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Julie sprang parents, barbara in her husband Dennis smith. Well, they publicly called out their son in law, stephen, in a capitol news. Nine piece, Barbara said quote: I believe that stephen is the only one who knows what open to on november first, and I do believe He harmed him. She elaborated that earlier in two thousand and seven Jocelyn asked even to leave the home because she was afraid he would harm the children according to Barbara stephen

Anger management issues and had been going to counseling for them. They were so bad that job one had made him move out of the family home for brief periods. This twice in two thousand and seven because of aggressive behaviour towards the children and after the stream incident that we talked about yesterday, Jocelyn force stephen to pen, a letter of apology to delete for this and made him do the child's chores for one month, Barbara and Dennis enthusiastically helped Elaine persons found the find Julie task force, getting billboard, directed holding vigils and organizing volunteer searches, those searches, continued weekly, even after police scaled back, their official searches for jalek. This in may of two thousand

eight, and also in may of two thousand and eight barbara petition the court to assign custody of July over to her so that she could more. Actively pursue legal avenues to locating him such as a any medical records and contacting homeless shelters on his behalf, He said she also wanted to ensure that the boy had a safe and stable home to come back to in the event that he was still alive. A warren county judge ruled against her and July Jeffrey mick. More. he's. The attorney for the parents said of her request, quote ram other here was just worried about her own publicity and quote this lawyers as big a dirt bag, as the father is at least he's getting paid to do,

so the the father's just being a dirtbag for no, no, he was he is getting paid too. He can paid by the state. That's true, so they're both paid dirt bags continuing with July two thousand and eight here. Captain the albany times union reported that Julie's grandmother, the one that we were just praising was arrested and charged with second degree burglary. This is based on a complaint from Jocelyn and Steven. Apparently Barbara entered the unlocked, raven way house. This is where they were living and use a flashlight too a little snooping a little poking around. If you will remember, stephen and joscelyn were no longer living there. At this time they had already moved off to vermont a name, reported that some one was in the house. You know you. Can you ve seen this in the movies that all the lights are out

post to be dark over the neighbors home all know you can see someone walking around with a flashlight in there, so neighbor reported. Someone was in the house and since her entry technically was authorized by the owners. Barbara was facing charges for this. She did plea not guilty in court in a court proceeding which took place on July. Teeth. I think more interesting than her arrest is what could she have possibly found in the house or which was she looking for law on whatever she would have found? They would have the problem of been immiscible and the court of law. Well, what we do have is shortly after this burglary and- and I don't think this is any coincidence at all- the police executed a search warrant on the home good. Well, look. Here's a couple of things: I applaud what she's trying to do

also applaud that she has no problem, throwing her son in law under the bus. He doesn't seem to be cooperative. He doesn't seem to give a shit. You claim that this boy went missing on his own accord. Any move- none of this stuff makes any sense, you're, ripping down posters, of this kid. You are not cooperative with police. You are hot line over and over you're still collecting money for a kid that you're not taking care of you. You basically tried to kill this kid by drowning him. This is not a good dude and I applaud effort by turning on him and thrown him under the bus. Bear the same time. We're not looking for

missing person anymore were we should be looking for a body if the father is responsible, which it this makes the most sense. The logical connection he's not responsible for the kid gone missing, he's responsible for the kids death and we need to be looking for a dead body. What the police was looking for with their search warrant was one item of interest. This was reported to be a piece of clothing. That day stated that Barbara Shaw while she was inside that home. This was a bright, yellow, fleece pullover. The one Jalisco was said to have been wearing when he disappeared, the same the searchers were looking for as they scanned the woods builds and waterways? Usually that's one things that there really pointing out here with in regards to the searches when you're looking for someone it's very helpful when you're able to tell them till the searchers here

he or she was last seen wearing this bright red sweater right or this bright, yellow fleece pull over something that's easy to spot, so you can move clear land and keep going well this fleece that they were well, he was last wearing was found by barbara in the home and then or by police after they executed. The search warrant turns out. Obviously, this was in the house. This whole time was this more proof that they're liars, it's odd to that. It was even left behind when they moved right like it. It, though it seems like an old because when this be something you would try to get rid of, if you realized after the fact

