« The Editors

Episode 291: An Utter Disgrace

2021-01-07 | 🔗

Rich, Charlie, and Michael discuss yesterday’s shocking violence in and around the Capitol building.

The Editors is hosted by Rich Lowry and produced by Sarah Colleen Schutte.

This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
The writing at the Capitol and Congress counts. The electoral vote will discuss all this and more on the special insurrection edition of the editors umbrage Larry enjoys, the right honourable Charles See W cook and that ashore, his boot Michael Brendan Dorothy, here listening to a national view, podcast, if this has not cast a NASH, review, dot, comical indirectly in the corner. Where delighted to have you better be easier few that for us few made as part of your feed industry services out there from spot fight, Itunes like what you hear
please consider giving us a glowing five star review on Itunes. If you don't like what you hear here, please forget, I said anything so Mvd images yesterday that we're just hard to fathom that just still astonishing. Just I can't stop watching the videos and the pictures just so hard to believe that this happened and the heart of democracy and the United States of America. The kind of disorder in vandalism that you expect from a third world country right here at home there was stopped steel rally, Giuliani, dont, trumped junior and present himself whipped. Every everyone up, Trump says: hey, let's march, on the capital and show show, are weak Republicans strengthen boldness that they need. The mob shows up breaks in. There have to be a lot of after action about how they
Managed to do this, it should be the most secure building in the United States would make of it. It was an utter disgrace. It was extremely dangerous. You know, We get a nerd to trumps level of bs, but Yesterday he got in front of a giant crowd. And said that the vice president was potentially going to overthrow the american form of government and constitution. And then said like let's go to the capital and show them strength, that is
utterly shocking, and then I mean the business of government stopped at at this highly symbolic time. Remember surely the Congress was receiving the certified results of the presidential election and making them official and they were interrupted by a mob and you and I can see see semi celebrity. Wailing warned fur lined helmet took to the Senate days like As well as a cure, non guy he's a big q, another guy he's got. This figure is not like a random guy he's like a cure, non celebrity and it was interesting, is then Q announced- are passing around photos of him?
From black lives matter, rallies that he's been at as a counter protester and saying all this guy's, a Belem guy he's not one of us he's not one of them agur people, but anyway he em. He took the stage and I have to say my first thought was soon and on other people are looking at America. The way I looked at Turkey in a few years go when there was the coolest putsch, like I'm what witnessing a historic event in which a nation States government is being challenged. In fact, actually Turkey put out at a plus trolling statement saying that they hoped all factions the United States can resolve. Differences peacefully and turkish citizens should avoid crowds. Well, we deserved it. Are we absolutely deserved it, and I just couldn't think I mean that the prime minister of
The United Kingdom, Boris Johnson, put out a statement about you know. The United States is a symbol of democracy. In this scenes and arrests are very troubling. I mean if your uncle a Merkel, you know, and you made this little risky bad. I think it a wicked one too, open up Europe to chinese investment in a way that that's trying to chart this it'll course between the United States and China are you. Bring that decision. After what you saw yesterday, stability in chaos? I dont think you are, and I mean you just showing that a few thousand people can overrun the capital I mean that's that is an insult is astonishing and they went into congressional offices, I mean One rapporteur pointed out, I think, mark ambient her. You know if you
a spy in Washington D C, I mean you could just send them in to the capital with the thumb, drive and own congressional computers. I mean this was very, very grave and as as our own any Mccarthy set on Fox NEWS, Trump incited it. This is I was historic, I mean in some ways I don't want to. Oversell the amount of violence, the woman died and three others omens and three others died of medical complications. Most of the people that went into the capital when, in after the first wave of violence kind of How is the capital please to retreat? Then they wandered eleven had that bizarre spectacle of people filing in and conforming to the velvet rope lines, not not going outside. The velvet applies
walking through the returned. I know it was no use astonishing, but, unlike most of them didn't because most of them just stepped over barricades, lot been knocked down by others and they didn't have to push through any cop. So they worked a lot of them want in that frenzy of disorder, but they work part of this disorderly event an end. I I really think that this was the symbolism of the moment was really destructive? to come to the country. Yet try that some people on the interruption minimize by saying all that people just didn't realize that they just thought they were being invited in right who thinks he can waltz and with no security. It they'll know that x, Ray machine or whatever to into the capital, and there's just these astonishing videos of that the fight to breach security
that's some places. The security can melted away other places. This was a real battle and that there is also the lie out there. These Antigua was involved, maybe they're, couple anti for guys and thereby the these were not these anti for people, see the video says they rush by the police pushed the place out of the way, I break the windows. They're chanting, USA. You know Karen Trump fan of flag, so this is just another element, another instance of misinformation and propaganda, that it is the backdrop to this event and that Donald Trump is Stoke. The last two months Those people are lying. What they are doing is what the die hard defenders of the summer riots dead.
