Coming up next on the Jordan Harbinger, show the people who flourished had satisfying relationships. The people who floundered did not have satisfying relationships period did matter the money. It actually been matter, the physical health and even the guide you who started this. He has a really interesting, unpublished paper with the results, and he says I can describe the results of this. Like seven decades study, and flourishing. I can describe it in five words. Happiness is love full stop on arguing on you, but he's totally right Welcome to the shell, I'm Jordan, Harbinger on the Jordan Harbinger show we decode the stories secret and skills of the world's most fascinating people. We have in depth conversations with astronauts entrepreneur. Spies and psychologists even occasional former called member Russians by or attack mobile, and each episode turns our guests wisdom into practical advice. You can you to build a deeper understanding of how the world works and become a better critical thinker. If you're

due to the show or you're looking for a handy way to tell your friends about it, we ve got episode, starter packs. These are collections of top episodes organised by I bet that'll help new listeners get a taste of everything we do here on the show you can find those on Spotify organic. Orton harbinger dot com, slash start to get started or tell somebody else get started with us and of course I appreciate it when you do that today, my friend best selling author Dan Pink is back on. The show will discuss the power of regret, namely how we can not only help mitigate regrets. We already have and ease the pain of regrets, but also how we can use some very practical tactics and strategies to avoid regret in the first place. One of my favorite Exercises in here will actually show us how to reverse engineer regrets they never you can happen and keep us focused on. What's really important in our lives, brilliant cycle conversation here with a brilliant thinker and if you're wondering how I managed to book all these authors, thinkers and creators every single week it because of my network and I'm teaching you how to build your network for free over.

Jordan, Harbinger, dotcom, slash course the course is about. Approving you're networking skills, your connection, skills, inspiring others to develop a personal and professional relationship with you, it'll make you a better networks their conductor and a better thinker? That's Jordan, harbinger dot com, slash course. In most of the guests, you here on the show they subscribe and contribute to the course so come join us you'll be smart company where you belong now: here's Dan, pink So no regrets it's funny. As soon as I saw the title of your book, I was like this reminds me of that tat that you see everywhere. That has no regrets on it and sure enough. Mention it right at the job, which is great. That means that mean as saturated when it ends up in a book about regrets and it's not just some red it fodder. That's a real deal thing absolutely and a girl. I got me thinking likewise, I clicked so popular this idea. This kid as such, it is, has no regrets and Jason said it is, as you know,

even one letter and avoid shows is that it has another way of getting into the main point of his book, which is that everybody has regrets their ubiquitous their universal. The only people I regret our five year old people with brain damage in sociopath. The rest of us have regrets and, as you know, in the book, and you know I talk to run a lotta people with tattoos, its aid, no regrets or no regrets. But of course I also found a guy who got a no regrets tat to regret the decision and had a remote. That's probably what most of the people are doing with no regrets tattoos depending on location of said tattoo. Yes, used to run a company where we had like live coaching and staffing guys had come and stay from all over the world, and in some sort of life that life behind. But one story that sticks with me as a guy fluent from South Africa, really cool guy's name, Sean Williams shout out because you didn't do this and it's not as embarrassing as one might think. If you actually got it, but he's walking around wrong three o clock in the morning and he's like

did I just hear about in the morning. I have night thanks so much for not letting me get that tattoo, the other night and the guys like you, had no problem, and I just knew it would have been a mistake. I like you're, going to get a tattoo on Hollywood Boulevard at three Germany's idea. Man knows I go. What was the tattoo say. Ah, I was gonna get! No, cigarettes, are here before and I'm like the irony, but also while thank God, you didn't do absolutely in writing. Like old English fought to just like the hated most hideous sorest Grammy ended in this research. I've seen a lot of no regrets. Tat is more than one person should ever be exposed to an alive time, and I suppose the locations very is well. They re very You know I got people with no regrets that to lag behind their ear, somebody on their rest, somebody on therefore somebody out there, but so everywhere, yeah man, anything above the neck line, is kind of like that's no regrets and no career prospects potentially alongside it am, I sure, tat you artist resoundingly better. Why is

The flawed ideology mentioned that the only people no regrets our kids and sociopaths. Sometimes it's hard to tell one from the other why is speaking of a man mammoth toddlers. Why is having? Oh regrets. Really a realistic outlook on life are realistic. Philosophy is flawed for a couple of reasons. Number one it's profoundly unrealistic, because truly everybody has regret in the recent everybody has regret, is that if we treat them right, regret or useful regrets clarify Van struck, if you look at the research here with the research tells us is, that regret is the most common negative emotion that we have an arguably the second, research done by Susan Chapman upset with years ago. The second most common emotion of people express of any kind after love, and so this no regrets philosophy seems like this courageous act. But it's not it's not an act of courage. What's an act of courage,

It is an looking your regrets in the eye and addressing them and when we do that the benefits are huge, there's a pile of research showing that it helps us make better decisions that it improves our problem. Solving skills are negotiations. Skills are strategic skills, deepens, our sense of meaning it. So what untried, at? What I want to do is to reclaim this idea of regret. I think it's actually almost indispensable emotion and it points the way to have a good life yeah there's a lot of people, how we not in their head, but also I'm something about. Having is saying, hey, no regrets its comforting yeah, but, on the other hand, I will say that most of these, like self help drifters that you and I have probably come across as we know, a lot of the same people. You hear that they loved this frailer. You hear it in those like. I don't know if you ve ever been duped into those like self help: seminars where you get there and the like everything you ve done your life, no regrets its lead, you to this place and, unlike our unity,

Marie frame. All my bad decisions is a divine journeyed to come here and give you money, because I feel that I have left. I think the answer is yes. That is exactly what they are trying to do yeah, but it's also its ludicrous. It's bullshit you'll, forgive the phrase the out, because our cognitive machinery is programmed for regret. If we didn't have regret, we would not be able to survive, and the question really is this: I think of it. Great point, Jordan, regret, makes us uncomfortable and so a national response to that is to ignore it to say I really backward. No regrets. Ok, that's a recipe for delusion now, because we haven't been taught how to deal with it. Another responses that is to let it be hobbled by it. That's a bad idea to what we have to do is we have to look these regrets in the eye and think about them in a week when we act like grown ups in

do that it is a powerful, powerful force for progress and the idea that we can eat elude regrets as nonsense. I did a pizza research of my own for this book. We did it a big public opinion. Survey of fourth does it four hundred eighty nine Americans and I asked people the question about regret without using the word. I said how, because of exactly this kind of full, Sir self help nonsense. It you're talking about there are but something unexpected something books in the Library of Congress whose title is no regrets and we're out of control. But I asked people this question. How often do you look back on your life and wish you had done something differently? We had one percent say never while locate we had started, like sixty percent, said rarely, eighty three percent, so they did it. They do it occasionally so over forty five Americans a year. I do that occasionally and the reason for that their human banks, that, when human beings do the question is, are we willing to confront our regrets?