It's still be here, and I told everybody this is what he was wearing. I don't think these are good people. I think these individuals try to use the system while if we adopt these kids were going to get sent fifteen hundred dollars a month as a stipend, we're not going to really close these kids or take care of these kids we're not even going to try to pay for electricity or have heating in the house, and so to me it's not an oversight. That's just what people these people are they're lazy pieces of shit that don't want to work that don't want. You know that don't want to care for people that their goin out their way to take responsibility of these kids, but they don't even want to take care of those kids. They just want the stipend. Therefore they don't have to work as hard. and also how to remind you of the d or coon's case where they found an article.

The thing in their home that he was supposedly wearing when last seen at the campsite. The police did submit this fleece for testing. I dont know what really came of it. There's not been much said about it since it was low key. did. We did have this weird voice, analysis thing and we ve seen this in some other cases, and this was brought and in god about because remember, stephen would not agree to the polygraph tasks. So some people said No, you can use data using the data to determine whether he was lying or not, with this voice, analysis, stuff So remember there was that strange interview stephen and Jocelyn gave to news tan. This was almost immediately after disappeared, the one where really answer a bunch of questions correct, while at the request of this fine julie task force that has been formed, texas

research brought in to a leading voice analysis experts to use a method called layered voice analysis, which measures, changes and voice frequency to detect truth. this and analyze the interview, audio voice, analysis, expert in private, investigator t, J ward said I have dealt with family members and this is not the way family members react to someone missing, not at all and quote okay. But what do you make of this brennan in this expert. does it doesn't seem like a huge waste of time to you? We already have evidence that this guy's a liar. So why spend any more time on the fact that he's not truthful, well you're grasping for straws here is what you're doing it's

it's you know it's the task force bringing in these experts via texas, aqua search, but anything it's in some way shape or like We know he's lying. We know because at him lying multiple times right is this their way of if we bring these experts maybe they state that he's lying. Maybe that puts a little more. I heat on the fire low little more flame. little more pressure on him to possibly come forward. It's an interesting tactic because not the police, bringing in these experts right and it probably didn't anything to do this work and a publicly state that they are doing this work really you're, as you stated, turn up the heat a little bit shake some trees, see what falls out. Maybe he maybe does feel the pressure and he goes and he talks to police. I mean at some point in these.

Esther geishas when you really feel like you, have the person or know the person to be responsible for whatever act that is or misdeeds that it were done. If you got nothin autumn, got nothing autumn, but you still have them there. In the spotlight in can react. They can make mistakes We've seen this alive rigid, and I want to be clear about that: alleged behavior and actions of this man. They don't to be well thought out or well planned, and we seen talk of him flying off the handle. Maybe you turn up the he does something dumb by is dumb barbara and Alain Angela leaks other advocates prayed that these type of things would bring cha which against the of, but we have to keep in mind just like polygraphs, this layered voice analysis. The results of these are not admissible in court,

articles noting the one year anniversary of julian disappearance stated that police work still meeting regularly to discuss the case and shit any leads or tips that might have come in, but the off misery was really fading around this one year, anna versus clauses from say they need to be doing searches around his father's cabin where there were at that night and then the cabin that they lived in with could cadaver dogs and- and I dont know if that has been done but though those are the search for that needs to be done, they they were doing that early on within within the first hours and days of the boy having gone missing. But the problem with all this, as this is an area where there's a lot of wooded areas right, so It's a lot of ground to cover yeah. They did a five mile radius search with the assistance of many different.

