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the welcomes the true crime garage wherever you are, whenever you're doing, thanks for listening, I'm your hosts, nick and with me, as always, is a man that knows it life's the same moving and stereo, except for the shoes. He is the captain and we'll all be ok. As long as those shoes aren't velcro get to be seen and good to see you thanks for listening. Thanks for town, a friend

this week. We are very proud to be featuring focal banger by the alchemist garage grade. Four and five bottle caps focal bang is an american india pale ale, a b b, seven percent at alchemy, they show some real love your ip address and they brew focused on freshness. So you know you'll be drinking, a fresh, clean and delicious beer tall cans. The air france, and this too see, treat was brought to us by first up a big thank you to friend of the show rob out and would bury vermont a big shouts, christa up in north vancouver, british columbia and here's a cheers to megan and mills massachusetts. A big shouter, scotty G in the agro falls. Next we have ransacked and her awesome mother pam, that is in the parts that are unknown and

but not least, we have jordan w and lawrence Kansas. Everyone we just mentioned, went the true crime, garage dot com and contributed to this week's beer fund, and for that we think The term tourism parts- and I have no idea. Good luck, finding it on a map, it's always sixty nine and that is enough for the bees. Everybody gather around grab a chair, grandma beer. Let's talk some true crime a seventeen year old girl goes out with friends to a party, On a saturday night nearing- It was believed to be the end of her knife. She calls her parents. This is just a brief in simple call

saying she plans to be home soon, but something happened. Something went wrong She does not come home the next day, in the morning hours her body is found, The sight of a road Thirty miles away. She was strangled for any town. This would be a horrific crime would strike fear. Into the residents hearts, but for the akron ohio region, nineteen, eighty seven, this murder, caused extreme terror, panic and outrage. There are three strongly supported theories in this unsolved murder case each theory presenting its own level of disgust and outrage, but each also presenting a different terror threat level. The first theory,

Is someone close to the victim, attacked and killed the girl? The second maybe someone she only thought she knew for someone the fringes of her social circles is responsible. Thirdly, and certainly the most terrorizing theory, she was the victim of an undetected, serial killer, you see there is evidence to suggest that this murder, not a one off this murder could be just one in a string of murders of women in the area for women were found, murder and some account. The final eighteen weeks of nineteen, eighty seven. all of those murders to this day are still unsolved,

This is true, crammed iraq, and this is the case of barber, black nick the nineteen eighty seven summit county murders. Our future case takes place in december of nineteen. Eighty said barbara, blast. Nick was a fairly typical. Seventeen year old girl. She lived in garfield heights, Ohio This is on ban drive with her mom teresa, her dad John and her nineteen year old sister donna Barbie ass. She was called had feathered nineteen eighties style blonde hair and has described as you and bubbly her father described her as a free spirit who loved people, maybe too much. She loved heavy metal music, make up dancing baby sitting.

hanging out with her friends, of which she had a lot barbie sister Donna whom true crime garage spoke with at length in our research, The show describes her younger sister. Frankly, as a girl who, like to party she was known to drink, dabble in drugs smoke and basically live the party lifestyle. now we said she loved loud heavy metal, music captain one thing we have in common with barbie and anyone who listens or other show off. The record knows this: one of her favorite bands was a c d c. A barbie had a pack of girlfriends that was very tight and they all hung out with a bunch of neighbourhood guys at a bite shop. On one or road called motorcycle specialities where they would go to party. According to our sources. The bite shop owner light pretty girls around and would supply who's in part now Barbie had a boyfriend, his name was jerry and the two words

getting on and off for about a year from what we understand this was in a relationship that was likely to go down their traditional role of dating marriage and kids. Donna says her sister like boys and was known to data around never being exclusive with anyone. Barbie had been a trouble a few times and transferred high schools in january, leaving garfield heights high school in switching to eerie view, catholic where she was a junior according to her family. Although barbie was a handful, she had no enemies and, on the contrary, barbie had lots of free it was known as a fun scrappy. Bad ass girl anyway, barbie, set out on the afternoon of december nineteenth, which was a saturday with some friends to go to a party she dressed in genes, sweater jewelry and she had her calm money and six and her back pocket. As usual news,

