Search for ET on this StarTalk mashup – featuring Neil deGrasse Tyson, David Grinspoon, Seth Shostak, Michael Ian Black, Chuck Nice, Jill Tarter, David Brin, Allen Saakyan, and Doug Vakoch – as we explore where to look and debate whether to send signals ourselves.NOTE: StarTalk All-Access subscribers can watch or listen to this entire episode commercial-free here: https://www.startalkradio.net/all-access/extraterrestrial-mashup/
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This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
Skip the commercials support star talk on patriarch to listen to every episode, commercial, free, secrets in a mystery, is leaving us with many questions to be answered. We find ourselves searching for those answers as the very fabric of space science and society are converging here for the first time. What what are you? the tv I mean the brakes daddy, you Glinda did you grandma ass, the brain they get lab, like the plague why What
I am the grass tasted your personal astrophysicist this week is a special mesh edition. Mishmash of some of our favorite moments around a specific topic using a range of expert guests and co host, and we selected segments from anything it. Under the umbrella of the star, taught radio broadcasts network this week. We're talking about the search for e t. We're talking about the scientific search for alien intelligence, feature interview with steady, cofounder Jill tartar. Check it out. How much of the galaxy have we actually searched for like see
because I every time amount the street someone says we ve looked at me. And found any are we alone and I'm trying to find a way to tell them not likely alone, but they know it looking for a while. So how do you? How do you deal with this? So I try and tell people about all the different ways you might have to look to get it right. All the different frequencies be at the right time, looking at the right place, has to come together right now that big volume that you need to search through set that equal to the volume of the earth oceans all that water? So how much have we sample than the last fifty years? One twelve out glass, snow lot, and so, if you were looking for fish in the ocean, are there any fish in their social? Here's, the glass, I'm gonna, scoop up a glass and I'm gonna. Look
and their own inefficient. There can you claim that there are no fish in the ocean. You'd be stupid to do their short sighted stupid with stupid in the first place normal education to real, shortsighted you you'll be inexcusably egocentric, that's, and so is the fact that it is hard to comprehend how big the searches, no. You can't understand how little we ve done. How ever exponentials will save us beat as our ability to search me technology, computing, exponential growth of storage, retrieval of information all at started, her guests faster and better all the time and all the good stuff. At the end, It's really getting faster from next. We might get a garbage pail of water swimming pool Swimming
of water from a b and then a lake and then very soon an ocean right, we're talking about listening to the skies for a chance to make contact with an alien civil And I got one of the world's experts on it sets just act running I Committee CO, whose tonight, Michael in Black, and right now, it's time for me, very wary, even called from the internet and all about so to search through life in the universe. So let's do it David Hamilton, my guys port to would it be more likely that any intelligence, No, we detect is simply an echo of life now long gone. How could we tell the difference and if we couldn't can we still claim we aren't alone yeah? Well, look people ask that you pick up a signal.
It took me you know who knows how many years to get here, maybe they're gone what maybe they are gone, but you know what the time it takes for a signal to get here might be too. Hundreds thousands of years, the? U S post office, my get me a letter from my aunt and tomorrow, and maybe aunt, has died and she sent that letter it's possible, but the lifetime of ants is pretty long compared to the functioning of postal service, so the chances are she still around. I think that if we pick up, yeah. Maybe it's a hundred year old signal, but I like to think that they haven't self destructive. In the last century, I think it's a good question because ultimately does it matter. I mean we're receiving this signal that answers a fundamental question. I think this is an important point, because we ve talked about the fact maybe there's different kinds of intelligence and maybe we'll never understand the signal. I think that's pretty likely actually but the matter, because what you ve learned is that what's happened on this planet, as happened in many other places, the next day
North New Orleans Louisiana. Could we send entangled particles to an extraterrestrial intelligence to communicate with them in real time where you could send a particles, but the facts are there? in a quantum entanglement, very appealing, but it doesn't allow Sudan might communication. Despite what many people think physics allow you to send information faster than the speed of light unless less outline. It is wrong and he's never been shown to be wrong. Sorry rights, even when he was wrong. He was right. You're always talk about the cosmos yes, exactly cosmos, constant, he put it in his equations, which would represent some kind of
of gravity in the universe and turn out. It wasn't necessary to be in his equation for the universe, to expand, which he discovered a few years later, have to hobble, discovered and expanding at first. He said it was the biggest mistake biggest blunder of his life, and then we would find the cosmos honourable constant, in the actual universe, called dark energy, and so I've concluded that I started biggest blunder, was saying that that was as biggest blunder, don't even when he was wrong. He was right. That's how you you're bad ass next James Colthursts by in view Arkansas, if Seti discovered, extraterrestrial intelligence. How long would it take to share the discovery to the public in what is the process involved with making it, I would say, a billion for research. Did you tell them? Firstly, due to the president to know? First, no, I look. We don't have a call. Let's start with this, William, we have had false alarm.
