Seerat and Kyle get together to share their reactions and examine the cognitive dissonance around the Draymond Green punch. They discuss the ramifications it may have on the Warriors, and the misconceptions fans have about aggressive incidents between professional athletes, while also touching on the importance of having an emotional instigator on your squad. They then talk about other players who exhibit Draymond-esque characteristics and name some teams, including the Nuggets and the Jazz, who could use that type of spicy energy.(19:12) Finally, they share some personal anecdotes involving heated emotions on the basketball court.(46:20)
Hosts: Seerat Sohi and J. Kyle Mann
Production Supervision: Conor Nevins
Associate Producer: Chris Sutton
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This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
The time has come to get ready for the twenty twenty two world cup and what better way to prepare them by revisiting the world cops. Most amazing goes: I'm Brian phillips, I'm making a pod cast about the history of the men's world common told through the stories of twenty two iconic conic goals shows called twenty two goals out now and the ringer podcast network and we're having so much time,
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welcome to another. Since the answer we have common man friend Michel. Looking
instigator, you're mine, I know it, I can. I can see him
front of misuse. Just wearing what looks like the confused hurry.
time and saw friendly eyes, and this nice beard and, like you know you guys all here as boys, emphasis on soft, very soft friendly,
the beer deleting all your favorite basle obedience and I'm sure seems like a nice guy in the world, but you you know I just as they were just jump right into this right, so where europe is the largest countries, anyone suggested you today. No one has like step to me today. I mean she should we say in front of me.
I don't want like jump into this as if there's no precedent for why you know right or no reason, because we were gonna talk about like aggression today right so I
it's all right away. I think that I should say this about. You know, sir, and I met for the first time and allay has been like a month ago now, right
Exactly a so we meet more talk in and when one of that one of the conversation things that I told over dinner was people I think generally- and this is people are meeting that are meeting
me and my thirties are kind of like cows really mellow, like that's generally, what I get from the even keel dude, you know just laid back whatever I'm wearing a drug reg.
god's sakes right. So I wouldn't call that was a you know. Some people gone drug drugs bauhaus joking name anyway. So
yeah. I was telling you guys stories about. You know we're talking about playing basketball because that's still a big part of my life always has been never really stopped like. I still you know, I'm always playing. I love to play, love it love it love it. But the thing about me that people never expect is
that I am an aggressive person on the court,
and I have I've had times in my life, where I have been very confrontational,
I like to win. If I feel like people are screwing up, I might you know say some
Then I like to pick people to battle with, like that too. Like say, I'm gonna set out to like compete with you, but
first thing that I told them was a story about somebody saying that I was some guy like switched on me like basically
implying, like oh you're, older, I'm going to take a break this dude, who was like a younger guy, and I took that really personally and just went after him. He caught me poppy and I got really mad. He called me he said, what's up hoppy, he said what's up poppy and I was like
about a bury this mother. Fucker now went wild so anyway, that's why we had he wanted it, I'm not a great player, but I'm ok player. But where do you want me to launch into the russian mike snoring? And may I say that for a little bit later right now, I just you know, I think it's in this. I eat you set it up.
because we're going to talk about dream on green today, I dont think that there is
body at the ringer who is better suited to to get into cycle.
of wandering mondrian and the general sort of the
the relationship between sports, the nba and aggression and physicality, and when-
one that line has overstepped men,
and you and this this is an interesting,
when an interesting story for it has been developing for
last week or so and run
spent too much time on, because you know I think
one is gonna talk about at this point, but one of the things that really stood out to me just like this is a hard won
for us the way people to try to calibrate in our own minds you now,
we once in a while. There is a story that happens and sports that kind of comes up against
a real life. Morality, let the morality of sports comes up against awaited me actually do things on a day to day basis, and that is that the zeppelin instead
What action will dream on green? I think when we all saw the video
a kind of the cognitive dissonance their eyes.
dinner of unites ago was talking to a warrior span and she asked
is really a question, and it was basically just why can't we seem to collect,
we decide whether or not this is a big deal like you have heard every single thing on spectrum. This has been very enlightening weak for me personally, just
as somebody who has never been in these types of situations, I've and probably actively actively runs from your address docker you can have. That was something we kind of bonded over a little bit cause. I save it. I save it for the core and save it for the court, but in life you know we're talking before the plot, like I'm, I'm a five six girl. If I tried to if I tried
action is still just like people, think it's adorable. They think it's like cool
it's like oh like what? What a? What an interesting surprise didn't your spicy. It was like. Oh it's like okay, like I'm. Never I'm never going to get punched in the face for for talking shit. You know what I mean. Have you ever come close, though, how close have you?
Ah, I've been nearly punched many times like like. I have had several that, like
I've had several situations like in this goes into kind of the reaction. I think that we we both I've kind of comically, observe from different walks of life, different the people who have been in these types of situations. I've been close to what to this situation. Pool was in many times.
and got out of it. But I was curious if you hadn't lot, probably not after junior high, and I definitely I got into some sites. I was a kid
and then I I smartened up a little bit, you know it's it's. It is you're right, it's it's one where it totally depends on your experience.
