This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
This episode is brought to you by peacock bridge ending the original limited series, a friend of the family, based on story of the Jan roper kidnappings from nickel. Oscar executive producer of the act and candy and direct producer, eliza hip and comes a dark compelling look at the harrowing story through new lands produce which amber burke herself. This theory stars anna pack, when jake lacy college hanks LEO Tipton and mckenna grace stream. Now
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I'm doing good just how are you doing one for real a lot more people subscribing to our patriotic. Thank you very much its awesome. We are planning on a many sued coming up. The slender men stand.
in a lot of other podcast- have covered it. So we're just going to do it on our patriotic. So look for that and please subscribe if you aren't I know that I will just go out and hit play on. a lot of podcasts and never subscribed to them, but subscribing does help. So, if you're on itunes hit that subscribe button, whatever use on your android phone, thank you very much and a special thank you to me. Erin from australia have is a very nice email and messages. like that. Well, they make our day. So thank you. So What are we talking about tonight? Aaron tonight's topic is Maybe in one way may not be a after. You learn what happened, but the belt islands massacre, and this is the belt islands that are located in hudson bay, hudson bay, exactly and what year was is ninety,
forty one, I know lately weaving covering a lot of men, or cases some of them evolving, possibly innocent people. This one really caught my eye because it's an older case, I'm not saying it's exactly. The same thing, but if you ve ever seen old movie title, the gods must be crazy, where a man finds hope bottle and then crazy things happen afterwards this kind of similar, except in involves into it finding a bible, and then it turns into jameson We should start by saying that most people, in this planet have a need to be spiritual or to have a religion to have a god to have a belief system of some sort,
and in the baltic islands, this bible that had been translated into the inuit language. Well, it was quite different from there my belief system. So what do they normally practice or believe in? I know that they have shamans in medicine, men, but what's their religion They believe that there are our spirits in everything, even poop. in your religion. They have gods for, as we said spirits and everything say cad lou would be noise key to would be fun air and then Agnes stock would be pisses. Now, I'm not pronouncing these correctly, probably but
There's some very interesting spirits better described in their religion. Some of them are just downright demonic and you can go down a rabbit whole reading about these creatures than their very strange indeed, but I would recommend, if you're Stayed in other religions. Definitely check out this animism system that the emu it believed in its known as animism, so there animism and shamanism, and some of the gods that you hear about are pretty interesting. So it sounds like a branch of native american belief systems very much about having to do with spirit.
Everything has a spirit, the belcher islands. They are not very accessible, especially previous to the time that we'll be talking about the hudson bay company did a lot of surveys and they attempted to go over there a lot, but they didn't find that you know setting up a post. There would be worth it normally. You could set up a post and you could trade with the people that lived there. You could trade them goods for furs. Se, fi spurs or eider skins. They didn't really feel it was worth it, and ships moving into that area often had trouble and would rack so kind of dangerous. They region is very rocky. There's a quite a bit of wind wins pretty normal over there. I guess there's not a lot of trees and voyage to block the wind either, because a lot of this is just sheets of ice. Yeah there are sheets of ice and in the region can be fairly rocky. What are the average temperature?
in this area as well in the winter, its negative, twenty, three or so celsius, and then summer. It's about on average, is about ten celsius. So it's always below free. with the wind, chill horrible horrible conditions well, that's why they need to wear their parkers and any that lives in a very cold region with where caribou skins protect them from the cold. But something happened around eighteen, eighty out in the belt islands, where ice just took over the feeding grounds of these caribou and they they change their migration. So they don't have any caribou, but they would do instead as they would use eider duck skin. and it takes, I think, twice as many. It's actually a lot heavier of a parka, but they make do theyve. They just switched over to iders for
caribou and the sea ice can take over quite a bit of the area, but this, actually them to go from island island or to get other trading posts or to find other hunting ground so the ice actually allows them to travel better because travel by boat is kind of dangerous. Anyway, you, you got all kinds of icebergs, you have. The sea ice, which is huge blocks of ice. That way, hundreds of pounds so navigating through that is just not on how they would do it. So what is this do for de animals and wildlife when the ices taken over like this? Well, they have a surprising amount of wild life out there, but really what makes the biggest change is. The hudson bay company moves in and in eighteen, twenty eight establishes a seasonal trading post. The
but people that live there. They start to discover hey. Instead of going hunting and fishing like they normally do, they can actually just trap animals and then trade, the skins in for goods from the hudson bay company, and so I go from one hunter: gatherer type, people to a tradie like a trading trapping trapping for pelts over the years, with the conditions getting more and more harsh, it seems that there's less and less animals for them to trap and it's sort of a famine. Well, as we said it's the case that the cases will be covering it, it happened in nineteen, forty one and around that time,. Hunting conditions got worse, so they were able to hunt lass, or at least they were bringing unless pray, and not only that, but because of world war. Two.
