On this special edition of The Editors, Rich interviews Megyn Kelly about her time at Fox, current journalistic trends, her new podcast, and much more.
The Editors is hosted by Rich Lowry and produced by Sarah Schutte.
This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
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ACT in DOT org flash and are too subscribe, acted dot, org, Slash and are what makes good tv what happened at Fox and twenty. Sixteen and what's wrong with the media, will discuss all this and more on the special Megan Kelly Edition of at her is obvious lowering of joined by Megan Kelly to talk all things, media and her new I cast your listening to an ash review. Podcast a rigorous ghetto programming will return. Soon, if you listen to broadcast on national view, dot com unclean directly on the corner, we are delighted to have you gotta be easier for you and better for us. If you made as part of your feet,
the stranger services out there from Spotify Itunes, and if you like what you hear here, please consider giving the glow and five star review on Itunes. If you dont like what you hear here, please forget, I said anything: Megan Kelly thing so much for joining us. My pleasure thanks for having me this is the biggest This happened to the editors Pat Podcast, since last time, Charlie Cook was on his retreat, I love the editors rich? I have to tell you I never miss in episode. Thank you much slower, were delighted that you made the time, I'm so you got a lot of stuff going on, so it will talk soon about that. But I thought we do do a little bit. Megyn Kelly work, story. Little Fox little knew the talk about the meeting Burma generally now these days way make of it talk about your new ventures, maybe at all political
the tree out of you before we go like it. I like getting the questions before the tests. Thank you so what so, when did you first realize you? You want to go into tv and why, when I was in high school, I had some small weakening that I might be interested in journalism. I took one of those tests when you want to be you grow up and it said I, be a journalist and I did a couple of small internships and that I just got sidetracked and went political science when I got to college and thought when you people to be a lawyer I'll be important people. take me seriously. I haven't Esquire at the end of my name. No one can ever take that for me and so that's what I did and it really wasn't until I like to put it slammed, face first: the brick wall of unhappiness nine years later, that I decided I needed to get out of law
journalism was the natural place to go. You are one of the most frequent pieces of advice. I give you. People who come through NASH Review, who Europe bright, ambitious but are quite sure what they Do and say I am not sure what I want to do. I think I'll just go to law school number. Who don't do that? Well, I mean it's a lot of debt and for a job that makes me few people happy, but I will say this you acquire in law school, at least the ones I did William. helpful in life. They translated to journalism. Did David French of former colleague was makes the point that where's or are probably something must have. The professional skills. This glamorous vision of being a lawyer and then you end up. You know right at a loss you're in a windlass basement somewhere doing doing document review and would probably thought tat. As you say, so, we started in with a local station down Washington DC yeah.
I started with w jail ay and its sister Cable Channel NEWS Channel eight, which is the Mr Channels, what gave me the confidence to even apply rigorous. I had no experience whatsoever television or in journalism. So if I may be the put me on the small cable station and that when five the news director ran both and he was a believer in me and next annual moves on Hu Jia lay in Washington, which is getting sets the number eight market. Yet another fantastic and their people spend years. Trying to get my market like that, and then you you make your way to Foxen is correct. I was like about nine months later, I don't know it was not long after that and the Lord, the news director, me a full time job. I've gotten, if I'm good enough to be full time here. Maybe I'm good enough to be full time something better than here, and I got my tape to actually came home at box. So so what makes good tv
and how long did it take you to realise what makes good to me. That's a good question. I felt too many people forget that is called broadcast journalism and There are people who are very good at the journalism part and not so good at the broadcast and vice versa. But I think one of the things you need to be able to do is condemned, information large amounts of information into small digestible bets quickly. You this this, given its factor as well? Do you penetrate the lens or don't you do? Can you is Roger S always so? Look at resonate takes with a sound off, and if you want to turn the sound on you'd, get an interview, I think, being able to just limit the lens look right through it and see your viewers is a scale that you can liar over time and is an important one. I also think that If he's gonna tell us area than goods. So let my pleasure Therefore, what is that even me, and how are you able to consciously consciously looked through a lance, and
of yours eyes. You just have to black out everything around you. You have to forget the earnest studio forget that you ve got stage managers and so on around you and just focus on your viewer and yourselves, like I was an imaginary viewer, Nay Madge and still do a nice Big Madge Madge I just like Is it from shore for imaginary were worse match, that's pretty clever I don't know, I don't know where it comes from it. Just like somebody who's, not a jerk I haven't, you sounds like somebody who works hard and one consume her news in a user friendly way, maybe she's having ass, a wine maybe she's like she doesn't work hard for it. As my points like I want to make the new, as for Madge, in a way as to call it. Cool water over a hot brain. Is you shouldn't everyone? anything she's never was not. anything it's just easy flow. We experience for her