Ninety nine. You are false alarm that, for most of the day, looked like the real deal and I kept waiting for the pen call the White House, the call somebody to call the people are called within your times and the facts. Are there they were calling within hours of us finding the signal. Yes, though, this notion that the government is, now in control, and now this is not the case. The government is not that high functioning What was it got? The questions excellent this is. Special guess denied all the way here from California, which is even beyond Jersey Doctor, Doug tobaccos dug from donkeys the president and founder met the international, its amity, I and that's messaging extraterrestrial intelligence. So, just talk about looking for the aliens we're gonna talk about how you
communicate with them and maybe what you would say if you did Doug thanks thanks for coming to be here. I I first saw How many of you people out there think there is life in space I'm a palm scam. You may find it all, but intelligent life via eyes, so there we're listening how many of you believe in S on radio. Nobody can hear you raise european vision of our tonight and in how we know they're not out there I get that guy out. Let me start with a pale What do we know about life in space? What have we found so far what are we found of our world? we found a lot of static so far and that's what we ve been looking for. So Seti scientist Sizing involved in the search for extraterrestrial intelligence
look for radio signals, unlike the kind of radio that Galaxy stars made and we and found those yet, but I think the bad news is over the last twenty years. There's been a lot of things we have found so just over twenty years ago. We knew of no stars that have planets. Now we go out and look at the night sky and vote, we all of those stars and planets. Maybe one out of five of those have planet at just the right distance that it could support life with liquid water we didn't know about that when when setting began, and we know that life can survive in incredibly diverse environments here on earth from the Arctic tundra of the north to acid hot springs. The core of nuclear reactors. Why even handedly jersey Yes, even handed New Jersey of life can survive. There is a very
the chance it's out there now we just need to find an hour, or so you saying is: there is a lot of real estate, but we seen any condos road no condos. Now there there was actually suggested that there could be not just the Congo but an entire city. In the fairy institutes and we Actually, you looked at the Seti Institutes and we looked at many international anyway the star that Kepler mission? This is a NASA mission to look for planets around other stars and they look at by seeing the domain as the planet goes Savior If you're the Kepler spacecraft you're observing a star on the star and every time It goes between us there's a little dear me. This is a planet, the size of Jupiter or Saturn, one of the big ones in our solar system, the Jimmy less than one percent. There's something strange about this one star up to twenty
dear me and one of the explanations was maybe it's an alien mega structure. So sad that the settlements to do Alan tell us cooperate as well as their engine. Is there maybe they're sending US radio signals we used? an optical observatory in Panama, to see if there's any brief laser pulses sign of that, and so our expectation is we're going to find a natural explanation. Majors freedom! then we can imagine, and in Lahti as these turn out to be false alarms. So so far, unfortunately, no sign of guarantees technology set before we go any further. Can I ask what may be a silly question, since this is what you do is? Is it necessary to point and listen, different directions, and if so, how do you know where the point listen? Yeah? Well, that's all that's a good question for which is no terrifically. Good answer the facts? Are we don't know where the aliens are hanging out? I mean you know. I never got a text message.
