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Murasaki Shikibu and the Tale of Genji

2020-01-08 | 🔗

Murasaki Shikibu, sometimes known in English as Lady Murasaki, lived during Japan’s Heian period. She was a lady-in-waiting to Empress Shoshi, and is credited with writing the Japanese classic literature work, "Tale of Genji."

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This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
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Monetary or the tale of Genji Mercedes. A key. We ve been on my list. Basically, some falling join the show and twenty thirteen, but she also has a lot in common with, say, shotgun who we covered in our first year on the show and whose episode we re publishes a Saturday classic and twenty seventeen we people who have similar backgrounds and stories all the time but in terms of say, shown a gown and Morocco tricky issue. There is a lot of overlap. Both women were ladys in waiting in the court of japanese Emperor ichijio at the same time, but they served indifferent. Households say shouted own served. Empress, tasty and Maria Zackie should keep, who served Empress show she needs to emphasis. We're rivals, although a lot of that rivalry with sort of by extension through their fathers, both of these women also wrote with their work being viewed as both literature and as a historical documents about life in the court of Hay on Japan.
At the same time. There are these two women's written work is really all that similar and at this point it seems like there is plenty of time that has passed between that say, shown episode and Saturday Classic and now there is also a lot of context about Hey on Japan that we didn't get into as much in that earlier episode, so that discovery that I came across Bre unearthed episodes finally moved mercy. he up to the top of the list, and we are finally getting to her today. What is Aki should keep, who sometimes known in English, is Lady Mundus Aki lived during Japan's hey on period, which spanned from seven ninety four to eleven. Eighty five in this period is name for the japanese capital of hay on Kyoto, which was the predecessor to today's Kyoto. The capital moved from Nora to hay on cue in seven. Ninety four Japan's government and culture during this period were heavily influenced by an patterned after hung dynasty. China with influences from Buddhism as well. Japan started this
thing itself from China in the late nineteenth century, as the tongue dynasty decline, earlier influences continued to be a big part of the culture that kind of started growing for their own bang hand, Japan particularly known for its imperial court culture, which had a focus on elegance beauty. A fine meant then spawned a whole renaissance and literature and art. During this period, the You oughta family really dominated the japanese imperial government and society in general, although emperor was considered to be both above and outside of Japan, social and political hierarchy. The food you. our family, had extensive connections to the imperial family and was consequently able to exert a huge amount of influence. Polygamy with common in hand. Japan and for much of japanese history. Emperors typically had multiple wives who were arranged into a hierarchy that included the empress followed by consorts, followed by intimates, powerful.
ways arranged marriages between their daughters and the emperor, his heir apparent, and then those daughters place in this whole hierarchy dependent their families position in the greater social hierarchy. Although there were surely emperors really appreciated. This system gave them access to so many women. This was also really giving Japan's most prominent and powerful families access to the emperor. The food you A family was Japan's most powerful and high ranking family during most the hay on period. So when the families high his drinking members arranged marriages between their daughters and the emperor or his air. Those daughter is usually became. Emphasis or high ranking concerts the daughter sons were in line to become emperors, and if they came to the throne, when they were too young to rule their food, you oughta grandfather became regions. Rivalry between emphasis, tasty and shows that we mentioned earlier
fathers were brothers and each of them was trying to get his daughter and her children into that highest. Ranking position possible in case of not really clear from these. The number of times we have just said hierarchy and rank the hay on court was incredibly focused on rang and where you were in the rank and precedents in order really extremely Mirza, you should keep who was also part of the food. You are a family, but from a less prominent and influential branch of it. Her father was food. You are, I know, Tommy hokey. He was hated and well regarded as a poet and a scholar, but he was not nearly high enough in the family hierarchy for his daughters to get married into the imperial family during his career. He was the governor of three provinces and at one point he was tutor to the crown prince Thelma. Turkey's famous daughter was born sometime between nine seventy
three and nine. Seventy eight you'll see both of those years pretty often as well as years in between, depending on what source you're looking at it. to not knowing her birth here for sure. We also dont know what name she was given. Girls names generally recorded in hand Japan. So for the most part we only know their names if they eventually became and empress or mother to an emperor. When it comes to the money her Maria Saki. She Kivu, Mirth Zackie, was the name of one of the characters in the tail of Genji. She was one again: Jeez wives, the one who's often described as being the love of his life, more Saki, also means purple or lavender, and the name food. You are a means with Syria Arbour, so there's some speculation that this nickname was also kind of a nod to her family name as well. She Kivu is a reference to food. You are, I know, Tommy Turkey's office is one of the offices that held, it was the bureau of Ceremonial. In addition, not knowing her name. We don't know a whole lot about motorcycles life. She does seem to have been rigged