It was mostly peaceful. No wasn't. Are they just patriots who want the country to improve northern up Sometimes you have to do this to effect change. No, you don't anti fur, nor wasn't out they thought the building was open and everyone got in. By smashing the windows and knocking down the doors. They thought. That's how everyone goes into. Congress noted in its was a mob It was a riot, it was an illegal act that was designed to interrupt Congress and subvert the constitution, not save it or improve it back in the summer, when we would do podcast after podcast on riots mobs, I got some emails from progressing
You asked me why, given that I think the American Revolution was worth while I was against these rights. It was a ridiculous question, but I assume those people can now see. Why not This was done by someone. They don't like right is a riotous mobs, mops its It's always wrong unless the aim is actually to overthrow the government and in an extremely Tiny number of cases its right, but if the people we saw yesterday, are trying to overthrow the United States government than they should say so and they will be dealt with accordingly. There is no justification for what happened yesterday. This is not how the system works,
and beyond that, the wrong on the merits. Isn't a matter of well will meet and will debate this, but please don't burned down a building or hurt anyone. That's wrong Too many people are indulging this too many people say while the very angry, ok but they're wrong, Conception of reality is wrong. That claims are false. Aims are untrue. The elect was not stolen, my pencil not doing anything other than his job Mitch Mcconnell is not doing anything other than his job. The United States Congress is not doing anything other than its job, so you have the ultimate insult here, which is illegal behind yeah in service of a lie. There is
no justification, for this sum will come to the president's role in a moment. So anybody else, if you watch, is videos and these people, like legitimately, think a lot of them that this this is the people's house that has been stolen from them on their shouting. This is all her house and is because they, they ve, been told repeatedly by crappy right wing outlets and by the President. I states that the election was stolen and one of us in the most dastardly conspiracy and american history, and if you take that seriously or literally it justifies violent revolution, right and that's why I wrote today in the corner. The trump is morally responsible for what happened. Yesterday I mean he, incited it the day of, and he has been seeding it.
For two months. I mean I said some weeks ago as Pakistan he's playing with nitroglycerin, and I had in mind- and I thought he was his theories- would set off Alone- Wolf type actor. You know the kind of person that tried to shoot up the congressional baseball game four years ago. But instead he activated a giant crowd and you know, as for seriously, and literally I mean, I think, both are at hand. I think they're both people, genuinely believe that.
You know there's this fraud and conspiracy against them, but I think a significant number- and I talk about this in a piece of things going to grow up later today. A significant number of them believe not that there was fraud exactly but that the institutions of american government are implacably set against them. That either- when they voted for Trump. They couldn't get relief, for they couldn't get what they wanted or whatever they believe their error formable in a way that needs in a mirror image of black lives matter right that This idea that the institutions are irredeemably corrupt. And so you know, if the sea I can make a fake dossier to try to subvert resident trump. While I can pretend that might pence KEN,
for some stupid technicality of twelve amendments, which doesn't exist can president again and it's kind of wilful but in many ways calculated rejection of american institutions. It's a SIRI. I think this is a serious growing problem and it's gonna take really intelligent and capable leadership.
