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from EU efforts to ghosts and government cover ups histories unexplained events. You can turn back now learned stuff. They don't want you to tell everyone welcome back to the show. My name is met, and I then- and that makes this stuff. They don't want you to know, and you guys, oh man, you're in for a treat. This is something we usually don't get to cover its a mega conspiracy. That's right! It is a conspiracy that is true involves multiple conspiracies functioning. In concert. This is a super size can bureaucracy, theory and we do have to say theory mad because this boy, while a few of these things, are improving true right, a few things have been proven. True, this is so big that

the connections between these events are the part that There remains the radical new elections are the key in and a lot of times with conspiracy theories. That's the missing piece: re inactive tissue between two or more events. So, let's dive right in first off to the two hour listener Alex on Twitter. Who asked does what we recovery earlier this week Alex. I did tell you that it was an octopus. I guess he was bigger than a giant octopus, but I did not mean the animal. This, in fact, is a group that, if it exists, is called the Octopus Could you are just just lay the gist of the conspiracy theory? Downpours? Ok, here you go guises juicy. So the octopus is a group, interconnected, powerful networks that cooperate together

further their mutual interests, and I ve been doing so for a long long time. Now this was allegedly discovered by this journalist. His name was Danny Castle Arrow, and if you ve watched or video already, the the tentacles of the octopus you use We can mention his name. This is one of the places where we're gonna go deep into Danny Castle Eras life. So this guy discovered it and he was beginning an investigation essentially in what then castle era was looking into. Was ongoing legal dispute between the Department of Justice- and I T Group accompany named in slow incorporated and I He called this group the Octopus, due to his belief that this there's this organisation involved in multiple criminal activities again kind of ahead that has its two goals in all these different places and his astrogation. It gained him national recognition because

he died. Supposedly as a result yeah. I know this is one of those episodes. Ladies and gentlemen, where, if you are not driving, feel free to make drinking game have other times we mention the words alleged or allegedly, because again we have to be careful with this Danny ass, a narrow to his friends, Joseph Daniel Councillor of full name, did die. In August of nineteen, ninety one, the official car of his death was listed as a suicide in his body was examined not once but twice by different. Local professionals? In both times they re the same conclusion now you'll? Let me just give some context. He was found in a bathtub with his wrists slit now after twelve times in the Sheraton, hotel of Martens Burg West Virginia exam and he had told his family and friends that if he were to die, it would look like

excellent and it wouldn't be an accident that, according to his brother right and The suicide note right. There was a suicide note and Let's go back here first and say that win castle arrow started investigating the dispute between the parliament of justice in this group in slaw. She was, asked investigating whether or not there were shenanigans going on in these court cases, Rome, which had already turned pretty nasty by the time he shows up on the scene. What believed. He discovered this octopus, that he alleged existed, came as a result of his investigations, and now when things began to get more more tent that's when he became. You could say, paranoid. Oh yes, that's when he became more concerned that is in castigation might put him.

Or I his sources in some sort of danger. I had been he'd been receiving phone calls that were menacing in nature and from anonymous sources, and I was corroborated by I think his housekeeper absolutely his house. Or corroborated these stories and went on record saying that she had been the axe, no recipient of a few of these long halls I believe the anecdote stuck with me, the most is where she testifies that she received a threatening phone call when she picked up the phone. When just threatened to throw her and castle arrow to the sharks, now don't wanna make light of it this is one of the reasons that I am so thankful for cholera, Idee and don't answer unfamiliar? No? No, and this was a time when this away too sanguine to technology, because this year time when, the internet was not, as