We do it in a systematic way. They are a powerful force for forward progress, particularly coming out of this pandemic. I know for me and I'm sure this is probably true for everyone, but since you took a survey, negative emotion teaches me a lot and not just like big regrets. Where I go all men, I probably shouldn't, have gone to school fur vetture at Numb, adding go to that school, but like that's cool. What I hate animals. You know there's a big regrets. I got married that person who I knew was a con artist, their small regrets, You know I kind of that was a bad reaction to that particular situation. I should not have yelled at my kid for peace the floor. It's my fault. He had to go to the bathroom so bad. You know like that kind of stuff. That happens time. That's

primary mode of Learning Dan because you're a human being- and this is exactly right- here's something we have never been taught. When I say we I mean really Americans. We have never been taught how to deal with negative emotions. We think that the only emotions that you should have are positive emotions and what science tells us alright forget about anybody's lived experience. What science tells us is that positive emotions are extraordinarily important. We wanna have positive emotions. We want to have a lot of positive emotions. We want to have more positive emotions and negative emotions. Positive motions are fantastic, but they are not the only thing aright. And negative emotions serve a purpose reason why our brains are able to feel bad feeling. Bad helps us do better. If we know what to do about it and so imagine levels

an extreme example. I don't believe in fear, I don't feel fear Loveday you're a dead man buildings burn. I don't feel fear. Ok, what is fear telling you fear is useful and the thing is. I am convinced that regret is our most useful, emotion, negative emotion. Maybe the most of you smoke, emotion overall, because he is what it does. We look backwards. We say a crap. Alright, we deal with the pain, we say what is that paint telling me, and then we extract a lesson from it to go forward. Regret is transformative it instructs if we deal with it right and get past this nonsense that somehow, debilitating are on human to have regrets when, in fact it is among the most human things that people experience yeah. You mentioned kids brains, and I think you said injured brains like death, sociopaths or or people who literally had like a closed head injury or something along those lines. So it's a normal life mature brain regret, but no regrets. It makes sense that people who have been

damage can't really experience or in some occasions don't experience regret. It also explains a lot about those self help has self help- seminars we just talked about, but- and I think you talk about this in the book- regret is: do you related to a time machine? I believe I read that right. Where you can get your ass back in time, because here's a think regret is an incredible thing that our minds can do. This is one reason why how what are your kids to another f in one month. So not old enough to have anything timeline is so short, but here's the thing, your kids, it's gonna, take them a few years for them. brains to grow and do your one month, obviously can't speak and can't walk, because it's a boy or girl, it's a girl, ass. She can't walk or developing Reggie hasn't learn to do. That's. That's Zaka she's, a flawed percentage species of one month old enough, and so she's gonna learn how to do that. Her brain and body are going to develop and our brain developed this ability for regret, but its cognitive. Dreamily complex, it's extremely complex. If I say I take one of the regrets that I captured at their where someone says

Ok, I think one of the marriage once if only I had an marry that idiot, they regret Mary. Eddie? What happens? They go back in time. I'm right. They time travelling there had they been go back in time. They neglect what really happened, then they get back in their time machine go. Forward and imagining refashioned present because of their decision they made. In the past I mean it's so cognitive, highly complex. It makes sense that little kids, tiny little kids can't do it. It makes since that, if you have lesions in the orbital frontal cortex of your brain, you can't do it. If you have certain kinds of Huntington's Disease or some kind of Parkinson's disease it doesnt work is incredibly complex. It's something that art species does and if it's something that our species does, the odds are very good. It has maintained itself over our evolution for a reason, and the reason is that regret is ubiquitous because regret is useful. Yes and

the point, and so I want to try to reclaim this emotion and show people how to use it as a force for forward progress. Yeah. I really like that. It is this time travel this mental time. Travel is at the same, is counterfactual thinking or is that a different concept, exactly yeah perfectly set regret as a form of counterfactual thinking? So we think counter to the facts, so what you can think of and this is actually useful as we think about our lives. The oversimplify bet you can do an upward counterfactual If only I hadn't marry that guy's, how could things have been better, but you can also do a downward counterfactual, at least I stated that marriage only a year right, how could it have been worse and there's some fascinating research fairly familiar but well validated is about olympic athletes. Yes, if you look at the photographs of Olympic Athletes, Olympic Medalist, routinely, bronze medalists look happier than silver Metellus brought. I don't like happy environmentalist? The silver medalist objectively unequivocally have outperform that what's going on,

the silver model, as the saying, if only doing counterfactual, even more only I kicked a little harder I'd, be a gold medalist, the bronze metals, the saying at least set in fourth and Mr Manuel together, he Enzo counterfactual thinking is something that human beings do its glory as it's incredible you can imagine. a coon doing, counterfactual, thinking rights, it's something that our species does and again. Why are we able to do it because its use all right, yeah? You do feel for the silver metal is too because, especially when like one one hundredth of a second behind or let swim, lap and you're. Like man, you breathed out your nose more on your left, strolling you're right nostril. Now you you're not a gold medalist. I always think about that when I watch the Olympics, especially in swimming, because like civilians, it's hard for them to even think about training. It's like well my golden years to shave. Five one hundreds of a second offer might

I'm an unlike what now like. I can't even think in those kinds of units in the idea of devoting a year that doing that, but I am I admire that dedication and I'm a sports fan so any chance. I up to sort of analogies from sports or you sports examples. I tend to take yeah you always kind of when you look at the bronze medalist nets, like some underdog country, to you feel so good for them, but you're right. I'd, never really remember, look at a silver, medalist and feeling anything, but like man, I bet you're having a really bad time now and you feel such really- I'm proud of gold medals winners, but I'm also like you must be so relieved that this is over for everybody in fact always really that it's a better, you can tell I'm never I'm not cut out for these kinds of high stakes, competition design, just thinking you can relax. Now. That must be so great. Maybe there thinking the same thing, but who knows? Well, I Tell the? U S. I see that you're not interested in being recruited for now, the next Olympic. Let me deliver the news. Tat still regret help. Make decisions. It seems was almost like a second

