A car max we're pretty flexible with how you can buy a car if you'd, scroll through fifty thousand cars instead of walking the lot go for it. If you want to see our car smells on the lot before you bite by all means, We all have our things want to hold to come to you without ever leaving home by online. Compare how the speakers sound when playing your favorite mixed. You visit our lot. And if you want to browse a little on the lot and insular markets that, with the limited home were certainly not stopping you garments, which should be you aren't. You know that the challenges the most heart pounding competition show on television, but do you ever wonder how challenge competitors are selected or which challenges were too dangerous for tv? Well, you can learn all that and so much more on empty. These official challenge vodka hosted by your girl to worry and may any sir we're, given you the inside scoop on the brand new season of the challenge. Let's go baby, listen to empty these official challenge, podcast on the I hurt, radio,

apple pie, calf or wherever you get your pod calf. So it's no secret that every so often we will run across a story that stays with us after the after the digital tape stops rolling and that's the case with today's classic episode hauled simply. What is the octopus hint? It's not as nothing to do with a merry I'm creature. No, no. It has to do with a journalist that stumbles upon a story that really takes over his life in a lot of ways, and my goodness it is compelling. It feels like some kind of movie in it was actually made into has been made into several different screen versions, and we highly recommend this episode again has been said. I there's not,

there's not a month. It goes by what I dont think about dainty castle era in the octopus, so rap all aid of your arms around this pod gassed Fred Octopus, like an animal and something to from EU efforts to ghosts. History is written with unexplained events. You can turn back now or learn stuff. They don't want you to know hello. Everyone welcome back to the show. My name is Matt and I've been, and that makes this stuff. They don't want you to know guys, oh man you're in for a treat something we usually don't get to cover its a mega conspiracy. That's right! It is a conspiracy that, if true involves multiple conspiracies functioning in concert. This is a super size, conspiracy, theory and we do have to say Theory Matt, because this boy

while a few of these things that have been proven, you're going to write a few things have been proven. True. This is so big that the connections between these events- part that is their remains, the radical the are the key in and a lot of times with conspiracy theories. That's the missing piece: re inactive tissue between, two or more events, so, let's dive right in first off too to our listener Alex on Twitter, who asked does what we were covering earlier this week Alex. I did tell you that it was an act of worse. I guess he was bigger than a giant octopus, but I did I mean the animal. This, in fact, is a group that, if it exists, is called the Octopus Matt could you are just just leave it yes, the conspiracy theory down forests. Ok, here you go guises juicy. So the octopus is a group of interconnect

did powerful networks that cooperate together. Further their mutual interests, and I been doing so for a long long time. Now this It was allegedly discovered by this journalist. His name was Danny Castle Arrow and if you ve video already of these, the tentacles of the octopus, you so that we can mention his name, this is one of the places where we're gonna go deep into Danny Castle Eras life. So this guy discovered it. and he was beginning an investigation essentially in what then ass. The lira was looking into was ongoing legal dispute between the Department of Justice and in I t group, a company named in slow incorporated and I He called this group the Octopus, due to his belief that this there's this organisation involved in multiple criminal activities, again kind of a head that has its tentacles in all these different places and his investigation, it gained him national,

recognition because he died supposedly as a result I yeah now this is one of them. Was episodes, ladies and gentlemen, where, if you are not driving, feel free to make a drinking game help other times we mention the words alleged allegedly because again, we have to be careful with this Danny Castle. Arrow to his friends, Joseph Daniel Councillor of full name did die in August of nineteen ninety one, the official cause of his death was listed as a suicide in his body was examined not once but twice by different medical professionals. In both times they reached the same thing We shall now hear you won't. Let me just isn't context. He was found in a bathtub with his wrists split up to twelve times a year. Sheraton Hotel of Martens Burg, West Virginia exam.

