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Welcome to study should now has the floor. Extend a welcome and Pakistan Josh Clark with these eyes, Charles Debbie Shop, Brien's primary and we're regarding this study should now the aggressive version he did a dude. Are you tired, runs out human? was rather puppy up, I'm not almost out of here with just like the middle of my day. He reorganise like ten, and then your can Saturday, I'm working Sunday. Sorry, you found that's right Chuck. Yes, just do you

remember. When we talked about brainwashing, we did a brainwashing one night yeah I enjoyed them. I did too dear Mary. We talked about the Koreans, brainwashing american pew, daddy. I that's against the rules, the rules, There was a war, more examples. Ok, do you have you ever heard of the Dachau massacre the Darfur MAX. Yes, yet you have the Dockers massacre, yeah yeah! Well, I'm in its secretly told me everything or using shudder and right yeah? I didn't realize the connection, and yet the flashbacks worldly, in order to cabrioily-

the army in their at this concentration camp in their shooting the german guard. Yet that actually happened. How really? Yes, at Dachau, the american liberators who came late payments Oleson like were apparently so overwhelmed by the fatal, lined up the S S officers are against the wall, seventy five of them and shot him. I guess I didn't know about it, then yeah, so they didn't come out until two dozen one, actually that this actually happened was covered up ignored, but it was against the rules committee our great member that one year, not in the news, I those against like six or seven different rules in all these are there against the rules of war right. It's actually kind of to me a triumph of the human spirit to know that their we ve tried to figure out how you create structure right insanity in a chaotic in insane.

Pollution. That's when we look at it what's another way how well what I was the most struck with. Was that how messed up it is that you have to keep revisiting this over the years, because all of these rules that are in here there, because someone tried to do something awful to someone else, and they said you can't do that more right incident in they said. Oh well, then the think of something else offer we can do right in this way. You can't do that now either. Why, in this article, the Julian row, how the rules war work, she makes the point that, as the technology of war progresses usually means that were going, we are figuring out more horrible ways to inflict damage on one another, and so, as that happens, is technology progresses leave em people

who oversee the rules of war, are trying to come up with new ways to stem that re aggression, but yet that's a little mope your way of looking at it in mind. We are clear, usually them up here when tat, usually interest. I'd checklist talk about the rules were where they come from. How long have they been Well, they ve been around for a long time, but prior to the nineteenth century, they were established per battle in poor countries. Supporting in that battle, and that was where they ended there like for this skirmish, where we can do this this initial, but you can't do this, isn't this once that skirmish was over or once at war was over, but then they would say right for forget all that men and less to stir will make of a new set of rules right. We find

the next time they were like no scalping. There was the last time, do not scalp innocent. Finally, at some point well, actually we know exactly the point in eighteen. Fifty nine, a guy named Henry demand, who went on to found the Red Cross and was one of the key, was the co recipient of the first Nobel Prize. I understand I really am came upon a battlefield after the battle of cell of fairness in ITALY in eighteen. Fifty nine, the bell of us out of them. Yes, Chuck dry, that's german and italian, and one part ass. He came upon this battlefield. I guessed right after the battle happening. There were all these dying wounded soldiers lying around and he great he gathered up the villagers around the countryside too. We have to treat these people and treat everybody both sides because for human beings and that what we do

one of the things that the Red Cross still does today in wars, there neutral party might not on either side the Red Cross and Red Crescent and they treat everybody. Regardless of what side there are unsure that happened in eighteen, fifty nine it gave birth to the Red Cross. Anna gave birth to the first Geneva. Mention right, yes- and I think I told you at some point- we are talking about this- that the told the convention aspect of it kind of me up a little bit always picture like a bunch of world leaders with their name tags hi. My name is Keyser Urville Hombre Molin about Summer Hilton Conference room. Imagine the talk with them. But with the First Geneva Convention is when they sit in eighteen. Sixty four at the jury said