are function right. Usually, we just think all regret makes us feel bad and that's why we try to sweep it under the rug, but it all Oh endows our life with bottom. We send our lives with greater meaning. You write about this. Tell me about that. Well, one of the things that happens is that what people regret a loss of meaning. So there Somebody in the book I write about it. It's a good example of this who she grew up in Arizona, grandparents you lived in Indiana would come and visit for a couple of months and she hated having their she likes. This was an intrusion and then a ramparts passed away. She's like on my god. I blew it yeah. I could learn from them. If only I had talked to them or, if only I had been more appreciative of there being there, I would have learned from their wisdom over to learn to live it more about my family, and so she took that regret and said you know what why my feelings about about this, because I lost that sends a meaning in connection to my relatives and so what she did in statute. This healthy way to deal with. She fought terrible

because you re ass, it were my god like I blew it like. If only I talked to the more. I have learned a lot about myself and about my family and so what she did. She took that regret and The plight of forward and now with her parents she's got a subscription to this interesting service where every month they send a question that's pretty actually for older people, yet they sponsor our show. It's called the story worth are worthy of our great think, Jerry Worth it's fantastic story worth. Yes, exactly. She got emphasis given to story worth and they send him a question every month. and her dad answers it and they put it together and is in a book, and so the whole thing is like, while I missed That's a meaning in my life. I don't want to do that again and so that I learned from its story worth dot com, Slash, Jordan. They dont sponsored this episode most likely, but go to story worth dot com site your in China. To having my mom. Do it in eight is, I have to say it: the interesting my mom right either they sent a question like what some tis. You made about how you raised your kids was one of em. That's the latest wanted to my end,

That's a question about both relief and regret right, any parent, I'm apparent. My kids are twenty years older than yours, I'm apparent and I looked back and I said ok, what choices did I make and some of them I rejoice over and some of them, I regret and and when I about what I want. I regret it act Lee allows me to extract a lesson that I can use going forward that I can transmit to them that I can transmit to other people, but we have to handle the rigour properly in order to make the meaning right. We don't do. We can't just like chocolate, wallow in our emotions and there's a systematic way to do that. Here's the thing at a top level here Who does what we're talking about earlier? No one ever taught us to deal with negative emotions, as a consequence of that, we think the best approach is sometimes it's to ignore them back

dear and when we can ignore them, they end up hijacking us even worse consequence. We have to think about them, confront them, and so one thing to do and in looking at lot of this research is of very systematic way to do it. So one thing is sure to look inward and use something. It's a powerful line of research with a pretty gooey name called self compassion where you treat yourself with kindness rather than content when we square up our self talk is brutal and we will never talk to other people. The way we talk to herself so just treat yourself some kindness and also recognise not that special. I went on a collected. Sixty thousand regrets from people in a hundred and five countries. So, if you tell me, you ever regret about buildings, but when you were younger or not starting a business or not traveling enough, like you're, not alone, so that's four things. Look in looking second thing: I can't tell you how important disclosures disclosing our regrets, there's something pretty powerful that six

thousand people around the world, were willing to reveal the regrets to a complete stranger, that's incredible, and why is that? Because disclosure serves us in a number of ways want it unburdens two most important once again, if you look at the work of Jamie Penta, Baker it at Texas DV, look at the work of Sonia la liver mirsky at busy Riverside when we write about or talk about negative emotions back to your point, when we write or talk about negative emotions, we convert this. LAW, be a more fists sensation into concrete words that makes them less fearsome. It helps us makes sense it up. So disclosure unburdens and helps us makes sense. What's more is as a social phenomenon and we're just totally wrong about this. We think we fear that when we disclose are vulnerabilities, our mistakes, people will think less of us thirty years.

research tells us they think more of us for doing that. So we can relieve ourselves, we disclose, and then we try to systematically draw a lesson from it and the way to do that is to take a step back. Take a step back in time. Take a step back with language. Take a step back with with space. I actually think that one of the best decision making tools there is of any kind, but certainly for regret- is that ok suppose your best friend was going through this. What lesson did she learned? Would you tell her to do next? You do that. Everybody always knows how interesting right. So what would you advise someone else? Who is that, because we're due divorcing at all. From our personal, I guess the baggage that the rounds it in terms of our emotions is that why it's easier to advise someone else to do something versus did there is there is up there the whole point. Research on this even cross at that Michigan has done a lot of it, some really really brilliant stuff. What it is is that ok, we do it

rapid job of solving our own problems in general, because we're like we're trying to solve an ocean problem, but we're scuba, diving, we're like inside. You know what I mean we're through what we want. Is ocean right. You can't be a good ocean very few only do scuba diving, you wanna zoom out, and It is like one whit with with our cells were so unmatched in our own details and struggles in perspective, and what not we have to actually affirmatively zoom out. So what you can do I mean cross his researches fantastic one of things you can do is you can say it may give an example from Antwerp. Let's say that I have regret about isomer gets by kindness case. All its ever read about lack of However, I regret about being too kind. Now I regret about. Lack of kindness evolve, extract a less from what I can say is not what should I do but hey? What should then do what you can do in this talk yourself in the third person is useful. Putting yourself

sort of scientific mousing. Ok, you know what here you go, there's a regret. You have this regret and you're a doctor of regret science in your examining this thing in this pristine laboratory room. What your diagnosis! What's the next step, your best friend is dealing with this. What lesson does she learn? What do you want her to do next, and so is zooming out, is one of the most important thanks, and so, when we kind of treat ourselves with kindness, closer regret to make sense of it in the Duma. For a solution, it's easy night isn't no one ever taught us how to do that listening to the Jordan Harbinger show with our guest Dan Pink, we'll be right back. This episode is answered in part by element, for you know by now how important it is to drink plenty of water. But did you know replenishing your electoral rights is just as important, whether your workin out or simply going on a walk, sweat inducing activities not only make you lose water but electrolyte as well, when it's too low get headaches, muzzle cramps fatigue. Weakness element helped keep me here.

