« The Generation Why Podcast

Molly Young - 330


March 24, 2012. Carbondale, Illinois. After 3am, Molly Young, 21, was contacted by her ex-boyfriend, Richie Minton, because he needed help. Apparently, he was very drunk. She went to his apartment to help him, but just hours later she was dead. At 9am, Richie's roommate, Wesley Romack, called 911. During the call, Richie took over and told dispatch that Molly had overdosed. He would call again a little later to say that he found his gun and that Molly had actually been shot. While an investigation into Molly's death should have cleared up the question of whether she took her own life or was murdered, this case proved to be somewhat complicated. There was evidence that Molly was severely depressed at times. But Richie was a 911 dispatcher for the Carbondale police department and his father, mother, and aunt also worked for the police. Did he get special treatment and benefit of the doubt due to his law enforcement connections?

See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
The I dont another. I'm doing I just then, are you ok, On the last episode I mentioned that I will be doing a podcast event with other true crime: pod castors in toronto. That's august, eighteenth of twenty nineteen. If your interested go out to the royal
t o and navigate through their schedule to august to the eighteenth, in fact and get yourself some tickets. It's going to be really cool, though some pod castors you listen to. On there. We had a nice email from some people up in canada. Speaking of toronto heard from a guy named David. He wanted me to give a shout to staff in toronto. Thank you both for listening and you recently just saw a ban play here in Kansas city. This is crime related yeah, don't If any of you are slayer fans but they're on their final world tour and if you're on offence about it. You need to go because it was pretty amazing and vague, Mr just put out a limited edition, slow, bottle and tonight's case will have a tie in with you
Your meister thinking about Yeager meister I've had a few shots of yeager in my life and it's one of those things where now to pronounce is properly probably, but it's a niece black licorice flavour I really don't like that flavour I do happen to like yeah meister, but it's a strong for me. I don't know why I am right there with you. I I actually dont like the licorice flavour either, but I'll have a sad iraq which has absinthe in it, which, if you dont like yeager, don't ever drink absence? Actually you this funny, like I've only had absinthe, maybe once in a but I really liked it. It was really good in fact I had a choice. I would always choose absent over yeager over every time, but- bigger, is a little tough army, not something I would regularly want to drink with no fees or minimums banking with capital. One is the easy,
Decision in history of decisions, even easier than citing to listen to another episode of your favorite podcast with no overdraft fees. Is it even a decision that banking re imagined what's in your wallet term supply see capital, one dot, com, slash bank capital, one in member of the icy price line- it goes saying that we're all missing travel right now, but you know- elsewhere missing getting more for less, with price sign. You can save up to sixty percent on your favorite hotels, and you can also get exclusive deals on car rentals flights and more and when you save more, you can do more more. Wild view, is incredible. More another round of room service, more sorry, boss, I'm going to extend my vacant in price line knows every trip is a big deal. So when you're ready to book your next one check out price line dot com, for the easiest way to get more
how an extent vacations so tonight's case takes place march. Twenty four twenty twelve it's in carbondale illinois. A woman in early twenties gets a cryptic message saying help me from her exploit. And she rise at his apartment to help him. And by morning she's dead. So the question is: was it homicide or was it suicide and I always think of those pictures? You know that finding the true crime groups, you know was it murder or suicide, and it has like the picture of the woman. That's laying on the floor with a gun in her hand and a cigarette, and you have to take in account all the things in the picture and make your decision this case very much like that. So what are we talking? That's an iron tonight is the case of molly young
Molly Marie young was the youngest of three born to Larry and Cathy young. She enjoyed photography and art and was now To be a non conformist in high school, reliable, her down described it as being very talented, being very carrying compassionate in ocean a real person so she's, not just all butterflies and sunshine Molly struggled with depression at some point. She covered that she had a lump on her neck and her my and immediately went to cancer, and I don't blame her for that area area anytime, you feel lump on your body, go get it checked out, and for those of you who have cable. You might I've seen doktor pimple popper. So nowadays you really is that a lot of times a lump isn't cancer, but it can be cancerous. She did have it checked out and it turns out. It was not thyroid cancer,
it was not malignant. No, it was removed. It was not cancerous bite you can only imagine if if she blew its cancer that just drove her depression to deeper depths. She into university. She was studying at southern illinois university And she was living with her grandmother at this time. She was dating guy name, richard minting, he goes by richie and he worked as a police dispatcher in carbon they began dating and twenty eleven molly was head? four heels forum, Molly's family? Not so much? I think her father says that he didn't like his teeth or his smile. He has a very specific thing. He doesn't like about richard, that's reliable, because my mom would always pick out characteristics of my friends that she didn't like, and tom
about it. They found him to be narcissistic, manipulative and an arrogant jerk. They just didn't like him. When molly became pregnant, she decided that he would have an abortion after she had the abortion they broke up. This wasn't the first time they broke up, but they broke up soon. After this abortion woollen She personally wanted the abortion because she didn't want richie around the child, treating the child the way here treats her? That was the reasoning she gave to her friends. richie. On the other hand, he just thought it was a bad idea, because their relationship was very rocky. He didn't make that much money all the other reasons why he wasn't.
