Present Trump takes Warsaw by storm in the left. Freaks out. North it makes another missile advance and trumps says he's considering a severe response, and as usual, trump tweets, discuss all this and more on this week's edition of the editors, podcast I'm rich Lowry and I'm joint, as always by the right. Honourable Charles see w cook the effervescent raw, hence alarm, Andy redoubtable in huddle welcome everyone Charlie. This reaction to the Warsaw speech really took me by surprise is a moving speech

it had the really affecting passages about the resistance in Poland too. That the nazis- and it was it- wasn't the kind of America First speech that some people would fear that trumpet give on such an occasion. It was a defence of the West and its values, and you have votes on the left freaking out and saying it's basically a racist, exclusionary speech. There have been two categories of criticism. As far as I can sue one is that the terms that we used were offensive in another himself, the West civilization and so forth. The second category criticism is that in the hands of most people most present

The speech would have been a knock. You is, but it's not in trumps. Let me read you a passage. Trump said: we write symphonies, we pursue innovation, we celebrate our ancient heroes, embrace our timeless traditions and customs and always seek to explore and discover brand new frontiers. We reward brilliance, we strive for excellence and cherish inspiring works of art that, on a god, we treasure the rule of law and protect the right to free speech and free expression empower women as pillars of our society and of our success. We put faith and family, not government bureaucracy at the centre of our lives, and we debate everything. We challenge everything. We seek to know everything so that we can better no ourselves that was fair,

the typical it's also fairly typical of the way american President's tend to speak. Those words could have been answered by George W Bush by Ronald Reagan, or indeed by Woodrow Wilson, and yet the framing of the speech in the context of the west and civilization is according to write to such a safe. To buy not at the Atlantic White Nationalism. He says in his speech in Poland on Thursday Donald Trump referred ten times to the west and five times to our civilization. His white nationalist supporters will understand exactly what he means. It's important that other Americans do too, and then he goes on to suggest that we shouldn't used the west at all, But the very term is offensive. I'm reminded, in this response of a term that David French coined Trump law. That idea is that the law must spend two x.

Donald Trump, because we all know deep down that he's a bad person answer. The powers of the presidency that would normally be exercised without controversy cannot be available to Trump, and I think this is ultimately quest begging. The argument is that we just know that Trump is Hitler. We know that his speech prices are racist and white supremacist and therefore These terms have to be imbued with nefarious with visit Pugnaciousness, I was reminded also of South Park episode in which the local town we have a problem with homelessness and eventually the homeless people raise enough money to stop paying rent or buying houses, and the locals complain that they can't tell anymore who is homeless and who isn't, because everybody has a house

again, if your argument is the Trump, doesn't give these speeches and say these things. Therefore, he can't have given this speech and meant it. You may be, ought to reevaluate your your logic, sir, I had one of the more sophisticated criticisms of the speech is at its exclusionary. Compared to the rhetoric we heard from George W Bush, which was loosely based on western values, will I should say this is based on western values, but didn't talk about those values in terms of the west. Instead, it was this universal values of democratization and human rights. Absolutely so, if you're looking, at the early two thousands. This is a time when we spoke more often of yeah, a universal civilization, grounded in the of law, grounded and lots of values that I think that some of us think is certainly rooted historically in the west or or having achieved fullest flourishing in the west, but

our insidiously universal. All peoples could potentially access these. These things. Like Charlie, I found Trump speech unobjectionable and I found it pretty impressive in some stretches, but I am somewhat sympathetic to the idea that the implicit understanding of the west, what the west is, was a little bit off for this reason. So this is a kind of cliche video, a lot of votes in the left, but that, I think, does have some truth. If there is such a thing as western civilization, it really is, to say, rooted in Christianity, but its specifically rooted in kind of latin roman Christianity. It's something that really is kind of you know it's not much Athens to Albion, it's something better, and of really rooted in mediterranean civilization, and Poland is very much a part of it, because Poland is very much a catholic country in its soul. And then, if your look,

at the fringes of northern Europe. If you think that pull protestant world well, that's actually a little bit off killed her from the heart of the west, the latin Roman West and the United States. We come out of that fringe of the west for and not a French, exactly fringe of the French, and so if the irony is that, if you're looking parts of Latin America that aren't continuity with this kind of catholic improvement, civilization. It's always those places or more western than we are. So I guess my view is that the reason the United States and Europe are bound together is really different. It's really about geopolitical interests, it's about the fact that we have lots of shared political values and also we're just block you look at a basically in a world in which China is arising, power, Russia is arising power, Russia, which, by the way, is also on the fringe of the west. Either it happens that we The most shared interests with the Europeans. We should be a block. We not a very effective block. At the moment, if we did

