The West has gotten rich off the backs of underpaid labor living elsewhere; people who are dedicated to Fair Trade feel it's time people at a disadvantage should stop being exploited. The concept is simple - just pay workers fairly for their labor.
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What are you, something amazing discover matches all the cash back you earn at the end of your first year automatically with no limit to how much, though match leaders of people a year are getting their cash back, matched discover cash back match. What are you waiting for? Their more discover? Dot com, slash cash back match, welcome to stop. You should know from house works You work under the podcast, I'm just Clark Charles Babbage Uprightness, five hundred somethin time that I said that when under the subsidiary, no no it's what are we midwives yeah? I don't know like we have five hundred word around January under a lot and now
we're doling out for free books were like ran like like five twenty. Maybe a really remember you do nothing, I'm great hurry. Ok, like my back her it's a little bit in June, is convinced that it's a kidney infection answers. She's like you need to drink a lot of episode of vinegar and baking soda deluded in water and energy says it I'm doing and water they want to, but I guess that deluded and water so accounts, but it's some kind of rough in another, your coffee counters water. No, it does actually unilateral the whole you shouldn't drink, eight, eight out classes and water a day. In coffee yet- and it's totally made up like there's. No one's ever said that you really,
do that it can. I came on, is like an early mean, I guess, and there's no there's not any evidence that in adult human living in a temperate climate of average health survive without any additional water on a daily basis, because we get it from things like food and other stuff. I think the ideas that you ve benefit from drinking water again, there's not necessarily
scientific evidence that you backward anarchy, one. It's pretty much made up, I'm not so sure. If I'm telling you look it up, acting. Ok we'll have a look up off the arm, but that's not what this is about chuck. Nor is it about my possibly impending kidney infection in hospitalization. It is about the idea that everyone around the world deserves to make a decent, sustainable living wage agreed or should, at the very least, get a. The issue should see the fruits of their labour in a fair way. This kind of flies in the face of something called capitalism- the free market system now little bit because in a free market for some one of the big things you have is pretty much every man for himself now, everyone in a free market system, it completely theoretical unfettered free market system, has the opportunity to enjoy the fruit.
His or her labors has the opportunity to make a decent level wage, but one could also argue that the bounds of power, his Tipp so far in favour of a consolidated internationally connected view that this is not a real possibility. More that theory, that theoretical version is now an impossibility right at think. Hate not now might be a good time to recommend people to listen to our previous pike. Ass is the free market really free, oh yeah too, given when that than him alone most go, and I was so because this balance of power has two so far post pretty much post war war two's when it happened. Yes, there are over. There are some people out there who have come up with the idea that maybe we should go in extra mile and make sure that the people who are actually making all things we enjoy, for example, coffee sure wine, soccer balls,
people who bananas bananas to big people who actually make these things get a an income. That is like something that anyone who is on the receiving end of these bananas in coffee would recognise as a livable amount of money in return for what they're giving us that's right. This is not a call for communism. No, this is a call for fair pay yet something called fair trade, and the idea is that you and I- and whoever wants to support this cause might not mind going into their local captain. We're getting a coffee luck. Is it's one of the big daddy that value added sleeping terrier might now and going into their their coffee shop or the grocery store every hunt down your coffee and painless. More for your coffee. It's got that fair. Stamp on their knowing that, ultimately, the worker who pick those beans is going to be cared for in Vienna. Humane, fair way
it's gonna get a decent amount of money for their further product. Exactly in you, you can hit something on the head when you said seeing that fair trade label there's a really big distinction between a a product that carries a certified fair trade label and something that marketed as fairly traded. That means nothing. It's means absolutely nothing like that that they might as well say like contents, insider orange and green, maybe yeah, it's the whole miss labeling mislead. Miss misleading labeling of things here, which is just The organic deal certified organic verses. These you know this crap food that will say like contains naturally Natural ingredients for things like their Emily has defied spell all the time with her company could she's one of the people that The only use Europe trade ingredients in a hundred per cent certified organic and tedious
angry every day when she sees products body products, it slap, something label like naturally good and people, think that means it's all natural right or all natural. That does it mean that it's a hundred per cent, genetic or all natural Dinah does it need to be regulated more in it that such a cynical thing to exploit the air like something that really meant something at one point: forty dollars there in order to market something that doesn't mean anything that is actually not good for you and marketing. As good for your clear while using an already established consumer trusted label or phrasing. Yes to the said, it's one, it's one of the wrong things in the world. That is to say that that's why a fair trade people for trade groups have the jealously guard their their labels, yeah,