Four fatherhood. Well, let's get into around the time that everything goes down on the night of march twenty. Second, this is two thousand twelve molly went to a concert with a friend named collins, stout collins, disabled his. Personal assistant is the one that drove them to the concert that night she was picked up between in eight nine p m and stayed out till about one thirty. Two in the morning. I think Colin, really lean for that too, I am as this kind. Important because of some information that will talk about later. On march, twenty third, twenty twelve at around ten p m Molly's mom checks on honour, finds her in bed wearing her pajamas. They say good night to each other and Kathy goes to bed at around five. Thirty a m the next morning, Cathy wakes up has a gut feeling that something's wrong
she goes to check on Molly finds that she's, not in her bed, tries to tax molly tries to call her is indeed in anywhere any response. So she starts driving around the neighbourhood. She It knows that molly, an richie have a history, but she doesn't know where richie lives she drove around because she thought she knew the area in which he lived its around nine in the morning on march. Twenty fourth, that wesley row mac, who is richie mittens roommate, calls nine one one and he's reporting that someone was dead. in their apartment. I don't want to read into the normal one calls because You never know how somebody's gonna sound on a non on one call but
wesley seems very calm, collected and states that somebody's dead at their apartment and kind of an odd way. And then he passes the phone over to richie richie, told the dispatcher and this is someone he worked with that when he woke up he, and molly next to him, but she. The responsive and saw that she had a pill bottlenecks to her and he thought maybe she had overdosed and he says she blood out through her nose, which. You don't bleed out to your nose from an overdose. You just die from the overdose, but he says he sees blood everywhere.
And so this is what he said, and I will one call he said my girlfriend just committed suicide as his words every hangs up that call and according to him he starts trying. give her cpr, but about seven minutes later richie called them emergency line, and he said hey, I'm can you send the sergeant? She didn't o D, I just found my gun laying underneath her molly hadn't overdosed. She had been shot in the head. This is where the question is according to richie. She must have shot herself in the head with his gun, and this is a check mark in richie's favor. He calls nine hundred and eleven. He doesn't know her cause of death, so he's assuming cuz. He sees a bottle of pills and his girlfriends on
sponsors or his ex girlfriend, so he's trying to make sense of what's happening, he's trying his best it's a heightened situation. He gets it wrong. He calls back and corrects I put this in his favor and underneath her is, gun according to richie and on the other side of her is her phone. It's her phone. And the pill bottle and there actually down kind of by her ankles the guns underneath her torso, so detectives gets the apart they find richie in the living room, ma Ie is next to a bed in the bedroom. Richie talks about trying cpr here is a problem. Normally, when you get into situation like this. You need to lock things down. You need to preserve evidence.
Some point here either before the detectives arrive or shortly after he's allowed to wash up, he changed his clothing and you soap in water. and apparently the officers didn't have a problem. With this. The officers get his statements. He will talk about how molly was suicidal. The officers get a search warrant to go search molly's room or essentially her grandmother's house and pull her laptop. They find a note in the room and her phone records on the laptop, they will find that somebody searched for suicide, how to suicide and there's a note. They find that essentially it's not a suicide. Note revenge. I guess you can read it as a suicide note, but it was more or less a farewell note. They also find
her journals where she talks about being sad and just unhappy with life, so the investigators say this is a suicide case. Glow first one another clause paid. It definitely was uppermost in our minds that this looked like she most likely took her own life. They take wesley and richie to the station for statements. but it doesn't feel like they're, really locking anything down here. Well, here's where we got gotta go.
Start over a little bit. They show up the first responders. Are there there are wanting to question richie unwisely wesley. They give these statements, they take him down to the station. They ask for permission to search his apartment and rich. He says no, and then they go off to go, get a search warrant, I'm not sure how they dont have probable cause. Here I mean you get a slight with with of marijuana. You got probable, caused a kick in the front door, but they didn't find any drugs like that yeah, but you have a dead body with a gun and a guy saying, oh, my girlfriend killed herself. They dont have probable cause ike, apparently, so they take seven hours to get a search warrant to search his house. Now they ve already searched molly's house. They had that done within.