that making the news that way takes practice. If you have to do it overnight, and over again to get better and Anne. Did you watch yourself? I remember bill over time. You once once in a break the You get good, is doing it and watching yourself, CASA idea, a definite so I ask myself, and it was painful because when I was doing it, I thought by right sorry, I'm doing ok and then I would watch the tapes and such. Reporting wrong. I was so sudden death in my earliest heads and w jail, Certainly that was a disaster, but Fox NEWS too. If you look at the old, like reporter heads I did on early morning fox, Friends weaken foxen friends at six, a m or on with Shepherd which it was a big deal. If you got to go on with shepherdess seven o clock, it was terrible, and
and just through watching it just realized. What's what's good was bad and and your conscious about it, while you have to be super focused, you have to be focused like a laser and you have to be cut You know I dont generally, I dont like lawyers as guests on television because they try to couch everything they. Never. Maybe kneel down in a position is so they give you forty five words wait what can be said in five and that doesn't work. So I was used to step on those people and try to sum it up for them. So we can move on to the next point: In a somebody wants to give you a list of five things: it's like no, Does it work here, but somebody to give you a quick head of three things and they can do it fast that works. So you just over time. You see yourself struggling you see yourself, take a risky should have taken. You know, like anything, it's practice
more of it. You do the better you get. So, let's, let's talk about eight, and I think people know about your Senate at Fox it that they know what what happened at fast. Let's stop into it a little bit more. He mentioned your Roger one we're looking at tapes with the sound off- and I remember, Roger saying you needed in of projects through the screen, Father Roger. Obviously, a mix of incredible genius and a hugely entertaining person with this enormous. Failing- and and abused as his power hideous ways. Yeah my feeling about Roger are complicated and we had a very complicated relationship. You know we we started off purely by
ass, an employee, and I was very deferential to him and a little afraid of him. He he really was television genius. He more than any executive out there anywhere understood how to program great television. And I really look at you- you know I was seeing this the other day and I really believe this look at the prime time line up a fox. At least when I was there, there had me. I went to Syracuse, you had o Reilly, who, I think, went to merest. He likes to say, went to Harvard, but he went to the fake Harvard even going your head and you didn't go to college and end the reason he protein I'm U bear, who went out some middle of the road school. The reason he liked that he wasn't looking for the Yale graduate, he wanted people who could speak to real for real Americans rely over country not try to speak down to them with the glass is at the end of the nose and the use of the money
syllabic words and I thought that perhaps the fact that I went to Albany in Albany LAW, school and Syracuse undergrad would be you know something they were necessarily love, but it was exactly the opposite and he's writing it. Penetrate the lens and it's the same. is when you're, so acting lawyers. You take the people who we'll number one in their class, and you put them in the issues in a feels department. The super smart people who write brief for the court of appeal in Supreme Court. And when you looking for a trial lawyer, you you pick the sea student, because that somebody who you can put in front of people and they know how to talk to real people one of the back in the heyday, what things always astonished me ass? I never quite realised at well. I guess how it, how shall I put it? I know,
I'm not sure anyone would have looked at bill, O Reilly like walking in the room and say there's a tv star that guy here, then he has it. It's gonna be the biggest thing for some period of time, but Roger. I do realise that bill is another one for whom I have. no remaining love. I need to make that the air, down our relationship definitely took a turn, but but that does take anything away from his ability as a broadcaster. He he actually is very smart and he's a great great television guy, hee hee. wholesale he wrote the whole show he would dictated outlined. on his way into work. He it was very hands on. He knew what the people wanted to hear. I, to this day, miss the bill. O Reilly. Talking points I realize he's got them. Presence. I don't really feel drawn to it, but bill bill found a way to get right. To quote the folks rabies to calm the
folks, any Susanna, simple man and in He was, but he also had a sophistication that allowed him to take really difficult subject matter and get right down to the point and bring it home. Each night and that's why you did he did so well, I mean he's well as people who on camera he was great and off camera doing nobody likes bill. yeah so so did did to what extent of people know chronicled about Roger said I I I had no idea. I was no big Fox insider I'd, make a point every one of it. A calm there, every six months or so just to go sit down with them, is hugely entertaining and an unjust. hear stories, but I I never witnessed anything inappropriate when first the aggression crossing complaint first came up I am sure he said like terrible things,
here are the inappropriate things I wasn't- there then obviously is was much worse and that were right and so distant, but not the last point: early on in my relationship with Roger started, to change where he'd have me in his office and he'd, be giving me professional advice. Is I went in there regularly at his request, and then it would just start to get least with come and that went from body which I didn't care about. I'm it's really hot to offend me really hard to financing Today, at the end of my time at NBC, I get in trouble for me no asking that costume so offensive. If you, if it's meant to honour well limited there was once a maiden Kelly costume of like a blonde wig, and somebody walking around with a bloody tampon after Trump may suggest that I made better my period at the presidential debate, care I didn't care it's damn it's like. I Halloween but anyway my point is he didn't offend me, but I started a feeling comfortable when it got sexier. You know he