I know as widely spread is- was like. This was a time where people didn't have the pervasive access to social media or the ability is that we have today to track people gather it's a strange thing to think about of just the time before collar idea, something as simple as collar. I d just knowing who you're picking up a phone and connecting to date it and just make you realize how how pervasive now an amount of information exists on the people. You are communicating with any moment in time, how the unknown and the anonymous nature of that communication is kind of going away right. I know in the case of castle error that something we wanted to ping on. Your radar folks, remember that scan be a big part of the separate owed in just a few minutes. Castle arrow windy. Official cause of death was listed as a suicide. Several

friends. Family members and confidence. You mention is brother, already images, housekeeper didn, by the official story. They believed that consular was murdered because he was on the verge of exposing today's upset his property by IBM. For businesses around the world today is a restart. It's a rethink! That's why they're partnering with IBM retailers are keeping this is. Up as millions of orders move on mine, hunters are using IBM Watson to manage an influx of customer questions with a sigh and Salute is built on the IBM cloud are helping doctors care for patients remotely today were rethinking how business moved forward. So, let's get to it. Let's put smart to work. Is it IBM, dot com, slash Smart, to learn more, though we're part these days was sharing so Geico we'd like say thanks thanks for sharing your savage dance moves thanks to sharing you d, I why haircut fails

thanks for sharing your inner lips ink star. Now it's our turn to share with the guy, give back ten percent credit on car and motorcycle policies for current and new customers, because we committed for the longer the fifty some credit last your full policy to visit guy that comes less, give back for more info and eligibility stuff. They don't want you to know that right, so first things first ban on. Finally, because of circumstances in your lives, people to commit suicide- and it's it's a tough to grapple with at any time you know again, there's somebody circumstantial things can happen stress we, I have to go in all their right now, but we do know that it happened and there was a suicide note found right any so it. Possible that maybe he did take his own life.

The stress anything else, I'm saying here is conjecture fund. Well, I think I think we're out right now is- were asking ok after this Rand Mega conspiracy, the gist of this code. It true that want a couple things raised a very important and unfortunate point, which is that people do take their own lives. We ve already mentioned, that he was found with a ten to twelve slash wounds on his wrist. In the bathtub of Five. Seventeen, I the shared in that had also been harassed and threatened as his progress on the UN's law case continue to go a little bit deeper each time limit further down the rabbit all its True, that time magazine had come in turn to. In this case and we have to ask: why was he in Morton's Burg, West region to begin with, here is the major point of contention here is there, because

making contact with the source that he really believed would give him the last little bit of connective tissue. The evidence that he needed to reach He called the head of the octopus, the main part of the organization, and that's why people believe that he did not take his own life right If we look at this octopus thing This idea, if it does exist, what we're looking at. The concept of some sort of super mafia for lack of return to write. I d Were we go too far into the mafia aspect to whatever. Let's look at some of the big players there, castle, arrow and other conspiracy theories after him happy naming as members or tentacles of the octopus possible suspects right, yeah, not the usual, but the possible yeah, so the

one is the Department of Justice, so so they used and improved this. This piece of software called promise it was that was as this is the thing that was made by install incorporated They used it to become basically on people tracking and surveillance machines are they. They wanted to be a people tracker fright right they took they took the idea of the promised software, which was a means of managing legal cases electronically and in hence the source code, so that wooden just be a case management system, but it would be a people management system and after the enhanced which violated the terms of their licence? They also cooperated with other governments, to sell the software, but I wanna, I wanna see some of the promised stuff. Ok, look I know that their that their one of them

biggest players that at least there one of the first touch stones Salerno believed he found now. Of course, this being a story about spies. We can't go too far without running into an intelligence agency right, and so it should be no surprise that another member this alleged octopus would be the CIA which was legibly working with IRAN, private weapon manufacturers and a bank called b c c, I too funnel drug trade in weapons sales money. IRAN and other sources into money for nicaraguan conjurers which there's a lot of our listeners, will recognise as the in contrast, scandal, yes and you do a great job of outlining that then have to say in the video the Tentacles videophone watched it again, wash levity, oh yeah, Wednesday, video. Yet the will think you man,

