« True Crime Garage

Jeffrey MacDonald /// Part 1 /// 464

2021-02-16 | 🔗

Jeffrey MacDonald /// Part 1 /// 464

Part 1 of 2


This week Nic & the Captain tell the story of one of the most litigated murder cases in American criminal history. Doctor and Army officer Jeffrey MacDonald was convicted of murdering his wife and two children. The man says he is innocent. Jeffrey claims the murders were committed by four intruders in the middle of the night. He says they tried to kill him as well. Join the guys in the garage for a beer and hear one of the most debated murder cases to date.

Beer of the Week - Black Galaxy IPA by Beacon Brewing Company Garage Grade - 4 out of 5 Bottle Caps

Our show - True Crime Garage “Off the Record” is available only on Stitcher Premium. For a FREE month of listening go to http://stitcherpremium.com/truecrimegarage and use promo code GARAGE

Beer Fund: https://truecrimegarage.com/home

This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
Whatever your wellness goals, maybe whole foods market can help you reach them from their nourishing beauty, hair selection and huge variety of supplements to their beautiful in season produce. You can define what wellness means to you by what you put in your card with so many local and seasonal finds you can discover a new favoured each time you enter the sore, not sure where to start ask a team member for help and see what they recommend. Maybe you'll find it in gym. You want to pass along to the healthy, be happy the whole at whole foods market. Summers here make sure you have all the summer essentials, including highlands. Naturals era drops the number one best selling earache drops for ten years highlands. Naturals earache drops, provides fast and effective relief of the pain and itching of irix from swimmer's, ear, cold and flu and allergies, and it's safe for your whole family for day or night relief. So you can get.
back to your summer fast highlands, naturals earache drops to healthy summers and beyond available at walmart walgreens target and cvs claims based on traditional homeopathic practice, not accepted medical evidence, not f D. A evaluated The.
welcome to true prime garage, where you are whatever you're doing. Thanks for listening, I'm your hosts, nick and with me, as always lady gentlemen: hands down the illicit financial, this side of the mississippi river. I give you the cap, so should have been a man who has such fat hands. He can't fit them up the dummies, ass to be seen- and it's good to see you thanks for listening thanks for friend this week. We are very excited to be featuring black galaxy ip by the good folks down a beacon, brewing company and beautiful le grange georgia blast off into this interstellar IPA don't be fooled by
Just beneath the black abyss lies a roast character with pungent tropical fruit and muskie citrus garage great for big bottle caps, and let's give some praise who are friends who helped us out with this week's beer, run first up a bit here's to paula and lagrange GA and the big shots of huntington west Virginia next cheers and ron Swanson. Please, and thank you to jennifer v and farmers branch, texas, big. We like it to Charles, be in fort worth texas, or I hear a long distance west coast cheers to mariah in long beach, california and last, but certainly not least, we have a big thank you to even in car love, moors out and warrant in virginia everyone we just mentioned while they helped us out with this week's beer funding. For that we thank you. Yeah res I'll, be see thanks for
supporting the show for the bead away, the bar you in beer run, but if you like to support the show, get something in return check out our website. True crime, garage dot com and click on the store page there's something for everyone and that is enough of the business Everybody gather around grab a chair, gravel beer. Let's talk some true cried, I heard was asked
and I believe I heard that twice at first. That was the first thing that I remember hearing, but it's very jumbled, because that's mixed up with my wife screaming Jeff help me and my daughters, bringing as groovy cafes. The paris rain
the following is an adaptation from the book. American justice great crimes and trials by Paul bag and martin vita doktor Jeffrey mcdonald was an army, can in the prestigious green berets? The crack specialty operation unit of the american army trained for protection really hazardous roles. Was a good soldier. He worked hard in red. waited from princeton university, while still a student, there he got married in nineteen, sixty three jeff, completed his medical studies at northwestern university in nineteen sixty nine, Sixty nine was the year of Charles Manson and old families, arrest for the horrific murders of sharing tate and our houseguest follow I those of MR and mrs labianca, so it was appalling to and that in february of nineteen, seventy the hippies had struck again
Another household had been violated. Another family savagely done to death their blood to have been used for crude graffiti. Nineteen. Seventy, the mcdonald family of was living at fort bragg, a large military base in north carolina mcdonald apartment was located at five four four castle drive. Military police provided security The early morning, hours of tuesday february, seventeenth, Jeff mcdonald, calls military police. His voice was weak and croaky. His message alarming and imprecise help five. Forty four castle, dr stabbing five forty four castle, DR stand hurry duty, police race to the house on castle drive in the living room. they found signs of a struggle in the main bedroom Jeffrey macdonald and his wife collect.
I found lying on the floor. Colette is dead, She was savagely battered and covered with blood on the all the word pig had been scrawled her blood, apple's, two daughters both lay dead in their bedrooms or weapons were found outside the back door. Mcdonald was taken to the military hospital he severe, stabbed to the chest which punctured along his story. The family had gone to bed, he reported, except for him. He stayed up. reading and dozing off in his pajamas on the couch in the sitting. Room he awoke to find for hippies in house three of them men. The fourth was a woman Jeffrey struggled with them, but they overpaid, our him and tied his hands before clubbing him over the head when he, finally came round, the house was cold and silent. The were gone, Jeffrey went upstairs to find
stains on the floors and walls. His whole family had been brutally massacred the middle very police were working under severe handicaps, their normal It does not involve solving serious crimes, let alone the the tories, led difficult, stranger murders. They can give experienced detectives serious problems the mps are normally used to breaking up drunken brawls, pursuing listed men who have gone awol handling the odd case of pilfering, they're, usually inclosed, barracks too guards on the gates mean all entries and exits have been checked in community can be sealed off for immediate investigation in a crisis before bragg was an open base. The public had the right enter and pass through parts of it. It was not possible to. is everything down at once and hope the hippies would be caught in a trap. This
the shrew grandma, I just scream ass. It is crazy, kill the pigs. Him again cried with fish whereby at our captain. We are going to dive right into this week's time line and we're gonna start with the mcdonald family timeline leading up to the day in question, because there is a lot to cover here in our two fantastic episodes here in the garage in nineteen. Forty, three, both colette Catherine stevenson and Geoffrey mcdonald, were born, collects father, edward passes, away and nine
seen. Fifty four and nineteen fifty six collects mother Mildred starts dating a man named freddy cassava. These well I'll, be major players in this week's case and nineteen sixty three Jeffrey colette are married. Jeffrey is still a student at princeton university. At this time. A little back story here- captain they grew up in the same area, went to the same high school, Jeffrey mcdonald and collect state. in our kids that grew up together went to school together. They dated in off in high school. In fact, they were a bit of high school sweethearts yeah, but there were some time periods where they were not together.
