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574: Can There Be Merit in the Extramarital? | Feedback Friday

2021-10-15 | 🔗

You've been secretly chatting with an old flame whose torch you still carry, and you even met in person to discover that these feelings are mutual. But there's a big hitch: while you're now single again, she's in what seems to be an otherwise happy marriage and is mother to three. Now you feel frustrated, jealous, and even heartbroken because you can't be with her. Or can you? We'll try to help you find answers to this and more here on Feedback Friday!

And in case you didn't already know it, Jordan Harbinger (@JordanHarbinger) and Gabriel Mizrahi (@GabeMizrahi) banter and take your comments and questions for Feedback Friday right here every week! If you want us to answer your question, register your feedback, or tell your story on one of our upcoming weekly Feedback Friday episodes, drop us a line at friday@jordanharbinger.com. Now let's dive in!

Full show notes and resources can be found here: jordanharbinger.com/574

On This Week's Feedback Friday, We Discuss:
  • Rekindling with an old flame whose feelings are said to be mutual should fill you with joy, but her current marriage to another man and motherhood to his children is a bit of a downer. Can there be merit in pursuing something...extramarital?
  • You share custody of two children with a narcissistic ex -- one is hers by a father who was out of the picture by the time you came along, and the other was adopted. The problem: she shamelessly plays favorites and clearly favors her biological kid. Are you hurting your adopted child by allowing her to go to your toxic ex's every other week?
  • You're blind and working toward certification in a well-paying field, but it involves visual math concepts and a lot of the instructional material is inaccessible. On the other hand, your interest in languages makes a career as an interpreter appealing -- and it's much easier to accomplish. Should you finish the certification you've spent so much time and money pursuing, or just cut your losses and take the lower-paying but potentially more satisfying path?
  • You have well-off parents who let you live rent-free in a house they own while you finish school, but you think your roommate may be taking advantage of the situation by mooching free food without asking and even offering it to guests. What can you do to set better boundaries without creating an awkward living environment?
  • Working the night shift doing repetitive work wasn't really what you signed on for, so you've been looking for a new job. Now you've been informed you're on deck for training in a more challenging task that's more up your alley, but you're not sure you can work three more months of overnights before this is slated to happen. What are your best options here?
  • Have any questions, comments, or stories you'd like to share with us? Drop us a line at friday@jordanharbinger.com!
  • Connect with Jordan on Twitter at @JordanHarbinger and Instagram at @jordanharbinger.
  • Connect...
This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
Today. What business needs most is creativity, so, let's create a lie with integrity, not bias purity that henceforth threats in the wild cloud management that requires less management and new ways for business to do business. Let's create at scale right now to gather let's prototyping, let's tweak, let's test, let's adapt, let's create something that changes everything IBM. Let's creaked, learn more IBM Dot, com, welcome to feedback Friday, I'm your host Jordan Harbinger, as always, I'm here with feedback Friday producer, the royal, my sick, red and yellow by the way, the lions who molluscs on stage. In case you are wondering Gabriel misery. I hear on the Jordan. Bonjour show we decode the stories, secrets and skills of the world's most fascinating people, and we turned their wisdom into practical advice. You can use to end
make your own life and those around you. So we want to help you see the matrix when it comes to how amazing people think and behave in our mission is to help become a better informed, more critical thinkers. You can get a deeper understanding of how the world works and makes sense of what is really happening even inside your own mind too. If your new for the show on Fridays, we give advice to you an answer. Listener questions the rest of the week. We have long interviews in conversations with a variety of amazing folks from spies to see, owes athletes, authors, thinkers and performers. This week we had r, L nursery who infiltrated terror groups inside the United States and Canada Fascinating story he still under cover, which is why he's a blurry pixelate blob in all the videos and pictures- and we have returning guest David Bus on why men specifically cheat in relationships. It's definitely outside the conventional wisdom. Here, David, an expert in evolutionary psychology and biology so that this is really a more scientific and interesting episode on this subject. In my opinion, a lot more with the ratio,
emails to males and vice versa, as well as social status in play here, a really fascinating, interesting episode, if you're interested in relationships and human psychology, as most of you, are also right, so often on the blog. My latest posed the best way to ask for April ocean and make sure you land it so one of the most common questions here on the show. Obviously, we finally decided to write an article about it, this one's all about rising up in the organization. What to do. If you don't get the promotion, you were hoping for using feedback using strategies and mindsets to keep climbing and figure out what you want. Of course, all of the articles are at Jordan, Harbinger, dot com, slash articles, that's we're all of our goals and writings reside now by the way at the funniest brunch. The other day is by the way, when adults, who are married Sabre it's not nearly as fun is one single people, say, branch and one that I have learned like now from now brunch is one or no drinks back when I was
my twenties brunch was. What did we do yesterday and how come it's Sunday already now? It's like. I had french toast and I feel disgusting right that but I had then I went home and took him up right of least one nap so generously, next to this girl who's on a date with guide she's average or so the guy looks like. Silicon Valley, engineer who hasn't seen the son of a few years, and she goes where long story short, my kid is twelve. My acts it The he doesn't matter he's not allowed, have any contact with them and then like she's, like it's a long story in the guys, just sort of the lowly shrinking, but also tightening up at the same time, and then she goes drama. I mean it, sounds like drama I mean I love drama doesn't love drama. I mean bollywood unjust. I mean I'm also dramatic. I mean like I can control it Don't want to little drama right and I look at the guy and I looked again dead in his face because either as me like sitting next to Jan anyhow.
