Explore how science has inspired art through the ages, from Leonardo da Vinci to computer games, when Neil deGrasse Tyson interviews artist Peter Max. With co-host Lynne Koplitz and guest Bill Nye.
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This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
Skip the commercials support star talk on patriarch to listen to every episode, commercial, free, the first is filled with secrete cinemas trees, leaving us with many questions to be answered. We find ourselves searching for those answers as the very fabric of space science and society are converging here for the first time. What do you want? Are you just recently the domain the brakes, Daddy Glinda? Did you grandma South Nasty Brenda, get lab browser,
welcome back to start off. I am your hosting the other grass Thyssen joining me. My toes Lynn tablet. Well, we will come back to this you're. My compost, well then. May I miss you, tell you no matter which are today able to talk about the universe, as it inspires the creativity of artists, artist throughout time, an artist of all kinds, not only painters but sculptors and the like. That's very interesting. I'd I'd like TAT, because You know scientists we hang out together and, and sometimes we not appreciated as much We would like to be ever reasons, and occasionally we see some of what we are handiwork reflected in the creativity of artists themselves and we set ourselves, maybe we're because mainstream, maybe we're creative and we're not married. Well, we will need to take credit for that. Ok, I'll, take credit for two, so actually
I saw none of this happened. So a few years ago I wrote an essay for natural History magazine called the Universe Ass, the artist media. Do you have a family do ever not you're always rating? a book about one, because I guess, but what I do. Ok inspired symphony so me, oh I'm, I'm happy that I get off the couch. So It was an essay cause. I was impressed by how often I was being called by artists to get the latest image from the Hubble telescope with I wanted to find out the latest understanding of the bang or black holes or Mars, so they can paint as seen something inspired by mean, even as a comic you now, artists tend to look at where people all artists, whether its rider comedian,
visual artists. Even we tend to look at the whole world. We look at everything over under. I just don't think science was being that portfolio until recently. Scientists is part of the world is definitely part of effective shapes the world, and so I think science has come a long way in terms of being felt by the general public, and so let's see what do I have to say bill he's. My boy bill. You know bill is due you. Ve got to set the tone. He said shaking the romantic man will give it a bit ly the science guy here when you think of a planet in your minds. I, what do you see? Many of us see sadder, but no one could envision such a thing until astronomer, starting with Galileo, drew sketches of this and other worlds. I've seen Saturn Ring Saturn Broaches, Saturn, Ladys Pumps, dress shoes with joy.
Saturn's instead of both sexes, that with images of distant storm clouds and our so called nearby world, we can make planetary art from photographs. If you ve Taking a bit of time with the Voyager spacecraft, pale blue dot must and thanks to a spacecraft named after another astronomer Cassini, you can our through the thin rings of another. You can see the earth beyond the wings of Saturn backlit by the sun. Its astronomy, but for me inspiration its art. Mrs grilled, I hoping that after we're done start talking, you do a bit of start looking at the works inspired by distant worlds and heavenly wonders very deep down. It will deepen one man, that's a bill, my minute for you evaluation. Ah, yes, yes- and you know, when you think of the first of the artist
be fully site everything why we gonna talk about for you gotta, it's gotta be Leonardo, Leonardo Da Vinci, there's no knob. Does nobody like em before or since may his a guy who, who was on science. He was all over engineering. Who is our architecture and though he painted on the suffer this guy Eddie eat used to do experiments in visit physics, experiments. The word physics in quite evident was defined back then, but he would do experiments in motion and weights in and wait now. He did this for his art. Well, I don't know if it's forests art, but he did it in a way that then influenced his hour. I dont know if that was the point of why he did these experiments He was a smart, curious guy he's morning curious you play with, and that is why those guys been activated both sides of his brain. Yes completely. If you did like one of these scandal, Brain would be firing at every every cubic against that was in their great guided date
he's gonna think sounds gonna. Just I'm just saying some of these guys in history I go. Oh would be a good like Galileo boyfriend dimension as well. He's ok, because he'd be distracted by his own thoughts rather than by you, and I, like someone who's here like his manipulate. It is something that would not happen with Roger nobody, but tell me more about him. He also so foresees one of bringing people who ever lived, and he looked at his writings all these subjects that he geology, physics biology. And from our side he he was a painter right and so what one of my favorite particle. But you know about his eye. He drew a first a model for our it turns out. It wouldn't work if you actually built but he's thinking about flying, he's thinking about flying and not just energy,
be great. If I had wings and I flew like a bird he's actually trying to draw a machine that could make that hasn't, he was one in four people started with machinery. Yes, yes, to bring machinery to the to the task of ideas. Rather, just imagine if you had wax wings like like Icarus, trying to fly to the sun, he says: look, do you need some machines to do an that's more like live a day? So so you ve got this and would Leonardo he's he's he's. He embraced all knowledge and, with all that knowledge infused into his artistic expounded in prison, is our them. Well, ok, up did you did you know that he probably not a guy he's, ok, so hee hee, hee, basically pie and what invent perspective that something that's been around since ancient Greece when it got lost, they got lost until the Renaissance renaissance, his friend for rebirth, and so a rebirth. Leonardo is in the renaissance. Yes, he was the