To address it because he was going away because one story can you can tell that the top administrations in the insurance of our institutions, the strength of the proverbial guard rails, but they look at yesterday to see how fragile it is and what what's behind what happened yesterday in Theirs Transcript Lincoln about public sentiment. Does everything if you twist and perverse people's minds and what they believe, then everything follows from that. So, let's pause, we get a lot of it more into trumps, conduct responsibility here and what to do about it and are an excitement but extra question. First to you, Charlie. This episode will be remembered for months for years forever. I think, as a practical political matter this world, like almost everything else,
Received fairly quickly in the public imagination, but I think that this is going to be the image of the trump yes, and so, when, in twenty years CNN, does it's the two thousand tens documentary series it will include this on the cover. Immediate This'll be remembered forever, it will be the image like you know. The for National Guardsman Kent State are an image right. It's just going to be burned, to our psyches, and I do think it's you can't unseen it and I think that's a huge problem for Trump for Republic,
ends for America, maybe even beyond America yeah it forever. I've asked this question about very cept, says every last year. Most of them, I can't even remember now, even the ones that I said would probably remember for some for some time, but this is a defining. That's for dream for trumps present see the narrative will be that it was all leading to this, and it is just as the shameful episode and will blight than the memory of of President Trump literally forever so Charlie, let's get now to what what to do about it. So for small, we I say when he saw things happen. Well, the responsibility is further: the writers themselves or the shooter and himself or whatever it was. So. How do we do we think about how we
a cape responsibility and in this instance, where I think we can distinguish between responsibility in a criminal sense and the behaviour of the president in a moral sense, does the president's behaviour meet the Brandenburg standard? No, should the President of the United States behave differently, given the office he holds, and the purpose of that off Absolutely- and I would say this came very close to incitement, in a way that a newspaper column in store political speech usually does not. I think that, irrespective of the behaviour of the mob, the things that trump
said in an off themselves, are impossible. I dont think that Trump, needs to have inspired a mob to go into the capital. If every single person listening to that speech and to everything that he is sad since November third had said. Thank you very much, sir. Your eloquent oratory we're going over the road to pray now. He still would be culpable still would be deserving of our opprobrium and in a different age. He'd be close right now to be taught, in fact,
this is tyrannical language, MRS tyrannical behaviour. Now I don't believe that yesterday showed that the United States is fragile. As you said a few minutes ago, I think it shows you upset. I think it shows that the institutions are strong, that the majority of the people who run the market that the rules not only in place but are being executed. And I suspect that if we see opinion polling on this, we will learn that Americans are appalled. Americans of both parties opposed this and that the president's approval rating we'll drop even further authority down ten.
Points, but the system doesn't have to be in real danger for us to exercise the tumor and the president has now made it clear that he sits outside of our hence in far more than just a rhetorical sense and from from a conservative perspective, leave aside America for now it would be good if his party made that clear again and again, he tweeted yesterday that the gene appears the law and order party is it He certainly not that's gotta mean Something is not for the law, the laws,
you lost the election he's trying to stage a coup he's not for order. He could not bring himself until absolutely push to condemn what had happened and if the papers of it to be believed, he didn't understand why he was being asked to do, so it is George wholly for law and order is TED crews for forlorn order. Mesh Mcconnell is Fences, Tom Continents, TIM Scott is but. Donald Trump Snob. I've Republicans want to be the law and order party than they need to make speeches such as the one that Mr Connell made yesterday in which they lay out what the lorries and explain why they follow they don't do that. Then they deserve to be lumped in with president germ cell everyday couple. Difference.
Answers to this being floated. One is an impeachment and removal too hard isnt peaceable offence, but seems to be hard to impeach, move, em and twelve or thirteen days can help the listing the processes unless the Senate, just in the mood in work and above for anything and just have a snap trial, which kind of hard to believe Twisted the man that is the wooden is really convoluted mechanism, but some of that complication is removed because of the timing of the complications
is having the congressional vote too were to keep the vice president in charge which will apply and because it there's a deadline there, which is beyond the the twelve or thirteen days they could have just majority that the cabinet and had doing this is not really, though, that he's incapacitated, so that would be an appropriate than then you have reservations and we ve seen a handful. The social secretaries out, a persuasive social sector is out, but some other ones, Stephanie Gresham, former prospector it now working. First lady S, chief staff is out. I believe I heard this morning: Matthew, passenger, really impressive, China guy.
