« The MeatEater Podcast

Ep. 160: Lust and Greed

2019-03-18 | 🔗

Steven Rinella talks with Seth Berglee, Ryan Callaghan, Sam Lungren, Ben O'Brien, and Janis Putelis.

Subjects Discussed: More on the world’s most expensive fish; disservicing Robert Service; Canadian pride; talking someone on to something; shooting effectively; what good marksmen have in common; being process oriented versus outcome oriented; how to be deadly with a bow; Daniel Boone’s ol' Tick Licker; the origins of getting skunked; the battle of Adobe Walls; big bore pistols; what exactly does “loaded” mean; our penultimate word on Herrera v. Wyoming; and more.


Connect with Steve and MeatEater

Steve on Instagram and Twitter

MeatEater on Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, and Youtube

Shop MeatEater Merch

Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.com

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
the shirtless severely wounded and in my case unaware of the meat eater podcast he can't predict the gulf i got a bone to pick verse off cause i remember we were talking about the guy that the guy that had the bluefin tuna yeah the right and he refresh my man all you gotta do they caught illegally dragged into some are doing some horrible hosting so we got a copper corrections about the bluefin tuna
more clarification of one correction regos misled me and missed and really misled listeners by not no one not no one something the story is how the cook the that the catch season and bluefin tuna had been closed on the east coast and a guy called a five hundred for those different ways down out of four hundred pound bluefin too nah he thought maybe i can hide this giant fish and no one will know i actually boated it because he could legally release it right like you could targeted for clients but you just can't keep him but decides to keep think of the real valuable he thinks he's going to go and take it and sell it in a backdoor restaurant exchange which i guess happens quite a bit and he doesn't do it at one of the restaurants reports him for trying to sell this tuna he panics ties it to his truck and dragged out into the woods and and gets all these crazy finds an entire mothers are timber
is the value of bluefin tuna in you boys can which is most guilty you two are involved in it in miles novelty is not here right now is involved in it talking about how some tuna are worth millions of dollars we look it up on the internet yeah yeah internet guy right ass to be true kate now all but a guy i is going to now correct us kate you check this out then check this out i will where he's saying he says in reference to the story of the poached and discarded bluefin tuna you misstated the value of bluefin tuna in the japanese fish auctions as one or three million dollars and you either that is the first of the year right k there's a there's a sort of ceremonial thing with the first tuna they take a nice tuna and sell the first tuna of the year at auction and it's like a dick swinging contest
where whoever can sit down the fattest wallet and his has the best business going will do us balik purchase of the first tuna as a sort of media driver but the same fish if it was the second tuna will be eighty grand it's a thing you do to be like it's it's like the opening of the sail like the texas state fair with the grand champion steer and all the oil companies tell me more i don't know this but i like i like the sounds of it says you have the voyeurs at burghley i guess all your rural your rural areas they have you know your four age or your state fairs and so all these kids usually show these animals and then when you get in the end they had the grand champion you know this is the supreme steer while you go to a state like texas where obviously there's a lot of oil money a lot over like north dakota somewhat because european eel thousands of dollars which those kids a ton of money but
get the same thing they steers gopher you no one to three hundred thousand dollars for a beef because it's the same it's like the grand champion you no real gotta have it so yeah that does not guy did andrew yet not yet not man i feel i feel like we're like in special contexts they will be sold for a great deal of money but now here's the problem here yes that was bad you were saying that the tuna is that a tuna can be worth there the amount of money so the guy didn't pay a million dollars were but yes but ok value of the tuna it was like us it's a symbolic ceremonial thing as nothing do the value of the tuna near know you completely right we're day they re wrong for misrepresenting that like the average value of a too they want a year you saw that way in the thick swinging contest then it's not the value of the tuna male gear
honor if you charge him i guess the wholesaler that these do on their outer banks third better selling the tuna to they're not gonna get that their money i get a rare you got nothing to do with it at the interesting thing is doing some trickled down economics dude that caught fish minds of getting five hundred grand or something year of junior doctors yogurt wonder what about door deal at a restaurant on get other this gather road irregularities gather i guess you ten thousand dollar fine this guy wrote in one as a road and about this was very close to this in new the players involved in calm explained a little bit of bachelor yonder astonished to learn it seems as though others other boats around and somehow this guy thought it's possible to to do this without
to deal with a fish of this size without attracting attention and it seems like you blundered and a number of areas people were aware of my hey academy if by with a five hundred four hundred pound tuna hanging off the end of his boat and south ex introduce yourself set burghley i dunno how much you might mean i bet i grew up not there's no actually i s named on berg's not burghley burghley no es yeah lot people call me berg's but a lot of nicknames no as i grew up northeastern montana farm ranch up there so that's kind of my background as agriculture start hunting when i was about three years old bb gun and sparrows weren't safe and been doing it ever since and what's northeast montana north of brockton so i'm kind of between plenty wouldn't wanna point yeah kind of up in no man's land dated a gal from plenty would one time go ahead wasn't your sister got a sister i do while i do she wasn't deployed
yeah so we moved out of buildings and i was in high school my dad and health issues and culture to healthcare stuff did college there and then got a scholarship gotta state name on a shooting scholarship so shocking competitively there and then the we pick me up after that negotiate for them and spend a few years doing that move back to me and i am not alone in politics little bit on i level state representatives stay representative represent the people of representing the good people of carbon county what's the area that basically from just south of laurel all the way to red lodge the luther roscoe area and then south of the border how many constituents do you have about ten thousand so it's funny i was just in dc and i was talking to a state representative from virginia and talking about campaigns and constituents and that sort of thing and so i asked what's up with the campaign like for a state representative in virginia he's like oh you know like three or four hundred thousand dollars that's like well an expensive one hears about forty so it's a little bit different
she has got so far back there's no four box where we can still has an expensive or the averages pray about sixty ten maybe six agenda knowledge about about were in an election year you're looking at like five hundred thousand votes a swing in their yeah yeah thousand vote is a big big difference think we have a high voter turnout in earlier this year was like sixty seven percent or something like that and yeah it's about i want to say that we have the euro the registered voters there was probably hired turn up and others about sixty four hundred votes i think so but it can be swung auto districts her panful about twenty votes forty votes brilliant some unusual there's one or two in the state that come down to five or eight votes may do a recounting are we won by three so in the most like most state legislators are they have another gig
oh yeah you can't make a living at this i mean they say we make eleven thirty three an hour or whatever the state wage but that's eight hour days so you know when we're in session i don't know i mean i guess there's some days we get earlier you have a half day that you work but generally if you're involve you bet around you're there it six six there the every morning in you often won't leave delve eight nine o clock so if you work sixty six that's kind of an average day so you're not really making that much money everybody has a job sorry go ahead no i was just going to say how many terms have you done this my third term okay cool so and then you're only getting paid when you're in session that's kind of a people think you're on like a salary deal it's you get paid every day that you're working and then we get a per diem but you're moving up there and paying rent and buying food and stuff so it's not really moneymaking gig do it for the figure ideological reasons are in turn help people out so i very as a launch pad right
people might not see that as micro projection i guess i'd like life it's good when you're really there's when you look at the the make up of the legislature you get a lot of retired people could they have time to do it you get some younger people that kind i have time on their hands you know independent business owners guys that can do their own thing take some time off and you get lawyers because they can just shut the practice i don't like our i have not taken any donated work for four months and then they'll come back but it's kind of tough for you in the egg world you know there's a lot of guys from you know out in the sticks that are ranchers or farmers and farmers have a little easier could they you can't get the field but this year they won't be until after we're out but like uncharted i have right now so their wives are at home you know cabin things out the neighbors are helping them out so it's it's a tough gig if you're kind of a working man how much of your job is bad sing out all of urban county verses red lodge i get a lot of people bid
i got a staters in red lodge and second homes and yeah it's it's more of the ideologies i think it's not there's some really good people on both by i mean you get people that have lived here for five generations can be you justice one side or the other really people in red lodge can be like all there they gotta be from california and be super liberal and it's like well i know guys from california they're like more conservative than anybody else in the county so it's not so much like where you're from or where you live it's more about just kind of how you think about things and people tend to group together it is the other counties alot more agricultural rural people are there for while more farm in old color action and a based and relaunch islam or more retirement and then you get the ski hill so you gonna get that aspect too can i get more people that this country is now feels like a ski and hang out so you gonna get some of that do so
how do you get this deadly laudable agro tourism of montana totally is you know it's like i tell people like this is exactly like if you took montanans squish into one county it's like that's carbon county because you ve got kind of like this in our way i got the hippie town you know all the people live out there anything alien other mountain mountain town little more palatable some people i dunno and but it's like it's kind of like missoula you know you've got that kind of doubt that type of group that does that and then you ve got the two river valleys and carbon can you give the clerks fork and rock creek which has come if missouri and you know the yellowstone and then southeastern county is all just sagebrush nothing it's like if you go to brought us it's like people live out here it's just nothing and and then there's oil there's oil in southeastern part of the county and then we have a lot of coal to your carbon county they named it that because of the coal mine there in bear creek so you have to without industry and so it is it really is kind of like a little microcosm of montana and then you got the mountains you know the western slope grizzly bears wolves and you got elk and yeah every lotta turkey xian had to strive to
grandma also get a mention just got me fox girls it have box or their deadly there i know now i'm looking at my retired about their not risky and for the squirrels dammit though so south what is the name of yes of course then o brien ok i'll oral sex sam london dude wrote in real quick dude wrote in we're thought we were talking chasing a little bit job ass jane garden he chafed when swims it doesn't this is only one aspect of the salt water freshwater yes all waters as a lot worse chafes when he swims i could see that she's in salt i mean you got you got the sand mixing around in the just carried out a brace of negative sailor i feel like
and splashing around snorkeling and change the earth is chiefly on out of our presence of moisture yeah i don't know man but how do we define what com his chief plenty emotion watches his depends as you say big man's problem because modern contact yes lay my legs don't brush no you know so that's why most people think alike on shaping the jap ask is everyone's like most people are going to have some skin on skin contact and they're glued your crease yeah but that was really the thing the u p michigan's upper peninsula where i live very briefly ah there is getting while it there's a deer biologists than the eu peace and if things continue this this winter keeps home and long like it is he's predicting naval loose forty percent of their white tailed year does wonder at oil
at our local biologist told me the highlight lost forty percent in some areas last year forty percent forty percent and you think hunters kildare tart robber tuna big correction i quote i was talking about the great poet robert service i meant like american poetry employed i got some canadians riled up he's a guy bodies is as a canadian in a british colombian i worry about culture being overshadowed america and our attempt maintain a distinct identity from our southern neighbours and even spelt that you can indian way you just put that you in there for emphasis he was like real worked up about mis identifying bob service but that he was born in england so let's they can including my own scott why are you move to scotland use five i was born in england so really sorry
barbara pioneer here for many scots land and so much time the you can't do you know if you're in the yukon you definitely differentiate yourself from those folks down british columbia so i guess i dig amazement american politics have like that's where his audience its yet in english he's a british canadian and american poet and then you and we just kind of appropriate a new thing very very large scott yeah you just pick like something in canada and you like it he does act like it's america isn't it sorta is i think he spent like forty years like the last forty years of his life in europe in london paris bob service robert service up i call robert frost bob us and i call robert service bob earth i think it makes them more you know the poems of bob frost right like that debt thing about building fences yeah you use the use that an american poet laureate bob frost he's got that poem
to do dudes are like they spend all their time build defence between their properties like good fences make good neighbours and like an old stones average and that you realise all they care about is very very carefully delineating the line between their properties as like what they dedicate their lives i will admit that a deafening i definitely do service robert service impression of him so i bought book collected works from air little airport shack and king salmon alaska the sell robert service books yeah because they want their like oh one everybody likes to like lay claim to join your last you're saying that you're down on you say you know like is portuguese it all rhymes neural this is i just bought his book was waiting on our planet to the peninsula to go home brown bears and it was just like wintered would not leave and span a ton of the trip