that when you do see them you, you can't trust what's going on here and you know, companies it miss level or mislead with their labels, also make their labels look like the other levels, even in the fight in the color. Like it so underhanded yeah, it's really awful thoughtless over the back on it, did ya it's really awful thoughtless. How about the back? Under this? I just started the nineteen fifty with something called alternative trade organizations. Eighty owes not the fraternity, eighty as if they were doomed, beer, banks and other things, their humanitarian groups that started this and basically they wanted to alleviate poverty, in developing nations by. Cutting out middle men between small producers in the north, northern hemisphere, and small businesses in the southern hemisphere, regiment, more profits directly going to workers. You picked the bean,
yeah again with coffee, and then I guess over time the they found it. This this process could work, but you really do need middlemen. So you're, not always, but depending where you are in the process: you're right, but the if you're using the existing. I guess trade routes, yea, system of trade. That's been established globally and in the world, there are many men like you. You have a coffee growers in Ethiopia. He can't get to you you know in New England Do you need a middlemen? What they figured out with fair trade is that where you can certify the people in between to make sure that the money it's getting to the producer and rather than cutting, the middle man to increase the income of the of the original producer in the developing country. You go to the consumer, swimming in, say: hey you mind, paying a little more for this, and in return we will guarantee you that this, the person you
who made this coffee the going gets that money that extra money here you are basically socially sending it to this guy and were the ones who are going to make sure that happens. We're gonna do so through this label that's right in a nineteen. Eighty eight is actually when the labeling itself was born with the dutch eighty o called us. Solidarity, add their rights that is, you see we got yet another like email about pronunciation. We try people, that's part of the charm of the show. Some people don't like. I understand. So solidarity, add from from the Dutch of the world from Amsterdam from the Netherlands from HOLLAND from all those places they said, you know what we should label these things help people out when their shopping,
get them in the main street markets without compromising. You know the the trust that consumer has in these products and that this basically, where fair trade was born in We do have one step here in two thousand one, not super recent, but just to show you in how people pay for coffee coffee for weight and price? It's like you know anything online video, so in two thousand, when the price that really low and coffee growers receiving only about forty five cents per pound for coffee, but fair trade, coffee buyers paid a dollar twenty one per pound that year to ensure that these people, despite the fluctuations, were able to keep the lights on for their business, rightly because every fair trade organizations sets a minimum price, a minimum fair price that their their producers are gonna get no matter what no matter what the market does not matter. What, and I believe that the market goes up
they give they get the higher the two, but at the very least there getting that minimum bright price for their product pillows, if you should know listeners, do you want a new year's resolution? That's easy to keep yes resolve to help protect your identity and personal info with lifelike identity theft, protection, lifelong alert, you to potential threats, to your identity, and they see more, though what you can see by just monitoring your own credit like your info on the dark web and that's a big deal yeah and if you have a problem lifelike: U S, based restoration specialists, no, the steps to take to help resolve your case after all one in five identity theft, victims who had accounts open in their names discovered their theft through bank or credit card company and course. No one can prevent all identity theft or monitor all transactions at all businesses, but lifelike The new year's resolution does not
easy to keep it will help you protect what you ve worked so hard for get lifelike for up to twenty five percent off your first year, gonna lifelike, dotcom, slash stuff! That's why flock dot complex for up to twenty five percent off. So what is an ethical? Oh, this is sort of how it starts or how the process itself starts, or you want to talk about their answer the fair trade labeling organization, so that's that's one of em, there's theirs a number of or labeling organizations like this transfer. Usa. There's a european european, Fair Trade Association, and apparently I guess the Othello is like the the agency that oversees the agencies as ever. It is that's the impression that I have of it, but simply say that you want to tell you you are coffee, roaster and again we're gonna coffee gazettes, the big one yet you say hey. I really want to get in on this fair trade action for whatever
It doesn't matter if you increase your own sales or whatever it doesn't matter. There's u can exploit this process right, yes or no, but that's the thing like here The coffee roster can be, like you know, everybody's into this fair trade thing, and I think I can tell a lot more if I go through this process. So let me do it right, and they contact the f. A lower labeling organization is great. We so you a licence for ten thousand pounds of fair trade. Coffee beans, yes, it's a contract for a set of Mount. Yes, now what they could do is set the if he was her up within already certified fair trade producers, yeah and supply chain, or they can go in and say, We can go ahead and certify your existing supply chain and producer and that's what they do. The the coffee roster pays for that
since in since their fellow out they go through the supply to make sure that all this money is going back to the producer. Who is expected to get it right yet and they actually sent people human people yeah visit farms right to ensure that other business practices in there are adhering to these procedures and not only that they also had a dash of like sustainability like there that there is not using like horrible environmental techniques, stuff and vs, basically to make sure that this producer interests, like eight you know, dull disguised as like some dude right, you know they're going to do some detective work and once they figure out their everything's legit falls into the fair trade standards will not to talk about later, then that certified their licences exercise and that ten thousand pounds is delivered in like I can.
