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done select accessories, free shipping, monthly payment options with Del preferred account save today, by calling eight seven seven ask Del that's eight seven, seven ask del mastercard is growing its music but print and turning up the volume by unleashing the power of web three to help emerging artists unleashed their true potential joined the mastercard artist accelerator, a next level programme with tools, tech and community, where new voices can create, learn from indoors and build a fan base to help make dreams a reality. Soon, new opportunities will be unlocked for both creators and vans alike, with the mastercard music pass visit, mastercard dot com, slash, artist dash accelerator to learn more elevating? The next generation of music is priceless time for our weekly classic episode, where we bring you some of the best and strangest stuff from our archives that this

when is this, will is an update because ever since you, when I started this, show as Paul helpfully pointed out ten, ago this year we started the audio podcast version of this week in tunis I feel like a sucker man. Every time I hear their J f k updates, I think, maybe Oh, I feel the same way, but we a little trick. All its trickle down J, F, K, economics. Sorry, sorry, I know it wasn't Bobby. We once in a while. You get a few new documents that have been declassified and you think, oh, maybe there's going to be something in this trove. That's going to! Let us know what really happened and well there was

some stuff, the went down and twenty seventeen and we talked about it. That's what this episode is from. You opposed to psychic powers and government conspiracies history is riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or learn this stuff. They don't want you to know, hello welcome back to the show. My name is not my name is no, they call me, then you are you in that makes this stuff. They don't want to know now we are looking at developing We should in in the past guys we ve been hesitant to cover, like as their unfolding because a peak behind the curtain here, of course, in our supervision paul deck and will agree with us a hopefully I'm sure

look at his body language, all his his wishes. Hedging he's hedging he's edgy is bad. I respect that. We we feel just terrible if we the report on something that is it's occurring in the news right and by the time our episode comes out, the situations, Lately changed did you, I guess boiler you guys. This is not live we did this like a week ago. The good thing about specific topic is that the occurrence happened in nineteen sixty three, some exiting the earlier fifty plus years of history that we can cover and then bring some of these new stuff that actually occurred around eighteen. Sixty emily. You know we don't want to be old beans. That's a nine vague, say that now think so. You're there I work and I think he's gonna learn. Beams yeah well write it let us now. I are they mouldy or just stale leaders

like I'm using it as, like. I just add a term a figure of speech. You guys are sceptical about bag badgers. that's, got a really do. If it's ok, what are we talking about today? Can we get to the thing for crying out loud? Let's, let's start with the facts of brass tacks, president John, If Kennedy was assassinated on november twenty second nineteen sixty three or about twelve thirty in the afternoon in Dallas texas, while they were riding in a presidential motorcade and in the probably the biggest understatement of our entire show, all hell broke loose yep, it's true, and then you fast forward several decades and would like there's a survey by a site called five: thirty, eight dot com. They found that only thirty three percent of the people responding actually believe the findings of the official warren commission. That's the one that can

polluted in nineteen sixty four that the gunman lee Harvey Oswald was responsible for the death of president Kennedy and today sixty one percent of U s public believe that at least one other person was involved. Yes, not just a single gunman, so you guys know and of a kennedy, not ask any catch me up on the warren commission shore the warren commission. We talked about it. before on the show. Officially is known as the president's commission on the assassination of president Kennedy, which I don't feel like one too many presidents and thereby that's fine. Name? Can we make it into an acronym for me that helps me digest a little better than other t, pc, Forty eight o p kay. go on anyway, was formed by the president that immediately followed by the presidency Lyndon Johnson correct who, by the way, was a real pill, apparently use a pill

A lot of accusations have been made about him and his involvement with the assassination jfk over the years. We have not found any of them to be completely true, but there are some juicy details in there but has a very pleasant sounding name. When you say the initials l b J, it's very mellifluous, it is, steve why you know there was a thing. Listeners, friends and neighbors that Lyndon Johnson used to do was called the johnson treatment he will get in people's faces, like grab them there, their lapel foreheads inches away. He would one guy into a bathroom here busted into the stall, because I wouldn't fly today yeah while he was doing his business on he's a large gentleman as well a very tall and imposing bit of a bull in a china shop. Kind of absolutely no they'll be J. Do Ok, so he formed the present commission on the assassination of president Kennedy. The twenty. Ninth nineteen sixty three just a few days after President Kennedy was shot,

and it was all the whole reason to have. This was to investigate what happened on that day right, because people wanted answers and the commission acted as quickly as they could to this day. You can read their full report. Well, their quota boat, full reply We can already information. It was given to the warren commission quickly in government. Time isn't like day is right. In this dispute report likely took many months. yeah, there's no quickly in people time and see how quickly and government I'm so There were racing to determine whether there was any truth any sand to the multitudinous rumours surrounding this assassination and the commission eventually concluded that lee Harvey Oswald acted alone, but his own power in EU assistance from my any criminal organization intelligence agencies. shady dude or foreign government or foreign government is very important and that jack room

be the man who would later assassinate Oswald had new previous relationship with that guy, either so jack Ruby. Apparently, the astor, yet the store was that the loan gunmen was killed by alone, gunman and Nothing is related, nothing to see here folks only conspiracies you been reading about or anyone's been saying in papers of these weird rumours. No, that's true, please continue you regularly scheduled programming and win win win the three of us started. This show. One of the things that we wanted to do was to explore the stuff on the fringes, rare and n. We stay away from the jfk f k assassination because there is already been so much work dine on it right. There don't come sooner, makes a movie and then a whole bunch of other conspiracy theories, sack into the laughter and nothing you nothing,

he would have found, would have been new news. It would have been old beans away I'm not giving up on it and how I realize it's gonna work. I respect your can only tell you know see nobody. Told beans yet, but that just because this episode hasn't come out, I'm a than I'm telling you guys invest now get in on the ground floor of these various catchphrase. So they can. The commission has a quote where they they sum up. This relationship quote The commission made intensive inquiry into the backgrounds and relationships of oswald in Ruby to determine whether they knew each other or were involved in a plot of any kind with each other or others. It was unable to find any credible, evelyn, support the rumours linking oswald and Ruby directly or through others. The commission concludes If that they were not involved in a conspiratorial relationship with each other or with any third party in quote,