Where did hang on love to get in touch and we're over here, so you can say well all right. The way to be, rapid just look at the entire sky, the trouble that is If you do that, you're spending most of your time, looking in the wrong direction right like an into finding life in the desert. You can look at the whole desert, but it might be more effective than just look at the your ways. So we that we look at near by stars at an hour. She might have plans that are the kind of stars and planets it might have life. Ok, so that city by Doug Year, as another idea? Why way, for The call or worry hang around hoping to pick up their call. Why don't we try and take the initiative and get in touch nets? Many doubts about. Well said, he is always assume that any alien that has the ability to transmit we're going to be motivated? that they're just altruistic,
the main messages here for our benefit- and we hope that's true at least some several dozen So that's why? Even at our organization, Mattie we're still We're looking for a laser pulses, we're hopeful that that continues, but we also want to explore another option, and that is that are not taken the initiative that maybe, in fact life is out there much more widely spread than we had imagined. There was italian physicists called Enrico Fermi, who in nineteen fifty said well, if that's all wipe out there. Where are they called the Fermi paradox and one of the answers to the firmly paradox is maybe and they are observing us, but that's it. They say they want to you're from us before they respond. So it's a little bit. So you go to the zoo. Your observing a bunch of zebras.
Very well and good years, even talk to one another. But what happened? One of those zebras turns short. You look you in the eye and starts pound how to series of prime number. Establishes a very different relationship with that creature. It may just a vulgar, responds you're, not other just traveling with one another, they want to talk to us. So that's what we're here with Mary testing the zoo. This is to see whether even nearby stars might be inhabitants in hypotheses looking anything how so I say other than tobacco, you need not me, you don't need to be smoking anything other than tobacco. You just gotta be willing to do the experiment, and you know something usual for a lot of astronomers, because astronomers very good scientists, but it's a passive science. You just wait for the information that come in. That's what we have to view of years, trying to very different? It's a different mindset have the same We can actually be more active. We can send out a message and them yet
Why, back? I hate me silly here. I know this is a serious come with Asia I believe there was an episode of started tramp where we, we cannot do that and we got something called the boring, I'm sort of anybody here, the stars they were like the a bore, the boar out there. You know there are other people who share your view. Stephen hawking has said. If you get a single, do not trans matter. The aliens might come here. I've got bad news for both you and Stephen Hawking, We know the way. I'm gonna write that down in my diary. You got there, but we can view and Stephen hawking. Our overlooking one critical point was that well if the Borg want ass? It's too late? because they have already picked up. I love Lucy, they our radios, Ngos have. You can travel of you if you can build while those huge born cubes, then
picking up a radio signals is no big deal said you run the numbers if you look at how much our radio telescopes have grown and then just continue that Three hundred years, We would be able to pick up our own level of legal radiation at the five hundred light years. So The bad news is it's too late. The Good NEWS is looks like It's not a big worry, because not only a radio and tv signals been going a long time. We, giving evidence that we all life on earth for two and a half billion years, since the sense that it I've been started, creating oxygen in the atmosphere. So there any really paranoid aliens and want to wipe out the competition they had plenty of time to get here if they are on their way. I say: let's be proactive and they were much more interesting, interstellar conversation now being an island. Look. I think we ought to come back to this, because this is but new shoe, whether its
idea to broadcast in his face, but I'm still backward that the zebra at the Zoo linking prime numbers and my direct. My reaction to that would be you and I are going on the road, because the Nez Do that to me when I was gonna do ripe so, but I think that that the point is you are assuming something about their psychology if you say look, all we have to do is to send them. You know some interesting tweets or whatever, and and then they will do something in return. That will justify that effort. Now your training, Ecology! So absolutely are you you have to assume their motivations, but that's what setting I'm just have been doing all long. We have been assuming that there Why do they heavy lifting that they are going to be transmitting for a benefit and again, I hope that's true for some of the aliens, not all aliens may have the same motivation and even at you this idea being altruistic. We know from looking at altruism on earth than
reform of altruism is called reciprocal. Altruism, you do so. For me and I knew something for you. The trick is someone's gotta make the first move. It may be that they look at us in a way we're supposed to go on, far away. We ve been doing this for thousands or millions of years we ve been through this. Big out an advantage to contact you Once we have the most the benefits are. You should take the initiative where sometimes we talk about interstellar education is joining the galactic club. What I find so irritating no one ever talks about paying our dues or even submitting an application, but that's what it is to send ignore, saying we want to make contact me. What we need to make an application deficit was so there's not a restricted. It is a bit like the gradual marks comment about not we want a model and an alibi
