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six in a small North Carolina Mountain town, the days old. Bodies of two local men were found on a hillside, overlooking a lake south of town nearby. I was a woman's body, attire jack shoved into her genitals, other Terence wires and Neil discovered the crime in two thousand. One thousand four hundred and forty eight years after it happened and still unsolved. Now, the truth. The book to her featuring this evening is the true story of the nineteen sixty six Hendersonville triple murders, volume, one, the confessions, one thousand nine hundred and sixty six to nineteen sixty eight with my special guest author Terrence Wright.

Neil welcome to the programme, and thank you very much for a green. This interview, parents, writers, allodial good evening. Thank you. Thank you very much for joining me. Let's talk about first, you wrote about the Henderson Cripple murders, but it was a fictional book. Just tell us a little bit about this book. Did you wrote in two thousand sixteen thousand seventeen called the kills. Tell us a little bit about the kills. I wrote that book because a lot of the residents of the small town were really anxious to find out what I had discovered. But I was not ready to reveal the real names of the people involved. So I wrote this fictional version of the story.

To give everyone an idea. What had happened? What had really happened because they had never really heard the true story. But I did it and affection way, they could put the pieces together and and get an idea of what was going on and the great thing about the way. I do it was that it not only made a good story, but everyone in town who read it said I know exactly who you're talking about regardless of the fact I used a fictional name or a fictional location, so it achieved its purpose of basically buying me some time to finish. Writing the book with the actual names by supplying everybody with something to read in the interim. Now you write about your

your aim on your main goal in reconstructing these events through interviews and historical documents? What is the intention, and the goal of this primarily may well be? The crime itself was so intriguing to me when I first read it, and it was this by accident that I came across tat- I was looking for something to write about a true crime and I thought I would take something that was you know, old, unsolved, cold, very old, told case, so this one was nearly fifty years old, and so I selected it well almost immediately after this I started getting. Phone calls from people telling me to leave it alone. Let it go, there are people still alive, you don't want to do this? I even had a reporter call me until

It was her story and I had no business getting involved in those. Well, that's just raise the bar for me said I've. I've got to look into this, and on top of that, the more I read about this Korea like some accounts that had been written on the fortieth anniversary. I just said to myself: there's there's no way that this can possibly have happened. This way, for instance, the two men who were murdered, who were gay. Who am, I believe, that their they were lovers says we would have called them back. Then they did not live together, who were murdered. They were pictured in such a vile way in the fortieth anniversary series that I knew personally, that that would just didn't make sense and there were lots of other red herrings and things like that

the more I told them to this I just decided I had to explore. I think the most important aspect of the story: Now that that bug me, the most was that in the fortieth anniversary Series for the book of others, sorry a night in two thousand and six, that was not in the local newspaper It alleged that pay. An african american man named Edward Thompson. Was actually the murderer, and the more I read about how they came to this conclusion. I just decided that this was another instance where we will probably about a was being used as a scapegoat and, I just say, that, if, for no other reason than to find out, if it was really true

Maybe I could do something to help show that he actually did not commit the crime and and discover who did commit the crime of those were my other several goals and there I realize that it was so intriguing that I just guess I wanted to solve all up and if I could, talk about the fortieth anniversary Special and you talk about you talk about the programme after that, as well with this involving the psychics. So but you tell us what what was your first step? You talk about writing. A book did with so many people that helped you, but you talk about a person called the pic

in the beginning, Dick Sixty six, I believe where you say he helped. So what was the first thing? What was the first break or what was the first? Your first step in this investigation, where I have to admit that, even though I disagree with most of the stuff that I read in the two thousand and six fortieth anniversary Series that was featured in the local Henderson North Carolina newspaper. I have to admit that it was because of the fact that it was actually featured in the paper. I would probably have not explored this crime as much as I did so after reading bowed and discovering that are figuring out that I just couldn't believe what I am reading. I actually placed an ad A local newspaper called the mountain Express in Ashraf Ill North Carolina, which is near by and I put a picture of the woman, allegedly though a picture of the woman