Agencies, including the forest rangers, the state forest rangers, so In this first year anniversary, we have chief bell who states that at this point there was really little that they could do they being the police other than investigate leads that were coming in and wait for a break in the case. Cuz, I'm kind of exhausted everything by this point, the investigation he said had cost a fortune to that date, putting the police department well over their budget, the missing persons flyer shewed, they issued a new one around the same time, fortunately, by the state division of criminal justice services, it was updated at this time too, flecked julie could not run away but had disappeared on unknown circumstances. As for the parents

the lawyer issued a statement saying that they continued to quote pray. He is safe, and will return home soon. Do you think the mother just doesn't know Think that if the mother knows what happened. The only way she knows what happened as if she was told. I don't think she witnessed anything first hand. Her was a part of anything in regards to the first twenty four hours of forty eight hours of the boy being missing eighteen months, sikri into this thing, roughly made thirteen, two thousand and nine police and state forest ranger search the banks of the ban kill river This is an area the area that is called the hell hole and its decision What is a swirling bulge in the river water cadaver dogs hit near this location? and police were aware that Stephen Kerr was there.

The familiar with the area sounds like a lovely place, though, cause he's a shit bag that goes with her alright. Well, the family would camp in this area in and had been known to do so hey kids just got at the old hellhole. Nothing was found in this search of the bank's chief bell said. We continue to get tips, The interest has not died off. We still want to fine jolly. This is all per news. Ten and about a year four months later investigators returned to this area again this time with state police, dive, crews on hand, the water level of the bat and kill river fluctuated actually in the quote, unquote hellhole and it was often unsafe for divers quote it's a dangerous,

I to dive. There is metal and rebar and other stuff down. There said chief bell: this is per the times union. The chief described the site as a lord, at the bottom of a hydro electric dam which needs to a whirlpool. A new york state police spokesperson said that the dive team search that specific area because of its proximity to a hydro electric, damn because of the water pressure created by the damn anything in the water. There is pushed down into a very small area, so I mean this. Sounded like a perfect spot to hide something too A body maybe the search fortunately, was fruitless or, for fortunately, was fruitless. in two thousand and nine: a hunter in the woods near lake desolation.

In northern saratoga county found skull fragments on the ground. it was determined that they were, in fact human and they were, to be the remains of a child, estimated to be ten to possibly twelve years old. It looks like at the time, in two thousand and nine captain, there were six missing persons cases in the area that would meet or could meet this criteria by law enforcement officials they jumped all over this, of course, and July leak was one of the possible six missing persons that they thought it could be. Fortunately, it not him and some of their estimates were wrong with their findings. It turned out that the skull was the remains a eighteen year old girl.

Colorado. Her name is jennifer hammond, who went missing in august of two thousand and three in march of two thousand and ten police released in age, enhanced a trick of Julian they had been prepared by the national centre for missing and exploited children. Police held a press conference announcing the release of this photo to the media. Chief bell said quote: I'm hoping this might spark some interest in the parents to come forward. It's too a half years later and they act like this never happened need to reach out and be cooperative with law enforcement, and quote one thing: I will really really to command chief bell and others that do stuff like this again, we we have, have a situation where we look at it from afar, and we can say it

The points to two possible outcomes- maybe boy ran away, but we have evidence So tat the father is being less than truthful and is not in cooperative with police and by own admission in everybody else's account as well he's the last one to have seen the boy when he has also temper issues, and he can be violent The boy didn't run away. This is your responsible person, you're responsible party right. thing that I love about chief bellows any time they have any reason to go to the media at all, he's. Circling the wagons and saying hey, we're put this information, one for the public to help us out but too, because we want the parents. This is this is in efforts to get the parents to cooperate with us to talk with us to help us out

now, captain we need to introduce somebody named scott, thorpe age, thirty, seven, okay, his involvement or non involvement in case. I don't know how you want to look at it, but he certainly, in my opinion, a big part of the story, because in april of two thousand and ten scott thorpe kidnapped a man who owed him money for drugs, he beat the guy up and showed him a photo of what appeared to be a dead body along with jill leaks, missing persons fire. He told the guy that he beat up that he had killed the kid and he would do the same to this guy if he didn't pay up on his death, Then he and his goons dumped this kidnap victim off in kingsbury about