How you feel about it.
and be a world
there. Is this sort of thing right now. This is the biggest deal
the world steve per called it the biggest crisis, the warriors
but also like simultaneously in the four motions is try to act like it wasn't a big deal and that is a video never came out. They would have handled it internally, like
the company lines unawares, essentially as your site like this is unacceptable, but also we kind of accept it like this.
Were forced to reorganise shows, but we're not going to suspend him at the same time. So it's it's with a weird one. Obviously
If her has been in this situation to like is his practice, scuffle was Michael George,
which obviously it was not. You know it didn't didn't get weeks, but it's one that we have all you know talked about a lot. That's a
and it was also interesting to me- that there is also the subject of the n b- a and also the warriors and anchor actually going to bring it back to him and dream on. That, ah seems I don't want to equally as offended by the fact that the video leaked but
Pretty invented at the video a and it was, it was hard to telling her had a moment where he said he said no comment about something, and he was he's really
angry and then he had to cunning walk it back
new right away. That people would interpret
anger as being toward streamlined, but his anger was actually about two seconds video leaks, and I think that just comes down to the fact that leg there are different rules and sports because differ
things win in sports ray and that's, ultimately, what this comes down to infer for the for the players in the coach, his right leg having things week out of her practice, is bad for
the teams like the word, trust has been has been using both, but both these scenarios, but it seems like the league, is a bigger breach of trust than draymond. You in a fist connecting
without with paused john right leg, those that something that we see happening
words are the people who work in professional sport see happening sports bush. Oh, that's interesting meeting is pretty unprecedented so like that,
seems to be way more surprised about that. Then there is the bow of the punch itself. Bright
it's in it seems I was thinking back about you. May the comment about her and in the end, the jordan fight in it's funny said that it in
but I'm a minimal will older than you, and I remember that story came out if I'm not mistaken, pretty quickly after it happened. Like I mean, I feel that we can
just speaks to how a video sure sure sure if there is video of it, there would be different between we knew it happened, nobody denied it happen and it's interesting how the world has kind of changed since then. You know I mean that was in ninety ninety seven, ninety ninety six and we have moved towards this world of
trying to be more vigilant about policing. You know these two
if the wrongs that kind of slid by in the past- and we would say, do the boys will be boys thing and just kind of laugh it off and and move along with him
Ask about does seem like a little bit of tension is permissible right like and we
no that work dream on is a specific case, and I think that you spoke to it. I think the reason
why this is the reason why its unacceptable, but still acceptable. Is that dream on just as leverage yea a he has a history with them. He some
body that gets away with more even on the court in his aggressiveness, in the way that he talks to people in the way that he talks to officials and the way that he talks back to steve car incur has the right temperament for that a lot of the time. But yet I think that he's at ease able to have that kind of leverage- and I think that's true- just across all walks of life like yours,
leverage really dictates your value to society, and this is like cruelly unfair and allow situations like people do terrible things in some situations, and we all
your value to us. They have leverage because we're like lonely kind of like what they do like prince, apparently was horrible. I've heard stories from people who, like new people, that worked from him for him behind the scenes and they were like prince, was a monster to the people that he worked. That worked for him and we all disconnect
man. I love. I love little red coral head man who want to hear it live. You know we can
overlook things depending on your side, elaborate right here. I want to hear about that
I told you about that. It's actually reminds me of a story that I know somebody who was working for for the raf's association was talking to me a couple of years ago about the different players at
his legs in different players or priests. Don't like. I also think that there is an end sports are respected.
Aggression over passiveaggressive best as well like passiveaggressive s, nationally pisses, most people off, but it really pisses people off in the sports world bank, where there is a need for direct nansen. Also, just there are
with cameras being pointed in all directions, but the first movies,
telling we was people like rats and people who, like work,
the refs referees association. Actually
dream on Algeria.
isn't a blanket perspective. This is maybe just his perspective and, and you know some of the people who talk to him, but they love draymond, because when he
on tv and he yelling at your leash. He
It is very clear that, like that's, what's happening right leg
isn't necessarily come out of that situation. Looking good, you might actually have some sympathy for the refs and you're going to look at that situation, and most fans are gonna. Look at that situation and say yeah almost,
we are spending like he needs.
I will be happy at the referees one,
employers they really don't like is Chris Paul. They feel like Chris Paul is always trying to show them up like you know that video that went viral a few years ago of of paul like fake laughing and then like just
turning the other way, it's mean mean yeah, that's a type of thing that they really don't like because its leg
you're, just gonna pull one over on us and look smarter than on national television and actions, not really cool rose another age.
for my edges reminded me of you just write me of that
it's. Ok, it's an interesting thank as like theirs it there's a level of directly is a dream on operates where slag a thing
We also think that alone and roger logan based they called it like the dream on
I should really like everyone kind of goes through it, where he might say something that you may not necessarily like that she's kind
if the tedious and at the end of the day, like you know the warriors, they love him. They say he has a heart of gold, so they also give him the benefit of the doubt. For that reason, but also thing
it's really really enjoy marge like a basketball,
Yes, yes, yes,
No! I don't know that's not why there's you spend it made. They don't need him further
cs, I frankly not understand what it means to spend him, but in a play offsetting if you will
the warriors roster right now they are much better situated to be able to replace
in a hurry, restoring pool
then they are. You know any anybody, tobacco dream on! That's a take right there, you think like them. So let's not, let's go to litigate. This gets it. I was going to ask you which, which ended the florida. You think he is like more like irreplaceable, like with which which ended the floor. You think is way more important for them cause he's important on, but people underestimate
both sides of the ball is really important that we use injured in radiation
last year. It like that often did not look good, it was it was distorted. By the same time, I think that a team was deaf, curry, edward pool and play tom said. As regards is going to figure it out on off. Answer could be different configuration it wouldn't be quit his beautiful other people would have to go into more play, making positions.