is it because it has a sense of inferiority complex? What do we have to say that is innovation a million years more advanced than we could want to hear, but I think I I dont think we're the most intelligent or them wise civilization put my money on us being the civilization in the entire galaxy that has the best balance between joy and rural, I dont think anywhere, but the current time right now to get in Our civilization can make us more unique. I think what we offer you know we want to always, but our best put forward show off how powerful where we're not on the galactic scale. The thing that we must have offer is just saying here is who we are as humans, and it might just help us. Vision that is being around so along the way, of annihilation itself, they can't even conceive the idea being mortal is beyond their capacity driving. That's where we really have something to offer show
who we are ass. Human beings, human beings, decease do is watch start somewhere reminder of kindergarten. All right we can already taken great here for a moment, but when we back to talk a little bit more about this, because I want to know if organ, if dog is going to speak for you and talk to the cosmos, right? Do you care what he says I mean here these ideas about the aliens being in a pretty benign info. You because you're at a very special point in your screen? Let's get back to that when we get back to start on, all men have guns secret for you. I'm gonna, to consider singing all of the ads on this shell there's just one
and where to get out of hearing there go to patriarch arms last star, talk and support where does at the five dollar level or higher to listen the star talk ad free, you can download all current episodes into your favorite podcast player and never, we're here another commercial on star talk ever again. You will definitely not have to hear me sing if you support us at Patria, dark coms. Last our talk, radio, I mean I'm just thinking I mean just saying. Really space inside it down to earth you're listening STAR Doc, welcome back to startle talk more of this week's mashup.
Why I love with nice, Byzantium and Tobacco John you're hosted just back from common astronomer at those set. The institute in the lonely, big area on the other coasts and our job is to try and look for life and space. Doug. Isn't it stated communicating would live in space. Let me ask you this guy, if you're gonna broadcast in it, Can I take it that would marry use all about right? You know what about the message? Are you just gonna send an empty town gives you say: hey, there's someone here on earth? Are you going to actually get mom pictures something we're going to be sending a message. So our organization began in twenty fifteen. We laid out our plans what we plan to accomplish by the end of twenty eighteen, so by the end of twenty eight June, will be transmitting a powerful, intentional signals to nearby stars?
we're, we're taking an approach that somewhat different from the path. First of all, we are focusing on near by Are there been a few symbolic transmissions in the past? It will actually, Yet you in a minute, I think, but living here, he was in the past. We often transmitted to very distant stars were. Because on nearby stars and were also going to send them repeatedly over and over again that helps to actually satisfying. Does another world know whether we are encountering and so what we see now we, know that there are plenty of stars out there that have planet? A recent discovery is trappers star one forty light years from earth. It has at least seven Amazon, three of them are lying in the habit of ozone. The zone called the Goldilocks zones, not too hot. Not you go just right for liquid water for a lot
This is the kind of stock with their ones better, even nearer than that, so that you can get a response back within the life of these are no stars that those are all plant this the hours on the left their scale now trap is one system forty light years away. That's not much so you're probably has in his hand a right so low? could send a message to this group of planets and bite. Wait. You may know that all these planets in the trap is one system that, once we know about, we know about seven there. There there shown in this slide, which particularly vivid on radio you'll notice there the same size as the earth. That's very unusual. You think in our solar system got mercury, Venus Earth and Mars, kind of the same size, but then you have Jupiter Saturn. There are very different size. Ok, these about the same three of them are in at the right. Where maybe you could as in biology, maybe I'm liquid oceans atmospheres that kind of thing that so maybe this isn't just as place where there's an inhabitant planet
maybe this is a whole inhabited ecosystem. Now, here's the question and if you, if you're broadcasting's, is some system like This is forty light years away, You can run out of money before you get your reply right where there's a common misconception that you need to transmit continuously in order to that for this to make any sense. What happens if there's any scientists are that we do and what we do. We look at a star for a few minutes: nothing as many we move on to the next one and we laughing, and we only transmitted want so that nearer. The idea is you talked about at the beginning that we think of aliens is being like ourselves what we need. Taken would now it is just a little bit more advanced than we are with our thirty surge and vacant. Looking at us all the time, so, in fact the setting institute is in the process of building an optical Seti observatory. That
everywhere in the sky all the time. So, even if that signals comes by just once, it's enough to pay them. We have now and economically viable way and you go to one star you paying it and move on to the next hour. You pay, but you don't have to be brands, maybe in all the time you do the need to have one thing that we are in a very short supply of here now and that patients, because trappist why you send a signal, and we get a reply back if they don't take too long and taken to their equivalent in the United Nations to get consensus. We get a reply back. At the end of this century. So it's gonna take eighty you get a reply back and there are others that are closer than the nearest star proximate Centauri little, poor light years away if it would take years to get around trip, but I think the biggest opposition to marry, within the setting community is not that it's a danger to the aliens coming here, but it's just do we have the capacity as a civilization to take on that kind of law?