There is some very important information that will get to towards the close of this show. to discuss specifically what may have been held to the chess to some of the intelligence agencies and not give in to the Warren commission specifically right. So they're doing their best, yet people more in commission doing their best, I I hate to steal a line from beauty and the beast, but the typical conspiracy, stuff, you'll grow up you're going to hear about the jfk assassination might as well be tails oldest time. At this point, however, very recently there were documents, files of a plethora- and I am using that word correctly- of files pertaining to the assassination that were classified for decades and

and again like in the past couple weeks and as we record this as no pointed out earlier, this is a bit of a time travel experience whenever you're listening to a podcast we're in early november when we're recording this it's november, it's november. What year is only just okay year of our lord two thousand and seventeen oh whoa, the whole time, yeah yeah yeah all year long we are, then I saw it recently several of these documents. The pleasure of these documents were released, were declassified and for years people who do not believe the official story or the findings.

The Warren commission have been have been convinced that there will be some sort of great revolution that that comes forthright in the public eye. I have to put myself in that camp yeah honestly, because we ve talked about these records being released by the past, at least two president's when, when there's a date that comes up that essentially hey if the resident decide he or she can release these documents in every time that has happened up until this year. They have said no and we're not gonna released the documents YAP, something something always come yes! So there is this thing. This act that congress past called the j f k, assassination records collection act. which are they passed in ninety ninety two bush senior. Yes, yes, george bush, George h, w bush, that is a george w Debbie bushes, father,

gotta, be the voice of the voice, heard another voice affairs about oil on october, twin six. Nineteen. Only to my daddy pass this act here, signed it and it was the final release date because it's fifty fifty years after october, twenty six, two thousand and seventeen so that that was a date that the current president used to release the docking. Mr president, MR president of question, from the front I bumble and stuff they want, you know what Is this collection consist of and we'll call you all beans yeah? less was Joe maggie into a real world maths I get to her. I just need to go through some of this sure what is but what's in this collection, ok, so this collection, it's basically all of the intelligence agencies in federal government organizations and agencies in usa. But all the documents relating to the assassination of jfk

I collective more. They sent him over to the national archives, so in this collection is approximately five million pages of records like printed. it is worth we're talking, indiana jones style, vaults. Just how all we way up to horror stories or whatever eighty percent of these records are open in full. So that's the amount of five million records. No one accidentally used a black highlighter. Well, according I don't think, there's any such thing as a black highlighter. Also, I knew an article where it says the, whereas, like F b, I and ca realize that they've been using black highlighters amazing. I love those designs are wonderful.

A black eye letters and eighty percent in eleven percent of them their released in part with the black highlight hers going through, which would be stuff like proper names. Yes viruses, maybe you know it's usually proper names and proper places specific places. They would be like a little dangerous or numbers. That's where you see stuff like blank net with blake, approximately twelve forty p m that blank yes this blank exactly they blanked, no about stuff about. So then one percent there's a remaining one percent of this five million pages that is identical as assassin related, and they remain completely sealed for at least up and well this year and there was a governing board that that made the call here so it whenever we deal with government related documentation or filing we run in the

while these dry names, yet so here's another one. The assassination record's review board the a r r b. No thanks, buddy they they are the ones You said you have to be have to reject. he's die these eleven percent type madrid and in this one percent nobody can see ever heard think they get to do the manual rejecting it has to be can't be some enter it has to be somewhere a pretty high level. Uruguay. There is, you have to have at that level. Compartmentalize crappy can of sluggish job, can imagined, is having to go through thousands of pages and dislike ex stuff out, but assured her process oriented, and I bet it's viewed as highly important in a marriage. No, I think I think you're right, I'm I'm! I don't mean to diminish it as merely in terms of process yeah sure

agency the er. It was a temp agency adjust it was there for a time, and then it went away after it fulfilled it's job. Are you talking about arb yeah orb only lasted from before nineteen. Eighty, four to ninety ninety eight interesting and according to the act itself that congress past all the records that would there were previous. We withheld the one percent, the eleven percent. All of those records should be released on october. Twenty six seventeen unless further, authorized by the president of the united states, which with holding yes for withholding so unless the president decided or was told, to decide to not release these documents, slippery slope right, which happened again previously, at the other little what he called the road, the markers, the other markers where it could have been worse,

so at least employ sure yet and this as as he said that was signed by president george, w bush, who was just in the studio with us a moment ago on over twenty six nineteen. Ninety two, July of twenty seventeen. The national archives released almost four thousand records right there. Fluted stuff from the fbi and the cia and somewhere, some of them was held in full in the past and some were released. Redacted and I gotta tell ya, ladies and gentlemen, friends and neighbors. The three of us spend a lot of time reading these terrible scans from like the vaults, I vault. Where you can, you can see someone is maids and screw notes in the margins in

gone over. I got over it a black out different parts of things and there there tough to read. You know it's, it's It's a paint village removes all this context. I mean to me they are so much reject that it, literally strips of large, We any meaning you now. I is very frustrated yeah not to mention you're, dealing with intelligence agencies that are making these producing these documents and a lot of times. There are clear the cryptogram sir. There are anagrams like they're they're, weird, there's, weird stuff that goes on in some of these documents, not to mention their already pretty dry yeah yeah yeah. So this the banality of evil aside, which is what I'm going to categorize lot of this reduction stuff ass: the banality of evil. Aside the inaction of good people aside, there is still a struggle to release this information

yes, whatever it might contain, ram and a lot of people wondered whether there would be some smoking gun whether there would be some sort of memo from you know tina, sixty two, where one one intelligence operative says to another hey, I just got the phone with so and so, and they said that it's going down in Dallas. You know that is not the case. There's some stuff, that's kind of close to that. But it's not it's not that specific in that, wasn't the only release that Acta July release was actually jumping the gun a bit on nine october, twenty six twenty seventeen date because on the actual date. The national archives released Another almost three thousand documents, which is huge, and this included a bunch of other stuff that they also released that was pertaining to that fascination records review board.