we want to my ignorance. Ok though, until then, let's live come back a minute. So let's go back like the Greeks and Egypt. In all these kind of people like further ok, Egyptians when they did higher, they were flat, you're, all those due to a flat rate. Richard you look on their like the flat, but you never see like recorder face of an egyptian right, always like side. I didn't seem lock and entered a distant rotten right by none of that, their flat so than they were arrows plenty like anyone that land and they went so they were flat, right, and then there is the absence of perspective that other names in the growing went then who the Greeks, while they have perspective well so so so perspective comes in, but it doesn't we take off, ran upstairs discovered, they know about it and its use in the architecture right, it's there. But you don't. You don't see paintings that make full use of this until the renaissance, and so my point is that the that physical principles of light and optics in re, tracing and and and
it's a divinity he was, he studied the laws of physics. Not they were not known as laws of physics back then, when you wanted to know how things balanced and how things would look if they were imbalance, because if you draw something that Europe I in brain told you doesnt quite look right: either it's not as convincing to you so he wanted to. Sure. You understood how things worked. I took part in college. My mother is an earnest as a kid. I remember one thing she always use made me: do they make you do this than our class and in school, if they may, or in college They make you look at what you thought you saw and what you really saw. That's what it sounds like you're saying they can sometimes what you think you hey it's not with your act, they were put. Your brain is messing with what what it is. You thought you saw he's trying to get the basic data there, so he gets it right, I'm alone ex me. Squint, do not always quaint to see what it really You know who we have for this week's start talk. I spent some time with Peter MAX
without you know Peter Merge, member per man from the, and he still around he's really popular hop artist and did you know he's deeply inspired by cosmic feed? I wouldn't be surprised by this check out with Peter MAX, had to say better understand the universe, inspires you is at every phenomenon or ago far back it started. When I was about ten, seven years old, living in China and it was near Tibet and I met an older man who start talking. We do know about to start. The planets, and I had no clue and every day we talked about it and by the time I think five, six or ten days went by at all, I would think about and what I would go to sleep. You mean about is shocking about it took only a week for it to just infiltrate year, be undermined and bought jumpstart that, and even that I just grew and grew and grew. There's not a single day in my life, where I'm not preoccupied with things about plan, stars the universe. What is this whole thing? There's not a
data goes by without and think about. It up in the morning it's amazing, like some cause alarm clock thought it opens my eyes and I think about the universe. I dont think the bed, I'm sleeping in ok what day it is, I don't care what today I did what you? What is have to do today. The first thing is the universe, the cosmos than I calm down, and then I look at my what I gotta do today. The first thing is the unit so you ve got a bad. I got a bad, you gotta, do you got it? So bad is good. It's unbelievable! That's why, when I'm with you see tv, I'm Do you even hear your name? Forgive me, but I guess spied by that he's so nice to me right give me he says: that's that's a beautiful yours muse. He didn't have to save it. I thought that was so nice, so Peter multilaterally, and if your member Peter MAX, he won't always love posters from the sixties and and and and it's like he was it, the artist of a generation coming, as you still see our teacher said, have
sign in your heart, the hordes of big hard city that and I wanted to say what I did, but he said I thought was so sweet about waking up and how the universe inspires him, like you, didn't think about his bed. That's what I'm saying like artists are so neat because think in such a bigger, bigger canvas, the universe, tightening of inspirational cuts, infinite, I wouldn't it I would have any listeners where, if anything about science or space inspires them, either artistically or otherwise. I noticed I was me, and I'm a scientist inspires Peter MAX and inspires me and then he's an hour and an end Lynn, and I have something like an hour as there are many people who are inspired, who are creating or who are making a difference in this world, and I'm armed charmed by that because, like I said to see, artist, get mainstreamed in that way if it becomes a subject of of artists to see science get mainstreamed in that way, with science becomes the subject of artist. I think
This is a rise in the culture in the ways that no one had ever imagined for it. Didn't you don't mean or think cited about scientists being call. You know it Lino did to try to become a better artist did. He do new ain't he's drawing people, and so he dug up cadavers, real Doug them up P, some open to see how this gross, but if you are committed to your heart, you'll do whatever it. What do you do? We tell them about and seeing this is again, we give dead, what are they care? The dead who general downward did the same thing and heating get credit for being a look. As you said, the same thing, he filled the diverse, that's different, remodelled and killed for the already dead, only just dogma. That's fine dogma that criminal dogma pure the scant look? We looked at how the muscles came together, how they form he wants to know what was going on beneath the skin of his subjects. Will then another happenings in it now at body was so the problem. So here it here's what interesting hat if we had the bodies exhibit, which is in a lot of the big cities across the country right now we have them
They have people formally alive shown without their skin, and you can see how the most pools in all the rest of the body. Parts come together, indifferent poses ensure Some really do I look like I really like a serial killer. Disneyland we're not creepy demented serial killer Disneyland. Yesterday, spiritual just kill people, you gotta be demented enough to publish the skin back and see what the muscles are doing, but I do understand why they would like Leonardo what it does give bodies exhibit existed you wouldn't have to dig up cadavers this week and I just saw thing a national Jake. As you know, all my knowledge of everything is for me or tell them hungry software, National Geographic, where they had found these terrorist act of poker, and they did it then that very thing they had found just that I thought, skeleton and they ticket and aid that they put the skeleton through kept, alright. Alright. I was really tired, but there is nothing inside of Corsica. There was a skeleton right, but they they could then drew art artistic pictures of, and then they could figure out what would have gone in their rights. What was
