From the cornfields of Nebraska to the top rung as a rising star of the adult industry, Timothy John Boham had everything a young man could ask for; including a beautiful young daughter. The fall from the top of the ladder to the depths of prison was short and steep as in one rash moment with one wrong decision, Boham lost it all.Seasoned true crime writer Donna Thomas spent countless hours with the subject Timothy John Boham. Thomas also worked for a period of time for the deceased victim John Paul Kelso. As only a gifted author such as Thomas can, she takes the readers on this sometimes very perilous-but fascinating and entertaining-journey of adult film star Timothy J. Boham AKA Marcus Allen as his thirst and hunger for fame and adulation explodes into chaos, love, loss and murder! INTENDED FOR MATURE AUDIENCES-The Rise and Deadly Spiral of Adult Star Timothy J. Boham-Donna Thomas
This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
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you are now listening to true murder, the most shocking killers and true crime history and the authors that have written about Gacy, Bundy Dahmer, the night Stalker Dck every week, another fascinating author talking about the most shocking and infamous killers crime, history through murder, with your host journalist and author Dan. This is Nancy good evening from the cornfields of Nebraska to the top rung as a rising star of the adult film industry.
Timothy John Bull him had everything a young man could ask for including a beautiful young daughter, the fall from the top of the ladder to the depths of prison with short in steep, as in one rash moment, with one wrong decision, Bohem lost it all. Season. True crime, writer Donna Thomas spent countless hours with the subject. Timothy John bull him. Thomas, also work for a period of time for the deceased victim, John Paul Kelso, as only a gifted author such as Thomas, can it takes the readers on this sometimes very perilous, but fascinating and entered ending journey of Adult Film star Timothy J him aka, Marcus Allen as his thirst and hunger for fame and adulation explodes into chaos, love loss and murder
sure. The book that we are featuring this evening is intended for mature audiences, the rise and deadly spiral of adult star Timothy J Bo him with my special guest journalist and author Donna Thomas welcome to the program, and thank you for agreeing to this interview, Donna Thomas thank you so much having me. I really appreciate it yeah. Thank you very much. Finally, we have you won with this wild wild tale. Now you spent considerable time with the former Marcus Allen or the a k, Marcus Allen, Tennessee H, J pull him, but let's take the audience back to where he grew up in this little town in Nebraska tell us about his his parents, his family life, so we can see how what is early life was and what really shaped this man that became Marcus Allen. So tell us,
little bit about Timothy Gable him life. He grew up in Stuart Nebraska, which is on the northern slope of Nebraska. It's about three thousand people. Even today, there's only four one thousand, so it's really really small. Even now, and he had you know very working class parents, his father was a long distance truck driver had an old sister named Catherine and the mother and father were both very, very religious. You know fundamentalist Christians,. And his father was extremely abusive. He was an alcoholic and he spent you know he had a very, very difficult childhood and the religion was. He had a real hard time with the religion. He he told me that he always felt very out of place they're in Nebraska. He was very small for his age, so he was teased. A lot in school. You didn't gain is hide until he was thirteen. He was always the small
want to. It was pushed in lockers all that kind of thing and then, when he went home his father you know would come home from a long trip and he was very abusive to not only him but to the mother and the sister to all of them. He was beaten, terrible ok so and then the Father is TIM's. Father died when in a truck driving accident, when he was only thirteen and the mother. Susan, strong, Miss Susan BO met a man that was from Denver named Walter Strong and she eventually would remarry him and then the family relocated to Denver. So.
Then, by the time he was in Denver by the time he moved to Denver. He was just why I school he had a now. I skipped a little park there. He had as a girl friend that he was very seriously involved with and she was African American and that caused a lot of strife in the family that she was. You know one of the very few there and brass. Even now, there's very few black people. Then it was me out. This is thirty. Three years back thirty years back, it was really a big now now there I mean they frowned upon. Does those kind of interracial Not only did he have a girlfriend, he went ahead and had a child with this girl who was to be terribly addicted to drugs and wound up dying shortly after childbirth yeah they they. This was. He was amber, and then he got her pregnant. You know he'd go back and forth between Denver in Nebraska to visit, or it's not that far in the car to make the drive
and so then she got pregnant and then he was laughed at that point. When she died. There was no one else care for him so that by the time he was nineteen years old, he was a single father with a baby. Down term that has started the wheels. Turning yes now in terms of his future career. What was What was his transformation like from this sort, smaller than normal sort of kid How did he blossom? What did he look like? What was this transformation like and when did this happen, that he became this guy? That. You know. He said he wasn't when he was younger. Let's put it that way. I in high school he gravitated towards the theater, because he said people in the theater world. Just more accepting you know they were more open minded, so he started to do plays in high school. He started to get into that people told him. You know you're, really, nice. Looking you have a really nice look.
Then he started doing my thing when he moved to Denver, because it really wasn't any anything in that small part of iraqi would have to go to all mine, even when they do that he was already in Denver. So you started modeling in Denver, and so that's where he started. He found himself in. Arts modeling doing that kind of thing, and then he really had a amp it up because he, after the girlfriend died. He had this child that he was responsible for you sell. That I believe. I believe that if he went to had the child, you and I wouldn't be talking right now- that's just what I think. I think that caused a lot of the roads that he took at that young age, that he kind of was in a panic. He didn't know what to do basically and didn't have a lot of support from the family. He he just didn't have any was basically on his own with a child. That's that's hard for anyone, but a nineteen year old kid that of a male, very large. Now you see, you say he was
doing some modeling and so tell us what type of modeling he started off with and then, when you say he became you know, he realized he was single father at nineteen years of age and had to really was responsible for the child now and himself that. J that changed obviously, so tell us what kind of modeling started off with and what kind of things he was entertaining as he became more desperate. As you say, it was signed it. He was signed in them with maxim, talent and they're, still they're. Now, just doing you know legitimate modeling runway where a catalog work for like Sears and that kind of thing lots. I mean you mean you see his picture. There is very photogenic he's a very good looking person he's tall. He was you know when you guys. Heidi was six one. Who's had perfect model, Look back in the day, so that's what he was doing was doing legitimate modeling at first. That's how it started, but Now they told him, you know TIM people,
would tell him. You know you have a really good luck in Denver, but they said to really get anywhere and to really make money in this business. You gotta be either in New York. In la I mean you're not going to you're going to get as far as you can go here regionally, but to really get to a bigger place. You have to be in a bit in one of those cities. So that's how that started, but he started to get into the escort business. In Denver. Sorry, he became male escort there. That was before the porn. So that's where this escorting and they're kind of your belly cd world that he found himself and started in Denver which a lot of people think it's a small little cities. Denver is a big metropolitan city with all of that two. It is the travel agency, but with the suburbs. So that's where that all started the the it is a
blue stuff that he was doing it started in Denver. I always mostly men that he had mostly was male customers that he I mean you know: women don't have to hire escorts. So it's mostly men that he was filtering too. It was it. What was his own sexual orientation? A finale bands that book yeah that's a great debate when the when the into the inhabit mean he was he added he had a baby, he had always had a girlfriend, but I I think that for another issue with what made him so angry, I believe that he's that I mean it's hard to get was very difficult to get a straight answer out of him as far as because we discussed that at great detail, because when he went in his porn it was gay porn primarily, and he said that you know I think it was gay. I mean to do
he did. You have to be gay. That was a big issue and when it went down, everybody said that he hated gays and there was a there's a whole lot of stuff. With that, I don't think he hated gays. I think he hated the fact that he was gay. That's what I think I mean he probably would say he was bisexual. That's what he's going to say right. I just lean. I see what you need and I don't say I don't say what he is and what he's not I mean if you watch some of these movies, like I have it's hard to see this person as a straight man when you see what I've seen and you know that's up to the rear. Now you talk about the CD elements of this in really you'd really do bring the reader into that CDL meant that underbelly, no matter how legit it may look at anyone's viewpoint, but we're what would what kind of money are we talking about when he's doing escorts, and this is before he gets to California, so we're talking about Denver kind of money we? talking about with this
They were seen hourly right. He had hourly clients when he was an escort, so it was probably around one hundred and one hundred and fifty dollars an hour and we're talking about you know years back here it was maybe one thousand nine hundred and twenty when he was doing that when he was an escort, so we're going back. You know one thousand five hundred and sixteen years so it's One hundred and twenty five dollars an hour and then he said he had overnights like he would stay overnight with someone it was, You know, but it was a lot more than he could make doing. A regular job. You know in a straight job is what he called. He said he just could not make enough money doing any kind of straight work to support a child. He couldn't do it, that's what he said and just you know, reporting what he Now with this is he's making good money and he's making steady money. How does he handle that money? What's his lifestyle like is he? Is he in arrogant person with
this money? How do we put this personality? Become? He drove a pickup truck. You know the same pickup truck that he had all through high school. He he got himself a little tiny, farm and his family did help. I mean his mother helped a little his his sister helped a little, but you know they all had to work. No, and in that family was independently. Wealthy everyone works, so they will have to work and to. An infant. A small child is a full time saying nobody could really say there and say: okay here, I'm going to watch the child. Please is Clint or they didn't want to you go work for you, though, back to school, you do what
We have to no one really sat down and he said when he got down to looking at day care what day care would cause for. An infant Ethan teaches felt that he needed to make a certain amount of money. He got himself a little tiny apartment like a studio for himself in and the baby, and he went and did he did modeling and then he did his escorting and that's basically just was to pay the bills. He didn't go and buy himself a nice car. He didn't go and do flash and dash. He lived very simple, meager lifestyle just to support his child in the beginning. That's what it was did he have a history in high school develop at some point? A drug problem Is this an issue? No, there was no drugs or alcohol. The girlfriend was a drug addict which was interesting to me when I was you know, because you would think he wouldn't be in old with somebody that was a drug and he said it was a true I mean he would. He said he would drink, you'd go out and have a beer, but no drugs, and he begged her.