there really wasn't any movement from the people. They were trade with so of the planes were taken over by the royal canadian air force and that They cut down on goods being dropped off the internet, people that lived in the area. We are starting to experience real hard, yep and the canadian government said that they were the most destitute people they had ever come across. They'd shifted their lifestyle from hunter gathers to trappers because of the trading post, but because of the war and because of the lack of animals, they were pretty much left out in the cold yeah. It said that only the best hunters would be able to bring in what the people needed, and so your average hunter just wasn't
mean that well anymore, there were some very good hunters at the time a nineteen forty one one of them was peter salah, but the hudson bay company in nineteen fifteen had a prospector in their employment name. Robert Flaherty and he went to the belcher islands with a motion picture camera Really sad thing was, apparently he had shot a lot of footage of the people and of the life out there. He was smoking a cigarette and he caught the film on fire. It went up in smoke literally, so he had to re shoot and he would make a film titled now nuke of the north. This is very much like a bland between a documentary and a movie, because the way the inuit people are depicted in the film more exactly accurate in a key
ask them to act a certain way. I do believe nuke means polar bear, so he used this name instead of the real name, the person, because it was too difficult to pronounce for the average person, despite the film being dishonest about thee. Often felicity of this main character, who actually knew a lot about white people when, in the film he said, like it was a new discovery, and he had no idea about white people at all. It still became very popular and revealed this world that most people had no idea existed. So I think it's much less zoos. Are you know you can look at as zoo and you can come up with a lot of negatives about the zoo, but, on the other hand, your exposing people to animals and hopefully getting them to appreciate them more. It's kind of like a mixed bag.
In this film, probably drove home that these people were very isolated, with very little contact with the rest of the world. Since the rest of the world didn't know about that. But, as we said before, they are trading with the hudson bay trading company. They do have different businesses and in ties to the real world, We mention Peter salah before and another man who is around at the time in this camp is charles or Iraq? Sorry for mispronouncing his last name, it's hard to say he's it short frail twenty seven year old. A who after Meteor shower declares himself Jesus Christ hold on what is it? What does he do There's a man whose and elder in the camp and will attempt to say his name is keechawik.
and he was forty. Seven years old, possibly considered a showman, he was reading the bible and he was telling others about Jesus Charles or charlie, really picked up on this. For some reason, they were kind of associating the meteor shower with this new religion. It was a sign from the heavens right. We don't really know the true motivation here of charlie, but it seems as though he wanted to move up in status heat. He wasn't content with being not a great hunter and probably not real popular either by becoming Jesus Christ. I suppose he was hoping that that would move him up status wise and he would become more popular. That would be my guess anyway. Sounds innocent enough, this other man keechawik
He's the one that's considered to be the one that people would normally go to and Charles is now now Charlie is saying: hey, I'm Jesus, I'm the guy come to me Peter sal, he's a very tall man and he was considered to be the best hunter and belcher islands not long after I mean we're talking days, maybe two days after charlie declared himself to be Jesus and the people because of charlie, I do believe start referring to peter god and peter doesn't exactly come out and say guys I'm just peter now heap he accepts it, but he plays along with charlie or Jesus now. This will have a big effect. Because keto x, reading the bible, the bible has been translated into the annual language, but he
really focusing on the end of the world, and so there is some prophecy going on- and this starts to spread, jesus now around. Now I guess you could say things are escalating, both god and Jesus here. Talking about charlie and peter kill quite in them or of slight dogs. They told people that the end was coming a miraculous things were going to happen. So they didn't need all these slide dogs anymore, As we said at the time they were going through some real hardship. The hunter was not as good the value of the goods they would trade for other goods. We know, had gone down in value, one things that happened was that fox furs between deed nineteen twenties and nineteen forties had dropped in back. From about you know. I'd say to about a quarter of its value,
So you can see how things were getting hard for them, so people get getting hungry and they were kind of losing some hope things weren't, looking so good. So when their hearing that the end is coming and that there is going to be this rescue of sorts and miracles would happen, amazing things and they started to get a look cited and it was a long before I'd say about thirty five or just over that of the two hundred people in the camp were following him: we're saying your Jesus. They had to have been destitute day. They had no hope they weren't getting anywhere. So the new testament. They read some passages out of exodus and now we have two men who say they are the most important deities in the world and salaries.