Did we once quickly and then again quickly? And I look him dead ban in the face and I just sort of slowly shook my head and he immediately looks down and looks back up at her looks back over at me in the looks down again and looks back up at her and goes ok and I can tell had not a word of what she said outside of that, but he was just processing my head shake and I would just like to Run for the hills, Jan after we left, because you can say anything in a moment, she does see, you heard that right. Like you heard that conversation I was like yeah, she goes that girl is for sure one that's crazy, MIKE and in a bad way only and and heard even more choice bets like how she doesn't get on with any of her family members in their way too strict and her parents to approve any of her choices, but they take care of her kid because they want to get married. Men like this is the worst situation, well that this guy could be in right now, just absolutely run
I dont know what relevance that has to anything. But I thought of this kind of a funny story is the guy was just absolutely dear and headlights totally screw. I loved you and this guy have your own silent conversation across the road we did. France in the only caption was only dialogue in the silent about through good, that's like about those Charlie Chaplin movies, withers away like they just public a frame of a text and allowance. I gotta know you would be here: yeah you're, right, you're cold, like rose again, maybe she's row with like seventeen hours on the following sly that just kept going and going in going while the piano music place. I hope you pictures your face for the rest of his life and gets out of our relationship. You might have saved him when she calls him again. It's just gonna be mental image of my face shaking my head in slow motion and he's gonna be like boob screen. No thanks and straight de voicemail change. Alarms. Ma am you know not just on feedback for auditing,
like out in the world. I brung one disapproving not at a time of change and lives, fight away, some people have been asked me on social media, how I managed to read so many books? One look it's my job. I plowed through a lot of books. That's how I do I make time for it. I have to I prep for the show, but sort of secret weapon. That I have is I why, by a lot audio books from audible- that's no big, surprise there, but I use a program called open, audible and this programme, its free, open, audible, dot, org? Actually I don't know if it's still really might be. Twenty bucks now open, audible, dot, Org will Lincoln the shuttles works for windows or MAC and what it will do. Is it eel login to your audible and you can download all the books instead of playing em in the audible player, and then you can take the books and listen to them on any device. Any that play an audio book and I drop him into overcast, which can then play at like three acts and remove silences invoice boost in all this stuff I actually and shaving like an hour and a half of every single book that I read, which may even to our
depending on the narrator. So that's not bad. You know an eight hour book. Turning into six hours, then he played at two x. You read the whole book in three hours. I do that all the time multiple times per week, open, audible, dot, org big shot after them definitely a worthwhile purchase. If you do a lot of audio books, tough aren't gave what's the first thing the mailbag high Jordan and gave I'm thirty seven, I'm newly divorced and I've recently reconnected with an old college girlfriend who is now Mary
with three kids. It's been nineteen years since we met out. We have always been attracted to each other and I'm still head over heels for her. I could about a serious relationship with her in the past, but I said no, as she had had her first child during our third year in college, and I wasn't willing to be with someone who had a child back then I stopped talking to her when I met my now ex wife, but she was always on my mind, then, a couple years ago she called my office. I was ecstatic, but she had found me, but I blew her office. I was married after my divorce, though I decided to look her up and she was thrilled. When I contacted her, we ve been secretly talking every day through video chat and an online forum to keep any suspicious activity outside of our social media. I also saw her once for lunch. Nothing, but a small pack on the lips occurred that day. We both tell each other how in love we are We also agree that we should not have an affair. We dont trust ourselves to meet in person. Again. I am in love with this woman. She claims the same, but she has a life of her own and her marriage seems ok if I had the opportunity
totally be with her. I would accept her kids. I want her, but I also want to be a homemaker. I now feel frustrated jealous and even heartbroken, because I can't be with her. I have mile depression and I begun therapy as a result. I also feel awkward going into the dating seen in my late thirties, like my age might be off putting two girls I want to be with, and I might miss the boat on finding someone else. I could have a family with. So what would you do if you were me signed waiting in the wings while quite the situation, your and my dude, it's really it's messy. It's probably pretty intense. There's, no simple answer. There's lot at play here, so late start by getting a handle on the facts? Your love with a woman. You ve been head over heels for for almost half your life. It sounds like she feels the same way about you you're having a mostly emotional affair, but it would escalate if you saw each other again, because you know as well. For one thing, it sounds like you'd be into it, but really really hard for not to happen. She's married somewhat, happily
kind of unclear, but it's not a terrible marriage, but you're. Also, willing to ask her to leave her husband to be with you and now you're, stuck in this painful limbo, so yeah. This is a a one if she were soup unhappy in her marriage. This would be a lot simpler, still messy, but at least then she'd have two good reasons to leave and you'd have more licence to ask her to do that. You know. Life is short, were in love, let's be happy now. It sounds to me, like you is more in love with you them with her husband. But it's not like he's some money stir and there's no love there. It's just not that clear cut of indecision. You know maybe she's a little board, but it's not like it's a bad fit and before we continue, I just want to say. I know the situation is a little so little unseemly some people listening now, probably going up, she's married, they crossing a lines, is wrongful stop into being, I hear you I get it, but we're not gonna sit