your shoulder to shoulder with three other deeds an attempt made advocate bob service poem well yeah and so i was super into robert service and just but i had like reading that book front back twelve different times on that trip i'd kind of come the conclusion that there's no way this guy got stationed in the yukon because he was a crackerjack banker united figured they keep was put out there because he can't had like some drugs or alcohol problems and then you know all of his poems too about like the working class and gangrene in my brain that this guy probably did what a lot of poets and writers do as dive bad death some destitute drunk grunders umbrage exactly but that's not the case at all turned out to be quite quite straight out
really yeah and i didn't dinnerware then dodges recently made some money off his merging he was most wealthy writer in paris at one time well what the south as the outer ravaged vessels has drunk under a breakthrough way less inward thank you re less interesting this were re everyone yeah cause lower nowadays are too lazy to rhyme all their poems and that guy had their work ethic that it needs to go into like rhyme and that stuff out to the bitter end this cannot lead like he had a pretty sizable fortune going and then he can when world were one broke one broke out he can join because of his physical condition so during the red cross and anyway little bare and want a bunch metals he sounds like to get a due to be a poet like how it should be under a bridge drawn drunk like hemingway screaming at people yeah just why did you just ease the word litter rare yeah have we talked about to the movies
tombstone oh not for a long time but i know where you're going with that the yeah huckleberry so real quick i guess it's about how we talk about student was that so it's ok i don't know this drive looked into this but this everyone knows that that is in tombstone right yeah the dude a man from top yeah plays thou can allocate joam garral outcome document also our point out very good in heat the mann movie so they'll camera says to a feller he's fixing to shoot em maybe or someone's fixing to shoot someone about a dual kilmer says i'll be your he's like do it shoot me or whatever pull your gun i'll be your huckleberry k know what the hell's at me no nos that means someone was telling me that
that listeners will write an unhealthy clarify this point some was telling me that he message that he met the line up or someone the writers nested opera something i messed up the expression is he's i go ahead i'll pull your gun i will be your hustle bearer which would be a term for he sang try it i'll be your paul there smile not i'll be your huckleberry have you watched it like ten times in a row to make sure that he actually does he also doesn't like huckleberry says i'm your huckleberry i'm your brother russia is hunger where job ringo johnny arise someone just delong january rain i should never bring of stuff you don't know what you're talking about he was too has drunk real quick quick question for you guy rights
he's gotta understand us here he's got a boat max is out of sixty pounds a man wanted mammogram outcome can i can invite you responsible to account when my sixty pounds so guessing compound i say absolutely not absolutely not not i'm not not to do my long delay fifty two pounds yeah fifty four now understand what's your weapon can do that's all all matter get close don't be bombing them at sixty yards sixty pound compounds like an eighty lb longbow i mean how many guys have with eighty lb longbows i was like i just ran out and he has a heavy areas goes i heavier army should be shooting heavier of the sixty bobo annabel fix belabour never go to town yeah i'm not a humongous man on august may about bipolar quite a bit more now that's it i'm just curious but i don't know what to say
single what how what are you pulling says she's seventy keg ironic and military in he says you guys are talking about whether you use when you're trying to splain to some one where something is so you're you're lucky on the landscape and your lighter you see a deer and trying to explain where the gears and we were too talking about whether you should that's described as talking someone into something or talking someone onto something he says mill feller he's as it seems like the hedge mony his word settled on the former now he's a u s air force joint terminal attack controller j data our job is to call in aired aground fire in support of ground forces they damn sure talk people on to something
they do not talk someone into something and he has more call in fire though you don't call on fire so you're calling them onto it but you call in fire so that's a good point he says assuming every one of us has more or less the same knowledge base what really sets a good j tack from from a great one is our ability to get aircraft overhead and talk theirs or destroyed you found all this talk there so the straw sensor onto a target expeditiously and facilitate fire the term we used to talk on because you are virtually moving the pilots eyes from the known to the unknown we work big too small whichever direction you are facing is twelve o'clock as opposed to changing it every time you talk on to a known spot that part i don't understand till you find your fixed points like on a hillside he alright the big tree but he got the big tree all right the deers
at twelve o'clock so you are the known point cause he knows where you are also that that's what i was wondering where the personally out i gotcha so then you're designating off of alright my twelve o'clock because otherwise it's changing no matter where he is and he always knows where the guy's face it man here's the hardest to later dealt later here's the hottest j tactics adopt from now on we are talking use it as a unit of measures list you have a thing say that happens to dear by a school bus and everybody can agree that that school bus common scenario yeah you'd be like on trying to explain distance what they do is you pick something out on the landscape and make that a unit a distance so that's it you can agree on a alone cedar tree a rich up the dear somewhere after the right you take the width of them known cedar tree that becomes your unit of measurement then she want good very
why so awesome you'd be talking about well fifty cedar away okay but let's say you're talking i think are worth less than band shirt but whatever you just saying like pick a known thing and make unit distance units often known thing so if let's say it's a let's say the deer's pretty close someone can't see it like that unit of measurement yes three go three of those over i would be like a little bit teeny ways our yards are always trying to do yards just like our at what point your yards are mine were always like i like twenty yards but i don't know how the hell many of you could go there and one of its ten yards sixty yards would make a unit of measurement and marched her eyes on that unit of measure i've done it with clouds before that stupid you see that big moving cloud clouds mustache go to the right of the mustache on the subject name and guns global feedback people a guy sand it you can't name you want one
it says he has a rifle that he gave it a name it feels ok with it because he has a six five by sixty eight a six five by sixty eight percent he knows a gun i'm not sure i've ever heard of five by sixty eight six five by sixty eight that's what he says some crazy well can he even says that he times since it's six five x sixty eight he times it out it comes out to four hundred and forty two so he calls it before forty two another guy was saying you can't the same way you can't give yourself a nickname if you're going to nickname a gun it can only be given by other people who named the gun the same way you can't give yourself a nickname somewhat legitimate yeah his body as a gun he keeps too much oil on it and one time he dropped a dark in the oil it came off it and so they call his jargon the veil these as that guy he's got a guy named the dog that this the lad
last know i'm ever going to give about cheese curds or top thought like cheese cares when you're buying the squeak if you've been to wisconsin you know about this it's the only thing i like about wisconsin except for doug dern as a joke but cheese carrots when you buy and they get squeaky than you leave lane around they lose their squeak indulge dern feels as though it's like against god and man you that would you ever let your kurds sit around so long that they losers their squeak unlike if you let him sit that long you don't deserve to have squeaky kurds his boys in el ray wisconsin were telling us that you leave him on the dashboard you're talkin the sun re squeak some will tell us that you might raven they'll get squeaky again this guy's in absolute best way to revive your neglected cheese kurds is the place them into a colander and run
water over them for about a minute they will be not just as good he says and pinup he makes a parenthetical if not better then right when they came out of the vat cash i'll be trying that little cheat wisconsin turkey seasons coming up yeah that guy can i go ahead it's not going to start asking staff questions yeah shoot i got one that might be a good way to lead into the can you can you pivot off it yeah a mobile to go to an office if we can do this first one quickly the dude wrote in this is interesting because it's kind of it's kind of about shooting but he's got a predicament that he's found himself twice no one you guys all way and see if why would you guys doing the situation he went back at you cotton in car body and on the third year they were battery as finally got into a bull knowledge stay it was in they trade days
who gets to be the shooter and who's colin right so it was his day to shoot bull comes in he's going to have a perfect shot at the age of upon backup what about the three year there's this is bad ridden yeah they ve been hot and three years on successful haven't got a shot and killed nothin third last day it is it's his day issue and bore staff so and right as he's getting ready to shoot he hears or bogo off he sees the aerial smoke this bowl and he ends up still punching his trigger because of just like he's like whoa but wagon and shoots an arrow to his arrow hits in the paunch boy was like thirty average overrun over and dies ends up being nice three hundred twenty inch six point and he's like dude thought it was my day to shoot ray and he's like oh really i thought it was mine like
we saw a whole lot of say i'll hold on a second this fight that the two guys are hunted together here they call in a bowl in he's saying both of them simon like virtue like almost simultaneously launch arrows both hit the one who got search was away tolerate their that seems to me when you look our military all your draw your boss drawn or they with it are they indifferent different spots because if they could see each other not like a subtle thing you do typically a is like twenty to fifty yards spread out one guy in front one guy sure typically to but i also called in standing right ex valued and been whispering in his ears were when to draw bozo ya don't september he could have been ten yards away deathly been could have drawn and been doing job in jackson the other guy witness barely see what happens there is a very valuable takes all anyways they spoke to me
i can always happens and they can decide on who should get the antlers the dude who is both be certain yeah oh he had a bad hit he about here my have not kill you blame his bad here on the fact that other guy shot ass roused the ass totally now they're gone one there they alternate years this wipe it out each other's houses it seems like to nice guys right yeah i know a lot of guys it would not be so i saw it down the middle does each heaven amp messroom sailed on after i get her i didn't you you know why not be realised and you can do and he saw something and have him he brought us realise how you're supposed to put that to your wall it be prick vision is half and put it aim and out you cut it down the school did they mounted just have the school
they mounted on others also do its duty man no one wants to sort out the markets of the actual amount is always rule if it's the old school where he's looking were the mouth is a short term outlook and dead nuts forward so you could so then you can split it turn sideways and plastered against the wall thank you he called out illegal if its high school you caught it and don't have looking out you haven't plastered against the wall which looks very cool yeah menu like kind of artistic maybe an innovator workspace your wife's going to like it he tells me to get a house with the same floor plan two that'd be here that'd be helpful we were going to do that one time we were gonna bandsaw have a buck down the middle because it kind of kind of stepped out in a narrow opening and a buddy and i were ten yards apart and just both pulled up and fired both hit it will happen who got to keep we spoke we split the meat brought it back and we talked about at all sorts of stuff we are going to do in this
was lying around for a while and i did the european mouth and it was sit sit in my house and who tagged kept set i dragged it i feel like you ever tags it but we're just going to be as italy is that you never he never asked for it never asked where it back in kind of think got out a hunting blocked as now but i still nobody ever whoever it took a hit right you'll don't know they're taking that's their fill in their tag for the team the argument that you took the question to a game warden game warden would wanted to go to who tag if you did it curvy shoulder mount with the dears looking curvy and any split it did not the spines but the thing than you have a wall which is tricky yeah he lived sir yet delivered us in a castle
yeah or they have the planetarium or something that hurt or they have the parapet set you were telling me so you kind of walked us through the thing of how you became a competitive shooter and how like for the one asking our question i'm going to get into how this all cabins how how a fellow gets into this but you are telling me that the used to shoot pistols competitively right so that's why did ohio state with shoot pistol and you're saying that some guys set the trigger so light that if you pointed toward the sky and shake it it goes off yeah so that in the event that they actually just removed the olympics that shooting this guy or that reason for that reason view view is where you just run around there some of those guys are running like fifty to seventy gram triggers on those things it's called it's called free pistol fifty gray and so it sounds super dangerous but the reality is that you're in control
so you ve got it right you got your pistol pointed downrange and you its most of em are some sort of falling block you know so you're one explain it folks so it's it's kind of like the ruger number ones if you've ever seen those you've got a little switch on the bottom where you just flick it open it drops a block down you put the bullet in your clothes it back up the block comes up and locks it in so it's kind of like a block mechanism behind the chamber and that's almost have a more comfortable in block the single shots at twenty to put around orkut and then your aim down your lane and there's usually in us as they have been breaks or something you ve got six or eight shooters and it may be or that are wide and then you got your targets outdoor issued its fifty meters away meters down so if you talk like damn hard with a pistol yeah and it's about a two just under two inch bull's eye at fifty meters so it's i mean it's smaller than a coffee cup lid so there it was more so you come up and your accidently your touch this thing off that zero in its ten