A lot of emails. Well, there emails from nineteen eighty four to ninety ninety eight, so I wonder without even looks like like forward forward for he had no, but they will. it's the fifty two thousand plus emails and almost seventeen thousand files from the from that review board that actually decided what was going to be redacted or not, and then on november. Third Just a few days ago, there was another release from the national archives of six hundred and seventy six records, and this was central intelligence stuff. There were previously night entirely, the cia stuff. The cia stuff and yours foreign of justice, divine of defence, how select committee on assassinations and even stuff from the national archives like a single document. So What does this all mean? You can also, I think that was excellent review of the chronology of this year.

and, by the way, take take alone. Matt and view all these files yourself. You can real Yeah he's a real are hung if you are, if you are willing to again put up with some poor quality reproduction yeah, some scrawled nudes margins and a lot of of missing pieces. Rape is a grueling journey. If you want to go on it, but I really do think it's worth seeing their history and the big question is to what end does this matter? Was there anything worth reading in there? We will tell you, after a quick word from our sponsors, assuming we don't get assassinated during the break this is cavern, castor and if you're an avid traveller like me, you ve got a download my new app otto, that's audio with a T. A! U turn I'll enjoy a new way of travelling with stories activated by your location. So, when you're drunk

I've been through a new town discovering a national park or just curious about the origin of your cities. Name, you can listen to a quick three to five minutes story covering our history from the first peoples to famous places and insides only locals would nome it comes only. Twice a year and signature savings start now. The dell technologies semi annual sale is on with limited quantity deals on top deck, did rear savings on select laptops end. I powered by the latest, twelve jen intel core processors, save on select thin and light ex ps. Thirteen laptops, her life on the go as well as well equipped in spur on laptops and two in ones. Streaming creating and connecting complete anything savings on select monitors and countless popular accessories plus get free shipping.

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calm, slash new home to learn more. That's s, o f! I dot com, slash any w, H, o m e mortgages through self I bank, and a member after I see animal less six, nine, six, eight nine one alone and offer terms conditions, restrictions, apply. Equal housing, lender we're back and I think we'll just jump right in with a couple selected articles a lot of these come from various new sources because we ve gotta had to go? through research villain, it with all of the official researchers who are going through all this stuff, yeah there there's gentlemen being interviewed on CBS ouch watching just before he went in the studio and he's he has this massive team of reach. Mergers and interns in all these people going through the documents- and he says they ve been working on it. it's that July release and they ve gone through about eight percent of the newly released documents widen,

he's sick, our team of interns and researchers? On the whole, I mean we, I guess we could have asked why don't we just sick ourselves on it, which you know that's fine, how we went to all the top top now new sources that you are familiar with a daily mail, young vote? National enquire dogs been killing it lately by the wind, I'm not getting a not getting less seriously good journalism coming at a teamwork. Where are we did we did look round and I want to speak, enveloped he's working on that through it ask anybody. She's, ok, see and you probably wondering, because we are moving a little quickly on the stuff. You re, probably thinking Matt, no ben, you you guys, obviously just check With someone off mike about teen vow to co. Sign you got to co sign. Who is this mystery person Is our new coworker kathleen Karelian, who is sitting in which everybody, sir Paul helping to engineer this session?

since europe play a big part in the stuff media and we very sooner yes, yes, indeed, spoiling? Welcome, welcome so point Being the boy remains that, when you are looking at this sort of stuff is paramount to investors. every single new source you can fight. Yes, you should rigour, less of whatever your starting point may be ideologically the experience we etc. You owe it to yourself to check as many things especially things they come from. It says that you might disagree with yeah. You gotta get a lay of the land, the exotic kind of be your own aggregator too, and it's like because this is the kind of stuff where there are going to be. It's going to be mired in various opinions on the side of the other, so you kind of get the full picture it's best to kind of like have a broad spectrum of material, which is what we tried to do. What Matt largely tried to do this

It's his baby right yeah, that's our bloodhound on my will and I actually found just going to letter. We know I found a cnn article. That was the, in my opinion, the best kind of middlegame and for all the sources. I had been finding everything from the intercepts to the guardian, and maybe just everything in between in the fox news. have you seen an article hit the mean? I guess the main documents that I found to be permanent does not make sense. It does give it to us so the first document involves Ain t phone call there was intercepted on September. Twenty eight nineteen sixty three alleged. They from Lee harvey oswald to a kgb agent in mexico city. This is a good one, oh yeah, So this memo from the day of kennedys assassination it talks about this call. There was intercepted to the russian embassy in mexico. He spoke to the council that I'm not going

I am pronouncing a gallery that nero of causticum, Yes, you will, then this was indeed identified. Kgb officer and the children were speaking in a broken russian. Can I can I reject areas there is. There is one and oddly they use word funny. May I think it is when it is one odd side note in this. In this conversation, Oswald insisted that the conversation be held in russia, yes and his russian was cartoonish leap back, it's like a it's. It's like like on the level of saying a bonus nachos. Instead of buenos noches it- and you speak spanish- and to the point where the kgb folks were like having difficulty, understanding, I'm here and probably going