as gifted from a very early age. There are stories that she was such a talented poet that her father said that he wished she had been born a boy. He also seems to have taught her to speak. Czech he's an right Chinese, calligraphy chinese the official language of the imperial court, with everything from official documents to literature being written in Chinese, but Chinese was also considered to be a language for men. Women were not generally taught to read or speak it. Maria Zackie herself said that she learned Chinese by listening at the door where, while her father taught her brother, but that would not have explained her ability to write in calligraphy, she also taught Chinese to the empress, probably in secret, or at least as discreetly, possible because there was really no privacy at court food. You are an automaton Ikey was given the governorship of the province of itchy, then in nine. Ninety six and were Saki travelled with him to help him establish and run his household, but she was
particularly happy there and only stayed for about a year before returning to Kyoto and nine ninety eight or nine ninety nine. She married food. You are, I know, nobody talker, although we don't know Maris accusation for sure this does seem to have been a relatively late. Marriage and taco was a distant cousin, fleet twice her age, who already had other wives and children, more Zaki talk. I had a daughter in nine ninety nine, whose name was catacomb or can she the characters used to write? It can be read either way daughter, was later known, as diy mean no sovereignty and she became a highly regarded poet in her own right, do. I know no attaka died in the year, one thousand one, and it was probably at some afterward, that Marine Zackie started. Writing the tape of Genji. It might have been this work that led her to be called to serve in the emphasis court invitation came in the year. One thousand six and the tail of guinea
as we know, it today seems to existed by about ten o, seven or Tenno eight. In a dish in writing the tale of Genji Morocco should keep, who wrote a diary during some of her time at court summit. This diary is compared to say Jonah goods pillow book, but the pillow book includes lots of lists and snippets and other materials that you wouldn't necessarily describe as a dire three more Isaak is diary is more like a series of memoirs or sketches of court life. It mostly covers the years of ten o eight to ten ten, including the birth of the emphasis children, in addition to the documentation of notable events. Court we're Isaak is diary, includes analysis of court life, personal reflections at references to buddhist rituals, just as the emperor's wives were arranged into a higher, Ok, so were all those wives ladys in waiting throughout the whole called As we said earlier, there was just so much focus on Rank Morocco.
wrote about all this in her diary, including documenting disputes about the other Ladys and her feeling that she was treated poorly by some of the other court women because of their jealousy over her literary success. The date of motorcyclists death is not entirely clear. The last may tons of her in writing. Our dated from ten thirteen or ten fifteen by that point, Emperor Ichijio had died in Marsoc. He had moved from one residence to another with the empress and the rest of her court. Where is Sakis brother died in one thousand, and fourteen and her father died in one thousand, and twenty nine sources put her death anywhere between one thousand and fourteen and one thousand and twenty five her daughter died in one thousand and eighty we will get to the tale of Genji, that's a break. Ok class! Welcome to car leasing, one o one. Today's less price negotiations, first take out your phone and go on the road o k
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although the tale of Genji is a work of fixing, it's also regard it as a look at what life was like for the aristocracy and the imperial Court and hey on Japan, the very fictional, wised, highly romanticized, look it's a long romance with fifty four chapters that span about seventy five years, Beijing at least four hundred characters and running for more than a thousand pages, when translated into English. So early precursor to Georgia Martin. Yes, that thought a couple of times: there's not much murdering live, but it is very long and and polluted, because it's a long work of narrative prose presenting realistic characters in a fictional story, and it's likely the oldest work that we know about the fits that description. It is often called the word first novel, although that designation is not universally agreed upon. Sometimes it is also described as the first
historical novel, because it seems to depict the time between seventy five and one hundred years before it was written. An it treats that earlier era, with some degree of nostalgia if you care about spoilers than a thousand plus year old piece of fiction for about to give a brief overview of what this book is about, along with various ways that it reflected are depicted high, uncorked culture and just to be really clear. Like most of the literature and art that came out of the imperial court, this was focused on court culture meaning that it was about Japan's richest and most powerful people, not the ordinary japanese population like it was not about the japanese one percent. It was like the japanese hundredth of one percent yet and, as its name suggests, the book tells story of a man called Genji and his mother, one of the emperor's intimates, so she is at a lower tier in the emperor's hierarchy of wives. The M,
it is quite fond of her, but that affection just is not enough to change her place in the order of things and she also dies when judges very young genji just so beautiful and intelligent and translations he's also called Shining Genji or the shining prince his father, the emperor wants to make him heir to the throne, but, as has been the case with the Ganges mother, the emperor's wishes alone, are just not enough to do that. Genji is not really high enough in rank for the rest of the court to accept him as the heir apparent. So the emperor does what he can do, set Genji up for a life of wealth and privilege, but one that is outside of the imperial, Molly! He gives Genji the surname Minamoto, making him a commoner, although he was still a commoner, a very high rank and a to hold high level offices. Danziger is grows up to be handsome adventurous and very sensitive, and much of the book is about his love.
