« True Murder: The Most Shocking Killers

BONE CRUSHER-Linda Rosencrance

2010-11-24 | 🔗
When the urge took hold, serial killer Larry Bright brought women back to his home. After raping and murdering his victims, he brutally disposed of their bodies. Sometimes he built a white-hot fire and burned them in his backyard. Other times he dumped them along nearby roads and fields. For years, Bright had trolled the roads and back streets of Illinois for the most helpless, desperate women he could find. Then one woman escaped, and suddenly police were looking for bodies everywhere-trying to find out how many women Bright had really killed and what he'd done with their remains. Step by step, an all-out investigation would shock hardened detectives. From interviews with women who survived their encounters with him to the forensic search for bone fragments and pieces of burned, buried flesh, the case against Larry Bright finally closed like a vise-on the man who turned his victims into ashes. BONE CRUSHER-Linda Rosencrance
This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
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Yeah. You're not listening to true murder, the most shocking killers in true crime history and the authors that have written about him. Gacy Bundy Dahmer, the night stalker BT came every week. Another fascinating offer talking about the most shocking, an infamous killers into crime history through murder, with your host journalist and offer Dan asking. Good evening this is your host desert asking for the programme to murder the most shocking killers in true crime, history at the There's that a written about them when the earth took hold serial killer, Larry Bright, but women back to his home
hi. I'm J Foreigner, ceo of quick in loans, America's largest mortgage lender. Let's talk credit card debt for a minute. If you feel you're carrying too much of it, you're, not alone the average household in the. U S carries over eight thousand dollars in credit card debt, ready for some good NEWS with a cash out refinanced from Quicken loans. You can quickly and easily put some of the equity in your home to good use by paying off a lot of that high interest credit card debt. A great way to take cash out is, with our thirty year fixed rate mortgage. The rated at our thirty or fixed rate mortgage is three point: nine percent AP our four point: zero. Eight percent call us today, at eight hundred quick and to learn how taking cash out with a thirty or fix mortgage might be the right solution for you and for a record nine years in a row. Gaiety power has right click and loans highest in the nation in customer. Satisfaction for primary mortgage origination calls today at eight hundred quickened or go to rocket mortgage dot com for data power. What information visibility particle rates of exchange? At one point, five percent feed received just gonna break off across information intentions. Equalising wondered lessons not that estates and unless number thirty after raping and murdering his victims, he brutally dispose of their bodies. Sometimes he built a white hot
and burnt them in his backyard other times you dont them long. Nearby, roads field for years, bright had told the road In back streets of Illinois for the most helpless desperate women, he could find the and one woman escaped and suddenly police were looking for bodies everywhere, trying to find out how many and bright had really killed him, but he done with their remains step. By step allowed investigation would shock hardened attacked it for many with women who survive their counters with him, for the forensic search for bone, fragments and pieces of burned, buried, flash the case against Larry Bright finally closed with a voice on the man to turn his victims into ashes bone picture with my special guest, Linda Rosenkrantz. Thank you very much for
to this programme and welcome back their programme linen rose and grant. Thank you very much, then. Thank you. First off what made you decide to write about this killer, and this case in particular. Well MA am. My publisher always tells me that readers like to read a book serial killers and in my research I came across this the case and I was fascinated he killed. You know eight women and I thought what would make someone do such a thing and just got involved in it. An when, from there. Now the story of bone crusher is set in Peoria. Il San tell us where that is in relation to Chicago and and from your research, what type of community is Piora Peoria. What is it best known for and after that you can tell us about the what's really featured in this book is
also the low track. That's featured in this the place where the most vulnerable, women or availed. You yourself tell us a little bit about that set the set the scene for us sure I'm about one hundred and sixty five miles south of Chicago is between Chicago and Saint Louis, and Anna Blue Collar Community Blue Collar city, industrial. You know in industry started there, it was pork industry and flour. Mills and you know it has universities and it's always been known as sort of a typical american city and the fray days will it play in Peoria. I'm sure folks have heard that right right, originative there, because because it was such a typical city in the twenty authorities, vaudeville acts would go to Peoria in and
try their acts out and if it worked in Peoria, they figured it would work across the country right So you know it has. It has everything it is affordable, housing, this great schools, colleges, medical facilities, arts, but, as I mentioned in and books is Acedia side to the city and it's a place, that's just inhabited by prostitutes and drug addicts, an people like Larry Bright who preyed on them right now lair. Bright is the or a central figure of this story. Tell us about his life growing up. And tell us about his mother. Surely, in their relationship from what you could find right, well, vague, he He was born in California, and then the family moved to a city in Illinois Morton and his parents divorced when he was
young and his father really wasn't in his life until he was maybe in high school. So he was really a mama's boy. She would do anything for him and he would do anything for her. You know he was a type of kid in high school got in trouble like to party. Do drugs involved in burglaries fight? You know ended up in prison, so you know he didn't have a great bringing at all no one really there is no real male role model anyway. Ah, what was from his friends that grew up with them type of personality other than get in trouble. What was he a person that had a lot of friends despite his criminal leanings? There was a? U, with what kind of
personality was I mean he had some friends not a whole lot, but he just like to party they would go into the woods there was there were various camping sites with they would just go and do drugs and drink and party, and that was pretty much what his life was growing up. How was he with women? Did he have early relationships with girls? What was what was his relationships with women like when he was young and growing up with. I don't know that I wasn't able to find that out. I tried talking wanted to talk with his mother, but she, you know she called me back and decided not to so. I so? I don't really know about his relationships when he was in high school now you're you're talking about Larry bright as a young man in his 20s early or late teens.