They started becoming an international thing with it crossed boundaries, it crossed the time frames and there were solid rules for everybody for anywhere they were disdaining rules of war at six, more sympathizing short and the first step. Firstly, the convention produced the convention for the amelioration of the condition of the wounded and sick and armed forces in the field that was first went forth. Like you said over time. As we saw new atrocities take place, they went and created an amended. The existing conventions created new ones, so there was a convention that addressed sick shipwrecked members of

forces at sea air. They forget the seamen and the first one, and they said Eric. I think, about this guy, exactly there's other rules can governing the treatment appear. Debbie is now and then the fourth convention, which is ratified. Nineteen. Fifty four was the treatment of civilians, not surprisingly, shortly afterward to yeah. Actually, after world war, two that drove the live with the First Geneva Convention and actually the first three or I'll created before What war too near and people were like. That's really nice. We like that's great idea and then we were to happen in everybody behind the table under the auspices of the U N and said we we need these. So a hundred ninety countries have ratified the Geneva conventions and you get the impression that if you want to be recognizes sovereign nation internationally, that's one of the steps toward toward being an independent nation as yet to ratify the Geneva convention there. I was, what are you doing.

You'd do some rope, jerk jerk country, so that the Geneva conventions and we'll get more into those later. But there so everyone's heard, the Geneva Convention, not many people heard of the Hague conventions, although they should there are just as important there were there in the Netherlands, is where these took place and they were called. The M also called the international peace conferences. Yet about the same time that the Geneva conventions are me yeah. They had won in eighteen. Ninety, nine nineteen o seven- they were gonna- have won a peace conference in and they decide to cancel it and have a world war instead, and those were one obviously, and they, the Hague Conventions the categories of combat weaponry, property rights and duties of neutral countries, but

In addition, so a lot of the latter. The rules established in the Hague conventions are similar to the the rules of the Geneva conventions. They overlap, but one or one of the things that defines the Hague Convention specifically, is that there are steps outline to prevent war yeah right. So there's two in the lead up the build up toward their steps. You have to take two to be instep legally with the Hague conventions, which are armed, there's like a thirty day, cooling off period of time out, right, arm, arbitrage and media. Liberation. Now sorry, those in exile committees of inquiry yeah. Basically, you have to also declare war. Formally or you have to declare an ultimatum. Saying like give me back my sandwiches and pull your troops out of my south asian territories or I'm gonna come at you and that's after they ve gone through all the previous steps, the thirty day time out

in the corner and everything else has failed. Then you have to officially sent to evade saying we're going to attack you at some point. Ninety distantly surprise attack illegal per harbour, an action. I would say it legal right. That's illegal hire you in that one of the reasons why they, the democratic peace theory, works out all that about so democratic peace. There is based on the idea that democracies are especially democracies that follow these conventions are so transparent that t democracies will never go to war because of a fine. This same transparent steps in the lead up to re again and communication will be much more open on what one of the view that a surprise attack is impossible, not only illegal but impossible because they have virus independent media,

right. So it's a democratic peace theory says that to democracies will never go to war. I dont others necessarily true, but it based in part on this Hague Convention gotcha thanks server combat and weaponry, and the Hague conventions they're, pretty obvious things like you can't fly a white flag then shoot someone in the face which apparently iraqi soldiers than two thousand through in the? U S invaded not very nice, not illegal, cannot if a person has surrendered or is injured, then that's it for them. He can't go shoot them in the face and you gotta treated well we'll get to that in a minute to if a person has a vision or an audible speech impediment. If that's what you are, you came a jacket, defenceless person. You can't like attack a hospital or a building being used as a hospital knows what they call using a human shield. There's a huge, no, no answer,

that's big time, jerk quality right their national at and see. This is what I was kind of interesting. National and cultural symbols are protected. So right you can't desk the flag or use the enemies flag like dress as a soldier and say I'm really nazi, even though others He's always did stuff like that. We avail it's illegal, fascinated sensible, but it's illegal near the whole movie. They were dressed up, we'll knothole movie that a significant portion of nearly dresses nazis to kill Montes, really awesome shock. You also can't hide our museums or libraries. Well, yeah. You can certainly can bomb just like I just like a hospital, their protected as well. The tractor, more about later and their certain weapons, you can't use the Higgs specifically says the right of belligerents to adopt me.

