that instructed Alaska Suppressor in not to dismantle the program. There are senators several Republican Senate, First, that also support. It was a genius, an even one, of the attorney generals that was involving the delegates in the litigation and threatening to include the Daca students in the current litigation they have. An immigration are dropped out of a lawsuit, so there is some sentiment out there I am hopeful that this item will take priority when we get back today to cc as you said, you have a congress, is a lot on its table from Harvey to the debt ceiling to The government running to obviously tax reform has been something they claim that they're going to do next. What legislative steps do you
we're taking now? Is it worth holding up government funding such as we can in the Senate. How far should we push to get these Daca recipients saved in the next six months. Well, there's two pieces of legislation, one introduced by Congress after the American hold back and the other one by Senator Durbin, the bridge Jack, which seem to all want to address this particular issue. I think we should be given discussion around these two legislative proposals and try to bring closure in the solution to them as quickly as possible certainty. What we don't want is for this doctor discussion to be linked to funding the building of the wall or throwing another monkey wrench in the way of these eight hundred thousand young people, fifty percent of which are working, forty, eight percent of which already have a bank account with a c
in some level of increasing their salary. Thirty percent of them already have a credit card, so it's not only inhumane to disconnect them from their experience, as American is economic malpractice as well, and so I asked at this thing that is a priority and that will begin the discussion of these two pieces of legislation that have gained bipartisan support and we could make this a priority when we get back to DC today. What would sensible? immigration reform look like if we were doing through a comprehensive type of immigration reform right now, 'cause? Obviously, what we need to fix? The system goes far beyond protecting these young Americans. Well, you know a comprehensive immigration reform will bring. It bring a pathway to first legal residency. A conditional legal residency permit,
legal residency and ultimately citizenship, and so this is what most countries that engage in a comprehensive immigration, reform system or initiative. This is what they put forward an it should not be any different in America, so we must bring some level process through which undocumented people become gay, conditional legal residency that will then become permanent legal residency, a green car, if you may, with the ultimate goal that they may have a pathway to citizens down the road if they buy and play by the rules they work if they paid taxes. Why not make them? America, so as part of comprehensive reform has always been a border security component of it. Would you support that having a border security and restrictions on legal immigration as part of a comprehensive plan that in
helping the rumors rented our borders, I don't believe in building a wall, we could put more border patrol. We can deal with technology, that's available right now to secure, although it does the border better. I think the wall is the fast simple is it doesn't help security in it in no way shape or form, and- and this would be costly in the sense of that message across the world that America is now. You know he close society that it is a a closed society to people for outsiders, if you may- and so there
No objection from the and strengthening border protection, although I would not support the building of the wall, but so the wall is like a dumb thing, Donald Trump back into, because he got applause at his rallies. Yes right, nineteen, he heard the applause from that. You know he will get some of political, cheap shot well made and goose is, is ratings and and- and now he's he's so like committed to it, but I don't see how we words, it will be costly after you take money to build the wall when we got to rebuild Houston right now in Texas. So this is where we're at right now congressman. What are you telling your constituents who may be affected by the Trump ministration, resending Dhaka. Well, first and foremost, I'm telling them to be serene and and to be
waiting for the legal interpretation, the corrected eagle interpretation of what all this means we're looking to see how well we will counteract this, both politically and socially, but, most importantly, each person should feel reassured that we had the Social Service safety net of legal services that will be able to interpret what this means to each and everyone of am every case, of course may be, may have different circumstances congressman. Thank you so much for joining us and thank you. I appreciate that absolutely have a good take care is brought to you by Peloton Peloton means of joining a group, cycling class. Sure I do whenever you want right in your own living seems impossible, don't let a busy schedule keep you from getting your credit. I am busy skip the commute to the gym and let the workouts come to you. Finally, why do you like pellet on love it? So I have.
Time bike. So I like going to the gym. Look I like I'm not going to. I don't like going to the gym part of my routine, your gym rat. I don't know about that, but I like going to class is right and you know, it's seven hundred and thirty, a dot m. I got a meeting with with Jon Favreau Tommy be tore up and they're punks one, and now that I'm not a writer anymore, I'm punctual and Arie I don't have forty five minutes because actually going to a gym class takes an hour and a half he gotta get fifteen minutes there. Then you're milling about got get there early. Then, by the time you go, you know it's. It takes a lot of time, but if I have just the thirty minutes of the forty five minutes jump on my palate on and it's great because there's all different lengths of classes and you can do different kinds of classes, and so it's like. Ok, Thirty minutes to work out, I'm gonna jump on this bike, I'm into a thirty minute. Thank and it's great. So I recommend that the only thing peloton can't seem to do is take the cheese burger out of my hand, discover this cutting edge indoor cycling bike. That brings the studio experience to your home pellet on his offer.