hours of discovering the body, the carbon dale police do do something right here, because they call in the illinois state police richie is a dispatcher for the carbon to police department. So it's kind of a conflict of interests there so they need to bring in another authority. That seems like a good call yeah, because we wouldn't even have a stephen every case. If man, it's walk county had done this properly, but we might not. But here carbon dale actually does call Andy illinois police. So the illinois state police get there about an hour and a half after riches call and he lays out the way the night when with a morning went according to him. He said that the night before he got really drunk
they do find evidence of that because they find that he had vomited on himself at some point. So there's that, according to richie, this is how the night went at nine p m. He showed up at a friend house with a bottle of Yeager Meister and they start party. They end up changing venues. They go to a bar. Now, you can't just bring in your own bottle of the egg or meister to a bar. So what is rich? You do. He gets a pitcher of jack and coke, not a pitcher, a beer between a bottle, yeager, jack and coke and then, whatever other drinks they mix in their pretty wasted. This group, a friend, including richie, go to another friends house where they continue to drink at
Around two hundred and thirty, a dot m. A female friend decided that they should take richie home because I don't know, maybe you died of alcohol poisoning if he kept going and he wasn't capable of driving home, so they take him home and at around two hundred and fifty for richie will call molly and I'll talk, and then three twenty eight a m he texted molly help me somali leaves her house goes to him to help him when she gets to his apartment. We have three quick calls from all: I'm here. Where are you? Let me in she gets access to his apartment. She takes care of him. She tries to clean them up clean up. His vomit get em out dirty clothes and riches
is he passes out shortly after she arrives at this point. Westley is not their riches roommate is working a night shift at panera bread. He doesn't get off work until about five hundred and thirty a dot m. According to richie, he wakes up around nine, a dot m. That's when he found her unresponsive and he wakes up at nine a dot m, because his co workers or texting him you're late for work, you're supposed to be here, taking nine hundred and eleven calls. Where are you so? He says he wakes up at nine, because he was supposed to be at work at seven two hours late and he calls work well, he doesn't even call work. He says he calls nine one one which technically has works or of but not, you call and later anything but a report. His girlfriend has taken her life, so
seven p m. On march twenty fourth richie was given a blood alcohol tests. They wonder to see how drunk he was, while we Oh he drank a lot. Then I for well by that time enough time had passed, that they were going to get good results from this task, that what's twenty four hours later gimme a break as you go through this case. There are some very odd choices made right by investigators, absent really, I don't even know why they bothered with that so hours later after riches taken to the station. That's when they call in the state police, by the time the state police get their riches parents or at the police station riches lawyer is at the police station and richie statement is, I got drunk, I asked for help
She was suicidal, now she's dead, and then he shuts down stops answering questions He refers the state police to his lawyer, so he's only given a statement to the carbon doubt police. They inform cathy, her mother of her down. when Larry her father learns of this, he will go down to the station and he's approached by a lieutenant from the state police who this is according to Larry informs him that the investigation is already botched andy allowed richie to wash up and changes close. So this is Larry's first impression of the investigation. About his daughter and first impressions are everything like at this point.
doesn't really matter if they are doing a bang up, job he's being told it's already been botched and for the most part has been again. You have to preserve the scene. You have to lock things down. And by letting richie clean up and by not searching anything, bidding him and take his computer until much later months later, but they had bali's computer the day of really put that in perspective? the victim is being investigated way. More then, the suspect sure to check out where the crowded sing in theatres July fifteenth based on the best selling, book comes a juicy mystery full of romance murder and deadly secrets. Daisy Agur Jones plays kyar an outsider, who grew up alone in the marshes of north carolina
she finds herself drawn the two men from town. It opens a whole new world possibilities until one of them turns up dead blamed for the murder the town once answers, but will the truth set kyar free or condemn her forever produced by reese witherspoon featuring a new. original song by taylor swift. This is the event film of the summer, see where the crowded, being exclusively and movie theatres July fifteenth buy tickets. Now. Small scale? Food is so fresh. You might mistake, for your own lunch now we're not joking This fresh human grade cathode delivered right here doorstep. The protein pact recipes are made with human great ingredients, you'd find in your own fridge. You might be wondering Why can't I just feed my cat kibble, won't believe it or not. You're cute kitty descended from ferocious desert cats who hunted pray for food. They still need fresh protein pack. Meals
at their very best for you, other cat food brands know this, but they choose to put their wallets first smalls. On the other hand, work with leading had nutritionists to create protein pact recipe. that are exactly what the little fir ball craves and needs errand cat banana boat, loves the kitty, snacks and the rest of his cats can't get enough of this food higher. quality ingredients mean a healthier and happier life for your kitty. Try small today customize your sampler through a short ways at small doc. Slash generally for total fifteen dollars off your first order that small Last suggestion why code jen? Why? Let's talk real quick about wesley wesley was questioned. He said that he ended up coming home and plugging is found because it had died. He discovered tat, molly had text in a number of times. Then he went to bed at some fifteen a m, but let's talk about those tat because she sent him some very odd texts. Yeah at three