and i d out is how scored so you dropped ten points on one shot and you got a cat i mean you count it so that's ten points down your idea no it's what international international pistols thousands olympic they shoot at all over the world cups and did you ever shoot their competition which won three the more tommo the pre was one of my events in college that shock so raising a pistol and shoot in southern two inches in diameter fifty yards so we shot a lot of indoor you're fifty foot indoor targets about the size of a dime for your tendering how many shots in a row can you put in there the best i've ever done is like eleven i think out of sixty in a row for a full in the twenty somewhere the key with three best all is not screwing up and shootin seventh and eighth you shoot a bunch budget ten that you can hold the nine ring that's like the world's best shooters are pretty much hold nine ring with the tens and your nine rings at fifty meters about four inches probably so it's about you
in a group and now they ve changed some of that they went away from if you touch the ring it scores here too now did you a lot of it on a decimal so if you shoot a centre centre it's ten point nine and if you shoot just in the edge of it it's a ten point zero and if you just outside nine point nine so then go on you know guys it can shoot super deep and then throw an eight you're going to score better than now cause it's oldest decimal so zach how close can you keep them to the middle so it's a little bit more fair i guess that way why did the olympics get does this kind of thing lol a lot of it is it's not some of them are super fun to watch i mean this is like a marathon of shootings or you're shooting at fifty meters is sixty shots in two hours so it's super long and a lot of it has to do with they kind of are going from sports at art the women together shooting so you gotta some of the rifle events theirs more cross over your wherein jackets and your shootin anymore controlled environment and like some i'll shoot the guy's whereas free pistol more of asia there's a lot more physical
bobby don't get any real support to not wearing jackets her parents are needed make your plan to generate super their land i fly right yes canvas like a super thick canvas you get locked in there and you literally or can't even move so its super state so they're kind of going away from sports that can't be both genders i guess and it's not soup citing the watch i guess so one of the other shootin spores that are in the olympics shotgun that's a big one in the shotgun because you know you go to the middle easter some of those countries and shotguns a huge huge deal to big money sport and a lot of places they do air pistol bill also air pistol air rifle and then smaller rifle and they still do rapid fire pistol which is a twenty two event where you've got five big bull's eyes which is what i shot when i went to the army they're just big giant black bulls eyes at twenty five meters and you're ten rings pretty big it's like three three and a half inches and that's a more dynamic so you start with your gun at a forty five down they ve got lights
turning targets most of that upper class ones are lights and the light goes off you gotta come up in one two three four five should you shots and they do at eight hence for you you due to serious eight second two series of six second two series of four seconds i've lost them before and if not boring now at least to me pretty cool and they changed it for the final two where rather being scoring if you're a nine point five you get a hit nine point five or better get ahead if you're nine point four or lowered its amiss so you come you just one two three and then it is all this guy got four hits so people can look at that it really see that oh a non celiac died it's they all know what that means what's the nine point nine or ten point two i really enjoy watching the biafal on their that's my favorite england has that's kind of the only ones i think people know is it the olympics right the otherwise it's like dirty arthur rested on yeah yeah now when there is little that they also letter yanks yet somebody's buyer on the only winter shooting sport i believe so i don't think they have any strict shooting sports i think it's just the ski in skins you work
these are the best shooters america's decent at like shot gun like we are roadie came rolling yoga there's a haircut peas one gold medals it just about every olympics it he's went to so we ve got some really really solid shock almost metal olympians or shooters right up a lot of em well besides you swim aspect yeah the so they gotta plugins good for us at data big ones are china's you re pretty good south korea some of those the asian countries put a lot of effort into it russia has a really long standing tradition of shootin super well and i gotta and the rapid fire there seemed dog germans that should really really well wrapped fire free pistol it's kind of a mixed there's like a kind of the bigger countries while the european countries really begin to show the people that is generally kick ass at the olympics general the arrest russia take asset shooting pretty metallic weird outliers not really shot guns gonna one could you get like you know
our job as a shock and sheer that comes out like doing really well you'll somewhere so zero is there a wing shooting culture in the arab world like another the falcon i don't you know i haven't really pay too much attention to it but i know when i was on the army team they had a shotgun team and those guys would go over and shoot and i guess some of the places i go are just super posh you know marble trap houses all sorts of crazy that has already been done we are talking about how do you know whether or not this is like the sporting but side but one of the things that they that big in the shotgun kind of almost like the underground as they do pigeon shoots and so what they do is they have a bomb so the spring in it and then they have a ring it like you don't say forty fifty yards across and smaller not actually in its gallagher forage fence and so i got this ring around it so you sit back at certain distances and they basically push the button and it springs the pigeon they can fly and then you go to shoot the pigeon if it falls inside the rain you get the point and if at all
outside of the ring and don't that's not an olympic game down enough just i don't see that popular in america i will have admit to having done that before and it's big money they still do tower shoots alone all over the place someone who climbs up in a tower and starts rose as adults are done over the road i did it in the dominican republic and there was five boxes you say pole and going street pigeon the pigeon comes flying out of the one of the firebox and launches them out it launches a mammoth springs mount because they they they're captive so they they you know the wings and they put them in the box on pin em through and the springs mountain shoot them if they fall but for the good one fancy get a point was diameter of the of the fence while he died not only were done at one time and i decided i will do that again you know you know how people ever done it but it's big money i mean people
then the tower to spend money on different shooters and you can buy shooters and calcutta stuff and it's i mean people are flying a lear jets to shoot these things so do the youngest that we talk about turkey shoots like when i was a kid i grew up by a gun club a private gun twenty gun club and if i'm not mistaken man actually i need to i need to call if the folks back home and ask if i'm not mistaken they when i was a little little kid they would dig a ditch and put turkeys in the ditch live turkey which has their head sticking out yes ok and if you hit the turkey you got if you bring it home and cook for thanksgiving oh mo long ways out it was i can't remember it was like i feel like it was like you had to use a twenty two is your way the hell out did you see their head behind a burma and if you could hit the turkey does here too
you feel it does the origination of the term tat i showed you ass i was i don't think i'm i dont think i'm making this upper limit of blocks here earlier this year olds are like the notary turkish because at a time when i was a kid turkish soon was you shot a target and you get a frozen turkey if you want i think i doubt he see world out there like when we get a gas rigidity versus rap competition i did some work from a body round ebay add a turkey slaughter facility and if i was if you put me in a turkey if you made me a turkey and i had in you said kate yard thanksgivings quickly approaching you can go to bill mar the turkey slaughter facilitated working in the old die there or you can go to when they gun club and die there i would go to an egg and up to date can be cured i find it more and i like the comedian guy he doesn't know no that's a i l hiven
may i say that i did not hear the other dozing off reality resize slaughter like these guys like you that these guys slaughter i think what they wonder gear up i think are slaughtered twenty thousand turkey's a day or something like that or some insane number and it's like dude it's a lot of turkey turkey's runner turkeys would get out of the trucks and get away and once they hit the ground cause there all in a controlled environment so we had all we had all the materials like raids mill right and we will have on materials on the parking lot and you'd come in in the morning and you'd find turkeys hiding out in the parking lot in our material like they'd get out of the truck and once they got the truck they couldn't macedon and so the turkeys go try to find a place to hide in gaza work with a catch those turkeys
bring them home and and i remember this guy rick he made a little cage at home and would take the turkeys he call out the parking lot and put them in the cage and fat them up in the case to make smoke turkeys out of the sound he wanted the good old days if it's peace if it's more pc if it's more than a it's not even political correctness whatever it is if it's regarded as more ethical to have hit a target give a frozen turkey i just challenge that i'm not have no bearing on the matter but i did my where my coming up had change right it was a turkish you really iran turkey shoot and all the ones i d ever muzzle order based so is all black powder of insight what i want i remember when an muffruff frozen turkey was quite the accomplishment they took a picture with griffin grin john deering on a pivot back into wayne shooting wanna deering the clinton administration
and they very early on a first identified bin laden as a threat they he was out hunting birds in the desert at a falconry camp and they debated hitting in there like way back like ninety two or something like that they debated hitting him there but there was some other high profile saudis who are also hunting out of that same camp and they decided against it so they almost got him on a good way to go that that was my pivot because large of a wrap it up so since they you know there's that bird hunting culture through falconry there's russia gunning culture there and you were a competitive jacques ensure a village activate away well i thought so what you do in high school i your shot pistol pistol and sword
yup enough for some reason i thought you'd you weren't you dont like them competitive wing shooting knowing shooting whisky i've i shouted a little bit played with it i had my roommate shot competitively but yeah i was always pistol all the way through how did you how did you first like start how'd you get into that so i kind of started through a local club i was at high school in billings we had it on the competitive side and we shot small bore rifle twenty rifle and then an air rifle and so i shot africa years and then it was ok but there's it it's a lot of kind of building up a system of shooting i mean you're trying to get your pc and now lockdown that's most of what rifle shooting uses is the position so you trying to get super stable say your rifle literally doesn't move and it takes a while to come develop that frito writes a year shootin three position you shouldn offhand kneeling and prone and prognoses pretty easy you ever think of the slain in peep site so that
pretty easy and get in your kneeling and often positions takes all the more time so i was decent but not really great in the restaurant shooting pistol as color an add on to that end with a lot better pistol enjoyed it more there's you know how to put on all the jackets and drag your suitcase around with all your gear so i'm a little bit less ushered in that regard i had more fun with it how good can a person give the twenty rival pretty good what kind of hundred yard group can issue the with a twenty two under an inch like with a sling inner shouldn't to stop a sling prone shouldn't offhand style they don't really shoot hundred dollar matches are fifty yards so but most guys that are good can hold pretty much hold half inch group shootin higher is all away through three position yet a bell drop some points but prone it's to be competitive in the prom level issued a six sixty two sixty at fifty yards in that's when calls you shoot near you know it's not a half an inch bulls either you shoot net
so you have your at than that even the national level the top two or three guys we clean and on sixty two sixty shootin besides have you wanna squirrels much little better cod yeah i was i was stationed in georgia so georgian alabama sporadic pretty much by no less so the guys with an old mill you go on oh really so they could hunt squirrels and just you offhand and hit squirrels out of the trees in the head yeah those guys are some of the guys are nuts how well how will they shoot yeah i i i should have twenty two rifle decent i'm not you know some of those guys are pretty good but yeah you just mess around and pick my glock nine to go squirrel hunting just get gte up on that and you could get that good with that he act hits girls with it okay so funny story a buddy of mine whose whose back in the service now is actually one of the special forces groups now that i was in them the ship unit with we were teaching classes costs when you're in the army march bishop unit it's kind of a dual you have to be an instructor and a competitive shooters
you you do your training and you can beat but you also run instructor instructing side of it and the unit started to fifty six and the idea was hey we need to figure out tat people she well so what's what better way to do that then have people compete and then they learn the best way of doing everything in then they convert that to the military and then teach all the jos so that was kind of that the mission statement of the union its stayed pretty much the same all the way through and that was the unit you were in yeah yep the army marksmanship unit and it's ns they're still you know you're titled the shooter instructor so your training but then you're also going to teaching which i found it to be a problem or rewarding side of it just cause you worked with guys it this could literally say their life and it happened to be effective so we had a class of irritation there is about twenty guys and it was a close quarters marksmanship seek you m stuff so you're shootin rifle oh carbines pistols out of fifty yards it's kind of them i'm gonna need action shooting type stuff so we're this class in a lot of guys qualify we had a six inch dot at fifteen yards and that was
the standard that we try to get them to by the end of the class so everybody was kind of shooting and it was lunchtime and whenever his lunch we had ammo laying around and gun so we always just kind of kept shooting so my buddy was a they're shooting and we look up on the berm and it's kind of about eighty yards this berm and then maybe thirty or forty up to the top and there's this fox squirrel run along this sperm and so we see this thing like that's ok hate there's a scarlet there so of course you know it's open season on squirrels and like like right so and this girl kind of comes down the berm a little bit and buddy walks forward may fifteen twenty yards who's not right next to a classroom setting into this cupboard area and the squirrels maybe seventy eighty yards away and it's sitting in this tree and so he pulls out his glock you know thirty it's like alongside glock nine millimeter and everybody's looking at him like yeah there's no way you know we'd try to hit this six inch dot so he shoots i think he was