in a relationship, but they start seeing each other again at college and while Jeffery still in college, they get married in nineteen sixty three. This is because cola is already pregnant with Jeffrey's child, so a nineteen sixty four, their first daughter is born. Her name is kimberly, Katherine mcdonald. The mcdonald's then moved to Chicago where Jeff starts medical school at northwestern university just three years after their first daughter in nineteen sixty seven, their second daughter is born. This is kristen jean mcdonald. Now nineteen sixty nine captain is going to be a very busy year for Geoffrey and the mcdonald family. This is because Jeffrey joins the: u s army, so first Jeff reports to fort
SAM Houston army, medical in san Antonio for six weeks, then he is off to fort benning in georgia. For three weeks a paratrooper training, then Jeffrey macdonald was sent to fort bragg in north. He is assigned to the green berets as a surgeon for the special forces group. come into question later, as we're going through the case itself. The investigation in the actual murders is jeffrey, mcdonald's, army, training, green berets or a special forces used. They are able to handle very difficult situations. Most of the time they are in martial arts in hand to hand bat in all kinds of different tactical. Should Jake fighting moves the council, but we have generally here, who is sent to the green berets as a surgeon, so He is not trained the same
way that they would train these typical ground troops Zama. They have some kind of boot camp and some initial training, but specialty soldiers they're going to go through a different training. After the initial trade correct. He receives this boot camp type training he receives paratrooper training, which is kind of above and beyond. Anyway. He never gets into the martial arts. Sir. Any of that because its understood the it's very unlikely as a surgeon that he will actually see any real, combat I mean, if you ever watched the show mash it wasn't like they were confused fighting right only if you are absolutely forced into some very difficult situation, but that's when you just yell no karate, but I know crazy,
that same year, shortly after arriving at fort bragg, Geoffrey and the mcdonald family of four move into the apartment on base and officers housing. This is the five for four or five forty four castle, dr residents. This take in nineteen, seventy, so the setup here is. We have a family of four, the victim, gonna be the wife and the two daughters, the only soul survivor will be the husband and, of course, the wife, and daughters are killed either late on february, sixteenth or very early on February. Seventeenth, the following will be Jeffrey macdonald's account of the events leading up to that and what took place during the tat brought on by these intruders, starting with sad
day february. Fourteenth lieutenant Ronald Harrison made a visit to the mcdonald residence. This would be in the evening hours during the visit harrison and mcdonald discussed the sharon. Tate murder, yeah, that's from the Charles manson case. The conversation comes about because Harrison spotted an issue of esquire. magazine sitting on the coffee table on the cover of the magazine was quote Lee marvin is afraid. Evil lurks in california. Harrison picked up magazine. Looked at it and mcdonald basically told him The issue was a must read, harrison flip through them Zeb, while mcdonald told him about the articles inside mcdonald said that there were, calls about the sharon, tate, murder and a cold in California. Yet I'd be the Charles manson cult
who had a five minute conversation that mostly included joking but also discussed in a serious manner the which the sorcerer, the black swan and the acid goddess. These are all from articles in this particular magazine. They both agreed. It was unbelievable what was happening in California. They went on to discuss drugs and people take drugs. Mcdonald says from what I've read and medically speaking that marijuana isn't so bad, but the harder stuff he had some serious concerns with. So we're setting it up in this manner, because this is an important part of his account, because what happened was just the year before was the share and take in mister This is lobby aka martyrs right, Charles Manson, an manson's family killing people in meeting homes in california, and this now
in thousand early nineteen. Seventy. The trial hadn't even started for manson in his followers. Yet this is big big news and, of course this is something that mcdonald's discussing, but his friend the conversation. Peace was the magazine itself, but this is also a topic of discussion in homes around america at the time, because what went down in california just so heinous and so unbelievable yeah. It's one of the big bang moments. It's like Nobody knows where they were at when Kennedy was shot. I re remembers hearing about them ants and murders every bay knows where thereat on nine eleven is one of the big bang moments. This will lead us to sunday. The fifteenth on Sunday february, fifteenth mcdonald, went to work at the hospital in hamlet, north carolina. He reports nothing unusual.