said he wanted to see me in my sexy, briars and started just lace, some innuendo. He talked about a very famous news anchor and said she smart. She slept her way to the top, and then later told me. I should be more like her, so It has to be a genius to put to you who, together in any culminated ray I'm actually trying to make out with me in his office it's all very jarring very during because I was doing well, I was covered. a Duke lacrosse case. My career was on track I knew I was just so this prior to you having any show oh yeah. Well. Prior that I was, I was the baby at box. I was a cub I had no power still sharing an office in the Dc Bureau with Major Garrick and I would come back from these New York trips and tell major like my cod, You know you're not gonna, believe this and he was exasperated. He didn't know how to help me, but he was my wife
As you see my phone light up as you can see the name of the person calling and it will be a Roger, Ales, Roger S, generals, and then you know I did. I did tell a supervisor who Mina did not. The lip, but it went away so maybe he did handle it. Maybe he did in light of this moment. I don't love, you never said anything, but he told me to avoid your. I avoided Roger for a good. I don't know eight months by the time we reunited he had moved on and I, just talked it up to the guys, look and haven't affair. This is not the first man who is looking at an affair with them with me. Then it's like tat. He took action. What's going on in his marriages between Roger and his wife, I'm not interested, but thanks for their offer right- and I think that was my own hubris. It's just thing it was all about me, and it wasn't until much later that I met John Dene. She told me
story and we're both starting to look now for other when one of those made by the most wonderful people on the planet- Justine, if you, if you don't get along with and it's you rest assured, you're the problem: so we came close in and she had a ridiculous story with him. You should read her book, mostly sunny. If you want to hear it and we just sort of started to keep our eyes and ears open to see. If there was some else and there wasn't there wasn't in fact there. Was a woman she shared in office with who came back. This is the closest we came to somebody. She came from his office in tears and genocide or what was wrong, and she wouldn't tell her and J D called me. She said Ann Kaye I think it happened she's in tears and I was like you gotta go back. You gotta ask her whether anything happened, so she did and then And swore nothing had happened. It was about something else. Well course, when everything
wrote about all the wit women? We were like. A hundred per cent happened to her that's what it was about. She grows she called me up. I thought this is it. This is the moment Tell me something did happen and I asked her all those years ago. Did something happened and the answer was no. are you sure you never know them funny live loud or not obligated, so so then said so: there's Gretchen lawsuit and that breaks down, but there, but there's a lot of, internal dissension and loyal these back and forth sooner we get back up, Roger or not, etc, where we all left him. Even I loved him. He he was such a magnanimous guy. He was extremely generous. He would help people users, low level producers at foxy develop cancer. He would do you pay for the treatments he. I remember
Greg Jarrett had a very bad alcohol problem and got embarrassed publicly on the air. Most bosses would have You know sent him away to treatment in never seen him again. Roger did get him in treatment and brought him right back. Put him on the air. Helped him come back. There's a reason. P! felt so loyal to him an end to a person said he the best boss they ever had, and I didn't want to turn on him. I didn't I wanna- tell that story- I didn't want to be involved. I didn't particularly care for Gretchen and I certainly didn't want to side with her over him, but disease I knew what had happened to me and I knew what had happened, Janis and she was twisting in the wind and all I wanted me is an invaluable gaily grit, Gretchen Earth Gretchen was twittering in the wind. No one now One came forward to say me too,
Rand. What the thing that really push me or the it was someone very close to Roger made the mistake of telling me that they felt they had had They had succeeded in getting the investigation in him into him, limited to only the very small circle that worked with Gretchen and that new that wouldn't include talent or any if you know not mean Janis or anybody, and in the people who were getting her by whom we weren't all talent but now Now many many talent were in their Cosette, so we called in there all the time. so wouldn't it wouldn't catches in the circle, sir. I really did. We know that the move was just a call the Murdoch and tell him what had happened to me all those years ago and to tell him
I didn't know whether it was a serious problem. I didn't know whether anything happen to Gretchen, but they need to do a full and fair investigation, and then they did yes and then and then you get get everything's coming out. yeah I mean it was hard news hard for me is her for Janis. You know I lost a lot of friends. It fosters to this day. I have a lot of people who won't speak to me there, because. they feel like I stuck a knife in him, and in a way I did, but I still think it was the right thing to do. You know even it even at the moment he went down, he was still physically, like darkly harassing a very young person, a fox who I know and on his way out the door he he was afraid she was gonna talk on his way out the door. He called her to tell her. You got her ten thousand dollar rays. just shut up.