his first shot at it second shot he smokes this thing and it's like hanging from the tree so he shoots again missed his third shot shoots again hits again as for time and it falls he runs up and grabs a squirrel so it was really funny watching not expression alleys guises face like this guy to shut up of a tree like eighty away with a nine millimeter clock so that's all that's gonna work it was some of that stuff those guys it you should all the time it is it's crazy accurate some even gets better with a pistol you know we carry pistols forbear protections times now we'll get around a shooting the pistols it's embarrassing so are we took one class from a really well known instructor but a hand class we could all hit gong at a hundred yards with forty five nineteen eleven the up and its its form
the foreman and just and the mental thing there's like a mental thing like i can't hit stuff with a pistol like then you wash somebody pull up and shoot a man's ice targeted two hundred yards like ding ding ding ding ding ding neil inculcates voodoo as i know it's not you does have you gotta get your mind right there's like a certain way of thinking about pistols and triggering an cider and then what form like how to lock it down no single shooting displeasure like that at the shooting one thousand yards with a rifle seems intimidating until you lay down and have somebody tell you how to do it yep it's true not you have a spotter to you know to walk you through it and you've got control i think that's the one thing about pistols it's there's nothing there's no support system where a rifle you got a stock and you got nathan kind of make it stop moving keep it from like twitching pistol any little thing it's all about the mechanics of how you're shooting it and it goes back to just repetitions but that was kind of our thing in training it's the most boring thing in the world but trying to get your whole old super super tight so we would literally hold against a wall for half hour forty today and you were gone
this way because you naturally sway when you stand eliminate all out so that you're not smoothing your site back both on the target we i hold against the wall you just had your arm up for you but what does that mean like you're push so nope you just take a pistol and you hold it about a foot from the wall and you've got a dot and you just try and hold it on that diet is basically work through your i didn't try and get all the moving out and just work on keeping that as still as possible and you kind of build up all your little stabilizer muscles but it's it's crazy how tight you can hold with a pistol once you've if you've trained that for one because you're shooting at something so small you can't be if you're moving around a lot you know your wobble area you try to get that as small as possible and then you just like any other pistol just trying to get inside that little wobble but the small you get it the more consistent you'll be in the more here your score go up i must see your site or do you like it we have all your mechanics down matters there is because you think of
you know if you're off by a millimeter on your side a limit that's thrown you off by inches at even fifty feet so no at its sights front sites i to limit the targets blurry we shoe you just its literally to lock in those sites in and we had a national coach names target loser he was a russian shot running target over in russia and then came over with a pistol coach so he had an accent that is like you know and i don't know if i can do a good russian accent or not after he's like ukrainian russia we're pretty for you what are you going to do you not like it's meant that we have is if you don't think about it like this is it's your friends you're not like this you just watching this child walk around the room he's like that you have to grab the child and slammed on the table like hold him there is that's all work the sites sounds russian it's know sir let's see it's like you know they're not just passive it's like you need to grab them i was like ok okay i got it sites are important can you is there anyone that makes them
money shooting competitively is already like mitten paid well if you're good that's the key and i know some of the guys that i shall within the unit like three guns pretty allotted i get out and they go work fer you know some of the guys i wonder now pop for sig for instance go get an industry job like that yeah you make good money or vincent and that shoot shotgun a lot hancock he's a multi time gold medalist so he's out of the army now and does a lot of training seminars so he'll go and has his own kind of training system and does and so you can make money on that side of it but generally speaking unless you're really really good or you get sponsorships there's not i mean you're not going out and winning hundred thousand i feel like three gun is really the the main one where guys could make a magazine sponsored by right several companies it basely pays to pay out you don't really mad explained regan for people saw three is it an action sport where you shoot rifle pistol shot gun so it's a running
anybody that shot like i d p a u s any of the action pistol stuff you're and those guns and there's different classes so you can run some of them are race guns at ports and a dot on them don't even move and then you've got limited which is more you know you have to shoot iron sights and you're limited on samir magazine stuff and then production is just like a stock glock you can change a couple of things but not a lot so there's different classes and then it's just run a course and you'll have a our fifteen target area rifle and you shouldn't targets that are either paper steel so you have like knocked out fall down plate see a lot of steel and it's either two hits on stealer one he don't steal knock em over and then you ve got paper targeted the rings like a ring be ring you know syrian types of so you're a course and you have it all in all three guns at once not not usually some of em so there's a match
i haven't shouted a lot of reagan but they had had a match that mgm it's like the metal target company they sponsored out in idaho like eastern southeastern idaho called the iron man it's other stages were i mean you'd run a stage it'd be like four or five minutes long and you'd have to drag dummies and like have weights and you'd shoot me like sixty shots shot gun and you start your like loan the shotgun got you like for magazines on your pistol and it was just super long stages and your and threw in space start here and he got to shoot this big targets and you could mr then you know you're trying to keep track of everything and like all are you didn't see that target and so that's those kind of fun and then a lot of more controlled were sure to us tight stage and you just gonna run through and play the game it's all about speed and accuracy so how fast can you move the guys that arise
really good at it can break down a stage and find the least amount of movement and it's they don't tell you how to shoot anything so you can shoot pretty much any order as long as you're not you know shooting back is like a one eighty plane that you can't break if people just work through it it's it's pretty cool there's work to it hitting all the targets yup and you're just trying to you know go through and hit everything as fast as you can and at least amount of movement and then it's all time time vs hits a lot of times shooting house or like the danger question about where the guns are how about a barrel shock dragon and really eurozone members ran up up up or air fifteen on the table so you some of em pack i'm so you shoot it and you got a sling right that's right go with iron man like you got a sling stuff and carry it sometimes but a lot of em like you said you choose your pistol drop in a box gabby rifle she d rifle drop in a box gregor shock and finish it out clear it so that
to keep it safe or the milk or the milk dude the military guys dominate this or are there people who never been in the military that are good at both it comes out of training you know obviously in the unit if you've got gunsmiths you know that think quilting about the aim use we had a fully functional gun shop with fulltime guys that are working on machining i mean full on cnc machines i could pretty much design build anything you want them to full reloading room guys at all they do is reload and test so in terms of figures market you guys like that which is obviously an advantage but a lot of it just time on the range and boards it's time to audition man right through run through your stages like everything has to be muscle memory how do i cut off a half a second on the shotgun reload how do i scoff a half a second on this movement half a second here because that adds up and that's the difference between first and tenth i tried this some years ago and it was loading they got me also running a shot guns horrible and i was horrible everywhere drop around like a guy got up and then if you don't get em all in there you're going to miss one like you just and then keep going
have a military is good we we shot some of that styled stuff so this kind of a competitive and when we were in we stood up a teams of the last year those in the unit actually went over his we call the i t g instructor training group and usually what we did is we had the pistol shooters got to teach the close range stuff you know the service pistol international pistol and then the rifle shooters that were on the rifle teams they taught kind of the long range when calling and position stuff and it worked okay and what we did while some guy stood it up and then i actually joined the team after they had kind of started working on it was to develop a curriculum that said hey we've got guys like like myself and other guy that shot through college and we had you know six eight ten years of shooting experience and then we had guys that came over from like the third ranger battalions at fort benning so those guys would come over so you've got guys that have been deployed six eight ten times it's been a long time you know years in combat and then you take those guys who sara what's effective in combat what's effective if you're if you're in houses if you're knocking on doors of shooting long range would have situations you see how do you make this
but then we took our shooting ability said why not a poetry or not a run a gun but how do you kind meld the two together that you're running a gun to combat effective and that was really really cool and then developing programmes through that so we trained a lot of kind of three gun but it's like how do you get your kid efficient how do you get to stuff quickly had where you put your magazines how do you set up your rifle so that you're not in everything's quick and efficient so efficiently of movement is an important matter what what your shoot if it's combat or if it's you know training or i think i told you this over dinner but i one time went down i was the guest a special forces group in fort bragg and i went down to their compound and also i ask because i went out to watch him train their training anthem seemed exult specific there were spent the day training on how to transition from your rifle to your pistol
right basically their training how to drop that and pull your pistol out so in shoe to target weather and it's a different aim is to see them all but you gotta think about the situation that you look in attica you passed into a building and all centres guys popping out with guns and you pull the trigger and you hear the loudest sound in the world click right and then what now it's like well you can try and clear your rifle and get around in it or you know a misfire yes i know it's all you have some sort of malfunction we train and it's kind of a bit of transition in the military away from we'll get your rifle up pistols are just there so you can look good i guess towards acknowledge it's like can be an effective tool so that's where you see those transitions is like and i know a guy that i did some work with the had a situation that has happened and is the same things i click he tried to clear it click and also
i turned around with a gun it's like what do you do now it's like well i've got a secondary weapon cause it's always primary secondary that's how they train the military he's like well here comes the pistol and basically saved his life so that's why if you shoot it it doesn't go and you've got a threat in front of you that you have to get to your secondary as quickly as possible and if it takes you three seconds to do that which isn't a lot of time but hold different than second half that's why that's such an important thing and you know you start from the ground up that's where every little you train every aspect you start with just a gun low bring a gun up and shoot and then you bring a gun up and shoot left and right you know transition targets and then you bring up shoot close near and then you do a reload you just gonna work your way through every aspect and then that gives those guys ready to trade and you can do it without even shooting you know you can transition you can do all that stuff practice movements and it's it's crazy how quick you can shoot transitions and how fast you can move between gear and how fast you do a reload where do you put your your kitten
with all the like you said it's like we're spent a whole day doing this it's like well the level details fascinating i recently heard an interview with an f b i agent and he was saying the f b i academy they teach you how to unbuckle your seatbelt that they'd like you to take your left hand and put it between your body and the belt slide down to the buckle reach a finger round and unclip the bottle and move it so that it diminishes the chances that if you need to get out of your car quickly come entangled in you see seat belt and to think about that someone's looking at like that second that levels of specificity at using words you learn you never on buckle your belt another way it is because they you do their parliamentary benin grisly country though like if you're thinking about having bears brain
pistol then known ever talks about a year and frankly you have to like you should have that transition down and where it how you get your pistol how each embarrassed but a practice that you'd think i know you is it so that we talk about doing thing renown and when you're out grisly country now and then so much just clapped their hands with a stopwatch and be like how long does it take much like dig through their pack rapidly spread around thirty two satellites where'd you were also say a quick word i put that stuff you know them in this is a democratic danger at me now i don't want to by a bear or shot by a dude you know your chances if you spend a lot time in the wilderness you know your chances are higher beating by a bear and a lot of cases and getting shot montana mean just reality you know what like what makes makes a good shooter is is it is it is and we can't divide amount but what makes a accurate or a great
nor is it is it psychological physical deadly psychological more so logical we say shootings ten percent physical men recent metal what does the mental saw this is work is crazy right depends on what you're doing so if it's a dynamic thing than its about training muscle memory training movements so it's like building up you're you're kind of processes your thoughtless processes on the more intentional side of it so it's that i shot is very slow methodical it's all process based so what you're trying to do you're trying to get a mental process that is repeatable and then you are a plan and then you stick to that matter today when the whole time so you work on the physical you know the holding the gun the triggering and all that but then the rest of it becomes metal so we would read a lot of golf books tennis books things like that because it's the same idea it's like get your golf sweep down you know anybody you the top fifty guys the pga can also have golf clubs like what's the difference as well where they put themselves mainly the decisions they make you know making good shots follow