Every which way and Sunday too, for her to stop to go to rehab and she would stop and she would get cleaned up. She managed to stay clean enough while she was pregnant through most of it not to you know, transfer anything because the baby was born healthy, but right after she delivered the baby said a few days later she was doing drugs again and we're talking about hardcore drugs, cocaine, mass crack, all of that stuff. She was doing dies, but he didn't do that. Yeah he never being did not have a drug or alcohol problem in ever never had any kind legal problems never was arrested. Never now. When does he may the decision to go to California and and why does he make that decision based on what? What There were a few things, he's really hated himself and for being an escort, he hated it. He hated being an escort, so he fell
and everybody kept telling him. He was still doing the modeling when he was an escort. He was still a model. So everybody was telling and in the industry that if you just go out to LA or New York you can you can you can do better. So that's why he did it. He wanted to get out of being, as crews trying to you know, be an actor, be a model and you it successfully in a legitimate market, but just make more money just wasn't making enough and then drive the model. So that's when he decided to go and he decided to go to California because it was. It was all about geography. It was closer. You know. If you want to I could drive it's a twenty four hour drive it's it's. You know it's an hour and a half playing wide versus New York. It's further so and he had a fee friends that were living in la that he met. While he was a model that went went to LA to model, so he knew where he had a few places where he could stay. So he just thought it would be easier from the go to LA. So that's what he did
and then how old was he at that time? Roundabouts. Yes, he was twenty one when he went a twenty one. So, he was in LA settled in West Hollywood, which, if you know la that's kind of a, predominantly gay area. Lot of gay people live in West Hollywood. I add and why he live in now, why he would go to West Hollywood? There's a lot of places. You can go 'cause I in LA for long time too, and he said well, that's where I knew someone that was living there. So I went there when stayed with them and he said I gave myself three months. That's all I could manage that's all. I could get a commitment for to watch the
his daughter, was three months: 'cause 'cause he didn't have money to go back and forth for the three months. He had to stay there and work. You know and try to work. So he said I gave myself three months to make it to get some kind of work in a movie or tv. Shell, get some modeling work, get any kind of work that I could make money with. So he gave himself three months. He tried, I mean he went on additions. He went on cattle calls. He did all of that stuff. That actors and models do and got no. Where he parked cars. She tried to work in a restaurant. He did have an anger problem, no drug problem, but a very bad and problem- and he went last long when he tried to get like a job to supplement his acting or whatever he was doing, he wouldn't last at a restaurant or driving or whatever it was, he just, he would have flare ups and he would have those kinds of problems now, on the last part of the three months, like the last few days when he was getting ready to go back to
there's varying stories of what happened next. So that's another, thing I I mean. I know my side, you going to ask him what he says it's a different side, then you ask a third person it's another, so it's very hard to corroborate. This particular story. Kissed him as a the problem with the truth. You know it a lot of. It was helpful to me in this particular case, because I knew the victim that that that we're getting back to when he's back in December, but I wouldn't have been able to get at the truth in this case of what actually happened with the murder. If I unknown the, and that's only because he's such a law this kid. He lies like it's like it's nothing like its drinking water. I was only able to piece together what happened in this particular case, because I knew the victim because I personally knew the victim. If that makes sense right well will you will be able to explain
that, because that's a fascinating, fascinating element of this story, just adding another incredible twist to this. So now I want to ask about and I think the the audience would ask this as well this guy's a real muscular guy, a part of the industry, is that these guys got a look real boss. Well, maybe back in the day they did, but I think they always had to, as he's always had to so this rage. These these fits, rated. They have anything to do with steroid use. Was that a yeah? I am he's not you know. If you see them person, I mean by the time I saw him in person a You know he was added the porn business for a long time, but even if you watch his films, he's not like Roy Roy did up on steroids, he doesn't have very very fan I mean but macho I mean worked out in the gym and he's he's much sure enough that you can buy that he's going to Jimmys work he's not. He was never Arnold Schwarzenegger Muscular.
Even slider than that. I mean his didn't look fabricated, his muscles. They looked real. From working at any work at everyday and twice a day and ate lots of protein and knew how to be I mean, but I don't think it was any kind of It was a mental illness in the mental illness was because part of he was abused. He was beaten and then a lot of those types of people grow up to be very violent people themselves, and I think that's what it was. Better a boy. He was self on that and a lot of self welding, but I think why he was so angry and violent with a lot of different relations and things that he did was because that's what he saw when he grew up. That's all he saw was violent when I was growing up that that's it. So a lot of those types of people grow up. To be violent. Now was there when you talk about mental illness was when was first diagnosed? Was there any diagnosis before this
This incredible climb high school, he was diagnosed with bipolar. He was diagnosed as bipolar when he was in high school. The mother would took him to therapy because of his anger is that was when they were still in Nebraska, so he was that was hurt as bipolar, Was there any instances that involving police- or no, there was never in just the way he the way he interacted with family with friends. They felt that he was. You know angry that he was an angry kid. Always he would throw. Things that was never anything where you would be arrested or becomes a police attended, but he would throw things would break things when he was in in a That kind of thing he never hit anybody or beat anyone. Never any of that. Not now he's been abused, his child to anything that I've talked to people. You know. So I am is his family is mother
is he never was abusive towards this child either it any of these fits of rage. Did he again in retro, fact. It's always easier to then remember something that might fit. You know some watt into behavior but was there anything that was there? These fits of? it's characterized by anything that people would say later that you know out of lost control and didn't know what he was doing. I couldn't stop fighting or anything now that you're angry and most people that I talk to and from what I just personally saw, if I had a lot of interaction with him myself, he was just a very angry. Angry birds would snap very quickly and get angry lose his temper mad. You know that kind of thing. It didn't take much to set him off. That's why it was, I think, not that it was in a blind rage. He didn't know what he was doing. He always knew what he was doing, but that's what you mean right that what you mean?