labour reports at the time state that she left her home either around four p m or six thirty p m reports differ on this. Do we know why there is such a gap in time. If we have one paper reporting four p m in one reporting, six thirty p m: We don't know why there's a discrepancy in that time frame, but what we You know that she left with friends and they went to a party on tourney road which was about a mile and a half away from barbie's home. It's unclear what if this party was at someone's home or somewhere else, we don't know who hosted this gathering one. It's also hard, sometimes to define what actual quote unquote party his party could be eight people sitting around the house or one hundred people or a couple of teenage kids in somebody's backyard or at a park right now, newspaper

report stated and Donna confirmed this that far be called home some time after ten thirty p m this just to say that she would be home soon now, Barbie sister Donna tells us that this was very unusual. Barbie did not usually check in typically, she would go out with friends and she would come home or she would crash at someone's house. It wasn't uncommon for her to stay out all night sleeping. Out of france, it was uncommon for her to call home remember this is nineteen eighty seven, so this would also require her to find a landline to make that call who took the call her parents answered that call so, but can we definitively say that it's her? I mean, because I know with my parents if I were to cod stocks

they got off a school night or the weak and night and said hey, I'm gonna, and it was a quick call. I might be able to confuse them by Heaven of a friend I dont think anybody's disputing that it was barbie on the phone. But Spite that unusual call saying that she would be home, she didn't come home her, and went to bed and didn't worry the next morning. They ask that she was at a friend's barbies, mother and sister went out christmas shopping. Did, teresa donna know that, while the shopping two cops showed up at their house. John black nick was asked to go to the morgue in Cuyahoga falls. Barbie had been found.

We have been able to shed a little more light on the events of the last night of barbies life. This thanks to Donna and also from the justice for Barbara black nick website, run by a local armchair detective who wants to help bring closure to the black family. Here's what we found barbie met up with her good friend Michel, that afternoon, at a party at the bike shop on warner road. This is in addition to the party on tourney road. The barbie told her parents. She was going to if, in fact that was true are so she meets a, but their friend, Michel right. They're gonna go to the bike shop. That's where they normally hang out. Have these little parties little gatherings? Yes, when Michel meets up with barbie, it sounds like why of them is already at the bike shop on warner, road nora as this party, so the first time that Michel sees barbie according to Michel is

despite shop where they were known to hang out and party okay, so than they're gonna go to another party. Now, that's why think things are a little confusing here. So we have the statement that barbie tells her parents that she's going to a party on turning road ripe, my and then we have Michel who's going to add some detail, fill in some blanks of the time that bar He was gone that night and she saying that the first time that she sees barbie is at this party at the bike shop, a warner road, so indifferent party. So if, in fact, There was even a party on tourney road. The barbie was going to go to. She could have. gone to that party and then went to the bike shop afterwards. I think this is. The reason why we have some different things within that I'm line regarding when she left the house that day yeah. I think it's it's tricky too, because there are some people

when you're friends with people when you're younger they, you know you'd, be hanging out at your buddy's house and they'd just be saying: oh we're going to go to such and such house and we're going to go to somebody else's house, and it might because they know that the parents know the parents better, but you never end up going there Does it make sense? Well, the other thing to that we gotta keep in mind. As I dont know, one hundred percent win. This Barbara black nick website was created by the local arm chair detective but michel is supplying the armchair detective. With this statement of the timeline. For that, I of or what she knows of the timeline for that night, and this could be twenty years later are so we have a gathering at the bite shop. That's where barbie runs in her friend, Michel Michel, was barbie's friend, who had just had a baby in the two actually had seen each other in a while. Now, michelle,

also had another girlfriend with her, and they did eventually meet up with at least one other girl their names. Linda and sheila, the four of them partied at the bike shop, along with a bunch of other local teens, this bike shop a basement and the owner Jeff was known to man I'd booze an marijuana too, to attract teens too out there during the winter months, when they couldn't party outdoors, the girl party, therefore, while and then they laughed and Michel's car to go to a pub that served minors. This is on east seventy first street. barbie and her friends were known to hang out at pubs like this, where drinking rules weren't enforced and they were openly right and some people higher priority list in right now gone what by shipowners or supplying drugs for kids. To hang out bars serve under age people, because that, crack down on the lot more now back in the aid,