term task and the reality is that the early days of steady have reflected that we are in at a lesson civilization. We did that easy thing. We looked in a way that could give us result to benefit us now what a better way I'm characterizing an adolescent than us, and now what proposing is that as we move into the next half century, we expand back to think about what we can do for others, other civilizations and future generations of humans. A project that takes a lot longer than we're comfortable with decades for centuries. Starter welcome to start on all stars. I am David grinned spoon and this the star talk all stars I'll, be here all star host today and today's co host is comedian, Chuck nice David Eyes growing Jack. I mean it's good to see you again, this great, really fun to be with you again and now today.
We're going to be talking about communicating with extraterrestrials, I am not only that there's, no there's a controversial sub topic, which is the question. Should we be just the list We ve been doing for maybe fifty years. Where should we actually be sending our own messages, some people that's the way to go. Other people think that it's stupid because we don't know who we're talking to deal bad guys over exactly you know you just gotta put it out there. You know just it. Like an old cosmic tender, Where were you don't get a swipe right or left you just put it out there exactly? We don't do it, we can. We can this assembly choose, who we're gonna be, who we're gonna be dating on the end interstellar seen here ass, the others. There is reason to maybe for caution. Maybe not some people think it's silly, so it will get into that. Today we are going to be fielding. Your fan questions we're going to be doing something that we call cosmic queries and
right now we ve got David brain on the line with Us Award winning Science fiction Arthur and also a published scientists Oh, don't peer reviewed studies, communicating with extraterrestrial intelligence, and somebody has been very involved in the discussion and the recent debate about Miss Seeing the aliens were very glad to have you with us David, bring greater it was you guys couple a real brainy acts in star talk at headquarters. Be me up, I know a lot of people have felt like they ve been abducted by being so captivated reading Our books by you, you haven't personally ever been abducted. Have you David,
Well in the sixties, there was a lot of ambiguity about you know whether or not you had I was adapted as an excuse for what you did on Friday night, but I hear there still using those excuses in your generation check to see us as a matter of fact, they aren't. I say, there's nothing wrong with mind. Expansion, drugs, no mind France is yes, That's it! That's that's one of the reasons we need science fiction speaking to mind expansion. Maybe we should move into some of our cosmic queries in and see what the readers want to hear from us, absolutely where you got justice, Brass Meyer for a more old Greenwich Connecticut as opposed to New Greenwich. This is what he says. Let's say we see the response from extraterrestrials to one of the messages we have beamed out into the cosmos over the years, such as the hello from earth message.