their process exactly the same way every time and that's where it's you know it's like like a lot of things i guess it's process oriented versus outcome oriented so you're trying to keep herself from thinking about what the implications of if i do that took no it is a matter of skills do my process whatever happens happens i've train the process now stick to it i gotta do not obsessing over the outcome you care you think outcome you're done that's what i think like that now that over the years i've become i hesitate to use the word unlike us a very good over the years i've become good like good as a rifle guy not like i don't take insane shots but i dont have a lot of i don't make a lot of mistakes cause you just i do this this this this this and it just happens but archery but the the minute the minute something's approaching all i'm thinking about i'm i'm in what you say out
yeah all i'm thinkin about its outcome may i don't want to miss it i don't want a wound it it's like it's all in thinking about what my rifle it's not like i sure hope by i should robot or wounded i might all the time every forty i'm very focused with like i'm a very like i that i'm gonna do what i do and i know that i will i will be successful like i just know that that will happen so i've developed that confidence with archery i can't overcome it's a major problem with archery i can't overcome jumping to the unknown the outcome if only you put it that way because it's a bit but it rises yet it's in your head man not in your head i've got a mental image this is from like five years ago still like crisp as day in his it's me letting an arrow go in a bowl of about thirty five yards away and watching era go to do do forges over his back and like
i shoot a bed of our tree a little bit you know for while and so i can aggregate both pretty decent and thirty five yards is not a long shot wide open nothing between us you know grass stand there and looking and then you have this mental playback and i'm thinking cause i was kind of in some low grass i was trying to stay real real low and then i remember now like okay so you're you're my goal onto this whole do you know this whole memory about a millisecond and millisecond like you have all these pictures even kind of play back and i'm thinking you know when it looks that pen the triangle that i was looking at that pin through it was not us golf was might have said yeah i know i gave that and i was low and i looked right over the top my peeps light through the little screen lol we're going to string split as to accommodate and i came through and i was like this is perfect and i'm like in the aerogels forest with three forwards is right over his back
dead not straight up right at the back of the leg writer was only the hindsight is that unlike i totally looked over my peep site and it's like something out of we have ever done that said man you get in that situation and it's like the blood starts pumping in a big ball and you're like obviously going to a back tension release because i was getting jumpy and once you go to the back centuries have you not the form is right and you're not pulling right ways not going off the prize you can talk about this may have acceded trend it fixes a lot it really is these are three people than talk about for a lawyer had this ugly my brother like switched its it really like what i would when i was practicing with a trigger you know one out of six shots i get tired i be jumping the trigger when you're practice in what i would do the teachings of john deadly like i would put i'm folks on my back elbow feed
that deltoid muscle pull in the right way right focusing on that muzzle focusing on my follow through any almost you stop thinking about your front cite your thinking about it am i following through proper process is my process gone we used to i used to put up and i still do this put a speaker behind me directly by me where i want to pull to turn music on public speaker photophone puts even an elder you suck you suck and put music on and pulled the music right in and have my elbow go towards the music and focus on we know how my elbow as is wobbling towards that sound and you totally forget what's going on that front half your body and i'm more accurate like that than any other way with the back digit yeah i'm going to i haven't but i'm going to see that's the thing it was kenyon was like he mark kenyon was talking about he's going to finish up the season and then switch so he's got plenty of time
to switch into i've thought about that i've thought about having a thumb release which is generally the same at setup but your you have thumb trigger instead it acts as a joke to you he flipped that and the china the same motion but you have control rights of alex coming to you not the weight but are we i know guys like and say shane dorian and a bunch of guys about bowen with recently who took the leap and said i'm just going to home with this thing and next thing i know they're five shots five dead animals at all different ranges all different times so adapt to it as being the most sound way to have a process in the woods i've been thinking about it forces you do it right now forces do it right i just hate like new learn a new start man germany after so many years of doing something subway gray eyes would rather adjusts easy not easier is used want to double down on what you know rather than really changing like if someone said like there's a new rifle out and you put a thing in your mouth right and you just bite down to make it go off
which pride not a bad idea maybe look ass a boy i would be hesitant i was very hesitant when i met with john i'm like it's actually a good idea to use somebody right that that is like pinched between your ids released her i know it i know a guy who got in accident last year man some like trash compactor thing any got likes wished in it messed up is back on ladders and no no in the job dude but he's really he's really on record that israel is really serious really serious hunter imagine someone you know someone you know and buddy hunted last year with a with a bow with a mouth release because he couldn't draw widget author no no apps tab that he was biting in and drawn his bow a yeah i grew up with a guy like that he'd lost his arm in an accident then shot by holding the mouthpiece yep i think he might have killed a bull doing that this year but i don't remember exact
i think he did diddy are you talking about joshua yeah why why you going to be secretive about it's just just because i couldn't couldn't breathe mind right away any you like how much named rapid do you want to do a mediator meat eater podcast normally the right amount not be confusing to people that's my that's my barometer like you feeling or high and mighty in your fancy sweater today due to them are we going to talk about it are we going to talk about well let's talk about it listen man does either either my wife happier i make you guys happy guess i'm more interested megan happy us dad s man's got it you ve gotta make us my right to make my life the commented on how handsome i looked in the sweater she bobby yet she by either side that wasn't she knew she bought it for you simply where's that it gave us our line sweaters
you can have ratified it will bring us closer my sweater pivoting away from us letter i was quick psychological what can you hunt this this get you build a hand to this highlights does what you learn from competitive shooting we're just replicating controlled atmosphere right is hunting just totally different early yet yes and no there's crossover the trade it's a it goes back to the process you gotta put yourself like you said and you miserable and it's like how did i do that it's like well you get amped up and you don't follow through the process that it's kind of the same thing it even comes it's the same thing guys that go over and they say wow you guys are good shooters but you gotta combat it's going to be totally different it's the glue we used to there you are you will perform at your lowest level of training so your worst day that's how you can expect to shoot now you might do better
but good point you're always going to revert back to your lowest level of training everybody wants to show per peak perform you can arise the occasions i get doesn't have very often you you'll revert back to your lowest level training so that day when you feel like crap and you're pulling crappy shots and that's how you're going to shoot when you get a big bullet from you you might shoot better but that's what you could count on you know your lowest training so little does your shittiest day yeah the range work on eliminating those that's that's the whole point you know like talkin back tension releases is like well maybe it doesn't give you as much control but if it's more consistent like it eliminates those like jerked shots go off and neverland it's like well and that eliminates that shot that that might be the shot you pull in a bowl and all of a sudden you shoot him back in the pond the high liver or something you know the game you play with yourself ray is your you go you're out hunting and you throw the target and you make a nice shot hundreds to be like kay
as andrea i'm also just because you want to end on that you want to end on that feeling of that you gotta dial that if you shoot like a really bad one the longest one mortgages i got out again that's it womack goes back in a few years time the longboat you know her with traditional for a long time and think that thing that's really we're gonna get your mind right as there's no pender rely on there is no like oh i'll just pull back with pay the right place and squeeze the trigger it's like no it's all process i mean you don't have anything to rely on you like well i've been doing this for a long time and i shoot a lot someone's gonna come back followed through touch in that area go we're supposed to and try and get your five yards away that helps but it's kind of that same thing i think i want a does transfer a lot for the mental aspect but i think a lot of us just a process with my process i get in there you're thinking about the right thing and think about the first thing know a lot of guys like how i don't know how to to break this down it's like walls if you get to step one what step one so say a ball comes in it's like step one is saved like remind my
if you know i'm going to squeeze through the shot or eminent back tension you know whatever works for you site make sure i'm picking the right pin or focus on the pin you know let the elk be a little bit blurry or whatever it is it's your first step in that process and then say i am going to do that first thing i've got five steps or three steps and i'm gonna do the first one and if you do that it's like your your process then takes over it's when you get there i dunno i'm just gonna pick a random step and roll with it well then your brain freaks out this that's step one and then the rest of them will just go like you got it you got to get yourself into that start your process and then it just is automatic or most of the time you just said two things that resonate with me i don't want to a backup on one because i think it's such a it's really interesting point i hadn't thought of is practicing to eliminate your worst which is like when you shoot if you eat i fear if you i'll shoot in yard with your bow and yeah one six arrows just like what the hell right how did i
well yeah and you write it off as like some thing but it's like consistently if you throw a bad area if you could find a way to like think about that rather than try and of course trying to replicate your good shots to make more of them but to isolate like the freaks well it's because i have enough freaks where if you just is rolling the dice leave every time but if you're into teresa and every time a deer comes by and you got one six arrows is just crazy you can never figure out why one in six arrows is great has he's going to be the back of your mind you're like well is this going to be the one the bad one you don't like to train stuff you're not good at either it's like i like to make this is what i'm good at i'm gonna go do that so i feel good about it but it's like the work involved is fighting areas where you're deficient or weak thing or what causes that one sick shot well it's this will then train that get better at that that it brings your whole system though it's not as much fun but you know like blank bale shooting your blind
i think a lot of guys will stand there just work on form me do the lot especially traditional you just get a big blank bale and close your eyes and what's it feel like alright that's the system and then that's what you do but it's not fun it's not near as much fun as watching arrows flying the target i've i've tried i talked about this before but my dad's somehow got his hands on the stickers we were kids that set on steak pick a spot and you put him on the inside of the limb you'll be bow but then you saw reliant on this idea you remember to read that damn bigger but oh i don't i do this rival awning at all from our bow hunting i spent a long time china do like what wonder a moment when you sense a moment's gonna happen to start going in this thing like said to remind yourself betsy process it's a mantra yeah but but in you can even be in a situation where you see something common an inner remember you like
congratulate yourself for remembering be like the process process and just pick some part so you're aware that there is a process but then all of a sudden like you you can't tell continents hutton seek it here this year i had all sound worlds i call this i called you a stag start the calm and i'm like why he's coming and i'm like k process process process process process of trying to remember all the things i'm going to do and then he comes to this area where its lot of obstructions so pass through this whole thicket and i'm like he's gonna come always do i'll never get a shot not any stops and the weirdest little gap and instead of this all things i've been telling myself behind do this whole walk through the middle east wow it's like right until the second and then even though i remembered like i was happy to remember process but then you get this gap and you like
screw the process yeah i think it's a good i got to shoot this arrow yeah it's a good hunter who could who who would be the i'm not gonna have an opportunity there is an opportunity to stick to my plan and if it doesn't work he steps away than than to ban and it's not like i'm now going to throw the whole thing out the window and shoot shoot over it's back which which is which that i do that's like kyle hutton for me i've been doing a lot of kohat in the winter matt calkins rather than it's like i forget i mean you forget shoots like one hundred yards stand that mean it's like they stop and you know they're about to rush like boom you miss them like i'm shooting a sitting shot with back support and i missed a coyote stray aliens target at a hundred yards new ill humble anybody but it's like saying it's like i got this plan he's going to come over here and pop out and all of a sudden it's like there is about ready to leave and you're like crap that shot takes off look why don't i do that i could take it half a second actually squeeze lloyd upkeep instead
and and up here but i look i got a few you think the biggest mistake what was the biggest mistake that honours once you mean tat you can do it adrienne and or artery and or rifle russian the shot i'd say you knock i do it still that's that's the main thing try to try to push that shot you know you you break your plan like you said i gotta do i got to shoot it now i gotta i gotta do this i gotta do that if you just take that it seems like ever your mind but if you actually watch a video of yourself shooting you like i felt like i took an extra five seconds and it was quarters of a second that little bit of time to just ok this is what i'm doing and then just do it seemed like the deliberate you know as i try and tell myself that be deliberate be deliberate be deliberate because i know the system another process i've shot millions of rounds said things like be deliberate make a deliberate shot it helps me to repeat things like that it just helps me bring my