who had been murdered in with my add, it was because of that add that I started getting phone calls from people and pick sixty six this source did not come along right away, I would say: maybe it was six months later, but it was definitely because of the fact that This add was placed initially it raised awareness among the community that I was investigating the crime and word got around to many many people who began contacting me, and so I created my my facebook page called the nineteenth Sixty six Andersonville trouble martyrs and that became actually a great landing spot for many of the people to a kind of gather

a virtual room and discuss this with me as well, as do private message: Jane almost like private messaging interviews. With of it was. It was different for me to do this it's way buddy. I I was discovering the technology actually offered a lot of benefits when it came to investigating the crime. Let's talk about before we get too far ahead here. Let's talk about this Marie of what was known at the time it was reported in the time in nineteen. Sixty six of the climate self, before we start talking and introducing tell us just a summary of what police could see at the outset. I am at the crime scene itself. How was it reported? Well that will be a little difficult to do precisely because I do not believe that it was reported.

Accurately by the Police- and I do not believe that the local newspapers actual be portrayed everything accurately either what I discovered- looking back is that newspapers outside of the general area of this all community, a North Carolina were actually work, what details that was not being reported locally so that they accept details, as was reported initially, was that the two men who ran a local music shop in Henderson they'll North Carolina called Tempo muse. They they socially sold vinyl LP. That was the primary business who were. They were very popular and teenagers are very popular with teenagers. They were also gay. They

they were gay and nineteen sixty six, which was, Pretty unusual and pretty brave thing to do. Because it nineteen sixty six, even the American Psychological Association, was called being homosexual, deviant behaviour and and bad. So to do this in a very small mountain, town in North Carolina aware, basically, you didn't I'd have interstates or they were being built. What was it the brave thing to do so, these two men one week Angela, I just didn't, show up at the record store and it didn't open so be the father of one of the men reported this and it actually took about two or three days before any one took them seriously and then began reported in the local newspaper two men, the two men are missing that went on, for

or two or three days that there is a search for these two men nobody knew where they were course. The rumour was so well. They just gone off somewhere in the and they'll, be back, and then, on Sunday night in July, nineteen sixty six the local radio station reported over the air that the bodies of two men and some one else were found at lakes. And literally was soon as the residents of small family. Maybe three thousand people in the entire area they literally. Got in their cars and and and drove down to like summit and walked all over the murder scene or I'll. I'm calling it the murder scene will call the crime scene but walked all over that scene and destroyed

a dance and picked up things, and, and then it was just reported in the newspapers about these two men, Charles Glass and Vernon, Shipman their badly decomposed bodies were found on this no side, like summit and nearby was what appeared to be body of a woman and the interest thing about it was that you read the back cover of the book. Book and book, and you noted in there that she was defiled. A attire jack had been round up inside of that actually was not reported, and it was denied for many many years and no one even wanted to net, but that was actually what they had. Found and in fact it had been removed by the police before

people started showing up that night in July, eight nineteen sixty six, so what the police bound and what they reported were two entirely different things and my guy, right. There is the great beginning of a wonderful mystery story, although its a little more Cobb to go on a wonderful industry story, but it sure set the tone for this one. They talk about them. You talk about the county that was involved with tell us how police problem proceed in this investigation. Well, the interesting thing about the where the police proceeded was that there was a sheriff in town who was elected sheriff.

And then there was a police chief in town and almost immediately. However, there was this county of Henderson where there was this police chief of the chief powers and the Sheriff Sheriff Hill. However, for some odd reason, the sheriff in a county near by a bunker county witches were Asheville, is share of clay. Decided that he was going to take over the investigation because he said that the woman who was found near by the two men had lived in fill and he had jurisdiction over this crime that took place in Henderson, County of Sheriff Hill was up fairly. Week administrator and not

he was well liked, but he was not considered a very good sheriff and in fact, a few months later he was voted out of office. It was a republican and thirty years of a republican sheriff. Indeed, in November of that year, he was voted out of office and the first democratic sheriff was placed there so because there was such a week Its presence in the area of it Billy gave sheriff clay the ability to just move in and take over. But of course the one question is: what business do you have here doing us