yeah sure a very angry person, not a mellow person. Angry very, very angry type of person, you don't think of cunts and then, when you see someone like that sure you just think angry. It's hard to picture when you watch This film, because I've seen a lot of his films yeah, he was a pretty good actor. I think he could have done very well in regular if you just would have had the opportunity regular fell because he was a decent actor. That's the kind of films, though those films, and he did you know I'm getting at, but they're very known, the type of films they did for more dialogue and then a lot of the other porn because of the directory. That did it, but he was a decent actor in them. If you actually watch the films- and I think that he had a lot of potential to be a good actor, because what you see on film is very very different than what the real person is like
That's, why I'm saying that extremely now you say you talk about the ninety days that he gay thumbs up this window to make to see if he can make it and then he has to go back so tell us about his mood after this thirty, it was bad. He was frustrated. He was mad, he was upset. You know he was felt very defeated. He said because he didn't feel that you know he was trying every day it out there making the rounds doing what he had to do. His head shots out, but he wasn't getting any call backs. I mean he would go on auditions, but he just didn't get any were it would go on several editions, but he didn't get anywhere. It wasn't. Making money couldn't stay there. I mean the plan was: if he made it, he was going to move his daughter out there with him. It was trying to do that to get his own place. It's very expense
to do it. That way, you really gotta. Have you got to do something? You can't just you know, be sleeping on someone's couch, especially in his case. He had a child, I mean everything would have worked differently heading on how the child. That's. Why I said that earlier he could have maybe stayed there a few years and tried to do legitimate work, but he was on net timetable because of the child, because he only had a commitment from three months from the family members to watch her while he was out there auditioning. That was a problem. The child was problem in this scheme. In the grand scheme of things, I mean this is just my opinion, but that's what I think. I just think it. What went down a lot differently, many people that break in the movie business in the modeling business day. It takes them years. Sometimes you know they're working restaurant there driving again they're doing what they have to. They don't have kids. They can do that. You have that luxury. When you know when you just worrying about yourself, you can go to sleep at the beach if the weather is nice, you know.
Really have to worry about. If it's just feel right, I went a long way that you could do yeah, there's a lot more, that you can do when you don't have when you're not responsible for it. For a child and that's in that instance, under those circumstances. So, No, he didn't give himself the. They only gave himself that ninety days- and we can say it seems to be resentful after that. So how does he proceed after that work with? While you were always mommy tell me I mean I think it was large them in for his family. There were, and it could be, you know, he's blaming, but he's the one that got the girl pregnant. I even told him that you can't blame the whole world they, he is call his mom and he would say you know mom can't you just watch I another week. I think I might get a call back at isn't as something that you can get And they said no, we can stand and then I asked them others they spend a lot of time with his family and she said that she was afraid to do that because he was the type that would take advantage.
And then she had a job and she didn't want to get fired from a job she had to be able to work. I mean it would took a lot to be able to watch her for three Once everybody had a you know they didn't they just because we were afraid. If we gave him another week, then he would. He would say. Okay, I need another week, so they stuck by that three month window for him. Now tell us about the go ahead. Sorry, yeah yeah and he was like today was very resentful. It was very, very frustrated by that point. Ok, you want to know when he met CHE. Yes, please tell us about the film okay, so he was just about it. It was all packed and ready to go back yet three days left of that and they were serious on the other end of Denver, because his mother, I actually gave him an ultimatum and said John NAIL called him by his middle name, which is John. They said John, if you don't come back on the appointed day where
Coming LA with jasmine was his daughters and where coming with Jasmine and where you let us know where you are we're dropping a lot. That's out. I mean they were very strict with him about that. So. They weren't playing games that he had to go back. He he knew that so by the third day. By that they did before that on this when he had three days last. This is what he says: This is his story that he says I believe it's kind of the truth from what I know because I've talked to she said it was walking down Santa Monica Blvd in West Hollywood, just say after he went and had something to eat and just like you see in the movies, Cici Larue
was a very prolific in order for in and not not only in the game in our review, but in straight means handle Jenna, Jameson and he's done all kinds of an already, but he's very well known in those chords was walking down the street not in drag his chi. Chi is as his stage name, but he was just dressed as a man because he dresses as Chichi, which is the his woman alter ego, but he was just dressed as a man and walking down the street, and he said he saw him and he turned his head and he said. Are you an actor and said now? I'm I do some modeling and I do been trying to be inaccurate. You see a lot of those types in la like I mean there and I'm a dozen they're all over the place. So he said that him and it was an he gave him his business card and he said he said what do you do? He asked Cici timid TIM as she
He said: well, I make movies adult films and even be around the Bush and he didn't lie. You told me straight up. You said a minute any chichi road said she. She were on the card, not as real name, which is Larry to Cody, as she she's real name, but it said she she will grow whatever Falcon films, which is his film studio and he said dolphins like wow. What do you mean and he said porno porn, porn films and he said all. Ok, so he took his card and then he went back. These room where he was day and he said I'm not going to call him, but then he called him because she said it was definitely. He was trying everything in the world not to call him but finally called him and they had dinner like the next night or something, and they were discussing his film practice hitting tell him that it was that it was gay stuff that he was thinking of him. Doing he just said he does porn. He didn't say it was gay porn, but he said- and I said so- you never heard 'cause. Even I heard of him
for I mean- and I never knew about, but I have heard of changing the role I knew who he was way before this and they say you never heard of changing the route this now I never watched an rv and certainly not that gay stuff, I never watch. I had no idea who he was. I never heard of him before. That's what he said and it's possibly is twenty one. He didn't know who he was and then that's how he got into the porn business. From that point forward. He just he said. Was he alright? Well, he said thought about it? You know, and he said well. I have sex with people. Why? Not so I'm going to have sex with people again our minds will get paid, and then I don't have to go to back to them with my tail between my legs, that was his dad. That which is initialized to that actually going and doing it because really did want to go back to Denver, defeated and any. So what was he going to do when he got back to Denver. He would need a job there anyway. I mean Why-
he's got back to Denver. He'd need a job. You have to make money to support his child. It was just that they could watch or not think they can I mean he had to go back and supporter. He had to have money, no matter where he was that's what he told me, no matter what city was in, he had to be making money. So that's you said it was I never thought in a million years, if you would have told me a week before, even that that would have my stayed on that day that night, that I'm sitting there even with him contemplating that I'm going to go to do porn and He said weather was gay or straight. Did it really matter at that point, you're selling your soul. Once you do that kind of stuff, you're selling yourself doesn't matter if it's cows, it's a person. If it's a woman, he but I didn't think it really mattered at that point. That's what he told me 'cause. I said what he didn't tell you at dinner. It was going to be gay porn right now. He said, show up. Shouldn't be annoyed, 'cause, that's where a lot of the you know, North Hollywood Van Nuys it through a lot of the poor nose, made probably ninety percent of the porn that any Everyone. Watches is made in the valley. So
You show up at the house and tell you where to go. You walk in its people all over the place. Moving around inside the thing that really surprised in bed holding whole matter. Fact you going you are you saying you, lady? It's not a big deal, it's not any of that stuff like you would think that it would be it's nothing to them. They go in, they do it and they just go. Have a pizza after it's not a big deal. It's nothing! That's He said his initial. You know, orientation into the whole thing. Is that you do you know? Did you see here's your person you're going to be doing a scene with this is how it's going to go. This is how it's going to be, and that's it you just do it. You know make a big deal. You doesn't work like that. Like you would think that it would be this big big thing. It's not I mean- and she said she's she's just very, very rigid and vet control. I mean he just he wants it. This way. This way that way and you do it or or you don't work for him,
there's no mod! We you don't want to do it. I got a hundred guys have to do it. That's his attitude that he has You don't want to do it, I'm not gonna model and coddle you, that's kind of thing is not begging anybody to do it. It's hideous and awful, as many people think that it is there's many people that still want to do it, though, certainly certainly, yeah, what his family, his sister and his mother's reaction to the deadline, not make that deadline on him, making the deadline yeah. He didn't. Tell them anything in the thing he said. That's the whole part of the story. I mean He told oh yeah, I got a modeling gig. They go that screen, he said so I could say any told Cici though, something with the deadline. 'cause I got. Gotta have cash advance, God have some money so that I can go back and get set up.
