« The Ringer NBA Show

How Do the Great NBA Teams Stay Good? | The Answer


Seerat and Kyle start the pod by sharing their excitement for the new NBA season and discussing the intricacies of Krav Maga. They then examine some of the teams that are looking to make a big leap this year, before debating the elements of what makes a great NBA team and the franchises that have managed to maintain continuous success—notably the Spurs and the Warriors.(5:40) This leads to a conversation about Draymond Green's role in nurturing new teammates on the Warriors, the complications in doing so, and how young assets like Jordan Poole and Jonathan Kuminga will change the team's overall strategy going forward.(19:28) Next, they speculate on a look at Bam Adebayo's role with Miami this year and touch on some of the other bigs looking to make some noise in the coming season.(36:11)

Hosts: Seerat Sohi and J. Kyle Mann

Production Supervision: Conor Nevins

Associate Producer: Chris Sutton

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This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
Mac jealousies, ripped, not precursors, galling place the celtics or title favorites. And the ringer as new boston show I'm brian buried host of off the plight. The show covering all things boss, sports olive, shows multiple times a week, ever your favorite teams and with your favorite rigour and local guess. What may be built stop. I ran about the socks. Follow up the fight with me bribery now, in spite of that. It's the ring radiation presented by fanned the nba and there's no better placed to get in on the action than vandal I like the end or because the app is safe and secure. As of these exclusive offers that you can tap into and when you win- and this is big- you will get paid fast. My friends use, promo code, ringer, mba and download the final act today to make every moment more. This mba season twenty unpleasant lex,
dates. Call one hundred gambler or visit vendor dotcom such energy. In colorado, I love michigan, new jersey, pennsylvania, illinois or virginia when a hundred next step or text next step to five three three, four, two in arizona one, a aids eight nine, seven, seven, seven, seven or visit c c p e g dot org such chat in connecticut, one hundred nine with it in indiana visit K s gambling help dot com in Kansas. One seven, seven, seven, seven, zero stop in Louisiana one, eighty, seven, seven, eight hope and why or tax open? Why? Four six, seven three: six: nine in new york, tennessee redline, one eight hundred, eight, nine, nine, seven, eight, nine one eight hundred five, two to four seven: zero: zero in wyoming or visit w w w dot one eight hundred gambler dot net and west virginia sarasota. Are you by state form some fans assume that a young stand out player will have pretty good stats, but then they supply entire league is an empty piquant tender that can one in the playoffs.
People that assume they can't afford great insurance, but then they discover that state far has surprisingly great rights. Like a good neighbour stay farmers. There get a quote today. man said the answer where I m very excited, because not only is the opening night tonight and I came home yesterday, just you know my I was just like. I wiped It took the remote and I was like twitching I'm just like. I want to turn on the basketball terms, a basketball there's no basketball to lodge so I m very excited. We ve got lakers warriors tonight. We ve got six years something I have cairo man in front of me about to give you these wonderful, eggs and and made me smarter made you smarter, so it's gonna be in good time and you go
excited. You know this is the guy. I always think of that that Michael scott member of your office person, I just remember that whole show for some reason it's just by into my brain but like when he like is gonna when Toby's moving away and he comes into work early and he's like stratton around. I always think of that mean where he's like, sir, he can't contain himself said he's like doing these years ago. I couldn't leap. I said this over and over again. I think that, like the sort of covert run that we had, where the seasons we're just on top of each other in the flow was all it just sort of, I think it robbed us of the christmas feeling that you get, that It's been a long enough time, it's time to come back like I'm somebody they consumes basketball and never stops rare, but there's something about the new game, the new story lines the questions of like who's gonna, be the young guys gonna do what are the rookies gonna look like that super exciting, because our expectations are different. Things like that. That's gets me.