he in one of the photos is said to have some resemblance to July leak and the victim was told that it was in fact, cia leak. This is all pr and investigator This was reported in the times union paper. They said that police recovered all of these photos during a search of scott thorpes. house. Apparently this guy, he fled the area he went down to florida and was on the run for a while, until the es marshals caught up with them in a row did him in late june of two thousand and ten do

on the run. You dig use along the route for was, of course, locked up in charge with the tempted, murder and kidnapping, and he was extradited back to washington county where, at that time he was being held for an eventual trial on the charge. Is now investigators at the centre for missing and exploited children examined. These photographs that were found in thorpe's possession at his home and specifically the one that was thought to be jewel our final ruling captain, was that it was not julie in that photo on force, wait. Any of the information out there to the public does not address who it was in the photograph or my thoughts. Maybe it was a doctored photo that it wasn't anything right like what scott thorpe was telling us

it would be. The good news is we know that whatever it was in that photo dead body or not? It's not our missing boy, jelly The.

the alright. We are back, cheers everybody thanks for joining us. What a frustrating case! Yes, illustrating indeed, cheers to all the people up front people in the back come on spend up spend up. I think I think you're just getting excited cause you're heading off on your vacation and want to upset everybody before he's been drinking our evilly- are a cavern captain kept. We mention the nationals

for missing and exploited children several times round this case we ve mentioned them on the show dozens of times before, not because not just because they ve been involved. In other cases we ve covered, but also because we ve encourage people to seek Now and maybe offer up a little bit a donation, be it money or time because they are doing fantastic work they are king there damned is to bring children home now. In this case, they have continued to support law enforcement and continue to help in the investigation and the search for julie, rain walker. We mentioned that the national center for missing and exploited children created an age progression photo of Joe. but in two thousand and twelve that organization took On a larger role, representatives of the inn see em easy or nick mac. As John Douglas, like

came to washington county to undertake the daunting task of reviewing the investigation and all of the evidence compiled by four thousand one hundred and twenty three for law enforcement agencies. That investigated this case. Not only are you good at computer you're good at counting, I can also go for three hundred and twenty one in the opposite action, the nick mac report turn out to be eighty pages of his eighty page report. There was a very We released to law enforcement investigators said that it opened up a few leads that would be pursued after working with the anti am easy in late, two thousand and twelve Cambridge greenwich police finally changed the classification of julian case. This is something you were pointing out and you've been you've been pounding. Desk and pounding the table and saying this is what we need.

be doing here. They change the classification of case from a missing child to a probable child homicide. At a december twenty twelve press conference Chief bell made the announcement, the jolly was the victim of a quote: probable child homicide, not a runaway state police, major crimes unit, backed this up, vesta gaiters acknowledge that they had exhausted all leads in the case, although they insisted that it was not a cold case at the prescott grandma, Barbara and her husband both spoke about how painful it was to continue to have every day that Julie was still alive and yet to have no answers. For all this time, a plea was made to the public to help find the missing boy. Authorities also requested.

that the media stop disseminating the old national centre missing and exploited children. Age progressed, photos of julie, and the organization took them off of their website. This is weird right because Earlier we are condemning the father for bearing down the posters of the the prayer vigil and saying any publicity is good. Publicity Here we have law enforcement, tearing down their own photos and telling me the tear up the old age progression photos that we set out there doing this, because what they're saying at the time is all they are getting. from these age progression. Photos are false, leads their spinning. Their tyres, they're out chasing ghost, always see that a lot of times with missing.