here and wag, our fingers at this guy, at least Gabriel, and I aren't y'all- are welcome to real TIGERS Mullen us onstage he's in a difficult spot, and so is she. There are legitimate feelings at stake here. I'm not a big fan of infidelity or anything, of course, but it's not super helpful to judge him or this woman. Sometimes you marry the wrong person. Sometimes you meet the right person later in life, sometimes feelings evolve. I know it's messy. I know its dramatic, but that's life, I've just forty one I'm still young, but I know enough people that this has happened to where I get it can't just be bad. People are the people who cheat everybody downright everybody else is horrible for doing this. It just it's not that simple anymore. It was when I was a kid, but it isn't anymore, not anymore. I mean. Isn't this basically the plot of a notebook yeah? Probably everyone is totally rooting for Rachel MC atoms and ran Gosling to get together in that movie, even though she was engaged. So I think we can understand where they're coming from here. Logo
yeah like team now the way so we're just gonna put those judgments aside and meet this guy where he is so bottom line. I think you need to sort some things out. First of all, I you know that staying in this limbo is not healthy, is not sustainable. It's not a true, if it is, it stands right now, it's up the highly charged friendship, that's putting her at risk and our kids for that matter, and in your heart, as you put it, it also preventing you from finding somebody else whose great and so actually available, which is actually this is a major opportunity, cost right, you're in limbo, your orbiting around here you're, not even looking for the actual right person. Some, is going to have to give here or something is going to have to give here or you're gonna up one day in your forties, still pining for a woman who won't commit to you possibly ever. The thing is, though, you don't gonna be a homemaker, and I get it it's a difficult role to play, but you're already a homemaker innocence, and this is in
We think that you're doing it's not serving either of you really either. She needs to come to terms with what she really wants. What kind of partner she wants, what kind of marriage she wants? How she really feels and make a decision and or you need to tell her what you want teller you're ready for her to be. You partner and create a future with her or you just both need to close the door? I mean your obvious welcome to continue this ambiguous, covert torturers, emotional affair. As long as you want, but again, where is that even going. What are you getting out of that each of you? I am also not totally clear, I'm what's going on for her. Obviously, she has strong feelings for you. Does she want to blow up her actual life to act on them? How does she really feel about her husband, her not trusting herself to me in person again that could be acting responsibly, minimizing her risk or that could be heard, and to contain the relationship with you enjoying the stimulation, its breakin, the boredom a little bit. There's a thrill, there's newness of it, but she's not really start. Not the whole affair. She can always deny
she can always say your friends. You can always closed the door, there's not any real commitment. Here again, we don't know, but it's important that you know where her head and her heart are right now so you're not on two different pages, which is, Actually I mean Gabriel, it's gonna, my hunch, but whatever we don't have enough info. Basically I'll need to talk like really talk. If I were you, I would get a good handle on what she wants. Where sees your relationship going whether she is willing to risk her marriage in our family to explore this with you, then tell her how you're feeling why you want to be with her what your life would look like together, how you want to proceed, and then I talk about whether you guys see a practical path to being together in the near future. If there is this chapter will just be the unpleasant transition, do your life together. If not, I would seriously reconsider what you're doing in this relationship. Absolutely, I agree completely, but the truth is she's, the one who really has to make a decision here, not so much him. Her situation is more complicated. She has more
Lou's and by carrying on with you, I mean, let's just be blunt about it, she's playing with fire right. The question is: is playing with that fire worth it? Is it leading to something better? Is it leading to a relationship, that's going to be more fulfilling for her or is it just? You know a bit of fun, but that's what you mostly her, but both of you really need to figure out right now, but there is one other thing, Jordan that I think we need to talk about here, which is this thing he said about feeling very awkward going into the dating scene in his late 30s, like I think he said his age might be off putting to the girls he wants to be with so looked at. It sounds to me, like you, have some belief,
how people perceive you how they feel about you, given your age, but you know, look you not! Seventy eight years old trying to meet some twenty five year old on bumble, yearned Europe laid thirties speck in these one of many people. In that situation there tonnes a single guys know, lay thirties, nothing wrong with that, but the fact that you think there is or that you're a little and secure about it. I have to imagine that that's playing some role here, because I do wonder if your fixated so intensely on this woman, not just because you love her, which I believe that you do, but because, in your mind, she's your best shot at getting the relationship you really want because dating as fraud for you, which obviously not agree, reason to keep her sewing this one percent right. So I would take a look at those assumptions see what else is going on there try to separate out your fear about your dating prospects from your love for this person, specifically I know that's hard to do, but these two things there probably connected- or at least their informing each other in some way right now, and if I were you, I'd want to get a good handle on all of that. So you can be sure that your pursuing this woman for the right reasons, yeah good point- gave