life, some of the women involved or Ganges wives, the first one, that he marries. As the minister of the left daughter, the Minister of the left was one of the highest ranking imperial councillors. Another wife is known as the third princess who Genji marries when he's forty, that happens after her father user, retired emperor and thus Ganges half brother decides to become a monk and Kenzie to take care of her in between those years. There is the character of what is sake who gives you first sees when she is only ten and living with her grandmother. She RA it's him of his late mother and after her grandmother dies. He takes custody of her. Basically by kidnapping While her family is distracted, and then he grooms her to be his wife, although she is hello in rank for Genji, to name for his primary wife of all the women in his life, she is the one that he seems to feel the most deeply for and her death devas.
it's him Ganz. We also has a lot of affairs, something that wasn't necessarily frowned upon in hand. Japan polygamy was expected for men, and people also took lovers outside there's marriages. So a man could have multiple wives, but a woman couldn't have multiple husbands, although she could take lovers if she chose as long as the husband acknowledged the children that his wife gave birth to those children were considered to be legitimate. However, although all of this was pretty much expected, it did not at all translate into a lack possessiveness or jealousy jealousy and envy are very present themes in the tail of Genji. Just couple of highlights of Ganges affairs. He fathers a secret, be with the emperor's wife Fujitsu Bow, who is another woman in this story who is said to resemble Ganges late mother that baby, he goes on to become emperor at
Point Genji goes into exile after being caught in an affair with the daughter of a political rival, and he pursues their affairs while he is exiled since the text of Genji was a reflection of the court culture of the time. All of these affairs could make. It seem like the hay on court was a total hotbed of steamy licentiousness, but real These relationships were carried out with just uninsurable amount of discretion in the imperial court. Men were house separately for the men, including with married couples. Wives had there in homes and their husbands and lovers came to visit them and there were a lot of barriers, both physical and cultural, between potential partners. Women's attire, also involve layers and layers of clothing. The number could vary, but an idea, a number of layers was twelve, a typical outfit included at minimum trouser skirts and unlined dress lined robes a gown, a mantle, a train and a jacket. So too,
nudity was not common, even in explicit artwork or literature. These clothes and their materials pattern. in colors are a big part of the tale of Genji curtains and screams, also physically separated women from their male visitors and to move these curtains or dreams. Aside to see a woman was essentially a promise of commitment, the idea of just glimpsing, someone through a gap in the screen, is another big theme in the tail of Genji and in classical japanese literature and general, and even though Ganges Physical relationships are a huge part of the book. Actual physical encounters are here we ever mentioned in some cases their barely hinted at alluded to in a lot of this intimacy just happens in between the lines, although emotional sense seventy was a hallmark of Hampton Court culture. People also did not talk about their feelings to each other. Directly. Poetry was the most acceptable way for people to communicate their most personal thoughts
they were poem, so they tend to be veiled rather than direct, and even these poems had to be delivered by a go between rather than straight from the writer to the recipients. The tale of Genji contains nearly eight hundred poems the Abbe all this, there was virtually no privacy in the hay on court. High ranking women were always surrounded by Ladys in waiting servants and staff who all naturally everybody's business, but only really mattered. If you were caught by some one else of rank, doing something that was questionable. We should also that all of the women they Genji pursues in the book are fully realised, characters of their own with the novel, exploring their feelings and motivations and internal sake logical lives, some critics argue that the work is really their story as much as it is Ganges and that if it wasn't the first novel period, it would at least be the first psychological novel. So to get back to the plight of the book,
Kenzie rises through the ranks becoming wealthier and more prominent. Eventually, he has multiple households after his secret, some, the emperor learns his true parentage. He names Jimsie, the honorary retired emperor, which is essentially the highest honour. That You could ever hope to attain as a commoner, but in his last year's after the character, Mercedes death, a grief stricken Genji becomes really lonely and wistful and ultimately decides to take religious boughs and live his last year's in seclusion. But the book does not and with Ganges death it continues on with a mostly new cast of characters. Its last third tells us worry of Kourou who is presented as Genji son, but is really his best friends, grandson plus carers, friend NEO, who is Ganges, grandson like Genji, they have a series of relationships, affairs and seduction, some of which can have a similarly soapy tone to modern western audiences.