Listen. There's a limited time offer go to Pillaton cycle com enter the code Save America at checkout, God save America. Is the code get twenty percent off accessories with your Palatine bike, purchased, get a great workout at home anytime. You want go to Pillaton cycle com, use the code, God save America and get started on of course, but Americas brought to you by the cash out the cash app you can send and receive money from the convenience of your phone links directly to your bank account. We of it, I'm just trying to think there's any agreements. I can sort of is over there. Everyone's got all their wine. That's been tough son, Michael! this weekend that she makes wedding. Oh he talked about sending you a bottle of wine to finally shut you up. He also sent me a creative Buca teenie. That's right. He told me that too, and he doesn't know this yet and I don't know if he's going to have listened to this in time. But, let's just say: he's got something in the mail Oh that's great! You know about because it's from you,
right. I do know about it and I was not asked yet to pay for it via the cash and you won't because it's a it's a company expense anyway, cash app download the cash You get five dollars. Five dollars Hurricane Harvey relief efforts, yet we're still doing that. We're still doing a code is pod. Save code is pod. Save to today's. Today we love the cats, were switching to the cash app. Is the easiest way to pay people back we're doing the cash have now we're not doing the other ones catch up some of it there's a great story in the New York Times by Neil Irwin, was on Sunday that I wouldn't going to read. It tells the story of two janitors make incomparable pay, Gail Evans who worked in code- Kodak in the 1980s and Marta Ramos who works for apple today, here's a big difference. Evans was a full time employee, with four weeks paid vacation, Kodak reimbursed portion of college tuition, she's mentored in trained by the people in the company, and she ultimately became chief technology officer Kodak.
On the other hand, is a paid contractor hasn't taken a vacation years, can't afford college, hasn't, received any bonuses and has no opportunity for advancement at apple yeah, and what was interesting. Is they roughly make the same yeah at even in county for inflation? Basically, they have the same income, but just one of the jobs is upwardly mobile and the other is, and it's basically a story of how companies are driving in a quality today by paying middle and lower wage employees less than they used to and outsourcing work to cheaper part time contractors. I thought it was interesting in the context of the tax, for, for, debate that we're having today Trump is meeting with his two White House. Aides who are former Goldman Sachs executives as well as Republican, congressional leaders to talk about tax reform and the main
Bank of reform is bringing the corporate rate down from thirty five percent trump. One hundred and fifteen Congress wants two thousand and twenty five, whatever they're going to pay for this paper, some of it 'cause they may not pay for all of it might just the deficit, but they want to some of it by possibly taxing workers, 401k contributions, cutting home mortgage deductions, penalizing using the highest tax states, like California, New York, by getting rid of the local and state deduction correct. So I can't Leave that this dream team of new King Ryan and Mcconnell landed on reducing corporate tax rates by increasing taxes on everybody else. The thing about this is so outrageous. Is it actually also goes to their Medicaid cuts too. It is it is so ideological to the point of being self defeating. We actually do have a corporate tax rate problem in this country. I don't care where the rate lands, but we have a jury rigged. Rube, Goldberg,
contraction of lobbyists financed tax breaks, an loopholes that riddle the corporate tax rate to the point where, even though we have a international, high corporate tax rate on average companies pay and then some companies pay zero. Some companies pay the main rate. It's really really unfair, so you want to reform corporate tax rate. That's something that makes you really excited more power to you. There no reason whatsoever to pay for a reduction in the corporate tax rate with money taken from the individual earners in this country. You want to court that you want to blue Poles go crazy, have a good time, but then you're going to pay for it. Making people pay more taxes on their on their houses or make them pay more taxes on their retirement savings. It makes absolutely no sense whatsoever seems like there's a bigger issue here, which is The defining challenge of our time that we have not been able to local challenge. Economic challenge is that we do not
an economy that is providing for average workers. We have not figured out how to respond to globalization as a country, and I want to do about company. That are outsourcing jobs that are using automation, technology we've talked about in Latin America million times. We are very comfortable saying that in the twenty sixteen election, Hillary Clinton did not break through with an economic message. That would mean something you know what it meant, something working people right and sort of. Now I read the story, and I'm like we sort of lose sight of the economic challenge at the all of our political problems with all these other trump fights that we're having right now and there are further along longest time the Republican Party's answer to that story about those two workers in different times, working at Kodak nail is everyone's being strangled with regulations and high tax and if we only lower regulations, when we cut regulation and lower taxes, everything will be fine. We saw through the two thousands- that's not true right that didn't work in the persian mystery at a
