Lobotomies -- brain surgeries to relieve psychiatric problems -- are rarely performed today, but they were once fairly common. Tune in to learn more about the controversial history and practice of lobotomies in this podcast from HowStuffWorks.com.
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I should just comes in long beach together now you know you're in trouble without adjusted. Didn't I do well, sir, you pretty get em feel a great actually chuck. I am glad to be alive, yes, so why? Yes, I think this could arguably pan out to be our greatest podcast ever knew distinctness. No, I really don't think that truck. I did the cheek think twice before this one to his kind enough to do the second time and I dont think we ve never had a topic that chuck or more intensely interested in than this one guy just came out of nowhere and is really well not unaware, coz its historical, but in our eyes,
which, if money, I say in our eyes what yeah little foreshadowings, Charles Bryant NICE one shot. If you will get off of Ella cats for a second and go check, your itunes you'll find that the title of this one is how the bottoms work yes and its origin to be talking about. The bottom is so fascinating. It really is libitum he's kind of exist in this little lamb segment of twentieth century culture met. Gold madness. I guess you could say right right and pop culture cause you still here it being thrown around like boys. My legitimize me scramble my brain, but it's kind of exactly the way it happened. Yes, yes, a check, your lover of great cinema right, of course. Of course, you seen one flew over the cuckoos Nestor. I have a poster. You do yeah Goodwin, yet the one eject Nicholson laughing with the lounge cap on yeah. That's a good one,
Of course, you remember the the pivotal seen movie, where Mcmurphy is some lobata mine for being unruly, tries to owners hatchet because ratchet nurse ratchet hatchet thousand forty in separate there it was. She was a hatchet, so, who she was mean and totally with you. It was a forty and slip part they got me. I had like eight jokes going ahead. It wanted to know if I can say that I can say that I can say that the terminator yeah scanning for passing this exactly right here. So yet so he tries to kill nurse ratchet because she is a terrible nursing cannon. Oh yeah, very evil, and so he gets libitum eyes and they don't show the procedure. Don't worry if you ever want to know what one was like we're going to go into grisly detail ran it and he comes out this kind of this drooling imbecile, awful, which I have to remind everybody, was actually of medical term
for it was, was imbecile more on an idiot were all degrees of mental retardation, while that weird yeah, of course, as is at the same time that people were performing botany so's, seems like very archaic. Even there wasn't a longer yet will it set the scene? Okay, so we're talking the nineteen thirties rights and the nineteen thirty three terrible time to be nuts. Basically, you got locked up in straight jacket, yeah to keep you from eating your own theses or throwing their orderlies or doing anything really crazy here, and that was about it right. They had a certain numb. Certain techniques like shock therapy right. What are they use? They still in shock therapy here and there actually
Well, you have like electoral convulsive there right right and you had. Apparently, they also use use insulin, ok, insolent right. We know how bad that is from my. I can remember one of our aging podcast right right and they would basically inject a hefty dose of insulin into a patient too
He took my paper. Rustling is going to get the raft Jerry Data, the way they know use crib sheets buddy, I'm so they inject a patient with a healthy dose of insulin and down would basically shock their system, possibly causing convulsions. There is another drug resistant justice. Do them all that I'm gettin in that this is their faces part. This is this was the grasp that medical science had on mental illness at the time right, there's another drug call. The measures are which was a respiratory and dumb circulatory stimulant in hefty doses it to produce shock and convulsions. So if you ll notice all three of these produce convulsions shock therapy in the reason that they did, that was because there is a suspicion that there is a link between epilepsy convulsions and men.