What was his personality like you said he liked a party but of what was is what was his as idea. Did he go to dinner frequent prostitutes at an early age. From all the information you gotta know, which it doesn't seem like at an early age and I'm not exactly sure when that started it? It probably started, maybe in his later later 20s I would think after he was in prison for burglary and and after he got out of prison, I think and he had a serial serious relationship as several of them as a matter fact, and he was married in no time in his own, although one woman told him that they had a son, but the son really wasn't his and he was dead. The stated but find that out so
It's really unclear when, when he started, because he told so many stories that it it just wasn't clear what to believe. Now you talked about the drug use and partying and we're talking about crack cocaine. So this is this: is a drug problem evolved if you're resorting to crack Cain rather than some other drugs? So when from your research, when did he seem to be seriously doing Rocco came around what age in and what part? What time of his life? Was he doing this again? I think I would say it was probably Lee while I think he started that early on I mean you know they said how does smoking marijuana and then I think they went into cocaine. You know maybe in his early 20s, so pretty hard and drug user. Now
did you do for employment was was interested he he did sort of odd jobs. He build Barnes and and dismantled Barnes, and did brick weigh work and yard work whatever he could find. No discernible skills that I could determine Now, what was his relationship with his mother and where did he live and under what circumstances when he lived? this mother throughout most of his life, except when he was married. They lived at one house in Illinois and then in Peoria, and then they he lived in the basement and then when they bought the house at which he murdered
the women he was living in sort of a a makeshift garage type apartment, no, no kitchen bathroom, one sort of one large room: Anna, a bath and his mother lived in a larger house in the front. From your from everything, did you learn it in writing? Spock. What was the mother was a mother like what was what was her lifelike her life wasn't easy. There were They wouldn't insinuations that at one point in her life. She was a prostitute, but no one ever move that. So it's really unclear, but she seems like a hard war. Looking really nice woman who had no idea what her son was doing, you know I'm not sure if it's that she didn't think
he could do anything wrong or she just just didn't, have a clue about what he was doing, though you he was married to someone. What was that Mary just like? How long did it last? What was it characterized by? Did you find out think about that marriage? If it wasn't, I don't and at last, very long and and I'm sorry this is what they were. So many is involved that I don't remember everything, but, but he was abusive to the women. He was with as a matter of fact, I think one of them was pregnant and he he he was defending himself, but he at her and and and she had go to the hospital and I'm sorry- I don't remember if she lost the baby or not, but
you did right so so he was an abusive personality, so it didn't last very long. Now a lot of stuff starts happening in Peoria in the low track. There is a woman named Linda Fields that was found dead on February 24th, two thousand, and how was she pardon me in Westconsin in Wisconsin, How is she killed and what was your relationship to Larry Bright and where was aided her and her body was found, she had been strangled and her body was dumped under a tree near her home Lake Ave and she was just wearing a nightgown and her shoes when next to her and and Larry coincidentally, or not moved back to Peoria the same month, her body was found now Larry in his interviews with police.