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A recharge, your creativity, running low, are you not carving out the right life balance or you just feeling blah can't get out of bed in her typical, no bs style milk has through the hype to deliver simple tools. We need to move forward and create positive change, be short impact. Full episodes of the perfect way to take a break, take a breath and feel truly empowered. Here's exactly what to do. Is the perfect followed to start here routine topic breakdown of how to deal with whatever life is thrown at you, about only on audible, audible, dot, com sash. What to do things so much for listening to the show. I love the fact that you, like these conversations, cause I sure enjoy creating them for you by the way, all the discount code and all the deal's we put em all in one page, Jordan. Harbinger dot com. Slash deals is where you can find it. Please consider supporting those who support us now back to Dan, pink I would advise segment every Friday, and I often look at the advice that I'm giving in like manner I'd known or thought to do this when I have encountered similar situation ten years ago, and then I think what I do

this right now What I really do this, and so I tried to be really honest about that on the show and Feedback Friday, because, unlike ok, here's what you should You should analyse diplomatically and this in this and this in this, but what I would probably do is be super pissed off and tell everyone and ruin this person's reputation because they friggin deserve it. You know- and then I'm like, but don't do that. That's bad, makes you look bad and then you will regret it, but then you forget yourself and you just it, and you extract a lesson from exactly exactly you took this big survey. What do people regret you say bullying as a kid. What other short a giant categories. Stick out. This is fascinating. So I think one of the things that super cool about the times we live in is that each individual smells like me can do some pretty sophisticated large scale research. So I imagine I do this big survey of the american population, the largest public opinion survey of american attitudes over about regret ever conducted. We get some interesting stuff from there, but was also interesting, is another piece of research that I did called the world regrets.

Remain whereby simply collected regrets from all over the world and what I found in reading through these regrets, thousands of them, literally thousands upon thousands of them all over the world is at around the world. People have the same for regret over and over and over and over again, and some ways. The traditional way we even I had been in my public opinion survey. I said I had people put their regrets, asking their regrets and put them into categories like career, family, education and health, and so forth, and I found that that was not very revealing because there's something bigger going on beneath the surface for core regrets that people had all over the world. Ok and what were they nor on passively tell yet. Let me give you an example of one of them about how it spends domains. I took me want to figure this out. So among Americans who went to college huge numbers of people

we're not setting abroad its unbelief really. While I'm glad I did then ok, aided where'd you go when I was in high school. I went to Germany, then in college. I want to Israel, Ukraine, Mexico, Panama and Serbia. Cited in lot just so. Those are. Some of these points are not that close to the other places, you ve traveled around a layer, so people regret not studying abroad. Okay, so education regret. I have huge numbers of regrets from all over the world. where someone has someone they're interested in romantically LISA. I like this person is, manner this woman. I want to ask him her out on a date, but I never got around to workers on future. They regretted ever since people we're getting that for ten years. Twenty years, thirty Yanks huge numbers of regrets about people who say ah stating this crappy job when all I wanted to do was start my business, but I never have the guts to start a business, and I really regret not doing that. Gets you that's a career regret, but all those regrets at Saint, yet its regret no kidding. What you gonna juncture, you can play it safe or take the chance in place if you regret it right. So this the boldness regret, and so this is a big cadigan

I regret it doesn't matter the domain of life. It is that we have regrets about boldness if only I taken the chance we also have foundation regrets which our regrets about not doing the work so regrets about smoking not saving money. They give you a wildly foundation. We have these more regret. Switching we have only had done. The right thing, which includes a mazes number of regrets by pulling out shocked at how often those bowling regrets came up lot of regrets but infidelity other kinds of moral breaches, and then Finally, connection regrets where'd, you have a relationship that should have been in it comes apart, usually in slow undermine ways you want to reach out. You want amended, you wanna, get that connection, you dont do it and you regret it and to me these four regrets. These four regret are the path out of this pandemic, because these four regrets are essentially photographic negative of the good life. All these people telling us by telling us their regrets, they're telling us what they value most in life and over.

over again around the world, it is the same for things they value stability right, Oh, my god, I don't have enough money to pay for that. In save money on, I gotta endangered my health, the right they value stability, boldness I'm here forever. We want to do something we want to grow. We want alarming to try stuff. We want only two psychologically rich life moral unconvincing. Most people want to be good and actually feel pretty criteria when they do not everybody, but most of us actually want to be good and dont like nothing, the first one is connection. Is it is love and not only romantic love? I think our notions of love need to be expanded to our entire family, not just a romantic partner that not only our kids but just like our siblings in our other relatives and our friends in our colleagues, different kind of love, but that's what it's all about. So that's what we need. We need stability. We need some growth, we need goodness and we need love and that's it man. The photographic negative concept is pretty genius right because we can look at all of these. We can even pry take our own inventorying. I really regret these types of things, which are what you just mentioned:

and then, since we know what people regret most now, we can focus on doing those things the right way. So if we regret not keeping in touch with our friends for long time or something like that, because we were too busy with life. Now say: ok, what it's not too late. Most of them are still around. and unwilling to reconnect at some level. So I think this like the one you're gonna take one. Away from this episode. I think this is probably yet which is You can inventory of some your biggest regrets and see which ones you can fix mitigate or at least not make the same type of a mistake in the future, because all a lot of things, I thought I would regret like wasting about if money on something, I literally can't remember what those already more and it doesn't matter in the law, I remember when I was young. My parents would be like you're gonna regret bending seven hundred dollars on this thing, and I might now I'm like seven order. Who cares that no, I regret, bullying this kid

every one else was doing it and I felt bad for him, but I have the guts to stand up for him and myself. Like that's my regret, I don't care about wasting money under Nintendo right, so that sort of is it. Shift our lives in a different direction. If we regret not choose Korea, career, not being bolder, are going out on a limb. Then that guides our future decision but only if we again only if we don't like sweep it under the rug and decide that, because we want to us help, seminar, we're not gonna think about those things, and I want to move from a self help. Seminar to Georgia just give you a big man, I'm not sure I mean that's, I'm with it a man. Otherwise, like you said, what's the use of regret, it obviously has a function I guess a lot of animals don't have language, but if they did they probably our thinking man. I regret not. I don't know what railways regret not a whole.

Really yeah and are now that's a survey. You can do next spring expert, I dont know, guerrillas might have more, you know about to be higher on the regret chain, then say raccoons or jelly yes or something, but you know obviously animals learn yet they learn yeah. You know, in regret, as a formal learning at a very interesting question about my country, No idea- and I have no way approving disproving this- is that regret- is too sophisticated, cognitive, Liefer, most animals, most other animals besides human beings, to experience it and by it in a sophisticated, where I found a very, very hard to believe yeah yeah, it's kind of tough. I guess, look somebody lesson Probably like now, I'm an expert in June. behavior and they have regrets they're, just really, oh, I would love to hear from that. I would love to hear from the person. You are an expert in this area of with animals, and you think that they have regrets. Definitely email me, Jordan, the Jordan Harbinger dot com, I'm curious too, because if they have regrets, maybe they're really sort of- and I want to be

about it, but it's a chimp whatever unsophisticated like maybe there's some sort of basic regret, but it's not a very it's not like. I wish I'd kept in touch with the other chimps that that last zoo they were really nice. Folks, it's probably more like I reckon eating this certain things it's almost like, then wonders regret. just become learning a lesson that happen debate. behavior. I dont, that's, maybe a philosophical discussion yeah I, but I don't think chimps are saying. Oh my god, I mean a bag of chips. You I had a chance to do you near abroad in Paris yeah now, maybe I should have taken more advantage when, as the Berlin Zoo, I really just stated time by time. In New Jersey, mandatory get over there. But what is the difference them between disappear?