they've said, growth would solve every problem there and there was he's also a wink and a nod for Republican Party too and by the way yeah, maybe immigrants are taking your jobs to write. That was always a subtext. Now that is the primary plank. Donald Trump's campaign and administration right, Donald Trump's. Answer to that story that New York Times jury is immigrants are taking your jobs and form workers are taking them when their companies are outsourcing, and that's that's his now. His problem, but Still has this republican Party with Paul Ryan and Mitch Mcconnell, in his Goldman crew, who are saying no no cut the corporate tax rate. They fundamentally. I think that the Republican Party just does not Kenai's economic inequality of as one of the great challenges in the economy. They view it as a problem, but they view as a you can solve again still with deregulation and growth, except for Donald Trump, who ran this nationalist platform, at the same time the Democratic Party's answers are have been insufficient. You know that was
I was thinking as I was reading the story, and I actually was thinking of another story that came out over the weekend, which is the fact that on college campuses, MOE, colleges now are employing huge numbers of adjunct professors who are not full time who make as much money who are not on tenure track, and I found myself connection between the con tractor janitors at Apple HQ and a young. Grad student, who can't get a job as a professor and people driving for ride sharing companies, and then you look at what Dema they are offering edit it's at the kind of the end of this structural inequality right. It's it's earned income tax credit, San, raising the minimum wage and shifting to a more progressive tax system. Now those are all really smart things to do. If you look at an economy that all the gains in all the rewards are going to the top to the top earners into the corporate and enter corporations like companies like apple sitting on tens of bills, two dollars trillions on economy. You look at that and you say what we need to do is cut corporate taxes.
And why did the base? So you shift the burden of the taxes on two middle class. People that's insane, but at the same time, Our answer is sort of at the as at the kind of mouth of river like we're not at the problem, which is what we do about the fact that that a technologically fistic ated globalized economy has left working people the leverage that they used to have- and I was also you know- the decline of unions- is part of this. The fact that we're now I think just six point. Seven percent of it was labor day zero point, seven percent of the private, here is now unionized, the lowest rate that's been in one hundred years. You can make a connection but and rising economic inequality and the decline of unions in the private sector. So we have these big structural force consolidation of companies into these behemoths that are not not responsive either to their workers or to consumers. To automation that is made people more productive, which means you need fewer employees, so you know
the center left in the center right are failing to offer solutions to these fundamental problems. You have people like Donald Trump who emerge from the wreckage and say all of your, trust. All your anger, it's fair here, so you can point it out. So what's your Democrats do then? What's the plan you know That's a great question, John! No, but we've been talking with look, we you, you know you and I and Tommy and we've. We started this company and- and it's gave us this platform- and and we're talking to people, people that we can sit down and have conversations with, and we put this question to a lot of different kinds of people and the answers aren't great. There's a you know: it's it's really really: hard, but so it's actually just something. You know I mean I say by this question because I think that that answering this question is fundamentally the answer how we can win in our politics, but also just actually help people and it seems like there's only three well as demo there are people on the left in general? It seems like we would say, there's three different components to fixing this problem. Uh
one is making sure there are jobs that pay well for people right. That seems to be almost the trickiest thing told to legislate or to create a policy around the second planet would be making sure that people have the skills and education to get the jobs that pay well. Now I did some digging into the good old, better deal plan which again part of the problem with better deal. Is you lead with the slogan. No one knows what's in the deal. Everyone only knows there was an argument about the slogan, but if you look in there, they have tax incentives for employers. That invested. Workforce training, education, apprenticeship for workers now We can certainly argue over, like detect incentives, really make a difference, or should we require apprenticeships and skills, training and stuff, like that, whatever we can have that debate, but it seems like you need some sort of robust program in this country where
employers or the government, whatever offering people, apprenticeships, training skills I mean that's how that woman had Kodak was able to become chief technology, she got all these apprentice programs and skill training program in the people who do succeed at some companies today are getting all those kinds of skills based training and then the bucket of things is making sure and you that you know that you have all of sort of the safety net and the and the benefits to so you know whether it's vacation child care living wage retirement, and perhaps we should be talking about our robust program for contractors. Independent workers, part time. Employees so that they're getting the same kind of benefits and guarantees that full time workers yeah that's country, that's interesting, yeah! so stepping back from my yeah, let's look at those pieces, so, yes, you know, and this is why I think Bernie campaigning on Universal College was important and important thing to have for the democratic debate, so whether it's printer ship programs, under the government or that we make in intensive