Of injuring enemy is not unlimited right near. Basically, you can't use poison bullets. Now you can't use poison gas here. He is weapons that are designed. To inflict further harm beyond the initial injury yeah like those bullets that once they get inside of you, start doing all sorts of wacky things for further damage. They have the boat ties. It's been around laughing. Chemical and biological warfare is immediately go all the way back in eighteen, eighty, nine, seven gas imploring gas mustard gas, all those are old, timey poison gases smallpox. You can't do that, so we are talking about wounded and sick. Basically, the Hague Convention spells it out pretty clearly if you're wounded in yours or if you see us another soldier in enemy, that's wondered her sick. You gotta help him yet and wage policy about at this point that you can. You can break down the Hague in Geneva conventions by like combat weaponry,

treatment, civilians or you can look it up the rules for overarching as they apply to the different groups involved. Here. Any group with the least amount of protection are active, combatant right yeah. Once you be once you're injured or you're, sick and you're, no longer capable of fighting you slip into these or wounded soldier category New suddenly enjoy far more a protections. Then, if you have a gun you're coming at somebody We are not like I said. Not only, can you not shoot the guy in the face you you have help them, or at least allow them to be helped by, like the Red Cross Right, an chuck like you can't just walk away right now like after about you, can't just walk away from the battlefield, every one you can't just released the Chaus, which did you know that this would childcare recently bread for in China. I did not know they would release among about funding to the throats of survivors, real, yes, some other suckers or so a puppy and mean to her or east. Have Charles. Actually there not me so

but they are protective. We're Henderson damage true, but you can't release the channels on the battlefield, but not only that you can't just walk away from the better for you. You have to help injured soldier, you gotta help at the injured and you gotta clean you play. You can't leave the deadline or out everywhere. No as mere fact, you have to give the enemy soldiers at you. Ve killed a burial, that's appropriate to their religion, you're supposed to be here, to end at the beginning of every war, they're supposed to be a grave registration service, which is neutral party like that, the Red Cross and possibly operated by the Red Cross. Where you bury a bunch of soldiers- and you say you- you contact the graves registration service and say there's a bunch of dead soldiers. Here we killed in their buried here and here the coordinates ran. The grace registration

Airbus proviso side with these cords after the worth of the bodies, can be examined and sent home. Why not only that, but yours you're supposed to return or property found on the body. So you can't, like you, see in the movies that, where you go looting the body of of trinkets and things to take home a brooch right, let's say you can't do that. You spoke to mail that to their next of kin, which can wonder about that health and it happens, I want to lose myself by Bobby Brown. Welcomes my podcast beyond the beauty, a new show from Iheartradio Radio, you probably know the founder of the cosmetics company, but I walked away in two thousand and sixteen We have, I learned a lot. I've learned how to build a business I believe, a business how to take chances added a and can just try things constantly trying to figure out how to keep myself healthier and

of a better life. You know why I still have a lot of questions so I'm be sitting down with different people each week that I think we can all learn from Creators of some of the most successful businesses and brands today biggest names and beauty, doctors and health, birds. I admire even, family list. Beyond the beauty and the I hurt radioactive apple podcast or ever you get your hard cash You cannot perform experiments on a wounded. Her sick person like the Nazis, love to do that big one area. That's about it, for the sick and wounded and its biological experiments, but I think also brainwashing sure I was gonna. Firstly, appeared and experiment and you're not allowed to do that either So let's say that you have been caught. You you receive treatment from the enemy. Yes

and they're like? Well, you? Well, now you feel w you still have some pretty wide protections actually yeah. This is a fact that your next cocktail party, that you should pull out of your head pocket you if European W you're a prisoner of the kind We are not a prisoner of the soldier or the protein or the commander in chief of that region. Your prisoner of the United States of America, if that's, who is fighting against America, America, but not only that you're detention is legal under