He says he killed her. He said he didn't killed her kill her. He said he doesn't remember said he has visions where he killed her, maybe dreams. He just doesn't know so her death was never attributed to him. Now you get a little bit ahead, so I just wanted to make sure that with this late right was he a person at least of interested police, at least Ashton him at that time, not at that time, no, not until he had been arrested for the murders in Peoria. Now will jump ahead, a little bit to March 21st or march of two thousand and one or March 21st, two thousand and one, and what occured that day, that I think
If I remember it was the day that can givens heard them some dirt bikers yelling, something in a field and apparently they had seen they had found a body of a woman, and that was wonder, Jackson and she was one of the first bodies found, but ultimately they could never connect. Larry to Herman Y know. You include in bone crusher, talkest real killer, Joseph Miller, as well as other serial killers. Why include Miller and another serial killers, and why are they important part of your story? Well, Miller had killed women in Chicago and he had been in prison for fifteen years and then got out and murdered four
for three or four more women in Peoria in nineteen. Ninety, three nine yeah he was found guilty in ninety four of murdering three piora prostitutes, and so police were finding bodies of other women, but then, but then discovered that they were probably connected to him rather than to Larry. So you know they they were finding finding bodies, but the reason I included other serial killers is because they all well. I can't they all button, but this sort of up, but they could do similar things and pray on similar people. You know they prey on the most vulnerable, the people they think no one is going to miss. You know that the sober about what sort of why I include include them and also to show in
Miller actually it was the first time that dna evidence was used in Peoria County to convict a murderer. They analyze the dna in the blood in connected him to the women yeah, and it also it also well, is real evidence that its quite the phenomena when you can name two or three serial killers or there's, there's suspicion of two or three serial killers in one place ahead of small area outside of Chicago. Absolutely, that's incredible! You know a lot more prevalent in people think! Ok! Now on June July, twenty seven two thousand and three Sabrina Pay and was found. Who was she and how did she die? Well, she did. They were all african american women and she was found in a cornfield in Tremont Township in Tazewell County. The bodies were.
Disposed of in Peoria and Tazewell County, and but you know she was. She was like the other women on the street selling their bodies for drugs. I would say most of these women were drug attics, more so than prostitutes. They were only into prostitution to pay for that drug habits. All I wanted to do we'll get high and you know an answer. She she was dumped in the corn field. No, not too many months later February. Fifth, two thousand and four another victim is found and who do? Who do police find Fibre Williams gentleman, who was
on the way to drive his wife to work? The body of a woman in the snow man he went in and call polices is that with this one, this gap she was in the snow shoes she closed. Her feet were in the roadway. And when police were called they, they thought that maybe she had been dragged from one place to another. Now these women so far have been strangled. Yes, all of them So far is already thing that the killer left is in terms of how he strangled them. Is there any evidence of there any similarities so far with any of these victims other than their black prostitutes from the low track? No, no, no our two weeks later, incredibly Fred,
Eureka Brown is discovered and who is she and how is she discovered? They found her again lying in the snow in Pier county, but man driving in all terrain vehicle found her near Hanna City and she had been strangled. She was dumped about thirty feet from the roadway. She was wearing a coat and gain then a shirt, and if they did they, they weren't sure. If she had been walking in the area, but she had been there for a for a number of months. I thought she was there for awhile and and she had lived with her boyfriend, who was also addicted to drugs, and she had three children who in foster care and- and you know another person with a hard life she's been arrested. Prostitution, battery robbery
And another woman ultimately like want wander Jackson, did we get one Jackson, I'm sorry, but Larry was not connected to this. They couldn't connect him police think. Ultimately they think he murdered her, but he never confessed to her. He never confessed to two of the women The police found ten women over this period of time, but Larry, I confess to murdering eight of them, though, by this time you know, weren't, you, February two thousand and four and there's been needs a bunch of victims and is what is the? What is the presses, response. Is there? Is it? Is it high profile what is going on Peoria in terms of the media and
what's going on with the police, is not half or set up yet one night. The cat in TAT fourth is set up, yet you know them obviously the more bodies they find, the more they thinking. Maybe these are connected and- and I'm sorry I'm just I'm- not- I think the the media- obviously or not. I think that they're sort of involved in this, but there's not a lot of media attention. If I recall at the moment there were obviously newspaper articles in the Pr Journal STAR, you know each time a body was found, but no one was connecting them yet right and the police certainly worked so right. Ok, so, but we jump ahead to August 22nd and a woman named Laura Lawler is found and
who is she and how was she found? Is there any? Is it similar or is there some differences, differences Lara Larry disposed of aid of his victims with intact, bodies, four of them, including Laura he burned, and so police police didn't find her on August 22nd, she was reported missing on August 22nd, but police didn't find robotics. There was nobody to find Larry built a fire in his backyard and burned these women and then after the fire die down, he would take what remains of their bones and crush them. Hence the name Bonecrusher,