rolled up, I'm ready ready for the the started and these opening matches especially yeah. There's always a little bit of. Let's prove something. May statement before we settle in any sort of the drudgery of uh. You know like yeah, february to then I game, like I m, excited, get started me too. Before we began, you reminded me, I had experience something very devastating. A few days ago I found out the so here I am dating, does not like the office in fact hazy off and thinks that isn't it that it isn't funny rude yeah like I was, I still am I'm really enjoying my time with this person. But oh my god, like that religious
it's it's it's not! On netflix, I've noticed a little bit like a cultural. Like it's not a saturated. You know it's not as easy define anyway. The office is singularly oil backlash against the office. I don't think so. I think that iceland, it's not as accessible you. You said something to me. There was interesting last night, though, in Europe you were like gotta, go I've gotta go to cry mom. Clearly, when you first sent me the nagging okay. I always think it's funny when people leave text message like conversations. Unlike just answer, when you can answer, I don't I don't really you don't have to say see you later. It is actually left foot. He will do that. I'm like, let's get back to me when you need If you know when I saw maga magazine the title, I was a little curious guinea. you shed a little light on what this was about, because as phillip, we learn more about worldly, fascinating secrets like it would to tell us about
What that is while this is. This is where you know like every every everybody has. Everybody has their pros and cons right like her. She doesn't like the office, but she's gotten me into crossfit guy, so yes, it was my second class ever so it's not an expert by any means, but it is, The boy a form of self defence that is actually, I think, it's the israeli army trains. Soldiers to learn krav maga- and it is just like it is a form of combat, witnessed it's really interesting. I've done a couple of these. I got him five dabbled in some more time, which is really fine, but is a lot more like focused on the technical aspects of and like just kind of like. In your ear, just like you just initiative, essentially right and it just kind of like about sparring within those conditions like you, you got your evil
we're going to stop. You got her dear. You have laid your gloves and stuff, whereas problem casually, like I don't know, of every problem, muggah classes like this, but mine, essentially like the instructors come at it from a perspective of when you are attacked when you have five or six people attacking you at the same time like when somebody approaches you with a night for when somebody approaches you with a gun. Here's what you do with the assumption that there is always sort of like violence going on around you when you have to protect yourself as soon as violence, or you know I'm here and I'm just I'm just thinking. You know, and I don't want to hold up the basketball part of this. But like I'm just thinking last week, you tell me about being a part of a gang of ruffians who are on a basketball team together and this week, you're telling me about learning to like embrace violence in large groups, and I'm just saying it's it's an interesting puzzle. together here see: that's all we are, we all contained multitudes, it's true, but most of us fire
pulled up, the basque about part of this today we are going to we're going talk about some of the. young players in the league, not know all the young players and all the young teams. You are. You publish your young core rankings last week alongside zach cram, and I thought that there are a lot of interesting things in it. The thing that stood out to me, the most is probably just- the amount of teams that seemed to be on this two timeline developmental thing where they have veterans, and they also have young players and they're also trying to win a title at the same time, and those are that's a lot of different threads to try to try to needle at once, and the warrior is obviously famously are a very successful example of that won a championship last year, while also developing,
I'm, seeing but are now kind of a different coins where they are getting a little bit more into their youth movement. You they're gonna be much more reliant on players like john things, manga and wise men and moody this year, and those guys are relative unknowns in in This leaves in terms of what they can bring to a championship consent. In the team and there are a number of teams in the league that are like this this year and you got you've, got the heat with bama. the bio with tyler hero and you got the sixers. You know really hoping that maxim x a week which it looks like he cared. He got denver with Michael porter, Jr, the war solving their aunt makes a third year. We, you got the palace and was. I am coming back and we there is a sons to who were kind of game The only thing that I think, actually approaches and, moreover, formulaic way where they purposefully added a veteran too. A team of employers in and made the final two years ago, and you know there
we cannot hope to dig it a little bit of elite trauma from mikhail bridges and and and they andrey aden. But there are challenges within that there is, you know you after you after you have infrastructure that is to be able to develop, and you know and at the same time, which is actually much more difficult than just saying that you want to do it like everybody would love to. You know I was joking said the winning never stops. Everybody would love to to win and then also have you know a future that employees, but it much more difficult then just saying that so we're we're going to jump into a bunch of that stuff to that yeah. I think you just kind of in a broad sense if you look at like the way teams work in the way you know every organisation kind of has their short term. Thinking like what we,
they operating on and usually like the time lines of the players on the rostrum dictate that you know and in sometimes, if you look the way, this, the archetype of teams that work in the nba, You know sometimes will have young course come along that are drafted together. That have play off success together, like the young core is also that the the thing that is driving the team, if you think about that I think that takes like super special player types, if you think, like the orlando magic in the nineties, those were like historically like special superstar players there veterans bolstering them with, like. I feel you are here. Were you even able to watch the esteem? Did you watch those orlando teams lives here? It would like was shack and petty, but like nick gainers in disguise, figure is did did not literally as early as a magic chambers legs, the blight howard.
Yeah, I like you do is get suspend. It sure sure I mean memphis, I think is that is the best current version of that. You know, and I think Question that were asking here is about like. Can you be in the midst of a title hunt in earned stand like and have a veteran group, but also have a young group s developing. At the same time, to be honest there Does it really happen very much because teams that have like tidal level pedigree or they are competitive in that sense something has to happen for them to be able to accrue the kinds of pigs that would allow them to have the types of additional tower unless you just are a really great team. In there's an example this that we can talk about costs, Antonio. it just doesn't really happen and the warriors like we talked and we talked about dream on, and the wars we're going to talk about him in a different way this week, but like the warriors,