national law. Therefore, an escape is illegal and can be punished unless you make it to your other side to your side, yet any wipe the slate clean right. It's totally clean, like you, were, never captured in the first place. So if you're, a spy in your caught in your house appear w you're going to be tried as a spy and possibly hanged. If you escape to say in occupied territory, that your army controls, you are you're. Detention is just wiped off the map and, if you're caught again say as a regular soldier near you, can't be tried as a spy. It's like it never happened here and then to think this chemical tumblr name rank and serial number yeah you give off in her that in movies, that is definitely a part of the Third Geneva Convention, but it is not merely four name identification but you are worded privileges. If you are an officer in European W, like you, have to dig village

and it like the private in the corpus. Do you officer you have a little bit of a. Of course, your life, but you get the drink ticket every day and for a nice vodka gives ensure by this, You see other grower, two movies, like the great escape the officers there ways had a little bit better deal then than their men right like they were the ones I couldn T rose. Helen was always meeting with the was with clear, no clink, but the rest of the guys would meet with ICE Hogan because he was that they make the main man degeneracy order for an effort. It's hard to watch organs, heroes ever again. Seen other forgets that movie, though, yes right up your alley, the other thing about Bmw's they are prisoners. Like a civilian, This would be in their innocent until proven guilty, supposedly have to treat a machine

So if you are a capture disappear, w you are, or if your captured, you are required to grant this person Pierre Debbie Status, if you, but the air on the side of caution again later there appeared of yet not, but there is very specific qualifications that you had to classify them if they are obviously members of the armed force, can be a member of a militia or a volunteer corps right still, gotta be appeared of you right. Could be some guy who you who happened to be like carrying a gun out in the open door, and you still have to say we're going to treat you like appear w until we set up a tribunal- and they say no he's not appeared, he's a common criminal members at the media travelling with the armed forces. Really they have to be granted peered ivy status, and about it, crews, merchant marine and civil aircraft are working with our work.

The reasons why the Abu Ghraib and treatment the degradation of Abu Ghraib was so illegal, was because these combatants weren't granted pure w status right off the bat yeah. These captured combatants were treated as criminals. Basically, they were imprisoned. So that's why you can't imprison appeared of you. You can in turn up in an eternal camp. Yes, so they have borders, but not a cell, yes, another one. Unless they are like a specific danger than you can worker Ok, which is by what they said. You can't subject them to degrading treatment and territories. Interrogation basically amounts to you ask him a question in its up to them whether they want to answered or not. If they don't answer, did the new, that's it. You can't ask him again: even they can't be coerced or torture, under any definition of torture, and you can't they they can't their detention, can't be paraded in front of the media

right. There was another thing to you: I'm in your memory, Lindy England, right area, pointing in light did you ever see the mad magazine, learners outwardly Newman in her now has forget. So there are several reasons why our group is oh horrendous Wang. You also have to grant them any any rights that Your own soldiers get like food, water, shelter, clothing, exercise, correspondence like you have to a didn't. You have to let them know exactly where they are and you have to make them available to receive mail from their family. Yet not only do you have the time where they are yet again the mailing address, so that they can return care packages, letters whatever crazy, so shock as Peer Debbie's right yeah, pretty much. Let's talk about civilians. You remember at dawn. We talked about this often. I should say that recently, when we were hanging out with her from Chad, he remarked after

that I had just recently seen the fly David Gothenburg Supply for the first time that he had just seen red down for the first time you. I thought you gonna beat him up. You're going to put him in the face. I just don't understand how you can he's our age, my I get it to, and that was in our ages. Yeah he seems like you should have red dawn long before the that's axing hunting war games. If you were a child like a teenage boy and a right so back to read on Well, ok! So you remember Harry Dean Stainton, where and Charlie Jean come to join, suasion Jean when it yeah, but I can remember citizens out too that there are three possibly, but it was definitely jet in his brother. Here and they go to see their father, who happens to be hurried instead, and turned his in turn notice he's not gonna sell. They put up fencing around the drive in writing and their projecting crop

and up under the screen airplane like russian soviet music. That's legal right yeah when he passes by, I think, are tomorrow's father, whose getting like Joe, Shepherded face that's highly illegal case, the dogs. No, you can't the child. No! No! Charles! In Germany, there is no dogs of any kind when the Russians landed in open fire on the unarmed high school students that highly illegal I mean I just flat out shot up that teacher rumour that year and that kid to there It is another window. There was one of the most disturbing images of my young life Harry impact fancy I wanted to be a wolverine. Oh yes and I guess all little boys I clean war, but I mean I I didn't. I was gonna, be peacenik. Later on, but every time an outside bring it. Gone I'll, go to the Woods Yak of Football in some