Under a great minds by making ability by any means. This is all just to say that on the defensive, then they badly need somebody like dream on like he is. He is a source of all of their fuel. You know I'm not as either
those guys aren't competitors, but the same time like they don't have another guy like him who is going to fire people up right, like this, is missing
so the thing that is like really beautiful about the warriors and and what has been up until this point made them
What are the best stories and sports in one of the most important themes, the most important gmo, actual team you know of of the past decade. Is that like they have, this
when it works. They have this really incredibly beautiful,
in an yang not just on the court but personnel,
it was in that locker room where you have guy, like staff who is like outside of your kitchen and probably the nicest most affable superstar in the league. You have
clay, who is just like incredibly than waged at all times re, all these guys are really super competitive though, but you rising manifested differently and I think dream on this is the driving
Absolutely it's kind of like. Do you ever watch inside out the the kids movie at the pixar movie? Yes, yes, I'm a parent of,
There are certain elements in this.
Personality. Is there not respected, not his legs, but I think the pointed out
we'll be at the end, was a new kind of you in order to like
demise, as it here
and being and also as a team. You need to have every single element and any need to see the value and everything
all right, that's what the warriors of kind of always done their best. They don't
really swept the small stuff when it comes
to this is the thing that makes a guy who he is like clay. Thomson is ever gonna hear something about how there's a shot that hatred.
we tagging and there's like four curry. There's no such thing as a bad shop
and he has like he has its game, but that can go from wegg laissez faire.
two reckless, but it also makes a
as part of who they are and then with dream on you have this, this incredible fire that also can devolve into recklessness as well.
all care deeply and they all kind of understand each other's humor.
Finally, in a way right- and that's that's aloud-
to be an actual chamber.
Really long time now. I don't know
this goes from here by actions,
say they need him, and this sort of fearlessness aggression
might just the physicality is a really fundamental part of spain
it's just a matter of finding where the line is. Do you really hit on it? I think you're, like description of like the dynamics of an organization. I mean part of them.
way of inside out was like that, like they come to realise that, like oh sadness, doesn't need.
Run. The show, but sadness is an important balance or anger is okay in certain situations, and I think you are really hitting on something here that maybe I am realizing in the moment is a really good point that, like
the warriors: do balance those things really well and the fact that they do play close to the fire you're, absolutely right about, like staff, does walk a tightrope between chaos and like discipline in like profound discipline and skill, and then you think
and the comparison that I may be you earlier we were talking was just at like I've, I've,
This thought about like great teams in the past, and maybe they are just like the latest great adoration of this. We ve seen team
in the past, that I was running down historically, like championship teams in the past, you know dream funds already been on. A few like
be. Portas was a guy that I pointed to who seemed like. I always seemed a little teetering on the verge of out of control, run our test, I think, having our now
could walk the line. Awad he's probably personality, was the most
similar to dream on, but the comparison I made was dislike in a house. You have a pilot light in a furnace you of this little light that
like you want. It needs to be in that spot and it's ok for that to burn and it can heat the whole house. But if the pilot light is too big or its not in inside the furnace, it could very well burn the house down. So it's like it's important to have
but I think you can have one guy like dream on. I don't know if you can have more than that that something then I guess you could organization. We cannot ask a coach but yeah. I think that that's really good point about like the way. The balance of the way that org
zation runs right. I love. I love that analogy, because if you think about the other end of the house, without a furnace at all
all right, let's
your friends freeze and work
It's ok, we're going to talk about some of these teams that that could use a little bit more fire after the break tip policy,
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I was just so. I just got and spend a little bit of time in ontario away or ontario california, which
Actually one of the nuggets players confused for ontario,
Canada, which makes perfect sense in its general murder, using no position against
we're gonna geographers egg, but I've got to spend some time ago
where and what wondering thing they really.
About their team last season is that they just completely like they didn't have enough physicality, they didn't have enough. Fastness didn't have enough size. I found the denver
these last year was not really about making the championship running. It was about five trying to find a silver lining in the dry injury that then turn into a season that was completely about survival and they then have
the markets, tarzan too, it was nice and that he should seamlessly into the offence but didn't really provide a law on defence. Her forever perfectly later, he was a good
player from situation they were in Joe, I mean without flaw.