work together more effectively. What we could do is we can impose our will on whose reports the world we can tell the Chinese hey. We resent your mercantilism and we are going to work together with our collective economic power, and military might to ensure that you listen to us that you have had you go with the programme. This is very different from the vision that George W Bush and others in the early two. Thousands, because Vision was in China rush hour, eventually going to get with a programme. We're gonna have this kind of: U S lead Reversal order and that's all gonna work out what, whereas I believe in power politics in having a block, that's going to be important, but it's not entirely cultural or civilization. It's because it makes sense for us to do that and similarly, by the way, it might make sense for us to embrace the Japanese or the South Koreans, or maybe one day, the Indians for similar reasons of power politics, because just as there are culture similarities between countries on both sides of the Atlantic. There are also pretty big differences. We

are more religious. They are more secular it on and on down the line. So so I wouldn't way too much. on this idea of an ancient civilization of comedy. I really think it's more about hey. We actually do have lots of em Orton shared interests, and we have to emphasise that. I think the trump would have done well to talk about that because anything he does the opposite. He says that actually we don't really need this block quite so much. We don't need Nido, NATO quite too much etc, and I think that that's a little bit confused fleecy Anglo America is basically a subset within western civilization. That's a little off from the center, where exactly that

that's a little bit more dynamic. That's always been a little bit more open. It certainly part of this very broad tradition, but if we are part of that tradition than of the Russians are part of the two and that there are some other peoples who might be part of it to see. I fundamentally disagree that, because I think Anglo American is at the heart of it and I think other nations have been pulled into Anglo America's orbit and that constitutes the west. I think that you will write historically, if you go back to three centuries, you have these values in Britain that up historically peculiar. There then pushed out to the college is there retained in the colonies. The revolution is in many ways: a restoration America rises up to become the most powerful nation in the world with Britain a close second, the most dynamic economies are in Australia and Canada, and the United

dates in Britain and slowly but surely either by winning wars or by british naval supremacy or by needing to club together against soviet communism. Western Europe becomes more English in its outlook is so I dont see us as being on the fringe. I see us as being at the heart of what the Mai push back to that that this angle, America, this dynamic, Anglo American, describing I absolutely agree with you- that's a real thing, but that's the heart of a kind of a dynamic market oriented liberal civilization that is insidiously universal. Talking about the west, as distinct from the east, you know that something that's a little bit for an, and I think that you are certainly we are in a block with Western Europe. We

I have lots of share geopolitical interests, but what you described I mean that's the free world and the free world was always a more expansive concept than the west and, sadly, the fur world in some ways fragmenting or yes, but it is not just its not just that it also has its modest markets. It also has liberal democracy, which in Europe, has become more british than and we have all the guns and we have entered into alliances with these people. I'd always comes back. I made them a large areas are today in the minute. I'm leaving, you guess, interposed guns they bottle. You'd also agree that the third wave of democratization was all about democracy taking root outside of the west, and that was part of the project of the free world show that I'm not invent American, they are liberal. Democracy is one of the things that Peter by not complains about is that we don't count India, but you can't count Indy in the same breath as the United States or France or Germany, because it's not alive

democracy, as someone said that you can count hungrier Poland anymore, I'm it we could mitigate this further, but but I say that you and I are disagreeing all that much. I absolutely agree that the United States is at the heart of something something very important and I'd say that it's at the heart of the free world. It happens that the free world and very different place today than it had been ten fifteen twenty years ago. But the west isn't quite the same thing as the free world. There not co terminal nor should they be go terminus and in a while, I think that we owe an enormous amount to european civilization. I do think that, where something a little bit different indistinct are sometimes colleague, James Bennet, his written about the anglo sphere I may be Miss attributed to this this to him, in which case I expect a sharp letter sometime soon, but here I think, are using one of his books that the anglo angle, America, is completely distinct from France.

And from Continental Europe, and it starts work in England where there's basically no feudalism which created a political culture, that's utterly different. Then you get in France in Eastern Europe and Russia, but we need to get you in here one of the things that is at stake and all of us- and I think this is sort of MRS deep vein of this controversy. I'm sort of a non acknowledged controversy is in as much as we can identify common values, shared sort of shared identity, reassured commitments across these somewhat different, but related nations or or cultures, and as much as their embedded in these nations. What what's the ground for those for those values? What

one of them at the bottom of them and part of what seems to me that the left is critiquing in in turning out so strongly against. From speech is rejecting not just the values per se but an attempt to or their rejecting trumps implicit re grounding of those values, in God, the natural bonds of affection between family things that obviously deeply embedded in the in the European and what we say would be the western tradition in the way that those those some preliminary sort of fundamental commitments have unfolded in the west in a way that they didn't unfold.