Nobody seems to be able to push on all the way and an end to say leave us alone, so it was some. It was strange. I would say from the very beginning very strange as far as what the belief for doing now in this just like any investigator, he has the ability to hire private investigators or an and higher anybody. He wants and needs to be able to further this investigation. Who does he call and what is the sort of premise for that call? How does it come to be that he has his eager person willing to help him? Who is it. Well, that's another very curious thing too is so you got this crime that occurs on a small mountain town in North Carolina and no

and things too much about it, except maybe it's because these guys, you're, gay and people are. To get em, and maybe it's the coup course clan, ably somebody else, but the sheriff and the chief. They all have assistance, they have deputies, they have investigators and get share of clay, Overrun bunker County. Ass, his own soul investigators and things calls a man in Miami. His name is Edward Stanton and he deputizing Edward spam. Edward Stan comes up through the air Breyer. Apparently he spends thirty days in the area, although that's the fact that here

is even in the area is not even reported by the local Andersonville newspapers. It is reported in Asheville, but very little information is given about him and he is deputized by share of clay and an chair, Clay says that he sends Stanton back, to Miami with all of his files, which is another very peculiar state because the first thing that I ask is what files and what is he doing with files for a crime that takes place? neighbouring county and why is he giving into a man from my Emmi, and why is this man taking him back to Miami? The other interesting thing about this is that share of clay gets away with all of this activity, and yet this state bureau-

instigation, the North Carolina State Bureau of Investigation comes into this crime begins investigating sets up an office nearby in a motel sets up a special crime number and, according to other sources, the FBI, comes in and begins investigating, but the only thing that I know so far about what the F b I did was that they built files on all of the homosexuals in town and that's all I've been able to find so far. The F B. I says that they have destroyed the file. So that's that's all I know about that, but you have all of these agencies who held the authority to investigate.

And do all this stuff, and yet this guy from Miami pops up for some unknown reason and any disappears and its again just a complete mystery as to why this guy is there now the conductor investigation. But there are no, they make no arrests, but then someone named Joe Henry par him. This is nineteen sixty eight sources, Lou ways away. One is in a county Florida jail possess right, Wrigley tools, I believe. He passes a note to a jailer, tell us about who Joe Henry Pyramids and this note to the jailer what it says But what we know now about Joe Henry was that he actually had local connection. She was born just across the border in a spartan Burg, South Carolina

his sisters lived in the area and he had an itinerant or em. He had been person who had worked in the young farmer fields of Henderson County Does they grew a lot of flowers back and he had actually work for a glad he Ola flower grower and he had been in the area and nineteen sixty six ass. He had been for many other years working there. He was pretty much just career. The fourth, basically on the way he goofed off was to their work and the farm feels or to steal so he was arrested. Lee county is Fort Myers. Florida, which is just

on the other side of Florida from Miami, so you're pretty far south. When you get the Fort Myers and he was arrested and when he was, he was arrested with burglar but a Carl apparently from when I read that charge was pretty weak and he was not really going to be held very long, but he did ass a note to this man and at the jail, and he said I want to talk to an investigator and he hit here. I have copy of the note I published in the book and his axe. Isn't he s handwriting? So the investigator concern and talk to him, and he says he says I killed Charles Glass

I'm the one who did it and he goes him information and, that sets off crazy chain reaction of events having this man with a third great educate Should it works on the farm fields and Henderson County and lives in Fort Myers and gets arrested with burglary tools? It says office, crazy chain of events, two years later, and nineteen sixty six after these murders when he confessed was to killing one of the game, and so that's that's studio we don't know a lot about him. Other than that. You talk about this convention and its one of four confessions. I believe- and this first confession: does he state any

who did for killing Charles Glass and then, as a result of this one confession. What does Ed Staten do so you got Joe Henry Partum he's sitting in the jail in four Myers and he makes his confession: Phyllis Investigator, with the Lee County sharks offered. So he, the sheriff's office calls Henderson County and they confirm that sure. There was a murderer and nineteen sixty six and yes, man knew TAT all glass was was murdered, so immediate, we, the people and Henderson Kelly, are, are very, very interested in learning more about Joe Henry Poem, now keeping mine also that in nineteen sixty eight we got a new sheriff and Henderson County is names.