happening that day. He says that he treated a small number of patients and worked all day long now to be clear captain. This is a twenty four hour shift that he worked from sunday at six, a m to Monday at six, a m probably too long for a servant. Working, steady, the hands my free, I mean I don't want to be the guy that goes into surgery on the twenty. Second, our right, I don't think he's performing geez. I dont know don't airily what he's doing the is surgeon. What else is supposed to be doing shining shoes when he says that he took to naps while on shift and says that he slept for approximately five and a half hours total that day and he went on to say that that would be a bow wow? he would sleep on a normal night at home on Monday february, sixteenth,
when everybody to pay really really close attention to everything that is said here take some notes if you're able to after only if you're driving his shift mcdonald went back to his home at the base and had breakfast with colette in the kids, it sounds like he may have had taken a nap or slept at some point during the daytime on that monday, at four forty five p m mcdonald and his two daughters leave the house to go see the horse that he bought for the family for christmas. The pasture is about five miles from their house lets the horses name. You know what I idly noses at one point I did. What it might help story would call him rusty. I think I think can actually easily find the horse's name, but I I can't recall what it is at this point. At five p m mcdonough
it's daughters, ride and feed the horse, and then they return to the home arriving around five. Thirty two five, forty pm, the mcdonald family of four. They sit down to dinner together for a short dinner at six ten p m. His wife colette left the house for an evening class at the university of north carolina. This was a extension school that was located on the military base. Colette was taking child psychology courses at that time. We should point out some some things here about the family and colette and jeffrey before we move on to far Jeffrey macdonald. He he's a doctor he's a surgeon but he's inc. I mean, he's incredibly smart. Of course, doctors and surgeons are incredibly smart anyway, but we're talking about schooling at princeton and northwestern university, where he graduated near the top of his class
the people that knew these individuals very well would tell you not only was Jeffrey macdonald, incredibly intelligent, but colette might have been smarter than geoffrey and robbers so her life is a little bit on hold, because she's staying at home raising their two children, but we see here when he at home. When he's able to be home between these long shifts, she is able to go and continue her education. Mcdonald's said that after colette left he cleaned up dinner and played with the kids for awhile. His daughter, Kristen went to bed between seven and seventh eddie pm these are very young children kimberly stayed up watching tv mcdonald said he sleep on the living room floor, which was pretty common kimberly, woke him up around eight p m. and he knows this to be accurate as far as the time goes, because
says it kimberly in him always watched a show called laugh in together. It was kimberly's favorite tv show. so she woke him up, so they could watch the tv show together at eight p m and then, after the show he says he put kimberly to bed in her bedroom at nine p m Madame, he returned to the living room to watch. The bob hope special that was on that night brain at nine. Forty p m collect returned home. at that time she changed into her pj's joined mcdonald s the living room where they watch tv together because they had two children because he works so much because colette is in her education? They had very little time to spend just one on one. The two of them, so it is very common that late night. They would spend an hour or two together either watching tv listening to record
We are reading or just talking about their day, that was kind of their time once the kids were put to bed and once all the busyness hustle and bustle of the day to day life was done, he says Oh, let went to bed around midnight mcdonald says he may have dozed off, but spent some time reading a book in watching Johnny Carson. At the same time, he is johnny at one. I am. He shut off the tv and continued reading his book at one thirty, a m Jeffrey mcdonald says he went to bed and he noticed the dishes were not done so I decided alright, I'm not going to bed just yet I'm going to take care of these dishes, so he washes the dishes in straightens up the kitchen a little bit. He says this is to you know, earn some points with his wife and some brownie points. Yeah you do
don't want to upset mom or the wife by not cleaning up the dinner that he probably promised to clean up. Mcdonald says that some time during the last hour that he was up that night, that Christie got out of bed and went into the master bedroom and fell asleep next to colette, her mother. So He goes in to go to bed. He found her in the bed on his side of the bed right. She had wet the bed There was a large wet spot on his half of the bed grey long day. Just did the dishes go you. You almost fell asleep on the couch, but now it's time to go to bed one. You see your daughter there, so you're, a great I hoover I'll know she peed she peed the bed and she's too. So this is fair common that she would get up some time in the middle of the night and creep in and go sleep with mom and dad in their beds.
It's still one of those moments where you like. Can I freakin when one rises we win. One today could have slept easier at the hospital yeah, so he says he picked up. Kristi carried her back to her bedroom placed her in her bed. Then he gives her a bottle. Now he decides rather than he's not going to go sleep in the wet spot. Nobody wants to sleep in the wet spot, regardless of how it got wet. So He decides. You know what, rather than waking up my wife changing. The sheets you know fixing everything up, she's, fine, she's sleeping her half the bed is is fine. He decides it will be easier, if I just go and sleep on the couch for the night go on the couch in the living room, wake up take care of it in the morning right right. He says at that time when he goes to bed when he goes to go to sleep on the couch. He remembers
speculate that the only lights on in the house where a kitchen ceiling light and the main bathroom light mcdonald says he fell asleep within a matter of three to four minutes. He never had trouble falling asleep. Some of us do He never had any trouble falling asleep. It seems like a very likely because he's tired from doing so much all of the time mcdonald says that the next and that he is aware of he's awakened by a scream coming from his wife. He hears is I've screaming he's in the living room and he says
living room when he wakes up to hearing the screaming its mainly darkness in that room. He describes this as a very loud scream and he said it was definitely call let's voice. He says quote things all happened at once. He says I was sitting up. I was hearing this very piercing scream. Then she said quote, meaning colette quote help Jeff. Why are they doing this? To me? There were people at the foot of my couch. He says in the living room. These people are three males and he says then I saw a female behind the three males, so I saw a total of four people to four people is all that he ever says that he's
all during this entire event says I heard kimberly screaming at the same time and I started to get up and said either. What's going on or what the hell's going on or what's going on here. Okay, so let's paint this picture a little bit better. Those are his words Domini give you the colonels words picture this. He says he wakes up and near darkness he's hearing his wife scream Jeff. Why are they doing this to me notices. Three male standing at the foot of his couch he's in the living room collects in the bedroom master bedroom. He notices a woman standing behind the three males and then he's hearing his daughter scream now. At this same, he says at the same time, So I'm going alright same time
either. All three of these things are happening at the same time, wife, screams notices, the people, daughter screams or his words would indicate that the he hears his daughter screaming at the same time as some other event, meaning either his wife screaming or at the same time, that he notices these people in the living room with him. He says: what's going, What the hell's going on. He doesn't remember exactly what he says to these people when he sees them now. Jeffrey says there were two men at the foot of the couch in the third man was between the couch in the coffee table. They were all facing He says he saw a woman behind the two men at the foot of the couch. He goes on, They all I really saw was that it appeared to be a girl with long blonde hair and a big floppy hat. I had the impression that she was holding quote like a candle in her
her hands. He says this because mainly there sort of a light on her face. He does go on to say that it could have been a flashlight. He says there was a light coming from the kitchen and the hallway. There is enough light to see the figures of these people. The silhouette of these people, but not so much enough to see details of these people want to be clear, the mcdonald's house, it's it's connected to other house. Correct. Yes, it's it's an apartment on base, so it's on base officer housing and yes, they share walls with other officers in their fam and is pretty large. I'd almost say that it's almost seems like houses that are connected as opposed to what we would assume as apartments connected really seems like a pretty large space. The bill
itself. No I'm saying the individual units that are you can go online and see diagrams that people have made three d diagrams. If you wanna diving does to the the structure and the lay out of the house yeah, I don't know the square footage of of the apartment itself, but it's cool of that's what I'm looking for now that the easy way to describe it would be long, its rectangular an from I understand and captain the living room that he's an end the if you want to call it the upstairs level or the bedrooms is really only separated by a step or two. If this diagram is correct, it looks like the front of the house is roughly fifty two feet and the depth of the house rough, a I'd say,
the eight thirty feet he goes on to tell us that two of the three men were white and one of the males was black. He says it, black man was wearing an army fatigue jacket. He says that he started approaching me. He raised something over his head and swung it down towards me. I started to fall back and I put my arm up to fend it off this attack.