companies that are themselves your rights or training universal, higher education available to people. I think that's part of it. One other this by the way is immigration reform, because getting out of the shadows and legal is the ways you make sure that people aren't being under the table last, you can see wages start to rise, because pressure on wages at the bottom is a piece of this The other part of it is, can addition of big companies and that was in the better deal than in the better do you even people on the left, applauded that as well, I do think consolidation is, I mean automation. Tough one, and we have not found any good answers on how to maybe now- and we ask what we're asking the consolidation of companies is something the government can do something about. In fact, many on the left, including our Us would do that government exists to do something about it, and this is one of those places where the left critique of the donor class having too much influence is really important, because certain things become possible to imagine right, the breaking up of big companies that treat
numbers like shit and don't play their employees enough, because their monopolies or anomalistic or part of like a you know, a tree of companies that are setting prices together and kind of dividing up in the country and into feudal feudal manors impossible when you're raising money from all of these places. But I, we need to sort of widen the scope of what's possible, and, and and- and you know the union should, I think, is a- is a really hard one, because the decline of private sector unions has has had an impact, and you you you think about this. You know contractor who is in charge of their hours and by the way? This extends beyond contractors that big companies is a problem for a lot of people from Walmart to Starbucks too. A lot of a lot of service economy, jobs. You know it's not just that they're, not often that the minimum wage isn't high enough people can't count on their hours. They can't count on a promotion. It has know you can't build,
life when your shift is going to be moved around so figuring out, ways to protect people and, and that can't always come from the government- is very difficult for the government to regulate how a company set to hours, and you can tell you can. Maybe I think Elizabeth Warren has a bill about making sure that there's notice for when people's hours were shifted. I'm not. I don't really know the details honestly, but that is about union That's what unions used to do to make sure people got paid when they were when they show to work in that they could count on a reasonable day in a reasonable wage. So you know these are really hard questions and Donald Trump lying to people doesn't pick some yeah. No, I mean I, at the store, because this is the central challenge of our time. It is what I was on voters' minds, whether you voted for Trump or Clinton, or at least some people that voted for Trump people for This is top issue on minds what to do about the channel, Globalization Donald Trump, We have said a million times, it's no secret, that we think he has no good and practical answers to this. We do not believe the Republican Party
establishment Republican Party has any good or practical, and they make this they make matters worse and Democrats must find an answer in twenty eighteen two thousand and twenty and beyond to this question they need to about Marta Ramose working in ale, and what we can do for her, why she would vote for a Democrat. You know that's what we need to think about, and we don't spend enough time. Talking about it now, and so we started here, but we should no every time we ask a Democrat who we have on the show politician. They say they do the front end. Automation. This is a problem, here's the problem we have and we need good answers on that and so far you know, I think some of the the roots of some of the answers are there as we just went over, but I think we have not. We, we haven't gotten yeah, it's it's some to be the seeds. Are there right like like it? This isn't like we're. Not, I don't think the answer to all these questions is going to be some. Unknown, giant single solution. It's going to be a collection of its similar actually to climate change in that
It seems insurmountable, but then you look and you realize actually it's a collection of steps. Each one is possible. An reasonable, but taken together makes a massive difference in people's lives, and I think I think that the better deal for all the criticism got was an important for step. I wonder how big of a deal you can make about monopolies and consolidation. How I I have a call, I you know, I don't know like how much that'll appeal to people I I know that everybody hates their cable company. I know everybody hates the airlines, but I don't know if that if people can grab onto that, because you know new claims to to think this is easy or that they are confident in their way to address these problems or even talk about these problems is not being honest, yeah. Well, hopefully, we can have a good faith debate about this. I think you know what I think we already have started one now. Let's go now: let's go back to Twitter,
what one you're for hash tag jobs all right, that's all the time we have for today is it. It is that's a shame. Yeah we've got a little wild anyway, that's not what I'm using on the outro. You want to say. I talk to check DE and Tom Morello. That will greatly, but I love the episode. I was a kid I listen to on the fly home. You literally that's come along guys. If you haven't checked out, I didn't know what it you know. Look you want to show you try to learn and I never hosted a political chat show at a comedy club once a week, and now I have- and I like it- okay John, how are you I'm great? The music is going for in metro this is me procrastinating from going to work. What we have to do, some bad, so oh yeah so it's like.
Transcript generated on 2019-10-31.