before I am she texts at him and said, she's coming over to help out richie at three fifty six. She tex he so drunk. He can't walk and then at around four forty, a m there's attack, saying riches, texting chloe and said he needed her and wanted her to come over have ex with him. I think I'm going to shoot myself in the head. I'm really sorry! You have to come home to that. That's it pretty disturbing text. You would think that if he saw the message where she says that she's going to kill herself and he she sorry that he's going to have to come home to that, you would think that would prompt him to go. Look for her. I mean again He was working up until early in the morning there and he was going to come home. Does that not prompt a search, said he makes it sound like. He saw there were semesters molly and then he went in check
richie and then eventually just went to bed at around seven fifteen in the morning and then, of course, the story is that he calls it nine for richie. That's A little suspicious, I think was statement. As he gets home, he places guitar play some video games and then goes to bed and then wakes up. He checks on richie something to that fact, but checking on richie. He doesn't notice a girl's bloodied body lay next to his bed. It's kind of a weird statement that doesn't make a lot sense. Right, any wonder is telling the truth wesley. Never he doesn't call for a lawyer. Now we know richie did in justin. People probably should watch what they're saying to the police being questioned, but richie is in a unique situation and a unique
she's here, because both of his parents have ties to law enforcement riches. Father as for the cyber crimes, division and his mother is a dispatcher add another department, so they all work for long. force meant they know protocol, they know procedure and they know an investigation and how it's done. That alone should bring in some questions here. The fact that investigators were focused on molly and not richie from the get go while he's out the police station and notice. I didn't say detained or arrested or being held a while he's at the police station he's allowed to make phone call where he calls amber the despair we spoke to on the nine one call any asks amber
you get a hold of one of the police officers at the scene and have them get molly's phone for me. Essentially he just asked, You have one of the officers at the scene, tamper with evidence and get her phone, if he's really interested in Molly's phone and amber the dispatcher actually does call one of the officers on the scene who refuses to get her phone because the crime scene photographers haven't shown up yet to document the scene yeah. When you work for law enforcement, you can leverage it for your benefit yeah. It may not always work, but the fact that he did, that meant he felt comfortable making that call. They determine this a suicide and then illinois state police. They have a different opinion
and their investigating this as a homicide. Now, why would they think it's a homicide errant one of the things that probably signal this as being a homicide. The gun was found next to Molly belonged richie mitten. It was a forty five caliber hand gun. They noticed molly There's must have used the gun using her non dominant hand and fired the gun at a downward trajectory, which seems well unlikely in near impossible ass. She used her left hand downward from front to back of the head, so essentially holding your left hand with the gun also against your top of your skull. So you can shoot yourself with your non dominant hand. I absolutely by that, but wouldn't you just hold it,
either horizontally or even have it shooting upwards at the top of your head? Sorry to be graphic but downwards from front to back is a really awkward trajectory hold this gun and to shoot yourself with, and they also questions why richie wouldn't have been awoken by this thing, going on it's a forty five caliber hang gun its loud. It is a very loud weapon. I shot him many times. I would give richie a pass on this one now because you ve drank Yeager meister and a pitcher full of jack and coke year passed out your blacked out. I could see sleeping through that, because you're not really sleeping at that point, you're not responsive to the world.
I myself am a very light sleeper. If you drop a paperclip on the floor, I'm waking up erin. What kind of sleeper are you Well, I'm a heavy sleeper and it takes a lot to get me up. Didn't you sleep through I don't know a tornado that took off the roof of your house yeah. I was woken by my wife and then, as I went into the hallway actually turned around and went back to. Bed azure roof was being torn apart, yeah the roof in the bathroom, which was just off my bedroom guide. When I'm asleep I like to be sleep- and I dont know what weeks other than my alarm clock, I'm good at getting up to that, but all kinds of racket, yeah that doesn't really work. The only reason why pointing this out is because this is a huge usually contested point there's no way, you could sleep through a gunshot. Well, why didn't any of
Other neighbours report a gunshot there in an apartment. No one heard this could have a muffled someway it Muffled somewhat, they say because it's against her head and the time of the morning it was. We could give pass on this meaning he hasn't out here. Possibly that's not to see. is how it went down. It just means this is a real possibility that he could have been blacked out and nothing would get him up at that time. Also she doesn't have any gunshot residue on her hand. She doesn't have any what it's called back. Spatter any blood on her hand there's no fingerprints on the gun. Well there at least none that you can lift and use. Now. This is actually pretty common just because you pick up a gun.