It is out MIC Mulvaney has resigned from the envoys position, is not particularly meaningful. So what what's your review where you come down Alice? What's your view? What should be done? Romford thirteen days, I think what should be done hold on beer butts. I mean I shouldn't think that the twenty four women are impeachment are plausible, at this point, even if impeachment would be richly deserved. You know I didn't think I When I came to national view, I'd be the one talking up stored Mary rendition and enhance interrogation techniques, but maybe that's what's in it. Yeah I mean what prison from did was wicked. Beyond words, I mean it's the sort of thing that.
He no civilised countries, terror to Dino as ITALY, eventually rouse itself, to tear Mussolini limb from limb in the streets. I am I mean that sort of like what I started. Imagining could happen a mixed thirteen days this this a level of chaos. I aim I dont welcome, but I don't think he asked think there's a normal constitutional method. Here, let people resign, but it's too late. You're already been disgraced, the other than the resignations also my views. Anyone any position that doesn't involve real serious national security or legal responsibilities should should resign, but yet is it is late date and Charlie, I'm a little bit of. As you know, my offline communications, I was worried that there was gonna, get crazier and worry about trunk caught cawing crowds in Washington,
Might what might happen? I didn't envision this really, but I wonder now, if the reaction to this makes it harder for him to do anything else, crazier in this remaining two weeks let's hope so I was wrong. I never thought I still don't think that's his attempts were come to anything and that's what I was most concerned about, but I didn't expect him. To go this far, and I didn't expect him to be abetted by figures such as TED Crews and Josh Holy and I was wrong. I think that Congress should impeach and remove him ass. A warning
and I say reminder that it is the prime branch of government. We don't have coequal branches, that's a will Sony and fantasy. We have Congress. Congress can remove the president, and it should do so. The twenty fifth amendment is a poor option for a number of reasons. Firstly, it's not designed for this President Trump is not in a coma he's, not lying wounded, he's not mentally ill he's aware of what he's doing and besides to invoke, it would not really yield the desired effect, which is a congressional uprising against me. Executive branch, because essentially you would see the cabinet invoking the twenty fifth amendment tromp objecting and then the cab saying now we really are doing this and by the time that Congress,
got away in any meaningful sense. Trump would already have left office. I am also not thrilled about some have suggested, which is the soft version of that which is to start ignoring the president, treating him as if he has already gone. And ignoring his orders. That's not a constitution no remedy either the constitution, no remedy is impatient. I doubt it will happen, I'm pinned to the idea. That may not be enough time, but if the house move forward with impeaching him, even if there's no trial. I think that would be a welcome act of censure and a re off affirmation of the american system. Nba ex clash, dear down shop, was still the president when
the oath is the Minister to Joe Biden on January- twenty, yes or no, not just at the beginning of it, but by the end you won't Jacob. Yes, I think so. I think the aim will be to run the clock out, and so I think.
We're going to get a ghastly thirteen day period in which we see more resignations, which our honourable, in the correct way of doing things, coupled with a tendency to ignore him and perhaps even to defy him, which is less than ideal. I think the answer is yes, but it's really combat, and this list regulator art next final saying that here it's really incumbent on all Republicans tick condemn taken down his lies to condemn his refusal to you can see the election and taken ten his role and this violence is not enough to say you pose violence and in writing no two dozen. You need to call out the president, because the ultimate game here is to take the party away from him and that that's
that's a lot. That can be a long running challenge even now, but sir or problems of goodwill should be engaged in that effort, so anybody we had drama even outside of of all all the disorder. Yesterday on on the floor right for the rider showed up, he admits Mcconnell, giving on the certainly speech It is clear that this is the eye. Is a really adapt partisan fighter, cold blooded, partisan fighter aggressive parson fighter when he considers it appropriate, but at its core as an institutionalized, and that's what we heard yesterday, he made for Ms Mcdonald and extremely impassioned and emotional a speech, but also really cogent, well reasoned. One deeply felt one about sir. How if these letters were rejected, that our institutions and our constitution-
public would never recover. Armenia's render mean you it would be. What would have happened was thee abolish men of the constitution. I mean the states elect the president. The states determine how that's done the state certify, how they did it and its com. Says job to recognise the result. And you know He began to get worried when Josh holly who you know, is a figure I've in it up until recently, sometimes have been quite excited about the direct he seems to be heading politically, but he decided to play into this