I was, I was proud of their video, Did a great job man unblushing over here, so we dimension the banks as well the b c c I, which was again allegedly working with the CIA and related organizations to store and launder money. One point there we say allegedly working with the CIA in this case it's a little bit nuance because we do know that bees see, I am the CIA were working together. The question is whether they were working together to do something illegal near living. It's not abnormal for a government agency to work with a private organisation like a bank, absolutely in the money. You know you ve always heard, follow the money, so we ve already gone to the bank. Who else could we possibly have on this list. Then, oh I'm scooting, the edge of my seat met. Who is it if you're wrong

Was it so we mentioned that on his buying weapons and their also supplying cash were the contrasts in Nicaragua and even though, maybe they don't even know about it- May lady around it nowhere? The cash was gonna, be ok, maybe they did, but also working with factions of the Reagan administration to men actually a little thing called the October surprise, which remains on alleged day. Oh my gosh people plain. The drinking aim now has some water, please Heaven on earth of water, for the next few alleged mentioned so October. Surprise, real, quick sidebar is this conspiracy, theory that dream the time that Ronald Reagan and Jimmy Carter were both contesting the office of the presidency in the United States. But there were hostage

is held by IRAN and that some, how somebody told them I told the hostage takers to hold those hostages until they would be released. You know when Reagan was elected air or something like that yeah There are some there imposing cod. Seventeen interesting thing to think about. But again it is important to say that that was never conclusion we proven The timing did happen to work out that way. However, the agreed it prevent. Why and how? Much of that is confirmation I certainly do not want to see and and how much of that other people argue was somehow suppressed because, again, in an age before I such pervasive, ology existed I may have been easier to do something without amount a subterfuge, but those are some of the big players and here's the thing a castle I believe that these

all related or if you will all all tips above the water. Of a massive iceberg, there was all one thing and too to really figure out more of this. Now it's time for us to look at promise. We ve met and what happened in the early nineties eighties- and this is in our video series on this in the early nineties eighties. This I t group in slot which has stolen, the terrible name it just yet it doesn't ring, it sounds like their Cole slaw. Yes, that's all that a law here in my head is the slav art yeah, maybe we're just hungry. Are we guilty upon casting hunger? I think I think PR is just gotten so much more pervasive where people have done better at pr now. You dont name your company, something like that and maybe, as a personal reason, perhaps yeah. That's props, it's a clever, That's really him! I guess not the night. The most relevant point to her showed a diary, but despite

opinion about what the name their company one thing for sure. Objectively speaking, they were banned task at this. Case management software. This idea, promise is, is in changes the game, if we can cast our memories back to the nineteen eighty or for you younger listeners, cast your imagination back there, the deal that, department of Justice made within slot was to install this revolutionary people managing, hey management software. In forty two years, journeys offices across the United States when you make these kind of agreements for software will yours, we doing is buying a licence yellow right. So the Department of Justice a licence for these the two locations of promise however,

as we mentioned earlier, are apparently in the Department of Justice. According to insular and a couple of court cases, the departed Justice stole this programme enhance the code to make a bigger at her promise and sold it to foreign governments inside did take them the court inside didn't just say your uncle SAM wasn't true for in his dealings with, as they also said that Uncle SAM was attempting to bankrupt the company. In order to silence them and stop the litigation method, it is more than I just one, also reiterate that another thing that they did, the deer with this software is right, a back door so people. They were selling the software to they could have access to the information that was being on other end, so, let's say, let's say I don't know them sod purchased the software. We agree,

installed. Now I in the? U S and the deal. I can read everything you're putting into this software because I know how to access it right or or was specifically civically alleged was middle eastern countries. They said that the United States was selling this to Syria, Jordan, with the back door to monitor the activities of the government. If, This is what was true at a very half and serious allegation, The atmosphere, drinking water have more as the This is what happened so is very interesting. A bankruptcy judge of all people say within slot areas in a heap of money, to yes, says that the Department of Justice must pay. The President events Lop Bill, Hamilton, six point million dollars in damages the attitude three theories, but