Denver it then and get babysitters, and all of that, so that I get her out of their hands and so that I can go back and forth and he did agree to that. He front a lot more money than he would because he was under those conditions. You know he had a kid and he took my relying on him and say He finding money was able to. You know, fly back to Denver, take care and stuff get himself a place to get babysitters do all of that. So what he did was He didn't tell his family any. They said. I got a really good, really good modeling just made just made you some bs stuff about what he was doing it and say it was doing any you know they would have now they wouldn't. I mean they was very religious Christians that we're talking about here that never miss church on Sunday and went to Bible study. During the week very very religious people, because I met them very relate,
So I mean he didn't tell them the truth. You just said I gotta modeling, get when only gonna see it. Oh, I don't know you know that takes a long time to look at production. You make up with all kinds of stories, but they would just happy that he got something and never thought anything that he was doing that never thought they would just relieve that he got something that able to come back relieve them of their duties and he was saying the same. Only getting his life in order. They were relieved and proud of him. His mother said I was so proud of John. It was very high, I thought, maybe you know he'll be able to do that. You have a good life for him and and Jasmine. That's what she said initially. No, he was a duggar leading a double life. Basically, what happened next. Well, I was going to say: is you talked about how She ran out of a film set. How did.
How did he? How did he like working in the movies behavior? He absolutely hated it. He hated it. From day one and hated it every sector every day. That's when you start drinking, never drank like. I mean a beer here or there, but not like an alcoholic type level drink. He said they couldn't do it sober. He could not do it. Sober I mean like it right after a right before he did it enough so that he could perform, but he was drunk most the time when he was making those movies. Makes any chance very, very difficult to do it sober. It was very hard for me just hated himself. He said I just felt feel bad about myself? It was hard to look in the mirror doing that stuff. And there were a lot of issues I mean if you read the book, you see what some of those issues war why he ate it so much. There were health issues. You know he was. He was very concerned that his daughter would ever one day find out that their father was
making porno, he was very concerned about that. He said it would have all been different. Maybe I would have been his embarrass is. I was it was very embarrassing. He was very embarrassed by it Maybe I want to be in as embarrassed. If I didn't, I wasn't. Somebody's parents- and I didn't have this child that was looking to me for everything. Maybe I well, I can't tell you because I don't know because I was somebody's parents. Doing it right, and they said you know. I asked him once I think you know there's lots of people that have children. They are porn stars to porn, many of them JANET James Initial, many people and children, and some of them have messed up children and some of the night he gets Natividad and was not. I just found it very difficult at somebody's father should be standing you're doing it is very difficult thing to do. We ration why did my mind? Tell us about him. Meeting, Jenna, Jameson and their relationship tell us a little bit about that,
it's an interesting, but you know I don't really. I don't think I don't even know if, because I have never seen all the films that I've seen him do were most of men, so I think they did so seems together. I don't know if this seems actually got into 'cause. I haven't seen every film that he's made I've a lot of them, but not everyone. He made a lot of films in a van very short amount of times and climbed up, don't porno ladder. Very you know he want award. She was on the cover of freshmen magazine, which is lots of magazine covers porno magazines that are for the porn industry. He made the cover he was on. Cover plate when he was finally arrested was on the cover of Playgirl magazine the day he was arrested and booked was on the call that month he was on the cover of Playgirl magazine email. He rose very quickly Up the ladder up to point a ladder very fast, even she she said it was a very, very fast climb. Just had that boy, next door, look about him
yeah. Is there he's very, very nice looking, but at the same time he has a very innocent look about him, which is a little different from a lot of them. That's why they believe a lot of the network with him that he moved up that quickly and I don't know which- and he did so. Scenes with her. I don't know if they actually made it onto right and I know also that after he was arrested and in jail already cheat sheet, caught a lot of those movies, and you know really. Come that were never released before we released after the fact after he was arrested, I mean he made. He did a lot of c Do a lot of them that I didn't see the films actually and I don't know where they are now. I don't know if they were ever released he said? There were all really nice. He said he never had any problems with any of the performance. It wasn't them that wasn't the issue they were just going in and surviving some of them, some of them liked it, but a lot of them just we're doing it to survive. Working and it was the way it was a means to an end. He said he told
me that he never had any issues with any other performance. I heard different stories from like Cici, for instance, 'cause I've had conversations with. She might. He told me a lot of very different, diverging stories. Then why Tim Tim said he never had any problems with anybody. He got along Done with everybody on a porn set, never had any trouble with anybody got along perfectly. Well, it's just a job. It was nothing personal with anybody. That's what he told me, but that's not what other people have told me, no The other character in this tragic story is John Paul Kelso, and you talked about you working for also, whenever that's the most advantageous, tell us what you did with your relationship was with Jp Kelly, but first tell us about John Paul Kelso tell us about him. John J peeing, everybody called him JP so by his initials. Every
so Jake he owned a collection agency called p r as professional recovery systems. I use collection agency in downtown Denver and he'd been in the credit and collection industry this whole adult life. I have a law background, illegal background, so, in between you know, writing gigs. I do like the life of a poor starving right either what you gotta do this spot, so I did some. Legal work for him like I would go an I would go through his files and see which ones had assets that they could sue to get ready for lawsuit. So that's what I did. I went through his files to see which ones they were assets to sue. Basically, that's what So that's how I met JT and just see they had ads out. I went and applied to do some part time like a freelancer with him. That's what I did and he was openly gay. Ok would be fifty if he were alive now he would be fifty two. It was open league
and very very flamboyant. He made a lot of money in the credit and collection industry very flamboyant, Denver's, not la it's, not as flamboyant is la. You know, you see rolls Royces in LA there on every corner. You don't see it as much in Denver, but that's what he drove he drove around in the rolls Royce. He had a rolex on his hand. He had a nice house, he was very wealthy, any flaunted his wealth and he was openly gay. So it was not a secret. There was no fake marriages or nine a that stuff eating care. That was the one thing you read the book that I had respect for him. I I respected him because he was openly gay. He didn't hide the fact that we gave you didn't like it too bad. That's that was J, T five. He was in a very nice person, he was mean he was nasty and
he treated his employees like dirt, treated them awful and he screamed and yelled, and he made no bones about the fact that he didn't like women and had no use for women. He said that he actually said stuff like that. I mean you know I got up and eventually I got up, and I said you know what do we want to discuss? Then how I left I mean, I just went in there and did free clearance work trip, so I wasn't in nine hundred and five employee like it didn't sit there all day, but it was just if you know anything about the credit and collection just little cubicles and people would sit and the little cubicles make collection calls will be. You know, trying flying people skip trace, flying people that were missing dead or is it don't pay their bills get on the phone say you know you need to pay bill but we're going to garnish your wages. That kind of thing that's what they were doing there, but how he made his money. He had his little interesting system that he did. He would buy debt wholesale he would go all over the place and by debt that was written off like things that written off as uncollectible collectible by them for pennies on the dollar and tried it
you know and then, when he collected he bought the debt for pennies. That's how he made his money, that's how he did it, that's how he was able to do it. Make millions of millions of dollars, and but he had it, he was a very shady person now before that he had a criminal record. It was interesting because Timbo am the mean cold hard, calculated porno killer had a clean criminal record. Nothing but Jc Kelso had along rental record. He had you know embezzlement fraud. He could even own the collection agency in his name, because of that you can't have a license to own a collection agency. When you have those kind of crimes that you did, he had a silent partner, the silent partner. The business was in the silent partners, name buddy, but JP owned. It I mean he was there physically every day in the office, she never saw the other one. He was there on his own.