Even in the nineties, there was plenty of bars that you could go to cause. They had no customers, so there they were fine with serving under age, people right and they, I really feel like. It was in the early two, thousands at least in this area, which we are somewhat close to her area, maybe hour and a half to our drive, let's say: but in our area it wasn't until the early two thousands where they really crack down on that everybody either themselves or know somebody that had a bar that they could go into and get a couple drinks and be eighteen years old, let's say or nineteen years old at it. This way. Things get a little tricky, because now we know that their at the pub ok, but at tat thirty, when that call goes from Barbie to her parents,

not known where that call was placed. So that gets to be a bit of a difficult thing it could have been is something as simple as calling from a pay phone at that pub. But we don't have anybody else to tell us the barbie that they were present when she made that call. So anyway, we have the girls, they sat at a table in the pub chatting and drinking, they say that nothing seemed amidst according to Michel anyway, there No one who seemed strange or threatening at the pub are so we know that this call happened around ten thirty, but based on Michel's records. We don't know what time she left the bike shop, what time they got to the pub. So we don't know if this call came from the bike shop or why there at the pub

after the pub it would seem that it well? We do know what time they left the pub, so it would seem that this call would have had to have taken place if we are going off Michel's events of that night that the call would have had to take place at the either the pie or at the bite shop right because Michel goes on to say that the girls all of them, including barbie, state at the pub until closing time, which was three fifteen, a m at that time- michel drove barbie- HU, the intersection of warner, road and grand division avenue. This is near the bike shop. So if you look at the area on a map. You can see that it say residential neighbourhood, but warner has commercial businesses like convenience stores, automotive repair shops and so on. A barbie says

that she was going to jerry's house. Remember jerry is the boyfriend or the guy that she was seeing at the time jerry jerry thing obey. So this is fairly close to the place where Michel drops barbie off. He lived with his older brother bob and his parents in a house behind the ac delco otto parts store which was another place where the kids would meet up to party in the yard in the parking lot outside this, mostly in the summer time when it was warmer outside, ran, Michel and the other friend dropped barbie off. There then drove off and never saw or heard from her again the next morning, sunday december twentieth around ten twenty am barbers, nude and bruised body was found in a wooded area just off only,

road near the blossom. Music centre in Cuyahoga falls Ohio this is about thirty miles away from where barbara was last seen. Dat's canal, no nowhere air, if I remember correctly, yeah cuyahoga This is a totally different area of ohio in is a suburb of akron, where Barbara lived in garfield heights near Cleveland now initial reports confused things because they stated that army was found on the grounds of the blossom music centre. This is an outdoor concert venue. The kind of place where, like fifteen thousand people, can watch a concert. Now it's a pretty popular its popular in that area. Anyway, I saw radiohead their boots. Fantastic barbie in her friend, had been there in the past to see concerts, but she was nowhere near it on the night in question. It turns out

that she wasn't found on the grounds of blossom detectives corrected this on December. Twenty second, she was found near a wooded area. On the side of a nearby access road that would not have been heavily trafficked on a sunday morning in December, We don't know whether blossom would have been open in december, although it seems unlikely unless they had some kind of christmas holiday show. Some of these places have holiday light display and we do know that blossom in modern times has a halloween fright fast in october, Deborah law of these concerts, like we had germain amphitheatre here, which is somewhere to blossom, but blood this conference? Don't you remember them like closing down around midnight there weren't it wasn't like a bar show where you stay there till two o clock in them and I remember some of em closing at eleven p m yet because of noise ordinance

I am assuming that it was not open that night and probably not open. During the cold weeks of early winter, we have little details of how and by whom barbie was spotted. Newspaper report stated that it was an employee of K, s t oil and gas who spotted barbie's body as he drove along the road. The akron beacon journal and other papers reported that she was found about ten feet: north o neil road. Only a world has a strange orientation it in that it runs north and south, then curves sharply and runs east to west and then turns again into north and south barbara was found on the northern side of the east west portion, which falls between to other more unused roads

o neil road runs parallel to another road that abuts the Cuyahoga valley national recreation area. As for the person who found her, it doesn't seem bizarre that an oil and gas company worker would be out and about on that desolate stretch. of road, if he was on duty, perhaps even working near by what's horrifying, is that barbie's sister Donna tells us that when this person found barbie who had been dumped naked on the roadside like a piece of garbage, she was still alive. Barely

alive, and sadly that was not the case for long because even imagine being out, work come and crossed somebody that is losing their life yeah. Well, we do have some of this autopsy information because it was released to the newspapers at the time, so the summit county corner this is william Ache. Fox, perform the autopsy promptly after she was found. A preliminary report was released on Monday. The beacon journal quoted cox's statement in some broadcast interviews and what he said was very interesting. He said that barbie was killed in an unidentified place and her body was taken to where it was found just a couple of hours before it was discovered. So now we have the question.