Yeah, I think, he's being blackballed unfairly by the n b, a the most skilled big in the world, and it's just it's like my toe. It's my token thing I have to do sorry. Go ahead. Continue with your thought. Our lack of thousands. Do you is that a serious, quite yeah? I got a black color. I mean like he's like he's, got some style she's dealing with some criminal trial, or, I think, maybe that's over by the yeah yeah. Maybe I should back off of supporting him, so I dunno
what will we have to re? Evaluate me? Also, the staff scary thing on my back. You often because maybe I should re evaluate antonov great player, though my dogs names bogey anyway, I've got real. Please continue with you thought there aren't. You means building boogie, not boogie, but
buggy yeah cause your cousin.
and one day I'll, learn how to pronounce louisville as well we'll work on it will work on a look at their will. The
four hours, danbury and others, the team of them,
re evaluated in this off season tried to kind of reality, and this is what they always been trying to do. Find the right balance around your courage, and just
the incredible orphans and he could save this- isn't offers its never really gonna have issues, but there they are kind of similar to the warriors. Not they need a counterbalance for that, so they sign bruce brown design can davy is called whirlpool
This idea under adored jamal, when you know is he is he worked his way back from the asia is definitely one of their more fiery players inch
looked to me, like a regime that has now sort of sound or
it'll, be maybe on their way to finding that balance. They have the ingredients they're not quite there, yet we haven't seen too much of them in the preseason but they're a team that I'm going to be paying close attention to and close attention to that aspect of it. But one of the things that I found interesting was at it.
Seems like, while they want to get tougher, they are still trying to strike a balance and-
tina identity of sort of niceness, said David
over the last few years the Denver has become a place. I think nba players look at it in there.
while this is actually pretty pleasant. There are thirty. Three hundred days
son a year, I can golf all the time and everyone
in the city is just incredibly friendly and the team is
and being yoke inches, just like the one that the best superstars that you could play alongside and there's just a good vibe there everybody wants to live in Denver right. I mean it's like you visit
You don't believe. I do not think that goes beyond mere ba players. It's just like it's a just a chill place and
once you get there, you don't want to go into the sitting, credible food and drink out there and Marty supplies etc. You know, will leave it at that, but yeah everybody wants to live with.
I live in denver who doesn't want to listen to it right, so they they have this, and that one of the things that I'm going to be really curious to follow is that while they have added toughness,
since a team was allotted, asshole energy. You know what I mean
and like you were saying that lists that you pulled up there with a head Bobby ford is on a you know, last year's finals, where the
so then the warriors celtics of funding of guys you can kind of fallen to that. That category, I think, like
not necessarily assholes but like just instigators, people who cannot resolve the other side, rich, marcus
alright. You mentioned Bobby Portis in a you. Also you on your list. You had you know for twenty twenty you had rondo and and Markieff morris as well. Ah, and I'm I'm going to be curious to watch the nuggets and see how far they can get being a tough my trying to be.
Tough minded defensive team that doesn't necessarily have that extra edge
and you didn't want island is kind of like he is
a spicy dude. Like he's really talkative really competitive like he loves the talk shipment awry watching cracks me up,
are you seems, like somebody, but it almost seems like if you're going to have that type of presence on the team it works best if it's coming from a position of influence like that
areas, kind of naturally already in a leadership position like I know I said rondo, but you know he was rondo gets respect from other players in the league, but I I dunno, do you think? Do you agree or disagree with that that it probably should come from somebody like it can't just be like Jonas powers, the box in his competition like Jonas, is a huge competitor like any in his drive is like other world.
I guess, isn't it. I guess it doesn't need to follow the same script every single time right. It doesn't necessarily, but I hear what you're saying you almost want it to be somebody who you can't immediately discredit at at the same time right like you're, an n b, a player like there's, there's a level at which you can be like since VON th. You know, but at the same time,
I've gone silent can use it to their advantage as well, because when someone that you don't know,
he's doing man there's like almost like a person, think they are so
thing that can also get under scale as well. I think
Can you find of saw that in the early in going illegally
we may gangs of song of like the classic sort of instigators. Rightly,
and Joakim Noah is somebody who just came to mind because somebody who actually like really pissed off his own, better and teammates in his rookie year and pissed off the entire league, because they're like who is this dude, and why does he think he can act this way? If you don't actually listen, if you don't let that part of it get to you and you
continue to be that way, maybe maybe it works. Maybe it works out.
It's a little skeptical of bones like that. Bones is also a a I asked. I asked to something in denver about this and broke voters who was
and brought up to me as a counter it, I just don't I don't
I'm curious, I'm curious and see where he was brought up as the counter to what exactly to the argument that there are no hassles aged lady, insecure busy. So maybe it's a point for lack of an issue of improving himself. Like you said, maybe this area is a big break out year and people like ok, like Patrick beverly. He gets the kind of behaviour the way he does because he has established. He keeps getting contracts because he somebody that
some deviants evaluing he's somebody, that's gonna been poured in two different situations. I guess how difficult is it to import that? That's that's the question, because it
money comes in today. Everybody knows everybody, it's not like it's compartmentalized, as does it wasn't like the seventies. Eighty, nine, these all these players know each other because they intermingle and grew
to get, and things like that. I guess I wonder it like it is it? Can you import that to a team that needs it or york in its new, no self destruct? If you try
I mean Patrick beverly is a great example of that. That beverly is almost like a literal spark plug, like you actually jesse plugin,
I see if it gets the job. I don't know anything about what clothes work, but I think I think, like the clippers run and the and the
John or both really instructed on with the collaboration
He was an instrumental peace and get it
a team that problem we shouldn't have had any business being close to play off and getting them to be competitive, getting them to be praised for getting them to care about my decent.