some cases, even people, that we know people that were close to authors that have gone up to other countries and showed a people pictures of a girl in and they get leads, and you think how my god, it's going to be solved its Mr remember: people want to see things that they didn't see. They want to help. People are mostly good natured people that want to help, and they will try to give you some information that creates, like, the fall, while also what you have here too, as I I think, is its role. really underlining what they believe that's really putting the exclamation mark on a week longer believe that we're looking for missing child yeah, it's sad and although at this press conference there there

was nobody would actually come out, while chief bell did not actually come out a name any suspects, but he did say quote: certain people have been eliminated and certain people have knocked. He said flat out that the police have not received any cooperation from stephen in joscelyn an he please with them to come in and sit down with him. The grandparents, on the other hand, while they did not mince words, they said if you did nothing wrong, and you have nothing to hide. Why don't you cooperate with law enforcement to find your son? These were the words of Dennis smith,. In response to the press conference. Stephen and Jocelyn released the following statement. They released another note, This is the way the third know in the case that they're releasing, while their statement mandate, they have a rebuttal,

or it at least. It's not a no comment thing. I I don't know what to make of this, you could take it either either the us here either condemn them for dodging the media. Or can do them for releasing a statement. I dont know what to make of it, but they said, despite everything that law enforcement has had to say, we know that He is out there meaning julie and will Her to us some day. We pray that the reclassification of the case will Brazil, in the lessening of efforts to bring jalek home to his family. The statement also expressed objections to the discontinued use of the age progression Well, arguing that people needed to know who to look out for this is a statement, one half of the parties that provided statement was a man that was tearing down posters for a vigil at one time yeah I mean

I don't know if they know how big of piles of they are of people at this joscelyn, that's a key to it. All right is just one is what I think I think she now knows, I think she might not have known before, but I think it may be a temper tantrum and one of his little rages. that he slipped up or maybe there was some evidence that he left behind because he's a lazy, pile shit and he slipped up now. She knows, and now she's either scared and she feels like she has to protect her children and other adopted child or or she's also afraid if she goes to police that they're not going to be able to protect her, possibly

or what is he going to do because we know he's a known liar? How much is he going to throw her under the bus? he tried of blame her for everything that has happened. These are individuals that the kid goes missing and they ve done nothing. Everything they ve done. Every step that they ve taken is to muddy the waters and to me, that's all, that's all the proof we need were not you not gonna get anywhere. Unless you find his

what he but again, I think in these circumstances, I think that that's fine in a needle in a haystack unless somebody comes forward and says, I know what happened and I know some details and I could lead you to an area that could be easier, searched. I think, but this this son of a bitch ain't gonna come forward and say shit. So maybe one day it's going to wear on her more and marks that these are her Parents that are coming out saying you guys are awful people right and if he had nothing to do with this, be cooperative with the police did that these are her her parents that is going to wear on her and grind on her good, I should wear on you and whatever god or whatever. You think you pray to that shit. Ain't going to help you and when you get to the

cited for comparing and health for all your sins. That's what I think I told you I don't know they're trying to muddy the waters. There actions. To me, look more like. Pretend the water doesn't exist. I mean it's right from the get go right from jump street grandma's over at the house and she's saying they're, acting like nothing had. Been, thereby either more concerned about a doctor's appointment and going to a bird play party in. Should they feed me some breakfast? It's, it's like as soon as he was gone regardless how he was gone right, even the kid ran away, there was no, there was no most even no mention of it to her like, like big

called her and told her. This is what's going on. She shows up wants to help and they're they're concerned with other things, and it's been that way since the the minute that it happened. They have abhorred on that. So that's why I'm saying those is kind of weird because, as it is both happening at the same time, spect forrest gump is both happening at the same time. Yes acting like nothing happened completely, but also all by the way we found this note that suggests that he ran away,

I might have gave him that as a homework assignment, but I can't remember that, but hey he probably ran away now. Let's act like nothing happened, and let's do that for a time period. Okay, now things are getting a little hot in the kitchen. Here's some other random note that is typed, saying that he's alive or he's fine. I I believe, all heartless her wholeheartedly that they're responsible. For that note- and so yes, I agree with you- there's there's a definitely there's these moments of listed act like this. Kid never existed right, but I think there are times whether their they're throwing wrenches in young into the case to muddy the water. The in regards to the anonymous letter, the shows up to media- I don't know man, that's just a weird thing is if you could see it being the parents because they chose to send it to the media, I could also see it being just a complete hoax yeah. I mean we