MRS D. Ancona call. You don't have a third actual cadaver little cadaver, so you do the best. The next best thing you can what's missing, they figured out- and you know these, these bodies that are in the exhibit their preserved. Though there are different ways you can preserve human flesh and one of them, as you too, to deepen and acetone. Rightly gets rid of similar moisture and I'm just so you know, and then they have to sort of keep. Then they have to keep it, keep it shape, so they infused with silicone with then hardens the tissue so that they can stay on display, like PAMELA Anderson, what she's? I dont want everybody wages, silicone. I D That leaves the arena power, so they would not need to be prepped if they were down into the body to this exhibit at present what you're saying good day. You know that the pre made for the exhibit undertaken they're gonna last for a long time coming around with Russia's and cheese.
And an twinkies. Don't forget your listening to start talk, radio on your host astrophysicist, nearly Grass Thyssen. My day, job is as director of the hidden planetarium in New York City and I'm here with Linley Couplets few have something about space that inspires you, science or space or sign in general, if you're an artist in particular. If you just somebody online writer rightly examined, I want to create a vote. I want to hear what it is that might influence you, because will hear more from Peter from Peter MAX learning about how science infused his creator and we are streamed on the web on start radio dot net. Let's take a break will be right back hey I've got no secret for you when I consider singing all of the ads on this shell, just one way to get out a hearing there go to patriarch,
coms last starred talk and supporters at the five dollar level or higher to listen, the star talk ad free. You can download all current episodes into your favorite parkers player and ever hear another commercial on star talk ever again. You will definitely not have to hear me saying if you support us at patriarch doc, arms last our talk, radio, I mean I'm just thinking I mean just saying. Rigorous space, Cadet rocket scientist. I want to hear from you. This is start. I will come back to start out. I'm your home near the graph heightened with Lynn Complex. My clothes
They need had an old, rigorous space, brigadier general by the end of these programmes in complex professional standards performs around the country so happy to have me back. I am happy to be back now now before we move on. I want to go back to Leonardo Da Vinci for a minute here. We're talking about bodies and the bodies exhibit created, dug up bodies to get the artistic form of withdrew then on the brig did we were time? Are the bodies exhibit now during the brake alone? They needed told me a little of something that I didn't know, which was that those were prisoners like journeys told that the bodies on display in in the bodies exhibition, which has shown in many cities now who are, were not necessarily people who donate their bodies to this cause that they were the bodies of prisoners on that's. What's going on. I got better put. It became a little a little controversial because the prisoner might not have had a choice in the matter. Who cares
is a prisoner of should say, and I've done up just not voting for sides here. I'm just saying that it may be is controversial It wasn't Leonardo day when he's digging up cadavers out the kind ever so when he was taken about. Yes, he wants you dig up a body and embodies a sacred burial ground in a church yard or wherever people were, of course, but people than people did. Then now, don't you doing he did it in the North Atlantic. Ninety million women insistently made nothing Parma and you know one of the most famous illustrations from Leonardo terrorism. You got the virtue, Vivian Man have you ever seen it had the one with a man in a circle square, exactly exactly hot. This here that way, just like a little homunculus inside of a silence, life and work and everything got a veterinarian. That's true! Yet workers is drawn by people who, like muscles men, I've never been to Pittsburgh I know that there is no absolute had no you just performer
a great many other great sports teams, but no ads sports pointed out. We have not the not the viewer, yes So there's gonna be annexed. Like the tourist motto visit, there were no ebbs Duvalier adds condiments burned tell them about Maso? Here's! Here's what you get into trouble, because if you, if you have an aesthetic, no ok, But if you want to believe that somehow the human form is some epitome of aesthetics, this is what went into the room. Between man, and so you, you will all remember this image. Is this man with his arms outstretched and his leg slightly parted? And it's a perfect circle drawn around him and the arms are just touching the edges circle and its feeder at the bottom of the scene of his injuries are. This was to prove something. It's approved that the human form had some aesthetic beauty to it, because the circle was a thing of beauty, and in the centre that circle you know it was there his we not So what we I'm sorry! What we learned about will learn was that some people
have those proportions. It was assumed that your dear distance from fingertip to fingertip equalled your height. And in those considered the ideal form, and then you actually measure people and some people's Hansard shorter summer long minor, actually especially long. Some people have what they have a high ape in it's what little joke about. If you arms are really long compared to your body height, my arms or longer than my height, so I can touch her nose sitting right where I am right now that you know as you know, so the point is now you don't now. Did you measure them measure my arm? The distant from fingertips. Fingertip Euro area is eighty four inches then. So that's so I'm just telling you that it's it's not not everybody I'm out alone and though he don't have your now right. There is mine and yet but predicted to apportion, or are you just a bigger circle? Everything would be in proportion so that didn't really turn out the way anyone had hope, but it remains an iconic vision, romanian iconic vision.