Like he was a really good piece.
regards, but then when quite and Paul George,
may, I first saw a kind of undermining his leadership position as welsh and he's asking these questions that, in our fear, questions were unanimously
also ask if superstar is like hey, why did he get to do all these things differently and, and we don't write, that's to the leverage thing there yeah exactly it's not necessarily fair, but it's how sports works and
I would call george inquire Leonard arrived. The entire shape of the organization is going to change, ray and patrick beverly, as somebody who is it
What's he it was who, if it feels
kind of channel that frustration in turin and created not necessarily created, save me, things are necessarily
pension or just gonna help you preside
job together. There was a fact that created the sense of you know. There are factions in the current resort, locker room because it
spokesman in a guy like beverly
It can be really important. I think a guy like rondeau has has done that well with with young players in certain instances
and there is also the case of wine. He was with with the chicago bulls.
He became my sort of the shepherd of of the jangada we're just kind of just a butler and wait for it,
for calling out there their lack of defensive effort, which, by the way totally was real. It's it's interesting.
Excrement, minnesota was just for a little while ago do and they didn't bring pattered remilly back last season. Beverly was
very very important to the wolves culture last year, and they couldn't stop breathing about how important we was like he was a. I would seem like Anthony edwards. Basically, just like you just followed mostly like why what
regrettably was saying, and he and then pat also was just a guy who was willing to descend the young players on the cheap,
I meant he really is standing up for a team that is essentially like if you look at chat like and and Russell two and on some extent to some extent, like players who have been criticized for for being soft. In the past rate. I think I think he
and I think the truth is that I think you have really good for them and in sort of just holding them accountable on defence
an ant needed that an aunt has struggle with that at lower levels that, like he, was a little lot lena like like a days ago about defence of effort. He would check in and take out
consistently learning how to play hard at huge for somebody like him,
Absolutely absolutely. I think like as a rookie, you probably like any rookie bow. You know, especially especially somebody like him, that's a great point, but they didn't bring it back. They didn't bring him back and I kind of like part of me sort of
hundreds if there is an intention to reality to the two or just like that. Maybe we are seeing him as more
less expendable, maybe than they are in know that were thinking. Maybe they don't see the exact same way.
They obviously daily on the core re like just like what he brings distant
the wage and Earl sure I mean I'm in the course of us from the outside. Talking about this, maybe we're over rating a little bit his impact on them. But, like you said the boy, maybe days or maybe they thought that, like the lesson was learned
It was fine to move on. I think I think that's kind of that's kind of where it is. I think they can be overrated his impact all by themselves like they, they loved reading him, his impact all season right and it's like after the lesson is learned: where does a guy, like patrick beverley, necessarily go it's kind of like some of these coaches that wear out their welcome right, like a tom, thibodeau type of coach is kind of historical. You kind of
well, if it's going to be great for two or three years and then after awhile, the players just started kind of tuning him out. I dunno, if that was necessarily the case in minnesota, but that's kind of like the sense I got of like you know. How long can you necessarily keep a
they came around, especially they have is defensive, infusion coming in with with reading gilbert,
who, I think will be a very interesting replacement. He is apparently just like you
it- was kind of described to me as somebody who has been doing a good job of holding the team accountable on defense, while also
having a manner of speaking that was still much more affable. Now I don't know if you're a few playfully
wait for the EU jazz in the last few years. You might disagree with accurate deregulation of things, but that just kind of get goes back to what essentially this whole conversations about is like this. This pushing pole,
single defensive anchors, also
especially when there are young players on a team when it's not necessarily a foot like a totally bet veteran group that will kind of always you know, take it upon themselves to be prideful on on defense.
they can't just be the guy on the court. That's that's talking and you know cleaning things up it also the only kind of
Some situations. I think this is the situation we dream on. I think it became the situation was go bear where the onus is also on them to become almost like an impromptu defensive coordinator,
for the team as well, where it's also their job to cholera. Things in film session SU.
Make sure that it over those perimeter players aren't taking too many plays often that that's where it seem like there is tension in
in the jazz locker room with gold bear, but also kind of
attention. That is that it is necessary for four, when I think that the key players, social impact, can obviously shift a lot from from environment to environment. You ve done with a jazz, beat me no tired of of that or maybe they were dismissed. Maybe there I'm sure there are a lot of other things gonna baked into that. I always think about, like Chris Paul his dynamic with his teammates over the years,
just year. They stories about him. You told the story about like them, resist resenting in showing them up different, obviously, but
I think about the way he was kind of a has had a reputation for being kind of domineering with it with his with his peers, and it would kind of wear people out. You would hear stories about people just getting sick of it. You know everybody has immense respect for his knowledge and things like that.