Does not mean that you leave fingerprints or usable prints on the gun and believe it or not. Just because you pick up a gun and fire, it doesn't always put gunshot residue on your hand. and just because you fire gone against something that's gonna, bleed doesn't always mean- or it's just not impossible- for you to not have back, spatter yeah, it's one of those things where you would say. Most often, you would see back spatter we see gunshot residue, you would see fingerprints whatever or you would see one of the three at least, but it's possible to not have those things now, how they do fine gunshot residue oliver, her clothes
all over wretches clothes and richie was wearing pajama pants that night, but while he was drinking, he had cargo shorts on those cargo shorts were found out in the liver. Room and they detect gunshot residue on his cargo shorts, but not on her hands. So again, let me reemphasize just because you shoot a gun doesn't mean, there's always gunshot residue on your hand, but when you find gunshot residue all over the apartment. It's a little weird that they're not finding it on her hand, they did find blood spatter on his pajama pants on the right leg and there's droplets of blood to like blood dripped on it, which that to me that doesn't happen like there shouldn't be any blood on his
pajama pants. Now, if you say oh well, he gave her CPR well, then you would have smears blood or if there was blood on the carpet and heap kneeled down, you would have the blood soaking into his pajamas. You wouldn't have spatter and you wouldn't have drops so wtf right, f right now, oh and it gets worse because they find scratches on richie ads on like his back by his armpit and they find his dna under her finger. Nails now, richie has an explanation. He said when he was giving our cpr. She must have screw Jim, somehow I dont know how that happens. I don't know either. I there's no logical explanation. Sorry, but a dead person doesn't scratch. You interested
happen. If he just head scratch marks on him, I could give him a pass and say: well, is a crazy night of drinking or maybe he walked into thing, but when you have scratch marks on you and your dean is found under her fingernails. There is a connection they also found to other dna profiles under her fingernails, but this bang up investigation doesn't bother to in dna from the room, mate wesley or any one else, because again they deemed it a suicide right off the bat state police saying this is a little bit more to this. Her body goes to the medical examiner. Medical examiner, looks at the bullet, wound fines multiple bruises on her body on her legs and on her head. I know people,
have bruises just because they bump on the tables and what not. But when you bodies found dead and you who are at your ex boyfriend house who you fought with and broken up with wooden. It just be assume that these bruises might been inflicted by beatings or strikes. They might indicate that a struggle took place and when they took a look at Seen they felt like there may have been a struggle in that room. You scratch marks, you have bruising and you have a gunshot victim. I don't know why they would come to that conclusion, but yeah, I would say so. Molly's parents fully believe that this was a homicide yeah, but the medical examiner says I concur with the carbondale police self inflicted suicide
we ve gone from suicide to homicide back to suicide. I can't even imagine being the family of mali and being told suicide homicide and then back to suicide. At that point, you have lost the family, they will no longer have any respect, for they won't trust anything. You say at this point: you ve lost them. Ten months after my death, a corners inquest took place. Six jurors heard the evidence their job was to determine molly's, cause and manner of death for manner of death. They could choose from accident suicide or homicide on january,
the first two thousand thirteen the jurors came back with her cause of death as gunshot wound the head in her manner of death as undetermined, due to lack of evidence, because no evidence was collected or not enough. And they didn't lock down. This is really upsetting for the family bank it should be upsetting to anyone who won. Cases investigated properly to say that I want to go through the the suicide angle that the police take with Molly real quick. They said that on march twenty third, they found searches for the word suicide from her laptop. So this is pretty much the night before her death, the journals that they, Seized from her house talked about how unhappy she was the journal entries are from months, if not years prior to this, the idea, being
some time since she had written in that journal. They also found the note sort of a farewell note. Family and friends say she wrote that when she had the cancer scare and notes, but around forever that wasn't something she just written. They were taking it out of context. So back to the search for suicide in her search. History. First off, have you seen my search history because it looks horrible compared to hers. I'm sure, secondly, she has a friend that says I took her out to a concert that night We were seeing a shower together and she didn't have her laptop with her, and this search said to have taken place at like midnight that night and friend saying then somebody else searched. I don't know. Maybe there miss remembering now I've mention that they had a rocky relationship. There's this
story that they went out to a show or bar one night Another man had approached molly at the bar richie. Witness this got upset took it out on Molly said that she was a slut and all these terrible things and then left without her left her at the bar. I know couples fight, but that's pretty extreme, and I think that shows a level of impulsiveness like alcohol fuelled rage and will have more to say about alcohol later on august. Twenty thirteen Jackson, county states attorney michael car. Well, he up did not I'll charges, because they're just wasn't enough evidence to prosecute, he didn't think that he could win a case with the evidence they had well.