What humans would have look like and then there's the thing with the golden ratio. Remember that many! He thought of it, but don't quite remember it. It has a mathematic. Before I tabled. It- is mathematically more interesting, artistically, a relay mathematics is not more interesting than art room. That's a new idea! So if you take a mine. Segment and you could split it exactly half. If you wanted right now to be half in him, but if you don't split in I make one segment a little longer than the other. Ok, you want to cut it into two pieces where a plus, We divide, it may be a minute becoming my day, plus be divided by B is in the same ratio as aid to be as being too a now. That's what it is arithmetically. Ok, so now you can write it out, isn't equate is one plus the square were to five divided by two to one s. I am so sorry I wanna be disrespectful, but I'm innocent myself in the face of it.
What what is it me? I'm just saying. So if you, if you do the math, you get a ratio of one to about one point: six in other words back then back then, if you designed form you design it so that the base was one point. Six units long and the height was one unit high, and that would feel aesthetically pleasing to you now is called the golden ratio Oh that's right! Now, that's very in Kyoto done lately. They many do that with your fate. Exactly the measuring people's faces, the width of the face and the height of a face in the nose to the eye to them, and the claim is those people were those measurements of capture the golden racial or consider more beautiful than I was going to say that very creepy, because that's good, like Emma. We gotta that saying how to cut us people and more perfect while could to this other than one where they make to genetically your offspring to choose can be different than facial features, maybe in certain parts of the challenge that these turn they claim they ve done it for people all around the world, and everyone focuses back on this golden ratio. I have my time suspicious of it, but but I'm just
facial features, maybe in certain types of the challenge these turn they claim they ve done it for people all around the world, and everyone focuses back on this golden ratio. I have my damn suspicious of it, but but I'm just reporting what they ve, what they said in its effects and eighty two, might be some scotch and inadequate level areas like it's that there might be some genetic propensity for their like it. And you're, not you know about the normal that in its divinities most famous paintings. What do you know it is most famous painting? I don't do this to me me me, for you ve been Mona, LISA, Mona LISA. Of course I have in my room. She looked like a did. You have a copy of the Mona LISA. We get that right no one. I mean I live in at three for a walk up the smell like trash because wash me on those the sharpie marker on the wall. The real monetary says that my apartment, so what should be sixty, which masculine to you will you not, they found they were able to study the painting. You can expose it to a certain wavelength of like that penetrates the top surface of paint, and you can see a whole other paint a whole illustration below it.
It is rumoured that that was a a self portrait of Leonardo himself. That was the first attempt at whatever he was doing on their hands out any painted like his his inner Mona LISA. What is that? What you think he looks like a bit? She was like ignited note that advantageous that it. But, yes she does look. I get a look at our every morning. She is right. Of the night in front of my body on the second day, Europe up, ok, so sweet did so that Leonardo and Drag is what you're. Sorry, I'm just saying like there was a review back then, but, but he gave you she's got Kenema thick link, for she's kind of cross. I gotta look again. I gotta look again the check that out put it in a review is Edwin Reg, let's at the
enjoy listening to start talk, radio, and for this episode I spent some quality time with Peter MAX pop artist from the nineteen sixty ease any still added right on through to today, and let's see what more he has to say about how the universe has inspired him he's in we are part of something that is so enormously big. You know when you talked about the molecules and one glass of water, their mama He was the one glass of water than the Eyeglasses award on planet earth. Well, that law that you gave me bothers feeds me for the next months. I want to think about this at least once a day. I love it so much or I'm happy too your fuel supply. So let me ask you: are you? Are you more influenced by science? will or is there a bit of philosophy that Fulton this science as the mystery of the science, because there is so much We don't know than we do know, and we do know a lot and so that we must and probably not no a billion times as much, but it's wonderful,
we do know, but has also lucky in nineteen sixty six. Just about the same time I mean Swami Holy Man from India, so you would use pure science as you're source of objects and imagery, but the philosophy is a mean how you would interpose them yet Yes, it was nice through irritation I was able to get very, very peace quiet, but rules king at the Universal would get excited, and so, between the peacefulness and the universe where the art world lived ass, Peter Maxie, just so in tune with his own sense of art and self in science he sounds like like a cool hippy guy liked very like down the com is, becomes made this isn't it he's got one of these calming forces it so it so it's so beautiful, and you too
You are like a glass of wine. How can it be using a star talk? Radio, if there's some aspect of science that has influenced you? Inspirational IE is a creative
personal, just a new thought. We have managed from Santa Monica Mensa you live and snort or kind answering high dabbling in environmental scientists, but I like our lot and I've got an artist, seven inspired by environmental science and if we have a bit of our galleries, hearing that America Ambergris Station and this really cool exhibit verbally and what this, if you guys we're talking about the fact that right well that about flat on the tree, a kind of damage that that was guided, striding mathematician created by abolishing states that united up here and taken by
The cap linking Cornell mathematician trying to figure had a model that geometry, while creating new wine at finding that responded on Banana Republic of Egypt, actually hyperbolic geometry: I've gotten together and Christianity, incredible kind of landscapes of these objects. With about courage, prison, we're gonna occasion to learn a lot of children now going around without mittens, because the crochet effort of going to our I love crochet in its very difficult. But it does have a lot of that spiral and it is very interesting. So are you saying the crochet use of the natural artistic way to express these forms in nature? mathematical, very cool heads or anyone near Santa Monica go check it out. Definitely that's so interesting.