Its everyday. He owned it and he operated it, but the other one legally owned it in heat. The reason why does he had a criminal record very difficult, mean nasty person? I didn't like him at all. It was mean he was. Horrible. You moving and I don't know of any people, because Denver is a big small place. You know, especially in credit and collections. Everybody know those each other Anne. I didn't never met anyone at the time when he was alive. You know I didn't meet anybody that knew him that likes him. I never saw anyone that, like most people did not like him when you walk through the office, It went in the day. Everybody had the Denver Post out or the Rocky Mountain is. It was circling one. Yet that's what his employees is sitting there doing all day. They were looking for other jobs because they hated it so bad I mean the tension was always so sick in that place so that was J fee, always with young man. He always had like a young assistant was
sitting there in the office or he said mail. He said he always in his office. Was young nice looking men and they all that's all you saw when you walked in. No, it was over with very short, an overweight, physically all season, what about five For maybe an hour and sat very, very overweight, that's what it looked us physically, not I was going to ask because it's it's interesting to have this dichotomy between this flamboyant it gave person? That's why I want to ask the description just really the the audience with this description, where he's the bad guy, the bad guy with his criminal past and yet he's this flambeau gay guy it does. He have this element of mal to him at all, or is the malice. He had you know financial crimes, he did
violence. Violence didn't rape, write, enable he didn't beat up any dad, always sold no violence, but he had financial crimes. I was mostly what he did. Just get money was greedy was a greedy greedy business people we all know them. We all see them those types of people. Unfortunately, that's what he was and it was very, very obnoxious I would say you know I had a real moral dilemma with this book too, because a lot people, romanticize, victims and death. It it's very common. But you see that I have all the crime cases I'm working on. Now too, is that has happened? very high is another one that I'm currently working on. I'm communicating with her. You know that she murdered Travis there, and they did they do that with a lot of cases, and so I'm sitting here an I had the advantage, because I knew OJ pieces. Should I ride all the things that I didn't like me us, because that's the truth just because he was murdered that doesn't change the fact that he was
a nice person, and that I personally did not like him, he was so mean I'm so nasty you know- and I need the extra income. When I worked there, I really did I had a child soon succeed. You know, I have family. It did. No money on earth is worth walking in somewhere and reading being there. You know I I would come home and I go whatever Maybe later I should all use my writing skills here, and I handed it to him when I actually resigned and in the bottom of the letter it said you don't want me these days, you're going to look around the island and the islanders low
be gone. You know, and I handed him letter he wrote it. I watched him, read it you know, and then I walked. My dad is gathered my stuff out and Morgan and he goes ok sure Donnie. He said to me: I think you know you really mean you're really mean person and no one likes. You do understand it. He goes I'm not here to win to make friends, I'm here to run a business. I don't care if anyone likes me. I said I understand that in here to run a business, but she don't have to be so. Damn mean you're running a business, and this business takes employees to help. You If you'll need employees, then you need to treat them with respect. It's that simple. I thank you. I mean I made really good money sitting there with him, but it was it just. I just couldn't stand sitting there and he would scream at people the rate then in front of other people. Instead of taking them in the office and shoot you know behind closed doors, he did it right in the front of it.
This was horrible. I just it was just such a toxic, negative environment. I couldn't stand it anymore. I know amount of money was worth being in an environment like that and eat any can directly do it to me personally? He did it to others the way he treated people I just couldn't stand being in that environment anymore. Michael, and I said to him one of these days and he was just so so snarky. You know the way he looked at me. Smiling like I was. I said one of these days shape he'd. Mark my words, one of these days, you're, going to piss off the wrong person. That's all it takes is one person wrong person being pissed off. Mark my words. It's going to have an it did. Five years later, he was done five you after I said that he was gone interesting. Is that the let's let's talk about his sexual appetites. What I wanted to describe is that he seems like sort of a, even though these this
flamboyant, small chubby guy, but he seems to be someone. Unintimidating, intimidating, guide to a certain degree anyway, and at least part of his characters is sexual appetite, so tell us what how we can characterize his sexual appetites and how he goes about trying to satisfy that. What Hello, smiley. Oh, he said young young man with him. You know, like his assistant, was his boyfriend. When I worked there, what I saw it said was his assistant what his boys? Everyone knew that that was his voice I mean after the fact people have selective memory, but that was his boyfriend. I mean he was openly gay. Nobody, you never saw him with a woman. He was denying that he was gay, so he was always so isn't I'm putting up air quotes with his boyfriend. You know he had him. He put he put his boyfriends through college. He gave them. You know. Cosmetic procedures he bought them cars. It was all about money and that's it
He said elements of this little tale it, all about money. If somebody was with him, you know About money that JP was getting, it was never an equal relationship. You would never see someone like JP would somebody equally successful you. Never see that he had to have all the control, and I think because of the fact that he was just so mean, and so nasty who's going to be. With someone like that, unless it's about money, he wasn't a nice person. And there's been people with it's Terry part of it when you know they were talking about him like he was the nicest thing since sliced bread when it was announced that he died when it was on the news I said who they talking about, I have a jg that all I knew is and that's even the news does that. Well, they don't know who he is. When they're reporting the news journalists is sitting in front of the hello from there of when they don't know who lies, they don't know anything they're saying he was a philanthropist.
He gave money to charitable things. Maybe he did he needed tax write off. Maybe he did, but he wasn't a nice person at the Cora kind, warm fuzzy type of person. He just wasn't, it was mean and he was nasty. That's why I left the way I did ok and as far as his appetite they were. Never too young or too thin or too nice. Looking in a man that was JP. Always with young men twenty years younger than him. That's what you saw. This was around. He was in his early 40s when he met Timbo him, but that's always in TIM was one hundred and twenty two. Three when they met, and he was forty two, so you always saw him with people around one thousand five hundred and twenty years younger than him his men that were never his equal. Always you know he was the one in control the one in charge, Tell tell us about Lucy encounter the meeting between these two because they don't
the have a earlier encounter, so tell us about their first meeting and what that consisted of tell us a lot of him left. I have so TIM. I he is doing his porno right, so he's working in his four and then one day on he just he was done they looked in the mirror. He was called to the study on an early morning. Call what TIM was doing was he was living a double life he'd go out to La Shootist, his porno, and the being la for a week or two. She would his porno and then be back in Denver for four weeks. Go back to LA for two weeks. Shooters porno be back in Denver for four weeks. That's how he was living and nobody knew they thought it was doing. Acting gives. No one knew he was born, not in Denver, they didn't know they did not not the people that he knew in Denver like his family his friends, no one knew he didn't tell anyone in Colorado that he was doing that, but it elsewhere. He knew it was a big. He was a major adult film star. I mean he was
on the cover of magazines all over the place. But his mother damn watch porno. You know his step. Father didn't watch porno people that he knew his history didn't watch point and yes, you watch that stuff. How would you know who sue and less you really looking at it? You wouldn't know and also he used. Hey Marcus Allen. That was just professional name when he did it work when he did his film work, and I said why did you pick that who gave you that name, because you know Marcus Allen. He did his thing in football he It is not a guy out. I was hoping that some of that will rub off on me, so I take that name, that's how we came up with Mark Center, and so he just one day he was supposed to be at Call eight hundred o'clock call to be on this at and the valleys issue, one of its legs and he looked in the mirror. He was shaving and he said you know what I'm done I'm done eating call Cici eating called the studio. He didn't call anyone. He packed some stuff, stuck it in his Porsche that he had bought. At this point he did buy a Porsche, but he kept it in cash
He didn't have it in Colorado. So in California, in Colorado we drove pick pickup truck. He went to the airport, got on a plane, went back to Denver, didn't tell any in California that he was done. Never called anyone, that's how he left the porn industry. It was very impulsive. The way did things when he thought he was going to do it. He just did it. He didn't think it was not a lot of thinking with him. He decided he was going to do what he did it. There was no back and pours with him. He just thought. You know why it's my daughter or my mother find out and I'm doing is, I'm gauge. I decide be mortified. I get to be more respectful to work at Mcdonald's and to do this he said he just couldn't stand. It anymore and he was done, and he never returned to it after that ever again, after that, it was done. So what I'll? Let you know that he's back in December is trying to take lease looking for work desperately looking for kids, he knows he's not going to do the point anymore. She's back in December, left California sold stuff. You know that what he needed to look with
in California. So now he's back in Denver full time and he's trying to raise his daughter and take care of her and he's Sitting in a cafe on coal, fax Ave, which is a major ST in Denver, reading the the want ads looking for a job and JP was in that place, which is very close to his office in was sitting there having breakfast and he saw him Circling the edge and he's recognized him, he recognized him from his films because he watched him is there's diverging reports this, but this is, and he came over there. He goes your market Allen and soon sit down. My name is? John 'cause. You know he always went by his middle name, because my name is John and he said no, your Marcus Allen. I know your work, I'm big fan of yours. He okay. Whatever my name is John. I don't know what you're talking they say he denied it. He denied that it was him. He said is something I can help you with. He said to JP I'm trying to do something here. You know he was very dismissive up
I have you looking icy circling ads here. I have a company, I own, a company, a collection agency, a few blocks from you. Here's my car, if you need work, give me a call another one, giving him his card, giving him a call you to give me a Well, I have a job for you and he goes out He called me after that 'cause he desperately needed a job and he started working for him same place. I work went up there and started working. This was years later, though This is like five years four years later than he started working for him and you are doing the collections work for him, so that's how they met is. It was over the fact that he needed work. And so how does that work? He was when what was at a wedding out? Well, you know James. He only gave me his card because because he was tracked into immediately, and he was just saying you recognize soon as from his porn. But that's the only reason he had the the people that did collections for him, that he had people
had been doing it for years that were very experienced bill collectors sitting. Action never dated before he just gave his car because he was you know he wrecked I should say he hated it. He said he hated sitting there any actually did that was delight. He said he knew that he he's recognizing him. He said yeah. I know it was me. I know that what it was about, but I need work you know and if you had a job, I'm going to go, try it and he said: he's lasted like three days at first. We worked there two different times. The first time he lasted three days he said he hated sitting in a desk just sitting in dialing and looking for people in the hounding them for money. Wasn't his style. He said hated it depressing. I said which was worse, the porn or the dill collections. He said calculations with horses are born.