but like sometimes a guy can be at a certain point in their career and the thing that war, their peers out, is actually going to work for further for a younger group of players, I think to pat bad thing is interesting. I think the c p three in phoenix thing has been very interesting because suddenly he moves into this talking about it
that- and I think we should be careful- we're talking- we're we're sort of lauding this this fire in this thing and we're talking about
I don't. I want to be careful that it that it's not like hey every team needs a dream on. That's going to be willing to punch somebody in the face. It's like it, isn't like such a like perilous thing to to navigate having somebody that burns that hot I'm sure Chris Paul's gotten in tons of arguments and practice, and things like,
in like, but but it is interesting how, when you re, contextual lies in what the younger team they were,
willing to listen to him. They treat the respected him they were bought in and it really made a big profound impact on an organization, yet it
let's not get, why I think legs, while dreamers punches essential
the shadow side of what is a sort of
sorry characteristic? Ah sir, not silly, every teammates have a guy like dream on, but I think every championship team definite
needs to have a sense of accountability in an edge and in allowing the critical point. That's really interesting because
one thing that I'm gonna be really curious. You see going forward.
It was the warriors is if dream on is actually able to be that voice, I'm going forward,
I know that right now, they're talking about how he has to basically just re, earned the trust that change within the period
one in the warriors get off to a lackadaisical defensive
you- I think in the past- the past really well for dream on dray, just its essentially the same characteristic that it seems. That seems like the reason that they give him
benefit of the doubt beyond his value on the court has just said. This is a guy who has been able to make up, for it is a guy who wants to do good? Who genuinely does care about his teammates
she has done a lie in not like that that punch, basically, as I think, kind of terrorism tears at the fabric a little bit there and a boy. I guess maybe it's as I'm I'm curious to see if it does terror that fabric and then, if he is able to be the guy, who calls people out on
yeah and you just need you need to know the bad guy cares about you read or you need something
I think that was that was a thing. That's allowed dream on keepers to kind of persistent and continue to be that voice in vietnam and the warriors
groom without really necessarily like wearing himself out too much. I think like
like my come alone. He's been the denver code for seven years and for seven years he has been these sort of loudest most imprisoned for his eye, which is really rare for a further direct right, but he managed to survive because I think he's players knowledge. He cares about them too. So it's that'll be some israeli and
the thing gotta see going forward with his warriors season yeah, and you would think it you.
talking about how sports are sort of. We always expect sports to be like an exact microcosm of how the railway
what is in, and you know whether the opposite, rightly or wrongly. It's just now,
in an exit, exports and away simulates confrontation. You could go down a hundred paths about why we as human beings seat that out and get enjoyment
from that are like why. Why do I enjoy be like playing conversation in, but then it should be.
and as soon as you know what I mean and like it, we should simulate this competitiveness. We walk away we're fine most people you know are like that.
It's like dream on somebody that this is the first time that
His personality has cost the warriors dearly. So if it happens again I mean Kevin durant was probably going to leave either way. I would I wouldn't say, and I've yeah I wouldn't say that's like the worst time, but
You know him him losing his call on the finals like its head, dire kind of consequences, this
pension and in two thousand sixteen as a big, while the two thousand
Jeanne wine, especially with the fact that he got suspended afterwards. I of look back and unlike man was, I was at a little bit overblown
near oil. We can get into some of the teams are now. I think that really need some
sometime or knock him and they don t fire. They don't need punches in the face and put in practice, but they need fire.
russia have sister and about their lorries and fire, maybe their needs and patrick. Ever really. Maybe you know
I dunno who were the other guys in the league that you can kind of plug and play? Maybe they need some pj, tucker energy, sure sure and man like last year's nets, were the
steamer came to my office because without the interesting interesting, so you so you think that their situation would have been. How do you think it would have been different if they had had an enforcer type?
while you're out there, maybe a zach randolph. If forty different reasons sure nets were bad last year, but I think if we actually, Let'S- let's not look at just last year- let's look at the nets in totality since, like that, since Kevin durant,
we are being achieved up there. There a team has incredible, often short firepower and just like gets really really really like. It is along on the defensive banned in ways that are just borderline, unacceptable, like be the amount of time that a team takes the ball out of the basket and gets away
upon the nets is just like it. It is just so oppression honestly, I think
We need somebody and they needed somebody who would yell at them for that right, like carolina or I might not like that, draymond green was was yelling in his face and also like in fairness to Katie. I think I don't think that like if you were going to talk about their defensive problems, he is probably not very
on that list, especially at his big age, but at the same time like they just didn't, have anybody that seem like
was concerned or alarmed about how lackadaisical they were on the defensive edge for pretty much this
entire nets tenure it's been lagging
figuring out what fear,
and then they just don't really figure it out, and it seems I mean durant can run a little hot. Maybe that's why he and draymond specifically clash. So much because NASH is more of the cur hang back zin quiet sort of from the Phil jackson's school
well, of course, ger, on the other hand, can be really fiery. We've seen that do he's kind of both ends of the spectrum, but he chooses to be a little more calm and cautious. Most of the time it seems like
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Another one that you had written down here, that that was interesting was the hawks. What what do you think it would do for the hawks to have like a fiery whose most fiery guy they ve had? Honestly, I don't know that they have. They had a mean, probably trade,
sort of a different way and ask you to say not not in that way I mean, I would say, a sort of the leader of the defence is probably think capella. The clink capella is like a very soft spoken patient, introspective, like guy who thinks about all sides. Have things table.
guy. I think he's a girl, locker room leader in indifference, ass. It's almost may be providing the type of thing which that staff curry provides the warriors were. He can kind
I understand a lot of different perspectives and try to sort of bring them together. You can understand why somebody like John Collins has been in the John Paul's visit
in his career. Just like catching loves. You can understand why somebody like that's what more shots, but also to understand why
We, like that's gonna, need stood, needs, defer. Armies played a lot.