Our opinion back here on earth, whereas society or in our daily lives. Do you think the knowledge that we no longer are the only known life in the universe? With this have the biggest impact school religion business. What what do you think that about that we would have the biggest impact Oh you know if you look back at the science fiction of the fifties or forties, it was assumed that the biggest impact would be on religion and that their that people would go out and get all upset and all that well very clearly not true anymore, the world's several of the world's biggest religions, Buddhism and Hindus, and we're all always compatible with a plurality of world Judaism. It turns out the in the town what it is There has been discussion of plurality of worlds. Mormonism is based on that note. Plurality thoroughly and the catholic Church has
in the last twenty years done. A very, very substantial and impressive I cuddling on this issue and is now fully prepared, under the tutelage of the Vatican, astronomer, geek, Handsome Indiana, Oh you know there are some religions that would find it difficult and some of american fundamentalists have declared. For no reason that makes any theological sense. The earth has to be six thousand years old and there must be no other life form, but even these always say very. Emotionally invested, conservative, religious, times have been hedging? Their bets was one
there was one. I saw recently saying that there's no way you'll find real aliens out there and we're not counting little scummy bats. Those that carry out of the EU will probably find out there, which means they have already accepted the notion that there's probably They merely drawn their line in the Good question at safe here intelligent life was the legitimate position, take if you analyze the Drake equation and all the possibilities for why we seem to be alone probably in my opinion, one of the top ranked Protect explanations. Is this intelligence? difficult than we thought and believe it or not. We're still have some difficulty with intelligence as we speak here. I often wonder if there is I was life on earth, not even just saying that as a joke, although it is a funny thing to say, but that if, if really
really intelligent extraterrestrials would look at earth and we it is a planet with intelligent life is interesting question to me. I like to think that one of the biggest effects that such scullery would have be on international diplomacy and even inter ethnic relationships that it seems that our human beings, when faced with an outside threat or even the knowledge of an outsider tend to pull together, and I think that, faced with the clear evidence that there is somebody else out there It's not at all like us that we would realize that we are all really like one another, and I maybe it's just my wishful thinking or but I do tend to think that it really could have a catalytic effect on the way human beings get along on earth and that in turn,
but our buzz evolve into some kind of an intelligent species that might be worth talking to four from the aliens point of view we would all get together because now there's I hate the data, common enemy, Al Qaeda com and other things that we do not know what does way human beings do it like. You know we're well We come together because you know the the friend of friend is. My friend you know that whole thing. So absolutely I mean, I think, a wouldn't you couldn't help but feel like our differences between differences with one another were somewhat diminished by the that there's somebody out there really different that we are now interacting with in some way asked about president stuff. I love it. Welcome back to startle, here's more.
This week's mashup, okay, well, a man whose talk all stars, I'm David Greenspan and I'm here with shock nice. Yes- and I guess David Brain we're talking about communicating with aliens in including the controversial question of whether we should be revealing ourselves to the cosmos or what we should be a little bit cautious, not knowing what may be out there. There been some famous voices out there. I you may have heard Doktor Stephen, marking has famously said that aliens could come and do us harm. David brain has been cautious. Unease told us a little bit about that.
Now and then maybe we'll hear a little bit more there. Other people who say: oh damn the torpedoes, let's just send messages and see what's out there, what what are we worried about? So it's an interesting debate. My own opinion is that we should, as David says at least, have some kind of a global conversation about it before we just decide that we're going to speak for all of earth and reveal ourselves for all the time. Maybe we can't know for sure what the dangers are, but we it's probably worth at least having some kind of a consultation and not being so arrogant as to the hell with it. Let's just see what happens when were you planning cosmic poker? You don't want to show your hand, not me. You know, at least until the proper time presents itself. Yeah I mean it is. It is kind of a possible I'd, be interested to know what David Brain thinks of this. But when do you know when it's When are we really ready to say? Ok, we know enough to start talking, but at least we could attempt
to have some kind of a global buying a David, you have a quick thought on our own win, win Ok, too, to broadcast boys, are so much a partition. A sum of knowledge. That is my criterion, but the rate at which were learning. We are. We are like a four year old who wakes up in a jungle. That's quiet maybe too quiet. Is the cliche and what you do under those circumstances. Will you try to learn as much as you can quietly, while, because there are some conceivable dangers, I think it was Stephen hawking exaggerated, but it would be good if we were to pay attention to the fact it across the last thousand years every time a technologically advanced civilization or species and counter the less advanced civilization or species.
Less advanced ones suffered very, very badly and that's one hundred percent of the time, given that perhaps we should have a little bit of a conversation before running through the jungle going you who, especially since we are learning so fast, he asked the Hague just twenty years ago we knew of no planets outside our solar system. Now we know of almost ten thousand right yeah. So in this rate of learning. Why not? listen and learn, children will have the option with all that added information of this.