Have the attorney saying: hey, there's, there's stuff in there that only a leak, would know that doesn't mean anything. That's that man's opportunity and and the pair saw opportunity to say see. We told you so even If they didn't mail, it they'll all. We got lucky some some weirdo decided to mail in an anonymous letter to the newspaper I would like to talk to me newspaper and ask him how many anonymous we're letters. Do they get on the rag right lake is. What's what do you put the? What do you put the mark at the quota is, is a couple look couple of week, one once a week, back in the day that was, it was more often, but in late, two thousand and thirteen what's interesting here, is that rumors started to swirl that there was an arrest in this case that was going to

Happening and soon, but chief bell said that there was no truth to these reports, so we got all excited and worked up for nothing half chub. what seemed to spawn these rumours was the current washington county da he announced on the anniversary of julian disappearance that he believed a prosecution for leaks. Murder could go for for in it name any one, but reading between the lines here this likely meant that he believed that there is sufficient evidence. It evidence to bring charges against steve incur. Now it's important to note that this public statement was issued in the middle of a bid for real action, which the dna not when the koran did not went so when the new de took over his office reviewed the police investigative file for the case, but did not proceed with any prosecution

citing double jeopardy as the reason that the no body murder case should be put on hold until the evidence was rock solid in the case. Then in two thousand and eighteen, the case well received a terrible blow. We, add the man who had headed up the investigation from the beginning, the man who refuse to let the case die. The man who never gave up on fire delete chief george bell, very sadly He passed away suddenly in march of two thousand and eighteen, according to the times union, In his thirty nine year, law enforcement career chief bell had never missed a day of work. Thirty, nine years work in law enforcement chief bell never missed a day of work. He had been

having flu like symptoms leading up to this and he died of a heart attack after leaving a hospital in bennington vermont, In two thousand and nineteen, an article in the post star says jellies: does parents spawned one of the most in depth, investigations by a local state and federal officials in washington, county index and even after thirteen years, a group of investigators continued to work on the case. According to the same publication, washington, county district attorney tony Jordan's office been reviewing the evidence police amassed, which was. over to his office in the spring of two thousand and eighteen shortly before bells death. They are cautiously assessing the material in the file, with an eye towards possible

execution. This here is another bizarre thing in this case are captain a wonder how strong is any of this evidence? How strong is any of this case? What do they. have. What could they possibly have? Is it a case just minus the body we find that boom we're moving forward with charges, so this guy should be on the edge of his seat at all times. He should be very afraid. because we are one piece away from convicting this guy. And putting him away for a very long time, or is this posturing to try to get this dude to make a mistake, but again he's pretending as nothing. has happened. I think there's a lot of stuff out there in the open against the son of a bitch. So what do they have behind closed doors? Let's say it's equal to now got a pretty strong

case, but that we always know that they're weak cases, if you don't have a body so focus on that find the body. Once you find the body, then he can bring this bastard trial and he can spend the rest of his life behind bars and once you figure out that his wife knew about it, could spend the rest of her life behind bars as well see. I don't know that I share that same opinion. I don't know that. I believe the jocelyn is convinced that Steven did something- and I say that, because her actions before the boy went missing were to protect the children in the house? She even complain to others, her bomb and other people that stephen was behaving or parenting the way that she wished that he was right, so For me, I kind of look at it and go. I I really