and then he would scoop up the bone and ash in pails or buckets actually big frosting buckets that his mother got when she worked at a local supermarket and dispose of the remains at various places. Around Peoria in Tazewell County, he disposed of some of the bones in his grandmothers yard, so you know Larry ultimately confessed and said that he strangled her in and a body and then just dump the remains. So please didn't know about her at this point. Hooker reported missing. Ok, I know there are some people but come forward and very interesting characters so that the police have some idea who Larry Bright is 'cause, he's not on their radar. Initially right. What happens? There are some characters: Vicki Bowman
there is another woman named Tiffany Hughes who is who is Vicky Vicki by the way Balmar was a woman she's. Ultimately the woman who testified against very ad in court at a hearing and they got an indictment he could. He kidnapped her raped. Her I'm took her back to his house. Probably would have done to her what he did to the rest of them murdered her, but she locked herself in the back room and he tried he tried to get her out. And finally, he said: if you just come out I'll, take you home and she had didn't, have much choice. Now, what it seemed was when the women, the women who fought, the hardest. He let go for whatever reason
but he you know it. Maybe it's just. I don't know why I can't get into his head, but but she got away and she he said alright I'll, take you back, but when they went when he they were walking to his truck. She saw a neighbor for his and she ran over to the woman and said you know he just tried to rate me. He wanted to kill me and the woman said. Let me call the police and she said no just take me home and so Vicki. She didn't tell anybody, you can go to the police, but someone, but after all these murders started happening. Someone went to them if any went to the police apple. Well, given what are to the police and said that she another woman, she also had been raped and kidnapped by Larry, and then someone
went to the police and said you know. Maybe you should talk to Vicki Bowmar, because she told me the same thing happened right now, who is stiff Hughes, Tiffany Hughes, was with another woman who was taken by Larry and her story beard in the Peoria Journal STAR, and so you know she said I was kidnapped by this guy. No, he tried to kill me, and so they ran her story and after Vicki Ball. My friend, I think I saw that story. They went to police and and said we are or just hearing more about the murders, the fray and said you know you should talk to Vicki because she said the exact same thing. You know, but none of the big he didn't go to the police initially, because she had a warrant out for her arrest and so she was afraid afraid to go because she was afraid she would be arrested.
And in that interim there were other victims. We didn't we'll go through some of the other victims, but it is surely an trap right under the opposite was tomorrow Tabby Wall Fright, there is also everything, really seems to get started after Linda Niels Discovery, and then the task force try to link her death with five other right prostitutes from the railroad they will carry area right. That's all little bit about that task force its out. I just mentioned it after Lyndon eels bodies. Discovery tell us a little bit about the task force. What is purposes what they think they're going to see and they do have the are trying to link these murders together or they think they can well. I think I think right. I think that they thought at this point that that they probably were connected. So there was a task force that consisted of
members of the Puri County Sheriff's office, the Peoria Police Department in the Tazewell County Sheriff's office, as well as some people from the Illinois State Police- and this is all they would work on. They got some one thousand tips into the hotline and they would rank the keeps you knows the areas not so theory is something we should look into and and that's all they worked out with these cases and in fact, Larry called in a tip on himself because he he wanted to stop in and knew he couldn't do it on his own and he called and said you know. I think you should look into Larry bright he's. Probably the one doing this and what police do as a result of that. Well, it was around the same time. I think that that Vicki had told them about him and she and she picked his photo,
out of a you know a photo array, and so he was already on their radar screen and and they arrested him for kidnapping Vicki. Those who were Teresa and terror cedar- and what do they say, the police two more women are also who were. Held by Larry and raped against their will and in one of them as a matter of fact,. Actually, we would have, it was Tiffany who had who had gone with Larry And- and she was with Linda Neal and Larry. Provine didn't remember her, but she remembered him and she said to Linda don't go with him. You know he's crazy, but Lynn she's, not sure if Linda ever did, but the next day is when they found her body. So it's
obvious that she did go with him, but the other women were also taken by by Larry and talked to the police. You know people one person, another would say you know. I think you should talk so, and so I think you should talk to so, and so I'm sorry, I just got a little confused to really. I was with a friend of Brenda Irving, whom we haven't gotten to either right up. She she was in prison and she told she went. She said she wanted to talk to police and she gave them the names of people who might be involved with these murders, but but they weren't. So it is.
I really positive because it just is so hard to keep all these straight put arm, but Teresa terrorist EDA was taken by she was taken by Larry when he lived at the house on his first, no matter how second house that he went to his to his house and down and no I'm sorry again. He took her when he was living on Mc Clure Road, not where you murdered all the other women. Now we murdered the woman and he brought her to his basement and raped her an and then let her go. He was living in his mother's basement. At that point,. And he would tell these women and he told her to that. He was a police officer, and so you know he told him not to go to police go to the police, because no one would believe them, because he was a cop.