James, Patrick. He was the Democrat that was elected and James Kirkpatrick has has really decided that he wants to solve these murders. He wants to take charge, jam. You didn't care about sheriff clay, even though Sheriff Clay's give the a hard he said, I'm gonna I really want to solve the. He was really happy to get this information about. Sky down in Florida. So they immediately make plans to travel down to Fort Myers, to talk to Joe Henry Poem and yet almost immediately after they received word of what has happened in Fort Myers in Henderson, Velvet to work. Suddenly you got the having never heard from him. For two years you got Edward Stan Overend Miami who drives overdue for Myers. Somehow he has heard already that show Henry Forum has made this confession and not only that this figure

officially deputized by Bonham, county sure, clay. So the leak Many people let him in, and we don't exactly know what Stanton talked with Joe Harry Potter about, but he spent three hours with them discussing whatever this case. I guess now it's true that any left and and that we have some Other documents explained some things he said, but he laughed and then Sheriff Co. His deputy actually does Did he investigator? Neil Grissom comes down first, and he and interviews Joe Henry now do have to make it clear to that. It's interesting. Almost immediately again by reading different newspapers, you get different views of what actually going on and the sheriff Kill, Patrick

has maintained after several interviews with part time after he goes down and and also actually bringing back Henderson counting which they do because Shokhin Kendrick waves, extradition, Charcoal Patrick, maintains a Joe Henry Poem has been very consistent and everything that here said about the crime and his role in it and what he has witnessed in what he has done interestingly enough, some other documents that I have been uncovered and also some of the news articles. The poem was just make it up. One story after another how he went out drinking Worth Vernon, shipment and Charles Glass and how he discovered they had money and Sophie they were, they were at the Lake South a town, and he saw this man? he pulled his gun on Germany shot a man that was one story

and then another story is heading come over here, but there's all these different versions that supposedly Joe Henry Poem said yet Sheriff Kirkpatrick says no he's been very consistent and what he has told us. And he knows details about this crime that nobody else knows so to be honest with you, Do I have to buy what Sheriff Kirkpatrick says, but most immediately after Joe Henry Poem, it is known that he is I just confession and after them has been their share of clay, goes on tirade in the media and the local newspapers, Asheville and Andersonville, and were whoever every also listen to him they're all wrong. This guy may know something about this, but he had nothing to the sheriff. Clay hasn't even talked of arm

doesn't even know anything about it yet, but he's already decided that this guy is fruit, cake and needs to be just ignored, because and she's just trying to get out of jail free. So we are once again, you ve got parliament saying that all these things about what is motivations were in that he knew all these people on a just wanted to steal three hundred and forty dollars, which is supposedly all got from them, and that was his reason for murdering three people. Of course, that's essentially ludicrous, because we know that some of the facts that parliament is alleged to have said are totally inaccurate, but in his last confession, which we have he pretty much nail

exactly they or at least which documented exactly what really happened and thus crime, and it's right there in black and white. So I have to wonder if parliament playing a game with the investigators which is possible, because criminals will often negotiate with investigators- do a little dance around here. It's what I know and here's what I dont know and If you want to know more I'll, tell you this: if you give me this, and so maybe he was doing that or Maybe the investigators, maybe some of the copse, were dirty. Maybe they were trying to cause poem to be disbelieved by the general public, so that

The truth would not come out about what really happened with the trouble murders and I tend to be in the latter camp, because I do believe that Joe Henry Farm did actually kill trials glass and that he was one of the participants in the sky. You wait, though, at the same time to complicate the story. More would complicate this case more or two so the gate out information. You have Edward Thompson, a black man in the news at the same time tell us about what is in the news for and then of course, what we believe. He is guilty of honey that he suddenly gets drawn into this, because he doesn't get drawn into it until

one thousand nine hundred and sixty eight and one thousand nine hundred and sixty six Edward Thompson isn't even case not even a candidate for being involved in this. And in fact on the cover of the book is a spy spectre of investigations scheme. I'm a man who was allegedly in the car with the three victims, witness by these two different people on the day that the bodies were discovered, that man is cut short cropped, hair is white and end. The pictures of Edward Thompson was black. Don't even closely resembled at