you never want to go into the dating game with a scarcity mindset. Thinking that you're never gonna meet. Someone is good as whoever's in front of you at the moment, but I also think that he might be doing this for the right reasons. Sure so. My last piece of advice is to just handle this relationship with as much thoughtfulness and maturity is possible. There is on your feelings for this woman with as little risk and dramas possible, but it'll take a lot of communication and introspection. It'll require both of you to step up stairs your feelings and make a decision, and this could work out great. This could totally, your person or she could be a person who just happens to have a unique grasp on you, but that and automatically mean you can or should be together, and that's what you have to figure out man? You really need to put some thought into this. I know you can do it you ve got it in any new outlook gave this guy already knows he's gotta. Do this right and we're just highlighting, I think, probably he already knows he needs to do yes, but yeah. If that's your hand
go ahead and do accepts our hunch to man. Good luck with it, you ve got this. Aren't you reach us Friday at Jordan, harbinger dot com. Please keep your emails, concise, try to use a descriptive subject line that makes our job a whole lot easier. If you can include the statement true that you live in. That will help us give you more detailed advice if there's some you're going through any big decision that your wrestling with or you just need a new perspective on stuff life love work. What to do if you get fired by the church that is supposed to protect you. Whatever he's got you staying up at nightly, hit sub Friday at Jordan, harbinger dot com, we're here to help we keep every email anonymous listening to feed back Friday here on the Jordan Harbinger show we'll be right back thanks for listening. It boarding show your support of our advertisers keeps us going who doesn't love some good products and or services. You can always
Is it Jordan, harbinger dot com, slash deals for all the details and everybody that helps support the shell and now back to feedback Friday on the Jordan Harbinger, show our next up age or to a game Ten years ago I answered a relationship with a woman who had a three year old son. The sun's biological Father had abandoned him, so I assume the role of the second parent for you, into our relationship. My partner and I decided to adopt a girl from foster care, since we were not marry. Only one of us was able to adopt after I adopted her. A partner, and I remained together for a few more years until we split we been navigating co parenting for a year now, but it continues to become increasingly difficult to deal with my axe, she's, the biological parents, to her son. I have no legal rights to him, as we were
married. The same is true for our daughter. I adopted her because we were never married, so she has no legal rights to her. We ve been sharing custody. Fifty fifty of both children. The issue is with my daughter. For the past year, my ex has been trying to find ways of having less time with her she's constantly looking for excuses or loopholes to not have her a full week at a time. My thinking is that she loves and cares for our daughter. But she doesn't like dealing with her or her behaviors. Our daughter has fetal alcohol spectrum disorder and my ex greatly struggles with that fact. It is very evident that she plays favorites with the children, and our son is obviously the prefer child in her household. My daughter makes comments all the time about how she does not feel it is part of the family and its heartbreaking. My acts is a narcissist toxic person? I feel like I'm, not doing a proper job as a mother by allowing my daughter to continue to be subjected to this emotional abuse, but I fear that if I remove my daughter from the situation, my axe might not allow me time with my son. She can be very petty and she often makes decisions that are not in the best,
most of the children. Am I hurting my daughter by continuing to have ever go to my axes every other week? How can I best help my daughter without jeopardizing my relationship with my son, or am I just overreacting, signed shared custody, split, loyalty, man? This is a really sad situation. Now, I'm sorry, your acts has been making things so hard for your daughter, you're in it. A very tough position here haven't a basically choose between I've seen your daughter and staying closed with your step son, it's possible that there isn't an eye. He'll outcome here, but there are better out comes and worse outcome, so, let's get into it first of all are hurting your daughter by having her go to your access house every other week. Well, based on what you ve shared. It sounds like probably yes to some degree of Where's, your not hurting her, not directly anyway. You're x is, but I can see why you feel responsive so no you're, not over reacting. This hurtful relations with your ex? It could be taking a real tool. on your daughter, so I'm thinking that you need to try and talk to
ex about all of this, and I'm guessing you ve done this before, because that's not you know, super complicated advice, but maybe it hasn't happened is earnestly and as forcefully as it needs to because you're afraid of the repercussions. Perhaps so here's an idea. What if you made some to talk with your ex alone. I wouldn't do this when the kids around you need to be able to speak openly. Tell her but you're noticing how she doesn't seem to want to spend as much time with your daughter how she's struggles to deal with her behaviour, how she seems to prefer her son over your daughter and then- and this is the important part- help her see how all of that is affecting your daughter and will probably affect her for years. Come tell her about how, when your daughter comes home, she talks about not feeling like she's part of the family, that she feels inferior, her brother. All of that paint a picture of how heartbreaking that is for her and for you,
The key here will be not to blame or judge her for this behaviour, even though you have plenty of reason to do so, because the last thing you want to do is trigger her defences, so I'd say somethin like look, I know authorised and very difficult issues. I know that's not easy for either of us. I don't blame you for struggling to manage, or even I struggled to manage, or sometimes too I get how hard it is, but we have to be there for her. We have to make her feel loved and supported. We can't make life even harder for her by treating her differently your ex seems to get it. Then you can tell her the specific ways in which you want her to treat your daughter better or at least stop treating her poorly. Because, again, you might not be able to create the perfect home for her over there, but you can at least make it tolerable now the problem really is that you're axes narcissistic and that will probably make it very difficult for her to acknowledge any failure on her part. If she fits the textbook narcissism pattern, she'll be highly defended shall reject your feedback, she'll double down in her position every.