ITALY, and he had told his family and friends that if he were to die, it would look an accident, and it wouldn't be an accident that, according to his brother right and there was a suicide note, there was a suicide note, and let's, let's go back here first and say that when Castle arrow started, investigating the dispute between the Department of Justice in this group in slaw. He was just investigate in whether or not there were she going on in these court case room which had already turned pretty nasty by the time he shows up on the scene what he believed he discovered this octopus that he alleged existed, came about as a result of his investigations and gnats. When things began to get more more tents, that's when he became you could

more paranoid. Oh yes, that's when he became more concerned that his investigation might put him or I his sources in some sort of day I had been. He had been receiving phone calls that work anything in nature and from anonymous sources and other crops goodbye? I think his housekeeper, absolutely his housekeeper corroborated these stories, and on record, saying that she had been the axe, no recipient of a few of these long halls. Why believe the anecdote stuck with me, the most, is where she testified that she received a threatening phone call when she picked up fold, someone just threatened to throw her and castle arrow to the sharks. Now I dont want to make light of it. This is one of the reasons that I am so thankful for Our idea and don't answer unfamiliar know, and this was a time we

This is a way to say, waned technology, because this year, a time when the internet was not as wide no as widely spread. His was that this was a time where people didn't have the pervasive access to social media or the abilities that we have today to track. People gather if a strange thing to think about the time before a collar idee, something as simple as collar I d, just knowing who you're picking up a phone and connecting to date it our manager. it makes you realize how how pervasive mass amount of information exists on the people you're communicating with at any moment in time. of the unknown and the anonymous Nature of that communication is kind of going away right. I know in the case of kastler of that sum.

we wanted to pick up on your radar folks, remember: that's gonna, be a big part of this episode. In just a few minutes, forecastle arrow windy official cause of death was listed as a suicide. Several friends family, members and confidence are you mention- is brother already images housekeeper didn't by the official story. They believed that car scenario was murdered because he was on the verge of exposing stuff? They don't want you to know, that's right, so so first things first been yet, unfortunately because of circumstances in your lives, people to commit suicide, and it's it's a tough thing to grapple with at any time. You know again, there's somebody circumstantial things, happened stress. We don't have to go in all their right now, but we do know that it happens in there The suicide note found right any so it is possible that maybe

He did take his own life due to the stress anything else. I'm saying hears conjecture fund. Well, I think I think the point we're out right now is were asking ok after this, this grand mega conspiracy, the gist of this, could it be true thou to couple things raise a very important and unfortunate point, which is that people do take. The lives. We ve already mentioned that he was found with the ten to twelve slash wounds on his wrist. In the bathtub of room, five, seventeen believe at the shared and that he had also been harassed and threatened as his progress on the UN's law case, I continued to go a little bit deeper. Each time will, before they're down the rabbit whole? It's also true that time magazine had Commission TIM to cover this case, and now we have to Ask. Why was he in Morton's Burg, West Virginia to begin with here

is the major point of contention. He was there because he was making contact with the sword. that he really believed would give him the last little bit of connective tissue. The evidence that he needed to reach what he called the head of the octopus, the main part of the organization, and that's why people believe that he did not take his own life right now. If we look at this octopus thing, this idea. If it does exist, then what we're looking at is the concept of some sort of super mafia for lack of a better turn right. I e before we go too far into the super mafia aspect, to whatever. Let's look at sea, of the big players that castle arrow and other conspiracy theories after him have been naming as members or tentacles of the octopus possible suspects right, yeah

not the usual, but the possible yeah. So the first one is the Department of Justice so so they used and improved this. This piece of software called promise and it was there was a decision saying was made by insulin, cooperated and they used it to become basically full on people tracking an end. Surveillance machines. Are they they wanted to be a people tracker fright right yeah they took, they took the idea of the promised software which was a means of managing legal cases electronically and enhance the source code so that it wooden just be a case management system. But it would be a people management system and after they enhance it, which violated

terms of their licence. They also cooperated with other governments to sell the software, but I wanna I want to save some of the promised stuff. Ok, just look! I know that their that their one of the biggest players, the least there one of the first touch stones, then castle arrow believed he found him at did you know the seventy percent of men have no idea that different shapes of conduct exist. I did not know that, but guess what Trojan condoms has over thirty different varieties of condoms to choose from Theirs thin Ribbed lubricated non lubricated, just to name a few I run into this problem in the past, where I've I've really had a hard time with condoms, because they just or to tie are they you now feel uncomfortable, but here's the thing that's the case for most men, most pain points when it comes to conduct are caused by a bad fit are just the wrong shape.