Said on that that ten thousand pounds yet- and it's not always just a one time visit. They can also follow up with periodic inspections to ensure that you know that you keep up with that kind of governance, and you didn't dislike for fast when Ottoman, You now get out your house in order for one day, you know why they came in bright executives and then there's the licences usually there's like. There's a contract involves like so the middle men who are involved have to participate in these states. Their money standards is, you have to sign like at least a six month contract, usually which is actually kind of a lot for these produce. Because a middle man can be like others, guy selling for way cheaper, I'm going over him. He had no. This producers guaranteed six months of going to this middle man and men getting the money from them. We, like you, said six months than sound like much, but I get the feeling that it was just like it's the wild West out there,
If you can drop someone from day to day yeah well, they can be like while this castle in for a penny lesson, you forces guy down and now this guy's down the two since he go to another guy like this goes down to see. If you can just play as many small murmurs, as you want against off against one another in DR prices down as low as you want right it fair to prevent that from happening by forcing middlemen to sign a contract, Yes, it s, one of the tenants. Another is direct trade between the producers and buyer, so they try to it, the middle men, when they can in Central America, they call the middlemen coyote of those interesting, So, in order to do this, they encourage these farmers to get together and form Killops export collapse, band together. You know, I've got no more power, so something that he points out here too, is that the exporter, if it's a plantation the fair trade and requires that national laws governing the minimum wage in red.
Relations covering the conditions be upheld in the workers. Rights are all upheld as well. So that when you're not a guess forming a co up, no but fair trade tends to encourage co. Ups democratically, run Calot sir, but yeah there there there now they're, not necessarily completely opposed to the idea of certifying something Run as a plan take rather than a co up is always the workers are treated wealth and one of the other things I do like if there is a if they do run into a plantation system and the workers are fine, everything's good, they attacked with call the social premium. Yeah. So if you are say, there's a chocolate importer called double chocolate view be Ellie, I think it's in the UK and they they sell fair trade talks And they on their site, there are saying that they pay an extra. I think two hundred dollars a ton of cocoa pronoun of cocoa and that's just a social appear. That's on top of
whatever the market prices or whatever the minimum fair trade prices right, whatever's higher, in addition that they pay an extra two hundred bucks right off the top for a ton of cocoa, and that is that doesn't necessarily go right back to the the producer because back to the producers community bright and is used for things like scholarships, water projects, annotation projects like schools, whatever yeah, but it's that social premium is in a day yeah to raising the individual's income erases, the the well being of the entire community, yet well with the idea that this is gonna, be good for everyone's business. Ultimately, well, yeah! That's the thing! That's that's! Where its kind! turns capitalism in on it on itself. Like yet idea that you can democratize through capitalism, is a huge like neo con idea here, and I mean it's true like it, it does work but they're saying, but to do that through a certain measure of marxism right. It's Kenneth, the kind of funny yeah
in the final text, which you already so dimension, was the minimum prices for farmers dear, what they want here is obviously to make sure that the price that the farmer gets is more than the cost of production, because everyone's out to make it a dollar here and there And so they actually take it survey to make sure that the Vienna, the prices round, the money and a couple things like the cost of living costs of production and even the cost of complying with it, the trade standards, so they rolled out in there as part of their accounting as well, and we should say also it is that the to purchase a am a licence for for fair trade. Now it's on the ultimate, I guess distributor the coffee rest or in the case of coffee or the chocolate producer in the case of cocoa purchases whatever and before I think it'll do doesn't for like it was free if you were the actual person producing
there are the raw material that good like the coffee or the cocoa. Yet within a fellow said, you know what we need to charge. You guys a little bit too. So I think that further encourages collapse. Because a small armor and in you know if the opium can't necessarily afford whatever it costs to be in the system right again and make sense. And let's, let's take a second here, Chuck to remind people exactly what the disparities between them. People who eat the chocolate and the people who produced the coca say you were living in Timor Leste, Tee in South Africa in two thousand five guess how much you're annual income will be expected to be well? What am I doing my growing you're, just a graduate another doing whatever you want, but you you're an average. I have a petticoat, see. Ok, you have a petty camper.