I wish there dumb. You could take the video of your life and added I would make a mantle of all the times. I shouted wool like in the World tat. I would do my time it was more than once, I'm so ready. Somewhat on the Soviets, took care of the civilians to a certain extent. Legally and turned others they going back somewhat dogs, but am would say were Darrell's there? The mare riding around with the visa. The cuban commander right right arm why? What rights do you have is just a general civilian who's not been deemed a threat right, let's say, could Darrell's dad talk to their own mom open communication legal while yet it's a basic right that you're supposed to have it, I can't be curtailed if they think that there is could be detrimental effect on the correspond.

But even then they allow they laid a tweet. Basically. Yeah you're not really tweet that they allow you like twenty five words right. This special forms that every occupying force will have four should have that people can fill out to communicate with one another. If, if free speech is curtailed in twenty five of those words have to be free chosen by the person. You cannot be removed to another country unless it's for your own safety as a civilian and you can't bring in your people, is occupying force. You can bring in your civilians to settle that's right now, you're not allowed to do that. Not to do that enough. They can force you to work, but they do have to pay you, and it can't be work like for your military, like against your own country. Right, you can't make me can be made to make bombs that it can be used against your peeps exact, and if you are working and you're not making bombs, you can't be made the physically punish

your own countrymen like right, if your middle manager forced labour rights- and you can force kids too- to work to Morrow and chuck it's illegal to tattoo civilians for the purposes of identification, the yet another when they came forward to area now boy Hitler Ladys went Gaga after that, like with genocide that it never partly on those genocide before that, but after Hitler they No, we can't do this. Genocide thing right suggests a sort of our cultural property because acting as one of the lesser known aspects of these conventions, I know about it until I read the stuff it's absolutely protected. Like your museums, your works of art and science like gum member wants it, statue was toppled. The american forces couldn't do that. The iraqi people did that right, but if the amount, hence had toppled the statue, unlike looted his

I picked up right because, like you said, but the Hague in Geneva Convention specifically outlaw genocide, which is the systematic extermination of the people in much the same way, the Hague commences are like can't you there to their culture either their cultural legacy and not just statues books are included. Scientific achievements are of archaeological areas and then the things that housing things remember. We said like you can't go hide out in a museum or library rank as these are culturally protected. Two year, but it's on the it's on state to provide identification there. Special symbols and it's up to the country to identify these places as such, so they don't get banned right. So what happens if

these rules, it seems like it should be easy, but it's not just getting out of bed and getting your day started, trying to accomplish everything you need to do in your day that to do list as a lot easier when you're getting news stories and music to lift your mood and preparing for the day ahead, get connected to the things that make you laugh and make you think or make you want to reach out and share with a friend every morning with us, it's Elvis Joanne in the morning show listen to us on cue, one or two or anywhere in the world on the Iheart Radio, app Second, I want to follow these roles I wanna do. I should discuss face and even those wounded already yeah. I don't like the way he looks or his daily my girlfriend or those awful things you ve seen in the in the Vietnam WAR movies. When one like the mile massacre, when they just go nuts and to start doing bad bad things, so now

the Geneva Convention, nor the Hague Convention specify what kind of punishment should be doled out how offending party should be charged Ah, they basically say: hey everybody who is like an asylum law. Take these people, the international court and dole out whatever punishment. You think is necessary, so, for example, Effort Nuremberg, yeah before actually the Geneva conventions ratified the the I guess- France, great britain- in the- U S and Russia are formed this international tribunal, where they try these The work and hanged, I think they were executed, eleven of them. My so much the same way. We form tribunals for Yugoslavia. There, the balkan war,