Elvis and that, if you had one you couldn't have the other. Rather by producing convulsions, they thought that they were treating mental illness while unbelievable yeah. So you can just had epilepsy in that they would sit you any electoral convulsive shock therapy chair and to treat you yet they stick a little paddling your mouth, turn on the jewish state. What man I like! I sometimes look back and say why the nineteen fifty that would have been called with back then, but then hear stories like this, and you can forget about the downside, yeah easy to use Finally, one of the downside necessary so that another problem with this is that over the mental alarm, mental care, how did you had about me little video? You know I had to
However, they are all jack that night the yet that this state of mental hospitals in the? U S in the in the thirties and Fortys was that they were overcrowded right, because I mean, if you can't treat anybody really, you can't treat their mental illness where they come in there in yeah. They want. The docile patients they wanted people, it didn't cause trouble and really anyway, that they can get. There was kind of ok at the time, and this right- and this was also before drug therapy- was created right so in the thirties. Nineteen thirty six, this new procedure comes about a right. Well, nineteen thirty, five I was a thirty five. Thirty six and Portugal managed during five you right, yeah, sorry about that get out was the doktor Antonia, a gas monies nice and doktor meta lemme in Portugal perform the first phlebotomy spy drilling holes into the skull.
On the other side, the prefrontal cortex and injecting alcohol in there to destroy the fibers Fouquet selected in that this is actually based on an earlier study from nineteen thirty three by a couple of Yale researchers who The prefrontal cortex is from a pair of monkeys, yeah Lucy had now those yet on. Binkie will say, listen thinking here. These two monkeys, Heather Prefrontal, cortex, court taxes removed and down the researchers found that they could still be. Had intellect my, but they were lacking the emotion that lead to violent outburst when they didn't get their way tacky. By the way I like binkie better. Can we stay with thinking here? Ok, so these the doktor, the port
get a footman Carlyle honor you go back to Portugal, yeah Doktor Moonies, yes saw Fulton present one of the veal research, so potent present his findings and he thought her right. My mental patients actually gum monkeys in a violent outburst when they do You know my when they see things that aren't really their right to. Let me get my hands on a cadaver and see what I can see working work out with rain. So this early this early yeah. That was called the prefrontal about me right started out, like you said, by drilling holes in the school man adding alcohol. And the whole reason why check that the prefrontal cortex, why the frontal lobe? What's so important about that? Well, the prefrontal low, the cortex Josh has number of complex functions, called executive functions, whether now we're Talkin high level decision, making planning reasoning, understanding, personality ex personal expression that rising the basically your purse.
Reality. The way you create things the way you see the world and how you react to the world grassy emotions right. This is all this result generated here: its origin, in the final accordingly were stabbing the front of your head right now. Yes, the languor him thanks and so that, as we all know, that the brain is connected saw connected together. Sure rescinding in receiving signals like like mass email, So what you have here, you got two types of matter: gray and white manner: grandma includes neurons and brain cells and blood vessels, and things like that white Man, is axons and new fibres and they connect the gray matter and carry messages with electric impulses. So gray matters where these impulse, generated light matter translates Omar transfers them be transmits one of the treaty so our bottom you, what that does, is its intended to several
white matter between the different areas of grey matter, thus interrupting near the transmission ownership rights and the problem with the doktor monies technique. The early technique using alcohol is, like you said: the brains are connected and alcohol being. It is kind of hard to keep him one played right, so I started to go and destroy other areas. The average rate of academia buddy, onto something he. He was understanding by destroying the white matter right, yes, so unsteady decide below more precise any he kept with the whole drilling method. Society based on an ancient ancient method, a brain surgery called trepidation right which actually, what cash a wicked and be in trouble. Here we had a fan right in and suggest, trepidation