Do you mind they always english and his enemies like yet, but it seems like perhaps He knew there was some awesome is dropping going on. Now is one of the reasons, but again you're speaking to a council at the right. an embassy in mexico and you're gonna speak russian, so I don't know- maybe it's just I guess- to hide amongst all the other conversations, tour de shore and the the person wrote. The memo said that or relayed the belief on the f b I's part that Oswald was trying to get out re who is trying to get to the ussr? Yes organ of nor somewhere else. Who knows exactly want to get a visa right for some reason, possibly even to get into cuba, and this whole trip that the army, oswald, took to mexico city very close to when the assassination occurred is one Those things that just has a ton of conspiracy, theory surrounding it and rightly

Oh yeah, that's completely understandable, especially because the u s government spent quite a lot of blood, sweat and tears time trying to convince people, Otherwise, we are now all of a sudden stories changed. We know what we, didn't know he was a mexico city. We did it, we did, and why are we didn't? I didn't william, and especially when you bring a new account, the tumultuous relationship. They do? U s head with cuba, rights actually ride around that time in specifically involving president Kennedy Suo. What's next, I really appreciate the you mentioned cuba here, exactly there's a cable from fbi in nineteen sixty seven and it should stay he also it's like. I want something that we really can you explain: cables relief, We talk about these before telegram kind. It's just an almost just a quick communication, kind of thing come into the room and operative or from a diplomat or something it's a lot. You'll hear hear: cables used with diplomats

Can you write a cable? Will depending on the context. A cable can function as a street point, eight point anything that is not going to be vulnerable. In theory vulnerable to the same sort of surveillance techniques that can be used in a traditional letter or something over an open lying so is very much like a telegram, but the thing is with a telegram. For instance, you know johnny Johnny q public could, with the right equipment just tune in and then also hear whatever is happening right, so a cable is supposed to be a little bit high. Lake leak proof, but more so more study. I league resistant, more secure and that's why you hear the folks at wiki leaks julian assange is

still locked up. I think he is, I think, he's still doing the treadmill at the embassy. Now, okay, well, wiki leaks. You know, lives on cables, reading reporting cables, and I bring that up to point out again that cables are in theory, more secure in. Surely I would think that the cable, the term cable probably doesn't mean the same thing is today as it did then, and actually had just confirmed, looks like it just refers to a confidential text message, some I'm wondering if maybe today it might just be some kind of encrypted person to person. Can because he and on the document itself in big ball did type it says, sent by coded, what type of there you go again so well oh, so this was talking about a it cuban gentleman whose being interrogated it there's a lot to go through with just one document for this tiny

nothing, but anyway, Gentlemen, who is being interrogated, was asked about whether or not oswald was a good shot, lay just here You know it is a good with rifles you get sniper and the gentleman flight. Oh, he was quite good. and then, when you know he was further ass like or why would you say that, in this gentleman said. Well, I knew him the us even given officer. So what that's that's another interesting thing, because as you will find a lot of experts and people who spend their entire careers researching just this one, in two thousand and sixty three, they believed tat. Oswald was actually terrible shot and a lot of is the evidence, indicates that he was. He was not the the world's best sniper ending you'll, find opposing evidence or opposing people, the opposing view that he was actually and an amazing, gradual,

So maybe one of those theories implies that he was some kind of stooge or patsy had see a fall guy or whatever or was in communication with cuba. the soviet union via cuba. It goes amazing is like it's crazy. It goes on so, remember what we said at the top. The official warren commission conclusion was that jack Ruby enacted acted alone right and I just did what he saw as his patriotic duty, I'm killing the guy who killed the president yeah. You know instant karma's, gonna, get you etc someone it turns out. As this was revealed in these classified files, someone called the f b. I

I mean to kill lee harvey Oswald a day before his murder, while so a document from november. Twenty fourth of sixty three indicated that J edgar hoover, I actually addressed oswald's death, specifically referencing, that it was at the hands of jack Ruby, and the quote goes as follows: quote there is nothing further on the Oswald case, except but he is dead well. Ouch hoover hoover then indicated that agents in the fbi's dallas field office received a call from a gentlemen speaking in a very calm tone, who claim to be a member of a committee that was responsible for oswald's assassination, or are there a committee that wanted to kill oswald, hello

I'm a member of a committee have concerned patriots, and we want you to know that as patriots we are planning to kill the assassin janet, Kennedy? Thank you for your time. All right then allowed that call. So this this situation, develops further now we're getting into, of course, regains J edgar hoover creep by agreed creepy dude, are you serious right does get? What do you think they cause? He killed martin luther king jr, Obviously word you have never heard you that resolute about someone like them. Well, E. Ok sight, he didn't pull the true but he ran you. Ve read active, an illegal campaigns against against people that he saw as a threat to his version.

Of the status quo. I know he ate any like have files on like John lennon, even in like it, he was basically responsible for tailing anyone. He saw you talk about going, tell pro yeah racist ultranationalists power on a line you of how to use the term creep. Fatima hurt him, you know. So do you the fbi at this point, contacted the dallas police. Just to reiterate them. Hey somewhat it's called us and was really really creepy on the phone talk about. They want to kill oswald. Just do us a favour and protect him like really protect employees? Ok, yeah. And they said you will will totally do that and they did not yeah I quote- Ruby says no one was associated with him and denies having made the telephone call to our dallas office last night. That's something over said and who would on to say that the fbi had evidence of oswald guilt and intercepted communication had with cuba and the suit

union, Hellboy hoover went on to say he was concerned that there would be doubt in the public sphere about oswald's guilt and that president Johnson would appoint a commission to investigate the assassination which he did, which that actually did happen again, however, who yeah. However, I think that this point is important for us to note something we mentioned on the show before the hazards of fascinating. but the evolution of the the phrase, the thought terminating cliche conspiracy theory. So, in the wake of the assassination? U S, intelligence agencies sent confidential memos air to vary