yet nineteen sixty eight when poem makes us confession. What becomes apparent to me is that somebody doesn't want poem talking and they ve got to find somebody to blame for this. So it is alleged that Edward Thomson has kidnapped a teenage couple in southern Henderson County in a place called flat rock and that he rate the young girl and then he kidnapped and put him in the trunk of a car, took him to a spot someplace but does not identified and where he dug up bag of coins and then drove these made. These children may be made. These teenagers drive him all over kingdom com until at which a one point,

He brought some off leaves them somehow he's is and and then disappears later on. It will be said that he also was responsible for kidnapping a doctor in his wife for murdering a couple in for three counties over, Virginia and then also kidnapped the other three other girls. So he Edward Thomson with an extremely busy man. This one p,

three nineteen sixty eight in March. All of which I dont believe he actually did, because when you read some of the other articles that are actually out about what happened, there is nothing that even closely the descriptions there are NOS. Let us say that that there is no physical description of who this alleged black man, one

That that kidnapped this couple teenager there is no description and in fact, in one of the newspaper articles, it says that they were shown a very bad photograph of that were Thomson and they said oh well. Yes, that's the man well, of course, its it just was probably not true, because I went and looked up the court records on on what these two teenagers actually said. Apparently there that where there is no statement from the girl saying that she was raped her foot, other actually made the statement, but there is nothing on file from her and it was actually the boy, a teenage boy who said that the man performed oral sex on him, so I dont even believe that Edward Thompson was anywhere near these two

in nineteen sixty eight. I also don't believe that he was even any place near Henderson bill in nineteen sixty six I believe it was simply a matter of a well and you would have to know the American South to understand those- is that all that a white girl had to do back and that even as late as nineteen sixty six, which and say Well, that's him that black man over there he that they could just pick somebody walking down the street and if they wanted to accuse and point there somebody in say she did at any rate me. That's all it took and that that man could be lunch. Because of that- and I am, I honestly believe that that is what happened with Edward Thomson. They need somebody to blame for the triple murders. So it was a nineteen sixty aid that two years later

the rumour became truth, but Edward Thomson. The black man, was the man responsible for killing these you people, the two gay man and a woman and leaving their bodies on the hillside, unlike summit, so suddenly we have a completely new story, but circulating and and and so the heat is awful. I guess you could say John Henry Poem, some he there they basically do everything they can to discredit Hamburg. So that's it you're right. It gets very twisted and ugly, but unfortunately,.

So they they eventually get to the point where they did despite the confessions. Despite the sum of the facts lining up, at least they believe they ve mass this up and they have to let him go. There are no charges against your right and in its that's another strange thing too, because in order to extradite Edward Anson back to Henderson County, my sheriff Co Patrick has gone to preserve something to the local jurisdiction and he does, and a man named William actually. Prepares the warrants and issues the orders to arrest him and they go and get em and bringing back from Henderson Count are firmly. County in Florida to Henderson College, so that I can

eight hundred miles, and so there was sufficient information and evidence and reason too, I believe that show Henry Poem did this, and yet, within two months they somehow went through a process first of all. They they decided that Joe Henry Poem was suicidal, and so he was sent to a state hospital for evaluation is actually nothing that we, that we read about children reports that indicates that he was ever suicidal, but he was mentally defective. He was not a very educated man, but he doesn't. He eventually is released by the state hospital. They said, there's nothing wrong with this guy and yet

before the Incas dry on that letter before attacks they even may older from this. Hospital in railway back in him personal two hundred miles to the west. They decided that there are no charges that they can bring. Against Show Henry Parma gonna drop it and they're gonna relation, and it just like that is he's out of jail and at the same time there was no other than the rumours. There was no attempt to arrests, Edward Thompson for these martyrs. That's the other interesting thing about this entire. At the sword, involving Edward Thompson is that there was a lot of finger, pointing an allotted innuendo and they started incredible conversation.