And in other parts of the world, and so there's this. There really is this deep seems to me conflict here under underlying all of it, and they want a sort of say what you will about Trump. I think I think Charlie's diagnosis years right that there's a lot of projection, they sort of say our trump- is this air go everything he says is. Is this set that aside, the speech itself is in a long tradition, trying to return to the roots of the things that we share and re ground them, and I think that's very alarming. For a lot of people on the left cannot just push back against the idea, because I agree with and eyes push back against. The idea that there is something sinister about a president

claiming what the West means. It is fine for progressive to dislike it. If Trump tries to ally civilization or the west, or all we hold dear, would say the family or say a thriving civil society or strong military, that's fine, but one of the criticisms that I've seen of Trump is that doing so is arrogant or imperialistic or somehow fascistic, and it's him they not the case that he is broken tradition here. Every single american president does it. Brok, Obama used to stand up and most every rally and say that's not who we are now at National review. We would say what it is all we disagree for these reasons, but it wasn't that beyond his right as the president to make

claim. Similarly on the world stage, Barack Obama would emphasise different parts of american virtue or he would characterize the western civilization of the free world. In a particular way, he, for example, would be much more loquacious about democracy than about civil society or individual liberty or freedom of religion, and that's fine. I think we ought to be very careful here not in this room, but before we assume that a president pushing his stamp, on a given question is somehow exclusive, rather than the normal process by which politicians attempt to define and sell the world around them. The other thing, if my memory serves when George W Bush talked about these issues in them, Anna dine in universal manner possible is not as though the left said. Oh that's.

Terrific, you know we really love these values and is presenting them most open way possible to try to win over people. This was hit. The bushes version was fascistic and exclusionary and sort of authoritarian, that's very astute and, and it brings to mind, wandering that saddens me about the discourse around the west and run nationalism that we seen recently to me. It is my hope was that perhaps Donald Trump would offer a corrective to emphasise that nation states matter that national traditions matter and then also more broad cultural communities matter to ensure that these things are relevant to our way of life and to our political values. And what have you, but, instead of serving as a corrective and kind of inching us a little bit further away from hyper cosmopolitanism.

What happened is that he's made these more nationalist assertions and the reaction has been for people who are, let's aid, mildly, cosmopolitan- to become hyper cosmopolitans even more intensely. So now we have people think that actually the Habsburg him there was great. Oh, you know, liberal imperialism was actually a really wonderful thing up boy, the whole american revolution. You guys. That was a big mistake. We need, of course, you ve heard that from a certain kind of progressive for a long time, but you hear it now from a wider swath of people, even he overhear it and restaurants of Brooklyn and in its kind of sad, like wow. You like trumps. So much now that you decided that the amount revolution was a mistake that says something about our political culture, that I find answers, have you heard praise there has Burg Empire a coffee shops in Brooklyn?

this is a real thing. I've been actual Sdr, Woodrow Wilson you're going back a very long way. The idea that hate national self determination is, generally speaking, a good thing. These big undemocratic multi, national empires you don't we should kind of frowned upon them. They didn't quite work out lots of ways, the oppressed, some people etc. That is now consider this crazy idea and actually really is true- that either among cut of cutting edge. story and the whole thing is mediocre. Gosh, the Habsburg got it right and by the way, the Habsburg also know that's where the ideas of these so called Austro Marxists came from these marxist who said: ok, we'll get it

emperor, but we still have a kind of multi National Socialist Republic which, by the way, seems to be the aspiration that some folks have for the United States going forward so try very quickly before we move on from the G20. There is also the same day. The trump gave his speech. He had a press conference with Prime Minister of Poland and whose asked by Rapporteur at NBC to say once and for all that definitely Russia was the source of the hacking The Dnc and heroic Linsey nails and Trump responded in very trompe and fashion, which is the sort of agree. Tat was Russia, but the say no other people did it too and will probably never know. I think two things on the civil tenancy. The first is that jump has been busily defensive. This is a significant character floor. Is he simply will not give in to any body he thinks doing so is weak. Thinks he is helped by punching

at every single fist that comes his way and so he's never going to allow for the truth here in so far as it obtains that said, I'm just bored of this question being asked and then used as a pretext not to report on whatever it is it's happening, and it was so predictable. Yesterday, chump Trump gave the speech. Clearly it was worthy of debate. The rapporteur asked the question: You mentioned Trump gave his non answer. The same non answer he's been giving over and over and over again for six months before and all of a sudden on twitter and beyond journalist started saying. Well, I guess we really wanted to talk about this. it's in the G20, but is now going to be overshadowed because Trump One, so we want him to on Russia will yet because you did that, because you asked that quest