I wonder if she true, He felt that he had done something that all the other children are potentially endanger as well. Now we would know based off of the ages that we listed earlier than here in twenty twenty. All of these kids would be adults now they would be young adults, but they would be adults, but still you would have period of over ten years to be concerned that he could do something to one of these other children. I always like to to rely on the previous actions. of an individual, usually lead you to what their future future actions and behavior will be and what we saw on the outside. Looking in before in regards to Jocelyn. I not so naive to believe that she doesn't maybe at some level suspect something

but what I truly think is going on here is one of two situations. Well, I shouldn't say that cuz, I go here. I go narrowing myself, the two situations when immediately a third popped into mine, let's say and you ve been hinting at this a little bit along the way, and I can can agree with this a little bit there is a chance that there's something so much more horrible under the surface going on then, if it never reached of the public, never reached anybody that knew these people that there's just some really bad horrible stuff going on and it had been going on. A very long time there's always that small possibility that that is a truth where I lean with this case and going to go a little glass, half full and a glass half empty. At the same time,. Why we laughing- I don't even know what them

Will you will, when I finish my thought, so I'm going with. This is one of two things I think is probably likely here isler either a jolly did run away and his adoptive father. was kind enough and can enough. Please here the sorry, chasm in my voice, too give him enough time and opportunity to get as far away as possible so that he could not, find the boy and nobody else could find him and return him to the household. If that did not happen, I feel like he's, convinced his wife, that that's what hap

all right. So do you wanna know what I think sure, as we all know what I think so and I have to go over right well this that you know that I, I think he's responsible. I think she knows or or like you said, there's something. Maybe it's it's the way he told the story. One time may it's her finding the jacket that he claimed that that he would he would have been in when they are looking for the kid. I think, there's something in her deep down and her got that taught her. The sky murdered a child. And I been supporting him again, maybe also in a sense, if I'm here, that I can protect my children, but but it might not be a confirmed knowledge, but I think.

I'd be really interested to see what they have behind closed doors. What evidence that they have. That hasn't been shown to the public app, but I think it's really going to take finding a body in order to bring the charges against this individual that need to be brought against him. Yeah and I think you're hit. Something really interesting their captain, because there is a lot of grey area and there's a lot of what we do no about stephen cell phone, that they were track, that night, we know that they were tracking okay. We know that they believe he was out driving that gold mini van around that night. I have to believe with all these swirling rumors rumors, that they keep going back to time and time again every so often that We have evidence to prosecute. We might. arrest, might be happening soon. I wonder.

They have more information. That's based around that cell phone and based around activity did they know took place with that gold van that night, and here is a statement from a former state police, investigator who's, now retired, and he was involved in this investigation for six years or so, and he said that there was significant. He used the word significant, significant evidence in the case that has not been ravine. Publicly, and he went on to say that the national center for missing and exploited children when they were the key years earlier that we reported on in this episode, he said they deemed to be called prosecution ready so yeah Half the wander. Yes, are they just looking for that? One final peace? Now this is a case that is more than just

as much as any case out there, but more so than than than a lot of em needs. The public's help We need information from the public and Anybody knows anything at all in regards to their suspicions about stephen their suspicions about where Julie could be, or what could have happened to this, boy. Then they need to come forward. It's been too long and report this and point lol Force me in the right direction. Please again Anybody with information they're asking that you contact either the new york state major crimes unit. The national center for missing and exploited children and will have those numbers posted for you on our website at true crime garage doc com on the blog

where'd you leak rain walkers. The bonus show got off the record check us out on stitcher premium. Also, if you would like to check out our old episodes, they are all for free on the stitcher app just go to the itunes store, download the stitcher app and listen to all the old a love for free and before we wrap up, we have a little recommended reading this week. We have a really good one. As always, it's called hell hound on his trail, the stocking of more in luther king Jr and the international hunt for his assassin. This is by hampton sides, he's a best selling author Hell. Hellhound on his trail is an intense narrative about the assassination of a great man and great leader, martin luther king jr, and

one of the largest manhunts in american history that led investigators to canada, Portugal and england, so check out hellhound on his trail. by hampton sides, and you can find that title in many more a true crime garage dot com on the recommended page until next week be good, be kind. Don't worry.