No one would believe what they had to say now as a result of speed with all these women Teresa Teresa interceded, Vicki Omar and an hues and other other people as well as some. Some are very bright friends from the past. One happens on November 11th AN and what do they try to Larry bright with initially did what they charged him with with kidnapping Vicki bomber. That's how they first arrested him. Was also some drug charges, possession of a controlled substance clansmen? Well, I'm sure I just don't remember I'm sorry, but yes, but but they arrested him mainly for her you know for kidnapping her and then when they searched his house, they found drugs. I see ok, now now thing is, is that they're searching his house and but they are trying to question the
very bright. Now, how does he does he cooperate? What is, is it the meter? Others? How does Larry Bright respond to being picked up and arrested for anything he wasn't harm. He was glad. I really do think he was glad he won bit over. He couldn't stop doing it himself. I mean all his his interviews with police. I looked at all the tapes at the deep. Indeed he was joking with them. You know laughing like they were friends. I think he was just relieved that it the over now. What is what does it have to do with this story? Well, Larry thought he had aids here. He was involved in a relationship with a former prostitute
who had aids and he thought that she had given him AIDS and- and there was speculation that he was murdering these other women in revenge for what she did to him right. I'm not sure that was true, but it turns out. He didn't not have aids, he was tested. Finally, when he had when he was arrested, and he did not have aids that also. Did I believe he did, I think he believed he did, but you know when he never said he was murdering them, because this woman earnest had given him AIDS. That was just pure speculation. Icy know how does like again? How does he does he
operator not cooperate? Well, my guys initial operating guy did it and I'll take you to the body and the remains of the body. They had the full bodied I'll. Take you to the remains, and so you know big drove around with them. They stopped at Mcdonald's or burger king and got him lunch. You know fries and Burgers Anne Anne. They he drove them to all the sites. I'm sorry go ahead sorry. Part of the agreement was, though, that did they not which his mother's grounds and the police cooperated. Well now, not unlike the mothers round, he didn't care about anything else, except the fish pond that he had built for her
it was an elaborate fish pond and it had really expensive. I think koi in it and he was so concerned. You know he said, don't don't don't dig up the pond, please you know she didn't know anything about this, there's nothing there and, and so they said, fine, they wouldn't dig it up. They had two and they brought the fish to some wildlife preserve or something, but he was really worried about about. The fish sure has this nice of him, professor had about after all, right so so he's these, but if he doesn't need is now for a lawyer right away or he D D see what he wants to tell other and she got him a lawyer, but Larry really did
Do the lawyer said don't talk but Larry would you know Larry would send notes from jail to the cops and say I want to talk and they said, but your lawyer says not too, and he said I don't care and he would just sign away his rights and talk to them. Tell them everything they wanted to know. So what did he? What did y all in in it. What is it all until what did he tell police? What's the details that he gave her with some motive, he gave what are the? What did he tell police in the end and how many murders did he confessed to obviate? Well, he he said it all. It all went back to the crack cocaine and after while he started hearing voices when he wasn't when he wasn't smoking the crack, he was fine, but once he did that he hear the voices that said he'll kill an initially
you know he would just go out and not he wouldn't go out looking for anyone. He would just pick someone up and then the voices. Say, kill, but then, after a while he did what he went hunting and he knew from the outset that he was going to get someone an MA order someone? And he just said it- was the voices and he couldn't stop the voices and that's, but he wanted it to stop. Ok and how many does he admit, how many women does he admit he what he admitted to and what he was ultimately convicted of a two different things he also admitted to murdering Two or three women and other parts of the country he he got a little moment. He hurt his back at work and you got like a ten or fifteen thousand dollars settlement and he went on a cross country team.
Then he went to Arizona and some lazy. I don't remember where exactly where his father's family had from his father had since passed away from cancer and he claimed he murdered, women in Arizona woman in whatever state it was. I just don't remember an another one. I think either in Oregon or Washington an but the pleat could. Never you know they can't the police in Peoria contacted the police in those other states, but they could never find anything to connect Larry to anything. So I don't know you know was he did he make it up? Did you really do it? It's very unclear and, as I said, the sheriff
think that Wanda Jackson and Frederica Brown died at the hands of Larry Bright, but Larry only confessed it to eight women, not those too, and he end, and he kept saying you know they kept saying Well, you know, or he kept saying if I murdered them. Why wouldn't I tell you, they also they're, not sure about Linda feels, as I said, because he just kept saying. Oh, I had a dream. I did it, I didn't do it, but they think he didn't confess to her because he would have had to have gone too. He was afraid of going to wiscconsin because he want to be tried there. I'm not sure if they would have thought the death penalty there. Oh it was going to be far from his mother. I mean the police kept telling him look, we have eight, they have one you're going to be here. So don't worry about it.