Oh, it's hard meta to look around and say you I'd. I did the wrong thing. I did the right thing, but it was not without cost So have you seen the movie bombshell, yeah yeah? Is it at her? How how accurate is it. Well- I mean, in terms of my own personal story- largely accurate, largely accurate. I think clearly they cribbed from my book settle for more, which is ok, but I wasn't with my permission, but I think the caricatures of Fox are off. This is made by left wing Hollywood peoples. Of course, Fox NEWS, gotta be a buggy man and they enjoyed making Roger Ales a bogeyman which was well. He wasn't it hey man. He was doing awful things in this. one lane and in which can talk about that. But outside that he treated everyone well and they didn't capture that they did.
try to make him look like a monster so, and that was somewhat disturbing. You know we ve been better if it layer more of his complexity, they tried it right yeah, while also decides that the absence of personal want and standing by people they they imagine such a huge advocate for the network and a huge fight yeah. I know someone whose working the newsroom when he used to come down and give us tat talks, are updates about facts in it are used to use trade. Like Winston Churchill, you know like the western church of Cable NEWS, which away was a guess. He had to stop doing and people would began leaking what what he said, but he was a is enormous figure. He, is, he was funny he was self deprecating. He wasn't rational and he would make you feel, like you're part of an important team, doing something import. For America he was a patriot, so he was very innovation in that way, and I remembered just one moment of humor: he wished they after nine eleven. I join Fox NEWS in two thousand, for so it was not long after and every
He was given an emergency pack. It was like a Fanny pact that you're supposed to keep in your office with emergency supplies and run was telling us that he had these distributed to everybody in and he said in there you know you'll you'll find a masking you'll, find a small flashlight you'll find little title all, and he said, and in the event of a terrorist attack, you should take those pills and kiss your ass goodbye that's so so. Well, how did you experienced movies it flattering or is it said painful to see yourself depicted? How did you feel about it? He had painful. So good word. I cried. I cried aloud every time they put my court unquote children on the on the screen. I mean immediate tears because I did go through a lot too in an alchemist you get reminded of it. They they experienced some bad things in the way
Trump Rand. So it's You know I've watching a thinking there is reason. I repressed. All of this. I would like not wished to walk through all of us again and yet there it is written front of you. Knowledge is brought back such a pay. full time, so much went on in a first. It was that question the tramp and all the fun after it and then right on the heels of that was the Roger Ale stuff, and it's just that the part of the movie. That really upset me with meat. With his my story was they had the one of the main character. There's a very young woman turned on me and I'm her harassment on me saying why don't you start of market the Margo Martha unworthy character using. Why do you say got earlier. You did you think about the rest of us and they had the fake me. Charlie's there and say: how do you think you get to the top of fire
Snoozy snowflake has like weeds Zaire and the noose, the culture and the newsroom user. Stop that your character, kind of stops off right so I wonder whether the false and in the eyes- He stood up for women. I've never treated a woman like that and I also know whenever blamed their harassment on me and an that's not what hath in the meat to movement. Look at the women who came before Ashley Judd and rose Mc Gowan in Harvey Weinstein's case, did they blame Ashley and roses. You know this is not the way it works. It's like there were. I know that the Fox news situation, priests, you did me to movement by a year. There was no me to movement when that, whenever I doubt So anyway, I found a kind of irritating, but fine overall. That movie was a force for good shine, a light on the tough issue and I'm glad So now I don't know what I had nothing to do with and I dont really want anything to do with it. So so I ll make you
we live in more of it Megan during there's a trump aspect said so did the Trump do believe Trump had had heads up about their question or a heads up date that you're gonna come after him now don't I know people think he was given the question. He wasn't, and I think it was Jean mayor of that of the new Yorker, whose reported that he might have known and add. I think, she's taken that back Ok, air- or at least I forgot I happen to know she now knows it's not true that that piece of the reporting didn't hold up and I dont believe he was given a question, because let me tell you the only person who would have given him the question that was rugs. Ire was Roger and Roger. Didn't have the question he did not have it only. I had it and I guarded it with my life and the the other people who knew it were bred and Chris and Bill Salmon, who runs the DC bureau in our debate. For you now down. So the most
could have known. Is that I was going to ask a tough question on women. That's the most lucrative, possibly known and I had heard that that he knew I was going to ask me question on women- and I remember Thinking how does he know that, but the zero chance, he actually knew the question. As you know, the specifics of the question were: what made the question the question so there there many moments along the way when it, why should realise what's going on with Trump and how powerful phenomenon was, but one just at the outset, as you know, after their whole brew how's, he can't attack Megan Kelly that make it can. I can't say that about her and, of course you know you could make it. You could do it and say it is about a lot of other people too. Well, I mean look, I think the reason we have with me and tramp. The reason it stood out is because it was sustained and I was the first and in