That's what got me on the bottom is in the first place, and I apologize if you're other listening. Oh you don't remember. The faint you nameless fan is love you binkie thanks thinking or Becky, hello friends. I want to tell you about love book, the very easy way to personalize a book to someone you love in three easy steps. Logbooks helps customers express the sentiments that may be difficult to say out loud for some of us looking in anyone's particular direction, users can create characters that look just like themselves and the recipient right down to the outfits and accessories customers have the option to personalize each page as much as they like, but the express option creates a complete book with just a few clicks. Low book now offers a membership programme as well. You receive a free book when you sign up fifty percent off any additional books, unlimited free digital books and discounts on gift, rap and other products. Love books are the perfect gift for all occasions or just because so right now,
can check out love books. By going to love book online dotcom, slash crush. You will receive a special twenty percent discount, that is, it love book online, dotcom, slash crush! Ah, yes, actually in the article how about amaze work? There is a cool relief from a Herodotus Bach painting of some early physician, trepanning a patient and he's got like little segment of the skull lifted off in the brains exposed in each is poking around in there. But ok, so he still doktor monies are still using the drilling method right, but now is inserting instruments in their breath inserted this one that sounded like It is a handle with a little Lupi wire that comes out, but our tracks look at home. Yes, when you, when you push it, when you pushed down the back of the loop, extends out, you can pull it in this, basically remove hunks of prefrontal cortex white matter right
that's exactly what hopefully white matter again, you'd think and it was successful right. Well, yes, Sir, two to again to varying degrees and maybe not again, they think this of her son. We said that, but yet the villa bother me was successful to varying degrees, very, very degrees, but there was this guy who went and saw. Doktor monies perform one of these here. This work, it's good and Guy was named Doktor Walter Fremont in four, probably about what fifty thousand people- in the? U s alone, this meeting between these two men was the worst thing that ever happened in the history of humanity. Because it's about how many people were legitimize between four about over about a seven year period in the? U S was just seven years yet, while nine to fifty six, while others,
heavy work. So then there's many many more actually, but yet the Doktor Walter Freeman became an immediate evangelists. He was called for Lobata me right. He he tried. Moonies is technique air with it with a partner and did it successfully for awhile with, problem is, is it was still surgery right? It required a surgeon to do it. Operating room right. Freeman was actually not a neurosurgeon using urologist right. Aesthetic yeah. So there there were some some drawbacks to infringements of pink right, expense being one of them time and resources. So he created something. That was a lot handier lot easier in a lot quicker, and that is what we call the trans, orbital or ice pick.
Bottom right cancer. Can I say that says: yes, he determine that if you took something which is technically garden or bitter classed, but it's really looks like an aspect that you said it yesterday on webcam. Pick- you call it arose by any other name exactly so you put this ice pick over Eyeball, but under the the bone there, what's it called. Between the eyeball, an eyelid but Obama into the back of the orbital right. So once you get to the back of the audible orbital bone, there's a little resistance there. It's bound to enter a little silver hammer, and so he distinct on that thing until it cracks through and then he's gotta, pretty clean passageway to the front cortex yet, and so you ve got a nice big, stick out of your eye. He he scrambled up a little bit want it's in there
Any does the same thing on the other side yet and that in ten minutes later here about my slowly, so he do both sidetrack right. He got a kind of good at this doctor. Freeman got really. I guess you could say get at this, rightly very fast in one two week period in West Virginia, he performed the bottom is, and two hundred and twenty eight people there and then one day he performed the bottom is on twenty. I've, patients right one day and one day so he's just basically bringing a man in Cinema is exactly doing actually read an interview with one of his assistance at the time, and he said he would literally not take breaks as the patient left. The another one would be brought in ten minutes later them, analytically meant yet he before it does us he doesn't use anesthetic. He knocked him out. Electroshock right, so making use of two extremely primitive? And yet I