In this conversation will somehow become a reflection of her. So your best bet is to use that to your advantage in their way Maybe you appeal to her ego a little bit like look you're such a great parent to our son. I just one our daughter too, if it from your parenting. Two or our sun loves you so much. Wouldn't it be great if our daughter felt that same way, you too, I realize this is a little manipulative you're using her toxic psychology and dysfunction against her. So it's a little sketch I'll admit firstly, making your ex treat your daughter better by appealing to her narcissistic need to be admired. That's not suddenly gonna make, a great parent she's still gonna, be Forgot. Baron she's, still gonna, be a narcissist or have narcissistic tendencies, but it might get her to stop in your daughter. Quite so much that's coverage ordinary
kind of like a white hat at the goal, influencing kind of moved. You're right. You know she can't change her acts fundamentally, but she might be able to lean on her to be a little bit better as a parent. That said, it's also possible that your ex blows you off and just refuses to change it all, in which case you have to make a decision, but whether to continue allowing your daughter to go over there at all, or just as often as she used to the choice is basically and it's a terrible choice. Do you give your daughter to parents, one of whom is toxic, or do you just give her one good parent? I mean that's really tough, that's a hard place to be, and I want to say that the better suited she is having one great parent, but I know it's more complicated than that, and you also have to take into account your daughter's relationship with your step. Brother, I mean: are they close? Does she want to spend time with him? Does he want to have a relationship with her is not a big part of her life, because it's not just about you and your daughter and your daughter's well being and the situation is everyone's connected. It affects everybody,
but you know it's also possible that your ex would allow you to keep seeing your stepson. Even if you kept your daughter away and look, I know that this is a sad thing to say out loud, but if your ex really doesn't like parenting, your daughter, maybe she'll, be relieved to not have to see her as often which is super sad and obviously very hard pull up, but that's the reality of the situation here. You're the dedicated parent who's focused on her and she struggles to relate to your daughter to monitor, as you put it. So is it possible that you would still allow you to your son? I think it is so it's possible that you might be prematurely worrying about the taco
for you really have to. You might want to try to talk to her see what would happen before you worry about the chest. Move she's gonna make if you start to pull your daughter away, but honestly, at the end of the day, I do think you have to prioritize your daughter, not just because she's the one who's being hurt here, but also because you adopted her she's your responsibility. You have to do what is right for her. I would try to stand up for her without disrupting the family as much as possible, but if your ex continues to abuse her as you put it, then you might have to protect her from that. Its that there will be a major cost. You, a costume, stepson, accosted, the whole family and putting your daughter first, but that's the situation. Your ex created, that's not entirely on you agreed, I said at the beginning: there is really no ideal outcome here, it's more managing a bad situation as best if she can and there is one bright spot, and all this, though you said that you guys have been sharing custody. Fifty fifty of both kids and I dont know if that legal agreement or a kind of a handshake. Informal one, but either way I do suggest you talk to her-
Emily attorney in your area. A lawyer could help you hold your axe to the custody arrangement you currently have, which could mean that Not only will your ex have to honour her time with your daughter, if that's what you want, but she might all have to allow you to keep seeing your son again, that will not automatically make her a great mom, but it could the cost of standing up for your daughter, if that makes sense, but honestly, no matter how this custody thing shakes out the. Best thing you can do for your daughter is be an amazing mother to her as well everything your axis. You have to be the opposite kind, loving, steady present. All of that, if you do to take her away from your ex. I do understand that choice, but if you keep sharing custody, which you also have good reason to do frankly than you, after really be there for your daughter to absorb the damage. Your access inflicting talk to you validate her feelings process them with her help her find ways to cope with your ex ante appropriately stand up for herself, and if I were, you I'd seriously concerned
finding her therapist. Yes, I know she's a little kid, but I'm guessing she has lot to work through, because between the feel out all syndrome and foster care and the stepmom drama. This is a key located as childhood, she could really use of professional. To talk to. That could be the thing that gets her through this period of her life and out the other side, even stronger, as opposed to come out a little bit screwy from wondering why one of her mom's doesn't, like her sorrow, sorry that you are in this situation. I am you sound like a really thoughtful parent. Your daughter is likely to have you you might have to live in a world instead of crappy trade offs for a while, but as long as you keep putting your daughter, first being the best possible mom to her you're on the right track. So good luck by the way, if you're joining us first time or you're, looking for a handy way to tell your friends about the show we ve got episode, starter packs bees actions of favorite episodes organised by popular topic. It helps new listeners, get a taste of every
that we do here on the show just visit, Jordan, harbinger dot com, slash start, they get started. Our next up here goes on the twenty five a blind man working on a computer science degree and an online programme and machine learning, and until recently I really loved it not only as machine learning a fund exciting field, but it also pays pretty well. I've been poor. My whole life and emotive to get out of my mom's house and finally get a real job. The last year that I've been intensely missing on machine learning, however, has been exhausting. This is mostly because my disability and the fact that a lot of the work involves some pretty visual math concepts. because most online materials are inaccessible to some degree, and there are very few people out there who can teach me visual concepts, I'm burning the candle at both ends and I'm starting to worry that I won't even like the job I'm hoping to get. I've always had an interest in languages, I'm semi fluent in Spanish, and have plans to learn many more languages. My goal is to travel and live abroad,