trying to fend off. Then he hit me on the forehead, at which time I literally saw stars. I was knocked backwards onto the couch. I was becoming more confused. I struggled back to a sitting position and he raised the club up again and started swinging it down. I sort of fended it off. He says I grabbed his arm and slid down onto the club, so I was holding the club with my hands at this time. I saw sergeant stripes on his sleeve so he's saying one of the attackers. The black male is wearing an army fatigue jacket and it's this man who is striking him with something in the forehead and during the scuffle, with this guy he notices sergeant stripes on the army fatigue jacket, while the
It was occurring. He says that the girl he's referring to this. This is a grown woman, but he keeps saying girl, while this is occurring. The girl was saying quote: acid is groovy and kill the pigs. Someone lead once or twice hit. Em again, it may have been the girl. That said this Jeffrey mcdonald says I'm not sure the apple it he's given us a lot of details, but it seems, like he's, also question the details as he's given them. He goes on to say holding onto the club, at which time the struggle became more confusing, I'm guessing. This is because he's been struck in the head with this club, but then I- a terrific pain in my chest. My right chest I assumed I was being punched. I thought I had been punched the chest really really hard. Maybe the wind was knocked out of me. I let go of the club and I be and grappling with the other two men
this time my shirt so mcdonald is wearing his pajamas he's wearing pajama pants and a button up long sleeved pajama top. He says at this time my it was either pulled over my head or it was ripped. I have the feeling it was ripped because I don't remember there's something being pulled over my head. In any case, my shirt, up wrapped around my for arms and partially around my hand, I'm still struggling with these guys I had the impression that one of the white guys I was struggling with, was wearing gloves. I hit one of the men not sure who, in the face, I grabbed one of the men and I was holding onto his hand. I looked, and I saw a blow in his hand, and I really at this point I was being stabbed. I was not being punched
never really got on my feet again. The long sleeve pajama top was still on my arms. The It was he says in my way, so I he was using it as like a buffer right there you strike him or stab. Him are hit him with things and he's got this pajama top. That's now, wrapped around his for arms and hand and he's kind of using as almost a shield, he goes on to say at this point, I was aware of being hit on the left shoulder and head, and I started following I sort of fell towards the stairs at the end of the couch is the hallway it comes out right there in the hallway is too stairs up from the living. I just sort of fell that way, and then I saw right and for For me a in the top of a boot. I was under the impression that it was a female that I was looking at. I saw
a knee in the top of a blue, and I had the impression of the boot being wet. That is the last thing I saw before I woke up and now a word from our sponsor better help. It's my favorite spawn it's the one I use most often it's what has changed. My life so dramatically mental the so important, and something that we need to be discussing every day you now invest time into yourself and taking care of yourself I've tried many ways to make my mental health better and with better help, they are. Peat is look it's the best thing. I've done for my mental health period
better. Betterhelp is online therapy that offers a video phone or even live chat only therapy sessions. So if you don't want, to see anyone on camera. You don't have to as much more affordable than in person therapy and is available worldwide, better help. assess your needs and can match you with your own accredited therapist in under forty eight hours visit, betterhelp dot com, garage and join the over two million people like me, who have taken charge. Their mental health with the help of experienced professional are just get ten percent of their first month that better help dot, slash garage. That's better help. flash garage. I love better how you're going to love better help. I know you will check out better help dot com flash garage today
summer's here, make sure you have all the summer essentials, including highlands. Naturals era drops the number one best selling earache drops for ten years highlands. Naturals earache drops, provides fast and effective relief of the pain and itching of irix from swimmer's, ear, cold and flu and allergies, and it's safe for your whole family for day or night relief. So you can get. Act your summer fast islands, natural's eric drops to healthy summers and beyond available at walmart walgreens target and c b s claims based on traditional homeopathic practice, not accept the medical evidence not after evaluated. the bright. We're back, cheers mates, cheers to you, colonel Hallelujah, to the people in the back, cheers to all you. Snow covered critters out there, let's
ten you on captain with javary mcdonald's account of what went down that night. Ok, when we left off, he says it he's been knocked out. Basically, you know they ve he's been attacked and then this is the last thing I remember was seeing a wet boot who he We belong to the woman that he it in the living room before he blacks out or goes unconscious. At this point he thinks he was hit in the head multiple times by multiple individuals and also possibly stabbed. He goes on to say that the first recollection that he had when he woke up was that I was on my stomach on the hallway floor and my arms were still wrapped in this pajama top. My teeth were chattering, and I thought I was gone into shock. I got up at which time I was dizzy and confused. I had a pain in my chest and it was hard to breathe. So I
down to our master bedroom. I probably I turned on the lights. My wife was lying. of the bed and on the floor, her feet were toward the hallway. Her head was toward the bed. She was sort of next to the bed, partially leaning against the green, easy chair that is next to the bed. She didn't look good at all. She looked very bad. There was a knife sticking out of her chest and, as I was coming into the room, I started taking off this top he's referring to his pajama shirt. So my hands were and when I saw the knife, I pulled it out of her chest and sort of tossed the knife. The knife from somebody's chest might be a very, awkward or maybe on common thing, I think for a normal victim, but we do know that he's a surgeon, so maybe that is a reason why he did so. He goes on to say that I venture to give her in this is his
urge artificial breathing simulation. So maybe that's very doktor speak. I dont know by sepia. Well, not cpr. He simply giving her mouth to mouth resuscitation at that time, but he says that the air bubbles, the air bubbles were coming out of her chest and neck when he's trying to breathe. For her about that. When you're eating your lunch yeah, he says it is. Then He realized that he, the fact the sad fact that he would not be able to revive her. He said that There was no way that she could sustain her own breathing he's a certain so he's going to act a little differently, I think than most people says he then stop doing the mouth. The mouth Annie says. I didn't know what to do so. I covered her chest with my pajama top under the theory that, if she's not dead she's, at least in deep shock,
and you go over and elevate their legs and lie them flat. He says I don't know if was now or later that I checked her pulse, but at this point I re eyes that I had heard kimberly yelling also so what I think he means here captain is that remember, hearing kimberly yelling before he was knocked out. Not did she's yelling at this, it exact moment dec. Or here he, his wife, yell and also possibly one of his children yell. now he's remembering that, so he says I got up again and it was getting harder for him to breathe at this time