miracles were you know they said well. If we don't have the sled dogs, how are we going to get around and they said? Don't worry when the end comes then all of you will be able to fly and they say everything be provided for you. So we need material possessions. We don't need anything that will be the end of hunger saying you can fly to me slight crazy promises made to get people to just buy into this, to just carry on with their idea? Obviously thirty five of them are buying into this, but we still have over a hundred and fifty that are not misled. Dogs were just the getting now the divinity of the two men was not to be questioned, the first person to come out and say you're, not Jesus you're, not god was on january twenty six, a thirteen year old girl, Sarah Pocock, she told peter
you're, just Peter salah, on the outside and peter salah on the inside He said now, I'm god, Charlie Jesus, said that this girl was satan and what he did was he grabbed a primus. Nov it's like a little handheld stove and you can light it and then you'll have a flame coming out the top of it yeah just to heat a can of something yeah you could heat can up with it and he's put. It right up to her face. So when they held that up to her face, they were verifying that she was evil that she was satan and somehow the light of this little girl I have in this little stove is going to tell them everything they need to know. They are now interpreting that this flame will tell them if somebody is evil or not, and then her half rather, who is the son of Robert flirty, the man we told you about who
visit in nineteen fifteen nineteen. Sixteen would really get angry with her any hitter, a number of times with a piece of driftwood after she struck with the pisa driftwood he's then taken out and she is beaten to death with the barrel of a rifle by another girl who is a much older than her aimed a clinic and she then declares that she has killed satan. He held a celebration because Satan was dead. She complained that her hands were cold after beating the other girl to death with the barrel of a rifle, because metals pretty cold in this temperatures of that her reaction to this murder. Satan is now dead and they can carry on catalytic he's an elder and a lot of people respected him. After what happened with Sarah, he came out and said no, these,
men, Jesus god, nano they're, not designs, and god they're just men there, just peter and charles on january, twenty seventh peter and another man name at lay talk, would attack keechawik peter, would harpooner twice once to the body. I believe, and then once in the face so peters now embraced his role and will not be challenged at lay talk, would take a weapon and shoot him twice after catalytic was dead, Peter declared, I have killed satan, so anyone that's speaking, In questioning these men there being labelled as satan and murdered it lay talk, had gotten ammunition. He needed bullets from Jesus to stop satan intercourse celebration. It was this death of the elder.
or the inuit elder. That, like you, said, really drove home, that the others in the camp needed to comply with Jesus and god, because if you spoke out against them, if you weren't with them, you were against them, will Satan's the great deceiver and and Satan's the only power that will challenge god, so any
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isn't willing to challenge- and maybe he knows what they are capable of so he's not gonna- put up a fight, the I'm not sure that's quite I mean. I almost want to say that when these two men come in and declare themselves as Jesus in god they he just accepts it, because there's a man named ec pock he's twice years old and he was key to walk sun and we don't for sure whether he knew his father had been murdered or not that's up in the air, but he defied them as soon as he came across them. He said that they weren't Jesus or god and on February. Ninth cork said he did believe and he shot ec pop twice and he declared say he's dead. So now Satan is died three times so the law or of the other tribe son questioned
yeah the sharm in the inuit elder key act from the original can his son EC park was in the new cap. and so when Jesus and god go, there he's the first one mountain say no, you guys are not Jesus in god, I know who you are you're peter sala and they weren't having it correct is the one that kills them. So as the leader of the other tribal that I think it was up until Peter shows up so now we have three deaths, at this point a man who is an employee of the hudson bay company, whose around contacts his company and says: hey, we ve had three murders out here. We need to get broken. Eighty mount a police, but this is all by telegram so tat
time to send takes time to reply. This is not a speedy process in march of nineteen, forty one peter salah and a man name earnest riddle, who is a post manager for the hudson bay company liefer great EL, while their travelling Peter salah seems to changes tune. I mean up to this point. He said strong. He was again satan. He was god but now, while he's travelling with rideau t, tells him a number I'm that he's a bad man and by banning saying he saying I'm a bad man, not I'm gone he's saying: I'm a man and I've done something wrong. Yeah they're gone for some weeks and, in the meantime, Jesus or Charlie is winning over Peter sister Mina