How could he come to this conclusion? One thought I had is possibly since she was still breed. When found, he may have been estimating that she would not have survived long outside in the cold after such a brutal attack, or we have this to this possible Someone perhaps even the same oil and gas worker or someone else, the police talk too had drove by area on o neill road, just a couple of hours before right and here she was certain that barbie was not there at that time. One you like he said this worker could have been working in the area, so he could have been paying attention and said. Well, when I entered my room, I didn't seem by their whatever the case may be the coroner we'll stick with it.

timeline and stick to that statement, as he stated, the coroner didn't believe that the only real road sight was the martyr seat, whether he could have concluded this because of lack of blood signs of a struggle, drag marks or disturbed foliage and we have no idea if barbie was carried or dragged to the dump site or just dumped out of a vehicle. Now, coroner Cox also stated that barbie was intoxicated. when she died. This does go along with what we hear from Michel, her friend. He did not indicate a time of death, but we know that she was still alive when found at ten twenty as food when the attack occurred. We can narrow that down ourselves if we assume, friend Michel is accurate about the timeline she provided than barbie was still alive and well at around three

thirty, a m when the girls were dropped off near jerry's house and she was found at ten twenty eight. so some time between the hours of three thirty a m and ten twenty am someone raped and strangle barbie and they beat her so badly that her neck had to be covered by a scarf at her funeral service to disguise. Bruising barbara was found wearing only her contact lenses and a class ring that displayed her school and her first name inside of it. Her car rose and other jewelry. Does she was well that night have never been found. It is a little known fact the has never released to the papers but we learn this from Donna from Barbie sister. It was the eighties

an barbie was wearing at least four or five ear rings and wearing a you know, tons of stacked bracelets, at least two necklaces and possibly other jewelry- that my colleague them, but the honest style, or mister t? None of these were were found at the scene. The class ring we have to wonder, did the killer if he took in removed all these other items. Why not take the class ring to it? Was it's something as simple as he didn't see it, or was it too hard to get off? He can take it off. the finger, but he said that the earrings were an or they were taken, know your ix. The only thing she had on her was her contact lenses and class ring yeah. I I would assume somethin distant see it or maybe he can get it off, yeah it. He would have

had no way of knowing that her name was inside of this ring well, which is actually if your assuming that the person that attacked or didn't know who she was no. I mean, though the her name was inside of the ring. So you would have. Remove the ring to see her name right, my there. So if ring never came off. He would not have known that and we can't wait really go down the road to much of weather. he wanted her to remain unidentified for a period of time or if he cared at all. But regarding this ring I want a point that because this is actually how they were able to identify her. So they have her school class ring and then they have her name inside of it. That's what led them to realise that we have barbara black nick that we found on the side of the road

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ever you find your favorite pod guest. The all right, we're back cheers mates. Everybody keeps asking us where they can vine old episodes download this teacher app their free on the stage. Europe also check out our show on such a premium cut off the record. Let's get into this investigation, some more so barbies case was assigned to the key yoga falls pity she was found in some county. Not her native cuyahoga county, keep in mind. Barbie head ties to cuyahoga falls the police could find, and no one could think of a reason why she would be in that area all anyone knew was that barbie and her friends were very formal,

you're with the blossom music centre. So Barbie's case was investigated based on the jurisdiction of the body, not the jurisdiction. Where she had attended a party and been out and about just hours before death. This is standard procedure. but if the murder took place in or near garfield heights by a person or persons who knew her, perhaps this is why her case remains unsolved and perhaps dumping her and summit county may have been quite deliberate after the autopsy corner cox made some statements to the meat that are interesting. Barbie was strangled to death, we don't know whether manual or with an implement and she was raped what's intriguing here, and these are some uncomfortable details to cover in the case. But there are important to the case so bear with me here for a minute

The main thing that's intriguing about what cox went out of his way to clarify regarding barbara being raped He says quote by more than one person and quote this It was made to the media on tuesday december twenty second, so Two days after barbie was found dead. The question becomes: how could the coroner know this detail? This is nineteen. Eighty seven and very very early in the dna testing era. And what is the likelihood that a all town in ohio had access to the highest level of dna testing available at the time, or could complete that testing within just forty eight hours. My guess is slim to not one thing that is possible is that perhaps the coroner found two different samples of seamen on different parts of barbie's body and he did blood type.