For themselves, whether they want to shout you who are you? I had seen the eminently sensible boy arise and that's why you don't do it because recklessness is far more exciting David he's gettin out there, so the whole universe, like you know what you say reveal forget, reveal its flash. The universe out here. You're saw board. This also happened to becoming up at a time when we are faced with a range of global issues that require us to try to have some sort of global decision making or global consultative process. I'm talking about global warming and other issues. It wouldn't hurt for us to learn how to at least attempts to make some
a global, notation and other things you're never going to reach a perfect consensus with every village of every place on earth, but you can at least make an honest attempt. Yes, absolutely, and by the way, data you are a science fiction writer and I just want to say that I'm about to submit a treatment for Disney's cosmic jungle book, which I think is you just came up with. Can I read the songs they? Let me days, there is room for everybody on this trade at this is me Alison from Otto with Canada and Israel, says with one hundred billion galaxies full of stars, there's probably other life out there will, thanks Maybe I'm glad you were you turned it on that, but how close together do we need beads and notice each other? If we assume aliens have radio telescopes with similar sincerity hours, how far from earth could they be and actually discern any of our radio signals? So how
what our neighbours have to be that we scream out of our window when they hear us, that's a good question that is one of the few questions. Perhaps in this whole field of steady there we can actually answer quantitatively, there's so much that subject given subject to opinion interpretation, but that's that's a calculation, and it goes back to nineteen fifty nine when other, first ever serious, Seti paperwork pushed by by Giuseppe Cocconi and Philip Morris in in nature. Using and a calculated that with earths most powerful radio telescope, you could communicate clear cut across the galaxy, with another radio telescope of the same power. The problem is, of course, it's going to take a long long time if you're going more than a thousand light years, it's gonna take more than a thousand years, so there time element as well. We have the equipment, and presumably they would have the equipment to communicate over a long distance, but
farther away. You get, then you into these crazy situations where it might longer than your civilization has been around to have a conversation, brand. Do you have any any comments on this relationship between distance and power and how close the ailing, need to be to have a reasonable interaction, To really important aspects to this, one is for thirty forty years we use the classic Drake equation, which said all right of life evolves in these little places around the galaxy and that's all we have to calculate but it was pointed out that interstellar travel is not impossible, certainly not with robots that might cut the copy themselves, and probably colonization of some kind or another is possible, in which case you're, not you came up, warlike, spreading zones.
And how long would it take for such a spreading zone if you had starships the just travel ten percent of the speed of light and may planted colonies and then a build up their civilization and then spread out and plodded more colonies turns out. You could fill the galaxy within sixty million years, which is enabling nothing's the hour so league the question of where is everybody? And why are we seeing them is made vastly worse? If you allow any kind of interstellar travel ride together they started anywhere. They should already be everywhere. That's right, and so one of the things I talk about my novel existences, how, when we get out the asteroid doubt or the Kaiser about we find an entire civilised. Nor perhaps they fought of various types of space probes that were sent by
previous cultures and will probably be sending such self replicating probes. But the other half of the question is, you know, How likely is it that, at any of these facing intervals, we're going to likely be able to detect others and those calculations have been done and and it turns out, were at a border line the earth itself, would only be detectable two very super advanced aliens with huge antennas that they aim deliberately at us for a year and then they might take up. I love Lucy, so right now in the process of change the channel gory that the barn door excuse for Mattie is it's too. They already know about us, but it turns That is simply and scientifically wrong. The people who want to use these.
Planetary, radars, descend, focused, focus, themes, space going you who they intend to change the current situation. By yelling very, very loudly and very focused Lee. So now the the fear of that would be that we attract the Borg. Basically it and before you know it we're all serving overlords dead, come here and you know, I mean the thing is you you can put it that way, and it is easy to make fun of because there are there's so much questionable science fiction about about. Billions coming to invade us an hour. A lot of people think it's even it's silly thing to worry about, but Dave Brennan is written about. Those unease is actually persuaded me that if you, if you use the bricks precautionary principle. You have to ask well and we prove that is not a threat. An hour, we certain that it's not and are there some illogical explanations, we observe that might be consistent with that
resilience and then, if you admit that you can't prove that it's not some existential threat, then you to say. Ok all, then, what on what basis the we decide that it's ok to risk the future of earth Biosphere, risk. It turns out that there are mature ways to do this Two years ago, the genetic engineering and genetic research communities in biology hold a moratorium on genetic research and had a meeting at a seminar California and came out with better practices best practices. Let us have our cake and eat it to. Let us have advances in genetic research while taking some very, very solid and mature precautions. And the NASA has a planetary protection office whose for
it is to make sure that space probes we land another world have been sterilised as best we can but not in a way that makes it so that we can't explore, but but just as best we can and of course, these precautions are ten times a hundred times a strongly. If we're going to be returning stuff, you know to that. Might in fact the earth so there that's her ways of doing this land. From when you say that the only takes one space herbie- that's all it takes, is one space
to ruin everything David s face Herpes. You know the virus herpes stick! Actually you know what I'm saying you don't want to mess with. Nobody wants to put a sad one, the sore that shows up from bad sprays or be that's all I'm saying is the target or talking about safe fatty. Here is exact same member to practice, safe Seti folks. This from a job Carlyle. He comes from Facebook anyone's to know this does last or Seti have a set of guidelines for what to do in the event of extra terrestrial contact. How do we respond to the public find out? How much information can we share? Are they already here? What's going on? Oh yeah, good, I in the end, the answer is yes There is a protocol, the next question, which is what to do? If somebody from earth wants to send a message, we ve talked about talked about that a little bit, but if we can get a message than the idea what to do if a messages received freely.