but that was in the end, right well the end of that judges career because in his reappointment came up she is not reappointed and she believes that wise in some way retribution for his ruling. Otherwise, a another judge appointed to fill that seat. Who was one of the lawyers arguing in the ins lovers, dear G D, J case, by the way, if you guys want too in the interim before our episode droughts later in this week. If want to find out more about this insular case. There's a Youtube video from an australian broadcasting company that back in the day, did Entire series called the insular affair, You may or may not find a link to it somewhere. Hidden in our video from Wednesday, working from home conference calls instead

with everything we have going on right now, it's never been more important sleep we need, while they sleep is a natural amused and only the sleep number three sixty smarter senses, your movements at automatically just confidence. A point on both sides need member setting. So all those other things we're doing this. They help me unhappy. Well, they worked better chip and now, during the lowest price of the season, the queen sleep number three sixty C4 sport. That is only twelve. I do not say port at all. It's only for a limited time, more go to sleep number dot com, second debated. We ever podcast got straight out in Nashville, where we spell the tea on music cities. Are you don't dashboards known for its country, music with her so much more to the city, the math yeah. We are platform in it on show hanging out with all the different types of artists that perform here or that live here. We're hungry, backstage rhetorically food. That was in season one along with a hung over vast, still talking about Thou wild night out last time there in town and

and Hayley around here from the goal of birds confess about being on bumble plus? Did you know that Kane Brown is built? A painful calls in he's back here, you didn't hear all the stories on straight out a national make. She listen. I'm Iheart Radio, app on apple pot, cats or wherever you listen to your favorite podcast. Yeah you mind the frame by frame, it's their right. It's somewhere in there and speaking of massive conspiracies. We do always have a couple of interesting little Easter eggs in our video. So if you Thank you ve seen the whole thing from watching at once. Beer, another look or five five years, and now the added our own massive to our own massive. To of that, we get back to this concept here on this. This idea that somehow these things could all be concerned?

Then we realise that these allegations require in it Jordan amount of proof for, we know that we know Congress did not dismiss these allegations are these claims that were congressional investigations into the matter and others standing subcommittee of the permanent subcommittee tasked with In addition, the Senate found that how did they put we cannot say there is the evidence of wrong doing yes, you they couldn't. Say that there was no around doing anything. Not say that their what is wrong doing it's? It's! Not it's not up there with. You know neither confirm nor deny, but they said when Congress looked at it that the facts just word there for further legal action. Not every member of Congress was happy with this, of course, and peep. Who believed that there was something wrong

in Denmark, a rotten in Washington to one phrase for those people this one, further confirmation that there was something amiss. However, at this point do you know that we do know that any castle arrows peace. It's going to be published. I never saw friends and we do know that their there are some fairly divided groups about right, which is something you and I run into a lot on, shows therapy Oh, who say that this is pervasive, massive and the lack of hard evidence indicates that there's someone out there suppressing truth in that we have. The other side were embedded still happening around the others are still in charge. The right is revolutionary, given them their people who just say, come on guys. This is this is this is crazy talk. We can't we can't even look into these kind of things, because if we,

We believe that these people can be is organised- and you know this secretive about something this huge, then guys were what the hell are we doing here and that's all. The question is not when it comes to the idea of a massive conspiracy, most p, are terrible, keeping a secret a meaningless secret. You know like you, you why a television show that you were supposed to watch with your friends by yourself. Can you keep it quiet so Thursday, new owner, yeah right, and I mean that's, anecdotal and I'm not trying to belittle this? But what I am saying is for this to be true. There would have to be a lot of other things in play and for We do believe that this conspiracy, that point too numerous mysterious deaths that may be mafia hits it is is known. It has come to light before that, various actions of domestic, agencies have.