we are in a situation where they ended. There did you know one leg of their title window closed in the fact that they just kind of tired out in twenty nineteen. You know stem got, hurt clay, got her drink its injured and leaves them that really down here and twenty twenty and enough with some pigs. So there there really one of the more unique cases in the lee where they haven't. You totally compartmentalized course from each other. They have their dynasty core and another one waiting in the wings like you were saying a year as as we were look looking at some of the teams that we were going to talk about. One thing that I notice- and I think actually san Antonio falls into this too- is that you actually just most seems on plans being a situation. Something happens in that happened the san antonio to too, when they got Duncan. It was because David Robinson broke his foot and they lost a bunch of games and got the number one pig, and then you know decades later it's just they happens. It
does really nail, hawaii, leonard drafting home and and developing him as well and with the warriors, like you said they had the injury history, the rafters. aren't necessarily contender, but they had disastrous bubbles bubble season which surrounded them the force pick, and then that forces happened to be so barnes and he just like really like they nailed high lottery pig in bam, sixers nailed a maxi pick, so it gets in your nail, the draft and with denver it's like. They took the risk on a guy like Michael porter, jr high, the lottery, who is incredibly talented, but has injury concerns at the same time, so you do have to you have to get lucky, and then, in that you have to get really unlucky. You know you have to have something disastrous happened to you and then have the disaster be temporary yeah, and I think that you were talking about. I mean it's under
expandable that toronto would have a reset. I mean the year that the bubbles season- I guess they they finished, they were in the playoffs. In that awesome series against the celtics. I guess it was twenty. twenty one when they reset and then a lot of their veteran just cause another, not the bubble season there floor disease at her sure here sure they're they're covered season, but I think a lot of it comes down to you. You know scouting edge if you're a team that is trying to like extend your your window and like bolster it like a lot of these teams, kind of have commonalities and that, like they have strong cultures, they have like an an identity of like the types of players that they go after, like the spurs you were talking about back in, like the early two thousands gathered Duncan, but then they also hit on Manu would like the fifty seventh pick, which is in sight Jane and then, and then they had antoni barker late in the first round. To all, you really have to do is make contact with the ball to times like they did there, and that can like extend your window, but it's like I was trying to come to think about, like teams that, like the grizzlies have continued,
is it just seems? Scouting is sort of the thing that allows these teams to continue to function at a high level and into I do know that you can replace. Can you get core pieces like if you're, a good team and written drafting the late first round, every single year- I don't know, I think, we'll see with jordan pool, but it seems like Scouting- is like kind of the critical thing among all these teams right yeah scouting scouting and development, which is always a difficult conversation, because it's like is it the chicken or the egg? Is it because you scout well, or is it because he's available I'd? Imagine it has to be a combination of both, so Anthony slater actually had this great piecing athletic yesterday about this, and one of the things that was in there was, you know at the same time in like in the lead up to the twenty twenty one draft, when everybody was like hey should the warriors package, you know the number if you pick can of these other picks that they have on and try to get a star like bradley beal. You know try to just bolster the
after that. Have was another veteran star, they had actually already hired joma mila Leela from the rafters who worked with the rafters nine o five and was just like really instrumental in their development Kenny atkinson. Who is, as we know, it was an instrumental in the development of of the young nets before they were treated offer for the for the big yeah, where the culture and the good vibes were immediately abandoned and us never seen a wet hot american summer of years. It's going to be big it to the end of the movie and michael show lots of character? Like is in love with the one girl I forget, and they like obviously at it like turns the like eighties kit summer, can't move either on its head where it's like all. We have mystery, would don't you like me and then she's like now Paul it is really hot and she just went with power. That's what it reminded the other they were like. Oh, we have great chemistry. These are great vibes they're, like it's Kevin durant,
this man in the world, cool kids when they they also hired days and mueller's evening. I hope I am not perjuring that pronunciation, but he knows yolk yoke just got the other guy coach yoke is the max from from like seventeen to every year with age, but you're, a big development guy for big Yeah yeah yeah for sure who is like you know who kept gabon looney has credited him with a you know, just helping make him a little bit more of a fluid player. I'm sure he works with wise men and stuff too so does the one is before that draft. They had already hired those guys, and that is a big part of this, like you have to have the infrastructure and you have to have you know a staff
playing or not, staff and ownership group. That's probably willing to spend more money, so they can hire a bigger coaching staff. So they have these developmental guys, but they also have you know the the x's and o's guys RON Adams and the mike brown who's who's left. The franchise now, but was was a part of last year's franchise. Who will you know what is going on right now. You have to have kind of also those traps at the same time it and you know it- I also urge you, notably through the rafters, would have multiple practice is worthy of a young guys practice and they have the old guys practice as well and like there are benefits to that. Certainly, I think one of the one of the pews benefits with the the quite leonard, at twenty nineteen season in toronto was this you know one. Quite and to a lesser extent, kyle would either be her load. Managing you have young legs that a r we need to get on the core and able to play in get wraps and