another. There's that around thirty cringe baking photo of him before before others went down of of walking past these. The protesters with his fist raised. I mean this and there's something just kind of funny about his background is a Ivy League guy. Doing no heat, you know it. I think my grandfather private, have called him senator hair cut or something you know if you just saw the look of Ali on the day, but am Holly knows that dont trumps accusations of fraud are false, TED crews knows they are false, but they decided to try in this kind of
way too clever by half way raise questions and try to represent the voices of seventy four million people who were don't trust the system and therefore posed remedy. Was this illegal fantasy audit? of the election results which would satisfy no one which could not be completed in any satisfy everybody. In the end days, he had the idea of starting now. Somehow we agreed with the members will be what rules would be in the standards of service would be. It would be ten days. Beginning now said, takes seventeenth right and then like in two days stage, especially reconvened reckons that felt as us transparently absurd, and then he had group is going to stand up and television and say after ten days. I am absolutely convinced and sad that Donald Trump,
This election and Joe Biden is an Ex president of the United States. Is such a fuss. What a pleasure it please! I summoned. They summoned a dragon that they did not know how to leash, and I cannot believe how quickly a blue up in their faces and in the face of american people. This is not what we act senators to do we let them to legislate. We let them to do oversight. This is demagoguery and we got exactly exactly the price of demagoguery, which is not just mob violence. It is when I talked about earlier continuing disaffection from constitutional self government by a much larger group than that mob. We saw yesterday, and it is in its being led by the
officers of our federal government, it is shameful, so Charlie Press the time here got to get out. So it's going right to exit question here. In your view, Trump aside, just let's talk about Congress The congressional action best actor yesterday, worst actor yesterday, the best doctors yesterday were much Mcconnell MIKE Pants Tom Cotton, who, I think, should resubmit his New York Times ahead with a few of the words chain
The fact that we get published on the front page- I'm you know something else. We have to point out. Yes there hypocritical much of the time in the US is no part is an advantage here, but the Democrats are doing their jobs do, and it is a good thing that we have some of the Republican Party and all of the Democratic Party that will stand up to this. So later, a fine job too, and it is the worst I didn't do worse to the worst is obvious as president, the present aside the President Assad. Well, I think it's tankers attackers fraud. I never want to hear tat crews ever again talk about limited government. I never want to hear him talk about federalism. I never want to hear him quite Abraham, Lincoln or James Madison or George Washington. I never want him talk about the value of the Senate as as a cooling institution. I never want him too what about the importance of
Civil rights and the danger of mobs and the cooling effects of balances and checks is fraud. Emily worst acts TED crews to Charlie's list, I would just add, I don't hear talk about conscience, either and best actor. Unlike pence. I didn't think he would rise to it and his letter getting the day was appropriate. He had best actor. I d GO pants. I really underestimated him. We predict
earlier in the week. I took all of us right that that you would accuse he didn't, refuse to put on an excellent statement. I'd like women with it a little bit explaining why his role in this process is he filled that role honorably stood up there in three or four in the morning or whatever it was and read, read the electors demonstrating Trump's LOS and his own loss, and he did it under incredible pressure of political pressure from the president and and physical intimidation from the president's supporters. So you know, I think it's going to be tough, probably in twenty twenty four, but this this you know, if not if he does nothing else. This is a really notable capstone to his career, worst actor. I'll guess I'll go
the lady with the house with one hundred and twenty house members or something voted to objects? These are. These are people who are just on this question just beyond reason and had a shameful role and maybe in an excuses, they're not, is the thoughtful and well formed an versed in our government is Josh. Holly and TED crews are but still shameful, and in that context I honour will best mention for honourable mission for best actors, the folks in the houses stood up less Cheney chip Roy his put a target on his back, but has done what he says.
Thing in accord with with his with his principles, really proud of both of them. Gotta run here so no light items. No editors pick sorry listeners we'll try to make it up to you next week that set for us see been listening to a national. You pod, casting a red broadcast retransmission countess game without express written permission of now sure you magazine strictly prohibited the spot gases approved by the incomparable search. You re has been very busy this week and makes a sound better than we deserve. Thank you, Charlie. Thank you ambient they specially to all of you for listening where the others see next time.
Transcript generated on 2021-03-30.