It up online. Think unions, are you Nancy? I you know what I like about. You is because of your using yarn or whatever the delays which you use a rope to crochet. That is also going that's great for studying the body too, because it is tendons and muscle or how to who hates together. How does Hawaiian and may twisted and make it do things that you can't do it just charcoal, and so you springs in perspective. You use your and as a substitute for muscle, it brings them I have lots of crocheted. Brings this at all. No one of this new perspective, another very famous painting is the last supper, the less upwards Muslims. Either this data is Eve. Jesus is last supper and vehicles. Rather than dinner. I was minds, ecology. This minor party. I did a lot of mandatory as a dinner party, I mean, if you look at that there, the employees of perspective that reach what they call a vanishing point and the vanishing point where all the lines that, with our horizontal in a room or in a painting, end up focusing down in the backdrop of the painting and focus right,
Jesus, I really have areas or wherever you are in the painting. The lines take your right to the centre of his face, and so little those the who don't when you're, when you're, drawing or painting perspective. A vanishing point is that from one of the first things you you draw so that you can because everything else everything herds after that works and to the factory. So that's very interesting that the vanishing points of that was no accident that the vanished and pointless do this. As I know, accident at all and pushes twelve dinner guest and he was the centre and the whole thing we re- we have a tweet, but if you can treat us at STAR talk radio that we have a tweet, someone asks do think: Georgia, O Keefe paintings or combination of science and art and anatomy, every time flowering of flowers river come on every Jain flowers resume our they're, not flowers, get them. Please look into those is there not just fire. You know what meal? Ok, ok, I'm just
noise me about petrol. Sometimes a flower, as this well sometimes needs you to look for the Jews spot on its so out somewhat we're saying. As Georgia, O Keefe took the flowers of the South West and older them with her knowledge of human anatomy, to create a whole new expression of a whole other waited communicate with the view, I think what George O Keefe and many artists do great artist do is that they are very it may make you look at something a different way. They make. You see the other possibilities in it, then that occur or I could give other possibilities and I'd faintly in order to benefit all the great artisan painters in, and they have all done that and writers. They ve taken things that everybody looks at every day and night. They ve twisted it and so do other sides to we got another tweet risking.
The golden ratio which we talk about a moment ago only about aesthetics for is indicative of the health of an organism and that's a fascinating rate question. Why geniuses nobody, my family's, not turned in it, so no it's good about that is if, if these, if that is that, if the aesthetic soda hardwired into our brain and we identify beauty that way and then you turn ill or you something happens to your bodily form of words on me when women and if you turn ill, in your body starts, taking a shape that does not fulfil that golden ratio, and you because you look less attractive to others- is a fascinating concept. There, so maybe it is hard won angry suffered. So much so. My question I dont know the answer to that, but it's an intriguing like I've been aroused the exactly your beer bone started to becoming misshapen and you no longer fulfil the golden ratio arriving. There should be a gull dimension for different ages, so that should be like a silvery.