Asking, which showed to different types. What seems more likely is that Cox may have just jump to this conclusion, based on what he determined in the autopsy see their barbie had been raped repeatedly. He said quote: it was rapid wishes. I believe that we are dealing with more than one person whether or not this is correct is really anyone's guess. In any event, coroner Cox said that barbie was raped by more than one perpetrator. It's interesting to hear Cox described the state of dna testing back in late nineteen. Eighty seven, the following appeared in a beacon journal article about barbie's case on december, twenty third nineteen. Eighty seven, where it says quote sperm taken from the girl's body, has been sent to a.

york firm for analysis of genetic content, because men molecular genetic material dna is different for everyone except identical twins. A print of this material would be equivalent to a fingerprint for positive identification. Cox said the question is: is there enough to cultivate. If anything ever came of this dna analysis, police have not revealed that an article in the We can journal in february of nineteen. Eighty eight stated that although coroner Cox used the dna test on barbie, he said nothing had been produced to help if I suspect on you wonder, did they have enough to identify a suspect right in that's the question that he first pose when they were going to send it off for analysis Now we don't know if that means they didn't get a man,

to anyone or whether they weren't able to extract a profile at all? As your saying for what it's worth, we did ask the sergeant currently in charge of the cairo hookah falls to active unit. Whether there was any testable dna and barbies case, and he told us that quote, we ve done everything we can do with regard to dna and quo, and he would not comment on whether any samples remain intact. Act for future testing right, so we can assume either way, but if they have it, we, like we know now or in the golden age, and this could get solved Donna this her sister. not know whether any dna from barbie's attacker remains either. She does know, though, that her sister was a fighter and

would almost certainly have harvested perpetrator dna under her fingernails ass. She fought for her life. I know that they did at toxicology report and they said that she had been drinkin, but I wonder if they went any further because less say there wasn't dna underneath her fingernails I mean do we know that now we don't know that that's just speculation by her family and with her sister say look. My sister was a fighter. This also makes you wonder, was Barbie you in a state where she could even fight back or was she so heavily intoxicated or or drugged by something where she cannot fight back right and really the the simplest thing with all of these words that the corner and sang really all that's providing to us. The general public is that they have or had some form of dna

they know that she was raped and theyve. They believe that she was dumped there within just a couple of hours of being found. So another intriguing to that. The coroner mention to the media. This involved something found on barbie's body, so corner, found that she had something written. Her hand two lines of text written in pan. So during the autopsy, this is what Cox's We notice that there was some kind of riding in the palm of her left hand, some of

was legible and some was not. He stated that the first line contained numbers and the second line was words, possibly Cox guessed. It was an address. So what did the authorities in summit county due to try to interpret the writing, which the press immediately seized upon as a possible clue left by barbie as to her killers? Identity? or identities without her families, consent or even their knowledge. They amp tasted her left hand and sent it to the fbi lab in washington for analysis. Cox said that the lad had sophisticated lie these are and infrared technologies that might enable them to decipher the wording on barbie's palm and that he should have the results in a few weeks and that's the last. The public heard of this writing

on her palm, whether or not it was an actual clue. What we don't know was where be that, because, okay, we do know that she went to a bike shop that she went to.

Often, why would you write down there not address right this other party that she told her parents about if she left her address when she called? I would then assume that that would be the address that you might find on her hand, but we can also assume that maybe she knew where that party was too and then she gets dropped off at her boyfriend's house or her. I mean we're, calling it her boyfriend right, but she was kind of not one to have serious relationships. You would assume that she knew the address. Of course she does yeah right. So why would you write that down on your hand? So if, if it's not a phone number, which that would make sense to me as well you're out at some parties you run into,

group of friends or old friends- hey here's, my number, but but the coroner's saying I think it's a address numbers words on a knee to me. You'd only write that down if you're going to a place that you didn't now and so it's like. Is this a sign? ok, we don't have any. We don't have any information back. They they sever her hand. They send it to the fbi why the family hasn't got some answers on. This is absolutely ridiculous. Well, even more so that they weren't asked for permission to do so. or or at least even told about it- yes right right, maybe not asking for permission.