as I went down the hallway into kimberly's room kimberly was in her bed on the right side of the bed. I saw what I thought were stab wounds. I didn't notice any other wound. I just saw a lot of blood. I dont know if it was now or later I try to give artificial respiration. I think I tracked her pulse. I turned around went out of the bedroom and into the better. This would be the other little girls bedroom. I found christie lying in her bed. She had a lot of blood on her. I checked her pulse and remember trying to breathe and give her mouth to mouth resuscitation, and the same thing happened. That happened with this okay he's giving this the statements in an interview- and this is his recollection not
with police right. This is an interview, that's not being conducted by police, so he running to say, I believe that did this thing happened when he gave mouth amount to his wife and seeing the air bubbles coming from the chest in the neck. I'm kind of guessing here because he says the same thing happened. That happened with and then the notes state that the interview stopped for about ten minutes because they needed Jeffrey macdonald to. You know regain his composure to carry on with the actual interview. We don't get him to finish. That sentence when in our view, picks up. He says I ran into the hallway and I just stood there not knowing what to do. I noticed blood on my hand, so I went to the master bathroom rinsed my hands off in dried, my hands off with some toilet paper or something
And dropped it either on the toilet or on to the floor, I remember coming into the master bedroom. So I was back to colette his wife. I checked her carotid pulse I took away my pajama top and looked at her chest wounds again and at this time I kind of new. All of this probably occurred in june. The matter of a few minutes. It was getting very hard for me to breathe. My head was really hurting and I was getting dizzy. I just didn't know what to do. There is a phone in the bedroom, so I went over to the phone pick
up the phone and I dialed zero. The operator came on, and I said something to the effect like this is captain mcdonald or doktor mcdonald. I met five. Forty four castle drive and there has been some people stabbed and we need ambulances, doctors and mps, and she said referring to the operator. Is it on poster off post, meaning? where he's calling from and DR macdonald says. I said what the hell are you talking about. She repeated is this on post or off post, DR mcdonald said, for Christ's sake, what difference does that make she said? Well, if it's on post, it's an m p matter military police matter,
I said it is on pups she said. Well, you have to contact the military police and with that he says I just laid down the phone or dropped the phone. He says I went back to kimberly and I went back to christie, checked them for pulses and possibly go the mouth to mouth again. That part is a little confusing to me captain, because it seems to me, like he's already decided, there's nothing more. He could do for at least two of these three victims. I want to bring up to me things that I find suspicious because that's something that we're going to be gone over, but the fact that he he does all these things and checks on so many people before he tries to call for help is definitely something I think needs to be noted. He goes on.
say that he didn't get any pulses and again he says he finds himself standing in the hallway saying to himself. What's going to happen, he says that he then went to the kitchen. There's there's another phone in the kitchen area. He says I went to the kitchen phone through the dining room picked up. The phone in the operator was already on the line she had no broken the connection he says. I said this is captain mcdonald at five, forty four castle drive just a minute I'll connect you to the mps there. Apparently that's what she's saying to him. He says that he heard some dial tones and clicks and in a military police officer came on the line and said: can I help you mcdonald says I said people have been stabbed and I asked repeatedly for an m p for doctors and ambulances. I told them. I
five forty four castle drive. He said there on their way. Mcdonald says again: he dropped the phone at this time. He says I all covered in blood from the kids and from colette I rinsed off in the sink. I started out the kitchen, and that's really the last thing. I remember the next thing I remember so he's blacking out again. The next I remember I was being given mouth to mouth by an mp off when I was awaken. I was right next to my wife on the floor in the master bedroom. I remember: there's people all around me and all I could
see. Was the mp shiny helmets, I saw this circle of people and they were all talking yelling and screaming. Put that down don't touch her. They put me on a stretcher. I kept asking about my kids every one kept telling me every ones. Ok, they took me to a hospital where they were treating me he said everyone during the treatment process kept telling him to calm down that everyone's okay. But, finally, a doctor came to check on him, and he says it was a that he knew and had worked with at one point, and he said I kept ass, him over and over. How are they? He said? No one. I told you, I said no, he said they're all dead. He paused and said I'm sorry to tell you
mcdonald says I was crying for a while. Then the doktor came back in and asked what he could do and make Donald said. Call my mother and call my in laws and have them come right away, but don't tell them what happened but question for you, because the the the initial nine one one called talking to the operator phone down going to the hallway coming back talking to the operator putting the phone down again Does that remind you of any case that we've covered. It reminds me a lot of the the scott peterson, the the staircase murder, that's right, where the nine one one call where it seems like he's panicking, but then he eats back and away from the call. Then getting back on the car oddly enough, another military man as well yeah now, according to
just general knowledge. This is all agreed upon by all parties involved on February. Seventeen that three forty two a m me now, because we do not have mcdonald filling a sin with any exact times here when all of this is taking place right. So at three forty two, a m dispatchers at fort bragg, were notified. by a chief operator of the carolina telephone company regarding a call for help that they receive the operator patch. The call through to fort bragg, where Jeffrey mcdonald reported that quote, some people had been stabbed his residence in that he needed mps and medics and ambulances when the mp and medics arrived, Madame was found on the master bedroom floor lying partially on his stomach with one of his arms across collects upper body. Mcdonald tells mp
the medics that he and his family were attacked by four hippies and we'll circle back to that. Real quickly, mcdonald is in transferred to cape fear, hospital for treatment, collette, kimberly and kristen are all pronounced dead. They are transferred The morgue at cape fear hospital. It's interesting how many cases are similar, but this on his kind of amalgamation of multiple cases, oh won the chris watts case that the scott pearson case in and then you mix in the same shepherd case, and now you have the jeffrey mc donkey, so some things real, quick that I want to touch on in his account that might clear some things up. It might just muddy the waters even more. I don't know, but, as the captain said, we're going to go through this in a very compartmentalized way, but I wanted to touch on some of these things before we simply forget to get to them. So he says the very basic gen.