heart rate and my breathing down a little bit to have that mantra going i always tell myself slow is smooth and smooth is fast yep and i just kind of repeat that and try to not be like ooh pow you know we used to say that often it's fast enough yeah can't miss faster i'd do that also i have a five for archery i have a five step process right so it's feet draw anchor peep pull right that's why i do it in the line my feet up well all the time and that's good yeah like what you see a bot common and you're like remember feet draw so yeah draw straight back and i didn't come up with this john daly did but you're straight back you find your anchor then put your nose down find your peep pull and you're not like you never like shoot its poles or some of the five again feet your feet properly you bring your bell up you draw you find your anger and the draw anchor anchor peep and then pull and if you could just remember dude that man here's how i did just their here's how i generally do it feet
draw trial as yeah but i feel like it's if if the process marries up with your ability to act in the moment like i've read i read a little bit on the flow state and thought i was real smart and then thought i would flow state my way to kill animals didn't really work was flow state me is this like a a state of positivity in action and control like focusing on like your mental state and being positive if i'm meditate never meditated the idea that i could control mentally like this process and make sure nothing could penetrated like one two three four five bam just have now successfully doesn't work doesn't work doesn't work for you but that's when the when you get to the back tension then you start to like control you'd make sure that hey man i can i can jump this but i have to be porn the right way doesn't matter i can try to jump it but the back tension is is controlling me my brother talks about lust and greed
the preacher is compelling no issue how he talks about last the great and hunting but because he's said he could shoot targets all day long but he doesn't last farm and when you put like a big game animal in front of him like bill he he says it's it disappoint them that his take the loss in degree riot latest telling wants it you'd like i want it so bad that it blocks my ability to have it yeah yeah upset if you could just tell yourself there'll be another shot there'll be another animal there'll be like if you just treat it like that like it's gotta be perfect or i'm not going to do it if you could somehow
do that life will be allowed made when i see some commented words after that who gives a shit just bought the universe who really was this stupid stupid that's probably going to taste i don't care if i get a taste hair i'll take a shot but i don't care i always think about that pistol course that we took paid a bunch of money and did this xlr peaceful course but in the day five out of five of us can hit a target with pistol at one hundred yards and i will guarantee you within a year there wasn't one out of five of us that could hit a target with him if the art read because aided will you walk in the process on your leg well got that others put this on sheriff over here perishable skill that thing about them realise i prepared all day and area but saw so my longbow same thing
let me go to process progress process muzzle memory you don't shoot that thing for a week it's like i'm a danger to myself that's the weird thing in the archery space where everybody's gotta have a new bow every year right you gotta have the newest greatest bow you have to i mean if you're going to be any any kind of good like you're switching bows every year i appreciate that nothing by two real blow for luck lessons but there's i'm to me on your five combined yeah i mean but that aims to be a better way to go a bell you know and you know the mechanics of it you understand what it's gonna do why switch the logic of pretty seriously to switch like rifles i don't care i'll bounce yeah right there's a little with it all i'm nervous about not even like a grandma like a great shot right but far from a great shot but i still get nervous about switching but then like maybe i'll be better but it's a good thing that the industry has done is i think i don't know if it's slowing down now may be honest as perspective on this but it'd be like it seemed like for a while there's so many
and scissors they made you think there were advances and then when you had an older bow you were like missing out on the party yeah and there's probably like a marketing creation it's still that way i remember there's a particular company that used to have that here they would have like a dude come in on a motorcycle with the new bow and it would be like fireworks gone and you ve driver like see what i drive a motorcycle into their booth with a new bow and everybody we like and what is this thing like existing shootin five hundred effie ass for the smooth draw life cycle yeah so it but that they still every company still you know every company worth the assault in in the industry still puts out a new model every year i got a good question for this game like men versus mechanics rat oh boy get many many times i've gone on the range just me
true that my hunting rifles on all my rifles are hunting rifles so i don't know why i put that in there but like i start out gets some fly nurse and then end up adjusting my skill and then end of that session at the range and then readjusted it back to the original set wrapper mechanics or mental i would say probably mostly mc and the reason and the reason being that depending on your rifle in conditions exist in aqaba rifle for six months rights are you you haven't fired bulls for the board not hot ass you go through it all stop and depending on i mean ever rifles different it's like i i've gotten to shoot a lot of long range stuff since i got out just because it's kind of a cool gig and it brings a lot of things together for me and i do wonder rights you shoot these mass rivals only heavy barrels they await fifteen pounds which lie rifle now i guess you shouldn't twenty plus pound rifles and while the coms
we get out there to like our electric my zero make sure you go up there and it's dead nuts and over time you start to see trends like well it's colder outer it's warmer out or you know whatever my lo changed is that a fresh reload or is that a no one's been sitting there for two months that change ama two different lot of ammo you know what to say box is a yeah but that was that the different bear bulletin lot different primary law different case law prior power lot says the same boxwoods like everything's changed that's why you know reloading at this point there too many variables and you can just like stars like spinning yourself as far too rabbit halls you want to go i think a lot of it you know you get into a group how you shoot your position plays a part in that so you shoot some rounds through it it gets warmed up you change your position you get used to the recoil
tight start with and then you relax into it so that changes things a little bit now and so yeah there's there's a lot of variables i would say it's mostly mechanical and that's the key you know people have this idea you don't like take snipers for example that while these guys they just they're wizards it's like well there's a lot of trends through shooting it's like where's my cold bore shot gut where's my bullet going it's this format where's my bullet going i'm at this elevation we just track that and we keep you know dope charts you know you write everything down after time saving with a hunting rifle even when i used to shoot no pistol i would log everyday i shot i would write down what i did what i worked on what i noticed in overtime you could flip through that and you're like oh you start to see trends develop and it's not something a lot of people do but journaling we got a range of other ages have a notebook and say i shot here my gun in three inches high the left amusing this box you know maybe mark on your box of ammo or a lot of and more if le reload fifty it's easier cause then it's the same
i reloaded this on this date so then you go to the range and then you say well it always shoots you know it always starts out shooting high laughed and then it goes down in a low ride and then goes back to milligan so then you known if you're hunting like okay this round's probably going to go you know two inches high and laughed even though it was zeroed off the last group cause that's what it always does my journal largely the same amulet i shot some pretty sweet shots hit some copper wires ended on a good note yeah i had my first crush it'd be defined what you're flyers are when you say i have a few flyers and so i start message moscow man my brain is strange because i have like a very very select few things where i get like soup rain or attentive on one is like building arrows and an even like tuning my arrows to my my boughs and my groups and like well that doesn't look like a tight group to me when i have somebody be like well
yeah but you shouldn't in his group like somebody is also but some it just looks sloppy you know it's like well i got three within four inches two hundred yards and then i got two at ten inches you know for an example see your hate those your group goes from four inches to ten inches though you're saying give or take just just like some sloppiness and am i know i know i did everything riot everything fell grid and i care we ran my head around wide how one bullet constrain the best
do both sealer that say oh a minute of elk chocolate video of the old michigan direct put on a pie plate at one hundred yards yet hit it we're good to go we got a five inch group at one hundred were solid yup yup those do kill deer it's that's something to remember tuk as i shoot you know you're i want to go dudes friction image guns a calf and a lot of guys get wrapped around and they'll do low development to the nth degree in that got want a gun that shoots quarter 'em away it's like well a gun i shoot true quorum em away for like five shot groups is rare among you get an adventurous world the guy got guns that i've done upshot they'll shoot seventy eights pretty distant and as long as you're not shouldn't targets outside of that meeting public target you're shooting it's like i can shoot two am only targets all day long it's all about your wind calls and everything else so that i don't get too wrapped around that anymore as long as it's a consistent load and it's you don't keep into that same
like well it's well under an inch half inches great but in four hundred i felt like a shoot an inch like that's pretty solid laws well good job chuck christopher the big compare venturous guy i know i know i'd go down he's got a facility built at his house basically like a bunker on the hillside does do he should have elements chacha yeah flat tire ranch fitting and i used to go up there try to excite my rifles in with you and eu it was just the most is it a bad experience here the eggs at five hundred yards like that and he is so dialed any so he's got his process down in his prayers some like the hunting equivalency like they just do not meet my what it's not real world read some of the different sport
when you're talking about some of that bench press down twenty power completely different sport it's amazing those guys are shooting for five inch groups at one thousand though consistently like their eggs or you know they'll shoot like three matches and their putin five inch groups four inch groups with a little male or something called the cow use funny about redoubled the consistency that inconsistency of the equipment is the way is this idea that back in blue the era that these gasser like these expert marksman you know that they have like shoe split lead on hatchets and stuff like that is when you think about that their hand pouring bullets sometimes making their own gunpowder and then having shooting rifles that were that were rifled by hand and in people like to have a thing like this re old tick liquor nor could shoot the tick off a pass american split it's on hedge heads one hundred yards it's like it'll so
nice to be able to go back in time to see and your boon his compatriots i member like you be rid of of the that account their accounts that people will complain about people out in the settlements how they would just shoot all day long how lazy they were because they weren't out hunting they would just shoot but to go back and be like what kind of groups with those guys actually throwing it had been interest because that the mythology is this like real italy's like super accurate hardship every time only think about the inconsistency of all the equipment they must have and some sloppy ass shooting back then like there's no way they could have gotten good like how good could you get when every shot is just something so different i dunno at it in some ways i'd i'd inclined to agree because of the the quality but then you had a lot of guys that were true craftsmen that could build mean that way who built the rifle mattered because you had guys he said were throwing stuff together but you look at guys that try and recreate some of that stuff
and their use in modern day c c machines the whole nine yards and like i'm having trouble getting to wear this guy was consistently kind of making things you know handmade like trying to replicate how they did this it's pretty wild and then if you go back and look at the civil war you look at some of these some of these different rifles that these guys were shooting them and you guys they were soon eight nine her guards in the civil war that were taken some of these you know creed more rifles and stuff and they were so in guys with crazy distances and or you go to the black powder or the buffalo rifles and you look at what those guys shoot you know like they have the quigley shoots and they shoot these black power it's crazy what in there's same thing will gather be important those are sailboats and ending on they're not round balls but it's still sometimes i wonder i'm like i wonder if they like did have this figured out if it's you know like like the pyramids or like i dunno how they did it but here's the result you know if they were legit or if it's like a kind of oh yeah he was great shouting you know she the take up of awesome the girl
so there's a thing or two or its group at fifty yards in every house shootin afoot group you know like there's a thing called the battle of adobe wall when the bad the battle of adobe wildcatters bunch of buffalo hunters down the southern planes when they were exposed to hunt south of the southern railroad but they said goin down earn a god do a skirmish skimmer what drives they got through skirmish worth there's a legend this guy make gonna like a fifty inauguration either shall send plus yard shot and as i have how much he walk out and be like pale mary haven't ahead someone and how most popular here's what's gonna happen it seems like i verbally was pretty prevalent in that culture is so this was substantiated by multiple sources gives out there is then the adobe walls thing yet they credited that shot with ending the battle but i'm stayin here much like how much he does go out and wing went out there and he was more surprising in the more surprising the guy he hit and i believe like i wasn't it
it was like a little lad tray centre right like impose our little in one of the accounts and i ran away those are brand new rifles like somebody brought them in two then sell and when because this was an empire the summer moon so those who also comanche i know it from dan flurries talking about it ok in what way dance lorries presents it is from the buffalo hunters perspective it this long shot that so stunned their adversaries like the hand of god is against us we're dead go ahead leave his castle from the tribal perspective someone had on the way to the battle someone had killed a skunk and it was taboo to kill a skunk
ahead of a battle or taboo to kill a skunk in general in one like that man fell it was affirmation if someone had violated a taboo and that's their perspective on why that battle itself so i asked dan for his like who was right me like both of them i got here viable and that's the derivation like getting scope right i like it but it yeah i mean i've heard could be same all plays out the exact we obviously but i've heard there is as you know a very rapid or charmante character who said you know we gotta do this tack i guarantee nobody will get touched and then at the very