For example, there is a whole love triangle that also involves an apparent death, a case of amnesia. An exorcism whew decision to become a nun. The book also ends on an ambiguous note, which resolve a lot of these earlier threads, so that very brief overview seems pretty straightforward. But the novel itself really isn't. It contains a lot of little snippet, some of which seem like abandoned threads of the story, along with shifts, in the point of view, Victor's Interior Monologues Authority sides. Those nearly eight hundred poems that we mentioned earlier. It can be challenging reed and absorb any work. It was written in another language as a reflection of another culture and even for japanese speakers. The tale of Genji is typically translated from Hey on Japanese to modern, Japanese, but the tale of Genji has some tree. That makes it particularly challenging for modern readers and translators, especially for one thing it contains. A lot of
France's and allusions to historic all people and events from Hey on Japan, including many many references to the literature of the time So there is a lot of new, wants that a well read person in eleven century Japan would easily grasp, but just about invisible. If you are a westerner, whose only experience with hay on literature is the tale of Genji maybe she say shotguns pillow book as the two things that I think it read. The most often among english speakers and on top of that we talked about how relationships in the court of Hay on Japan were carried out with layers and layers of discretion. The book itself is also written that way,
hey, I'm japanese, as a language didn't always clearly connect things like subjects and objects. Often these kinds of linguistic relationships word denoted through very subtle shifts in verb conjugation. To add to that most of the characters in the book are not directly name. They are mentioned by title or rank in some cases. There are duplicate among these title the orb characters. Titles change over time. People who were part of a higher court who were immersed in a culture that was threaded through with all of these hierarchies and ranks probably would have been able to tell who was who, without a lot of difficulty, but translations The work often end up deriving various nicknames for the characters to make things more intelligible to readers, who don't have that background? All of this, up to a work that a lot of critics think was meant to be read and re read over and over, because it's only after re reading it that a reader could possibly pick up on
those illusions, and sub texts and connections involved. We'll talk about the ongoing influence of this book after we first pause for a sponsor break hi. This is celebrity acting coach, Tracy more and I have a brand new podcast. This spirit, it actor. Where I give you the tools to succeed as a working actor. My clients include, must arrives fifty San Lala, Anthony and Cardy, be just to name. A few here were thought to yourself. How can I learned the craft of acting and break into the business? Well, each week, I'll talk to industry, guess like casting directors, agents, directors and producers and I'll have celebrity Gaslight Vanessa, Simmons, Angela Ye Sean Ringgold and many many more. They will share their failures, their struggles and their triumph on their journey in this business. These are not just the leading experts there,
friends, so we're gonna keep it one hundred for you all the time. So join me on the spirited actor pod cast each week on a hard radial, app apple pod cast or wherever you get your pod cas avenues that earlier it's not entirely clear when Morocco should keep, who wrote Genji Monetary, it's not even clear what order, she wrote the chapters in or whether those chapters were originally red in the same order that they are today. One chronicle written in the fourteenth century suggest that Maria Sukhi went on a pilgrimage to a temple not far from Kyoto. After a princess asked the empress for anew story. The empress commissioned one firmer Saki. Then, while she was at this temple, Morocco had a vision of an older genji in exile and that prompted heard a right chapters. Eleven and twelve. First, not really clear, though how much truth there is to this story. There is
So been some debate about whether murder Saki was the sole author of the entire work with some people speculating that some chapters, in particular of those last ones after Ganges death, may have been written by her order, and there is really no clear evidence of this one way or the other, but there is some suggestion that Moorish Aki may have had an editor who helped shape a sprawling very complex work into its final form near the whole. Authorship debate is like mostly people reading it incredibly closely trying to pick up clues as to whether her daughter may have picked up part of it
we then decades of Morocco should Kyushu writing the tale of games. You, though people in Japan or recognising it is a classic food you are, I know, should see who is an influential poet and critic and the late twelfth century called Genji Monetary indispensable, especially for people who wanted to study poetry. The earliest surviving version we have of the tale of Genji is an incomplete set of illustrations. From about the same time, at court emphasis didn't typically red work to themselves. It was read aloud to them with the empress following along with illustrations on a scroll. The remaining fragments of this twelfth century scroll are considering.