it just kind of makes the whole idea of load management a little bit more seamless, whereas I think that like, if you had, we saw it with the clippers in hawaii first year there when kawhi came to the clippers and was low magic and all that stuff, all those guys were kind of like hey we're all too you know, there's so there's definitely there. There are some benefits to it as well, but you have to like you have to really actually want to do it that way. It I think, like that's, that's why the words have been able to be successful and also a vehicle. You, like a team with the heat, is well right, like they ve taken law. hi and lottery, pigs and and first round, except in a word necessarily supposed it here- scouting really well and then actually done a really good job of of developing them too, because they've always been one of the better developmental teams like they take. They take undrafted, guys like like duncan robinson. So, like imagine, you know what they're going to do with Bam. Adebayo retire, hero
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the other thing that I think you need, which is also a great point you made when we we're talking about this- is players who are invested and actually trying to improve the guys in are coming in ahead of them right arm and I think what's wrong! Guy that you mention was for eventually breath. I think before the quite right I been to marlboros and was it Israel invests in the young guys kyle lowry is a guy who's really invest in the young guys and is actually point at slater, makes in his piece about. Ah, about the warriors kyle lowry, in helping to develop fred vanvleet. Also, What kind of you know. just you just molded his own replacement away right. I think that actually works fine, because by the time that kyle lowery left the raptures, it was legs. She was completely like just minted in gold and everybody disarray, The hell out of him- and I think, a lot of that has to do with how we treat it as younger teammates and also like it's not me
it actually hurt him. You know he went to miami because he wanted to win the championship, but I think he wanted to come back to the rafters like they would have figured something out. A lot of shows the realities in some ways for what the team is, but I don't think that either side would have balked at the idea of bringing him back, but it does sort of bring us to an interesting point with the warriors now, where Dream on Green has been a player who has always been really invested in that too, and instead curry, including with all they ve, always been, they they vain great teachers as well right. It's all these guys, but dream is obviously the most interesting point right now because- looks like he my actually develops his replacements before he is necessarily ready to go, and a lot of that is we're. Having this conversation, obviously because of the punch and because you know
it could mean just arrived in conjunction with the punch, was a big deal was a big deal, it wasn't big deal. I think something that we're we're talking about. Here, though, is that, like two to keep these going, and I have a question about like developing your replacement, like. I think that that's interesting, that that is interesting to keep these things going, it's like you have to have so much. I was thinking about about a metaphor: I've ever heard of circular breathing. Have you ever heard of this like in music? This is the net like people play, horns and play anything that requires air. Is that When you're holding a long notes, it's when you circular breathe, it means you don't stop to take another breath. You can be either. The note continue is an you somehow. I have like breathed into your nose, I think, is how they do it, and then you can it's a continuous flow of air. So it's like four teams that really good to continue. You have to develop this. This ability in this consciousness that you need to continue
to bring in new air? And it's like for some time he's just it to hold a note to begin with. They struggled to do that. Like forty franchises. trying to get off the ground and hold a singular sort of cultural idea, that's gonna last and stick in the nba is one way, but if you think about the spurs, the rafters, the warriors the he, these teams that have had success, and then they- and they have also been able to sort of thread the needle and continue to bring in new talent. But I was gonna, ask you: do you think that do you think that, like where your pit does that? Does that affair the sort of like a level of experience players like how much they feel threat because you were talking about kyle lowry, developing fred vanvleet. What fred Vanvleet had been a top three pick coming in with like investment, the level of investment in a player like how much money they may, because sometimes, when a higher bit come in, they like ok, you're costing us this much. We need this much reward you gotta play
the players turandot later does that affects what do you think that has any impact How well there meant orders is conditional to the team, in question and I'd. Imagine it's it's probably situational like if you will be the warriors wise and number two pair coming a number seven pic. I think what, because witty fourteenth fourteenth, ok, maybe fifteenth somewhere in their lives, first round. Those guys were high level picks ray, and I think that different franchise? May put pressure on Steve current. Oh, ok, let's get Johnson coming by these minutes. Obviously, wiseman was her bush. the warriors. Gotta shredded, don't need all pretty well, where you know they were trying to win the championship. So, while coming on moody got some run during a regular season, got some garbage time run and you know there are times when dream on was hurt your times when ego dollar was her. Those Those were kind of moments where they got to show what they can do.
At the same time, I think there is always understanding of why you can't be part of it off rotation unless you're actually ready for that kind of a felt like that always underscored the seasons for them. So maybe that had to do with why you know maybe the players and associate was threatened by it, but I think it actually does have to do with who you are as a blake as as the older player you know like it's just like on which is called human psychology. Look if you want to find a real to be insecure about being replaced. You will find those reasons anywhere and if you aren't going to look at it that way then you're just not going to look at it. That way, you know what I mean yeah totally, but I dunno it's a good question. I wonder service like those george, I mean you come to my mind- is like the air and water stuff. I won't have you checked up on picture traffic quarterback know that basketball necessarily how's that I think the one that I read comes to mind right now is probably Monte ellis when the warriors drafted- curry, oh yeah, and then the
I think clay thompson after and I think that pretty much spelled his and they're in Marcus thompson's book golden that. I do recall that there were some issues with that lake Alice, wasn't necessarily ready to give up the keys and and steph was kind of on. The pages like hey we can kind of We can do something special together here, but the kind of it seems like they had some friction and I think this actually fur. I would imagine that actually typical, I would imagine that most franchises, like look worse off than about the success stories here, we're talking about exactly we're talking about doing something that is actually frankly lake. In most situations impossible and my actually not necessarily work out that well for the warriors or the heat going forward, at least like in the breeze in the immediate future. Right, like we don't necessarily know we are showing. What do you want to get into darling? The things that I started thinking about was the fact because we have a lot of these.