Platinum ratio dislike the average what your average wage to be whenever it has been a here's. The right. Over Asia, Africa Excellent, actual inform the platinum, excellent thought. We got some more, of my interview with Peter MAX. I was in his studio in New York City and get this huge studio where its he's still painting he still doing it. The guys still do I get to go to death. Well, my I'm not Peter men who didn't. Let's see what more Peter banks has to tell me I was a realist. I started painting realism like Michelangelo. I couldn't get any worse. I did, they would know, galleries were interested in it, no museums, nothing and I used to sit cafe, which back then was almost like what has Starbuck today and I will make my astronomical drawings every day, because I loved it and I have Maybe a hundred little drawings with me in one day in our directive said to me Peter. What's this than a bottom, you put folio and I got
oh, oh, it's nothing because I was shy. I was a real, as that was a classical guy. Is at the top. Your portfolio is all your realistic was very like Michelangelo. I wanted to be revered as like, because I was so good and realism. Anyhow and the one they said to me. What's is in the bottom you put forward as no it's nothing. It's nothing insisted I dig it out and when you look at it he went. Oh, my god, the stuff looks unbelievable, hey guys, Well, as a girls come over here, see what this guy does and I walked out of there for the first time in my life, with fourteen projects that paid like you know, if you wanna does each, which was today like a few things, I need it when I deliver them about it. Ten days later, I walked out of a wood twenty two projects and in the next eighteen, twenty months by one hundred and sixty six gold medals in art and design. For my creativity,
for my inventiveness- and I suddenly realized at the stuff I was doing, which was he's cosmic characters and cosmic stars and cosmic runners in all these characters with wings. They invented only because my interests than in the space area that I invented characters deadline there. They really want anything. I could see in the regular world sought fair to say that the universe birth, your career as an artist completely, you wanna be a great artist study, the universe, that's the his, and he knows very well that that's his inspiration and so Rather we don't have to be the universe in particular, but I think it's fair to say that you can a new kind of an artist or as an artist, you can reach another dimension of reality. If you come to it with some kind of science. Literacy is that I didn't. I think it is fair, but I think the only thing that I shall keep springing up is it science makes you ask why
it keeps you asking questions regarding being one. Real creative person keeps asking questions that keeps broadening their in their view of things and that's what happened to him. He kept asking questions and kept creating these characters and people both on much of science or deal it's. Actually this math, even beyond the golden the golden ratio that we talked about earlier. There is algebra, so others a branch of the matrix What movies and things are being built around this whole thing now exactly and theirs. It there's a branch of admirable linear algebra, which is normally agreed, that in in high school, but did not even take classes, ended in college, where the three a computer games that are unable, because of a huge mathematical engine, that's driving them! Oh yeah. I guess the note. So that's how ran up to now I don't know if I'm in math, you can't tell a whole instil a car or to calculate the math engine on that in what the new
I fully and allows, and what it does is to try to create a virtual world for you that you move through in a few stealing cars and find that your virtual world, but the perspective that changes as you run down the street and as doorways, open and corridors show up, they have to calculate. Every split. Second, what the new seem looks like as you travel and what it will look like. If you do this move that more exactly they don't know what you're going to promote you're gonna do next would have to be ready for that nets. Computing power that will have our clapped him later when you dive in the water of the centre in the ocean, music store, be lower across on no she's way to active, shoot. How do I gotta admit I'd like the movie when I and then with a video game is a very active and annoying at one point I distorted dumping amplify here is what concerns me as an as an actress aspiring actress in economic. You know see gee, I now computer graphic imaging is really taking over. I went to see bolt the three d me when I was sorry,
with my friends alters the with the dog yeah and anger and sons and on after grab little kids from nowhere signing these movies are not what scary but and I went to see it was great, but when I was a kid three movies we're not as intense as they are now. We know so realistically and as an actress who started off can mean the alkaline started. Thinking wow: when are we going to fade out like the way you talk took over silent fell right, I'm finally getting acting roles and I'm done just blind people. You draw people and Adam animate them in three d and then they will need you anymore. Isn't there a chance that regular actors and actresses they're gonna become obsolete? They can do can fully scan your body in various motions and then fully get you to read like a whole encyclopedia of words, they have all you vocabulary the volume body motions and they can just cast units Reedy animated for my native anymore. No doubt you just sort of sell your body
one time and then their used. You get used layer on another people. I know I've seen the sharing out of scares you because you're waiting tables and you're thinking what now its word about being out of a job, is having some of the science of the when it comes into. The creative farm scares me because, like for example, I dont like new digital film, I hated nude Did you know that the digital some verses, like sixteen millimeter owing onlooker, should everything on digital? Now, all of us- and I don't want to see people with lines in their face. I can see that in the mere myself I want pretty people. When the old greeny imaging I want the barber Walter's lens that looks like it's got vaseline over. That's! What's your folks lens. Thank you. Well, Reno, photography is, you know. It's Can I make you nervous all that that entails like I'm, never going to be on the view? What is Linda, I know we're we're gonna, go to break and were to come back. We're we're tweet, oh at STAR Talk, radio,
and we'll be right back, I'm going to try to talk Rafi in the universe and how that's inspired whole generations of artists and movements, social movements simply because the images we've obtained from the night sky. In a moment start radio. Neil Thyssen on the line we got to link up with my problem. Hello we ve got a core. With our question has scientist, I have a question about the relationship between science and art and inspiration who is the mused for whom we have Rick from L
hi Rick. Well, thank you doing good. Are you don't speak, then? Thank you. So what you got worth our while? I was with you. You are you talking about how how science has inspired our over the years, and I just wonder if you could think of any examples where are inspired sites in leaning womb? they discovered tat limit he's the best I could do for you there, for example, before the era of photography when people nonetheless had telescopes and they wanted to be able to tell others about what they saw, they had to draw what they saw, so they needed and artistic talent just to communicate their science to other people.