A lot of superstar, as he knows what it's like, the one is in one is a triumphal runs everything on the team, but she is not necessarily like you can try to get get get the locker room fired up, and I think that they don't know
it's like they can. You beg you, use badgered beverly the season also,
Well, obviously, last year, last year's lakers right in some of sounds like you're not going to get you're, not going to add patrick
ITALY or somebody like champion, and all of a sudden, all your all your bad offensive person house becomes good, but it can just get people to care. You can get like most of the team to carry ten percent more
like the hawks last year, which is the failure to launch situation. They couldn't put together a good forty. Eight minutes are incredibly
talented team that was definitely more serious for the offence, a band of the game, but currently do
events, but just didn't, because it didn't really have a lot of players who really just hung their hats on it. You know what I mean yeah and they have guys that have kind of been in and out of the lineup, and I think guys, I actually think a kong. We could eventually become a great defensive anchor for them. Like probably even better than clint capela honest, if I'm being honest, I mean
a lot of respect for gabel, but more modern kong yeah and I I think, deandre hunter, staying healthy and and b and growing as a player is going to make a big, a big difference for them too, and I guess he let yeah like just influencing superstars who need it. Like you said it is important.
Also there is also teams that have a little too much about energy as well ray. I think, like you're, going back to the wall, they were
Even I don't want to put this on pad by any means. They were very young team. They are a fiery team and they had they had. They had a young coach as well, and they they were just really really tight knit, and you get your answer.
Edwards. Just has like this. This really interesting, fuck, you energy as well that I really like and their routine bad.
it's the wages they lost themselves, the playoffs against the grizzlies. I mean, I know that the grizzlies and and the wolves are basically just in that series being like really young and really fiery and just kind of beating. They were beating themselves
and beating each other at the same time like that was just an incredible series when it comes to just like mental mistakes when it comes to turnovers, there was the car corral towns gone into a ton of foul trouble. Jaren Jackson got into a ton of foul trouble with dillon brooks got into a ton of travel
Well, if they were both teams that you love to see that level of passion? You love to see that level of passion from the grizzlies, and you know like
They have it all the way up and down the core bright, far from starting from job just going all the way down
which is kind of what they've scouted for in a way like, probably accidentally that, but they have a certain personality type that they like and it all converge and created this team that is going to be incredibly promising for the next few years.
Calm, but they also need to find a way to balance out now, and I thought it was really fascinating that way,
I was also didn't bring back beverly.
They also leg call-
I understand from the grizzlies as well in anderson is one of them
what sort of wegg com balance player.
On that roster. So I'll be I'll, be I almost wonder I mean the go. Bear thing just adds a smart defender he sort of like bring skill set in and heaviness without the volatility, and it's not going to tip the volatility scales too much
yeah yeah, exactly those does I've been on this directly team for a few years now, while not anymore, is its team that I was on rousing. You had bitten and.
we're. Always you haven't fine like we wanted to do well, but like we can never really get it get out of white, the first, the first game of the playoffs, essentially rage, and there isn't one year where to
since the end of the season.
For some reason we just started getting a little spicy. For some reason we do started getting really spicy, though, if you took the teams talk to us and we talked of Wang men like just we found it.
but we really had before. As a team like we just started getting ship year, then we
normally words and then in the first
the aim of the next season in there was a full blown fistfight mad, I'm gonna say: was it? Wasn't our teams false
It was instigated by the other team, and then there were then so one guy from our team got thrown out and it's a coed team. It's a coed team and one guy from our team got thrown,
and one day from their team got thrown out the guy from
We wish our team, who got thrown out also like had a pregnant wife on the team, while she wasn't playing, but she came to watch the game that she was basically like man she'd. She came back like a trooper, but when he
when he was getting rim, thereby by the other guy she bought into it too, and I sense that, like
the guys on the other team does weren't used to being taught by one,
it's very interesting thing and then they they waited
sigh are. You kidding me for
now and then, when he did like they do
I started going at him. This is in canada. I didn't think they did that kind of stuff in canada. I thought you guys were a lot more chill than that were fake news
I saw. One of the guys in the other team push my teammate into the guy, the heat that he hadn't had the issue with. So it look legs. Both sides were like equally at fault, but luckily this was outside and there was camera footage
and the edmonton sport and social club. Somehow they were able to get the camera footage, but they were able to get a play by play of the camera footage which showed that he was
so we only lost him for like one game but set the tone for the rest of the sea.