teams that are trying to win a championship and really relying on young players to be a bit car the rotation and are really knowing who you're gonna be gnarly, knowing what kind of jobs are going to make. Is that There are a lot of unknowns with these contenders. You know like we don't know if so coming at a great precision. I think he's gonna goes, your point of view seems great cultures and they already have. They ve already have liked this sort of instituted way of doing things. I think, commissioner, in your one, came in ed. While he was great, he got a lot of opportunities and he knows he just gave the warriors his athletic punch that, like when the warriors have an athletic player, like kind of happened was with with Gary payton in the moments that James wiseman has been healthy. It's been like whoa like when they have a guy that can that can catch just like he adds his other dynamic to them, and it's just like it's really exciting. With the same time, I think we saw commingle We fall into moment of tunnel vision. It didn't necessarily know how to play alongside
What curry and klay yeah in in and pool when you got to- and I think, like even wiggins- went through the same thing and in his first few months in and go state, and so we she started to figure it out single were seen from commissioner in europe Is he is figuring it out there last preceding game against a number of years? these moments where it was like he would get. He had one where he got the offensive rebound and it wasn't like he tried to go up. Was it after. After that, we should be like a very classic young player moved to make like where it's like, hey, I'm the one who got this board so like how many uses rep. For me, he immediately passed to declare for three and like that was a moment where I was like. Okay, like he is starting to and he's at a couple of easy. He made some great passes to wise man, that was necessary, something that was again his bag before this. Where he is starting to get in. Alternated into the warriors way of doing that doing things like the football has energy stuff and we ve seen some moments now, where he's given
if the ball and gotten him to actually dug in, like you know that in a dream on green is going to find him for these dogs- and you know like steph and klay- are going to create incredible gravity and he's going to get these opportunities, and he is starting to realize that as well. So I dunno, if he can necessarily then go and make for you know, forget all about dogs how this impacts adopts future. I don't know if you can just so, you can go and the like the law walked our legs. Incredibly communicative defender that dream on aids or she likes the passing of the dream is, but that is one part where he is starting to figure things out of I where's our unique case and this in this situation, because and indeed speaker to like their unique case because you know most teams that, like work that have an effective like thing that is working. That is, we think about, like the top teams in the Lee. They have stars that you have to contend with in and game plan for every single night in the warriors still have those guys.
I know they still have. They still have curry. You know they obviously pool has obviously come on the thing that made their success. Go is still sort of their aversion of that is and the question for the warriors. It is in terms of like long term, or you know any of these other teams. Can these young guys transition to the point where they are the thing that has to be game planned for because, right now you know commingle in wise men and moses moody and even pat baldwin. I, like those types of guys like if. they are in a situation where they are sort of the counter to like ok, the first wave has been stopped or like the first thing that causes gravity like staff were in clay and even pool like their shooting gravity, causes the cutting which causes like that. I'm trying to say is that, like coming and wise men are really necessarily the focal points of the office in. Can they transition into becoming? those types of players or is coming again.
Stay in the role where he's a responsive sort of like reverse the ball, make a quick pastor or be cut like in that dream, on role for four pool? I guess, just trying to figure out like what would it look like what it is It's been gonna have to like transition sort of into the looney role or because they're not gonna chain the way that they play. I guess it's gonna. What I'm getting not we're, not gonna, be see a team where or They will. What? What do you think? You think these guys? That's kind of the question, I guess at the end of the day is: do these guys just By a change in identity, or are they gonna have to kind of stay in system that the warriors had built, because It is a system You know to assume that it can. This continue. A little presumptuous. I dunno, Really good question that I A lot of these teams have to sort of wrecking wes. The warriors did last year was really smart. They
may Jordan for develop an away where he word like where he would serve the purposes the system but we also had an appetite for him, taking some excruciatingly bagshot and playing outside of what his rule should be enough. well, sir, it would eventually weeds hams, well understanding where the line is understanding. What's a good shot for him getting used to taking some of those like fuck, you three usa, that we love from Steph and that you know then actually allows them to sort of regenerate what steph gives them and moments when stuff's, not in the game as much as he is a system to him, a flag. It is short, in the extent to which, when you watch the warriors
and you know way, if I, if I'm watching the warriors, I'm kind of like farming, my kitchen and the angles not gray in the three goes up from from a little guy. I'm like is that your pores that steph curry, I'm not quite sure if the shot goes in them, like, I really don't know, so I think what they did was really smart and you out of he can strike a balance. You know because employers are still human at the end of the day, and they have they're coming in with their games. They're, probably coming in from situations where they're used to having the ball in their hands a lot in the n b. A for young players is all about adjusting to the reality that that's not necessarily going to be the case for you, especially if you're one of these players that's going to go on to a championship contending team ray, but at the same time I think, like the more space you give a player to you're able to explore some of the parts of the game that might be a little bit unruly. That might have might cost you a regular season game or two might not make you as efficient. You know it's
it could be the type of shots search drive, a coach crazier, the type of turnover is or just like a paste with too much english on it. Like all those things are, are the things that you kind of eventually have to source out of your game. But that's also where development happens. It's also like that's kind of like that beautiful space, where you will expand your game as well, and I think that's the fact that Steve Kerr had an appetite for that. I think really really helped the development jordan porn. I think it it'll probably go on and and help the development of the rest of these guys, but, like also like the other point like tactically speaking, you know when you I bought the warriors changing their style. I think just like the level of of of gravity that those guys are going to have in the paint like the worries have always said. The shuttle we want is a layup. Yet like we love the threes, but we want we want shots. We want dogs, we want. We want layups and