Description, that's in the papers and put out everybody immediately. Is it this Jeffrey macdonald, this respected doctor this research Did green bahrain member. Army. He says that we are attacked by four hippies there's some three major dispute going on. If that was in fact what he said, because people that this case is one of the most debated cases I think to hundred to date I mean it's up there with any of the are ones that you hear people that they start off having a very intelligent discussion did heightens yelling and screaming matches because people are so dumb. I did one way or the other did. Jeffrey mcdonald kill his family, or did this group of four hippies kill his family like he says, as some people would say so debatable that two debated itself you'd have to be a master debater
Well, one of the very first things that comes into question is he gives a description of the attackers and people are saying well he's, calling them hippies. Yet one of them had on an army fatigue jacket to which he says he noticed sergeant stripes ever that look, we ve all seen force gump right when he goes to the capital and he and they have the protesters. They have the hippies protest in vietnam and he gets mixed up in them. There's a lot It's so called you know, quote unquote hippies and what were they wearing they're wearing army fatigues? It was very fashionable in the mid sixties to to mid seventies well, and I think the description of hippie sometimes can be open to interpret
patient a little bit yeah or go go see a bunch of footage of John lennon performing and he's constantly wearing what army fatigues his. He was. The definition of the biggest icon of the hippie movement. Well in what mcdonald would later say is. I never said the word hippies. I never said it was for hippies. I simply described or people that I saw by an somebody from the army or somebody from the newspaper changed it to a very general description of four hippies. Now I can kind of believe that because we ve been doing this long enough. Captain I've seen things get skewed in the news in the papers because it sells copies. We ve talked about it, men times it gets clicks on the internet. Obviously, that's not a concern back in nineteen seventy, but it also gets people talking gets people tuning into the news. What would have been on everyone's mines is what we just talked about earlier. The man said family certainty, yet
crazy hippies that that broke into homes and and murdered everybody inside and and wrote things on, the walls yeah. I bet, if you look back at what of whatever articles were writ about the manson family in these court, on quote so called hippies. If that was lingo that was used in those reports. That's why that lingo was used, and this is now very interesting lee, though we have a similar situation here at the mcdonald home after the attack. So all four of the people, inside the home. Three of them are left dead, and on the wall in the bedroom. I apologise not on the wall was on the head board to the the bed in the master bedroom. Somebody wrote the word pig in blood right, which is with coalesce blood. We would later
figure out yeah, which is something that was rumored. I don't think it was confirmed in the the manson murders, but supposedly there was the words pig, britain and blood and those murders as well well yeah that that definitely happened in both of those while the saying actions with that at the time of this murder since the trial didn't happen, I just wonder if that was actually confirmed, you saw him saying yes and this we should be clear here. We already pointed out that this account that he's given is an account that he is given to in a person conducting an interview of a reporter. This is not his words, too, the mps when he's interviewed right after the attack, although he would tell us that this is the same thing that he told the military police,
right. I've seen that version. It is very similar, but the things that that are little wonky again, the word hippies. He says he never used the word hippies and second, it's very quickly pointed out mcdonald during the investigation that the triple homicide investigation, that are you sure that this woman was holding a candle and in his initial statement he does say candle. I believe she was holding a candle, because I saw some kind of flickering glowing light on her face. They say you know we didn't find any evidence of of wax of candle wax in the living room. Right, but just because is holding a candle doesn't mean that they're going to find wax on the floor. Well, is what's interesting. He may have been altering his statement to play. Along with what we're finding or not finding at the scene, because in this interview he sang it may have
a flashlight, I don't know, I didn't see a candle. I didn't see a flashlight, I simply saw the, it's shining up on her face. Yes, and it could be multiple things. It could be a candle, it could be a flashlight, it could be a knife that was somehow reflecting light onto her face sad, mcdonald's mother is called and his in laws are called. They obviously rush to fort bragg and unfortunately, there's going to be funeral services held for three on February 21st. A little background story, though, to talk about freddy and mildred kassab this is his in laws right collects. Father died when she was very young and freddy cassava married her mother, when colette was still pretty young,
member we said that these two had a relationship in high school. They were friends, boyfriend, girlfriend that sort of thing on and off the cause ah by freddy, in Mildred new jeffrey well well, before the two ever got married and this friday to sob look him up sometime or if you read up, want to read further on this case. You'll find the same thing. I believe you'll find the same thing that I thought this guy is. He's a very likeable guy, but he's also very personable. He seems to be very personable with everybody and what I mean is that he treated mildred's. Daughters and in her children as if they were his own, he raised, of they loved him dearly and freddy cassava loved Jeffrey Mcdowell, dearly and immediately after this, this was a weird case, because
they're going to go and look for these. Whatever you want to call him for hippies the mp are there not gonna, find anybody, then, find anybody matching that description. They don't arrest. Anybody matching that description, and after days and days, people go from feeling bad for Jeffrey mcdonald to deciding will maybe he is lying, maybe he's the one that is responsible for the murder of his family and his freddy cassava, his father in law. I think this is a rare thing. I don't think we ve seen this in a lotta cases. Captain Freddy cassava goes to bat for Jeffrey mcdonald. One hundred percent stands by this guy. He says You you'd have to be crazy to think that Jeffrey mcdonald would kill his family. He was very vocal about it and he stood in front of the media in the newspapers and told all of them that they are crazy for claiming that jeffrey mcdonalds
kill us fan right, because normally what happens while they had some fights? They had some money problems. My my son in law, he was a little bit of a hothead right. That's normally what you hear that it's a possibility, We couldn't believe it at all with the other scott pearson case right. I believe it at all, but then more things that are uncovered you start going won't. Maybe this is a possibility. Maybe it is a possibility and then you have to go well if he did do it. What is the motive for it? There's? That is another question. Mark another big question mark case. Did he have a motive to kill his family? Some say that it was because he was angered that the child wet his bed and that its It is a small argument that escalated greatly again. This You know the more and more that I know,
You have been researching cases years before I ever did, but again this guy you're, going to tell me that this guy, his daughter, probably what the bed multiple times, but he to go to bed and she wet the bed and he he decided to then kill everybody and then he's going to make up this story about these intruders, and it's it's very silly jonbenet ramsey jonbenet ramsey, wet the bed, and so the mother decided, while she has to die and We should point out was pregnant with what would have been the third child for the mcdonald family and did they know what the sex was? I believe this time it was going to be a boy Why so? She was well into her pregnancy and luck. Macdonald had affairs He went outside of his marriage, not once not twice, probably put a number on it. Five.