Yeah. I think so meeting. You know they hang up on you and they don't call here, I'm going to kill you and all of this stuff. He said at least they're not doing it before, so he, three days that you know that and then he was just buying his time. After that you know he was taking him out the dinner and giving him money then be with him. That's what it that's, what it evolved into. Does that's what it was all about to begin with for JT like it was with everybody that he's ever was in his life before him. It was the same in this brief period of time in this short period of time. What does TIM? What does he? What is he sort of determined about him in terms of this man's wealth, this man's? character. What is he what pc see and what is he looking at and possibly looking for yeah? He said it was just,
You know that's another thing. He told people you know, probably after he was arrested, that it was that they were really good. Friends and then he enjoys having to be in, I was buying that first I knew better. I knew Jpa nine. I just knew that that they see you like him. He was such a me that what was that you like to then I mean gay straight. He was not very attractive to look at. He was twenty years older than you. What could you possibly have seen that you liked about him I said I see that you're saying that you like him and he had a friend and he said year. He couldn't lie to me. That's what I was saying earlier. He could not say that to me cuz, I I knew Jay and I'm looking at him. You know even After a few years after he was out of the point is about two and a half years after the point industry, where we're at in jail. You know at that point in jail, so this is two and a half years away from the porn industry
But I'm looking at him in everything, there's no way, that's true that they would he he cared for him, because he was giving him money basically and he was helping him pays bills and he was by buying his friendship. He knew he was well he'd been dished out, he's been, his obviously knew he had. Money was very wealthy by Colorado, see any standards. He was a wealthy man and he knew he was wealthy. Any figured he It might and when you have to go to away with you know for eight dollars an hour somewhere and he gave him money constantly. He was giving him money. He would say to spend the night, and I can't I've got a kid to see. You know that kind of thing. I can't spend the night with you. You got Give me money or I gotta go- get a job. You know it was like that. That's what it involved in was constantly giving it money to go today. With him, he had to give him money to go, sit and watch tv with him. He had to give him money would not be with him in less money was involved. That's what the relationship was is about money.
Now, both players in this tragic event, no, what each is expected of what is expected of each of them in this brief period time. What exactly is J BP's goal and what is Timothy School in terms of these uh yeah he's looking for money, but he understands what JP's ultimate goal is, and you said he he the porn industry because he would not because we didn't get along with the other actors, but more so just his clothing, so Alice how how much of an issue this. So I don't know that he saw that for in the future. How would and I think, while he was with him, he was trying to figure out what he was going to do because he had his child that he has for you need in one is, but there and then you know in all of this was going on. While he was spending time with JP and being compensate, before he met a girl? That's another element to this
he mattered rolling. Anyhow, he went to the bar one night and he met a bartender that was tending bar, really really pretty girl, her name is Christina and he met her and they started dating. So he then he has this girlfriend and he still has JP. That's looking to buy his affections from So at that point, when he met the girl and had to have a relationship with their. He wanted nothing to do with jade I mean he didn't want. You know you can say we're having a sexual relationship. Obviously he and JP were I mean that he was a paid. Boyfriend. I mean, I don't know any other way. You say a paid escort whatever you want paid companion. However, you want to say: she's not going to give him all that money and not expect him to have sex with him right. I mean I mean he admitted to that that they they were having sex, relax, there's no way he's going to give them money and not expect sex. I mean he was in at the which is as court basically, but when
actor stating that out because he didn't know anything about the porn and eventually he admitted to him that you know once we can deny it. I mean you saw this film, actually one ninety we sitting and watching Tv- and you put it once and are you still going to deny that that's you? He said it when they had. Film in there he said now, it's me now what so it's me. What do you want? It's me. I don't do that anymore, that's not who I am now it was in the past. I was desperate. I need I don't do that anymore. I don't bring it up again. That's what he said to JP. Dover. I know much that anyway, he really didn't once he left. He never went back not ever and he was called to go back and he didn't he just did he decided don't want to do it anymore. I need in that was it was over now which is the sorry go ahead. They sell a, he meets, Kristin He's dating Christina and Christina doesn't know anything about any of that stuff doesn't know
he does. Man doesn't know he was still having relations with JP 'cause. He needed money, he had ran t had, you know, take care, his daughter had a girlfriend. He was taking a rowdy at my. So that's what he was doing to get money was seeing JP to get money and he had this girl who had no idea about any of it? Didn't know that he was in the porn business and doing and didn't know about any of that stuff, none of it. So that's what was going on there So what did he want to do with Christine in terms of what his goal in terms of gaining money, and it was his next plan. What did he eat? Well, I think that what happened as she got pregnant the girlfriend got pregnant so Now he has another baby on the way he's got the daughter who is now three: for at this point and then he has a baby on the way. So now he's got these two, these two kids, You know it's going to have war support. He just tried to try. He was just trying to distance.