men and regret, for example, is there a difference in their years? Seems like there is really a huge difference in the difference is regret as your fault, this point is not your fault. Ok, I'll, give you the best example is apparently examples, not mine. It's from my JANET Land Maneuver done a lot of work and regret at the University of Michigan. She says I guess so, Imagine you got a three year old kid. Your two and a half you haven't lost the tv now now now barely get. No, I just got a gallery. I gotta get some. You got a five year old and of particular honour residual loses its yoga ago. He could certainly Tita runs age sex. I guess it yet. Kid was the to the age sex. Okay, so we know about the tooth fairy Stiller, a part of most american families lives, okay, so she lose the tooth she put the tooth underneath your pillar for a so the two, very common, replace a tooth with take the tooth and give her a bucker Sunday rest guy. She wakes up the next morning, the to the still there she's disappointed her pair.

regret, not replacing the tooth with a dark right. What's happening, it's one person's for the other person is a victim of circumstance. The other person actually has the agency that caused it. So regret is your fault, those I'll give you sports example, I'm a basketball fan and, unfortunately, I'm a basketball van in Washington DC and so are hometown Tina watching with its I'm, always disappointed when the wizards lose. But I can't regret it right. I don't play and coach, I don't own. The team saw my fault about you know, but the owners of the Wizards or Bradley Beale should regret blowing games. yeah does therefore, I'm just disappointed that makes sense right. So a sort of like is this locus. Have control of Yahoo has control over that situation of great use come on bring bring the social psychology line distorting yeah. It's locus control its agency. If those countries that yeah that's exactly what it is, but you know essentially regret is your fault is appointed. Is not your fault that the distinction, because I think a lot of us- maybe

Here too, I mean what I was reading the book as like. Oh I regret these things. I wait. No, I don't obviously done no eight or sad This happened, but I dont know We truly regret it, because it is also hard to regret something that you didn't even know about gap, because you really didn't it never even thought about studying abroad. You might regret not doing it, but really, if you didn't know that was an option or you are so poor that there was no chance in Hell. It was ever gonna happen more. It's not really familiar to you to regret that kind of thing. Absolutely right, absolutely right! I agree that a hundred percent- that's true for this one category regrets about foundation, regret so, etc. Nowadays, we regret the foundation. Regrets are, if only it down the workers, are regrets about saving money and and Helen and so forth. So imagine you have a regret,

saving money. I get a lot of people with regret. You know the very point in story of a guy in Tennessee who forty three years old, very successful career, and he said he looks up unease as if one eight forty three I've been working, my but offer you start working with eighteen, very successful got so to work. My bought off when I was eighteen, twenty five years later, I am sure for America's yeah, it's terrible right, yeah, there's a lot of things like that. Now, however, another imagine you have somebody who is say thirty, five years old and he says? Oh my god, I regret not having. Of money. And then you unpack the story and you say well wait. A second your parents can afford is any to college. He went to college anyway, and you were saddled with a hundred and thirty thousand dollars a student love right. And working your whole life. That's not entirely we on you right, so we have to think about what are we have agency over? What do we, or do we not have agency over on boldness, We often have a lot of agency unmoral. We often have a lot of agency on connection. We often have a lot of agency with foundation. It's a little Mercier, but we

you have a designer want to exonerate people to say that all you have no responsibility for taking care you're finances are your health or your overall wellbeing. Yeah, that's, I think, most people, I don't know- People are themselves off the hook too easily, probably not people who visited us, adding mostly people who said at this hour busy beating them's up over things that they don't have control over as opposed to trying to shove responsibility themselves? Although who knows it's a big audience, there's a lot of people in it with different personality type. I wonder in the survey or in your reason did you find that people mostly regretted things that they did versus thing.

If they did not do or the other way around. That's an unclear question, but did most people regret doing something are not doing something and guests are very clear question and its central to the architecture of regret. Here's where we know in general, especially overtime people, regret what they didn't do much more than what they did to the root of inaction, outnumber regrets of action, and this is especially true as people age. One of the clearest findings in my own quantitative research is that at age around aged twenty people had about equal numbers of regrets of action and inaction, so in the quantitative serve I had people report their regret and then categorizes it regret of inaction or action, something I did recently and into and in the early twenties people had about the same number of action and inaction regrets as people age. The chart looks like this and just inaction regrets take oh wow, so why do you think that is with all kinds of reasons? One of them is that for action regrets you can sometimes do something arriving.

that no regrets removed. You can apologize to that kid. You believe you can find it at least it's like okay. You know I should have marry that guy, but at least I have these a good kid. Inaction regrets always bug you because they remain unresolved. You have this floating. What, if over you all the time and in May It causes a lot of the inaction regrets and are being things that especially things like boldness in connection that really really really deeply bring meaning to our lives. The idea of leading a psychologically rich life and doing something is, I think, that is a fundamental human impulse him we ve toward it. It doesn't go away. We have an innate need, have affinity and connection and belonging with other people, and when that doesn't happen, doesn't go my way here, in actual regret, really really linger. We also I think, there's a lot of research on people have close relationships: french marriages, whatever it is there I fear, and they live longer, so it would make sense that it not even close at its I'm in clause right yeah, so