at break obviously somebody gets touched them in a big way and it was like well oliver good mojo is is gone the shot that could have been a skunk could have been whatever there are two battles of dope walls yes and it was a very small amount to hide hunters defending like a little encampment from hundreds of adversaries but with highfalutin equipment that like big fifty cow buffalo rifles and the one account i read there like brand new and box like trade goods so then lay great about boys were under attack yeah what did we myths which is more is there like any marksmanship business there's about never did our eyes about big boy
pistols how much experience do you have with them not a lot of shada i went up to alaska just didn't actually eat during college i had a buddy that was a little bit younger than me that just graduate high school so i first started college we went up to alaska so i bought a forty four mag but the hard cast boards like ireland bear country time to get a little bigger pie sheet social a little bit i've shot like four sixties and some of that stuff but not a lot is it a lot harder or is it still just in your head the the fact that you're dealing with this thing that just barks and makes your hand hurt so bad similar concepts you know it's it's definitely different like driving to a race carver's driving a
you're not from the report on the basis of road rod words here two hundred i'm like us so little different but similar ideas you know breakin the trigger keeping your given your sites tie and break in the trigger in its similar concepts but it takes a muscle memory to get past blast fisher argues that you would like what you speak into his like forty four may with a forest barrel yeah yes but on comparable uncomfortable it is in a house stunningly inaccurate one is rarely if they can be accurate but i've always thought of those you know the cow likely make for fifty four so that its easy to carry him bear country right than you shoot the or a five hundred in it weighs two pounds verses like before that it should weigh plus
as like to me that's what we call a get off me bro weapon you know it's like affairs right here it's like it's me to you i just gotta be able to get that thing to bark and get it out and shoot at ten feet i'm not i'm not going to be go out and trying to smoke a bear with that thing at one hundred and fifty art i might begin this story wrong was always tell me about the head these they had a bunch guides who carry revolvers short bail revolvers is better protection if something really put em at the bottom of a hill and some guy roles ask a ball downhill category i could be mass do no story no
you told it before then when hill one hit it and that's the thing you're supposed to hit this bear in the head with as he's coming down on you well and until your point about protection so that if you're shooting a hunting pistol or something then that stapler put a scope on it or maybe that's different and i've i was talking to a kid whose dad used to hunt with a with a pistol and he was one of those guys that shot the big bore like the four sixty rollins and all those the wheel guns and his dad i guess was one of those pistol arrow types that he just he's put tens of thousands around to this one gun and he was telling the story they were breaking him he need bright cleavages at one hundred yards with this thing all the time rabbit would come right now and he just smoked this rabbit you know and there's tons of stories throughout the frontier days of pistol arrows that could just make incredible you look at bob monday the fast guy could draw and that you can see him it's like boom boom like okay i guess it's legit admonish the bob ross official shoot well yeah but you know like as bob ross is slow this guy's fast so it's like polar opposites you know and he's like ama daddy
go shoot he went and shot a brown bear in canada or alaska alaska i guess in he shot the saint like one hundred and forty yards was standing up and he shot right in the center of the but he said they went out with the guide ignited the kids is telling stories but i'm sure he can back them up another garza gathers dude i never see like shoot pistol like the iron sights we're going to go side in our hunting rifle and his guides kind of the same but a paper plate to you three shots on it yet they're on the play or go to go and skies exactly she went one hundred brown bear with a pistol boy you know kind of thing is like sure so he gets up there offhand shoots four rounds i think on this plate or five rounds on it five round goes up there and it's like a four inch group on this at hundred yards and he's like literally he shot a better group often with his pistol than that guy did shooting not the hood and so the gaza i guess so there's guys out there and i i've known a couple that they shoot big bore stuff and they crazy accurate but for me my the gun i carry is a glock ten mil hard cast bullets because
sometimes volumes while he was better than what i get one out for the five hundred to get that thing out i can i can check glock pretty quick so and i got ten rounds in that thing so if i get a bear this does start chewing on me i can get three or four off hopefully before i get knocked down and so that's that's where i'm at it's a platform i'm used to and what are you doing this fall i'm going to get together and hunt where i have tag you don't watch forebears you got it i guess it's gonna be somewhere to the vat directive over the summer the thing man bears have been now there's a lot of areas i've haunted and been around and i've never hunted you'll get down to like calm base and are some of those areas are guys that want an attorney the way is now already alone there i used to hunt there a year but we were it's not if you run into a bare it's like what's the situation and we like in its every year like it's not worth it what an auditor headlamp it's like i always at all there's something in the night it's like well there is you know and like you're going to run into them at some point like yeah the outfitters that don't work in certain areas
is there so you re so bad on feed and just as hard the bears decide what do you do about body yeah no let up in our new about now yet the more you wanted it your way that you know about the definition of loaded altogether download think that would just about legal it's illegal question it is well but not because i am a lawyer out of four of posts to couple different people in the area i got two answers early let's i should say he's a with the guy's a lawyer the attic a ghastly unlady re out there you owe me a spot out yeah i read this i actually save this talk about us and get to see the outside europe ass you make it simple for when she was in the court room and i think that it was it came down to the definition of loaded because too for the perpetrators
to be charged with aggravated assault the gun had to be loaded so then they came down to well what is loaded because if it's not then the punishment is not going to be severe the charge won't be as severe as if it is and she says well the domain was for another guy says well enough they did have won in the chamber so as was loaded so it's not you know but he was say i'll shoot you but if he actually can't you because he doesn't have loaded weapon then that's where life the grey area was so she's like did i feel sure thought that you know low you know in the magazine means loaded he went on and has been near talking to other people about it and never end she seems to be he wants to our younger was it she wants to argue their clients gun wasn't lower dixie didn't have one chamber no she saying that it was much
yeah whoever are areas where she stands on the case but she's wanting argue that having it have a loaded magazine counts for a loaded weapon odin went on talking about pointed a person if you're out hunting and he said is that thing loaded no having some in the magazine it is not loaded if it's not chamber the minute i pointed at you they have i point revolver at you and wines up that i have an empty cylinder and air and then and i got anti cylinder and he says that loaded now might now pointed at you i feel that it's a different it's a completely different set of rules or what's a deafening in fairly for what you call i was always how you our target
up the so we have different aspects right so you can carry you know you have different methods of carry so you can carry loaded round in the chamber on safe load round the chamber off saved loaded no round in the chamber so you've got different ways that you carry in the military so like you're on up a post and like what you can't care when the chamber but you can carry it loaded are you it can't hurt with the magazine period so i dunno i think it's gonna depend on the definition i i don't think montana code has anything that deals with that i was just looking it up will states is personal he was and i don't care i would be surprised if they have a definition of a loaded zira area using to challenge man but therein some law and i would have to look it up that deals with conceal carry because there there's a lot it says basically you can but brandishing a firearm is define and i dont think they ve ever define what
not you what loaded means or if your branching a firearm it matters if it's loaded or not its there's kind of that's the only thing ever seen broken you're saying in the military they don't use the term loaded for both situations right loaded in the magazine or loaded in the chamber while they they basically color code them so you can carry rather you can carry black and black means is red means they're so loaded too broad right yeah it's just here's the definition for change how you chamber is a better context it is one and makes sense yeah loaded tooth is to broaden the hunting context as well the guy levels off lizzie gave us a gold pump jack get guy levels off argument upon badge jargon and he's got to full none chamber in some later once when i was a really loaded could have been do not delay elsewhere argument if i was a lawyer i would say no one's ever been killed by a bullet in the magazine yeah if aldo yeah there's not a there's not a round in the chamber that guns are not going to kill you why
you said it's loaded or chamber right it's loaded if there's any it was one of the magazine is chambered if there's one in the chamber right that's it outside yom get i'm trying to jump into baltimore's react yeah i'm taking the perspective of someone haven't aimed at me the outcome would later be like i don't wanna parse hairs ear you lord the aim damn thing i like let's i don't know i haven't i can stop it aimed but i can also see the point where in a court like if i'll get it if i was in trouble for having done that someone else i could imagine myself arguing very vague leave it there was in fact not loaded the abc the level of the threat is if it is if you have to do that your papa shock on rather than pull the trigger the level thread is is different and both of which have you like it wasn't lowly it wasn't loaded it was loaded with chambers bright i think you have to let you have a lawyer that they want or my life is hanging on the definition of this word no no no
you're gonna get capital now i'd like to think that there is were really she was in the chamber in their like waiting to see to given the drip petya what we d what we decide now she was just curious more about the common usage in our and our circles in our circle it would be that it was not loaded yeah i'll say that it would be the there's not around in the chamber it's not i would say i use anything loaded and you say no i'm thinking it may well have a magazine in it but there's nothing there i feel like twenty years ago i took one hundred safety but i feel like i learned learned at different i mean this is in washington maybe the rules are different but i remember being told you cannot have a low gun in a car would ever know what in that case you right yeah nutcase i can't have a magazine exactly and so on so when it the only brought that another day i'm like will i mean like if if you're coming back from hunting he pulled up
were officer asks do you have a gun the car yes sir is it loaded you d better be able say no and you better have that the bullets around one are right we ve got from a woman who went her family is all gone fishing this is an idaho story to her family's all gone fishing and they go down to a park in the dad's vision with the kids and she's reading her book it's something or another happens where i was gonna leave and they give her the rod and so she's just holding a rod on the grass holding a rod someone comes up and checks her license she didn't have a license fishing but like yes i'm adelaide holding the rob i didn't fish and they give her a citation but she argues that court gets thrown out oh really no did i had a rod at lake because whatever her husband had all the rod
i think there is any way he came up cheek and in this her claim is that this individual came up the second she touched thereof but gotcha oh yeah well that's where you go back to the you know one of the other things i moonlight as a reserve police officer psychic to play with them this on the other side and the one thing they talk about a lot when you're looking at how to enforce laws because mean there's obviously you have a lot of areas and as a legislator i dont want there to be strict clarity where you gonna go through find everything down to every level because then you're going to have double the size of code i would rather live in a state where people use common sense and say hey you know this this law says don't do this this is obviously what it means i just don't do that but that's where you talk about the spirit of the waters is the letter of the law so what does this law designed to do is law enforcement whether that's inefficient wildlife and that you know we had some hits with that like tagged immediately upon kill will that got changed before moving it cause the guy got a ticket and he's like well
i haven't moved yet we're getting it but i didn't tag it it's like i sat down and had a what does this actually accomplish if i don't take this thing now versus five minutes from now it doesn't do anything the idea is that you can't move it around and transport it because then if you get caught you're like oh i was gonna tag it it's like what which didn't so i think that's where you get to this like you said is it unloaded that everybody knows like hey can you show with his gunners taken apart and put in a bag that's kind of the definition where if you're pointing it at me it's like well that have around the chamber so i think a lot of that comes down to interpretation of letter of the lager spirit of law just going to have to figure it out speak it loaded law a boy was one s do you want a head on and this is like a real i can offer you like people want to stop listening they can go ahead they can go ahead but our won't about drone on about some room please order yeah southern we want because the reason that the
we have an obligation to talk about this because we invited we invited it we did from lawyers i'm glad we did yeah i heard from a lot of very very kind and knowledgeable people on this and really helped my understanding it's good to know as much lawyers out there gia from any assholes too no no same guy glowing reviews good good eye joe joe mention one that well that was a little like maybe distaste for mike i doubt if it doesn't have anything substantive to see it now but our lawyers the road in and i read i read it full of last night lawyers wrote in were saying almost unanimously that sam did a fair job of walking through these supreme court case without a jurist after that people are probably sick you hear about i got a letter of correction from ben long who said that he in fact did not tell me not to talk