If they were not good at get there aren't they be showing something that was not really what they saw. Two other people, and that would confound any attempt to have a sort of a level headed assessment of what was going on and also the constellations that, firstly, they they came up with what the stars they came up with pictures crap you are, but there's no science anywhere in this just snarls. Well, if not with no they're they're connect the dots points. That's me they are. There are scientific sub themselves, but things will only learned much later long after anyone withdrawing pictures within it takes away the class answer, has been? No? No, no, that's not only offer little inside. I can say that artists not to speak for artists, casino, claim myself, among them. Over my brothers and artist, I can say all artist. I know, or driven often, if not all the time by some aesthetic and it's the aesthetic the drive
that the fuels their attempt to create a form, and I can tell you without hesitation that, as a scientist, we approach the universe. We approached the natural world with a similar expectation that what we're going to discover is something aesthetically, pleasing something beautiful something that will make you say that is nature at its finest and so can tell you that we share a common driver, but whether or not there some art that inspired a scientific discovery. It may be, that it doesn't it if you don't know what kind of aren't you tired now, because we have already discussed on their show that there are films that have probably in television programmes like STAR Trek that have inspired sign. Exactly so. What happens? There is the aren't our trigger someone to be interested in a subject that goes it. It affects them in an emotional way and then they become charge and that we want to learn about the science
and as we all need, each other ochre combine told so Rick thanks for Poland. Things like you and we still. We still have some more from Peter MAX Peter Peter MAX, but you gotta love em. You got what you said when he's his set such a soothing voice, I can listen to him all day. Venus fight remember him on a scale, never really smooth. Let's see what more he's gotta tell us tat, I was in Cleveland, I hadn't arches, and a wake up in the morning. It's in and I go back to sleep, no wake up again about ten thirty and pamphlet flopping around the tv set. And suddenly a senior Thyssen was catchy pants rolled up past his knees, squatting down lifting up a handful of sand and saying you see all the sand. There are ten thousand beaches in the world, they like ten or twenty miles long and then he lifts up another big pile. Full
sand, and he said, as its running was fingers. He said for every grain of sand that we have on these ten thousand beaches. They are more planets in the universe, and I meant, oh, my god. I can't it. This is so big it's so gigantic that all the grains of sand in ten thousand beaches that are like probably ten feet deep intended. Many miles long, that they are more planets in is the first thing I looked for my phone. I found Neil Thyssen's phone number and I call them. Who is this real? He said to you, he said to me: it's probably bigger than that Well, I'm onto a bone, your mind without drugs, you what you think of that it is like it there's nothing! That's nice to be blown away by then the cosmos, the universe. These complete unbelievable facts that this and the more. I think about it. The more you dream about the more starts, making sense, and you still know that you,
Is this little microscopic little thing in the universe. Thinking about all the bigness, the more the largest thing I mean. Isn't it should now that, because of this thing they call the string theory, they think there could be other universes other couple of ideas led to the idea that there could be a multi verse and we're just one bubble within an uncountable number of other costs. Just like would hobble discovered the first few galaxies exact Are they discovering maybe more university philosophically the same thing, because back then we imagine it was only one galaxy and then he discovered a universe of galaxies. Yeah you them unless must be place. You can hide. It is too big. It's too big to imagine, and sometimes you gotta take a tranquilizer, the calm down, assessor amazing. Ok! Now I didn't think this could happen that and Peter MAX made me like you more real so I got good dibs from Peter MAX and now it has. He makes his hand even call
No, he go off on that. That way, I was just trying to get some sleep. It you ve got him so my hunting for ourselves, but I didn't know that unease amazing, amazing influence in person and that's it they meet you. You know I have a homeless person in my neighborhood who says I really inspectors who set the guy those up on the sidewalk So did you the other day you, whereas these big, crazy, Erika biology, wraps and our hair, so photography can inspire people remember if you hold your line, but in the nineteen nineteen sixty eight APOLLO eight went to the moon, it didn't land but actually circle. The moon came back and took a picture of earth rise above the lunar land is very little in that ok, but you certainly seen that photos called birthright by the way earth does not rise on the moon, because the moon doesn't rotate compared to the earth. So earth is always in the sky so that that the picture is is misrepresents when act. They happens, animal it rose because there in orbit around them and when they took the picture. That's what I say: that's great things
The same is a mountaineer notion that everything that's great things is camera different, then irregular grammar, the bigger and more expensive and take better pictures and most cameras, you'll ever senior what're. You have. I know I don't know new data. So what I'm saying is that picture? Who that showed earth without any lines of continents or states or cities? It would just this orb juxtaposed as part of the scenery of another world, transformed our understanding of our place? the universe and the modern green movement is traceable to that photograph, and so there is their scientific photograph that became iconic art that influence degeneration of people to take action. I just had to show that even now the apple images and thing