so becoming a translator or an interpreter has been on my radar for while I recognise that the earning potential of these career paths is less than machine learning, but I have a feeling it may be more enjoyable to me in the long run its also easier to do from a technology perspective, because the tools are just more accessible. I'm torn, though, because I've worked so hard for several years. I machine learning. It feels like giving up on something that I put a ton of time, sweat and tears into, but at the same time I want to be genuinely happy with what I do. How should I make this decision? Should I finish the degrees inserts I've been grinding away at, or should I my losses and go for something that seems more fun signed grasping in the dark. Ok, first things: first, you sound like a truly remarkable person, so you're blind, you grew up with limited resources. Your study computer science and machine learning one of the hardest fields for anyone to master. I would think, let alone somebody with disability, you can't even see the friction, textbook your work and your ass off, plus
got all these other skills. Dude you're, incredible, I'm serious way. You stick with this field or not. You have proven that you have a ton of small and resilience and those are incredible assets that will get you really far, but I also know that makes the sun cost for studying, thing? That's a huge pain in the ass, even higher, which is hard to your head around. Basically, I think you need to get clear on whether you're moving away from machine learning just because it's hard or whether you are moving away from machine learning, because it really doesn't speak to you in your Canada over it, it sounds like it's a mix of both, but it's or that your genuinely worried you wouldn't even be able to enjoy a career and machine learning. Meanwhile, working translator or interpreter that would be more enjoyable in addition to being a lot easier for somebody, probably in your position, especially with all the tools now, if that's true, then those are good reasons to pursue that field, and I would chase that feeling. I would just take some time to really sit with all this and see whether the difficulty of this work, your exhaustion,
those are feeding this desire to switch tracks or, if you genuinely aren't happy in this field, have said this on a show before it's always better to be running toward something then running away from something, and especially when it, two careers and jobs, and things like that businesses and look. I know that in your case, it's probably hard to separate out whether something is hard from whether it really excites you since you're disability, dry, We impacts how you experienced the world, of course, especially visual concepts, but I still don't think, you can go wrong. Listening to that voice that saying air are more interested in languages, I'd be more fulfilled. Being a translator. I almost feel like some of the difficulties with visual math is almost but this is a huge pain in the ass. It's getting me to look at the problem, but it's not the actual problem. If you re wanna, be sure here's one practical idea. Why don't you book a few calls with people work and machine learning and talk to them about their day to day find out what the job actually requires, what it's like? What would it be like for you if you can see right what we, if they ve, got vision
tools whenever you have a lot more data to work with, but as for the conflict, you're feeling part of this decision we'll be coming to terms with the time and energy that you ve spent on computer science. In your case, that's a little more complicated because you have a whole identity on the line. and I'm guessing that mastering this field with your disability, giving you a lot of pride as it should its massive accomplishment, but then leaving the field behind Maybe it feels a little bit like admitting defeat or losing this source of gratification that might bring up some other feelings for you, all of which to me make perfect sense. So my opinion, I don't think this is time wasted if you decide to switch gears first of all, you ve developed a ton of skills by pursuing machine learning pro only a whole new way of thinking. You have proven to yourself that you can do highly complex work with your disability, which is extraordinary and maybe most importantly, you realize that you probably don't actually want to work
in this field and has huge. We talked about this recently with a woman who did a masters in English and then found her dream job working in mental health. That was episode five. Forty one by the way I've talked about this, a bunch of my own life, leaving the law to become a podcast her and all that we always carry things over from one chapter to another skills, knowledge, self knowledge relationships, especially relationships which, by the way, I'd also be investing in those right now, especially in the interpreting and translating world, because they could be the people who own the doors you need in a few years. Don't start then start now and who knows maybe down the road, you find a way combined your knowledge of computer science and or machine learning with your gift for languages, and you create some sort of super unique talent stack. Theirs, really exciting overlap between those fields and very few people have experience in both. You might even be the only person who has experience in both and is also visually impaired. Right literally, there might be like to you on planet earth vocabulary, point ride like them:
rare your talents. Deck is in don't get me wrong being visually impaired in coping with that your whole life and learning and having a productive life. Because of that, whether you look at is just getting by or not that's a talents DEC two, maybe a specialised, interpreting and translating for people with disabilities. Who knows that another way to cap flies on your unique experience. We're gonna linked to some great talent, stack resources in the show nuts, for you have talked about this, a tonne. I highly recommend check in those out. So I wouldn't let these cordon quote some costs. Stop you from making a great career transition. You shouldn't stick with something that makes miserable just because you ve been doing it for awhile right. I would tell that anybody, that's harder to em race as you get older, but man you are twenty five you're barely now in your career, you have all the freedom in the world. There will be a lot of hard work ahead. If you want to be a translator, interpreter you'll have to master new languages, you'll have to pass exams. I assume you ll have to navigate life in foreign countries to learn those languages. That's not gonna, be a walk in the park either, but