she's married to a man named moses. By now, Moses can't compete with with Jesus she started going around in telling everyone that Jesus was going to return, saying now, be wondering some of you why, if she's now- eating this Jesus, why she would be saying that Jesus is coming soon by it. Has not to do with he had as the spirit of Jesus. In his thoughts, I guess is the best way I describe it suits. Basically speaking for Jesus Jesus will actually return riding a kayak from the sky, so I get it he's the holy spirit is in charlie, so he's behaving or acting as a proxy for Jesus and peters, thee, god and then the real god. Real Jesus is going to return
It's something very similar to that. When anybody has written about this, it said that he's telling people that he is because both Jesus and the holy spirit in him and because of their other, beliefs, europe kind of seeing a mingling of the two and you're, seeing a very basic understanding of christianity being forced onto their belief system, so he's going to return in a kayak that sort of makes sense why they would think that way cause anyone else who thinks of the return of Jesus is just a light in the sky or there's all kinds, different bullies out, there's not going to generalise too much right and the other way that they meld the two. Is he saying that the spirit of Jesus spirit of the holy spirit are in him, and so people can kind of relate to that because they believe our spirits and everything it just. He has special spirits. Mina really starts taking
A spar because she's telling people that gene this coming soon on mars. Twenty nine. She takes about twelve people who are mostly women and children. Answer its pushing them towards the ice. It would be dangerous. I mean because it's so cold and is getting to go out there now they're starting to resist they're starting to say I don't want to go out there. I want to stay in my igloo, where it's warm, I don't want to be outside. It was in their homes. Yeah you want to stay in their shelters and not come out into the elements, but she has a dog whip. Apparently these are kind of nasty. It sounds like a pistol shot when you crack it and that some of the sled dogs they use. and sometimes be missing. An eye or have like a chip off the air, because these dog whips wisely do damage if they may contact and she's whipping this in cracking us people,
urging them to go forward and, while she's doing that, telling them. You know. Jesus is coming and she said Had you won't need your material things? You need to remove your clothes, you, you won't need them anymore. Jesus is coming. The end is coming a couple of the adults, they finally had enough there like no we're not doing this their kids out here, and they said to move kids back off of the ice onto the shore line and she's, yelling still trying to get them to stay out their cracking this whip at them, and the two people who are trying to help one of them is here's wife. Her name is also mina. She starts moving some children away from the ice and then mean is husband who you know. Crazy, mina, her husband, Moses, is out there trying to help and get kids away. Sadly, half of them die And I think this is very significant, because we ve already had three,
but now we have six dead end their dead from exposure. one was peters mother who was maria nuke iraq. She was fifty five, then Peter son alack, who is eight johnny seven who was as adopted son and then A woman named communal Sarah. She was thirty, two and her sons, John, these six and moses, who is thirteen so gods family? Basically, all this children. He he lost two sons. He lost his mother. He lost his nephews, you lost the sister, it's pretty bad any put together that he had gone this journey with Mr dell and while he's gone, he sang I'm a bad man, and now
Well he's gone, his family is being killed by his sister and his sister. I dont know how she's getting away with this, especially one gods. Wife is god's wife. I ride. I would just assume she would put her in check but she's. Obviously a believer in cheese. Taking this as far as she can. Ah, Monsieur it's because she wants to up her status and the tribe. I don't think she heard it all for anything that Peters wife had to say. I think again we're talking about spirits and having bodies, and she didn't. He Many divine spirit in her. So what she said didn't matter, and I also think that She saw Jesus as the real leader. That's what I think not peter god. Now right cheek, He was interested in charlie and Jesus. on April second of nineteen, forty one is when ernie riddle earnest, rideau, ernie and peter salah return from hunting and