Thousand million. want to put a number on it. I I don't know for certain, but I know that it was his kid. Jillian have a number, according to all the reports and everything that I've read over the years, that it was multiple times but hold on the sailor way. So he's a scumbag cheater but well anyway, surgeon was known to some people that the collapse and Geoffrey had argued and fought about this type of cheating behaviour. Before that it was kind of a long, ongoing argument. So so he is a cheater. We know that she was it's like the common thread, the guy's, a cheater. Then he murdered his wife and son I'm so murders his family, but is there any financial troubles? I mean he there living on fort bragg and he's a certain, so pray makes decent money as a green bird.
surgeon. I dont think that we have any kind of money issues. I mean they purchased a horse for his daughters for christmas rusty just months before this, and I think that there is not money issues, because look one given the time period. Nineteen seventy people spent their money and lived a little quite a bit differently, actually back then than they do today, but that a step further their living in officer housing. He is working in his profession. That will pay him handsomely at some point, being a surgeon they're, just a young family You know they're just a young family with too little kids in their they're coming up through the world they're, building their family, their building, their their life, and you know so if, if he was an issue? I don't think it would be a long term issue right, I also wonder if, father in law knew about his infidelity. I believe that he did, and I say that because
obvious to me that colette had expressed the difficulties in the the trouble with her marriage to her mother and given freddy cassava personnel, d, him being so personal and so loving entrusting to his wife and in her children. This not a guy that it strikes me that you keep stuff from this guy when he walks into a room. it's very obvious. He's in charge of the whole room, he takes over a room in that manner. But he's also, like I said, extremely personable and loyal to the people around him. This all took place as said captain on february, sixteenth and seventeenth, in seventy. It wouldn't be until July of nineteen. Seventy, when Jeffrey mcdonald is going to have to go to trial for the murders.
Of his family, and I and I should clear that up in clean that up a bit because s not exactly what's happening here. It's it's! What the army calls and artists Thirty two hearing to the civilians out there. I would like, in this too, like kind of like a grand jury hearing. Where we are going to decide, if there's enough evidence here to charge the sky and bring him to court, but because it took place at fort bragg, ah military property. It's the military's jurisdiction as a whole on So what we have is a guy that claims that these intruders killed his family. But doesn't seem like we have a lot of evidence that there was even intruders in the house. So as far as the investigation goes, that's kind of why they're forced into this, you know hey, we, we don't have much evidence
There is even other individuals there. So now we need to look at the most likely suspected and crime like this, the husband and then from that they're trying to determine if there's enough evidence against him to take him to try the short of it captain regarding this article, thirty, two hearing that's conducted by the military
They decide that there's really not enough evidence to go forward and try Jeffrey macdonald for the murders of his family. In fact, they they the case with the suggestion that the the mps, or maybe even civilian, police and law enforcement agencies, look for these four people that mcdonald says broke into the apartment and murdered the family. I mean cases specially that are this horrifying? You want to kill them because we don't get it right. You can't ever charge him again, and I think this is one of those cases where we can spend the time doing this
very and telling you what happened and how it played out in this thing was a monster of a story to tell because it's a story that that spans decades and decades of action in and outside of the courtroom and will get back to the storytelling portion a bit. But what I think is really key here: in this case is that we look at what we know. We look at the facts we examine it here in the garage and see what our opinions are as well as the listeners out there to figure out if Jeffrey macdonald is in fact guilty of these murders. So, let's start with the autopsies. So the following is a list of wounds that were inflicted upon the mcdonald's family.
and will go through these victim by victims, starting with collect mcdonald, collect sustained several blunt trauma, injuries to her head and arms. She was struck at least six times in the head. With a blunt object, resulting in lacerations to her right, temple left, temple forehead and on top of her head, All of these lacerations were deep enough to expose bone. She also received two blows under her chin, resulting in extensive bruising to the left front chin area and the right front. Chin area there was a small fee. picture in the midline portion of colette skull. The blunt trauma, injuries to collect arms were defensive type wounds. You see very often so you're seeing obvious signs of she was attacked with a club or something of that nature struck in her head area.
And she's trying to block these blows during the scuffle using her hands and forearms right and what's interesting, here is these injuries. The blunt force trauma to her head would be consistent with Jeffrey macdonald. What he says he was attacked in the living room and to believe his story. You have to believe that somebody started to attack her and that she woke up? Then she defended herself collects right. Risk was fractured and the inner aspect of her upper arm bore and extensive bruce and a superficial abrasion. The fingers and hand of her right arm had extensive black and blue marks associated with abrasion, so this is not a one and done attack that happen very quickly. This is a fight that we're
here. We know this by collects injuries. Her left arm was also fractured in two places, so finding herself in being struck so hard that whatever he's being hit with is breaking bone as she's trying to fend it off does Of course they have any clue to what this object would be. Yes, in fact, it's believed that all of the murder weapons- and I say all because there are different types of attacks here- right, different types of wounds indicating different murder, weapons. All of them were found at the crime scene. So one was a it's been referred to as a club and some statements mcdonald says that he believed he was being hit with a bat. The best way to describe this quota cut, Club is it's like a slat that you would use for a bed and it's believed well, I should say, believed it seems
black comes from the house, but the knife comes from the house as well, so there were two knives and a nice pic. So those are your for murder. Weapons remember make add room noted collect also had nine deep knife wounds to the front of her neck and seven deep knife wounds to her chest and twenty one hunks, your wound Stuart chest area, and but you are also saying that than the knife was found at the scene of the crime is Ah, yes, so for my understanding here, captain what we have is we have for murder weapons. One is that club that we just kind of described in which you think as a slack that came from the master bed. That's that's what investigators have stated so do investigators also believed that the not only this, It comes from the house, but the knife comes from the house as well, so there were two knives and an ice pick. So those are your.