you know you have the goods. The question is: where will those goods pay off the most? What will bring you a in addition to money. If that's another field, I say: go forward, invest your precious time and energy in Thank you truly care about. Something you know you can become great at if you do that, you really can't go wrong. This is the Jordan Harbinger Show, and this is Feedback Friday, we'll be right back and now for the conclusion of Feedback Friday, our right. What's next hey guys, I'm incredibly lucky to have parents who are well off and I currently live rent free and a small house that my parents own. While I finish school my roommate as a very close friend of mine and she's, aware my financial situation, while she has never seemed to outright taken,
answer me. I have pick up on small things that do bother me. For example, I always offer to share my food with her, but now she seems to take things without asking offers my things to guests and never offers split the cost. She has an eating disorder, or so I don't want to get upset and discourage her from eating altogether. I still have expenses and financial responsibilities of my own, but it's not the money that bothers me. It's the principle that she assumes that I'm automatically okay with paying for things. I know my friend has struggled with never putting herself first. She has made a lot of improvement in that department, but sometimes I feel like she's using me to see how comfortable she can get with prioritizing herself. I care about her a lot and I wanted to better herself, but I don't want it to be at my expense. I am a massive people. Pleaser I've had friends who have taken advantage of me in the past and that's caused me to
trust in a lot of people. What can I do to set better boundaries without creating an awkward living environment, and should I trust my friend signed the reluctantly resentful remain while this is a fascinating were made dynamic? You sound like a very grounded person. You now you are to be in this situation and you want to pay it forward and be generous with other people. I understand that an hat tip for you there, but it's it's over into this people, pleasing thing which signals to people that they can take advantage of you. So I totally understand why this remit situation bothers you. It does sound like she's. Take the advantage of your generosity. Now, whether that's me just or even deliberate hard to say she might be very self aware she might just not be thoughtful or maybe she's afraid of confrontation and doesn't want to have the awkward conversation about how to split expenses. This doesn't automatically maker some kind of monster. She's, ok, dealing with their own issues too, but either way, it's not fair to you. So I think you need to have a conversation with her
without accusing her of anything. I would gently tell her that what you're noticing that she's taking your food offering it to guess, ask she's aware that she's doing that, maybe she is maybe she's not, but even if she is this is a nice way ease into the conversation then I would or that you don't mean to be petty whatsoever, but that this bugs you write it doesnt seem very fair. are you not looking to make her feel bad you're, just asking her to be more thoughtful you can even tell her what you told us, which is that the money that bothers you, it's the idea that she assumes you won't mind covering the costs that it makes you feel, like maybe you're. Being too, it advantage of and that you don't I feel that way with her. That's a totally fair point. That would be hard for her to argue with, because you're really just talking about your experience, and awfully you guys, can talk it out either she does shopping the even things out or she kicks in some grocery money or should stick to our own freedom Greece, whatever it is exactly
right and I know your roommate hasn't eating disorder. I know she struggles to put herself first, you don't wanna trigger or some kind of dangerous response in her get super volatile ruin the relationship I totally get it, but the fact that you are working on exiles to avoid provoking her. That does seem to be part of the people pleasing pattern. So if she does end up having an extreme reaction to what you're saying, then it's her responsibility to manage that two, not sure away or spin out or lash out or to relapse in her eating disorders. Just like it's your responsibility to speak up for yourself when you feel like you're being taken advantage of so part of rewriting best bigger people. Pleasing thing is really recognising when you're doing her work. In addition to doing your own work, you know when you are putting her vulnerabilities. Of your super legitimate needs and I'm not saying that you need to be a sociopath in order to get your way here, not at all, in fact, quite the opposite, but just holding her stuff alongside your stuff, not automatically prioritizing her over you got would be.
step four, you and that's all you really have to do in order to have a straightforward conversation about. You know how to remit should treat each other good point gave this conversation does could be our first opportunity to rewrite this huge pattern in our life, which is great because its relatively low stakes- and she can, work her way up to more intense conversations from their. So that's how we handle it. Hopefully you guys and come to a fair agreement, but if sheep Russia's, you often goes back to stealing your Trapani, then you might have to be a little bit more forceful or maybe to find a new remade me doesn't steal your crap. Sometimes you can't make people the right thing. You just need to draw a line, wish them well and stay away. That's part of breaking the people, pleasing thing too, that and remembering that you can be generous to people without being a doormat. So good luck as MACHO Bonnie Base our what's next Jordan, I'm a recent college grad and after covered hit. I was fortunate enough to land a position at a medical diagnostic lab. There was only one catch. I had to work the overnight.
chest and sleep during the day to fit in. I quickly learned that the lab was geared towards executing a process identically and perfectly this class is hard with my personality, which seeks novel approaches to solve problems, but at least I was practicing a technique and developing discipline. I also decided to take a class in the morning after work to pick up some new lab techniques and a certificate. This semester, the course was moved to the afternoon, which is well into my sleep hours ice our down the night shift, but I couldn't change it. So I started looking for a new job. Then my supervisor told me that the lab is going to train me on the most complex process that we have, which would give me some valuable skills that are sought out.