They didn't find gunshot residue on richie, but when you get hours to doubts yourself in bleach and the shower and everything else and change your clothes. Will they can't really too any physical evidence to you win richie is calling the dispatchers talking to the dispatcher by name. Getting in a personal level, there they're gonna, take his word for the one thing at this state's attorney does do. Is he said that the case would remain open and that's pretty important because up to that point it really felt like they were closing it now, justin ricci worked for the carbondale police department, as dispatcher, but he had a couple of incidents. Shall we say he obviously likes alcohol gotta a dui, and this was while he was working as a dispatcher has happened and twenty twelve he's put on probation.
and he ends up leaving his job and in twenty thousand and thirteen he gets arrested for a second dui. He gets a little time with this one, because apparently he got a slap on the wrist for the first one. Maybe he added a lawyer, or maybe just maybe when one of your own of law enforcement get in trouble they come down, is hard on. You, when your parents work and law enforcement you work at the station. I just go on out a lamb here. Yet now, who you know it's? Who knows you? I mean I I understand that it's possible to get a second third and fourth de. Why? But this guy gets too in a very short amount of time, but
shows that he is extremely dangerous and is an alcoholic has rageous is really larry young, her father files, a freedom of information act to get the documents for his daughters, death. He submits all of them, he waits and weights and is denied. So at this point He turns around any files. I wrongful death lawsuit against richie. This is in July twenty fourteen. He wanted to hold richie accountable for his daughters. Death believes that richie merle, her and investigators work covering up for him. knowingly or through incompetence, really and in the suit. He says that
he called molly at around three on march twenty fourth, twenty twelve pretended to be drunk and needed help now he says, pretended to be drunk, Because when they tested him the next day, he didn't show Joanie our current system- I don't know he was pretending or not. He could have it when she came over to his apartment, said that richie shot and killed her. The suit says that he and wiped his finger prints off the gun, showered washed, his clothes and rich. He waited a few hours before calling nine one one and told nine one one that she might have overdosed and placed a pill bottle near her. Now The way around that pill bottle was a mock sicilian. I think you could take over bottle of that and you're not gonna die. Wouldn't suggest anyone take a hole in a bottle of antibiotics, but well at the very least,
the scientists and something that you would think anybody would try to overdose on What he's saying, though, is that this was a set up. It was a trap that richie pretended to be drunk got her to come over and then murdered her and then waited hours before calling nine one one. Now because of this wrongful death, lawsuit discovery, motions are put forth and larry has gained access to all of these files and all of these police reports that he was denied with the freedom of information act. He finds out some really interesting things And during this testimony wesley remember was lady roommate. He changes his story. So his national statement was just paraphrasing. Here he came home, play guitar playing video games, checked.
Richie and then went to sleep and then got up later and called nine when one with reggie historic changes to he comes home. Does essentially the same things and he says that richie can't find his farm. He changes a story to he comes home and plugs in his phone. Does all these things any fines riches phone. He wants to see what rich you had been up to that night. Getting these text messages from Molly about how she might kill herself and he'll come. under this without would explain why he would go find riches phone to see what you been up to. But this is a different statement then he gave previously- and at this point you think, ok, wait! Why didn't you say that initially that you'd found riches phone and then
How does that add in two when richie wakes up? He tells you his girlfriend dead and he can't find his phone, it's a major inconsistency for me. Once Larry was able to get the phone records for his daughter, he noticed that tax measures, his word- deleted- there seem to be a lack of communication between richie and molly prior to that, incident, which he thinks is unbelievable because they were dating. They had all these things going on. So there are some questions. If her phone was tampered with, an we have even the question of who did the search for suicide on her laptop, it's possible that somebody else sent those text messages. Richie was right there. Maybe he sent them unless he was too drunk. That would be his argument. Also, there's questions about molly's phone.