Like saying hey. This is what we're doing, because this is how we think we can solve this, and this is what we discovered: that's appalling, really on that site. You know that's very disrespectful to barbie and her family will they likely they likely didn't get the information from it even during this testing that they were hoping to to get right. But let us assume that car It is correct that it was some kind of address. Then I almost implies that she knew she was gone somewhere or possibly gonna go somewhere after she gets dropped off at her boyfriend's house, or I mean it could have been for any type of future use, we as it has done for that night and when I first read this statement, my mind, jump to a phone number. You know I could see. We ve all done it

whether it be a piece of paper or on your hand where we write down someone's name and a phone number, but the way that he says it when he says that there were numbers on top and some type of words on the bottom that to me, I'm I'm going with cox on this one, because that's how I would typically right down and address now that the the numeric and then these reed nato, so the other thing too, as we have not actually seen this, and not many people have apparently the including the family. So it's very likely the whether europe, able to make it out or not what what was written, there's a chance that he could have looked at this and said well, there's only four or five numbers on top, not enough for an actual phone number, again this type of laser technology.

Then we have discussed this on some of the other cases we covered the were around the same time frame. It wasn't it's common for them to bring in these, will this laser technology? From the f b I to try to find fingerprints on a body or on certain items. So this is really just to try to paint a better picture and fill in some of the blanks, because if there weren't blank, they wouldn't have had to send it off to be tested on. This is also kind of the problem with having where she was found, not where we think the actual crime took place, but where she was found investigate this crime Because again, maybe you have some smeared letters numbers or whatever, but maybe detectives within her home town would know what those meant Yeah I mean like they have a better chance of the anti dumping,

since I mean I know what you're getting at, but I don't I don't know. I do think that there is confusion in this case because they did follow protocol and in the investigative agency, was where the body was found right right, but I understand as protocol by again it's to me, The protocol should be not only are we gonna have where she was found investigate, but where she came from, where I have them evolved because again, a name or a number might bring about to a local detective where it might mean nothing to somebody from Cuyahoga falls false units. So when we covered the tony muncie case that place in the eightys as well and in ohio as well. There were, a bit of a struggle for jurisdiction. Regarding that case, I don't know,

that there was necessarily a struggle for jurisdiction here, but just to give some people an example of such an tony monkeys. Is he lived in Columbus, ohio? He was found in delaware, county and found within, but was it twenty four hours or so after he was last We cannot allow people to set clear this up loud people. Go on tony muncie. I don't know if I heard that episode is one of our bonus episodes. We only have to tony muncie in the brick a family murders you can find those on itunes or website yeah and, during that time, colossal pity, said we want to take this case on because we believe he was. He was killed, likely and columbus or by somebody that that was in Columbus, ok right in delaware. County was like no we're gonna take it because we found the body delaware county, what what transpired

there. In my opinion, I don't mean to criticise, but the leads that delaware, and he was following. They weren't they weren't equipped to handle that type of case back there. they are nowadays but not back. Then I think it would have been a different outcome. Had columbus police department been the one to lead the investigation, or I mean well, I shouldn't say, lead because they weren't really allowed to be involved. Very much at all, right, so what you're saying is not to offend by hey you guys medicinal little peace as well don't know the way that it went down in barbie's collect in barbie's case. I dont know that they were that there was a struggle for jurisdiction, What I'm getting at here is but see. I'm saying my the new protocol on to catch off side, but new protocols, Everybody works together, that's the new programme right, I mean it that somebody may still have the lead on a case, but

Austria has. We may yet often at least here in our high or what we ve seen with our own eyes and a lot of times with the cases that we ve covered elsewhere. What we see is when we're reporting this up. It's like We mentioned two or three or four agencies when we're talking about summarize cases so I don't know how much involvement garfield heights actually had in situation, because we know that it was some county. They had the case and we know still to this day. The case remains unsolved and summit county still has the case where I will give criticism, goes back to the removal of the hand, because this is the way that this whole thing went down and its a bit shameful to me this Emily discovered that barbie's hand was severed and sent away effectively, mutilating the corpse when a reporter called the black home and

person the answer. The phone was nineteen year old, daughter, her sister, and she was simply asked by the reporter. Why was your sisters hand? Why had it been cut off. What I'm getting at is. I am not suggesting that they would have had to ask for permission, but I do think there are better ways to handle this issue, nation, when you have love ones that are mourning the loss of their sister and their daughter where you dont have to show any of your cards per se, you could simply say look. This is one thing that we think will be extremely helpful to investigation of the murder of your daughter the hand contains. We believe that it could contain some evidence that could lead us to the perpetrator, crime and in order for us to do the best job we can as investigators we're not actually turn over this too.