Those are the best shots in basketball. So I imagine that things will probably tilt more in that direction and perhaps you know open up the greatest shooter of all time, even more and the second greatest shooter of all time, even more, you know like practically. I think the answer could actually be be easier. those guys, but I would be curious, especially especially on the wise man, no because different for big man. island jordan, tool, perimeter players guy like time, tottered, hero tray on They are given a lot more rope to do some of the things that we've talked about, whereas with big man you there is this expectation that they develop and and the timeline for development was big men as we know develop. What is the question right? What do we always expect big men? What is it over and over again, I think this transitions to some of the other guys we would want to maybe talk about a little bit. Is what what do you in your experience? What do you hear? People say I want this from this person, this big guy or I want this. From that, that big guy, what is it typically
I regard such a puzzle for young big man, because that question to answer that question arranges saw mudge blake. they operate and is a perfect example of the us, you know I think when he was a number one pig at arizona. I think everybody was like wow is like this. This is lash the modern answer to to kg right like this is what people are saying. That is actually what people were saying, which is a a for. A shaky was expectation to put on a player will be also makes things confusing, because you get into the league, and like oh yeah. Ok, I'm gonna shoot these threes and, like I'm, gonna, try to defend all these positions and, like I'm, going to be this like proto perimeter player
big men who are like, I don't know, I think you're right. I think you're right, I think when they was coming in. If we see the inklings of those things, we assume that they're going to develop that that direction and for I haven't really necessarily happened. If you get into it, you start talking to your coaching staff and the coaching staff is like we want it. We want you to figure out how to set great screens and dive to the rim and hit a bunch of bunch of layups and work on her short, real short roll game and work on your floater and all this stuff when it becomes, I think it I imagine it can become confusing. Very young, big man and the other thing is reps as well right leg you can get into a situation, the n, a where there's expectation and where you know you do develop, but you might not necessarily get that opportunity because, like you're working in a framework, especially in a for a murder, oriented league and especially, if you're, trying to win where you are.
Expect it to do more of that dirty works. Yeah. I heard a great quote the other day that I told you about this from popeye jones who's, like a a developmental coach for with the I guess I believe now where he was talking about like if your full blown developing, that means you're losing in the NBA sites like extremely hard to like balance, that and then you can and that's compounded you can you start from that point of like ok, if you're, if you're a guard in the nba and you're trying to develop all the time we ve seen that looks like it's messy, it's very messy, and sometimes it's a tolerable messing up it's nice to know, You guys get in there, but if, if you're a guard on a good team, it's really hard and then, if you're, a big on a good team is even harder because possessions it it's a real cruel filter where it's like. Okay, and you made a good point there, where it's like. If it's a guard were like, okay, we'll put them in the g league for a little bit. You know who we do. The the doctor write the prescription for like four hundred pick and rolls go. They go tear it off, go to take it to the G league pharmacy, but if you're a big guy, it's really difficult
because, where your touch is coming from what what situation area and I think a lot of tat, it seems like we expect. We want the space. You know it's like. We want to jackson to become less of a hypothetical shooter. We want you to be able to pass quickly whenever you seek to cut those types of things. I was curious to know what is this a good separated. talk about miami. Do you think right here, because I think that one of the other people you know ayton is somebody I remember eight and had a drive in like the finals before we move onto them. He he took, I forget who he took off the dribble, but it was like a wing and he took somebody off the dribble and everybody was like holy. shit. Did you just see that in the end we need? We don't really see those things, but it's like it's really difficult to to develop those things I've noticed an like ban is another people of somebody in the offing, in tat rightly said that he wanted to up his attempts. You know this. Past year we were taught about attempts. Seven point three per game, riley city one simply take fifteen per game for somebody.
ban in that office not whore. we dissimilar from the way with the warriors do things where it's like. You know three point pressure causing cutting intervene, honourable hand, often stuff. Where would even come from four bam: where do we expect him to wear? Could he make an offer of leap that would help miami fifteen shots per games? Hear it? where are those coming from them is a really interesting one, because the question for me is it. This lack of attempts to attend an intentional thing from that he were. They want to prioritize perimeter shots. They want to cry its eyes like on the dribble hand off. Is it about get Bam open for the role or is it a bell? You know getting Jimmy or tyler or kyle open fur a or drive, and I think the way
it's manifested in miami has been very perimeter oriented. I think I think also to their demise as well. Like I look, I look at that. Boston series and look Boston had a lot of good defenders for bam like grant. Williams is strangely kind of always at his number on defense. Al Horford was great, but at the same time there were moments where I was like this guy is catching the ball and he's not even turning to look at the rim is that a directive from the team of like hey, we're, you're running these, Dribble hand offs, and you know, taking the short mid range jumper is, whereas you know when you read features about him or you know same thing with eight and two, it's all about. Like yeah he's expanding his range he's crafting his his three point. Shot he's practicing his mid. One mid range shot, but it's like. When do we actually see that in a game and when does a player get like, When did the get opportunities to read that oh and actually try to build their range, which takes time and it takes it, takes a lot of ugliness right like do. We have do. We have laid the the appetite for the four that from big man on end