companies national treasure and are housed in two different museums in Japan. Although movable type was being developed in China around the time that Morocco should keep who lives, it didn't become widely used or spread to Japan until later. So the tale of Genji was mainly copied by hand for the first centuries of its existence. That meant that by the thirteenth century, or so there were lots of copies floating around with all kinds of variation starting to crop up. People started making an for to identify and preserve the original text. One of these was Minamoto no mitzvah Yuki, nor to the sun, Chico Yuki with Chica Yuki, probably finishing their work after his father's death, Missy Yuki the governor of Kowalski, so their version is known as the coercion texts, poet and colleagues.
Her food, you are, I know, tat cat was doing similar work at about the same time he compiled the Elbe Yoshi bone or the blue cover text version of the book until twenty nineteen there are believed to be for surviving chapters of this version that he wrote in his own hand, and we talked about the newly discovered fifth chap in our urine unearthed and twenty nineteen. There is also one other set of early copies of the tale of Genji. That's grouped together, basically as other texts but food. Or I know, tat egos compilation was regarded as standard by the fourteenth century, and today, most translations from Hey on Japanese use his version as a starting point. The tale of Genji continued to be read in Japan and the centuries It was written growing, more popular during the Muromachi from about one thousand three hundred and thirty, eight to one thousand five hundred and seventy three and then the auto period. From about sixteen o three to use eighteen, sixty eight, when it did,
The adaptation of the work into other media mirth suck. You should keep. You became a character in various works of fiction. During these periods, several satirical versions of the tale of Genji were written during the meadow period as well. We talk about the meadow period, its culture bore in our previous episode on catches. She got hokosa, which are also gonna put out, is a Saturday classic soon by the early twentieth century, the tale of Genji was still regarded as a classic work of japanese literature, but it wasn't necessarily beloved by japanese readers. The one thousand year old, Japanese, it was written in, was just too inscrutable for most people to read and enjoy then a poet, your Sano IQ, CO, publicity for volume, translation into modern, Japanese in nineteen, twelve nineteen thirteen hurt him. And made the work far more accessible to japanese readers. That was well reviewed and it's sold well in spite of what was regarded as a pretty expensive price tag. Men,
Other translations into modern Japanese have followed the first translations of the tale of Genji into English were created at the end of the nineteenth century, the first translation of the entire Work was by Arthur Whaley, who published a six volume work volume by volume in the nineteen twenties and thirty's ITALY's work was generally regarded as a huge achievement and the English speaking a literary world. Although it did have some shortcomings, there is some degree of Sub activity and translating any work, but Whaley in particular seemed more focused on trying to preserve what he saw as the beauty of Morocco language rather than the accuracy of the story ass. She wrote it. He basically left out parts that he thought were Annette resting or obscure, and sometimes he wrote passages that he thought sounded as beautiful as the original, whether or not they conveyed sort of the same meaning as the original. He also simultaneously tried to make all the dialogue sound like things that english speakers would actually saying
conversation, rather than reflecting the flavour of Mercedes prose dialogue or the many layers of discretion that were part of hay and court culture even sell his teeth. Relation made the book accessible to the world of western literature before he had even finished when he still had two volumes left to go. The tale of Genji was being called one of the masterpieces of world literature with people comparing it too everything from the Iliad and the odyssey to the works of Shakespeare flow Bare and Tolstoy Waylayest tremble. rather than the original hay and Japanese also became the starting point for other translations into other languages, meaning that way editorial decisions influenced how the tale of Genji was translated into other languages as well other ink language. Translation since then have tried to you in one way or another, improve on or correct Willie's work later english
Installations are by Edward Sidon sticker in nineteen. Seventy six Royal Tyler in two thousand one and Denis Washburn and twenty fifteen Helen Mccullough, also translated a selection of earlier chapters in ninety nine before, and these translations are all very different from one another. Now you can read whole papers that are devoted to looking at the same passage from pay on Japanese and how each of these people translated it and what the subtle differences or dramatic differences Those translations are some of these differences just come with the territory of translating any work into another language, especially when that work is so different in terms of both time and place. But translating the tale of Genji can be particularly challenging. It's a book that involves a lot of romantic entanglements and seductions and other deeply personal human encounters ridden during and about it. I'm a place that had a very different set of mores and expectations for behaviour than most people are living under today that, on top of that,