he's at war with everyone. Samoan really gives a down when he goes after Jim caustic as GMO Costas out their attacking trump everyday unfairly, great, So no one cares. In my case. I have been very fair in covering tromp and that question was tough. But if you look back at the first round of the debate, questions, there were some and they were tough for every by that I mean I gave up. I gave any plus the big banks said and so on. As an debate it was amazing. I challenge anyone to show me a presidential debate that was better than that one. It was electric and in it raided through the roof, and it was a tough it was telling in those guys handled it and handle me just binding ever that question. Just fine he's really gave us a preview of what was to come. You know what I, We got to pc. This is who I am fine. That's that's not looking to find out how you gonna handle this attack as its coming. It's common and it dick
so it so you you had the sir this experience of dealing with a wave of can approach from sentiment, and I think that as there is this some weird and consequential. aid where there is capable of effectively. As far as I can tell a struggle over control of Fox between Donald Trump and and Roger, it You think that's right, or that goes too far. Well Trump, then and now wanted to control his media coverage, and he felt there were too many court unquote, never tempers on, Fox NEWS this before there were never jumpers, but he does that there it was too the goal of him. He wanted all the street news journalists to be falling in their coverage of him, which did it's not that he doesn't understand how journalism works its that he just of Jack. Stewart me wants it to be biased towards him and I think Roger was scared of losing the bright bar wing of the Republican Party in a trumps diehard loyalists
he didn't want. He wanted. I always say that I was calling them national review Republicans. He wanted national review Republicans to say with them, but he didn't want to lose the brake borrowing, and you know I think, over. time. He figured out how to do that, but it was very hard for him. He was he was worried. He asked without there's also there's never been anyone at all politicians care about what I said about them in their coverage that has never been any one is cared so much about it than Trump and and Trump also knows, and cares tv more than than anyone else is someone who is doing a little guest hosting gig on Fox during the campaign I told me a story where you guess tussing to head trump on? He asked a question that was uncomfortable with with tromp under Trump for Tromp, any kind of fumbled it an trump on the way out the building called the control room and
complained and during the break, the guy in the control room got into this disguise ear and said Mister Crop called said. Never to do that to me again, so maybe has no power to hurt you but makes you think right. They always wants to make people think and then just just in terms of his obsession with tv. In particular Fox someone told me there is remember that when the earth is right from the time of the anti scare Muti knelt down there was this dinner at the White House with bill shine and I think Kimberly oh give oil. Was there and a couple others and minor standing at the first thing that trumps said the camel Go for it when she walked into the room is: oh, you you're getting move back to five clock. You know this is when the fire was in primetime. Briefly as the first she had heard of it right, but the present United States knew more about Fox programming, then than box. Talented
it might have been his call at that point. You yeah he's, listen, you can say a lot about things about Trump, but one of them is not that he didn't and doesn't understand good tv yeah. No doubt so so you you end up in see- and I dont want to invite self pity on your part. But there are other say Those so weird, as now outsider, watching how just everyone turn on you immediately it soon to me, it seems like high school mean Earl situation where everyone was rooting against you, can it in your failure and desperately wanting you to quote fail both on the left and the right and in between just to those of the bizarre episode in our. After all, save as it was very painful year and a half
I was really on the air with NBC, for it was. It was really hard for me personally it it was the the least happy time in my adult life and I think for some people on. right. They thought somehow I had sold that I was no longer going to be fair and balanced. I somehow wanted to go you take the Trump every day and renown, my earlier reporting and so on and the left will they never. They never raised me because I was from Fox NEWS. We re normal left. I think the centre left was open minded, but you know the committed left was I own a Fox news and a story em. If people had actually wash me on for an embassy, they see it. I was the same person I ever was I defended Trump many times, including when he was attacked by some of my colleagues during the state of the union, the cabin hearings. I one hundred percent was condemning what with what the report Democrats we're doing to him all of the alleged
the victims. I knew their stories board and back and I would correct the anchors when they would miss state the facts and how many draw us all delegations there were against Bric, a Brac Avenant so and so forth, but that but when you any fans and with the left wing and the right When is it really watching that? Don't think, there's that they're going there for their news, so look it was not a good fit and an that's my fault. I should have thought that through more, I, you know rich. I was looking around I needed to leave fox. There was no question my mind had to go now because of its editorial, but because of my life I had at the time my kids were seven five and I wasn't seeing them Monday through Friday. It was awful and my my little guy Thatcher seen him Monday to Friday from nine weeks old, because that's when I went that's when we launched the telephone And it was so crushing soul, crushing I wasn t