Self as much. He was trying to get money to keep getting money. Keeping one note but JP knew that he had a girlfriend and he would say, listen. I can't spend as much time with you because I have a girlfriend now and so what have long term? I have no idea what he was planning. I don't think he know he just do that minute. He had to me, He was trying to get work. He was standing at his resumes. He said he said he was going to maybe go. The National Guard and do reserve duty. So he get a check, that's what he said. He was maybe plant looking at maybe doing the middle. Terry uh as a as a reserve is so he could get a monthly. Check that way. You don't get very much sign up to support a family, but that was one of the plans he was trying to just get completely out of that kind of stuff as courting doing any cd stocking trying to you know, do it do it. Do it live a straight life? Let the terms that he use he was trying, but then he was on the hook with JP
eject. He wasn't going to just let him go that way. No, I said I have a girlfriend now I don't. I can't see you, she doesn't know you know, and that was not going to work with JP when he had his hooks in someone. He just didn't no friends he in this case. You said you gotta come over 'cause. He was very attractive and very attached to him at this point with him. Okay and tell us more about this meeting says you have to come over I have to come all week. I can spend time with me, you know and he would come over. We want to spend the night and he couldn't explain to her. Where was he going? What was he doing? You could explain 'cause, she didn't know any of these things. You know that was bad bad call. Should I just cut it all off completely, but then he was threatening him. That's when the threats started. That's when the course of events storage until he said, if you don't come and see me, I'm going to tell her I'm going to
when they were getting along and everything was fine, he said. Are you going tell her? You know and he was making believe that he was going to just back off and let him live his life and he said you met a girl, website says she know. Does she know that your passed. If you know who you are- and she said no, I don't have to tell her The things that start, who I am now that's in the past, We have to tell her any of those things, so he to Jp Adept died. He didn't that she didn't know and she was not gonna know not from him. So that's what he used. This is leverage start black. Tell him you don't come over here, I'm getting cold, You know what better, yet I'm going to send her one of your porno movies, that's what he was threatening him with. We can constantly I would call it was laying in bed with her at three hundred in the morning. He would be, I am on the phone who is dad was going. I don't know, crying phone, I don't know I. I know he was taught that constantly had to make up stories for who's going in. That was going on constantly with him blackmail. Now, by this time as well, Timothy,
Those the lay of the land at in terms of JP's home Ann and so tell us about. Say the day preceding or the day of, tell us about the events leading up to this incredible crime. Well, there was fierce there's another thing to what there's there's some different differing accounts What happened? The story that out. There is that there was a safer jp says, which there was. There was a safe there and The plan was TIM, which is going to go in there, Robin's House Rob JP's house, get money, take Christine and go away somewhere, go take Christina and his daughter and just leave and go somewhere else to some other city. That's what he says he was going to do. I don't believe that that's what he ever planned to do. That's what he said to the police. That's what he told his mother. That's what he said too, on the witness stand
and that's what he said he was well on the witness stand. It was completely different and I mean during the trial I mean initially he said that, but then he changed his story. That's what he told public that would the public story, the public version of events that he gave that he was going to go, go, get him to open the safe 'cause. He didn't have the combination to the safe. Rob him and leave that's what he said he was going to that's, not true. That is absolutely not true. It's all lies that I believe that he was going to go over there and just kill him because first it will, I think you know if he would have done anything like charge. Romney would have immediately called the police if he was left alive wasn't going to, he knew who he was. It wasn't going to just. Let him rob him and give him money right. That's before second thing: if see, if out got pissed off very badly, he would have told Christina and he definitely did not want or his families mother. Anybody to know that is. Has he didn't want anyone to know those things? No one knew
and he knew that he would tell any would have probably told if he had the chance would told them you well. He knew that he would tell, and he was very afraid of that. So he on the day of it, was November two thousand and six. When this happened he went there. He said he was going to just go there and rob the safe, and that would be it So what you want to know what happened now or. Yes, I want. What I also would also wanted to know was yeah no go ahead, tell us about what what actually happens. Well, he actually wanted to try to get him to stop. You know black telling him. You know, I even asked him: why don't you go to the police and say that he was blackmailing 'cause you're not allowed to blackmail someone, that's a felony when you're blackmailing when it doesn't matter who it is what it is not allowed to legally blackmail someone you do this or going to do this. That's blackmail, you know, I do that's crime. He said I thought
what about that? I actually did think about that. But then I would have had to say water he's blackmailing me over, so who is it going to take who the police gonna side with the? horror stories blackmailing because I'm a point star versus denies the overall goodguide philantropic JP calzone the well respected business, Denver Biz. I said he had a criminal record, you don't eat, said he didn't know. Tim told me that he didn't know that JP had a criminal record 'cause. He JP didn't tell that's of evil hi, my name is JP. I have a criminal record. He owned a collection agency then never dawned on him that he had a criminal, Record, I think, that's another issue if he would have known that, maybe he would have went to the police. He had a criminal record, TIM didn't the other one didn't he was blackmailing him
so, but he also wouldn't know. We wouldn't have also wanted his wife to find out his new is new girlfriend Christine he didn't want her to find out, and that would have been another way for her to find out to east trying to silence this guy in a couple front. Stop stop what he's doing and also silence him from saying, anything to anyone as well exactly any morning. He needed money, so he needed money also, he also definitely needed money right. So I won't give too much away here in terms of the trial, because it's like many cases, it's you think this is just going to be. Maybe possibly a plea agreement or they're going to spare the the family of the victims. The cost The burden and the and yet go to trial, and he takes the stand, which again is very unusual. Just tell us about the the crime scene itself and and before we do that,
What type of money are we talking about? He's thinking that maybe in that safe? he thought that were. You know like at least thousands of maybe at least one hundred thousand dollars in cash, and they say that's what he thought was in there. Because also a you asked me earlier in in weather whether had drug problems he did, but JP did JP had a very bad cocaine problem. He had a lot of drug problems and he always had money in that safety cause of that 'cause. He bought drugs. Although So there was a lot of money in the safe. He was right about that. I mean he said he saw him open it all the time any new. There was money in there right. He was at his house for many times. So you know that was money there. Now, on the on the day of the murder itself, Brent Cock. This is Kelso's housekeeper. He
isn't living in, but he has a key and he comes to work and discovers what tell us about the what is discovered at the Kelso's home, What the housekeeper that found the body is that what we're talking yeah. The housekeeper brand Cox was also gay CN. He had a male housekeeper. You just didn't like women, this man, he really did so Brad Cock, came to the house. On Monday. He was scheduled to clean out every day. Yeah people go to. Work had keys to that. He had. Keys to the house. He had keys to the house, and I've J he was that supposed to at work when Greg to the House he he saw that the car in the driveway, which was rare. He would go and clean the house when JP was at work. That was the schedule said he saw car in the driveway- and he thought that's with. Maybe he overslept.
And then he saw there was, you know no plates in the sink. It was a Monday morning. There would have been plates in the sink as he didn't clean over the weekend. He saw no plates in the sink he saw that it just looked weird to him. He thought and the dogs were outside and you It was called. It was November that dogs are never out in November. The three live dogs that were never outside, so when he went up he went up to Lucky STAR holding is great because he knew the car was out. So you really have to be home. There's a car was in the driveway, so he started calling him JTAG peed in here anything he let the dogs- and he went up here as you look for him and he discovered his body in the bathtub. He saw him in the bed to be looked at and he screamed he was. You know. He looked at me clearly could see that there was blood everywhere and he ran outside and called the police from outside
about and then tell us what the police response was in terms of tell us what happens next with police. Well, the police arrived and they you know at questioned him. And JP, which found nude in the bathtub with water. You know he was found naked and he weighed over three hundred. He found they found him and he had a pillow under his chin naked blood everywhere. In the you know, the water was bloody and that's how he was found. So the police came questioned. Him called the CSI team and uh went through? Do you want to know how they discovered that it was him or what we that Did I mean they went through phone records that so they figured out that it was time to the phone records to see who we called last?