We touched on earlier. It was written in a language and style that obvious created a lot of the details about all these things. So, apart from how they ve handled things like the sound of the language, different translators have come away with very different interpretations of characters, actions and reactions and feelings. On top of that, when it comes to translations into English, the major translations we have today have all been by people who were the United States or the United Kingdom. So, in addition to all those other challenges, these trans leaders have also had to contend with the cultural baggage that comes from centuries of western fascination for, and objectification of, asian nations and cultures, In addition to its reputation as a masterpiece and world literature, the tale of Genji was part of the earliest evolution of japanese literature in japanese and evolution was largely the work of women
we said earlier on the show and Morocco should keep who was living. Chinese was the official language of the japanese Imperial court and so called serious literature, being written and read, and chinese women The other hand were riding and japanese using a style of cursive writing called Hira. Ghana, which was so seated with women that it was nicknamed the women's hand. So, in a lot of ways, hey, I'm court women lay the groundwork for later japanese literature and brings up another point about the tale of Ganges translations fuck, you should keep. It was a woman writing a work that was being read or read aloud, mostly for an audience of women. The translator that Finnish, the first trains. should, in a modern Japanese, was also a woman, but as far as english translations, when it comes to translations of the entire work, all the english language versions are by men. If you remember that one woman that we mention she only translated a portion of it and that's not to say that men are not capable of translating
by women, but for a work that has so much focus on women's inner lives and feelings. It would be really interesting to have a woman's take on the whole thing in English. Guy personally, like my fantasy wish list, if I could just snap my fingers and have some kind of peace of literature at my immediate disposal, it would be a translation of the tale of Genji into modern English by a japanese woman. I think that would be amazing yeah, I'm sure it will happen at some, at some point sure yeah. So, apart from all of these translations, there have also been so many adaptation of the tale of Genji into every conceivable medium, including movies. Radio plays tee cereals mango, would black prancing kabuki place in two thousand eight at even appeared as a Google Doodle in Japan, for the one thousandth anniversary of the text, and that is the the now at this point. Six year delayed episode up. Do you have listened airmail does not six here,
delayed, not delayed at all we're recording assigned December twenty third- and this came December twentieth, seems very timely to me. It is from air in Iraq, I read about the italian Hall disaster and says hello. I was shocked and excited to see that you are doing an italian Hall episode I'm from Dollar Bay Michigan a couple of miles south of Calumet. I've been a history nerd my whole life and local history, as a huge part of that when I took part in the low or history smack down. We named our team, the Big Annie's. There are some points that are well known around the area, the one man drill is referred to as the widow maker because of the fear of being alone in that environment, the cuban brewing Company has a dark beer called the widow maker Black Ale, delicious though, if you dont like dark beers, it's probably not
for you, you briefly mention the Quincy mine. That's, why does a national historic Landmark District and the Quincy Mine, Hoist Association runs tours from April too late fall, usually with themed Halloween tours check out their instrument for fun pictures. I worked here in high school and college. I love it so much. I convinced my now husband that we should get married there that Quincy number two shaft houses in iconic piece of the landscape, Nord Burg, steam hoisted the largest steam powered hoist engine, attach some of our wedding photos for context. Thanks for all you do and bringing stories like this to a war audience Erika. Thank you so much Erika for this awesome, awesome, email and for sending the pictures. I had found the widow maker nickname in the research and it did not make it into the episode for whatever reason, but it ever in the area. I will suit were try that that dark beard, because I do love a merry dark beer. If you would like to write to us about this or any other pod cast history, podcast that I have raised,
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