all the time listening. My husband tell me the stories at night we'd go to bed of his. kid came and they go to Doug Side, not mine, ass a little things like that. Not now supposed to work, the innocent natal care who says that sexist I dont care and, on top of it work. Environment was terrible. That cable news This is a snake pit, especially prime time, and I was blue. by some people internally, because the Roger thing Tromp was still causing All my life, I had armed security guards. Following me around all day, because cycles were coming out of the woodwork to threat, my family had to go to Disney world with an armed guard. All this we it was like. Why am I doing this there's no amount of money. That is worth this. I have no job I remember, saying to dog movement also. My friends, if I signed
other deal here. I'm gonna get cancer. I've I've got to go and when looking for an off ramp Ali really wanted was someplace. I could still do the news and raise my family looked around. It was like I'm not gonna, go to see an end. That was clear abc, really wanna go to like the revision. anchor and good morning America distaste whatever some looking around thinking, I'm not sure, but embassies I carry. You can have your own show You can do in a news year, Sunday Joe, You can be home by one o clock in the done, but I didn't spend enough time thinking about fit So I'm I'm grateful I got out and grave lightly were offering for me. I'm grateful for the people I met. There are a lot of great people work inside the building, not all of them and I was certainly a learning experience. I'll say that so it was was broad, not some said, first of all
me, too movement. You consider it a success, something in between had he read how its change things. I have mixed feelings on it. I think it's very good that people, like the guys I named before were dethroned. The great world is better off. Women are better off, not having like that in the positions they were in, so I applaud that piece of it. I think you got weapon ized against people like Brett Havana and that completely gutted. It was good when people were holding up signs believe all women Haven't I hearing I felt it was over. That was the end of me too, because they What a sized it? No one in their right mind believes we should believe all women women are humans and capable of lying hello. Jewish neck, hello, Duke Lacrosse, and they completely. First themselves when Tariq came forward against Joe Biden. I didn't you,
anybody, SAM believe all women, then an effect Joe Biden himself. Had I believe all women and did a one eighty. So please spare me and the other right The thing that I objected to was people started sort of morphed from Joe dont grab women Office, don't condition promotion on sexual favours dont lace, every precision with a woman who worked for you with sexual innuendo, that kind of them into its some- abusive too. As somebody to work on Saturday. You just- morphed into this thing, where people felt any any critic. Them at work with somehow bullying and oppressive, and I can't brook that I just think that's absurd manner now afraid to pay you any sort of a compliment to hold the door open for you. It's ridiculous, and on top of that rich. I worry that it's gone so far. That now
and who are at the top and they still are the top they control most corporate Amerika there's cared They don't want to hire a woman in the sea swede offices because one Allegation can ruin a brilliant thirty years. Career, and I mean you may not like it, but that's the Ruth? And so it's not that I wish them to movement didn't happen, but there have been real consequence to it, not all of which are good and what did the media environment generally? We have this bizarre situation where we, we obviously haven't unreliable, the narrator in in the White House. No seeds example that almost every day, but then we we a media that just very often is hysterical and over the top and unreliable itself, the media's dead. The traditional media is dead. When it comes to credibility, there's does no one left to root for, and people know it they can tell
I have your favorite channel, but you know that there is giving you the spin. You wanna hear, there's it's very hard to find facts now in I've. Had the advantage of looking at this as a consumer over the past couple years, as opposed to a newswoman and I've been so fresh. Because there's I'll watch Brett Bear, I think, is ours, fair and outside of bread. I know I'm just getting spin and critics. Spun, along as I watch at virtually every other programme, and what I do now is I got a real, clear politics: dot com every morning red, editor ills from the right and the left, and, if you put them over one, another facts begin to emerge from the truth begins to emerge you're, not gonna, satellite. Yet I'm back, I never sit and watch an hour of Rachel Matter. I mean never because that she's out and conspiracy fantasy land- and I know him you know: you're gonna get with Hannah. Rihanna percent spin is, though you might want that. But that's
gonna get you ve. Never ever gonna hear criticism of vanity of Trump unhandy. So what is the truth? If you want to know the truth, you really have to work, for which is now are the reasons why launch this podcast. Yet it's it's completely. what I mean my I take us as a matter of faith. In anything we hear trumps say our selves University on Twitter. Ok, you said it, he did it, but you anything else in your report about the ministrations reporting about that. The that policy there some chance it's wrong or distorted, not all that is in such sometimes it's legit and and there it nailed on stuff, but it's like the old cliche about advertising budgets. You know, I know I know you're wasting fifty percent of your advertising budget. I just don't know which half and I think that's how you have to approach a lot of media coverage
any and you dont know unless, as you say, you dive into it and make a concerted effort to get the bottom of it yourself for virtually every story. That is bad for Trump. You cannot trust the media they salivate over trying to and you can't trust him on those stories either because it does not adult relationship with the truth. So you're just sitting home. That's why Cove it has been so frustrating because you want. real information. You wanna know like how how dangerous is it? How bad is it how Do we have to wear these masks? What about hydroxide chloric when, like? What am I supposed to believe the people have? struggled- and I I resent it. I resent the me as complete surrender to their own bias. Is we do need the press and we don't have him.