that's how you initially, then there was also videotape surveillance, young video cameras on the house, and he was on videotape answering yeah. The last person that ended the house before the housekeeper was TIM. Didn't initially believed that there, because of the Size of the man and how he had to be put in the bath, They thought initially that there was more than they thought it had to be even more than one per. They took five cops five different police officers to get his body out of that they after they drain the water to fly over them to get him out, so they saw I'd, be more than one person to get him in there and they knew from the forensics in the bedroom. It was in the master bedroom that he was killed, but they knew the forensic said he was not shot. He was shot dead, so he was killed, but they knew it wasn't. He was not shot in the match up. They knew that his body was moved into the bathtub after he was shot, so they knew who, every day they figure that's why they thought it had to be more than one person to get in it. You know rigor, mortis sets in your happy when you, you know the body is very
it's a lot heavier when dead, so they thought It was more than one person for sure they thought that if they thought it was a very right when they saw it and they saw, conditions of the house and the forensics. They thought they called it a burglary at first. That's. Why They reported when they started reporting it on the news. They said that he was dead and that it was probably a Berg. Gone bad. That's what they that's, how they reported. It so tell us just We won't tell a about everything, because obviously he well. You can tell us about his escape or where his his flight, but also a teller how, in short order within a few days they they have the evidence to be able to For a first aid for yeah a because first we go through the phone records to see who he called less. So they know who the last person that he called it was down, and then he had video surveillance in his house in the inside and the outside both and he was on tape so
I knew it was him they knew. It was him that he was the last person in the house before the housekeeper. They know it was him. They identified him through the video they know with him. They were able to tell through the video that it was him matched out with the phone records who they put through and through the you know, and they were able to that's how they got the war right and he and he has an idea to take off south of the border and and prior to that, he you know he got on a plane. He was going to go back to L a because he had a I there he still had a car, there in LA. So he going to go to LA, but in out went dead, made a change. The plane made a change in at the last minute. He got off in Arizona and went The border in Arizona, instead of going back on, put he thought for sure, there's a war and didn't know for sure they probably they know already that it's me there's going to be a war and it's going to be too hard to get back on to connect to another plane.
We could get it at lax when he goes through. He could get stopped. So he thought it was better to stay on the ground now get back on the plane at that point, so he got it I went to Lukeville Arizona where the border is into Mexico. Over there he took a cab from there ever. He claims also when he got to shave how's it there was no money in it. That's what he told the police that he open the safe for no reason but the cab. Ride alone from the airport to the border was four hundred dollars. From in Arizona to get to the border of Mexico, so he claims that there was no money in they say. Which I personally know from my own knowledge that that's not true, but you know. Okay yeah and he gets by some tools as well. He went to Mexico, he actually went into Mexico after you know that right I mean he was in Mexico for awhile and then you know thought about what am I going to do. You know: do I want to go to a mexican jail he
about that too, because the Mexican Mexico doesn't have the death penalty. So in order to actually someone back a lot of time. Steak have to agree to not seek the death penalty once you're in Mexico, but they then, you know the other issue is: do I want to be in a mexican jail or a mexican bridging. You know their way. He was thinking about. I mean are, you know they were a year and a lot of money on him. He could have lasted for a while in Mexico because he was not in like it was in a little small little town in Mexico is very cheap to be there, so he could lasted. But that's you know you didn't that's not what he elected to do. He just felt it was very you know. Do you want me to say what happens here or not? I don't know to see voluntarily turned it. I mean he went back into Arizona and went over to the border patrol agents, actually what he did was when he is at the border, he went and got on the internet somewhere over there. Like,
cafe or something, and he saw there was a warrant for him, and so then he went over. Border agent in he goes. I want to turn myself in because I believe there's a war for me at a Denver that was eight hours on and will bill Evers on on the other side of the border and they go. We have we're is the warrant from any said Denver and they said, let's before he said, Murder and they went, and they looked in ages through the guns up and arrested him right there on the spot, but he turned himself in at that point. Hey after he got on the internet, knew there was a warrant. He turned himself in yeah. Now we won't. We won't go into the rest of we after they have another hour, to really explain the rest of this and for many true crime readers they they think. Well, it's a trial. This should be a slam dunk and often it isn't, and so we won't give away all the twists and turns you're in and of course you get the interview, Timothy,
like you say, he's notorious half truth teller, Yeah, a lot of lies and I've liar he is, I mean he eventually, you know opened up to me, but it took a took. A lot of going and getting no no his family and gaining their trust. I actually did television show with his mother to try and spend it in a little bit diff, talk about. You know the JP that you know it's not all what they're saying and I are maybe spending a lot of time with him already a chill, and I just thought I would discuss the case a little 'cause. They were spending a long way. I didn't really think that was right to do that. It wasn't. You know this was more. They just riding crime. It was ironic because in this case I knew the victim. You know and I felt that it was the best the right thing to do to get it on there and say you know. It's not always what what did things appear to be? Basically, is what I said you know he does. No one deserves to die. I say that in the book no one deserves it. No matter,
What day, do you know you don't like someone you stay away from them like I did. I never had any dealings with me after I left. You know I didn't like him. I stayed away from him, but you know, let's say the truth: let's not distort what the truth was. I really believe, that's very Port, and that's when I write I get a lot of heat for that sometimes 'cause. I know our vision, is I don't change? What happens? Is beak someone died tragically? I don't think that's right to do that. You know, it was my last book too. I had a got, took a lot of heat for that 'cause. My last one was about Scott Peters No one's perfect, right. We all. I will, I think, a lot of these stories. I view This cautionary tales, a lot of them, are let look at maybe in the next case. He did something a little different and went to played out. That way. That's my sinking, that's why I view a lot of these cases.
Well, obviously, you have to report on the obvious interaction between these people because it's not to say innocence or guilt or partly guilty behavior by a victim, but it's just a matter of fact that these situations arise and these characters collide, and we have this incredible murder and incredible Corky. And, like I said, I don't want to give it away, because we have you know the mother and the sister, and it's incredible: who shows up at the trial and who is important at trial, and then we have an appearance by the killer himself, which is very, We very unusual so that very rare, very rare, but when you're making defense that he was, he had known,
noise I mean legally, and they say that you know you never. No one ever has to take the stand in any state. That's just that's the law, but in certain defenses it's kind of necessary because the jury just sits there and there's nothing left, there's nothing to go on. If you don't explain your version in certain instances, and so he did take the stand, and it's very very rarely right. It's less than three percent of these kinds of cases. These murder cases less than three percent where the defendant takes the stand in these cases, So ninety seven seven percent of the time they don't do it. And any other thing is to not all defense attorneys are prepared to we'll say, take a fanciful tale from a defendant or something that would and to be proven in the end to be you know, total false anyway, and take that and truck that all the way in the trial. That's a rare.
I know that's, what's really crazy in this particular case, it's like people are going to read it and think oh oh my gosh, it's just like that happen, but it's matter record. It happened. That's very bizarre elements at this case also absolute, Yes, I want to we going to get any more away, but I want to say that this is a tail. That's as soon as you think you know, what's going to go on, then there's something else that pops up and definitely absolutely surprises. You, so very, very interesting story tenant for mature audience. I want to thank you very much. On a for coming on and talking about this book and for those that might want to connect with you or do you have a website, you do say, spotlight yeah. I have stand daily dot info. You can see a lot of my articles. We do lot of exclusive interviews with you know, criminals. I read about pop culture, so they can act with me if you have
story want me to look at it on Twitter. Ms Ms Donna Thomas best way to find me right and you also have a book about Scott Peterson and you're working. You said you know that was my last book, yeah, I'm sorry! I like you, it's a great great book. It's a great read! I'm sorry! I lied to you the confession of Scott Peterson. The only author that wrote a book about him that actually interviewed him at San Quentin on the only one. Well then it sounds like it. I'm going to have to invite you back on to talk about that, because we have not that cover that case and that's the one in the annals of true crime, history in America. S radically and that read a fascinating case. It really is, I know a lot of time with Scott so on death row, it's in Clinton. Yeah well we'll have to have you want to talk about that and then that is yeah. Thank you as well. Thank you so much for Having me, I really appreciate it. Thank you
Very much done, and I hope to talk to you again soon. You have a great evening and thank you for this interview. You too thank you. Bye, bye, goodnight,. I don't get the flavors of computer back in a big way, we're talking con king donuts, pumpkin, muffins, pumpkin munchkins, don't have holes, Oldboy, pumpkin, coffee, pumpkin, iced, coffee, pumpkin, frozen copy, pumpkin, latte, scanned the exciting new cinnamon sugar pumpkin signature latte, which has got sugar and spice and everything nice. It's pumpkin flavored everything at Dunkin America runs on Dunkin and pumpkin cake, ipods to limited time. Offer participation can kick it used under license all right.
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Transcript generated on 2019-11-05.