techniques right time and the result was like we said very I mean it ranged anywhere from people being satisfied in Reno, seemingly successful, like a highly emotional people, suicide all the sudden being more docile and not so worried to death and people rendered vegetables litter so the old down the map, Doktor Friedman, actually referred to the bottom ease informally as sole surgery yeah. I hate that reason why it is because he was basically removing what kind of what makes us human people can still function under a successful about me. People could still function, they could still talk. Writing they were doing anything about bringing an end to the table. There is no reason for them. Do exist so much anymore. Either personality surgery exactly rising and that he will die. He did it
and so fast it some so often, and he hated much of the show me into on tat. He basically did he had a libitum obiang. Yet in which he performed demonstrations re he toward the country, one all over the place. I think he ended at doing estimates run from two thousand and five thousand miles between nineteen forty, six. Nineteen sixty seven Trans orbital libitum is in twenty three states right. U s right! You performed with both hands. He would stick the icebergs and with both hands at once to add a little flare but showmanship. Yet so he was basically performing shows about me shows and not. Everybody reacted. Well! Do these right that there's seasoned surgeons who had seen tons of gold,
and blood and horrible things in their lifetimes with vomit. Watching these things some had to leave. There was a nurse whose account I read of watching Lobata me said the when he moved the ice picks back and forth. It made the sound of tearing clause. Later on in the USSR, which actually banned the bottom is- and I think nineteen city agree at nineteen. Fifty three four we did witches is embarrassing, yeah well loved. Fourteen years before we did right, yeah, yeah, a physician name, Nickolay or sir and ski or the rescuers rescue thinks there are also asking authorised he. He called. He said that the bottom is violate the principles of humanity in change. An insane person into an idiot again, remember a minute medical terms at the time, so that I imagine that there is something that affects. Did you
Were you a human being like a real human being re, seeing this this rough, violent, misguided or unguided procedure yet being performed that it would affect you in some way, like some very prime, a party view would say, that's not supposed to have right. Plus there was no official scientific basis for this. It was basically hey. Look at the result. In some cases, but that it is,
but they were kind of basing this whole thing on and also as we were saying about, Freeman being a showman in doing it so fast, there was one visit to a mental institution in Iowa. I don't remember what year was, but free men killed three people in one visit yet and one of the people so awful he was doing. This will show a thing with the two picks it wants, instead of as his own procedure dictated one and then the other side right, he was doing to pigs at once. So the patients on the table with two ice pick sticking out of his eyes and Freeman says I'm gonna take a photo of this step back to take a photo. One of the ice pick slips and kills the patient instantly right. So apparently, Freeman was said to have basically just packed up right then moved on to the next place, without missing a bead or say I cheese that state pact at all about a model
yeah. You know one person he'll about my stuff. I know you do he the bottom Ized John F Kennedy, sister Rosemary Doktor, Freeman dated nineteen, forty one rosemary twenty three years old and an early on her childhood. She was the shine easygoing, they say, but as teenager shocker, she rebellious and moody, which It struck me a lot of these cases, as so many of them were just normal. Human emotions, like anything from post, pardon depression to you now, overactive child in
as an I afterward was rendered. Basically she can speak. She had the mental capacity of an infant can controller bodily functions and the candy family. Basically, from that point on said that she was mentally retarded, which they claim that she may have been before. But who knows, those even took one another guy Howie Chuck and I have a shared hero season, indomitable, a three hundred and fifty pounds, six foot, three bus driver who has this gentle tender personality right? This name is Howard Dolly and at the age of twelve Howard, dully met Doktor Freeman under unfortunate circumstances, meaning Doktor Freeman had a couple of ice pics on
meaning Doktor Freeman had a couple of ice pics on him when they met right and dumb Howard ended up under Freeman care because of a stepmother right, shut yeah. Here it was the kind of the classic story. The father get remarried stepmother, who is not very patient and understanding. With her sign that sounded. Like you know, He made them Lorraine, bumptious, but what twelve? Your boy isn't? I think you have some good notes. Actual notes were yet well in infringements notes that dully turned up later and we should say our dully created this great radio peace, that zone and pr you can actually find by typing a mile.