War. Murder weapons. Remember mcdonald's account he hold the knife out of collects chest and just kind of tossed it arrived or throw it down. So that goes it. What they find at the scene backs up his story for that portion, at least that one sentence, because they find a knife in the master bedroom on the floor, but they find the club the ice pick a knife outside of the apartment, so they find them. Basically what you would call the back yard, even though this is a shared space where they have a front door to the apartment in a back door to the apartment. When officers arrived at the scene, they found the front door locked and secured they found the back door open, and it's right at a bush near this back door at the
of a bush where they find these murder weapons like. So. If, if four people went into the house killed this family, they must have. in through the back door. Maybe it was left unlocked and when they laughed, they of course left the back door, unlocked left the door slightly ajar and it would appear that they just talk weapons down as they were fleeing the apartment but you're right. Captain one voice A difficult thing that I have with this story is that mcdonald says that he didn't recognize some of these items. and yet the mps in the detectives would tell us that they believe that they reason to believe that all of these items came from the mcdonald family from from their home right. You have the picture. This this story starts become very incredible. Very fast did these?
or individuals happened to find and unlocked back door to the mcdonald family home enter with no weapons? go around the house collecting weapons of their own. And using these weapons on the family and then toss them aside as they flee the crime scene. It has been a mixture of both yeah, I mean they could have found some of the items there. They could abroad, maybe one or both of the knives with them, but the the police and law enforcement have said. The knives belong to thee mcdonald family that because they think there are part of a set the answers. I do not know what there basing this off of. I don't have any reason to not believe this statement, because this thing, gone to trial. You know the article thirty two, during and then we have the actual trial of Jeffrey mcdonald later, and it seems be agreed upon that that these items came from the apartment, Kimberly mcdonald was struck,
at least three times in the head, with a blunt object, kimberly's right cheek right, ear and right mastoid area had one aces black and blue marks morning- irregular abrasions her, I was recessed and she had a fractured nose which was deviated to the right. Her left, cheekbone was fractured and a piece of the cheekbone was protruding through the In cumberland skull showed multiple fractures in the dome portion of her skull was fractured through its entire thickness. Its horrific to describe these things in, and I hate having to say these words, but to put it so lay her head was bashed in I mean that's how brutally she was attacked and they found eight to ten deep knife wounds on the right side, of her neck. This is one of those weird cases captain and ghana,
as this warning out to you, because you cannot hands these things, you can find crime scene, photographs, colored photographs on line of the mcdonald crime scene Unfortunately, you can see these victims pictures of these victims while they were found that night, when mps responded to the call kristen mcdonald, sustained twelve knife wounds, tour upper back four wounds to her chest and one to the neck to the wounds to her back penetrated her heart, causing massive internal bleeding fifteen, shallow puncture wounds were found in her chest, as well as multiple cuts on both of her hands. There was a through and through laceration of the skin and
in the middle of the right ring finger, so this young girl is attacked. She stabbed, as said, but again we are seeing obvious signs of defensive wounds here, the she as these wounds to her hands and fingers, because she's putting them up trying to prevent whatever attack is going on at that time it. But you know the knife the last oration that we just discussed about the middle of the right ring finger, was deep enough to expose bone and the index finger of the right hand, revealed a triangular flap of skin, so using the hands to try to fend off this attack. This brings us to Jeffrey macdonald, the man that says, He was sleeping on the couch and wakes up in the middle of the night and he's being attacked by three and in the living room. He says that he's attacked their. He
says that he hears his wife screaming in the bedroom. He hears his daughter screaming in her bedroom now his injuries- are, as such, mcdonald sustained bruising over the left. I beneath the hairline, a abalone of the upper left arm a stab wound of the left bicep. He also received a I love so, of course, he's having difficulty breathing during this time. We went through all of that for me to say, and I don't want to speak for the captain here cuz again. This is a case that everybody has their own opinion on it, and some of them are very strong. Some people are very strong in their opinions, this strikes the blows to the head. He said that it became increasingly more difficult to breathe, while this is going to be because he stabbed in the abdomen in the chest area, and one of these stabs is powerful enough. It
between two of the ribs on the right side of his chest, which resulted. In a collapsed right. Lung so, of course, he's having difficulty breathing during this time. We went through all of that for me to say- and I don't want to speak for captain here cause again? This is a case that everybody has their own opinion on it in some of them are very strong. Some people are very Strong in their opinions on this case, but we go through all of that for me to tell you this I see here and what I question here is. I have three female victims collect and her two small young daughters, on these three individuals, icy overkill on Jeffrey mcdonald, I see exactly what he described in his defence, it's exactly as he would describe it wounds. I would
the sea on him, given his account of what happened. However, how does for people kill three individuals so brutally to the point that there and maybe, if you know anything about fort bragg, maybe you know he is a part of the the one major threat you have in this house has disclosed say that is the all out of account any intruder, He does not have anywhere near the number of blows, stabs blood on him that cause it If you're, one of the true you don't know who This guy is you're you're on fort bragg. If you don't know who this guy is all soon. That is he's an officer of the military right. and maybe, if you know anything about four bragged, maybe you know he is a part of the green box.
I don't know if they separate the people like that in the housing. Let's take that all out of account any intruder that goes into any house who's their biggest threat to them. The two year old girl, the five year old girl, the mother or the husband, probably the husband and you're going to have. and what he tells you at least two males and a female in the same room, to attack him with multiple weapons and, like you said, the other ones, their bodies are mangled and he how is alive yet we know this from seeing these other attacks and other cases where people break into a home.
Or you know home invasion type cases, bt, K, type cases. The first thing that they do is neutralize the threat. Jeffrey macdonald is the number one threat to he's intruders. Maybe they neutralized him. It seems like if we believe mcdonald, that they did a good job to neutralize him say that, but then what the overkill on these other three individuals. Why didn't? They finished job on Jeffrey macdonald. Are we I believe, mcdonald that he just was able to fight them off better than his other, family members, join us back here in the garage tomorrow same back time same bet, channel and until then began
be kind and don't let the.
Transcript generated on 2022-07-15.