And, like we said most, where it don't even know that their options out their trojan is here to solve that problem with trojans new variety pack. All the fields, right and with it you can try a bunch of different condoms to help you find the right shape, fit and sensation for you, and I are you more of a classic, feel a thin feel or a full pleasure. You had on over to walmart dot com and grab a pack of all the fields to figure out what feels best for you, a car we're pretty flexible with how you can buy a car if you'd scroll through fifty thousand cars instead of walking. The lot go for it If you want to see our car smells on the law before you bite by all means, We all have our things want to hold to come to you without ever leaving home by online. Compare how the speakers sound when playing your favorite mixed. You visit our lot.

And if you want to browse a little on the lot and select markets have delivered at home were certainly not stopping you car max the way it should be now, of course, this being a story about spies We can't go too far without running into an intelligence agency right, and so it should be no surprise that another member of this alleged octopus would be the CIA which was allegedly working with IRAN. Private weapon manufacturers and a bank called BC see eye to eye on all drug trade of weapons, sales, money from IRAN and other sources into money for nicaraguan conjurers, which of course, a lot of our lives, there's will recognise as the IRAN contrast scandal. Yes You do a great job of outlining that then I have to say in the video the Tentacles videophone watched it please again watching

oh yeah, Wednesday video. Yet the will think you man, I appreciate I was. I was proud of our video. You did a great job blushing over here, so we dimension the banks as well the b c c I, which was again allegedly working with the CIA and related organizations to store and launder money. One point there when we say a lot, Julie, working with the CIA? In this case it's a little bit nuance, because we do know that b, c c, I am CIA, were working together. The question is whether they were working together to do something illegal. you're. I mean it's, not it's not abnormal for government agency to work with a private organisation like a bank. Absolute, in the money you know you ve always heard, follow the money. So we ve already got into the bank. Who else could we possibly have on this list? Then?

oh! Well, I'm I'm scooting to the Mai edge of my seat, man, who is it if you Braun was so we mentioned that on is buying weapons and their also supplying cash for the conference in Nicaragua and. Even though maybe they don't even know about it, may lady around it nowhere. The cash was gonna, be ok, belated, but there also working factions of the Reagan administration to manufacture a little thing called the October super. Eyes, which remains alleged Indy. Oh, my gosh people are plain the drinking aim now who have some water, please Evelyn on six of water, for the next few alleged alleged mentioned so the October surprise. Real, quick sidebar is this conspiracy

theory that during the time that Ronald Reagan and Jimmy Carter were both contesting the office of the presidency in the United States that there were hostage. Is held by IRAN and that some, how so body, told them. I told a hostage takers to hold those hostages until they would be released You know when Reagan was elected luxury like that you're in there There are some there's imposing cod seventeen interesting thing to think about, but again it is important to say that that was never conclusive, the proven said with a timing did happen to work out that way. However, the agreed at Britain will ya know much of that is confirmation by a certain age want to see and and how much of that other people argue was somehow suppressed because again, in an age before I such pervasive. Take

knowledge he existed. You may have been easier to do something without amount a subterfuge, but those are some of the big players in here's the thing a castle, arrow believed that these were all related or, if you will all all tips above the water of a massive iceberg. There was all one thing and two to really figure out more of this now, it's time for us to look a promise. We ve mentioned what happened in early nineteen eighties, and this is in our video series on this in the early. Nineteen eighties. This I t group in slot, which I still think is a terrible name. It yeah doesn't ring, it sounds like their Cole slaw, and so that's all law here in my head is the slots are neither were just hungry. Are we give?

Papa casting hungry. I think PR is just gotten so much more pervasive where people have done better at pr now. You dont name your company, something like that and maybe, as a personal reason, perhaps yeah. That's, perhaps it's a clever acronym, that's Really, I guess not the night. The most relevant point to her showed a diary, but, despite our opinion, what the name their company. One thing is for sure. Objectively speaking, they were banned task at this case management software. This idea, I promise Is it something changes the game if we can cast our memories back to the nineteen? Eighty

or for you younger listeners, cast your imagination back there. The deal that the Department of Justice made within saw was to install this revolutionary people managing case management software in forty two: U S! Attorneys offices across the United States and when you make these kind of agreements for software when you're centrally doing is mine a licence yellow right. So the Department of Justice gets a licence for these. Forty two locations of promise, however, as as we mentioned earlier, parent lay in the Department of Justice. According to insular and a couple of court cases, the Department of Justice stole this programme in hand the code to make a bigger, better promise and sold it to foreign governments in slot did take them. The court inside didn't just say