It can be simultaneously true. The trump should be more forthcoming. What have you done? you certainly have to agree with the way that the Russia question is portrayed in the press. The term hacked the election is deeply misleading, but he should be focused. We do know they actually serve as we do. Oh they tried to interfere. Would you know they metal? That is outrageous entities worried? He should say that at the same time asking him this question over and over and over again, so that you can run the headline Trump denies Trump overshadows. We wish we could talk about this, but every time is tiresome and I think it's a little transparent. Ok. So, let's button up this portion of discussion with his exit question right hand, salon rate trumps, Warsaw Speech, zero being all right, tripe, ten being Reagan S sudden in given an eight Charlie, I give it a seventy

I go all the way up to nine. I thought is really a tremendous moving and well written speech, private Bestridden speech that he's given so in another big events. This week, the north

Ryan's have made another advance and their missile technology and Trump has said that he is contemplating severe consequences. What he thinks go on her well, two points, one is depends entirely with consequences are, and that's a very difficult calculation, especially when second point. Both China and Russia send this week that their against resolving think the quote. The? U N Security Council was there against resolving the crisis of the crisis in North Korea by either force or sanctions. So I guess you know, therefore giving him jargon cookies and hoping that we can have or something out about

We have written about this recently it at an art. It seems to me that we are at a point where the only realistic path is a far more aggressive sanctions regime. part of that's going to be secondary. Sanctions is going to have to be secondary sanctions. North Korea's propped up by China, and on a number of other smaller nations. You know they fly their ships under Fiji, flags or tanzanian flags take send workers abroad to places like Poland, and then they bring them back and take. Ninety percent of their their earnings than the north Korean stay afloat by sort of exploiting other. care. Carriers are short of parasitic in the way the Cuba was parasitic Gun Soviet Union in Venezuela, etc.

The only way you're going to be able to break this cycle is by making it extremely painful for other countries to be involved in North Korea's ongoing survival project. We ve done this before we ve. We impose secondary sanctions from two thousand five to two thousand seven. We saw chinese banks in fact closed down. North korean accounts are freeze north korean assets over the orders of the Chinese Communist Party government, because they were so concerned about losing access to the. U S dollars system so that the military calculation here is is dire. I dont see a military solution to this, simply because North Korea can fire conventional weapons, let alone nuclear ones into South Korea in Strychnia tore Japan, the death tolls, the projected death tools. If you talk

Military people are just astronomical, so they're really isn't a good military solution to this, but the United States does have a lot of leverage when it comes to potential sanctions unilaterally and then, ideally with partners in the European in the European Union. Yes, yes to me, that's the question is not whether we can lodge they saw a pre emptive strike anytime soon is whether this is gonna. Forces is growing threat to be serious enough about this sanctions, to really focus on them in Billy, inflict pain on anyone indirectly dealing with that the north korean regime, and certainly in respect right hand. It looks as though trumps belief that some personal diplomacy

The presidency was going to turn him around on this long term. Strategic orientation towards propping up the north korean regime, for all sorts of reasons, was naive, and now we have all sorts of cometary about how this this may be. The breaking point and finally, Trump may start getting tough with China. What would you think of that line of reasoning? And what, with that look like I mean you know, you ve had american prayers.

And trying to get tough with China over North Korea for a very long time and the fundamental problem is that when you look at this from China's perspective, what is the alternative to preserving the north korean state? The alternative is the collapse of the north korean state, which would mean an enormous refugee crisis. South Korea would bear much the burden, but China would bear a fair bit of it as well, and you know, let's say you have actually have some kind of unified korean state. Well, that means you have a much stronger potential rival on your border, not stronger initially, but over the very long term, and of course after it is a. U S, ally that my change, who knows the world could look very different in the wake of north korean collapse, but that's it.

thing. China wants stability right now. China is emboldened by the fact that its stronger than it had been ten or twenty years ago, and so it actually tries to revise the international order in its favour. The Chinese still don't feel quite strong enough to deal with the kind of chaos that of green collapse would unleash. So what does it effectively mean that north re has become a nuclear weapon state? What it means is that China's buffer state is stronger than it was before so incompletely cold. I'd objective terms: that's actually good news for China, rather than bad news and then think about what it means for the northern states not viewed from the perspective of the Trump presidency, but over a let's say: fifteen. Twenty, your time horizon the United States during the bush. Here decided that we do not want more nuclear weapon states, so we are going to over. Throw Saddam Hussein's government in Iraq. What that do. Well, it basically taught the iranian wow we'd, better,