Autonomy in Google. I think it's the first thing that comes up rights every one of the most amazing things you ever heard where he just goes in retraced. His steps of his lobata me that he got venues twelve right as you get to the bottom of what happened. We typically don't recommend people go. Listen to other things that it's not us, but that's how good it is right that yet exactly it is that good, it's way better than actually answer, but he finds the Doktor Freeman notes on his case and apparently a stepmother played her case to get him lobata amazed by pointing out that he day dreams a lot and when you ask him when he's daydreaming about he says I don't know right eye, he doesn't want to go to bed and where he does, he sleeps well Bracket and my personal favorite. He turns on the lights in rooms, win there's broad daylight streaming in unbelievable. That kid deserves a la bottom yeah, but one of the things. I think one of the reasons why
now. Both look up to Howard Doyle was because he had has wandered his whole life. How different would he be? Writing? I lived hard and fast as a younger man. I have drawn days now right here right here, identical they actually way way harder faster. So I put up oh, I have often wondered You know how much sharper would I be had. I not live like that right, but this is my doing it with my own choosing Chief Howard, Dolly, had to think that same thing like is there something wrong with me? Is a part of me missing through no choice or fault of his. We should also say that when Howard Stepmother found that he was not a vegetable You just got about a house and he became award of the state. Yet so he went in all around Jane of Lady yeah yeah so again in the end finds you know they're. There really is something wrong with him he's a pretty terrific person is as easy as it turned out
We are not right, took him a long time now and he battled addiction and various forms of mental illness is alive after this, and I think going this special that air and he wrote a book and went talked to his father after forty years. He actually finally smoked his dad about it and that seems to have been the thing to get him over the edge to not feeling like a freak anymore ass. He called it yet even actually hear him working it out in my libitum, yet the big deep voice, they sense can like Alzheimer, not seem shepherdsons once again, big Lebowski same Elliot's, Emily yeah. Three reminded me of the dude here. He also that big mustachios were like saying: oh yeah, the handlebars biker must step up its anew here and you want to keep growing your team, but you need the right tools to help keep your hiring streamlined, inefficient and that is where zip recruiter, dot com slash stuff comes in.
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the criticism of it because they found that there were libitum icing criminals. There will of autumn icing soldiers from world WAR two because criminals against their will sometimes right, but they all about my soldiers because past were overcrowded veterans, unbelievable, and so that that was kind of gaining steam and then the introduction of Thorazine, basically was gonna. There is very little everything. I believe that somebody said Thorazine was to the treatment of schizophrenia. The insulin
I'm sorry that penicillin was right in the treatment of infectious diseases right, which is a pretty big comparison, yet became so thorazine was developed in nineteen fifty and as it began to fall into widespread use lobata. These kind of fell out of widespread use and Doktor Freeman himself. Here he had one last one when less the bottom in nineteen sixty seven kill the woman with a brain hemorrhage inhabited the third try, I think her. Third, let me and she wasn't justino. Some mental patient in Iowa is a housewife and out when she died of a believer hemorrhage after the procedure that third procedure, that was it he was banned from surgery. Preventing any kind of surgery? From that that point on and actually spent the rest of his days until he died and nineteen seventy two travelling, the country Camper was held under using it
If it was his the bottom of Veal Hyaena, he wasn't pity I was actually going around trying to find his visiting all patients rights to prove that he had done. Good Rennie had done some good in a couple of of cases. In several cases I imagine his first one was a woman can remember. First, they move Zionist, go and she she was violently suicidal, is described by her daughter and afterward. She went on to live a happy fulfil life yeah, but you know everyone. Every successful case I read about, they would say things like they weren't they suicidal anymore, and they were just now, can a happy, but it still seems to be that it's wrong, but no one's home thing like the couple the myriad ever Palmer of you. Yet though, the married couple is that the husband had his wife about allies
You saw marshal and ass. You smell idle is well here and she says she's happy the clam and he was satisfied. He said that she came home and she Cause any more trouble and she was just happy and she could still backtalk. Yes, she could still cooking clean and do everything she could do before and she agreed had it been worried about thing since then, and she's in our aid is, but in a heap he acted. Emotions are normal mood, swings or normal. It's agree, but I do. I do think that there is a certain threshold. If your violently recital you know- maybe Lobata Me- was a better option.