media institutions of no like new york times chicago papers and san francisco, etc, and they said, look, here's the story is the official sorry. If anyone says something different, I make sure to make sure to dismiss it and make sure to call it quote a conspiracy theory its it will be a region, in place of this right and that's how it entered the mainstream lexicon of the united states and, as we have to be very careful, You know I like the way, live in a world where there is an information light, and it's very, very easy for someone to go make a website that purports to be, some sort of legit legitimate source and then just write all kinds of cockamamie stuff right, but you gotta be very careful when you hear

very body- and I mean everybody in the west- calling something: a crazy conspiracy, ordinary person, a conspiracy. you're? A writer is shutting the stuff down, because you know how I think I have two different just briefly, just briefly just breathe. we ve got away to more hours in the studio right, we're ok, sorry diverges just briefly. It is it. Is a lack of critical thinking to say that anything called a conspiracy theory is automatically is: is automatically bob yeah alright, because we are so, you know saying that saying that, for since the the they all family of the united kingdom is descended from some secret race of half. reptilian alien, half human hybrids is that that would be called a conspiracy theory. Rain fell ass, a child to David Ike, but

people, also calling a conspiracy theory to see that international banks are laundered. Money for drug cartels, flexible use of like fake news right now. You know I mean how all stories and theories are not created equal and especially when a term is applied, is like a toy of abuse or like a diminutive? That's when things start getting sketchy sounds like a conspiracy theory, verses, a friend She notion or see what I mean like I dunno when you, when you apply that term, it seems to too large large proportions of the population discount. The idea of you know hope, yeah! Absolutely vanessa mistaken in you, I really pretty bringing up the fake news concept, which is absolutely right psychologically. We our species are built to seek classification right to seek hierarchy, to seek order, which means that its very very convenient to wrap everything up in a symbolic phrase, and for that reason, as a short cut too,

critical thinking. It's like I like jazz battle like fusion you're, obviously that are so now we're already in the thick of it we're finding out from these released files that at least several things, at least in a few cases, the things that the Warren commission and the? U s at large were saying turned out not to be true in my jibed. They aren't waited and now there's no future. there's just ass. So let's insert right here if you haven't already listen to our episode on or maybe watched or video, and where we have an episode on it on the central, tell these agencies and the? U s government's plans and tactics to assassinate fidel castro of cuba, because, you need to. You need to get at that information right now we did do a video on that pause. Go watch the video then come back, oh well, maybe if you're driving, just hang out Should we gonna break to give them time to do it

we can yeah what he said, what better time than the present this is Kevin costner and if you're, an avatar, We're like me, you ve, got a download my new app otto, that's audio with a two. A! U turn Guy o enjoy a new way of travelling with stories activated by your location. So when you're done I've been through a new town discovering a national park or just curious about the origin of your cities. Name, you can listen to a quick three to five minutes story. Covering or history from the first peoples to famous places and insides only locals would nome. It comes only twice a year and signature savings start now. The dell technology semi annual sale is on with limited quantity deals on top deck, get rear savings on select laptops and desktops powered by the latest twelfth gen, intel core processors, save on select thin and light xps thirteen laptops for life on the go as well as well equipped in spur on laptops and two in ones.

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So if I mortgage loans, you dont need anxiety to be on your mind when shopping for a home, just saving visit so fighter calm, slash new home to learn more? That's s, o f, I dot com, slash any w, H, o m e mortgages through self I bank and a member empty icy animal, less six, nine, six, eight nine one alone and offer terms conditions, restrictions, apply equal housing lender and we've returned lets. You want to do a couple more specific files, yeah. We have to keep going, there's so much stuff here I don't know. I candidly do not know if we're going to get to all of it. So we dublin we do want your help after you. Listen to this episode votes. If there is something that you feel your fellow listeners need to know about this release. Please write to us and let us now and will we put it on the

as well, so the cia did consider pleasing mafia hits on castro. Yet mafia hits so they now that you ve, listened or watch that video. You know that there were some crazy theories or some crazy plans wrought up by the government and the united states to kill fidel castro experts putting cigars, weird umbrellas stuff in wet, suits the poison cigar, yeah yeah yeah, from like the novelty story well, but but but more a rivalry. I had a really crazy softly doesnt seem true in the national spy musing. Whether you can see that started a couple of the police where we can find it. But this specifically was a of the rockefeller commission documents in seventy five, and it was detailing the cia role in all kinds of foreign assassinations and specifically plans to assassinate castro. In the early days of the Kennedy administration,

in the report said that attorney general Robert Kennedy, the brother of President J f K, also assassinated, a whole other story, a whole series of episodes, but we'll get into that some other time here. the fbi, that he learned, the cia hired some intermediary, another person, a third party to come through an approach, sam gin, conner encounter. Does that sound familiar from the terminator movies John connor, now This is a prominent mafia person, and known mafia person. At the time with the proposition russia's guy, saying, hey, we're gonna pay a hundred and fifty thousand dollars to get somewhere, he was the either within your organization or somebody else to kill castro in cuba. Like that's crazy, the government was gonna, hire me be a hitman for me and probably like you know it gives them plausible deniability right I mean if, if it's not like, if it's someone, that's completely not not connected to the government, oh yeah,

or in this case it would probably be layer upon layer upon layer if you're talking about government hiring a mafia guy to hire some other and I know the honor and fifty grand doesn't sound like a really big about money, but drag right I'll be right. Today is today: where did the inflation calculations were guys? It's it's about one point: two: million dollars. Why I do it for that? What what Well, here's a here's. The problem don't say, don't ever say that I'd predict that here, here's the issue, the attorney general Robert Kennedy had been trying to prosecute this gentleman, you know, he's a sicilian monster. They ve got files on him. They ve been Tralee and they ve been tracking leader in listening to him. They ve been trying to get it. something big, and if the government is gonna pay em that much money to go. Do an assassination. It makes the states case or the meaning of the government's case a little bit harder to prosecute.