but it is not just about a care but it is we have to think i am going to try to bring people up to speed in some kind of efficient fashion that is my touch on this correction because this is the most detailed correction we've ever done yeah if it's in fact can be counted as a correction the supreme court is hearing a case they already heard they have decided on it would be and it has to do with if a tribe in this case for talking about the crow tribe the tribe the crow tribe has a treaty with the united states from eighteen hundreds that allows them to hunt their own reservation but all on unoccupied lands outside of their reservation and there's been a lot of ambiguity about what unoccupied lands means that mean any national forest now park violette land state land like what does it mean and its people felt like this had been settled but
not settled and that are a member of the crow tribe went out and killed some elk off of his reservation he got trouble with the game ward and his hunting companions pled guilty he's saying i'm not guilty because my treaty gives me the right to hunt and the big horn national forest because it's unoccupied land and so it goes to do it it elevated up towards the supreme court is going to hear this and make some kind of decision possibly to upset current understandings of whether or not the national forest and wyoming can be regarded as unlike by land there yes get in this we are talking about how this individual when he first gets in trouble for his poaching violation he goes in front of a court and the court tells him
don't tell me about your don't tell me about your treaty rights you're not allowed to argue that you were exercising treaty rights and i was like how can you prevent someone from making an art like how can you get someone from like making their argument in a bunch of lawyers not about some lawyers rawdon say like what it is that makes it that would be situation where you are not allowed to give you're too to make the case you want to make in front of a judge yeah and i say we model our way through it and i think we were pretty close by the lobbies these people wrote in with some some really helpful correction just for my own understand of this and so how that worked was that carers lawyers prior to going to trial is the would be the convicted poacher yes yes ill before he stood trial
they they sought to have all charges dropped they said have this treaty needed drop all charges he didn't do anything wrong so that is is something called a motion in lemonade it but the inn and what that means is it's settling issues before a trial by either asking the court to pre approve the admissibility of something they plan to present evidence or an argument or asking the core to exclude something that they dont want their opponent to present so prior to the trial his lawyer said you can't you can have try as for this he's gotta he's got this treaty to support it but then the prosecution says no that has already been settled it's already been decided in the reps this decision that we mention from the late nineties its
been decided that the crow indians do not have a right to hunt on the big more national forest specifically the tent circuit ruled on that that issue is settled you cannot re litigate an issue that settled gotcha and souls were saying don't bring that all up again yeah router decided that if you've got some else to say go ahead and say it but don't lay that on me yeah so in court then because he pled not guilty he had to make a different argument he decided they decided to go with dinnerware was didn't realize that he crossed into i crossed into and there like well you are a game warden at the time you should unknown your guilty but then after that they appealed and two other why arming appellate core they upheld the writer decision the appeal to the while make supreme court they declined it and then they appeal to the united states
supreme court and you know it's it's a little amazing because i have been reading a lot about this in the united separate state supreme court has something like seven or eight thousand cases appealed to it every year and they select like eighty and so it's it's a little it's a little interesting that they were able to get there but one of one of the things supreme court is looking at how many cases the court about eighty is created same here because they also here in the case about the guy who has the pistol permit in new york he's got a pistol permit for his home that prohibits him from taking his pistol right out of his home he and he's saying why do my second amendment rights end at my doorstep and they're hearing that case too this is big year for hunters for in the supreme court know so so that
so the supreme court is interested in this very thing and so the you know what kind and they're interested in issue preclusion and where where it's it's a it's you know that's this judicial doctrine if it they're they're not really sure if if that was the right decision to not allow him to re litigate gate settled issue and as we know them album with this is there's another supreme court the mill locks verses minnesota decision that kind of shook the underpinning of the wraps decision it didn't overturn it by it it it it undermines it so that their looking there looking this site this idea of what whether you can re litigate something if if you well there's been holes poked into it now
like an example aus lay now as i say you lived in some situations where they said no one like we do it is never justifiable to kill someone in self defense so then you kill someone in self defense and you go up a murder trial and you like but do we need to revisit the idea of whether it's ok to kill someone in self defense like i'm not done talking about that and this is kind of a little bit of what's it is it is and so if we covered that there is one more email that i found a very interesting and provides a you know a good perspective on on this case and perhaps we'll go another thing i learned is that this it this decision is likely to be issued in june you're going like oh well i heard it was the summer maybe it be later bit but it's the supreme court's going to go in on recess after that so they they usually issue a lot of their their rulings prior to going on recess hold a thought from it yeah i'm kind of obsessed
the herrera be while men case that at all this is when you talk about her there somewhat under utilised heard of it saw as i was thinking about this case tree law came up so in ice on the judiciary committee and we had the hearing for the sea is getting water compact my second numb two sessions ago i guess and its huge in what they argued was that the tribe has that's confederated salish kootenai read right so the confederacy she couldn't tribe which is the flathead basically area so they had a ruling where they they redid the water compact so they were going through and water is a huge issue in montana as you guys i'm sure are aware and what they said
that the tribe had primary water rights are or were trying to establish primary water rights even back to some of these claims are in the eighteen hundreds that people filed for their water rights and they're saying while the treaty was like eighteen i don't remember the year have taught my head but it's it was prior the treaty was signed prior to these water rights other saying these should be a higher priority and the language that they use in the treaty to make this claim was that the treaty granted the tribal members the right to hunt and fish in common with the population so what they're saying is while you have the right to go fishing on any land anybody else can go fishing on you and it gets into the nuances of a what does that mean exactly but the argument that they made was if you have the right to hunt and fish on a stream over and like and we're talking like big timber area so this is how far out the water rights went they said if you have a right
fish then you have a right to mandate that there's an appropriate amount of water to protect the fisheries in those areas so that europe yours you might have a priority date that's you know in eighteen hundreds for their water rights than can be argued that well but the treaty prohibits them from using water that could then affect the instream flows you know two hundred miles away because they have the right to fish there and if you lower the water to wear it no longer so beneficial to the fisheries than you yours observing the right impacting i fish and so that with the argument that they made in that the treaty went through in it was compounded with the fact that the montana constitution says the large amount in our own by the people of montana and so the treaty the way that is written is since the treaty or the water compact is he states that the water is held in trust by the federal government has not actually owned directly
by the tribes its owned through the federal government so then it's like wait a second our constitution that we have that we own our water how can the federal government then our water it was a huge issue and you know there's a lot of nuances but it's kind of the same argument it's like well what does the tribal what does the treaty actually grant you does it grant you the right to have this and so that's it that's great lead in its a huge huge yeah huge issue and people are remit on both sides of it so yeah so this other one i wanted to talk about is exactly that it's like what did the treaty mean and in the end this guy and he he says he's are recent law graduate in just took the bar last week but he did study the law wanted to explain something they felt like we missed in so he explains that you have cannons of construction their basically rules that like under pen eyes and understanding of of laws such that
later when their brought up again you can understand you understand where where they are coming from and so the the the canon of construction for federal indian law comes from supreme court and eighteen thirty supreme court decision eighteen thirty two so this is even prior to that that treaty being signed but others something to quote a concurring opinion from justice mclean that says the link jews in treaties with the indians should never be construed to their prejudice how the words of the eddie were understood by this unlettered people rather than their critical meaning should form the rule of construction so the labour understanding so it's it's what they thought it meant at the time what the natives thought it met at the time is what matters
not what our modern understanding of that word or phrase means so this gets at that so we were just talking about one issue and the supreme court of issue precluding and this is the other issue that their discussing as unoccupied land and so this guy suggesting this is interesting to because we had brought up the context of the time previously as far where there are animals that time there were no animals on the land so in that context what was understood at the time and we work well that's part of it because there's there's no else there's no alcoa yeah it's interesting that they would have thrown that in where they say like you can hunt unoccupied lands as long as there's any game there yeah cause it's like why even add that yeah and in while meeting argues explicitly that it was under the they think it was understood in these treaty arrangements that the game was going away that it
soon be extirpated and in fact it was and in so they they saw all these things as temporary arrangements that that the this was this a transitional phase as the natives as the crow try positioned to an agrarian society so why armies like well yeah we saw that the other treaty was signed but you could hundred other gar yet every everybody everybody assumed that the land surrounding would become occupied quickly as states established in settlers moved in and you can hunt this area as long as they're still game because its dunaway fast in fact elk were extirpated from the bighorn mountains shoe lee after the signature of that treaty and were brought back through very rigorous restocking efforts are they can open that warrants point out is tribal members are obviously allowed to hunt
as any other resident non resident said laws so this is all is not like they can't on it would be that they can hot under the same guidelines at any other state resident or non resident would come in on but this has to do like an overlay which is a specific tribal awning rights yes a civic the tribal members yes in the specific like trot tribal tree hunting it it's an important distinction for people understand because yes natives can apply and draw these tags and the big horn mountains and in this area but the tribal treaty hunting the witch which occurs in many states often exists on a different plain than state managed in a normal hunted it's it's it's often offered often seasons are after non existent bag limb
or different it's more it's more like it's more like alaska subsistence hunting then it then it fits within our you know neat little program of of state managed wildlife so you are a good unclear points i think the reported arrest a split dressed and in june you're going to come on and tell us what happened yeah it's a big deal or not yeah yeah i'm in my my views continue to have all i said if i think i put as a three or four last time with his eyes that is going to change the world as we know it yeah end and i think i might be more of a solid for even a five or six after some of these conversations i've had in the last couple we this could have major ramifications for gay management at the press i i'd i wouldn't say major but i would say could have again significant ramifications interesting thank you don't area i don't got the turk calls
fuck yeah i'm gettin ready we're lesson by the way but and i are counting down were kept me snowshoes april saying now we're we're goin on the rio grande chaos real randy the rio grande data gate set things become down man there a pleasure yeah we're gonna we're going to probably have to call on you again for corrections and whatnot i'll be around and banks there and have also causing thoughts or you want here to closer i honestly have one looking represents the opportunity because you're going to have a lot to me the closures i know but want one for this video bend yet and you conclude hers that's a lot of pressure going to fill me your films evil i conclude yeah well you threaten there is an important one on the rio grande a exemplary out about that that overlaps with our austin texas live podcast eight o out to get on doesn't overlap
we go from there to too often for life show what one plane ticket i guess this was the point as your computer i think that just something to mention my we're doing a big fancy superfine live by gas mask texas i don't sickness brasilia europe they are they are for sale market polluter is as we are talking about shooting i was thinking about all the movies i watched as a kid and all the bullshit shocks that hey that were clearly you know i was thinking of pleasant before lonesome dove ass thinking of johnstone tombstone same always movies legally could we have not always seminal movies at shaped i think about the west were all there is at least a or a number of bullshit shots and each one of us
what i always hated was if somebody has a revolver and they shoot like eighteen times there's a mel gibson movie the patriot where the the the red coat the officer he has a muzzle loaded flintlock pistol and a dude is riding a horse like two hundred yards down this creek and he just pulls up and boom and the dude falls off his horse yeah you ever watch the ballad of buster scruggs there's some good yeah that's almost a parody of a good shoot but that's a parody of like what's been done in the we're in the realm of like western shooting satire yeah it's like a satire but that's my conclude oh i gotta conclude and we've talked over two here's a lot of it a lot about a documentary that i did was zero point zero production and damn you can watch it now stars in the sky film dotcom measured at their own stars in the sky film dot com and then it's available for
streaming and download on video you can rent it you can buy it so check it out falling feature film available now effort for crude good job your turn came around and hit your own computer south thanks recovery we preach measured my pleasure european model i'll go in other ways raises no it does not just represent some days everyone
Transcript generated on 2023-03-14.