they come back with an anglican missionary named the reverend Nielsen reverend George Nielsen phony finds out about the six deaths any sends a telegram to the arcy mp and he's as there have been further murders, come immediately. He M goes out and prepares a runway of sorts using coal sacks and he waiting nervously for a plane, because he knows, if he's caught doing this, he will become well he's worried he might be, and he does have some protection has a twenty two rifle any carries it with him wherever he goes, I don't think he really understood at the time that they're just more plain sitting round waiting to take mounted police out there all the time? oh yeah. All the plans are being used for the war effort, so they had no way of getting out their plus. It's such a remote area. You have to access it biplane, but I think the
The arcy mp understands the gravity of the situation and with nine ass. Now they really feel like they need to do something in there. Were no regular patrols out there. They just there was no need to. They left those people to their own devices. They dare their own people. Our sea mp went on a mission to find a way to get out there to the belt violence and then in defining a plain that was in disrepair and they had a reply. Where'd. They they had to go scavenge parts from other planes in piecemeal. This thing together I'll take. I would want to fly that across icy oceans to an island, but they made it work, I dunno, maybe maybe they have some good mechanics out there on April. Fifteenth The mounties announced that they have apprehended seven people in connection with the nine murders
they make it out to the island and as they approach the camp, they start questioning the people and their very open about eerily open up it they'd do not deny anything, they explain matter factly will. This is what happened in this is why we killed these people, investigators are the mounted police are able to determine who was responsible for this very quickly, because they can just ask anybody and they tell them. There is no hiding or concealing anything, and so they are able to arrest the appropriate people
On April fifteenth, the mounties announced that they have apprehended seven people in connection with the nine murders. Peter Salah ad lie talk, Charlie Orrick, Alec, a padauk, a key nick karak and mina. So there are five men and two women. Now it takes til august nineteenth, but the royal canadian mounted police they put up a white tent. A trial will begin. The people involved here are judge. Plaques then judge Charles
p, plaques, din and the jury is pretty interesting because it consisted of six people to mining engineers, jack Ruby and emmi holtzman to reporters who were there to cover what was going on James mc cook, from the toronto star and william came in from the canadian press, a ship's engineer named Ed cat me and a fur trader who worked for the age bc, ernie redoubt so much for a trial by your peers. Here, though, that they didn't really have any one that was part of the tribe on on the jury. Well, I So there's two ways to look at this: you can look at it as they didn't respect d n. You had enough to let them judge their own people, their peers, or they fell like they will be working from the ground up with them, and that would be too much work and aid needed to make this happen quickly, because they will have a lot of time getting people there.
me with the war going on making this trial happen is difficult enough, With the language barrier, they probably have no concept of our legal system or a deep, the canadian legal system so trying to explain all of that to them, but still I'm a little perturbed that they don't have any of em on their ok, see you could probably say: well, they wanted to be fair. They could have found some people who had enough grasp of the english language that they could have used them, but it still difficult to know whether they would have understood exactly what was her. Meaning- and I ll give you an example. When the welcome eighty monopolies and the judge and the prosecutor, and everybody was coming in the annual p were so happy to see them and they didn't mind that some other people were getting arrested were people having a trial because they didn't quite understand what was happening as just an said when they were being
ass. Ok, some people died, oh yeah was so, and so they had no problem saying who was the gravity of the situation was in quite there in the way that you would imagine it would be. The trial would take place over a couple of days and six of the seven would be tried on the first day, which should be august nineteenth of nineteen forty one before they could really start the try, Well, one thing they needed to clarify and saddle was mina. They didn't know if she was saint or not, because she acted so crazy when she was driving those people onto the eyes. She was using a dog whip and she was telling them to this robe and then from everyone. They talked. she just she was acting crazy. Even her husband was saying she so normal and then after Jesus came, then she third acting crazy. It was a very short time period between, This man declares he's Jesus and the first murder scene.