I do hope, a nuclear deterrent farmer quickly, because looking attitudes as an toppling the north korean government, the Libyans decided ok, we're gonna, give up our weapons programme who did what happened is that we ate and a the overthrow the libyan government, so I need from from that perspective, it really does you can control them all. You want You would have to inflict so much pain on the Chinese in order to change the calculus on their part, that I really don't see him You go about doing it. So then the question is: what can president Trump do? to sound plausible to sound kind of talk While we muddle through this situation until he's able, pass it on to the next president and I'm not really sure. I'm not really quite sure. The answer. That is maybe it is saying. Oh we're gonna get tougher on the Chinese, we're gonna do ex wines and then we'll get the Chinese to say that they will kill you. All the north hurt heads into doing a little bit more on this, but I'm in front of

this serves China's interests. It does not serve hours, but also where far away enough, that we consider this an acceptable risk. Now the other big picture thing? Is it what I worry about? Is I dont think that this this little you kind of unusual circumstances. I think that this is the future. Nor three is not going to be the last new nuclear weapon states. Where does she live in a more multi polar, more risky, more dangerous world in which a lot of the new nuclear weapon states are gonna, be countries that are very culturally different, that don't share interests, and just going to be a fundamental, more dangerous world and I don't think we have much of an alternative to it truly could be Morland from him and I just don't think there is any will anywhere to do much about North Korea. You mentioned Iraq right you mentioned IRAN my view of the democratic parties. Attitude toward her

Was it then you full well that there was no great appetite for military intervention and therefore, whatever deal Brok Abominable was going to be tolerated, we're not going to strike a deal with North Korea, but we also know going to do anything March and it's not just because of the horrendous casualties. It would probably be inflicted on softer and is not just because of China is because american people and the people of Britain and France and Germany for that matter, simply do not consider this a priority and would rather advance a policy of containment, possibly a policy of merely ignoring North Korea than to actually do anything about it. I think generate go back is right when he says that

we are somewhat hypocritical. We say never again, we know what's happening in North Korea and we leave it be, but that does not happen in a vacuum that happens because these are not political priorities. Just very briefly. The deal the North Korea's want is recognition. They want a formal end to the korean WAR and they won't get out of states to recognise that dp. Our k is a legitimate government, and what will happen then, once they pocket that concession is they're, not gonna. Do a damn thing: they're gonna, keep their nuclear weapons- and the thing is TAT is unacceptable. We cannot recognise that government. It is not a legitimate rights righted presented. These two halves outweighs we're not going to follow through if they renee exactly, but equally we're not going to acquiesce today wishes, and so we're gonna remain, and also to shrouding as North Korea situation, because nobody cares enough to do anything and they might be right. Frankly, I disagree entirely with us a couple things one in the launch.

It's kind of interesting because there are, it seems generational differences in the leadership of the Communist Party. The younger generation doesn't seem to be as interested in in preserving North Korea. As the lousy communist millennium, as the older interesting to see if, over the long term, there is a shift sort of in internal to China, but there are you know I accept both, but while Rhiannon and Charlie are saying about them, the political will here, as well as your China's interest in maintaining this buffer stay, but there are things we can do beyond sanctions which, which I do think we should do one is. We need to be working with the south Korean

in a way that not the new president is thinking about returning to the sunshine policy of the nineties, which was a fairly open handed policy toward North Korea, as opposed to her success, as opposed to our successors in the late nineties into thousands. That's a mistake. We already, we ve seen the base that that North Korea simply pockets the the humanitarian money that they get in, they put it toward their military programme. Trump needs to be, working with them to turn them away from that policy and also to make sure that the President of South Korea does not renege on the significant missile defence system that the Eu S has put into the count,

She recently stalled the programme on grounds that they want to do an environmental. Environmental F affect evaluation, and, basically you know that's, as everybody knows, a sort of cover for eventually pulling the jack. That can happen. And thirdly, we can do one of the things that George W Bush did, which is highlighted. Dissidents highlight outspoken survivors. There are people who make it out of North Korea now spoken about what's happening there. Bush was good about doing that and in design.