And it's it's been much harder, this aid. Can you community to agree on the next question, which is what to do? If somebody from earth wants to send a message we ve talked about that a little bit, but if we do now commit a message than the ideas first, you can form a first. You confirm it. Ok talk to another observatory, first to make sure they see it too. So we we rule out a fault. I cannot be an anomaly. It has to be a confirmed, a camp that has to be a confirmed, communication, yeah reception of communication, so you don't eat out of all the media when you're still not sure once you're sure and you become sure by learning other observatory, so they can check it out to so as not to some local thing and then once you're sure the protocol is, you were the. Political leaders, the media there is less there's a protocol? I can't tell you the exact order, but is the opposite of secrecy. It's like total transparency. We're sure. But what we do know is twitter is not the first to find it.
Like you, don't you don't you tweet out man? I think they're here think think contact that as well as an interesting question, because when these protocols were devised it was pre twitter, but certainly they person sitting there. The telescope receiver, if they're being responsible, is not gonna tweet. While I I see an alien, but once the news is decided This is good. We can release it. I'm sure social media will play a huge role in that let's move or let us out another question, Mr Another- and this is from Shelly sock- show you at Shelly Sack on Twitter She said: what would you most want to know about the aliens? and for them to know about us the game of getting to know you, whether the two most important things that you think should In that exchange. Good question Shelly. What would we most want to know about them and what we most want them to know about us. So my personify
Ask him one thing: it would be how did you do it? How did You survive where they technological civilization. Because I'm assuming in theirs good math behind this than anybody we hear from, has added techno I've got civilization for quite some time: they're, not brand new babies like us and therefore they ve solved riddle that were struggling with now. How do you have that exponentially? Create increasing more and more powerful technology and yet not somehow any use it to survive? Not to do yourself in we can you can easily see we could do one or the other, I'm thinkin somebody we hear from has learned how to use technology in a mature way, great learned how to handle this global civilization puzzle. So, if I could ask one thing would be like eight, you any tips for us. How do we do this year? David brilliant. What would you most like to know about them? well? I would ask
I'm a little bit personality. I would ask why do we have to ask you for that, help why weren't helping us all along this diametrically so where the hell were you allowed Nobody believer in ancient aliens and the whole notion that we deprecate. Ourselves is a good thing. We ve always flagellate ourselves and by how we aren't living up to our hopes and dreams, but to be honest, as animals go we're, pretty damn nice and we ve tried very very hard, and I look across the last six, eight thousand years, because I've been around the whole time and all the hard working desperately eager well, meaning people. Who tiled rocks on rocks on rocks, to make pyramids in appeals to some kinds of godlike beings to come and help us, and to be honest, we advance this level ourselves and
my opinion. That's the point of pride, its assent, Stick accomplishment Google that aliens claim credit for it. I like the way you think that we really goes learning Ottawa David brainier. By the way. Not only does it fine humans really interesting, but he's been here for at least six thousand years sunlight the plot thing at the very beginning of the earth itself, six thousand years era, we have to wrap up now. Thank you so much for joining us today. This has been star talk, all stars: I'm David grinned spoon on twitter at Doktor, funky spoon, my co host shock nice on Twitter, Chuck, nice comic and our guest today has been David Brain on twitter David branch. Thank you so much for joining us, Bardell only holds up the organs which you can listen. The star talk, commercial free, joint star talk on paper,
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Transcript generated on 2020-01-20.