So you struck out you're on and a couple voice. I have your own production company right and posting interviews to Youtube and you started a podcast. So what? What is your? What's your thinking about behind these various initiatives? Well, reasons I just pointed go someplace where I could say what I want to say, have to censor myself whether it's about Trump or these woke schools who are trying to kid, down on everybody about the way they talk in the way they think in the way they act. I'm sick of them sick of people shaming one another over nothing, and I can't stand how You can't take on these issues in any real or meaningful way on television. Because gravity, sir. They can avoid you you're your boss, too scared? Let you say anything, so I think that
Digital media is the future where you can control your own space and if people subscribed my show and download my podcast is because they want to be there. They they wanna, hear me cover the news. The way I cover the news and you don't like it, you don't have to do it. So I am very happy to be in a space where I can talk about black lives matter very openly and what the actual facts are, police shootings. I can do the same with respect to the Trans issues name it. I can do it and trump for that matter. I think people are ready to hear straight talk on all of those issues in more and and to have be fearless it in and that's what I'm begging on that the people will come because they want they want more of that sort the equivalent in the print world. You you have folks cut of splintering, often starting in it
newsletters on sub stagger Andrew Salvin, going back and as starting with would effectively as his blog again but going places where they can't be is cancelled or censored, or at least as much harder to do that. Now I see myself a bit like. Matter, you be in Andrew Sullivan claimed green, wild and even very wise who's, gonna land. Well, I'm sure after leaving the New York Times I see myself in that same lane. I don't I dont perfectly fit at the existing media outlets and I dont need to. I have an audience out there and that that I've already connected with and I know they'll come in. I have to build. It's gonna take a while, but I know they'll be there. I know My connection with them is, and was real. I know it and
I don't! I don't need Roger Rails or Fox news to make it happen. I certainly don't need NBC and Andy lack. I'm just gonna go directly out there, and even if I have to listeners, Rich Creighton than an week after all have ten. You know now build it slowly, so is there a rhythm to the union? its origin to do them just one when you have something something good has has that work? Well, I started my u to channel before lunch, my podcast the way, I've just doing the interviews I was interested in doing while I was off and it was great I enjoy them that's where my tar red interview, isn't it that target in our view, has got about a million hits on Youtube, but the clips that have been taken from it is. We have a metric that can see other places, The cliffs were used, was seen by more people than watch sixty minutes on any given night may it went everywhere, so you really can have access to the date they package. On the today shortly was a morning were Andrea Mitchell got up got dressed, put her make up.