You get older, you probably start to really acutely feel alone. If you like, never got married, never have kids and just resigned spending money on yourself. travelling around its April when you get older Ye D find yourself in a smart, smaller box. That means there is a famous renown study called the grand studied start Harvard in the nineteen allow authorities. I think I'm forgetting that it's a wanted. A lot largest longitudinal stays ever conducted in psychological science, where in all its it distorted little because they started following these eyes were all men are wiped out who were at Harvard as undergraduates, and then they follow them all the way through their lives. Bed Bradley was part of this cohort. Think John F Kennedy was part of this code or they checked in them all the time and some of,

more successful some of them were healthy. Some of them were not, but the people who flourished had satisfying relationships. The people who floundered did not have satisfying relationships period did matter the money. It actually did matter the physical health and even the guide you who started this. He has a really interesting, unpublished paper with the results some of the results, and he says I can describe the results of this. Like seven decades study in human flourishing describe it. In five words, happiness is love, full, stop vile while and he's right. I don't like it. We want you but he's totally right now I mean it. It makes sense corner court only but I'm forty one and, unlike you know, I don't regret all the fun things that I did that involved other people, but I often regret all the work I put in. Certain things in my twenties at the expense of having like classic. Example. I worked really hard in college and then It's really harden grad school am like. If I

do it over again. I would probably Do we less studying and weigh more socializing, because I was I'm not going to be that guy goes to colleges joins of fraternity and makes a bunch of friends hangs out. I'm an I lived in Library and non like you know that guy in some ways to where I am today, but in other ways I really could have had a lot more relationships from college instead of like that, I any and full of people. I still keep in touch with that. I we lived with you know next to believe next to them, or studied with evidence like the only people. I know from those those connection and its funding is now I had to advise someone else going back to your earlier point, I would say: make his men friends and connections is possible and don't worry about the skull shapes of pre humans as much as you did, oh? No, I think that you should. I disagree with the second part of that. I think the skull shapes a pre humans are revealing about who we are ass: human beings and where we were never policymaker you now I took a bunch of those classes. It was like here's australopithecine

skull shape, it has a brow ridge and like a little, I forget what liquor crest or something and, unlike that's, not serve me super well really glad I met sure it is sure. Does it make you? intimidated by evolution and by neuroscience later in your life, fair refrain, here's the thing you know it's like we gotta do both. I have plenty of people who regret not working hard enough in college because it gave them and uncertain foundational interesting. The question is: is there an inherent trade off between having a solid academic foundation and building those connections? And I don't think that trend of his inherent? I actually think that one can do, but you can do both. you don't have to be very intentional about it. I basically decided I shouldn't do one, because it would mean that I'm not doing enough of the other, which is total nonsense, because what happened rise. Exactly that's just a story telling yourself right. It was like. I spent you mean we're gonna himself, help seminar here I need to get a tattoo remind myself that I should not have worried about this. Speaking of inaction regrets this is

an interesting phenomenon that I experienced that maybe people can relate to, and maybe you even have some way to shut on this. I left an old company about five years ago and I realized very he quickly. I should say I immediately regretted not leaving that company earlier and so, when I type I talked about it on the show and people would say Jordan. I love you man, but it's really cringing sour grapes that you're saying that you'd wish you'd left earlier. I know you love Aesop's fables, but I will say now with five there's of hindsight or experienced by me. It really was and sour grapes. It was since the decision to That company was largely made outside of my control due to a dispute I wanted to leave, but I couldn't and then it over and then suddenly it was like you're leaving, but none since early on your terms, I just had a son realisation that I should have split earlier and it all came, rushing in very quickly into it. First to I think, a lot of outsiders itself like a rationalization that would make me feel better, like I M, so glad I'm gone, but really now MIKE

help. I'm really and always have been very glad that I'm gone. It was more of a realization instead of rationalization, but it happened like overnight almost, and I wonder if that's common, I think so. I think the key is what the lesson to learn from it. The lesson was when you start having these inkling or these feelings of what I really should do this, but here's a bunch of reasons. I can't maybe Those reasons are keeping you comfortable and keeping you. You know it's fear based, and maybe that means you should try it. I'll bet, friggin harder to to make those things happen, or at least stop sweeping and under the rugs What I did was, I went. I can't do this now. You know it's too late. I think that you learn lessons from that thing as a lily, but here's the thing. This is why it so interesting. It's like regret, deliver some paint, not massive pain but a little bit, but it also delivers. Learning thing is can have one without the other. You want the learning you gotta have a little bit of the pay gap, and the thing is

Pain, modest as it is, is worth were. Standing Is it the only way to deliver the learning? These upward counterfactual that weird river talking about the lease? At least I didn't do that they make us feel better, but they don't help us do better, if only to make us feel worse and help us do better. In fact, this is the key they help us do better, be caused them. I just feel worse, feeling. Worse is a signal to pay attention to what what's going on here and learn from this. The Jordan Harbinger show with our guest Dan Pink, we'll be right back. This episode, sponsor in part by bull and branch when a third of our lives in bed. While if your parent, you spend more or maybe less or more but getting Leslie, but anyway, highquality comfortable sheets, not worth cutting corners on Poland and to make the highest quality sheets doing things the right way, not the easy way. I was now even my younger years made the mistake of purchasing inexpensive sheets that didn't end up up in the wash at all, but I've learned better. We love are born branches hunter per cent.

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since from other companies all lined up and easy to compare. All you have to do is choose the right and coverage that you like Progressive, gives you options. So you can make the best choice for you. Could we looking for saving money in the very near future, more money for say a pair of cancelling headphones and instead bought more puzzles, whatever bring do you joy get a quote today at progressive dot com? It's one small step you can do today that can make a big impact on your budget tomorrow. Progressive casualty entrance the an its comparison rates not available in all states are situations prices very based on how you buy by the way you can now rate the chauffeur listening on Spotify. This is a huge help for us. I think it's gonna make the show more visible on Spotify as well just go to Jordan, Harbinger, dotcom, Slash, Spotify or search for us in your Spotify app and click three doubts on the upper right to make it happen. Now, for the rest of my conversation with Dan Pink. That makes sense. I mean look at the end of the day. It's hard to say

if I would have been in as good of a position to restart my business if I'd left earlier. So I try not to really be myself up about it too much, because all my god, I should have left three years for years five years earlier, yeah, but then what I've been totally screwed, not as coherence enough not have the right connection like you really can't ride right, but it was interesting to find that something I thought was going to be impossible are extremely difficult almost overnight turned into man widen. I do this earlier. This is so ridiculous. It's probably help Sophia feel when they leave and abusive relationship with a like? I can't I'm gonna be alone, I'm never going to find someone, and then three months later, the like, I don't wake up best. Every day I'm happier appeared out. There's all these different things that they didn't realize. We're gonna happen. I think you're right, I think, there's a bigger point there and then once again, yes of psychology has figured out. Some of this is that we are loud forecaster, especially about our own, are lost. You know the classic example of it is. If you ask people Simon my fifty seventh year to save, Ok here you go, you have different tastes and music and food and cold

then you'd had when you are twenty five, yet totally now go forward twenty five years in the EU and have different tastes and music culture Oh no, no, I wish you'd be exactly the same. We'd all realise. We think that current me is done like we, been evolving, we ve been cometh would coming totally different people throughout our entire life. In the time that we were your daughter's age and we're dislike lobby cute little things to the time Todd only around like you're older kid to the time that you know we're becoming differently but then the moment when right now we think it's done on me it's over and it's not, and so, when we forecast what our life is going to be like. We don't recognize, were making a forecast about a different person, ends another reason why we are really really really really bad forecasters. So this goes to custom anticipated regret a lot of times. We anticipate regrets, as thank