In some way or another with criminal element right like a vast and furious scandal. The idea of people would be CIA assets are informants working with criminal organizations. That's why this will be very careful to safe facets because we we can't say that an entire group people does something because a couple do you ever, but we also know. Organizations like the CIA and speed. Finally, the CIA their hands in a lot of things. We recently just learned that, while some we probably all kind of assumed, but that Ukraine the forces in Ukraine are being I want to use the word managed, but that's not the current. I advise that would be the correct word by the CIA as well as the FBI because of an anti terrorism angle.

Oh I'm sure that there are other forces in Ukraine being advised by the KGB. Lose me? Oh they own existence, as I saw where we see this is this is just a kind of a quick look. The to explore. In more detail the ideas of the octopus and it straight to think that this story was big for a time and now I think, is safe to say that most people not aware of this historical conspiracy theory I would seem. A lot of people are aware of some of some of these tentacles. The big questions. If they are all connected, we know that the Octopus, whether it is really not, has never been proven to exist, but allegations did become fact around Contra came around scandal Then they can grow. Investigations into the Department of Justice, an insular returned findings that com,

itself did not agree with and in and for a long time litigation dragged on between in law and the department of asked. The October surprise became thing, I guess it kind of rocket up into a big thing, but it was still never proven right. Yeah it still alleged and then the euro anywhere and was pause, you're just forsaken, because I have to ask you how this would, you say, makes LISA Toby surprise run contrary things that pop up around election time or to take down a president, how many things are genuine and how many are manufactured political crises. This all you know I've been watching house of cards. Thinking, oh yeah, ok, so Certainly in my opinion, I would say that powerful people will use means to get what they want or need them

I don't use all kinds of different means, but I don't necessarily think no pudding lives in danger in that way. That specific, For the October surprise, I have two remains: ethical just to justice go hide in a whole somewhere will if we did get ok just come with me. If we do a cost benefit analysis, what's your prior right, you're gonna, be president. Would you wanna take the risk if something goes wrong, because, if thing goes even just a little bit wrong. Europe can your career it's gonna be messed up. If I suppose, and if I have the means and the assets to manage the situation, I guess I would our so before. Go to some feedback from our listeners who have written to us from around the world, and thank you guys. I gotta ask map

Only if you wanna go on record saying this man I have, the Octopus will get us. Do you think this is a conspiracy theory or conspiracy fact, and do you think Danny Hassle arrow took his own life or do you think he was murdered earlier these two right. Ok, I like sphere. Well, I would have to say. I know the feeling and I've. It's so many its cropped up. First if the people that we ve talked about I'd who have committed suicide, at least according to the official record, who go on record to their friends and family and say that I will never commit suicide Then they do list the record and that just that alone makes me suspicious. I would have to say personally, I don't think he committed suicide. Ok, I see I see you were saying-

with whether or not this is a conspiracy theory or if there is a large full basis behind it. What I looking for him? What I think you- and I both in looking for as we as we look through this case- is research and again to various things is more connective tissue? I really enjoyed a phrase you use because It is completely possible that various. Happen. Drug dvd weapon trade be manufacturing, indian reservation and proxy companies and stuff like that. It's completely possible that whose happen without being related and as for whether any castle arrow murdered that or whether he can it's suicide, I'm going I have to say that the in unless there's more information that I don't have the notion that he committed suicide-

does seem abnormal to me. It's it's. The scepticism goes both ways sure you I mean this is not to say that people- don't don't do things like this without for warning, you know and dumb of ass. We remain open minded if there's more to the store perhaps there were some warning signs that castle arrow showed, but were hand you're the red flags or yellow flags of some wine have suicidal ideation. What. With the knowledge we have with what we ve checked. It does seem suspicious, but again we go back, is the body was examined not once but twice in both times it was. His body was, however, embalmed before family was even made aware. Then he was dead, which is interesting these that's going to his brother

from an australian broadcast road. He is the one thing I would want. I had been ok for someone to if someone killed Danny counselor. I would say that it doesn't it mean that the Octopus, in total, has to be real. All it means is that one of the things one of these tentacles had to be real and dangerous enough for him to be investigating that he would someone taking his life. So I just Fact even feel truly did not commit suicide. It doesn't essentially prove that the Octopus exists right yeah, that's really. Point met and, speaking of really points we would like you guys to make a few. Let us know what you think about this whole octopus mega conspiracy. Is it all about Is it all true? Is there a spectrum and this this story fall somewhere in between? What do you think, if anything, finally determine the truth of this.