and went on the today Show and Anne did report on my interview and it happened on all the other networks to so it can be a powerful tool for getting an interview out there if had tar red come to me today and we knew we were in that boat that we're in then I'd probably do both a video and a podcasting wine. I just I didn't have a package that we saw anything visual. I think you tube is good for and its point. We may add a visual element to the park as too. So what what's podcast called The maiden Kelly show Ok, Sir Launcelot! Haven't you ever want to be an easy matter? It does not want to have to work for it to an end often we can do that. right now we're doing it three times a week, more three or four depends on the new cycle:
and you know will see like that. May not be enough for me because I do like to work. I'm I'm a worker. It's not that I want to be home a hundred percent with my children. You can you can over correct so rosy right now is three times a week. So, let's, as promised, get a little put it monetary and before you go so what what are you rate? Trumps odds, the polling hasn't looked good last week or so, where are you on his chances? Now. Well, I listen to you guys on the editors, and I know that you guys around forty percent Charles is brought down a little. I think it's a
he's down it white, like forty five lower just years, trying to prove that Europe is there a listener here, but well saying I just back just I'm, I'm I'm revealing my bias rich. I'm revealing that you put some people in my head that are gonna effect. My answer, I guess I'm the higher than that a little, than that because I think, even though that the press loves to tell these national poles they're not meaningful, you have to look state to state realize trumps, not fairing, very well and most of those, but I cannot believe that there isn't a strong shy Trump vote there, and especially now, where the people are openly calling everyone who supports him, a racist, a big it, a transfer of xenophobia. Sexist. You know you name it. No one wants to be called that, so I do think that there is a healthy contained
like a suburban women. They talk about. I know a lot of those women and if a pollster called they would not say Trump. You can't even like tweet right now that in any way, defends, M or defence anyway, Issues he's been speaking of people getting fired for doing such things. I think they say no what they do in the voting boxes, something also we'll see here right now. If I wouldn't have noticed in the neck and neck of the woods were where I am, and people have long signs that you'll see a fair amount of by Harris, lawn size, you'll see zero trump lawn signs therefore, you will see houses with long signs for Ray other republican care. because, on the one hand, the ballot either from state wrapped state Censurer, governor whatever, but obviously people are worried about actually putting the trump signs up right. It's it's absurd, because tromp clearly handsome character issues. It's not like. I want my boys to grow up,
be just like him and yes, Stormy, Daniels and all the rest of it. That's not really my goal, but I do think he's been really unfairly maligned on being all the things I just listed over incidents that had been have. If it had happened with a different politician. They never would those conclusions, they ve decided early on that he's all the interests and then his Havre necessarily gets filed into one of those categories, because it confirms a pre existing belief, the so what you think buttons. I think they're trying to weaken it burns him just did November? Third, as sectors get involved, I'm over the finish line, and then they don't care- and it's like just you just stand up: now we know tat video of Joe Biden pulling him away from the crowd. That's part of it like for the love of God. You ve got three
and then I dont know what they're going to do is, I don't think you're in love with their vice presidential nominee. But I guess you she's better than rob in their view, but I think Biden he could be, I mean he's gonna like Trump and that he can be charming. Truck personally is very charming before supper. Here they magnanimous. If you want to charm you you we'll be charmed issue. He doesn't want to charm everyone agenda Biden too. He he can be exe, only warm personal, it's just I don't know you. Seventy six years old and when you listen to talk over time, you did ok that debate, but over time is really no question that he's in cognitive decline which is normal for seventy seven year old, but it seems pretty noticeable, and I worry I worry about.
he's gonna have a lotta responsibility if he gets this job. So so last question so, let's let's say buttons does wins and November. Neither of us are predicting that, but let us say he does so. What is that, due to the the media, does immediate bounced back to conclude any level of normality? Pre, tromp, oars, just or or, as you said earlier is just credibility is dead and we pass the event horizon and were never going back it once in its credibility is dead coming back, that that I believe, but absolutely the media will go back to defending Joe Biden. You you'll only see him getting criticized on Fox. If you're gonna watch television, you watch it even in print the Washington Post, democracy dies in darkness. The other, the new saying is gonna. Be lightness returns.
Light so I, have any doubt that what CNN is going to do is run cover for him for the next forty years. If he wins and fox wellbeing. less defensive of the president. Then they word during the Trump years do you mean he's gonna do is gonna. Do you? You can't trust them that their they're all about Ben and, frankly, there all about their bottom line. That's the truth. Having did ABC Nbc Fox. What they really want to do is make money it's not about some public service of bringing you the truth and that's why I feel that the future is people finding individual people who they trust, who they trust for information, what are the reason not nodded stroke, your show too much but one of the reasons why I like the editors. Is you got people who are there like open Did you try to love them? Their open minded to him, and they can. They can judge his sick Sesar and failures honestly based they can. see him honestly without
colored glasses and without demonizing everything he does an that's. How I feel I can see him honestly and report on him honestly, which is a rare thing in today's day and age. ok. That's it for us even listening to a NASH, Review, podcast injury, broadcast retransmission cow this game. Without the express written permission of now sure you magazine a strictly prohibited, despite gases have produced by the incomparable, sir, should he who makes us and better than we deserve? Thank you Megan and thanks. I want for listening. We are the editors and we'll see you.
Transcript generated on 2020-11-01.