Your uncle SAM wasn't truthful in his dealings with, as they also said that Uncle SAM was attempting to bankrupt the company in order to silence them and stop the litigation. That's right, and is more that I just one also reiterate that another thing that they did the dear J with this software is right, a back door so that the people they were selling the software to they could have access to it. formation that was being used on other end. So let's say let's say I don't know him sod purchase. The software we had gets install Now I, in the? U S and the deal J, I can read everything you're putting into the software, because I know how to access it right or or, as was specifically alleged, was middle eastern countries. they said that the United States was selling this to Syria.

Jordan with the back door to monitor the activities of the government. If this is was true, it's a very happy and serious alligator. The atmosphere, drinking water any more and the this is what happened so is very interesting: a bankruptcy judge of all people sides within slot everywhere you them a heap of money to yes, says that the Department of Justice must pay. The President events La Bill Hamilton see two point. Eight million dollars and damages do three serious, but but that was in the end right. Ah well, it was the end of that judges career

Here, because I mean his reappointment came up, she was not reappointed. I and she believes that this was in some way retribution for his ruling. There was a another judge appointed to fill seat. Who was one of the lawyers arguing in the ins lovers, his dear g d, O J case by the way, if you guys want too In the interim, before our episode, droughts later in this week, if you want to find out more about this insular case. There's a Youtube video from an australian broadcasting company that, back in the day, did an entire series called the insulin. Air and you may or may not find a link to it somewhere hidden in our video from Wednesday yeah. You may have your frame by frame, but it's their right. It's somewhere in there and his speaking of massive

spirits seas. We do always have a couple of interesting little Easter eggs in our video. So if you think you ve seen the whole thing from watching at once, my bare another look or five or Ah, yes, and now that we're added our own massive to hear her. On top of this, we get back to this concept here this. This idea that somehow these things could all be connected, then we realise that these alley geishas require an extraordinary amount of proof. First off. We know that we know that Congress did not dismiss these. These allegations are these claims that were congressional investigations into the matter and are thus standing Sub Committee or the permanent subcommittee tasked with looking at this in the Senate found that how did they put it? We cannot

say there is any evidence of wrong doing. Yes, you they could not say that there was no around doing and they could not say that their doing it's it's not. It's not. here with you know neither confirm nor deny, but they said when Congress looked at it that the facts just word there for further legal. action, not every member of Congress was happy with this, of course, and people who believed that there was something rotten in Denmark or rotten in Washington to coin a phrase for those people. This was further confirmation that there was something amiss. However, at this point we do know that We do know that Danny Castle arrows peace. There was going to be published. I never saw Prince Edward, You know that their there are some fairly divided groups about this right, which is

you, and I run into a lot on shows. There are people who say that this is pervasive and its massive and the lack of hard evidence indicates that there's someone out there suppressing truth. And then we have the other side were in that it still happening around yeah, there's still in charge the right he's revolution doing even than their own people who just say come on guys. This is this. Is this is crazy talk we can't We can't even look into these kind of things, because if we truly believe that these people can be this organised- and you know this secretive about something this huge- then guys were what the hell are we doing here. Always the question: isn't it when it comes to the idea of a massive conspiracy? Most people are terrible, keeping a seat

a meaningless secret. You know, like you, you watched a television show that you're supposed to watch with your friends by yourself. Can you keep it quiet on Thursday evening. yeah right, I mean that's anecdotal and I'm not trying to belittle this, but what I am. It is for this to be true. There would have to be a lot of other things and play and for people who do believe that this conspiracy, they point to numerous mysterious, dead, that may be mafia hits it is. It is known it has come to light before that various factions of domestic agencies have worked in some way or another with the criminal element right like over vast and furious scandal or

The idea of people who would be CIA assets are informants working with criminal organisations. That way, that's where very careful to safe facets, because we knew we can't say that an entire group of people does something, because a couple do as you move forward. American Express. Has your back earn. Sixty thousand membership rewards points with the American Express called card plus four times points at: U S, supermarkets, and up to twenty five thousand dollars and purchases per year and four times points at restaurants worldwide, learn more about how the gold car can reward your every day and your appetite for life explore this offer and the benefits that American Express dot com site.