He never. He never confessed, ultimately to murdering hurry so yeah. I think I did no. I didn't I'm not sure. So he never really confessed. No, he so he admits to eat right and then how does? How does the judicial system proceed from? There did the couple before we before we go to the judicial system that there's an interesting. As I mentioned, he burned eight bodies and dumped for intact, which is is very unusual. Serial killer usually do one thing: they usually get out and kill and dispose of of their bit in the same way, and so police thought that Larry had some kind of there was some straw change reason behind this, but it in Larry's mind it was all very logical, so the police said: why did you not burn these for women and he said
because my mother was having company on my grandmother was coming over and I couldn't light the fire right. So it was just a matter of convenience. He you know he that he burned the bodies, but it was also unusual that nobody smelled anything in the neighborhood. You know his mother said they asked his mother and she said yes, you know I smell something strange, but he told me was plastic, you know, and he was always burning leaves or Russia's, though no one in the neighborhood thought anything of it either incredible. So I think that I'm sorry so they were a few areas to be. He said it was one burn area and then there was where he dumped. The ashes was by the Kickapoo tell you dumped them in various places. You know, as I do, that someone is grandmothers. Yeah is grandmothers guard places that he had.
On two other child. We know it with was younger when he party does a teenager places that he knew well and he you know he would drive a car and then you know pack the car and take these buckets and just. Just dump the remains on the way and then in one place he threw the buckets in the stream. There's really no rhyme, no reason to where he decided to dump them yeah. So it must have been a horrific job for the anthropologist in the forensic people to go through the reason. My gosh it was the only the we're only able to connect uh a jawbone. I think it was to Barbara Williams.
Oh no, I think it was a Tammy walls that she had had had surgery until that there was the biggest piece of bone that they found a means of these countries ass a little above. There was no way they could identify any of the other bones. The dna or otherwise was a. There was initially that Larry Bright wanted a deal wanted. He wanted to. He wonderfully healthy, but he also wanted some kind of deal well. No, he wanted to plead guilty and the judgment. Let him He said I just want to say I did this. It was you they were. He wanted the death penalty off the table, but that wasn't the reason that he couldn't plead guilty. The judge wouldn't let him because he wanted to make sure he could
that he conferred with his attorney. He wanted to make sure he got the right advice. He tried twice to plead guilty and the judge wouldn't accept his plea right and then there was talk about a trial. He decided he was going to have a trial and then ultimately decided he wanted to spare his mother all that pain. So he you know, he said you know, I'm going to plead guilty again and the DA talk to the families and said you know he He wants a death penalty off the table. He'll plead guilty. Are you willing to go along with that and they were? You know they said we. You want him punished in life in prison. We know was ok with them. It was remarkable that the district attorney actually was seriously considering what the family wanted in that respect right, but that was pretty admirable right front of unusual, absolutely
incredible. So so, basically the trial was it wasn't my because it's when there was no trial, he just plead guilty and and the d a just went through. You know egos it around here right here, so I saw what was it tenants like at the trial, the term some other way? I am certainly show up. Some of them did right at the hearing, our worthy nourisher bright. What yeah, yes come showed up item, not sure all of them did. I couldn't it was hard to track them down. I talked to a couple of families, but I child more disconnected numbers and I think of dialed in my whole life. You know it's just the kind. You know that not all the family lived the kind of life the women did, but you know they're they're not well off, people
move a lot, they don't have phones and it was really hard to get in touch with all of them. I wanted to you know, and I also wanted to talk to Larry's mother, but she she just she said. Let me think about it and- and you just you just couldn't I want to, I want to say something and I'm not sure if you will, your listeners will think the something wrong with me for saying all the the all his tapes when he confessed again an English in the beginning. He said to the police I want to make. I want to make it pay for my mother. I want to talk to her. Can I do that and they said yes, I said, but anything you say can be used against you and here
that's fine, and so they went out of the room and he made this tape. An an I have to tell you of this is my fourth book he's the for murder that I've written about, and I truly believe that he he was remorseful. He was the only one of the four murders that I've written about that I think, showed an ounce of remorse. I think He was truly sorry and I actually felt myself responding to him in some odd way. You know I thought this he's deep down. I think he the willing nice guy strangers, that sounds, he murdered eight women, but he wasn't. I dont you did you want to do it. I really don't think he wanted to do it and I it's drugs. It really was the drugs, I believe
well. I don't know if I can agree with you, but you were were there, so you and you know the thing is- I know so what you're saying, because I think this is an unusual case because he really did want to unveil themselves and didn't. He wasn't didn't seem like a publicity hound with now and he and when you're, trying to plead guilty and you're getting advice, I mean it does show something because it sure is certainly is unusual for even the most guilty people to do what he was willing to do. So I don't know about voices in the head, but something compelled him to do what he did right over and over again, but I believe, but he was truly sorry. None of the three, the other three that I've written about, one of whom was also a serial killer, two which was spouse and spouse murder. I don't think any of them