I think that the same kind of came, I out: Hubble Dots, digital camera thousand, regular sort of film camera back in the days of APOLLO, eight and now hobbled pictures it is digital. Is it's a very expensive version of the detector? That's in the camera that all of us have the digital cameras that we all use is called a c c d charge coupled device camera. So I'm just the? U s I'm just telling you do you ask? I did I volunteered that you and I love you asked in the Hubble photos, are today's generation of exposure to the rest of the world and this matter o definitely digital pictures of far superior is a more accurate that there, they take the far superior bananas, romantic, Well, you're a lead. I terms a romance. You know, there's a scene in the thin the crossing and film contact. You saw the first remember we Jody Foster was
taken by the aliens into their distant land, she's looking and it's so beautiful in Europe and what she says she says because she's without she speechless by the beauty of it all, she says they should have sent a poet. That's that's just that's political poetical or critical, whatever political? Just and other thing I know I'm a big fan, I'm not Peter Man, even a watch. What you say, I'm on a big fan of Ngos. Starry night, oh yeah, it's been! fired a song, everyone S Orient or no near now. Has the starry night stuff all over his office everywhere they pillows books but she's great, it's beautiful and there's the cover of one. Books too, I kick cause it's a start age, an artist who he could have named, that painting sleep
Village. I want worth argument. We find out what can it used stars in the sky? It's about the sky, not about that I'm agreeing, so the man came through I'm totally with the on that and then there's other articles. In spite of that, the ceiling of the of grand central terminal do now the suit year. You took me they're inside the ceiling to me, yeah. Why didn't need me to take you there's a good grand central term that now, but I never really looked up at tea time. That's different! Ok! So that ceiling, no they're, all the stars are backwards. That pissed me off when I think of it. That was that the guys I forgot to Paul he'll you from nineteen twelve is french artist. I think he was not sufficiently scientifically literate to know that the so the sky he was looking at in a map was the reverse of what he had to put on this on the ceiling we might have been dyslexic. Now, if you can't be that dyslexic Dyslexia
got a few can to your eyeballs in the way we turn the Hubble telescope. I don't get that. What does that mean? That means the colors that I think I see there are not because it really coming up in space. I really feel special eyeball. She would see that where he would see just that where we have global so in space it. When I see, if I wasn't spacecraft, can I open look? I know you will of course something else there was commenced with your eyeballs, you would. However, if you ve got a few, can turn your eyeballs in the way we turn the Hubble telescope. I don't give a shit. What does that mean? That means the colors that I think I found there are not because it really coming up in Spain S very few special eyeballs. You would see that where he would see just the way we have feeble eyeballs. So in space it when I, If I was in spacecraft, Canada wouldn't look like that. No human or something else there was commenced with your eyeballs, but in humble we want to see aggravating while I'm sorry, but it's just you know what happens when we put our make up before they get photographed. It's not what you really look like it, something else. I'm just didn't you know, but if you were there on the planet, would it look like that
Mars, really read: yes, like what you get angry with me we want more climate witless, go fast, clipper, Peter MAX our final clip within which see what more has to tell us about how he's been inspired by science, Maxine Maxine. I want to make an animated film. I told you about earlier in this film has a lot to do with the universe and its with, like you know us suddenly connecting with another species from far far away, who have some common interest with us and it's a beautiful to musical. It's a loud musical and I'm about maybe half we three through designing it conceiving it when I go to some of my friends in Hollywood and see how I can get it made where we're going back. When then comes out his listen Peter MAX, it's been great, haven't our talk and thanks for your hospital inviting me into your studio, where inundated by paintings, ready to fall on me this place is this place. You need
three months wars of this warehouse. Thank you. Thank you. We just have a car applause he went about people, but it's my playground. I the morning. I can't wait to get here and I I don't believe that's how all jobs should Peter MAX thanks for being on start on those Don't you have what you love I guess that I have on on the interview he went on. I think he's my new favouring, can really awesome so I don't if you know that NASA is not unmindful of the fact that art matters in our culture and in society, so they did not just fighter. Pilots fly boys and scientists they send into space. And on its well know, they'll send our space not yet, but there's it doesn't. Arts in space programme where artists are invited to capture so the discoveries of NASA voyages of NASA and whatever is their artistic means of expression, and it was started in nineteen sixty two
commission artist such as Norman Rockwell and and others in it, and it chronicles the history of space exploration through the eyes of artists and others and is more than two thousand were of art by three hundred fifty artists in their orca even listening to start talk. Radio! Certainly I wondered the National Science Foundation will see you next keep looking up. Like Galileo job the orange We should listen to star talk commercial, free, joint star. I'm patriarch for as little as five dollars per month and the ads will disappear, learn more at patriarch dot coms. Last star talk, radio!
Transcript generated on 2020-01-25.