This places all over the world from can do that's while also harrowing exit question, beginning with you, Charlie, the percentage chance of war on the Korean Peninsula and trumps first term out of ten percent for society percentages is my complete numerical illiteracy. You did actually say percentage in a cellar. Ask that I think is extremely low gets five. Ten percent of the most ran seven. here five to ten, but it's worth recalling that can't quite remember when it was North Korea fired and killed civilians south korean Island early two, thousands, I think it was. I wouldn't be surprised if there was some kind of bad activity over the next three years. I agree that it is quite low. I put it about fifteen, discuss its inherently a dangerous situation

a unpredictable regime in the north. But I think this is much more likely to end up in a negotiation then in military conflict. I kind of think the North Koreans will proceed on the correct course and will declare themselves that at some point, whether actually, really true or not capable of delivering a nuclear weapon by an icy, be em and an open themselves up for business for a deal where they have over the last several decades. So it's turn to trumps tweets. Last week we had the meagre Joe blow up where a trump claims he's not watching morning Joe, but obviously is excessively watching every minute of mourning Joe, even I guess the replay they replay. I think, during one hour during to train the three our program. I wouldn't be surprised me, a problem actually watches at twice, said that they came

and to Morrow logo. New Year's and wanted to see him and make had suffering the effects of a really bad face, lift and was was bleeding so trumps. No he wasn't gonna meet with them, and then we had this the CNN Meme word trump took a clip of his his old days as a character in Debbie, W E and him self, slamming a on another character with it an end logo on his face to the ground, and it seems to me that the Joe make a thing Charlie that even if this was true even if make it had a facelift and was bleeding, and an demanded to come to a new year's party and see the President Elect of the United States for judges. Bizarre, but even those true it be

stronger, lay low to tweet about it, but to make it up and tweed about it is completely contemptible and just goes is character. Flaw where he can't stand criticism and if he feels slighted and if he's been criticized, it considers that a licence to hit back in any way literally anyway possible its upon this was probably the worst example of what is an important and counterproductive trade.

I don't understand why he does it. I have to say, aside from not possessing whatever Jean it is, that render seem incapable of declining to punch down he's the president, most people up below him in stature and influence whatever it is. That is missing in him as regards basic respect and admiration for other human beings. I dont understand and what he gains by it, and it is. It is true that the media has diminished in the estimations of the american public in the last few years. So is Donald Trump, and this is not a victory. is winning. This is a murder suicide. If anything now to criticise trumps, tweeting is routinely to be met with the rejoinder that he fights, but for what he's fighting

the press? Even if he were being more productive, they would of course be other ways to fight there's a lot of ground between being anodyne and being Donald Trump. But he's not even being obnoxious so pugnacious in service or something concrete and had he been hang around the country for the last three months, trying to sell the Republicans Healthcare plan Had he been running around the country trying to sell the wool had he been running around the country trying to sell attacks, but if he were being aggressive in defence of the Senate bill, if he were slamming Chuck Schuman Brackets Bomb. Anyone who voted for a bomb aka if he kept playing videos in his twitter feed of O bomber, saying you can keep your doctor or you can keep your plan if you like it. If he got rude about bracket

I would at least understand what he was trying to achieve if he applied the same nuke the ground approach to take. reform you could say wow. He is at least far more aggressive than George W Bush was, but he's not he's fighting with cable So I'm not sure what it is here that his friends think he's achieving. I think there's also and are given to be made an important argument to be made that far from merely not tweeting in service of an agenda, he is harming his agenda damaging his reputation, he's damaging relationships he's provoking the press into declared. An all out war on him, ass, a person which is justified, because this is a card for his rather than addressing the problems that, as far as I understand those who, like him and vote before him elected him, to address MR choice as you don't understand what trunk gains from this and in the sense that truly means that is correct, but clearly

Tromp gains from it is the psychological satisfaction you have wounded, and disrespected me, and now I've done it to you. I read recently that apparently CN ends prime time line up now attracts fewer viewers than Nick at night. Now it's possible that MSNBC daytime viewer ship is dramatic, be higher than that. My understanding is that the trunk controversy has in fact goose the ratings. For me presents Geese television programme. But I do wonder what about an alternate world in which President Trump, why is tussling with various other cable news, personalities and television programmes, roughly as popular as the line up at let's say, MSNBC or CNN. So imagine if

just spent all his time. You know bashing, I do know the Nashville predators in the end, a jail which has a kind of limited ten bay. I know riches evade the dynamic that her answer. The final details, or or what, if he, what if he's been all this time, you know just kind of life, tweeting episodes of the walking dead or something like a pretty popular tv, show it just gonna, interesting and and kind of wood. The net effect of that, be you know better or worse. I can really say, but but I do encourage the present to kind of click around the tv diamond echo to see if there are other things that might enrage him, because I think that he might find some pretty interesting stuff and also we as a country might get more diverse cultural amateur in fairness, this used to be the Trump way given. You might recall he weighed in on Christians,