more sorry, they were sorry they got caught, but they were not sorry for what they did. I think he really was sorry and I don't know what that doesn't do much good for anyone, but I could feel that from him. Yeah it's well, I mean, I don't know, blame it on the drugs, but this certainly certainly he was on those drugs and certainly drugs have a profound effect on certain people. You know he didn't come forward. Necessarily. There is some merit to to cooperating with police, at least for the victim, showing trying to show them where the disposal sites were didn't have to do. That if he was pure evil, so bright and other mention he did call in a tip on himself. He did he create, couldn't come forward because he was really he didn't want to her his mother. That was you. He felt she didn't deserve a son like him and he didn't want to cause her any pain
and he thought that that was a way to do it, but he was sorry he was sorry for murdering the women. He was sorry to their families. He was sorry that she had to live with what he did. He really was sorry, but you saw about illegal and see. The thing is, is it if you saw it? Iran is one thing it could be possibly can But if you saw it in the confession to police itself in obtaining the big in one of his first confessions, right, yeah yeah, absolutely right, it wasn't after it wasn't contrived it, and it was just him and a video camera, and he was talking to his mother Ann. It was as if she was sitting across from him an he was sobbing. I mean you know. None of it was contrived.
It would. He was truly truly sorry- and I know your listeners will probably think you know I should be in the looney Bin or something. But I felt that emotion from him You know I knew I knew that deep down this man just was so sorry for the pain he caused. Everyone. You know what I thought it was another interesting aspect of this story and I guess it's just a bit of a commentary, but it's the last few stories that I've talked about on my program, starting with the Stevie Cameron, on the farm about Robert Picton in Brighton, British Columbia. It's almost the same story of three or four of the last stories in that you have a subset section of people that are the most vulnerable. The prostitute did his blind or trade on the street. These
these were young women. These were older women, which I found interesting as well, but there there increasingly even more vulnerable among this group of people, because they're willing to go into a car for drugs, they had this intense need for the drug it's usually crack or something like that, and so he'll, take even more increasing risk of people, always wonder, or how did they rack up this? These? These big numbers, if the women were disappearing in his some of their friends and coworkers, and really what it was that people are, that desperate right and an end here, and he knew that actually because he would say to them. He wouldn't say you know: let's have sex or whatever he would say, do you wanna get high sure and they did and that's all they wanted to do. Yeah, I know- and you know I mean women would disappearing, but it didn't matter to them. The knee
to get high was so great that that they had to do it. They couldn't stop right now very bright. What what was a sentence? What did he resumed his life and pretty never getting out who's? Never going to get appeals have been exhausted. He know that was part of it. There were no appeals, that's right, so that was part of the part of the deal about that was interesting to again save some people, the because you really felt like you get any closure. That's that's a misnomer, but I mean for appeal to just hang around and hang around. I know the case. I was just involved with the peel just finished it's. You know seven one slash two years later sold my first book in one thousand nine hundred and ninety eight. The murder happened his appeal just ended like a month ago.
You know I mean there actually that maybe one more, I don't know you're right it, but he didn't. He didn't want to appeal. He no. He just said. No. I you know I just want this over. I did it. I want to plead guilty. I just want it over yeah incredible and was there any real response from them? I know the mother and Larry were very close. Did she do some media? Is there any update on her? Did she? I don't? I don't know you know she did. She talked to the media after and you know, people we're following her when she was going to visit him. I think I think it was hard on her. You know it and I felt really badly for her. When I talk to her, you know she asked me what the title of my book was going to be in there I was like hardline actually had to tell her. You know she cheated
do anything. You know she thought she was raising her kids the right way, but you know she no control over what happened. So it wasn't. It wasn't easy for her. Obviously what you know you, up an interesting point. The precision you had with his mother. What did she say when you know it's almost like a body moment when the another the inmates finds out what this would start with uptight of the book is called. You know, I'm cold blood now, Bonecrusher. Obviously, there's not much doesn't seem to be any seemingly semi seeming sympathy for her son. What a cheese say how did she use a word? She didn't say a word about it. You know, ask me what I was going to call it a night hesitated, a long while and and just told her. She didn't say anything, but I have to tell you I said to her. I think he must have been a good guy
and she said he was you know and end the wasn't much else I could say to her yeah. It's always the classic among the mother. Still visiting the killer. Son in prison are raised to keep, and course it's amazing. The mothers in a loyalty and love never ends in a right for most people y know, I'm credible that of others serial killer stories that I've covered. It's incredible. Many families still support there. Others and sisters and brain accused of these horrendous crimes right incredible. So. What are you working on now? You were, we were talking earlier. I've just started my fifth book. It's called the killer, debutante it's about a woman named Kelly Cannon from NASH. Who was it debutante growing up? You know, cheerleader debutante.