Who the f b I write. You don't have to tell him what you found you have to and in doing so we have to remove her hand bright and you don't because a it'd be a very difficult thing for apparent because part of you to speak on can't they just come here. Yeah can't they just come here. Do we have to now put her through more than she's already been through ryan, and I understand that she passed away at this point, but that's what it feel like that you're putting art

through more torture than is necessary. So what is known about the investigation is besides what we have already talked about beset by tuesday december twenty third cuyahoga. False police had interviewed fifteen or twenty people in connection with barbies death, including a number of her friends, but they said publicly that they had come up with nothing concrete and had no. Definite suspects in mind what if any police uncovered in their investigation, remains a mystery even to this day, when we inquired of the cairo befall sergeant about certain aspects of the cage such as whether police ever found her clothes or jewelry, or whether they could tell us what the message was on her hand. We received basically a no comment which is, which is fine. That's good

My hope what that line? Well, it's fine, that's good, and I say that because I hope that this is a case that their revisiting from time to time, and they don't want to show any of those cards that we just talked about ip could say something like that at work. Currently, working on this, we don't want to compromise what we have, but the fact that there's out there's people out there, like you, said armchair detectives. He got people in our family that are still pushing this forward. Now we're trying to push this forward. Sometimes these cops need to get off stop sitting on their hands. And put out more information, even if that's gonna be my argument constantly, you see it like what they may have a case Coming out with new evidence and having press conferences, twenty There's after the fact, yeah some that stuff just doesn't making

Some of them have dna that need to be tested it well. According to barbies family, the clothes in the drawer, you were never found and the police. Captain at the time back in nineteen eighty eight told the beacon journal, the quote: we have proper We interviewed over two hundred people about barbie's last hours. Her whereabouts and that I'm like ten years later, reflecting on the unsolved case in nineteen. Ninety seven, the lead car a hook, a false detective on the case, Larry Wagner, theorize that it had been solved because the crime was probably mitted thirty miles away and garfield heights and police didn't have an easy time tracking down witnesses wagner said quote: she was a early popular young lady. So had a lot of friends and a lot of people. We had to look into I'll bet. We interviewed at least one hundred people, but he said they had very few solid leads

go on even shocking, her murder up to a possible transient and that's about it, for public knowledge of the official investigation. Now, thanks to the facebook page an barbie sister Donna again, we have a little more insight into some of the players whom police might have spoke to or looked at in this case, according to Michel. Barbie did not hook up with jerry her boyfriend that night at least initially right wing. That jerry wasn't around. She asked to be dropped off, on warner road and that she was going to head to his house near by by law. go reports, jerry wasn't home. He was out with his friends that night

We have no idea whether barbie knocked on the door or just went away when no one answered what the situation could have been, or here's a possibility or if by Bob jerry's brother or any one else answered the door. If barbie did approach should or knock brain. work as we have to put it out there that it's a possibility that she tells her friends. Hey drop me off by my boyfriend's house. and that could have been a meeting spot for her to meet. Somebody else. So we don't even know if she made it to her boyfriend's house right exactly. I mean could be any number of reasons for heard. It in her mind and go elsewhere right. We do. that jerry was looked at hard by police. But