Evaluated by a coroner. He says that he thinks she's saying K so a court, She says she's saying when she's driven people out of their homes and under the ice and kept him out there until they froze to death, in regard to mean a being considered saying she was taken to toronto. The psychiatrist. There said she. to be normal. So they know they said she was fined, go back and stand trial, Another note that sir, I think is really interesting here when they're going to conduct this trial over the two days in august, the nineteenth and twentieth, and both the judge and the prosecutor. The prosecutor is richard a
homestead and both of them say some things which today people might be taken aback by. Like woe, don't say that little racist, it's very strange. They talk about how. Basically these are primitive people and that they are not as good as the white man. You know, that's firstly, whether getting at because they're so primitive, they don't have modern understanding, they don't have the same justice system there, not an advanced society, and even the prosecutor said that he is. Doesn't seem to like applying the canadian law to these primitive people. He says
in their using this argument, in their favour in their defence saying they don't have a grass so that they don't know that their doing wrong. With this misinterpretation of the bible and the prosecutor even says that he thinks it's a mistake cause hanging. These people is not going to deter them from doing anything, it's their knock and understand. The punishment or the justice that there would be extracting from them at the trial. They decide that she's not guilty for reasons of insanity. Now, that's not quite right, because that wasn't a real judge. at the time when they were really saying, is that it was temporary insanity now a key it very similar. They said, she's not guilty due to violent religious, hallucinations, So, in other words,
she didn't know she was doing wrong because she was hallucinating, probably because of the misinterpretation. She was filled with these ideas that were wrong, but she didn't know it at the time call it morbid delusion than a hallucination but yeah. I know the men were found guilty of manslaughter because they had mistake. We believe they had killed satan, and this is something that's well documented from the trial is that they say that there was an earlier case. I think from the twenties so, where a man who killed another man, because he thought he was a wind ago and so they can only give him manslaughter because he thought he was killing something that needed to be killed. and only later realized. He had made a mistake and They were applying the same reasoning, two's these men here, because they were saying out they made mistake if they had actually killed satan, they be ok, but because it didn't turn out to be so
They had made a mistake and so wasn't first or second degree There wasn't malice involved here. In the same way that it would be if they had just killed another person, I've jealousy or to steal their food. We get support from thumbtack, How will you ever stop here to do list from growing? You could become a magician or You can do what I did and download thumbtack it's the at the fines, local was for all your home projects hire a plumber to fix your leaky said or a handy man to hang your curtains. You can even higher approach to organize your messy closet, yet there people in your city who specialise in that. I actually just downloaded the thumbtack up and I could feel my apartment breathe, a sigh of relief, hello, fresh paint and an he's a unit that actually works on the thumbtack abbe. You can compare prices, read, reviews and chat with prose directly when you found the right person, you can book them with just a tap. All of those annoying projects will just disappear. Maybe it is a little magic down, I'm tack and start your next project. Today, after years,
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jeanne bucks a month at mint mobile dot com, slash podcast than the transcripts from the trailer are pretty straightforward. They, they say: did you kill this man and they'll say who and they'll be like? Did you kill him and all they'll say yes like? Did you have a problem with them they'll say no or like well? Why did you shoot him say? Charlie said he was safe? That's it, for instance both Alec a pocock A key neck stated that they thought Sarah was satan at that time, but now They don't believe she was, they made a mistake and cork add, lay talk and Iraq were tried together. Clarke said he didn't believe that epoch with satan anymore He said that he had had a conversation with the reverend Nielsen later on, and The reverend Nielsen had enlightened. Ten was the show him why that person was not satan, and so he,
I realise that he had made a mistake now, cork, sentence was suspended or remitted because the judge fell the way things were going and he had a feeling that they were going to be putting some of these people away, that it wasn't fair to take the best hunters away from inuit people, and so he said that quark his sentence could be remitted because he could be a hunter and provide for his people because he felt like he'd, be killing the entire tribe if he removed this. and from the tribe, yet they needed his hunting skills. Now more than ever, other mitigating factors of where they lived. I The judge actually says life in this desolate region, exposed to the cruellest conditions and even on the verge of extermination, is not conducive to excessive gentleness. So it's the environment is a mitigating fat.
Or for his considerations of punishment, yeah and speaking of that. Not only was the environment a mitigating factor, but the people themselves I mean knowing what their history was and how this was all new to them. They didn't have the same amount of guilt that say a person in tehran, would have for murdering a neighbor. They had it completely different life, the conditions under which they were trying to live, and this new religion together It's almost like they were saying. These are mitigating factors you can't if they weren't combining in this perfect storm. These murders never would have happened. Add later He received one you're in prison and hard labor or AK charles. The man who said he was Jesus Christ and the holy spirit. He said he no longer he was no longer Jesus. If you look, over the trial here, everybody, was coming out in saying yes, that that was not me back there.