The big question for my army, I think, is a big question from the sun to as well. I think I think in lucky. They it. I think the big reason recently loss both ears is, I paid their penal scoring, is just like not very consistent and not very strong and, like. I think it's something that you can really take away from them. So once they stop, you know being able. it literally the most inefficient shot in basketball. Then, like they're, going to be easy to beat, despite how well that works in the regular season ray- and I think, last year within he just had so many injuries that they weren't really able to. You know just develop come further, even though he did expand whose orphans of game, but it just wasn't necessarily enough fur the strident they need to make it, I think, doesn't want then I'll be looking for from boast. Both teams like do we actually get to that effect. He shot marquess with them, and how does that impact the efficiency of your office? Does it make like? How does it actually make it more versatile, which is something I think the word forbidden, a better job of an enormous he I daddy's kind question for me, cause
This is a tricky thing about the two timelines, my army is aging at a rate which I'm not sure they can replace the productivity of bawler, the productivity of kind. Allow really wish and here oh, unless they make it meant to actually give those guys accuse and then those guys prove that they are worth that commitment, That's gonna. What riley was talking about the off season was just you know. He once more to weigh consists in with more concern and see from advice when he wanted more to weigh consistency from hero. You do need to earn it. Something else I was thinking about. Two is ban in eight and do have something in common? And this is just me as a people, watcher kind of opt observer from a distance years, they're both pretty like meek personalities. I guess your level of kind of primacy on your team in like your level of like sensuality, to what they do kind of like, because
seen. Towns grow offensively, like I pointed out a statue you about how much he's like his driving game has increased in the past five years. Since its like went from four drives for games to he's rookie year to eleven this year. The ball is in your hands. You can kind of justified, ban is sort of the input. The miami off it's a lot of times because they run the similar kind of split cut thing that, like the jazz ran in the nineties and the warriors run where you know you go to the elbow and then the shooters cut things like that. lot of bans, shots come from. Ok, the progressions have gone all the way through. Maybe it's late in the shot clock, I have like a shot from the elbow, but it's kind of like I wondered a if bam has ribbon enough, you know on that's that you were making the point that he like doesn't even look at the basket, allow the times because he's also playing on a team would like really strong, tough kind of personalities. You know I've known those kind of a parallel there too. I just don't I'm kind of wondering why
He has shown enough efficiency to justify, taking doubling, has shots, and I'm I'm just not sure where those are going to come, Maybe I pick or pick a I dunno. I think the hope is that if you do double shots, the efficiency would come with him gang more comfortable, we're taking the shah's she assuming you're swimming. The numbers aren't really telling us the story, it's more that, like his comfort level, will go up if they do increase. You assume, I thinking, hope, that's where this is hard gray, like, I think, that's it. That's why it's again like jazz impressive, that the warriors were just like willing to. Let fool do some of the things that he dead, because it's all the question, you don't know until you actually let the player figure it out for themselves and you have to be patient and you have to make room for and what you have to allow for the idea that it could be wrong. I think I think towns is actually like the perfect counter. Example here right look. He played on a really bad team for a number of years and just
to take whatever shot. He want and it also as a guy. That's like I got my twenty seven or eight, and I think that's kind of thus the attitude that I think that the heat and sons coaching staff have also tried to call and then do not have to count strings more than they count their points and to be ok with the times that they roll and don't get the ball back in to be ok with the fact that, like their therein if there's going to be far greater than what the stat sheet shows, because they're going to be able to do things on defense that that towns can't do intent like you need to trade for rudy gobert because of how much towns can't do those things right like it's his it's interesting because I mean towns also, like townsend, gets rewarded with with a supermax contract and we're asking we're still asking questions about. You know like inc. Ain't got a really pretty similar contract to taught bamba, and you know numbers wise. It's still, I mean all those guys got you know. So it's not it's no tragedy, but you kind of you start to see how this wing works.
Especially when it comes big man and anxious and beverages doesn't nasty. Surprise you that much when they don't want to through the glass at their asked to do. I think, like offensive primacy. Primacy is like something that may be it a little unreasonable for us to expect for guys that come into the league that don't I it I'm just trying to think back and I'm thinking about this totally on the fly. So, if I forget anybody in and on twitter, if you hit me up, I'm They forget somebody just think about guys, usually demonstrate those types of ball skills ahead of time. You know yoke, if you, I can watch him with a mega, be max use. I count on the ball, bringing it up stuff like that. You know. In b, showed things like that, I'm starting to think it a big guys who earns control. You know your has handled the ball. A whole lot be it is unreal. You talk about the different stream contracts, their towns a whole lot of that stuff before college and after college. Maybe it's just a kid:
I, like Ayton and Bam, are just like really good sub, all star players that are valuable. You know like the threshold of we, we talk about like all star, as if it's like this binary of like, if you're on one side of it you're great and you either side of it trump disrespect wow, you know now. Man like there are sold, also, like all star means it so hard to make it if so many players that are very valuable and you think that legally garlic towns are rewarded because he s Skill set that maybe it is unrealistic. Forest like expect a bam, to become nina, it's. It's really unreasonable for us to expect this type of creature. Yeah evolve into this type, a creature I think I should probably especially the case was Bam. I think like with with eight men in in junior high and high school, is, like you know, produced pretty much as early as he started playing basketball. It was like oh wow. This guy can handle the ball. He can he's, got incredible, touch and you're kind of just like okay, there's a lot of potential here
with bands early Bam was he had a ball but that was compared. What howard you like I think that this is much more like they have tried to find a way to make came into a modern, big man. That's a good point. Approximately every two hours. One pennsylvanian dies from drug overdose. These are after wives, mothers rather His grandparents, children and friends never know when you may come across someone experiencing an overdose. Every second counts- and you can save a life by administering the locks on learn how to get the locked zone by visiting p a dot, gov backslash opioids paid for with pennsylvania taxpayer dollars this It has brought you buy slack with slack bring all your people in tools together in one place. It's your digital age q, where you can increase had activity in it.