Scold card terms apply American Express, don't live life without it. My name is Lowell Brill Anti and I created the bar gas prodigy defined. The answer to a very complicated question can genius be created. I asked academics, researchers, scientists and the prodigy themselves to gain a better understanding of intelligence, skill acquisition and expert performance, so disregard all simple explanations, because complex questions require complex answers, listened a prodigy every Thursday. On the I hurt radio, app apple podcast or ever you get your podcast, but we also know that organizations like the CIA and specifically the cia- they have their hands in a lot of things. We recent We just learned that, while something that we probably all kind of assumed, but that in Ukraine, the

forces in Ukraine are being I want to use the word managed, but that's not the current. I advise that would be the correct word by CIA, as well as the FBI because of an anti terrorism angle, alarm sure that there are other forces in Ukraine being advised. The KGB. Absolutely! Oh. They own exist, as I saw where, as we see this is. This is just a kind of a quick look the to explore in some more detail the ideas of the octopus and it's strange to think that this story was big for a time and now I think, is safe to say that most people, are not aware of this historical conspiracy theory. I would seem. A lot of people are aware of some of some of its tentacles right round. The big. actions. If they are all connected, we know that the Octopus, whether it is really

has never been proven to exist, but some allegations did become fact. Around Contra came a real scandal and then congressional investigations into the Department of Justice, an insular returned, with findings that Congress itself did not agree with and in and for a long time, Negation dragged on between insular and the Department of Justice in early October, surprise became a big thing all I guess it kind of rocket it up into a big thing, but it was still never proven right, yet still alleged and in New England was pause. You just forsaken, because I have to ask you how much of this would you say, naked lease October, surprise, non country. These things, a pop up around

and election time or to take down a president, how many of these things are genuine and how many are manufactured political crises? This all you know: I've been watching house of cards, thinking Oh yeah, ok, so is strictly opinion, I would say that powerful people will use means to get what they want we need that yeah, don't use all kinds of different means, but I don't necessarily think Oh, no pudding lives in danger in that way, split specifically for the October surprise, I have to remain sceptical. Just to just do not go hide in a whole somewhere will. If we did get ok, just told me if we did a cost benefit analysis. Let's see your prior right, you're gonna be president. Would you want to take the risk if something goes wrong, because if something goes even just a little

wrong. You're can't your career is gonna, be messed up, I suppose, and if I have the means and the assets to manage the situation, I guess I would our so before we go to some feedback from our listeners who have written in to us from around the world, and thank you guys. I gotta ask met. Tell me if you want to go on record saying this man drew the Octopus will get us. Do you think this is a conspiracy theory or a conspiracy fact, and do you think Danny Hassle arrow took his own life, or do you think he was murdered I'll answer these two areas, like sphere. Well, I would have to say, I know the feeling and I've seen it so many its cropped up for so many of the people that we ve talked about, who have died, who have committed suicide, at least according to the official record.

who go on record to their friends and family and say that I will never commit suicide, and then they do the least degree the record that just that alone makes me suspicious. I would have to say I personally don't think he committed suicide. Ok, I see I see sewer scene with whether or not this is a conspiracy theory or if there is a large factual basis behind it. What I've been looking for? What I think you and I both in looking for as we as we look through this case- is research and again to various things, is some. were connective tissue. I really enjoy that phrase you years, because it is completely possible that various things to happen- drug activity, weapons, trade

he'd, be manufacturing indian reservation and in proxy companies and stuff like that, it's completely possible that those happen without being related and as for whether Danny Castle Arrow was murdered that night or whether he committed suicide. I'm gonna have to say that the in, unless there's more information you don't have the notion that he committed suicide does seem abnormal to me. It's it's. The scepticism goes both ways, sure you I mean, and this is not to say that people- don't don't do things like this without for warning

I'm done. Of course, we remain open minded. If there's more to the story, perhaps there were some warning signs. The castle arrow showed beforehand, Yoda the red flags or yellow flags of someone having suicidal ideation. What, with the knowledge we have with what we ve checked it? It does seem suspicious. But again there again we go back as the body was examined not once, but I and both times it was his body was, however, embalmed before the fair he was even made aware. Then he was dead, which is interesting least that's going to his brother from an australian broadcast road. There is one thing I would want. I had been ok for someone to. If someone killed Danny Castle Earl, I would say that