Were totally disowning everything that they had believed. He all oh yeah, he admitted tat. He had given ammunition to outlay talk to kill catwalk the yeah. He he said that key to walk was no longer satan. Eden believe that key to walk had been satan anymore. He bessy said that he had made miss like you know, just like everyone else did or ok sense was two years in prison with hard labor peter salah. He went on trial the next day on august twentieth. Nineteen, forty one, you know we talked about it, he was the man in belcher islands and he became god. If you look at what happened, especially every left. In march and then we came back in April. He found out that many of his family had been murdered. He felt incredible remorse
he said. As someone who everyone looked up to, he felt like he was the one who should have stopped all this, but I think it's the the power, the feeling of power and he was already a powerful man before he was given that status of god and then you know he was wearing it like a brand new suit felt good in it and people were looking up to him even more than ever? He now at that time realized that this was a huge mistake and it cost him a lot, a costume many of his family members, and it would get him two years in prison with hard. Were lets us. Let's say this: you know no one serve more than about a year in prison by it. This had a tremendous
effect on them. Emmy Peter Salah one of his sons said that life changed drastically after his dad was sent after prison because they kind of lost hope and they weren't really accepted any more. The damage was done and they were seen as people who had contributed to the damage many of his children started. Turning to drugs and alcohol, he had done an interview in the nineteen sixties where he talked about this and Peter Salah himself. He and his sister
they couldn't go back to the belgian islands, so they would kind of wander romantically from camp to camp and it wasn't until nineteen eighty three, they was logical back and he went back and stayed with. Is his family and I'd like to hope he had learned a lot and that when you went back he was able to help repair some of that damage, but I dont have that information. I can only hope that that's what happened that he was able to really help boost up his family after all the damage that he had caused in this case we are talking about, basically to religions, and you have one that's animism at their spirits in everything and have all these interesting stories about different spirits. And then you have christianity, which again it's very much like that movie. The gods must be crazy. You have a man whose consider primitive by first world country standards and he comes across his coat bottle and realizes it. He has power with it. You know
can hurt people with his coat bottle, but he can use it for good and bad no. Yesterday they use it as a tool. It helps them with their their skinning. It can grant resentment and jealousy and envy, and it just causes all kinds of man for his tribe and similar to what we see here with the introduction of the new testament and them trying to interpret this trying to follow this. and turning on each other pretty quickly again, we dont know the true motivations of these people when the murders are being committed. Seems as though some people believe that me. I just went crazy and you know these people were desperate at the time. There's no way to know for sure, but I can also see that I could almost see that she just went craig.
see in really wanted to believe that Jesus was returning, that everything was going to be okay and that the hard times were about over. She seemed like a believer a fanatic where, Is I don't know of Jesus her god believed what they were doing in the slightest. I think that was a a power grab and everybody else was falling in line yes, really interesting it when charlie and p were tried. They were just themselves but mina when she was at the trial. She was strapped to a gurney and they said that she would scream out- and I know one author thinks that possibly she was being bitten by mosquitos or something but yeah when you're strap you can't move your at the mercy of whatever Zanu she's probably seen a gurney before she's probably never been restrained before I know one the airplanes landed when they finally
responded. A lot of the people in the group were not used to seeing a flying machine for I have reset. It was a big bird for some of them. This is new staff. You know my initial reaction to that was well if they saw an airplane land and they would obviously know that this guy Jesus in disguise and god, but really can they come up with that interpretation? I mean they're they're, going with what this man saying in their taking it they're taking him for his integrity, they're taking him for they know him, and they trust him. A plain landing isn't going to shake their believe now think gum. The eight analysis is that these low sentences were just that that they weren't punished as if they were real canadian people. I mean
and that's what was highlighted the beginning of the trial, with the comments from the judge and the prosecutor, basically saying that we understand that we are dealing with people who don't understand our laws and don't live the way we live when you have even the prosecution coming out with that, you cannot get the sense that that's where it was going to go. That's where we say you know: how can you really judge someone without walking a mile in their shoes? Well, I don't think there's any way for any of us in the first row country to walk in the shoes of these anyone people, especially back then it's just so alien to what we know. I think what they do. It was extremely horrible and I think that the mitigating factors are what they are, but if they are not willing to take a warrior, a hunter added astride, because they know that it's going to be detrick to the rest of the tribe. I wonder when you apply that two other systems-
their trials when you're removing a father and mother out of a home. But what are we doing with the rest of the family? you're be removing a breadwinner out and now everybody else has to pick up the slack. So at least when, I was to murder in and the more egregious crimes such as that. Yes, let's get through to remove these p from society, if they're a danger, but when it comes to- far less crimes, whether they be property crimes, whether they be Fines that you accumulate for parking in the wrong place. I don't think you should go to jail, and you should remove somebody from a home for that, and I I I guess, that's the only good thing I can see coming out of this is, I feel, like
I really did way out the ramifications of their decision and their their punishment ryan light. That's. Why says you can look over their comments and find them to be pretty condescending. Browning other hand it seem like they try to be very fair they're, giving them the benefit of the doubt by being condescending to them. What do you do with that? Getting when it comes down to it is it's very much a case of they just didn't. Have a very good teacher and may be key to walk would have been a good teacher, but this gets to the heart of charlie's motivations. Maybe he was just in it for the power, it seems, like that's probably the case in, and that the death of key to walk it was the death of his rival that this was a guy who is talking about with the bible had said and yet charlie. He wanted to be the one to dispense the information and having this other guy saying, you're, not doing it right.