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I bought by jones and in denver, and I think that that's another team, where it's going to be really interesting to me, sue with Michael porter jr health is the biggest saying, but he is a player who yes was drafted at fourteenth, but was also a guy, you know, could have easily been the number one picking the draft if he had actually been healthy, like he has at level of talent but now it is on this team. Were he's gonna be ass, a kind of try to play the discreet thompson s rule of here to spot and yeah. Well, you're get some opportunities but like that is going to be based around yeah, ok, at the end of the day and he's another guy were watch him, sometimes in exotic, okay, cause he's he's into it: keys, the plane around your goods.
he's spotting up. He is cutting and he is incredibly long and talented, and he just fits really well in that system, but it can really work, and then there are other times where it's like food. I was very shy so, like almost, I feel like that jaw. You know so that's another one I'll be monitoring, yeah, porter, a big lives in that space. You talked about. You talked about jordan Poole, and I I think that like, porter is, is one of those guys that you gonna have to live that in those margins of a little louder, control, because his audacity is sort of one of his big weapons and a lot of those guys like that. It's like porters fearlessness. I hope he never loses it honestly, like you know, I'd it, because it it can. One Since it I don't know, I want once you lose that it's hard to go back, but if you think about the guys in the media that are alter confident they can attain to stay. That way. Border is one of those guys that, like a key said, he incredible catch enshiu player. I think the clay thing it is is an interesting thing.
But I think he's audacity is one of the biggest weapons that he has honestly. Yet, that's it that's a really good point, and you know I think, the more that you nurture. That was then him like a just like it just makes the denver. and not much better, and I think you can also use these things as well as a motivator. If, okay, if you want to get on the floor and get the shots Then you're also gonna have to learn or or defensive system as well. You're gonna have to rotate and you're gonna have to leg just like the much the bonnet and which is another thing I think like you know, there are limitations with him, but that he is also a kind of that seems like he's done or is trying to do Porter, shooting numbers are pretty wild on catch and shoot threes. Last year, forty five point: one percent on unguarded catch and shoot threes. He was fifty five point, two percent from three and for a guy that's all that is put your brain in a blender at level efficiency, so I mean he just really hear a yeah. He is. He is a money
shot, maker and and really casualties. I saw no, you it really stupid because he elevates to any has issued that over over there. Had released point yeah trains against any issues. A trainer was our staff. You right here Jeff. Was there anything else on bones? You think bones just needs to come in hers. It is that a is there any other guy on the nuggets there. You think it's pretty much in PJ and then bones is sort of I on the on the nugget get bones is like I like the role they put him in right now. Where he's legs he's a point guard, but a smith is always is also on the floor, so bones can just focus on being like this just destructive. sort of like I'm going to keep driving to the rim over and over again and like I'm, just going to wear you out and talk shit and flaxen and all that fun stuff though yeah yeah, I it's the same kind of thing: those dimmers in a fund situation where they can let those fires rage within within reason, and let them be wild or is it not gonna beat
image, small market so like. If, but when things happen there, it just doesn't matter much either like you can kind of make it work through the wrinkles in a way that you know something's other teams, it's a little bit harder for a chill place. Like we said last week, yeah super too. Is there get which gave her you must excited about for tonight. Did you have a match up to cheer likely you get the popcorn pop and yeah, six, the sixers celtics, that's accepting the one for me, a butcher, you I'd say so either. I think I'm really curious, but sixers we did a sit, a survey on the ringer arm about like an m b, a entrance survey and there's a lot of calls. finance it. I've seen throughout the nba, like media landscape in james harden, and I dont We know why that's happening. This is like charlie brown kick in the football territory for me out. I don't really know why people are assuming that this use different, maybe I'm wrong, but we'll see When I guess he does look, argues in better shape rights, muscle watch, baby laxative agrees, and I also think that I can go back. Some magic way is shameful. It doesn't have to be like your pop
four and you're gonna lie on him all the time. Maybe that's the reason why I also I've had it with you. I dont understand all this optimism about Philly. There really sounds it. I really like they're off season. I super high on maxie and beat them need, but I really I need to see it and it's like not even the reduces and they can be the number one seed. I still allay the I need to in the finals you know like. I don't think that I will believe the sixers can win a championship until they actually win the championship. So on with the recovered clock, he has over five seconds left you'll still be sitting there. You know stroke you must think we are going to. We do need to see it and harden harden. That's going to be a laugh, a long game conversation with him so but I'm kind of I'm kind of with you I'd love to see in you know, when you watch old footage of harden, it's incredible to watch him runaway around and run off the ball, but
anyway, will see excited for the season very excited to measure? Thank you, kyle. Thank you. Producing crops, I'm really excited to talk to you after we. You know some of these games story and we actually have some stuff to talk about. Basketball is back baby chrome, guys say that right, yes, yes, yes, that hurt, should not everyone will be transmitted to the letter.
Transcript generated on 2022-11-06.