I also want to know what the criteria for all this was back. Then there wasn't any sir here so that your pipe and smoke is one of the most unsettling fittings. One of the most unsettling things that I found from this article is that lobata these are still performed today here in England right. The UK is one of the few countries where it's it's not recall. The bottom is his libitum. Is such a horrible stigma attached to it right for good reason, Neurosurgery for a mental disorder in M d here and today, apparently, they use em arises guides to be more precise, but pretty much. This type of surgery, psycho surgery is called, is pretty much the same thing,
destroying white matter Canadians and year, removing people's emotional cell right, I mean there may be something to do that, but certainly it was so nonspecific in non technical to jam on aspects and in just blindly move them back and forth rider. No wonder that was all kinds result: yeah the chuck. We are both kind of nuts and I'm really glad it's not like nineteen forty cents, because we are in trouble fire life Emily and I would be on the lookout imitating living. I drive you to see the Freeman thanks
Let it be said for the bottom is Buddy yet Anchorage people to go out and listen to our Dolly's radio show there still a great deal of legal and joined this when you can read all about the bottom is on ass the words that come. You know what to do. You know any search, bar, etc and Chuck, let's, let's hawks and out of it audible that gun okay. So if everyone goes to W W w dot, audible, podcast outcomes, less stuff. And sign up to give one free download from audible. That comes fifty thousand plus titles of your books and accommodating spoken word speeches pretty much anything, you can listen to his right there Yes, I was on their browsing I just this morning and I found one of my all time: favorite books, fourteen ninety one by Charles Man, given
The man runs around the Americas, basically to archaeological sites and gets the scoop on the most recent findings in finds that there were way more people in the Americas before Columbus, showed up. Then we realising any others a lag between the arrival of Columbus. You have been Yola and the second wave that followed within the next fifty years. The second wave founded It was a virgin territory. There is almost no one. There turns out it's because about a hundred million people died of smallpox from Columbus's first arrival loud between then and the second, wave its fascinated? That's many! So like their age, we will do. So it on a bigger, said: yeah. What about even yeah, recommend quickly. Stephen Colbert of the Corbett report points I saw his portrait is national
report eurozone recently. It was also with his familiar scowl, yet another guy. So yeah. He has a very popular book that he reads himself called I'm an american, and so can you and that's all. I need to say that yes, hysterical So we can get either one of those tables for three. By going to W W w dot, audible, podcast, dot com slashed, in signing up, and that is audible right. There baby. Listen, listen! I met Mr Virgin's gonna call this. We got a lot of great feedback for the high to sponsor. But we're gonna have probably like three PA guessing thrilling region I can bring back. Is ok so I'm just going to call the intelligent listener mail, because I max is a smart guy and I, like least most of all.
I'm a graduating senior in the business college, but when I'm not class or listening to podcast, I almost always enjoy listening to philosophy, more or less my passion. More specifically, I'm interested in world religion. Medical metaphysical theory and man's relationship, the nature and the universe. So the skies, obviously smart, every to say that does foreign server any other man made chemical compounds is not occur. Naturally, your speaking with the basic assumption that something different in nature and fortunately for you can find themselves above nature and importance or authority. This is not the case. It's our western, culture and religion that strengthens its point of view. Man didn't platinum, There is a separate and flawed phenomenon and a stupid natural universe. Man came out of nature and is nature. Man is the universe. The bar codes my favorite philosopher Alan, wants in your seeing your hearing, you're talking, you're thinking, you're moving, you express that which it is
which means the sun and other stars so to perceive yourself, is something different, is only an inability to identify yourself with the cosmos, so Josh Man's manipulation of him compounds is really the world's manipulation of itself or perhaps the universe manipulating itself, and that is certainly a natural occurrence boom, and that is what happens when I, and we say something made right, nice. What's the guy's Maxineff exit, my loss? If it is cynical, we dig you max and are we really dig anybody who sends us something, especially if it is intelligence that if you want to show off your giant, his brain, send an email to stuff podcast. How stuff works that
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Transcript generated on 2020-01-28.