It's unknown whether they ever tested his dna, so he's not home that we know of and well we we know, according to statements, that he was out with friends that right, so he has an alibi, is at home and his alibi, it seems like jerry, was looked at pretty good by police It is unknown whether they ever tested his dna. We have been told that several the guys in the neighborhood eager to exclude themselves from the suspect pool agreed to be tested, but we don't know for certain if jerry was one of them. According to Donna, there were a few who were fused, but police seem to have satisfied themselves that jerry was not involved, were basing this off of the fact that he was never knew

in the suspect or arrested he has since passed away yet so he got all these local creepers. Think about the shitty things that you had to do with your life, where you somebody comes up missing somebody, the dead body is found and you're very eager to get your are excluded from the investigation, but I dont know the debt necessarily means at their creeps or that they have done anything wrong. All of em boom same add on one of women. That group is super, duper creeper, right and so he's gone Please tell me because I made a lot of bad decisions and I dont want people think that I did this. Well, I I don't know, I'm just saying there there's at least one and I'm just saying that guy made a lot of bad decisions. It's a possum. only by when they're talking to these individuals. Look if they leave that they have a blood type were,

or anything regarding dna right or that type of evidence. It can either clear somebody or connect them you're not gonna, make their jobs and harder than it has to be they're gonna. Ask you where you were that night. Do you know Barbara blackness, how long have you known or do you know any of her friends? Ok, who have them? Do you know? Would you be willing to submit your dna or your blood type or any of that evidence to us and we can either include you or exclude, but I'm saying there might be somebody in the audience goin. Their hand raised. Please tell me and I ve been talking to you know. I know you Arguably, please asked me to be excluded from this investigation. I think what's more interesting is the alibis that sir, of these teenagers and young adults may or may not have had for that night

we have a lot of kids and young adults that are look. I'm not gonna accuse them of of anything that we don't already know. these are people that are drinking under age, smokin, some pot hanging out party and not a big deal right. That's pretty that's a fairly common activities for people of that age, so no big deal? They are no harm, no foul. However. I thought where a lot of the the trouble that this investigation has got into is going off of the word of these young adults in teenagers that are breaking some very small rules and laws, I wonder how well we can trust the alibis in statements provided. Two detectives regard

What was going on that night with whom and where bright? So hypothetically speaking, you get a group of teenagers. There were hanging out at the captain's pub and the captains bob was serving minors alcohol that night, my ties and marguerite is yeah loads. Of my isn't and we got a special drink called the douche canoe, it's very long and it's filled with booze and it's kind of like a fishbowl but anyways there's. So here's what I'm hearing you say is a T. A teenage group might tell the cops we were at Tommy's house, or we were just driving around and not to give the location of the place that they might have been drinking our party that and so that

pigs. Did they do anything wrong, no or they've been involved in the crime? No, but it's making a lot of these stories. Unclear, yes, And- and I base that off of this- so let's I'm going to create four different compartments. Real quick here regarding the teens and young adults, and especially the young adults. It are still living at home with mom and dad ok We have the a group that may not give a shit about anything, and they are just willing to tell the cops whatever, because they don't care, they don't fear the cops. They don't fear their parents, they don't fear law? Then we have another group who might be terrified of guinea, in trouble with the law, may not understand the law and think. Oh, I sold some pot to these people right. I'm gonna go forever,

and then you have another group group see that might just be terrified of mom and dad. I don't want to get in trouble with mom and dad or I dont want to disappoint my parents, but then we got group d Who is going to go? You know what maybe I'm a little afraid of the law, maybe I'm a little afraid of diesel. my parents, but in the sake of doing what's right, I'm going to accept what I've done and I'm gonna tell truth to the police anyway. But what I'm getting at is you still have to go? within that that large pool of people we know that she was a popular kid. She had a lot of friends, nobody there's nobody out there saying differently. So you have a large group of people, all of them young adults and teenagers, and you have if we're gonna break that up into just four different groups. We got two of those four groups that probably

would ban the truth, bell rang or leave out details, or you know the other group as the people. I don't We get the establishment that thereat and trouble right, so you so. No and then on top of that. No, it also can affect your personal life going forward right and your active These maybe a love go into the bike shop in december and january and get no boost up with their bodies, but guess what? After I tell the truth what I was doing that night when barber went missing in them was found dead, guess what I can do longer say: hey, mom, dad gone off to the bike shop seen a few hours. Then fly anymore way on all those rats that read it out: the captain's bub no due to new, for you know, disk knew for you well in episode

two of this case captain I really want to take a deep dive into what are some other possibilities for that night for barbers last night, and I also want to explore if her murder could be connected to other murders in the area a lot more decisive in two. If you have thoughts on this, go to true gram, grudge dot com and leave your comments on the blog yet join us back here for park two until

then be good behind and don't listen.