Since you live in Timor Leste Tee. I think I'm saying that right left one of the things we haven't seen the right you made four hundred dollars into doesn't five four hundred dollars for the whole year, and to those in five in Malawi. You made five hundred ninety six dollars in Somalia, six hundred dollars in Congo, six seventy five four year a year, while three hundred and sixty five days of labour or a large portion of three hundred sixty five days. I take Christmas, often the petticoat, but right three hundred sixty four days of bring it out you four hundred bucks in Timor Leste. He and the high end in Eritrea. You made a whopping nine. In seventeen dollars in the United States. Five. Ever do you? U S. Citizen spends a hundred and forty dollars a day spent. Yet so that's that's. The concept of fair trade is like you. Have this extra couple dollars
pay it for this, and we will make sure that that guy in Eritrea, yeah different and he's going to benefit- and in fact the whole world will benefit, because there's that hold democratic peace theory where like supposedly there is a correlation between democratization and a decrease in more yeah and belligerents between nations. So who knows it could just be beneficial for everybody Yet in this isn't welfare this isn't give taking from the rich and giving taxing the rich and giving it to the poor. Who you know can't get off the button go work. These are people working very hard at their. Job that you are ultimately benefiting from when you take that step of coffee that your enjoying and its psych,
Did it in our own country, when we started in acting like saying, hey kitchen work in factories, and they should make eight cents a week. We did it here in the fair trade label ensures that wherever your product is coming from around the world that the same things gonna meet happen gets it intervention exploitation, but there still critics. Yet there are definitely critics and criticisms in with fair trade. I mean their legitimate to yet mean now the criticisms about people saying here, shouldn't do this and take care of workers that violates, if Bobby Hansel, people out there to think that more the by general yeah. It's a criticism of fair trade in the fair trade organizations, not of the people who are actually seeing the stuff yeah, basically saying your ignoring the basic tenets of supply and demand in a way because you're you're attaching and inflated price above the market value
without doing anything else right an because it's difficult to kind of. Did these things to market more difficult than than a regular thing? There's been a real focus on things like this: yeah bananas. So in these areas, where you can go coffee and kangaroo bananas, since fair trade is saying hey, if you grow the stuff in you, do it the way we want you to you'll get four times what you know you're getting paid without us right. More people are going too far from cotton to coffee, there's gonna, be an oversupply and that ultimately, gonna drive prices down for everybody right Another criticism is that future generally addresses these go up, so we are talking about and it maybe if you are just a single farmer dislike and want to be in a co op, but I still want to be fair trade. It's a little more the gulf and these collapse dislike anything else. When you get me two people together in a room. There is a possibility for greeting corruption
So some these cops have been attacked for mismanaging fair trade proceeds and supporters say you know what we can only do it, we can we're trying, or We're not thing we're going to solve the world's poverty problems but what we are saying is that we can ensure that these farmers in these co opt in these workers are getting paid a fair wage and up the live on when you each a delicious or drink. Your delicious rustic off- and I guess I ate, though the one that makes the most sent to me is the year- encouraging oversupply on the market and driving down prices for other people in everybody in general year by Adam there, in a really that that could be very easily solved by focusing on other. Works as well. Yeah right now learned it. They say about eight hundred and farmers are benefiting from fair trade right now. I worldwide there was Edison await stand so that its over a million. Now this growing baby,
Yeah I mean there's another thing to the sectors are going to like in the early two. Thousands fair trade coffee grew like seventy four percent within a couple of years smell, so I mean like it's a good way to go if you're a poverty stricken coffee farm year in the depends on where you are, what kind of products are available? It's not like everything you find in your grocery store will have a fair trade option yeah, but it's then presented a market in a real like laid back hippy granola way, and they like, like hey, will put it out there and tell people about it and if they wanted this autumn, there's been no like the day. If you
the same kind of marketing that apply did stuff. That's not produce fairly and applied to fairly traded stuff. I'm quite sure you could generate a lot more interesting. Have people claiming filet. I want fairly traded beef for whatever you people are gonna want that stuff. They just don't know that they want it yet another thoroughly, and I think that there I think that the Ngos who are doing fair trade could do more to diversify excellent. If I'm wrong correct me, someone who's in the field, the unannounced visits