By other employers. The problem is, I'm not sure I can stand another three months on the graveyard shaft. Am I being impatient try to talk my way out a learning, something new. I had a tendency to avoid challenges in college and that could be happening again. Should I be up front with my supervisor about the reasons I've been having issues, I don't really want to tell them about the job search, but I also want to spring resignation on them if they ve taken the time to train me. So what should I do so and a reluctant vampire seeking the light. Yet a graveyard shift is brutal man. A lot of people who work knights were nodding. Along with your letter for short truck drivers, police officers lab tax. It's a tough gig gave their so many p that work at night. By the way I sort of Google anyway jobs are at night us thing and I go caught fire and who else there so freak in many in the family been able to make it work and take an actual course. On top of it in the morning is super human level impressive. It sounds like you're prioritizing your growth right now, which is absolutely the right mindset for somebody. Your age basically are torn between this
good lifestyle and your desire to learn, and I'm sure the lack of sleep and inverted schedule make it even harder to think through all of this, so my advice is actually pretty simple. If this lab is, I teach you what you need to know to be a great candidate for a better job in the future. I had to consider sticking it out and then start looking for a new job. I know you're tired, but three months in the grand scheme of things, it's kind of nothing in twelve weeks in this complex process that other employers want you to know. On top of everything else that you ve learned and then you can apply to join that gives you a normal schedule again. It seems like a fair exchange if this job is really making you miserable. I wouldn't advise sticking around for no reason, but if there's this very concrete thing, you're gettin out of it a new skill project to talk about, your interviews, another sort whatever it is. That's a reasonable trade off to me, but I'm also curious about this thing. You mentioned how you might be talking your way out of learning something new, because you tend to avoid challenges. First of all, that's very self aware
of you to notice in the first place. If that's a pattern of yours, then I definitely would tracking it and I'd consciously be trying to rewrite it. Starting now and sticking around this night shift. This could your opportunity to do it. If your brain is saying, I don't want to do the work, but translating the messages I don't want to do the graveyard shift. Then I'd look closely at that unscramble. The message stick around at the end of these three months. You probably feel way more capable of taking on these challenges, and the next the challenge, comes up you'll have evidence that you can handle it. You'll have a template for sticking with it and you'll be less likely to run away. As for how to talk to your supervisor, I don't know if you have to tell them everything front, you're allowed to leave a job after you stick with it for the better part of a year. So here's what I do get through these next three months at these skills to your then, when you really start looking for a new job, tell your super as our aid listen this last year, it's been amazing, I'm so grateful for everything you have taught me. I gotta be honest. The night
if this kill inmates becoming really hard on balancing class on top of work, I just don't know how much longer can do it. I might need to make a change soon and then we sure, given him fair warning either they can try to get you did the day shift or you can jumped ship knowing that you, gave them a proper heads up its thoughtful of you to feel loyal to them. I appreciate that you should to some degree, but I wouldn't over think this part of it put in the work, learn as much as you can be grateful and gracious and pay. supervisor, backed by being a great employee. Beyond that, you are allowed to make a move. I just wouldn't make it before you, ve really challenged yourself and guy everything you can out of this role, because that's what's really gonna make this graveyard shifting worth it for years to come, gave
actually reminds me a little bit of the bar exam. This study period is miserable right. You gotta go watch these dumb classes in your in your studying, like ten twelve hours a day what you shouldn't be any way, but you feel a gap to and then, when you take the exam provided you pass, you just never have to even think about it again right- and this can be one of those times where he's just paying- is due to get this under his belt, knowing that this is temporary and it's nearly finished anyway, and that same principle goes for Anyone in any role that they are unhappy with, if things could be better, then at least make sure you're still growing, learning evolving. Times, that is the reward for powering through a tough period. But if you're not growing, then it's definitely time to make a change. Hope I enjoyed that. I want to thank everyone who wrote in this week and everyone who listen. Thank you so much for that. Don't forget the guests from it week, Tamar Elinore, who infiltrated the terrorist group and David Bus on why men specifically cheat in relationships, the social science reasons and explanations
we want an, I managed to book all these great people and manage my relationships using software systems and tiny habits tall and our six minutes networking course the course is free to over on the think, if it platform at Jordan, harbinger dot com, slash course. I know you think you'll do it later, but you can't make up for lost time when it comes to relationships and networking do not delay dig that well before you get thirsty once you need relationships, it's probably too late to build them the drills, by the way, only take a few minutes per day. That's why we call it six minute networking I wish I knew this stuff twenty years ago has been crucial for me in my business. You could find it all for free at Jordan, harbinger dot com, slash course linked to the shown us for the epithet does it Jordan, harbinger dot com transcripts or in the shuttles videos on Youtube, Channel, Jordan, urban shared outcomes, lash Youtube. If you want to get in touch
at Jordan, Harbinger on both Twitter and Instagram, or you can connect with me on linked in you can find gave on Twitter at Gabe, misery he or on Instagram at Gabriel, misery. He. This shows created in association with broad cast one. My team is generally J, J, Sanderson Robert frogeity in bared million Campo, Josh, Ballard and, of course, Gabriel, Ms Raw. He our advice, Indians are our own, and I am a lawyer, but I am not your lawyer. So do your own research! before implementing anything. You here on the shelf and remember we re by lifting others, show the show with those you love. If you found this episode useful, please share it with you can use the advice we gave here today. In the meantime, do your best to apply what you hear on the show so you can live what you listen and we'll see you next. I, this episode is sponsored in part by build for tomorrow. for a trailer of build for tomorrow. Podcast now on the health watch when people think of addiction, they usually think of drugs and alcohol
it turns out. You can also be addicted to your cell phone and it can have serious effects. Is technology addictive? We are going to answer it for real with people who know what addiction really is and who study it and who are going to methodically pick apart. Everything that you ve heard before and it is there. I say a game changer and our kids on force. They are getting Did the smartphones in ways that are not positive for their health and the acts on plant ones. designed to be addictive and keep kids your check, innocent check and taxes. What we get a real addiction problem in this country are working to shape our fist at steward, at slack and netflix, and these companies and say hey Europe. It is to engaging net you're shows, are so interesting. I want to watch them all the time. This is why we want these companies to make peace that we want to use. What is the alternative? Please make shitty products that I dont want to use Wendy
something transform from engaging to addictive. How do we determine what is truly addictive? And what is normal behaviour that we are simply calling addictive? There are studies out. They are showing a correlation between social media use and mental health, but nobody is proven a causation, but if we keep thinking that the product is the source of the problem that we are not allowing ourselves to understand or to help to solve actual problems, fundamentally, for don't look at those the reasons why our kids are turning to technology. To this extent, the problem will never go away.
Transcript generated on 2022-03-02.