quote attorney general Kennedy stated: the cia should never undertake the use of mafia people again without first checking with the department of justice. I've got a check list check in because it would be difficult to prosecute such people in the future That's so weird, though they didn't say never do they know they just a guys just checking, and I ask you to add for ask it at first Robert Kennedy. I rather report also says that the cia was later interested in using mobs is today were poisoned a poison. In order to kill him and you Are you guys? Euro, though, is those fantastic, and I feel it there's a little bit of president obama influence in there lies the acquaintance. I think you are. I think now is. only needed gotta promotion, my friend well well, the group later in chief, yes to pretend to be

president and all the cia for us and get the sorted out. Ok, ok we're we're done here. Everybody emigrate. We know I'd continuing, though on this, this one thing is hugely important about this point specific? is that this sort of contradictory, this contradictory set of pursuits by various government agencies, this situation with the left hand, does not know what the right hand is doing, lends a lotta credence and gives a lot of sand to the claims that intelligence agencies in the? U s and another country's function as their own independent governments yeah. absolutely, and then you imagine that these independent governments in their own functioning times doing the same work, or at least overlapping, sometimes just doing vastly different stuff, but

Is there anyone in charge that, when you think about the government, the weave elected, though for the people by the people, the democracy that we have in this country like you ve got these operating hands? If you will in this octopus is where is the head? I dont think it's the elected officials in the point that if you cut off one had a gross somewhere out there, so many heads that you don't know which ones the real head Oh my god, what is happening. I am seriously. I am waiting at some point. I ii and I know not- everybody loves marvel movies, but at some point I'm hoping that a stranger like shakes my hand and whispers hydra hm. You should just start doing that with people. I can't do it no, not go over real well at parties. It's like you can't give yourself a nickname. You can't be the one who goes up to people and says hello. Hi I got to like start at the start of the conversation would be like hey. Did you hear taylor swift's new stuff man? I was jamming on it all

They noted yourselves, you much less others grave, and that is where it was squid word from my spongebob unavailing split screen where it's like his eyes closed, and it says you win you sleep and realize taylor. Swift, new alan comes out at midnight. When I was the same my what this all shows because he was talked about it. The a single tier homeward she, oh anne maria bamford, is a new show or the second season comes out to check it out. The netflix anime is awesome. That's good! Okay, plugging other shows in albums? Yes, well, it's important. that's it This is important stuff, you know, and we are. We are very conscious that this kind of sifting, through Archival information can be dry riah and We also acknowledge that we are talking about a very dangerous implications in the present day. I am we're.

We're trying to keep our genes up about it, but the situation is dire. As we record There are a ton, more documents that we didn't discuss. I mean literally thousands and each of them probably has a tiny little story to tell and that's why we're encouraging you to go in and do some of the research yourself, or at least if, through the new sites, will let's where even to the agreed by let's laundry list Ok, ok, so every I'd ray again. This is this is a lot of mass researching needed spine job man. Thank you so much you got it. So the director hoover rang, forwarded a memo to the white house in sixty three ride after kennedys death and it was this- memo- is classifies topsecret for years and its it's cool. It's

exploring the! U S, intelligence agencies, best gases toward the soviet union's reaction to the assassination, and we have a quote here. According to our, source officials of the communist party of the soviet union believed that there was some well organised conspiracy on the part of the ultra right in the united states to effect a coup. They seem convinced that these- fascination was not the deed of one man, but that it arose out of a carefully planned campaign in which several people played a part will now are they falling prey? into the conspiracy theories. Are they spreading up again, because you know after the assassination, the ussr did pretty effectively capitalize on the opportunity to decide descent and shout to general smedley butler

You know that there have been coup. Attempts in the united states, your typically not going to read about them in your history books, smedley I deliberately by us in the de l e wife made up man, I love it. Speaking speaking over my daddy george w. Which his daddy my grandpa, migraine pappy, he's, a guy who supposedly withdrew and decided to do the bins plot, My daddy was a businessman in his and it was a bit more, my dad who see Amy president president bush yeah yeah. Thank you. coming byword we're we're in the middle. The show, though, out once I'll, just go and corn and do some pain I'll I'll. Be ok, ok, hating, salute math

Why do you keep bringing that guy? Why do you keep letting him push you around like that? Pushes you out of your chair and then does this is a little creepy laugh, I gotta admit when he was in office. He just I know it's. Ok. I can hear you talking about me over day. I know just gimme to say: okay when he was in office. I wasn't the biggest fan, but afterwards, like this guy is chill like he is so cool he's just painting he likes to go to games. He likes to go braves need you know he can play the rhythm, guitar, apart from every three eleven sound dude I've been trying to learn the piano. Did you know that amber is the color of his energy keep saying that I feel it. He thinks that that was his idea, but its clearly a lyric from three eleven. Ok, so point be yes for me to do the real these various these various p of information are coming out and in many cases, if they are not content

the official narrative. They are at the very least complicating yes, you know, and so we have we have people who are saying never mind. This officials have called all conspiracy theory, but that then, at the same time, We are finding secret communiques between people, where, when intelligence agents He is saying pretty much everybody thinks like world. Other superpowers broody convince the now one guy did exactly. There are like, ok, we'll, don't tell anybody just wanted you to know unless you keep it secret. That's so strange

feel strange now, but we have to. We have to understand one of the one of the most vulnerable points of any any state powers. Existence is always going to be. The succession ran from the passage a power from one typically one individual to another sue, for instance, in the case of the democratic people's republic of korea, north korea, one of the things that is always a big flashpoint and really dangerous part of time for the world, not just in that region is when they pass from father to son. Don't know! What's going to happen, no look at look at turkey. Writer look at italy, the this so in the contests the time. This is very, very dangerous for the. U s is vulnerable now in a way that it has not been right.