harboured says we buy emotional insurance. We don't need that is were worried about regrets were worried about certain kinds of regrets and they end up not materializing, and so we make different decisions to avoid those anticipated regrets. So anticipate arrogance is useful, but not perfect. I'll give you an example. Let's take me What choice test multiple choice does so when I grew up and Columbus Ohio, the guidance and multiple choice. Tat was this: let's say here you got question nine and you think the answer is see and then you're going along like wait a second. I think the answer to question nine B. Should you go back and change your answer? Should you go with your first instinct? so I learned through painful experience, to just not change the answers because some reason when you really think about that question. In your that zone in your going you're out. Studying, and also your gut will tell you if you ve got. If you have no idea what the answer is in you just blindly picked ABC or de fine go,

can change it if you have an inkling, but if you had a reason for choosing one, I don't think you should go back change, a man. I've. I've done that too many times. Ok, perfect answer because is very revealing. Really here is what the evidence tells us, and this is not a close call here The evidence tells us that in general, not in every instance that you are much more likely to switch from a wrong answer to a right answer that actually switching is a good idea. Really I got yes, but here's the thing you just articulated exactly the reason. Why? Because we- anticipate much more regret, especially when it actually happened in our life. I know you're going to switch you gotta, you her eyes were right out there to around one feels your guy. That's right, so we insist, It is I am. I got it. I switch from BBC and I'm wrong. I'm so regret it yeah and you gonna do

at less than sticking with the wrong? I heartily same outcome, yet that's funny. So what we're doing Indian Gilbert phrases were buying national insurance, we don't need- and we end up, makes it dissipated red, sometimes leads us to bad, often very risk averse decisions at so funny, so it needs to be. We need to end The pillar regrets properly in a way to do. That is to anticipate what the things are. We really will regret in our lives, and we know that from these sixteen thousand people. We know that ten years from now five years, a ten years from now twenty years from now far less likely to regret the action of Spain. seven hundred dollars a mountain and tender system who, then you are to regret the inaction of not staying in touch with people who you were once close that totally makes sense man, it's so funny. I would even go as far is to regret, changing and answer on it Well, I'm not sure if those answers were wrong later and I will just assume those were changed wrong answers and that's why my score is lower. So it's all like a narrative in my own

had I know I'm not the only one who does this for share nowhere, that's funny! So if we have you call these versus closed door regrets, if we have open door regrets where we can maybe change the current situation, does it help to try to remedy it like reconnect with old friends or apologize to that kid? With that we bullied and what about the closed. once we're like that, person is passed away and we, to do that in our. What do we do with those? Well, I'm with open door. Regrets it's important, especially with the connection wretches really bored to do something. I ll give you an example, the biggest lesson from me, and all of this is like. We think that these connection regrets or you're at a juncture should reach should it not reach up if you're a juncture, we wondering whether the reach out in my mind, you answer the question always reach up, always reject, because adore still still open. Now I have a story of somebody in the book who had a friend, close friend friend, who ended up developing very pernicious horrible form of cancer man, and this woman wanted to reach out to her friends.

My friend was in trouble, you're gonna awkward. She didn't reach out. She waited a little longer should finally called her, and that morning the friend power has its horrible right. That's a gas or regret. But what did this person do? First name is Amy. This person Amy she's, like oh, my god. Ok, that's terrible. I feel terrible. Do I knew all never regrets do ignore that no do I wallow in it probably not psychological healthy? What I do I learned from it and sadly, but happily, and a weird way she had another friend in that situation and she treated a totally different, let where she called a friend regularly the exchange text messages and that friend to Sally passed away, but Amy says no. I don't have any regrets about that. So what did you do she forgave herself? She disclose the regret. She extracted a lesson from it and she did better next time and that's what we do with closed.

or regret, is essentially change our course of behaviour in and not sit there and beat yourself off. That makes a lot of sense. Confront it, don't ignore it. Confronted forgive yourself disclose it extract the lesson from, do better. Next time, when you were taking your survey, you meant They change a little bit by age. Was it different from and verses women as well since you so for the quantitative survey also regret not asking this question because there some other research on this, but I did separate people by the samples large enough that it could do cross by gender, and there were some differences between men and women in this surface domains of their regret. So men had more career rats in women, women, more family regrets than men. I don't it's big surprise. There's other research showing in existing academic literature to oversimplify a bit having do with sexual. Regrets and in general, to over simplify a bit? Men typically regret the people they didn't sleep with, and women tend to regret the people they did. Sleepily

also not a huge surprise. Probably I think I will go into Balin. Ok thought about it. anticipated. The regret of going into that subject changed so the interview well done such working already yet workin? Already you have a practical, a technique in the book that I like, which is meant subtracting, positive events. Can you give us through this? This is kind of I had never thought of heard about this. This is a good way to do it. A downward counterfactual on at least to make yourself feel a little bit better and its based on some interesting resurgence of psychology about this capacity for time, travel and essential. What you do is you you think about your current life and you take away something that is important and imagine that it never happens. You can think about what say. I never met my wife

I'm mentally subtract that it is a health skip, imagined they sort of imagine what my life would be like. It is a health cape and it makes you more grateful in a moment. It makes you more appreciative of what you have and it's a way to serve calm yourself and feel better about the moment by mentally subtracting those positive events at its is built on the technique that was done in NAM. It's a wonderful life were George Bailey is visited by name the angel traipsing back that look, what this town, whatever town is called. I can remember at all here. I'm really look at the town is called if you had never been born, it was a house. Gate I'm I use that word again. I'm gonna let this up our people, are gonna imbalance and be like it's kind of Bedford Falls which is rife God, right wit, it doesn't say what it would have been called, but it was called Bedford falls. Oh, it is now Potter's Ville ride right good. I was the bad guys savings and loan right

right, ok, you know, Sir George Bailey is visited by an angel and the angel takes George and show them what Bedford falls would be like if he George hadn't been born. So it is a mental attraction of a positive event. It is a counter factual and the dust. What George Seas is a healthcare that his presence on the planet actually made falls it better, kinder richer place. So what is the purpose of this again? Just ass, I mean, of course, in his case, is to make him feel better about himself was a guy. I know it's a technique for making us feel better. Ok and sometimes we simply do want to feel better, and so you have a regret that is hard to undue and you still feel bad about it anymore. It extracted lesson from it, but still lingering you can try to do in at least you can say off, I should have studied abroad and when I try to go to ITALY next year, I still feel robust enough setting abroad, but at least that junior year I made my good friend Hiram and that's really important to me