He had gone to medical school. She married a doctor an he was dead, poor thing her and threatening to take the kids and she wasn't going to let that happen. So she strangled him with the quote of a cell phone charger and put they were separated at this point and drag his body into a closet. Ah,. And put this big dresser in front of it. Anne left it for the poor made to find two days later well And when we do when the arrival day for this- oh probably they usually it's usually like every two years. I've just started this one, so I would say a year and a half after two years that one will be out right Now, where are you located in America, I'm just outside Boston, about thirteen miles west of Boston uh and have you in your book,
so you covered anything from that area. I got my first book as I was mentioning that the person whose appeal just ended with a guy a doctor world renowned, allergist Dirk grinder. And he murdered his wife in a in a park near their home. He had sort of this cd life. He was visiting prostitutes and having an on line sex life and apparently she found out and was going to divorce him that the theory, and so he murdered her and claims he didn't, but the evidence has just absolutely convincing that he was guilty, so he I think you know one of the last of his appeals. Anyway, was he just been denied a new trial about a month ago, Right now, just for audience sometimes curious, as some people have asked me to ask this question,
how did you get involved in true crime? In the first place,. I used to read an a rule all the time, all right and I'm a writer of Burma reporter I'm a writer of been a reporter, the late eighties and one day I said I can do that and so on. In that case, I was just telling you about. I put together a proposal. I found an agent and she found my publisher and this all happened in a month- wow and I had written a word. I had something else. I could show the publisher, and so we signed a contract, and then I went. Oh, my god. I have to write a book, and so you know been with them ever since then this is you know now starting my fifth book, so that was still a cynical Kensington. That way. You re very great great great company. I've seen it
company really rise in the last few years as well. In the last five years you see, Saint Martins Press was really big and you know there's a five. Measures are then candidate come round and is competing with everybody else really is, is a close number two I see in a bookstores, it's all Kensington bright. Some of the really good authors are now getting published with them in and cover some of the best stories, and I really like you know their criteria. In autumn two crime writers want to crime I want to read the most sensational story, so that's what candid and also absolutely no. It is interesting that the criteria you know they sent me. You have to be only certain parts of the country, you know an in depth and they like serial killers. I p murderers, the appeal here, absolutely yeah. Well, there's a you know: people like I asked the question. Once
I said you know if you really looked at the crimes that were in cold blood. You know that the crimes itself, especially these days, wouldn't it would mean that high profile just eight is tested on x. You know escalation of crime in general that it is not like it's not an interesting story, but it is a less Shaw. King stories, stuff, like that, goes on almost every day now right exactly right, but I think that with the weaker party road it it was thought over a heap fiction alive. Along with his writing, a dial that that propelled that book as well. Well, I I think you know what would happen is something that wouldn't happen now. You can imagine that if you had a publisher that was will, need to give you enough money to hire a really good lawyer too stay in the person's life now that they had the death penalty that they were going, they were going to hang really.
He had enough money from the publisher. He was such an esteemed author that the publisher paid for or the legal representation, and then also he paid the warden, so could be there almost every day. So we had unprecedented access act as right, plus plus EPA aid for the guy's lawyer, so that he would stay alive and they could be friend them away that you and I could never do many fish analyzed fictionalized everything wrong. You! Well, you know it's it's. I think it's a good lesson in marketing. I mean you know he. How was it true crime with some of the devices that he did? It's a great book, of course, but you know he he pants rules and no one else got to do the same so right now. I don't think that would ever happen now. No, oh! No! I think you have to take notes now and he lived nine thousand and ninety seven percent collection rate nobody's going. Take your word on that right,
at least that you know at least it got the true crime at that time, like in sixty five. I guess a popular genre, all of a sudden, so we can. We can always taken further on this absolutely right here. Well, I want to thank you very much Linda for coming on my program once again, another great book and another great interview, we've been talking oh your latest, true crime, a classic soon to be found, I'm sure the phone, crusher and uh- and I just want to tell her audience- you can listen to Linda Rosenkrantz and her book Bonecrusher go out and get it destroyed their lives than their bodies born crusher. Thank you. Much Linda have yourself a good evening. You too bye bye. Thank you. Thank you. Bye, bye, even listen to program to murder the more shocking killers in true crime, history and the authors at a written about them, but your host bands of that have a good evening.
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Transcript generated on 2019-12-05.