for Rwanda, but it's up to the country that has been offended not offended it's up to the country that has been impact to to do the leg work. To make this happen, like There's not some big general body. This cancer, we heard this happens, we're gonna make sure they get that prosecutor. No, but there is a banning body in the Hague called the International criminal court, and these are that this this body hears these war crimes trials is where you gotta have a war crimes trial. And there is a lot of debate over the legitimacy of this body. Some people want this body to take up more issues than has now they already up and running. Actually I don't think so, but there's a big movement to get it go, and yes,

as one that standing right, that the World Court basically gotcha there, the ethical thing I got one where you anything, I have a little more, but one thing I found interesting gestures is that the these rules don't must apply to the armies but militia in volunteer corps and will go back to read down here. Just for the sake of continuity, if you have a person in command radon, he was that gin sways. He did arrest us all. If you have a representative, the symbol, the moving recognise from a distance, if you spray thing what brings you here, so what they were doing, there were basically cannot put themselves in the corner they didn't realize rat carry weaponry and open. They definitely did that powers booth showed him how to do that with effectiveness. Here's the Pilar yeah he's a guy that crashed in

Can I headed things that for a little while and then they got to follow the laws and customs of war? So if you meet those criteria as a malicious, so if we just formed our own little pack of her house, the forks ruffians, if we that we in you are leader. We carried open Henry and we had our signal would be Bovary. Clearly sure, then we would be subject to the same rules as just like we're an army. Well that forthwith and in particular the little ticklish, because it base says: if you follow the rules of war, the rules of war apply to you yeah. If so, what happens if you dont- and we asked this guy Who'S- a professor of Internationalize- Aims, Michael Matheson. We talked to him actually buy from Nigeria, the George Washington University, and he said we asked him like white. How are these followed like? How are these enforced like? Why would anybody follow these? If you didn't really have to write- and he basically said the idea that

You don't follow on the other person doesn't get it doesn't have to and all of a sudden you can be tortured right or you know you can be attacked by dogs are humiliated, degraded, whatever the slippery slope that forms, if you don't follow the rules of war here, keep both sides in line actually and that their these rules are indoctrinated into the military rules on each side already. So, basically, each side regulates itself in the hope that the other side will neither collar on from what the golden rule, that's right, you're gonna end over that you want to learn more about the rules of war and see what the cultural property emblem looks like. We know where you can find it type rules of war in the search bar. How stuff works that come. Let me now. For the listener mail- gonna call this hand picked by you. You think this is a good one big day,

and it was a really getting male actually was on my list. If so this from Clovis and Clovis had some thoughts on the addiction pot casts that were very relevant, think mates in great points, guys in your pocket, ass, an addiction. I thought you treated issue fairly with a couple of exceptions. First of all, she said that a was radically successful or something that effect. There's. No one really knows how successful it is. It might be success helping someone obtains Roddy for some amount of time, but not be any stronger than a person to cycles out of drinking on their own. Also, a goal of lifelong abstinence is set up for failure. Studies showing that only about five percent of people remain completely absent for the rest of their lives. All this goes on to say, it also seems like you bought into the idea that that was cultivate of our government. That rates rates for the best measure of the harms that drugs,

mission: divorce aside our society. So if use rates are up, that's bad doubt if they're down it's good not quite true use rates, are actually a terrible way to measure the success or failure of a drug treatment and drug policy data would measure the increases in decreases and drug related deaths, disease, crime and suffering things can be significantly measured and in some cases even accurate accurately than self reported use rates, Rates are especially useful. The politicians, the use this court import evidenced use rates or down we're winning. You should increase our budget to help keep this fight. Or use rates or down we're losing, so you need to increase our budget to put his stamp this thing out, so either whether turning it and I guess the point about addiction. That's the point about addiction and treatment. Are society has defined both wait? You rigidly addict

is really drug use plus problems. What do we do for those people who can't use drugs without causing problems the attics? We should give them treatment entreaty be anything that works for them can be a can be heroin, assisted treatment can be knitting, but lessons the death disease, crime and suffering associated with the drug use than it should be considered a successful treatment. In prison cells is about the worst thing we can do with all respect. For this makes that clear, for one of the better emails males we ve ever received. I would say yes, if you have something you'd like to point out to check and I met with maybe around we bought into something you tell us how it is. We always love that rapid up and send it to stuff pod cats.

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