ok, so this is like almost rationalization process, but something that's a little bit more better than just Leah. It's a more organised way to do this and I can get behind that. I think it's important to do that, but there's gotta deep injures anyhow, but what it does is it can deepen your sense of gratitude for what you have to go, and we know that that having a sense of gratitude actually explicitly feeling in expressing gratitude is very, very good for us. Can we over Do this kind of thing with regret, aversion or anticipating regret. It seems like there's awaited just do this so much that it has the it blows up in our face hundred percent you're totally right. One of the things that you see is pretty well known: research having to do with the way the people make decisions or anticipate their decision, but make decisions than anticipated

this is of action. Some people or maximizes they're gonna get the best out of everything. I'm gonna maximize everything, a decision tat. Other people are satisfies us. Ok, some things are good enough and what the research tells us very clearly not even close, is maximizing miserable this miserable because it you can't maximizing everything they I think of of important lesson enlivened, especially and how would certainly how we reckon with our regret is only anticipate our regret that you ve got a MAC It might by minimizing ever regret. Should I have potato chips are corn, What one will I regret? My more you know right should have macaroni and cheese or a hamburger. Should I buy a blue collar break you're gonna go crazy here. What we should do We should on most of our choices- and this is hard for people to deal with, because we're in this world a maximization on a lot of our choices. We should just satisfice, because it's not going to matter it's your nintendo story there, all right. How are

We do know from a chorus of sixteen thousand people, the stuff we will regret over the long term until we should maximize on building our stability or connections our boldness and our morality, and I think that gives us a lesson for living. It's a rubino. We want to optimize. Our regrets would just satisfies on a lot of things but MA the mines by anticipating what we know you're going to regret it for an enduring time, because we know that these into bring regrets, give us signals for what makes life worth living interesting, so we don't want. necessarily minimize our regret but kind of optimize. Our regret, I think, maybe you even wrote about this. Yeah finger, so we want. We want, do it right, instead of just not doing it at all or doing it. So much that now it see our spending six months deliberating Cholerick are exactly that made it a dirty little secret maximizes are miserable. Ok, if I think of my god should I put on my gray sweater.

They are my blue sweater to day. You know I would try orca me you're gonna go crazy, you can't maximum and was even worse, and that is that not only do and at making bad decisions in a moment, but you have shoot opportunity cos because you're, not thinking deliberately about the step that really does matter which is like yeah. You should reject that friend you haven't talked to YAP. You should do that. The thing here at this juncture, rather than the wrong thing, is in a bug you, if you don't do the right thing, you don't yap, play it safe or take the chance. You know why take the chance, because you're probably not gonna, regret that and the other stuff doesn't really matter Dan thanks. So much we're coming from. You showed at a really appreciate great conversation, as always, Jordan always apply for talking to you. Thanks for having me your about here, a preview of the Jordan Harbinger Shell with a former pimp and how he uses mind. Manipulation apparent, teaches a woman manipulate men, so I'm teaching her but what she noticed it after the thinking of doing teaches that hey you're, a man to show us

We naturally that she works these women and, while on you best smart browser due to make a lot of us to prepare for any day so any vice, you may have their just foot. He gets it upon. You become a not assistance Your pact, you become empty, become hollow. You train is no joint use, various no pain. You won't know, you won't know hate you just an empty room. You can't love money, you can hated see the puppet master cannot have any interest any wants any. Thus any desires any dreams any cold, nothing. Why so? He can control your last your dreams, your desires, you don't do anything so that you can become everything I haven't aversion for women who are six feet off like like one more mistake in my heels, five sixty five, your fifty seven, but I find myself looking up feet tall around her.

And she's all powerful my presence, so we cannot separate anything. I was insecure about you that you thought it evaporate obvious shot twice a stab. Let them off. He tried to kill me. I must leave I've done bank our reason my to a purpose, one by accident, I know what I know, Gaza receive the consequence. That are what I do it all the more you I work it was their good of Iraq I would not be strong enough to resist the allure, it does happen, psychological effect, then the only way to avoid the effect is to stay there. Even though I told you who lives in the eleven million dollar house built up by one time cannot set up governance issues it every or a chilling peak into the shadow world and the life in mind of a former pent Mickey Royal check out episode, five, forty eight of the job, an harbinger, show hope

on joint listening to this one. Personally, I have no regrets about this episode. If you think it might be creepy by the way to reach out to somebody who you haven't spoken too in a while just think about this, think about how you would feel if they reached out to you, would it be creepy the ads are almost always is now so, if you're worried about how you do that. Are you feeling awkward by doing that, definitely go and check out six minute networking I made the course just for people who are feeling that way. It takes just a few minutes a day, Jordan Bonjour dot com, slash course is where you can find it super super easy, not even six minutes called it not even six minute networking, but it seemed a little bit less catchy. Then six minute networking George, harbinger dot. Com, slash course is where you can find it in the book by the way. It's interesting. It has all these anonymous people's regrets inserted through Dan Pink as a great writer big. Thank you to him for coming on links to all. Dan Pink will be in the show notes at Jordan, harbinger dot com. Please use our website links if you do by the book. It does help support the show transcripts in the show notes

and there's a video of the interview on our Youtube Channel at Jordan, harbinger dot com, Slash Youtube, I'm Jordan Harbinger on both Twitter and Instagram or connect with me I'm linked in any way. can find me. I was enjoying engaging with you. The show is created in association with. Broadcast one. My team is Jen Harbinger, Jason Sanderson, Robert Frogeity, Milieu Campo, Ian bared, Josh, Ballard and Gabriel Ms Raw. He remember we rise by lifting others, the thief. the show is that you share it with friends when you find something useful or interesting. If you know he's dealing with some regret, definitely share this episode with him. I hope you find him and great in every episode of they show the greatest compliment, you can give us share, they show with those you care about. In the meantime, do your best to apply you here on the show, so you can live what you listen and we'll see you next time. Are you ready for it? I guess that doesn't old, back check out the atom Corolla show the number one daily downloaded podcast in the world five days a week, and completely uncensored joint Adam is. He shares his thoughts on current events, relationships, politics and so much more Adam work,

a wide range of special guests to join him in study for in depth, interviews and affront received to his freewheeling point of view. Download Subscribe, entered into the atom Corolla show on Apple podcast, Spotify, Amazon or wherever you get your pod