Doesn't it doesnt mean that the Octopus in total has to be real? All it means is that one of the things one of these tentacles be real and dangerous enough for him to be investigating that he would warrant someone taking his life so adjust. The fact even feel truly did not commit suicide. It doesn't necessarily prove that the Octopus exists right, yeah, that's really appointment and speaking really the points we would like you guys to make a few. Let us know what you think about this whole octopus mega conspiracy. Is it all bunk? Is it all true as their spectrum, and this too This story fall somewhere in between what do you think, if anything could finally determine the truth of this story or is even possible to is this just a story? Of course you can read. Numerous articles wired has some great stuff on Time magazine as Well

about people who believe that they are cracking down on this case are tracking it and we're just very interested to hear what you have to say about it matter. I find us on Facebook. We're conspiracy, stuff were also Atkinson, Missy stuff on Twitter. You can all always good or Youtube Channel, which is also conspiracy, stuff or are brand new website stuff. They don't want you to who dot com and hey while you're at it wanted you go to your mother website how stuff works: dot? Com, you can learn about everything there not just conspiracies sure you can learn about everything from other obscure and fascinating historical tails to the nature of tech and the future everything science related pretty much, and just to prove that just approved you how much we enjoy listening male that you wanna check out a tweet.

Doing that. Today's tweet comes to us from our friends zombie combat diver, who says hey conspiracy, stuff. looking at all the zombie lore. Why are there zombie animals woman, a field? don't mind been yet a good way will first of all hello. Eric, though, is that ok, you guys met each other. I r L is I grasped year He may or may not work in our building and he drives the coolest vehicle. But I've ever seen in my life, definitely a living person, though not as on not a zombie. Did you know. Well, I would have to say there have been at least lore of animal zombies. All you have to do is check out resident evil than any of that franchise. It shows you that

Many there's a virus that infects all living beings, including spiders and snakes- sure everything in between, although there isn't much there isn't much old folklore of zombie, animals other thinking, I think. Maybe it has something to do with to be a zombie. I hassle to do with losing consciousness, losing humanity near. Well, that's a great point man. I think I can dovetail onto this a little bit. I ve most apparent example. I can think of would be. The undead animals in pet cemetery out all night, the film which is fine, which they don't explain, why they spelled that way in the normal either. But you are right, there does seem to be kind of a dearth of folklore may be for something to be in on dead thing, ass, having humanity to lose, but to add another interesting

addition here. It is true that there are numerous animals that can enter a deathlike state and then be resurrected. You know area there, frogs that will just tough outer drought in the dry might have a river bed There are other animals, they can be put another, not take him on a bare hibernating or something because it still has a life signs even monitor, but it is. It is possible that people thought it is a normal thing for some of us present. Here I come back when the water returned, but it is possible. The people in the past me have seen some of these animals and just thought it was normal for them. The quarter who die in the return to life totally, and that is, if our show we have a whole bunch of tweets, that We would like to answer on air was some excellent questions. I think we might even have a little special, then yeah. I think it might be time that for a

listener questions special, which will it will come up with a way better sounding Tonia O one more thing. Just in case you are not intoxicated alleged alleged. And alleged. Ah yes, yes allegedly that was our plan all along right that, yes, maybe we came in here, we allegedly and a plan by then I don't know it just went out. The supposed window or we just one small part of a much larger, planned spanish generations and that's the end of this classic episode. If you have any thoughts or questions about this episode, you can get into contact with us in a number of differ Waze. One of the best is to give us a call or number is one thousand eight hundred and thirty three STD Wy Tk. If you don't want to do that, you can send us a good old fashioned email. We are

conspiracy at I hope. Radio dot com stuff they don't want. You to know is the production of Iheart radio for more podcast. From my heart radio visit the I hurt, radio, app apple podcast or wherever you listen, your favorite shows It's pretty easy these days to feel disconnected report in so many different directions and that can leave us feeling incredibly fragmented, but together we can grow more connected to ourselves and to each other, and that is what my new podcast is all about. Coming here, to our homeless listen follow wholly human with me, Liane rhymes, on the eye hard radio at Apple Pie cast a wherever you listen. If I can.