and Roger had a break in his his papers and ensure can come back to that, but I think one thing on the meagre. The meagre versus Trump front the the ban. The best thing is, to my mind, it is just a rap beef. This is for a dislike to wrappers, calling one another out in you know distracts on their albums and the the fact as it's it's always grotesque. It's always extremely low stakes and and frankly, draken meat meal to more eloquently than than trumpet meet mega have on that

on the CNN front, this whole story is I'm Gaza really quickly trump tweets out this, this gift and or Jeff, and then CNN and other new sources go crazy, saying he's promoting violence, and then they tracked down the give maker on rather fortune manner or one of these, and they publish a story which they will hold his name and at the bottom of the story they say they reserve the right quote to publish. Should he observed, I don't recall, quite the conditions, but basically, if he stops being cooperative, which was a grotesque editorial decision on the part of CNN, and this has been a controversy over the past week. This is one of the things and end. The meagre trump conjurers

Was it a similar, similar circumstance in which it just everyone in this involved in this story, is horrid just awful beget they give maker turns out to be a sort of all right. Neo Nazi, who thinks everyone it CNN, is a Jew, he's horrible, whoever was trolling fortune for gifts to give to the President's I presume the Trump is not unfortunate himself, but who knows that intermediary was awful. Trumps does Isn t it out was ridiculous, especially in light of the shah forty thing, even though he was sure he was making a joke. You thought was funny. It was ass if, foolish decision CNN devoting ample reach Ursus to hounding the scale and then threatening the docks and was awful.

all the people who turned and issued death threats against Andrew Kosinski, because he was in the peace, are awful. Everyone involved in this just worried- and this is so representatives thing- an armed North Korea might not be I'm saying that this is it's. It's a depressing to me, how much of our political time and energy is devoted to things exactly like this, when the smart decision for every put him up would have been set, two other matters of far more important so says. We all agree that this is a self destructive practices on the part of present trunk Charlie exit question. How self destructive is this for President Trump Ray

from zero, meaning really a trifle, mostly media obsession to five at stopping him from getting anything big done and will keep him from ever getting above fifty in the polls. I think it's a three. I don't think it will stop and getting anything done at the moment that the biggest obstacle is a Congress Congress will, if it can get together in Sinai, pass a new healthcare they'll will, of course, ended the trumps desk and he will sign it. It might make it more difficult for commerce to do at the Trump is behaving in the way that he has. I dont think its a one, because, although a huge number of people

do not have twitter accounts. The latent impression of trumpets informed by this sort of behaviour had he shot up six months ago. We would have a very different presidency, but I think it somewhere in the middle- and I hope somebody can get to him and explained to him that this is not helping, because he seems unable to grasp that he seems maybe to think that he won because of twitter, which is not a an analysis that I shall read angry with Charlie. In spite of three point five in lieu of rye, hence decimal points, I want to say a two or three: I'm is steadily hurting. I think it

a little over played in the press, which is just obsessed with these tweets and its most people? Don't pay a lot of attention, and especially the republican base, doesn't mind and finds fines and entertaining and that the real a blow to Trump politically would be when he loses that connection with the basic knock. I do it by tweeting, but its defiling helping and it's turning so let's move on to some lighter items Charlie, you ve been concerned that pirates of the Caribbean just isn't what it used to be well, there was a store this week in variety, The pirates of the Caribbean ride adds Disneyland than Disneyworld and in fact they have franchise all around the world. Now is to be changed as seen in the far diversion. I believe it's echoed in the one in California, in which wenches are being auctioned off.

This is to be next because it is success than an indicative of sex trafficking and so on so this is a right that was put in nineteen sixty. It was the last right that Walt Disney himself had a big hand in. I understand that too many progressives anything of before about two thousand eight has to be reformed, but it is recalled awry about pirates and in the gist of the ride, is that pirates are bad. The pirates in question, lock, people up and torture people and kill them, and a one point in I did they opened fire on the boat Turin. Where going to remove the wench auction, because what we want to rehabilitate the reputation of pirates, it doesn't seem to make much sense to me,