is for a long long time, since the probably the death of lincoln is the last time it was that vulgar and one more example. Maybe absolutely okay. So for our last entry for the day, we have a document, a topsecret document from nineteen seventy five that was created for the rockefeller commission and in this document there is script of it, the testimony of a former cia director, but an aim of richard helms and in this document I'm home,

says that he believes that former president, richard Nixon old, tricky dickie believed that the cia was actually directly responsible for assassinating the south vietnamese president go den deem who died after a coup that was linked to these central intelligence agency, and I got a quote from helms himself right. We do indeed it goes as follows quote, there is absolutely no evidence of this in the agency records and the whole thing has been, I mean. Rather, what is the word? I want heated by the fact that president and then used to go around saying that the reason president Kennedy was assassinated was that he had assassinated president deem- and this was just justice-

and then homes as where he got this from I don't know, then just yeah yeah does during a deposition. There was the context of the conversation. Their homes was asked if there was any way. Oswald was in some way a cia agent or an asset or an operative or you didn't have something else in that's right when the document ends, but is there

the saurians we ve given just a few examples right- and I know that this episode is Israel little ill, a a little long, because we're digging digging into stuff stuff. But the big question is: is this the whole story? That's where one documents? Where does the story end? Are we finally, in twenty seventeen up to speed on exactly what the s intelligence intelligence agency did or did not know? Regarding this assassination arrived? I don't, I don't think worth their here's, where it gets grazing some of these files. Now we mention friend are still secret. They were all supposed to be released and they were released and rivulets in this. In the future they were released under the auspices of the trump administration ripe, but not all of them were released. There is

to be- and we have no idea when more, even if the other stuff will ever make it into the public sphere. The eleventh hour right before this stuff went public became declassified. intelligence agencies, the f b, I'm the cia, all your favorite alphabet, soup, members of of the? U s government, are they pressured trump successfully or pressured the administration? I should say successfully to keep some of this stuff secret past the due date. In light of, everybody's favorite bogeyman, national security, national security. What does that mean? It's just like tagging base. Ok, you know like Any time you don't want to tell the public something all national security. I know I wish I could do that.

My private life, for the good of the realm, Let me just say that from now on we can we can try. Let's have boats, let's was all up some irreverence over there and the intelligence agencies and to say hey man from I want, if you're gonna say national security did those guys are not your friends. I've been on the Oh the F field office, couple of times now working on this other stuff. I think I've got some sway. I know. Paul Paul's got sway all over atlanta rain. supreme producer Paul he can make some calls and should be a guys. It's now for the good of the realm. One call that's Paul, that's pretty good guy, but I hope all soup so, unless you are as fortunate as the three of us to have a super producer like Paul right in your circle, you are probably lost at sea a little bit conceptually. When you hear the phrase national security

It's one of those words that just gets thrown around willy nilly the same way that people use to add the the descriptor digital in front of everything in the nineties didn't matter what it was it was digital eager to try. five dollars more. So national security in this context could mean several things: let's break down into say three or four things. First, is preventing the spread of intelligence techniques, strategies spike raft, highly important absolute, the methods of gathering intelligence, not be intelligence itself right because if somebody else knows how this stuff was gathered than the jig is up can protect against it right exactly this is an understandable concern right. ever we're talking about what nineteen sixty three

prior to that, maybe a little bit after that, but mostly you're, dealing with before the assassination. So late fifties early sixties technology. So if this stuff is held back to protect techniques from in the forty forties that are literally on display in spy museums around the country writer, then the question becomes. Can you plausibly believe right, apply critical thinking, possibly believe that some of the world's most well funded intelligence operatives would still be using the same techniques for decades course not well. I have to just energetic here and say I think some of the techniques are very much human and psychologically base accident jet. Perhaps maybe existing in some of these documents, humans right now. Yes, yes, yes, exactly, which are the shortened terms for human intelligence versus signals, intelligence The second, the second category.

A regime of national security would be to protect the existing relationship between the united states and a foreign, clearly very important. Yeah yeah- and you know we have a lot of what did somebody just called this on unemployment called the china, the united states four enemies by telling us at the moment, we have a lot of those that we ve cultivated over the years those relationships. There is no such thing as friendship and geo political sphere. There are interested. Wine exactly interests little line temporarily, or you know, maybe in long term, for a specific thing sure so yeah. I completely agree. I even now we have another question. If information has been withheld to protect the relationship, the confidential relationship with two countries. Then this would mean that there can either be privilege knowledge

somebody may be has a skeleton in the closet rain. Maybe maybe the soviet union knows something that the EU s public, does it right or there could be collusion on the part of another country right now. It never happened here. Man, it's crazy. It's crazy saw a great and one example of this would, of course, as we mention the b, the ussr, efforts to spread propaganda after the assassination or, of course, similar attempts by the eu, as in other foreign countries, very similar attempts will work. Strikingly senior citizens is useful who's. The is the third genre you could be see national security, it could mean pretend in the lives of current or former government officials ram, so let's say,

What are the furies we hear a lot about. J f k is that a secret service member accidently fired the fatal shop. Yes, when refugees as well, the theory is again unproven right. So what is when we tackle government conspiracies? There's people often go to the idea of some great. collusion in advance right that the same the same institution that cannot for the life of a figure out how to do a effective policy is also capable of these supervillain level. Rube goldberg machinations ray I die. Arcos razor lends itself to covering up here stake right. So how much more realistic? Is it that someone screwed up and the people are trying to remove that from history?