or we lost them for a little. While I don't remember boy, we had him back to the playoffs sunday
We just set the tone for the rest of the season
it's like kind of informing. How I think about this because, like there is justice thing most of the time, I'm furniture like I'm, I'm a very level person, but if you piss me off then like some
just comes out of me and it's not something that I can self generates, and I don't think it's something that anybody on the team could sell
rage and, as a year went on, like you know, we started like losing sportsmanship points and like so we ve been. All these aspects should be also. Canada is poisoned, checkpoints, list of spirit wines,
and we would we would win these games, we're getting like no spirit points. So, even though we are winning like we had to cut a wait,
even to make make the play oscars like points actually cow which, like we, can we don't get into any san francisco, but they are just like sports really are just like
was more a sort of carnal pointed out there. The plans that we go to
release the attention of being civilized baron s near the place where I asshole. If you pass me often in it in a basketball game,
I want to see this, but I remember you said that
and I did pete. This would surprise people I think about syria. Is that
I was, I was telling one of the stories about getting disrespected
and I and I watched as our buddy rob Mahoney just started laughing and rolled his eyes. He was like, oh, my god, you're crazy and then sear it just totally
serious expressions here. It was just like yeah, that's what I would have to use all of the parties to it. He called you won't we would like, but exactly so sir, it is a mamma mentality person, so our it I wish we were. We were talking about how you know self generated. I am this person for this group that I've played with four like twelve thirteen years now on the engine. For this
So we are playing one time, there's this guy on I'll yeah I'll
would you, how would you define actually which which are and being aggressive? Are you I'm just I I get very I'm chill a lot of the time, but I'm always kind of looking for somebody, I'm looking for a reason to get motivated like a little slight. I'm looking like you said that I'll repeat it back to,
you know, I'm just kind of it. I'm a little bit of attracts talk yourself, there's this guy plan,
Russian guy, we got him shit MIKE definitely play back like a soccer player, so we get down around the basket get through this
Equally, he wrote ran his shoulder into my mouth knox, my front to doubt knox it out just clean time, really pissed off walkin around the court. You know it
to you, know: yadda yadda, he didn't seem to react. I go home,
weaver. I I believe we come back like two weeks later and he was not a regular play with our group, but he shows back up and were plain again and
I made some point about, like I had been really going at him that day like to that, so we'd been guarding each other, and I wanted to guard him. So I was just trying to make his life hell like I'd, eat it and score like nothing was going to happen for him we get to the end of it.
he was a man you really headed out for me today and I would like, as a gear was just after you not my teeth out a couple weeks ago
and he acted like he didn't remember that it happened. So he he looked at me like what are you talking about so that may be
it did. He did. He say anything just thought he just like why he was yeah. He acted like he didn't know what I was talking about. He was like what I don't and I was just in that just enrage me even more so I'm just
I'm just beside myself, because you are you're ghastly. Yes, I was for so I'm
areas like three or four years go by. I don't see this duty doesn't come back and play with us and I am still like it's not resolve, so he shows up
if you think about it at any point in those three or four years like you, don't want sometimes like you're, just like random thoughts come into your head, like did you ever just randomly just get pissed off about that guy,
if he would come up in conversation- and I wish it well because my front tooth is fake. I mean like he, he that happened, I'm living with that for the rest of my life and so he's like he like he kind of left the party he did. He took apart me, so goodbye so text thread. Rush mics come into play,
There are some facilities, the regulator this he shows up
I decide well ahead of time that today is going to be the worst day of his life. I, like decided I'd, decide ahead of time, I'm like he is going to.
a terrible time and and also I was going to try to score on him at every given opportunity and say something about it. So we play
I gonna I had like an incredible out of body great office of day and I'm goin adamant event.
every time I score, I'm like you have no chance guarding me, your you know, I'm just like talking all kinds of trash and then he finally discos. What's your problem, man that is in front of everyone as when I don't like you, I don't like the way you play.
I care, if you never come back like everybody was
that's our heart. I can get it's really situations and my friends were all dislike laughing, but it's like I'm
the dream on everybody's like well, everybody puts up with it, but you can have one person like me. I guess is the more the story. If you have more than one, it can just become kay
I don't know- or maybe you maybe you win a bunch of games and lose severe points like like syria,
come out. No, I haven't seen two years ago,
when his that brought him to the groups come back either. So maybe you could say a monster
let's not since he listened to the body may be. Hopefully that's not too shocking for the people to think I'm a chill nice guy, but yeah there's a there.
Like a symbiotic living in me that I can just become venom and bite somebody's head off. If you push me the right way
The story you go to meet its that's good, get to know get to now, all hopefully
Energy is continued, a balance each other out at a lovely to I'm talking to you today. How to members really found out right,
yeah yeah. I saw now like stage you guys can we co exist now, will see if we find honor. We won't edited out we're gonna, keep it in here. We're gonna, keep it in the programme
I. We will now be publishing on tuesday tuesdays. Looking forward to that little me
we action. So I will see you guys next, you thank you kyle! Thank you, crisper, producing thanks for answering
Transcript generated on 2022-10-14.