hey speaking of Ngos, our favorite colored cooperative education yeah. They are who took us down to Guatemala and we got to see their handiwork in person and it is good work yeah. They they seek to break the cycle of poverty are using education and I ve got a great model. We, like you, said we seen for Sant, we believe in it, and so we are making a collar. He were plugging forum because they have that, while there need they are looking to triple the numbers students they serve over the next three years, so they gonna need the help of some stuff. You should know listener site, so we got some details for you, folks who of this we're Talkin fifty four indigenous and middle school students threat like right. These students are getting help literally like first hand, help gather getting help through scholarships that cover to wish in school fees and the Youth Development programme that fosters community service in leadership. Among the students right there too scholarship levels, there's a diploma spot,
which is seventy bucks a month yet- and there is an honourable sponsor which is thirty. Five bucks macrosystem cute names at his figure. So when all this is going down, is they want fifty for students sponsored by the end of the year? Nearly twenty thirteen right is there anything greater Josh than finding a sponsor forever understood it now, and we can do it. I mean we have a lot of listeners me a lot of listeners with big hearts. Actually, there is one thing greater: they could cover these students and have a waiting lists for next year, although even better, ok. So this is how you do this guy's. You can go to the website, W W w dot cooperative for education, dot org, you can sign up the sponsor. A child today simply and the donate now button in the top right hand, the coroner s right- and you know what a lot of our listeners have got involved over the years- would go ahead and
gotten one out of it returned ass. Humans is humans. It's a genuinely great organization that we seem like you said, first hand, so we would encourage all of you to go help so that some cooperative for education, dot org you can become either a very acutely named diplomas sponsor seventy bucks a month or an honourable sponsor at thirty five bucks a month, and if you do that, if you sign up for it, let us now. Yes, we want to thank you on their church. Coffins gritted Togo poet cocoa at thanks friends, so ok, hold on what was taken message breaker there and then listener mail, a really good when this week, New you resolutions are very, very difficult to keep get more exercise save more money. What about this? We have a resolution that you can really work with stop wasting time going to the post office that right you standstill,
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yeah how this grief. We got a lot of really great responses on the Greek by gas, while people reached out where I had just had people pass away in her family listen to the pod, guess that weak and help them out- and we always again those things so this John Guys, like thank you for your grief, I guess that help me with a greeting process for my best friend and brother MIKE in his death. He was driving in northern Alberta. December when he lost control of his car after crossing railroad tracks, got hit by an oncoming car and died on impact family flew there from Vancouver and only had a few hours to spend because of some white mishaps. We can't even bring his ashes back with a smiling his ashes. I was not recommended for the end of the Christmas season, so we are planning on having a funeral form without ashes. Luckily, company he was to work, for he was a heavy
mechanic student. At the time he had heard of the news, and there had safely guy personally delivered his ashes to our home. We then flew to Manila on Christmas day right back and Canada on New year's. I haven't felt the usual simply, yet, but I'm sure I'll break down and start borrowing on the sea bus or something which would be super awkward, the first month is definitely the hardest the moment I always the moment I heard the news has been. In my mind, that in a single flower in front of his door, from one of the students are the tears really started. After I saw that guy's and I saw a life in a completely different way. The little things really do count anyway, MIKE was most likely listening to podcast at the time. That's what he does when he buys groceries news on the way the grocery store. Your voices in fact may have been the last he heard knows. Well, there was a frozen pineapple in the crash site
and I know that what is because he loved that stuff. That said, just in case he is listening to the park cast in another life. Could you please do one on pineapples and that would be for MIKE and John We will certainly look into pineapples. My friend then call yeah yeah, hang in there did it's very topical. Imagine going to something like that, but where we can help in some small, tiny yeah thanks for letting us know about that, we proceeded while those selected the best one year and we got some good emails about great yeah thanks everyone who said no, then, unlike
are there so sometimes retouching? We hope we make you feel better. You won t you tell us a story about how we made your family feel that better for you or whatever some Sweden may feel worse, although we should probably here about that to cheer you can I tweet suicide as why escape, I guess you can join assign Facebook. Counselor stuff, you should know you can send us an email to stuff podcast at discovery that come any can join us at our website stuff. You should know or more on this and thousands of other topics how stuff works are com. This episode of stuff, you should know, was brought to you by audible, dot com.
I'm Lord Siegel and I'm hosting a new pod cast serious called first contact each week will have new Onst an emotional conversations about what it means to be human and how technology is changing from engineers coding Botz deserved. The dating Epstein intimate conversations with tat pounders will tackle the ethical issues at a future. Now the Tec is just another layer of our skin listened a first contact with lorries. Single lets me on the high her radio out of an apple pie casts or wherever you get your fight cabins.
Transcript generated on 2020-01-17.