so imagine being a retired official and the public learns. That view did something negligent, name accidental unintentional, and then you find yourself up a very dangerous creek with no paddle whatsoever, especially in the age of cheap information dollar. So in conclusion, here guys, the craziest thing is that at least according to trumps twitter feed, he has released everything and long ahead of schedule. That's what he's saying, however, needs It was pretty certain that there is at least a all number of documents that remain hidden. It seems pretty clear, but what we do have is thousands more documents to tread and you know as researchers and historians,

interns or going through all of this stuff. You know, perhaps there's going to be some new revelation, maybe not the kind of thing that I'm was hoping for or after all of these years, but something surely they wouldn't let it out. Though man I mean they know they ain't, they know, what's in there, they're giving people something to play as in any now feel good about or whatever feel like in form, but he's not gonna be the government wouldn't allow that to happen. I don't think, and if it's a if it's a case of national security, then again the implications are dangerous. It's twenty seventeen year and if that stuff still applies, I think we can all agree. I think we can all agree folks that the idea of protecting a spy craft technique from the forties to the sixties doesn't pan out it's like tape, record

suitcases dude like they're they're, on display, like in its monies, lay raising its I'll know will, in my opinion, there is still the possibility that there is a needle inside this haystack line. Just we either. It enough time enough human hands and eyes working through it. So at least agree with me that the government knows exactly what's in there, what do you mean again we're dealing with the octopus with the diner zeal so yeah I dont know if everybody knows, because there is near their factions. I play eruptions and it's been a long time in humans die. the one thing we all do now is. There is there's something there. There must be there. There must be Was the intelligence agencies would not of pressure? The current illustration so strongly not released sums than in the previous. Several ran the pre

He has several sue there is. There is something something is rotten in this particular denmark rise. So are you planning on going through these files. You can do it, you can find them. Early search, new J, F k files, and you will find the national archives link that has a spreadsheet in it and it also every single file on their website sylvia. connection men's a little hot spots you can get in there and just start doing it, because I've I've been going through over the past several days, just trying to find things, but there's just too much like we said, you're gonna find all kinds of weird phrases in there in there's something I want to point everyone to if you're going to look into this it's the merry farrell foundations, CIA cryptogams, to point o the really cool website.

I go to m a r Y f e r, r e l, l dot org, and you can find this thing and it has a huge list that is crowdsourced of all these different acronyms and stuff that are used by all the intelligence agencies to represent certain things and its fascinating when you're. Through these documents, in like a legend kindness gillig, actually gives you like a young exactly that in its it's, not just a you know, I backs o o o b ibex equals there. Sir, you know whatever it is. It gives you a fool description of all the different ways that it can be used as it again refer to its. It's really neat among that, as we wrap here so tell us what you find and while you're online find us, if you haven't already, you can find us On instagram, you can find us on twitter. You can find us on facebook. We have

names are all approximations of conspiracy. Stuff, yes know, and we would love to hear your opinion specifically. Have you already looked into this? Do you think that there is something important yet to be? revealed? Did we miss something? Let us know and will put it in the shadows and speaking shouts. We want to I think everybody who wrote in to us the various different things. You know our social media, snail mail. He had mirrors in the dark at midnight, cables caveats we re. All of it. We had her slotted in actually for this episode, but it is run, pray as long as you're gonna hold back for the next one, but we I know we don't do it every episode, organ and try to get back into doing the shock when we

However, we are the actually. We have a a an astonishing piece of correspondence that we received recently. Yes, I and we want to give it its full do so, please do tune in next. Week, because, unlike the u s, government, we actually release regulatory things. Until we dish, I was sick burn on the? U S, government, you know I'm punchy today, man in our country with without act, going to shut out corner. We want to give you shot out to Samuel who sent us something in the snail mail summer. Can we should say what it is that rings they go in your pinky and you can see all documents with wax with them. I took them it has the alien head very excited about it. My sort of liquor looks what looked like a cook: a pay lake. Figure. I don't think that's what it is, but samuel, what is it what's the squiggly when I took it

cause. I thought it was neat looking, but I don't quite know what it is. Ben's years is an illuminati triangle ring the lc ny suit. We will put pictures of these rings up and go check us out on the green and at the end of this classic episode? If you have any thoughts or questions about this episode, you can get into contact Thus, in a number of different ways, The best is to give us a call or numbers one. Eight, three, three s t d, w whitey k. If you don't want to do that, you can see, so good old fashioned email? We are conspiracy I hope radio dot com stuff, they don't want you to know is the production of I heart, radio, for more podcast. From my heart radio visit the I hurt radioactive apple podcast or wherever you listen, your favorite shows this is Kevin costs and if you We now have a traveller like me. You ve got a download my new app otto, that's audio with a two, a you

The ilo enjoy a new way of travelling with stories activated by your location. So when you're done I've been through a new town, discovering a national park or just curious about the origin of your cities? Name, you can listen. Do a quick three to five minutes store covering our history from the first peoples to famous places an sides only locals would now mastercard is growing its music but print and turning up the volume by unleashing the power of web three to help emerging artists unleashed their true potential joined the mastercard artist accelerator, a next level programme with tools, tech and community, where new voices can create, learn from men tours and build a fan base to help make dreams a reality. Soon, new opportunities will be unlocked for both creators and vans alike. With the mastercard music pass visit, mastercard dot com, slash artist, dash accelerator to learn more elevating the next generation of music.

Is priceless, welcome to biggie burger I'll, take a cheeseburger two door or four door. What sorry I'm shopping for a new car on the roadway teach. You know that roto finds discounts and rebates specific to each customer. That's kind of cool right, so you get the car you want at the price. You want. It's like getting your burgers just how you like it, get every rebate and discount available, then save big on your next car with roto down No, the roto app or check out roto dotcom roto, the easiest to buy or sell a car right from your phone