Nonetheless, this is the world we live in. I imagine before long parts of the Caribbean will consist of nothing other than pirates sitting around and raising money for local schools. For ahead, you have been consumed with the struggles of the NBA. Eastern come look everyone! The eastern United states that this is really the cradle of our democracy, and this is where the American Revolution was fought, hugging planting seaboard and really, like think about all of the people The dynamism, the innovation think about the toughness thing at the cuisine the Philadelphia cheese steak, As anything about buying out here, this American, we tend to think about the divide in America has been beat a being between, let's say the north and the south, but really EAST and west. The EAST deserve

better than what's been happening in the National Basketball Association, where all of the talent has been leeched out of EAST has been just sacked up hoovered up by the west to the point where now the eastern conference, just consists of a bunch of of just toothless peasants. We're just gonna. Try to play basketball wearing as some kind of jury, rigged, stilts and ask you to playing with some kind of broom and using not even a real ball, but rather just some some kind of money, but that's a the through vision. It is, it is a real gravity and something needs to be done about it and look at present a trump wants to revive his presidency. I'd say you take some kind of anti trust actually superior eastern Basketball League in

that you ve been a lot more literate mind. I have, as you say, Ryan's first mistake is just supporting it seem in the eastern, comprehensive or lacking boss. I I have been literary minded. I just finished a novel, I'm going to to write up on the corner at national review on line just briefly because it took its nice plug in extraordinary piece of work. It sets called the signal flame, which has a line taken from escalating authors. Andrew crave, OC and answer is a fascinating man, but he wrote in the MID two thousand it of the one of the great with great world novels, one novels, which is is a strange thing to say, was called the sojourned on his back with a second novel about em.

a small family in rural Pennsylvania who are waiting for their son to come home from Vietnam. After he's been reported missing, but not necessarily killed in action. It's a heartbreaking novels, shot through with loss gorgeously written. It did needs to be Sir Red slowly, because the sentences are slow and spy just just a gorgeous gorgeous nobbler highly recommended well, on the eve of the all star break, I would like to throw shot out to errant judge. She's been highlighted in eighty seasoned and a fact, probably of all major League baseball, every baseball fan has a certain kind of residual memory of playing as a child in breaking some thing breaking a window. This is why care

in yards, that the first in the wave of of new, more charming ball parks has a warehouse outright field with lots of windows. Not anyone actually actually can reach the windows, but at least it has a tantalizing prospect someone breaking a window. Aaron judge has such incredible power he's literally breaking things for a month or two ago, and banning practicing, like whom he there broke a window in the restaurants, instead our field or broker Caroline. I forget what it was coupled games ago. He had a home run so hard. It dented this casement out beyond left Satterfield Field and Yankee Stadium. just an incredible phenomenon and just eat. The advantage of being a good play with the Yankees is opposed to any other team is when you really, good! Immediately you have feats that put you up with it. The grandest names in sport, sewed errand judge the other day has now twenty nine home runs, has tied

Jody marshes record as a yankee for home runs as a rookie. So it's that time in our pod cast for our editors picks. What's your pick? It I want to highlight, from the latest issue of the magazine essay by John Mc Ward, her I'm, whose always interesting- and he writes about this question of significant interest lately about the link between race and I q and and

Johns, not as interested in having this debate. As many other people are of its provocative essay on our Robert Virgin responded at National review on line with a different taken. I recommend both of those pieces to truly I very much enjoyed at whale and dismantling of an extremely silly and hysterical. I say by marked as his stern slate mock Joseph Stern is apparently deeply worried about judge go such but rests his fear on the thinnest of reeds, which add explains, with his usual panache, ran John Jay Miller, wrote a terrific profile of Eric writings, they governor of Missouri

and a rising star and the Republican Party. One thing that's worth noting about great and, however, is that he's actually been very antagonistic towards miseries, local, a very powerful republican Party and its an open question of whether or not that's the right way for him to to really get things done. But there is no question that the guy is an extraordinary talent and we're gonna be hearing more from the few My pick is Jonah broke the vicious attack on the July Fourth Edition of the editors. You should be grateful right hand that you missed this July. Fourth podcast you, you weren't caught up in this assault on our fair podcast and John objected to the portion. the discussion about whether we still love America. If it had different ideals and have say Jonah, started what I said, it is pointed out that America, is a nation and not an idea, as many other nations also have ideals that doesn't make them.

Ideas anymore than America is an idea, but I think so Conservatives have worked themselves into a conception of patriotism that just find it offensive to, even here that other countries have a sense of mission or have ideals, and also bizarrely Jonah objected to Charlie's answer, which was that, yes, he would love him. because it had different ideals but less than he does now, which is a good answer and from Jonas Perspective, unless America's ideals are all the only thing that he loves about this country should be the correct one anyway. That is all for us.

Today. Thank you, Charlie. Thank you right hand. Thank you and thank you everyone for listening. We are the editors and will see you next.