It wasn't. I guess, turning on right or connecting to service correctly. It was something weird about it which brings into question. Was her phone and was riches phone tampered with and then, when you take into account richie making that phone call back to amber while he's being questioned. Well, I'm conspiracy guy, but connect the dots. I understand why people think there is a cover up here I understand why someone would assume that something was done to their phones, because they don't have the same information or what you would expect to find law enforcement says that that's impossible. Because Her phone was locked away in evidence I don't have to, one, has seen the chain of custody documents and if that was ever broken, more given everything else it happened to me. Can you blame him for going down that road, not in the slightest
have you know: I've been an audible subscriber for like a decade now audible offers an incredible, select of audio books across every genre. I personally love the audible originals. They have everything from top celebrities down experts and as an audible member, I get access to a growing selection of audio books, the originals podcast, it's all included in my membership. I get one title a month to keep and I get to hear exclusive podcast that I can't find anywhere else. I just but the audio book anti social about online, extremism, techno utopians and the hijacking of the american conversation. audible, hope you discover new ways to laugh, be inspired or be entertained. New members contrived for free for thirty days does audible dot com, slash gaeta, BP were text gaeta, BP, two five hundred five hundred, that's audible, dot com, slash cheetah, BP or text gaeta BP, two five hundred five hundred to try audible, free for thirty days, audible, dot com, slash g
we'll be. Another thing he finds out is that some of the neighbours of richie have reported seeing a police off sir around the apartment, seven a m. This is two hours before the nine. When one call And this is kind of scary, because the new we're claims that they asked the patrol officer. What are you doing? What are you here for? and that officer said well, I'm investor, getting a homicide. So this carbon dale police officers, there are two hours early, investigating a homicide before nine on one call. Now don't know if I believe the whole witness testimony from the neighbour or not, but it's out their here's where it gets stupid. The police departments question about this they say well. Did you send patrol officer out to check on richie because he didn't show up for work
the police. Chief says we wouldn't have sent somebody out to check on richie, because we were in con act with them that morning, and he said he was coming in late. Why? Okay, so think about that? We wouldn't have sent a patrol officer out a check on because we are in contact with them any said he was coming in late. That's completely different than the initial statement of he was woken up later by coworkers. Texting am telling him to come in to work again if I'm part of the young family, I'm looking at this, and all these in Kansas,
It sees coming from the actual police department and thinking what on earth are you people doing? So? How does this a wrongful death suit go for Larry I mean, I think, that he has an ace in the hole with this whole thing right. The wrongful death lawsuit was kicked out on April, seventh, two thousand and fifteen because he filed it two years and three months after the death of his daughter the judge said I'm taking this out because you needed to do it within two years: statute of limitations as a big problem, because larry was hampered, he was told that he would get all the information, but he actually hasn't received all of the documentation most, notably isn't a missing some pictures and remember the freedom of information act was denied so
how is he supposed to move forward with this law suit in time? If the very documents and things it is asking for our denied him or where, even when a court orders the police department to hand these things over. They just flat out refuse so he's not able get everything he needs in time to file a lawsuit. This is just insane To say that there is only a two year statute of limitations: it's in twice team when larry works on getting me. Please, law passed. This law would not benefit his daughters case but Larry says he's trying to help other families. As we always see, and of these cases they pass a law to change things for the better the rest of society because of some wrong. They have endured molly,
law would essentially create a fine for investigating agencies when they refused to turn over documents. After court orders them do so, and then it would also require a wrongful death suit to be filed. Two years from the discovery of evidence, instead of the date of death, which is more, air because say someone dies on one day, but then evidence isn't found four months. Of course everything takes time. You file. Freedom of information, act requests if you're working with a court so they can order an agency to turn documents over too well, if you already in the home, three four months: it's not fair! So again we have to deal with this should d limitations, but this would give people more reasonable time to get these wrongful death lawsuits filed it so sad that we even need this law it so sad that we have to have these band aids for things that
should just be commonplace, but maybe I shouldn't be surprised that our government is so corruption and just incompetent at actually helping in serving the people. So, when you think about this case, I have to be honest. If you just look for evidence that supports the suicide angle. You can find it. You can work your way, pretty much to that point and say yeah, I can see that. But just in there Least a couple of things here that just seen insurmountable, when you look at this case, if really honest about it. There are a couple of things here that, when you add in all the circumstantial stuff, it's really hard to see this as a suicide. I went in very open minded and I had the the Inside of the page, with suicide, the other side, the page with homicide, and then you have a little check marks that you do.
and you know you have a few marks for suicide. She was depressed there were in a bad relationship she possibly found out that he was cheating on her and this moment of passion. She has this gun, but then, when you do check marks for homicide most, if not all the physical evidence is, it mark on the homicide side of things. The way she shot herself just seems really unlikely the blood evidence on us. farmers seems really unlikely. The lack of good residue in back spatter. All those things on her is unlikely. His statement. Well, you don't really give a lot of statements because he just lawyer it up and his roommate
statements changed a bit, I could believe suicide. I could believe that you could pass out drunk and sleep through a gunshot. I so can believe that he was so drunk that he might not even remember killing her. Some evidence that would support suicide includes molly texting with her boyfriend the day before and telling him that she didn't want to live, and that she had attempted to body, but she was throwing everything up so that that put the suicide angle right up front because we're talking about a time very close to that when she died, I don't know you just throw this out, but when you talk about boxes and you talk about how richie was abraham up he says that he was drunk any blacked out.