Here is even possible to is this just a story. Of course you can read. Numerous articles wired has some great stuff on it time magazine as well about people who believe they are Backing down on this case are tracking it and we're. Very interested to hear what you have say about it matter. I find us on Facebook. We are conspiracy. Stuff were also at conspiracy, stuff on Twitter, You can always good or Youtube Channel, which is also conspiracy, stuff or our bread. New website stuff? They don't want you to know dot, com and hey while you're at it wanted you go to our mother website how stuff works, dot com. You can learn about everything there not just conspiracies sure You can learn about everything from other, You and fascinating historical tails to the nature of tech in the future everything science related pretty much and just to prove

that just approved you how much we enjoy listen. Email met, you wanna check out a tweet stewing mats. Today's tweet comes to us from our friends zombie combat diver, who says, hey conspiracy, stuff all the zombie lore. Why are there zombie animals woman? I feel So if you don't mind, then yes, a good way will first of all hello Eric. Who is that? Ok earlier, you guys met each other. I r L is a correct a year. He may or may not work. Building and he drives the coolest vehicle that I've ever seen in my life hopefully a living person, though not a zombie, not a zombie good, it did you know. Well, I would have to say there have been lore of animals zombies. All you have to do is check out resin an evil than any other franchise, it shows you that

many there's a virus than infects all living beings, including spiders and snakes shirt. Everything in between although there isn't much, there isn't old floor of zombie animals. I gather thinking, I think, maybe it has something to do with tat. Zombie. Something to do with losing consciousness, losing humanity near? Well, that's a great point man. I think I can dovetail onto this a little bit ivy most an example. I can think of would be the undead animals in pet cemetery, awe of all not the film which is fine, which they don't explain why they spell it that way in the normal, either Are you all right? There does seem to be kind of a dearth of folk lore may be for something to be, and on dead thing ass having manatee to lose by two. Another interesting addition here,

it is true that there are numerous animals that can in a deathlike state and then be resurrected, you know, area there, frogs that will just tough outer drought in the dry might have a river bed. There are animals that can be put down that take him on a bare hibernating or something because it still has I've signs even monitor blood is it is possible that people thought it was a normal thing for so now I was just I come back. Water returned, but it is possible. The people in the past me have seen us of these animals and just thought it was normal for them. The quota will die in the return to life totally that is it for sure. We have a whole bunch of tweets that we would,

to answer on air was an excellent questions. I think we might even have a little special, then yeah. I think it might be time that for a listener, questions special, which will will come up with a way better sounding Tonia O one more thing. Just in case you are not intoxicated alleged alleged, and alleged. Ah yes, yes, yes, allegedly that was our plan all along right that, yes, maybe we came in here, we allegedly ETA plan, but then I don't know just went out the supposed window, or we just one small part of a much larger, planned spanish generations. If you wanna be put our listener, male special, coming up, do sinister tweet do right. A question to us on Facebook will be going to Facebook messages as well, and you and always right to us directly, would love to hear from you. Our address is

security at discovery, dot com for more on this topic and other unexplained phenomenon visit tests to duck slash conspiracy, stuff, you can also get in touch on twitter at the handle conspiracy, stuff, the only way is through more fascinate asked in partnership with our radio under join here from the world's greatest athletes, coaches and trainers, as they discuss how they utilised training competition air recovery to improve their performance. A push to start to visit Chechnya has been wreaking havoc. When the college level for the last three seas, but now says, is it was found risk is that elevators gains the professional love, his choice, it makes you feel good men attack, you know aspiring Yankee Commoner and as one

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