You're, not saying it right. That's not going to fly, not if he has anything to say about is this story aim pillar one is something that's in indian folklore or anything like that I'm sure canadian listeners I've heard about it, but I dont know how well known this cases outside of canada. I am, I would venture to say it's not that popular, although there is a book out there, the books titled at the end of the world, a true story of murder in the arctic. Now I must warn you. This book has decent information on the belcher islands massacre. It doesn't go into a lot of deep detail, but what the book good, for as it gives you a very good idea of what that places like the eye There are also, but the authors aim is lawrence moment he tends to. These long rance or he also makes little snipers Many here and there about smart phones in tablets and how they're making us dumb
and making s really not worthwhile having on the planet, so oh I'm just saying like it it it has good formation in It- and I think this definitely a man who he truly lives. gets out there and really experiences the places that he visits. I really got the sense a he knows how to do that by You know? A lot of people were annoyed at his writing style because he keeps going back to the smartphones making us down and how people dont really communicate anymore. They just tap messages to each other. So if you can get past that has some pretty good information. If you to know more about this case, and I know that we have had some people writing it. In saying, oh winner, we're going to cover this called, or that called than I thought with interesting, as we have this case, the belt rounds massacre, which is very much like a cult case. It's not quieter.
old, and I was trying to look up the definition of a cold and how do you define a coltan, a religion, and the only thing I could really come up with is in the leader dies or is removed in the region. gin or group followers fizzle out. Then it becomes more of a cold. But I dont like that definition, because I think there active coats, were the leader is still very much alive and running the show, and I want to define them as a cult and not a religion between the two it's hard to define, which which is which, but this is a group of people following a belief system that goes very much awry, see always thought a call, was just a group of people who are following a person who is giving them the information in their believing that person, even though there person has their own belief system than in that's right.
Here, is they have this bible that charley was reading but I mean he didn't really understand it that well, and they obviously were murdering people just because they didn't believe in them, and they did it at the command of these. These leaders, these people, who had divine spirits in them, and sure enough as soon as the man a police show up, and these people were arrested, it seemed like it all fizzled out. I think you make a good point. There. Errand were If the leader or the person course, one person declares that they have, I or no magical or have some sort of enlightenment or empowerment. That's not of this world thus claiming their god, claiming they're Jesus and there's a lot of people that have done that over the time I can mention Charles manson or David Koresh off the top of my head. Ah, these
I would say that they had some special something special about them, that other people should follow, whereas a lot of priests or preachers they they can is be a conduit to spread the word and not tell people to follow them directly, but follow the religion, whereas a cold. I feel the people are leveraging the religion soap or followed them personally right and you have charlie saying he's. Jesus and Peter saying is god, and if you recall me, Now Peter sister was yelling at all these people to go out under the ice and she was whipping at them and doing it for Jesus the person she loved. Now she gave herself to Jesus now she's willing to kill people, because this is what they had in their minds is. This is how they were to greet the return of Jesus Jesus was going.
Come down from the sky in cairo, it sounds crazy and maybe she was an anime. I've heard other people say that a called his when something militia This or bad happens, but that's not always there. is either there are lots of groups that people would define as a cold that dont murder people they don't do. These things is, there's always some issue with any religion, that people can nit picking point out, but right they say it's not really clear. By looking at the definition it does. Seemed to say a social group with socially deviant or novel, believes and practices, and I think that's what we're seeing with this
at the. In the late. Sixteen hundreds, the coast of north america, became a hotbed of piracy, but american pirate much more than just armed robbery of the high seas. They were also we figures in the growth of the thirteen colonies. I would eventually become the united states,
hi, I'm lindsey grant the hosts of wonders. Show american history tellers. We take you to the events times and people that shaped america and americans. Our values are struggles and our dream in our latest series. We take you back to the so called golden age of piracy and reveal that. stories, behind such mythical figures as black beard and captain kidd, listen The age of pirates by following american history, tellers on apple podcast, amazon, music or wherever you get your pot casts within one. We eagerly and ad free by joining one replace an apple upon casts or the one rehab
Transcript generated on 2022-10-16.