And you add in that molly was shot a downward trajectory their non dominant hand. it doesn't seem to make any sense and remember She went over there to help him if you will the suicide angle. She was looking at his phone and she felt like He was moving on another woman and it upset her and then she decided to give up, but this case wasn't properly documented and, if think about. There was blood on his pants and there is gunshot red do all over the place, but not on her hands. It just seems to me that this looks very much a homicide, but I put a hundred percent on it. No, but I'd say as a high percentage The likelihood that this was a homicide, I feel more comfortable, saying homicide seems likely here. Richie minton
no longer works for carbondale dispatching for the police. Obviously he quit he started, getting to you eyes, but went on to get a job for the fire department as a dispatcher. If you check his social media and what not he'd just post about sports and stuff usually- and I wouldn't tell anyone to go out and harass the sky or say anything to him like that, because such as wrong, but he's moved on with his life. People seem to be upset that he has a job dispatching for the fire department, the other what's wrong, but the fire department actually addressed this. They said they do check the background, so people they hire, but they do factor in if they feel that people who have had questionable things in their past if they have shown that they have worked,
To remedy those things, so in the case of richie and his de wise. Well, if he's gone through a treatment programme, and he said It is time whatever may be. They take them into account, which is admirable, because why, Should you deny employment to someone just because of a question situation and they're using their discretion, and they feel richie was a good higher, I imagine, and for those people feel like he got away with murder. Well, you're just going off of your perception of the evidence because number one, the police I feel like they did do great job investigating this case. They let richie way with a lot. You can say it's because
who knows him, he has law enforcement connections all over the place, but remember he wasn't taken to court and charged with murder. This is a guy who, in the eyes of the law, had a couple of duis now. That said, all sympathy to very young and his Emily, because this, for all intents and purposes, looks like a homicide and it looks like the police just didn't care, not the way that they do it. They had investigated this. With covered cases where people are charged and convicted. On far less evidence, the young family planted a tree and truly park. It was a dog, would tree. This was in memory of molly. They use The place, to have a memorial each year on the day of her death. Larry Ass, the ark
angels of justice, to look over Molly's case. It's a team of acts, law enforcement officers who want to any injustices in the legal system and if you go to youtube, you can look them up. User a bit rough, but these guys as they sound like they know about investigation about evidence, blood spatter, you name it. Some of the videos are pretty. Interesting, though they analyze different aspects of this case. They fully believe that the police were either incompetent or recovering up what was going on that the prosecutors are just going along with them. It's almost like a good old boys club now, when it comes to this carbondale police force- and this chief, you think well maybe this case this is just one situation where they botched it were didn't work out. There's this other case
that happened in the same area under the same police department of proving worthies, he was still who was found dead, I do want to give a lot of details because I haven't read up on it, but essentially They say he died of hypothermia or something yet he had massive head wounds exists is ridiculous at this point, and I don't know what this police chief in this police departments doing you know. It's frequently said that nowadays, with advancements in dna and investigative check, the ex that getting with murder is getting more and more difficult by it. I think vested geisha in is only going to is good as the intent of the investigators and the tools they have at their disposal, This case it really seems clear that they gave richie the benefit of the doubt throughout the whole case. If this happens happened somewhere else. You might have had detective saying: wait you washed up yet that it
happen here. They like, oh, you need wash up cool, hey its riches, badger. We know this guy. Do you really know him? I mean bt. Gay people thought they knew him. Britches shown us that he's an alcoholic was right issues so or at least he was a man or know how he's doing now. He he may have cleaned up his act with as far as the alcohol goes I am not really gonna sit here and blame richie. This was up to the law enforcement at the time to investigate this properly. There were some things they did right, but so much went wrong and it never really felt like they attempted to right their wrongs. The sad thing is: maybe it just comes down to molly young, not that important player here they know richie, they don't know mallia. He worked for the police, parliament and it sounds like they never gotten our you listen,
the episode. Now. Let us know what you think: think this was a suicide or do you think that is quite possible that richie took molly's life using his gun, I will admit that. I think we leaned heavy on the homicide angle, but that just because Have a lot more check boxes marked in that and I dont have a lot in the suicide angle. I'm not saying it's impossible for her to have done that, but yeah I'd like to know you guys think too. If anyone wants more information about this case, go out to just for molly on facebook,
The. In nineteen sixty nine, a vicious and seemingly random killing spree in los Angeles shock the nation and when the killer,
we're finally caught the nation. even more shocked by who was behind the gruesome crimes. I will grant the host of wonders, podcast american history tellers. We take you to leave times and people that shaped america and americans. Our values are struggles and our aims in our late. A series of fail musician turned quoth leader named Charles Manson, turns his young hippy followers into blood, thirsty killers and exposes the dark side of the peace and love generation. American history the manson and murders is a wandering plus exclusive. To listen to this special three part series join one group in the one app
Transcript generated on 2022-07-09.