Turns around town and they implied that he was involved. He was never ever even charged. He was never even interviewed, there's no interviews that I can find, and even if he was there's nothing to prove Edward Thompson was ever ever considered a a prospect in these crimes and actually there's nothing. He was never brought up on a charges for kidnapping the doktor and his wife, the teenage couple. He was not extradited to Virginia to stand trial for the murder of the couple there, and it just extremely bizarre about how everyone had this idea that, ah yes, they finally caught him, it was a black man. Of course it had to be because this is

fell from their such horrible people. Thank God. We got him now. We can put this crime to rest, but none of that true with all the charade. At the same time, with this you're not the same, time, but in your investigation one character that we that very vital and, of course imports the stories Louise she made. Then what did you find in your investigation above the ways, because this is important, depiction of Louise in this story as well as well as the the investigation uncovered by police. Initially in nineteen sixty six that there could have been some kind of drug connection here that Temple music, they were selling some yellow jack. It's mean some speed on the side and, of course, as you mentioned, the nineteenth six idea of homosexuals being deviance

and probably the source of all kinds of other problems because of that inherent criminality due to their Homosexuality tell us what you find out about Louise Shoe made and what others how they depicted the life of Louise should make sure, and I think that is important to put that internally. You said, put it all in perspective because now we're saying oh, it was because of them being homosexuals and they were selling drugs and, oh, of course, no reason they got in trouble and no reason all this happened. But put in context and understanding bad Hendrick in county was a dry county. At the time there were lots of people in town who had

liquor in their house and they were holding little private parties and selling. It goes against the law. There were lots of parties going on around town that that I discovered, when I do all my interviews and a lot of was a lotta reckless behaviour. It wasn't just Charlie and Vernon who were. The ones who were. I guess you it will call it sitting because a lot of the people in town there's a lot of churches and allow the people were good up, standing citizens, but they were doing a lot of stuff the rest of the week that I guess they were confessing to on Sunday put their lives. What exactly is pure and is wholly as they would like people to think. Louise was a very interesting character to research. Of course, that was the big question who was Louise Shoemaker

It was this woman found with us to least who gay men and nobody in town seem to you know who she was to me. That should be the first thing that you took off the bar Well, if they don't know who she is she's, not hanging around the music store- and you haven't seen her on the streets then she may not have actually had anything to do with these guys. So, but not what most people didn't like that idea. They try to connect her, but they said that Louise had an apartment in his place called the Ravens Cross departments in Asheville. So the first thing I did was I decided to look at what facts were presented about the ways, and so at the time there were things called city directories. They were sort of like a phone book, but they were much more detailed. They were

give you the name of the person their address, what they did also list all the people in the household and ages to sometimes so I I looked for Louise Shimmy, There is no record ever of the way she might ever living at his Ravens Cross apartments and Asheville. Absolutely no record whatsoever. In fact, the last actual entry that I can sign for the reach shoemaker of her actually even being alive, is nineteen fifty nine when she was living on account of the name of the road. But she had been living with her mother and thence. He was living in another apartment and she was working at a bone. My department store- and that's it nineteen fifty nine, if you try to fine

entry for Louise Shoe any place else. There is not so that should be a trigger. I would think for anybody investigating this crime, but there were some very other strange things about Louise And- and that was That was what I needed to figure out. Is that where we actually talking about Louise Shoe Made- or maybe this with somebody else, The reason I say that is because one of the very first thing said I notice that was odd was today a certificate for Louise Shoemaker. Now social security numbers were issued geographically back then so wherever you lived, all you had to do was walk into a social security office, and that's where are you it would be assigned yourself assured him.

And the numbers were signed with a number that indicated what region you had signed up in. So Louise was born and Asheville North Carolina and the number for her such a scary number should begin with two like everyone else in the area. But the number on the bird on the death certificate said that Louise had a sausage number that began with zero three four, and that indicated to me that she had gotten her certificate for ourselves, Deborah sometime somewhere in the northeast. Oh, I was able to narrow it down and I was able to determine that Louise Shoe made allegedly Louis she made the sausage carry number was fired in a place called Lynn L. Why, in in Massachusetts, so the next

That would be obvious to me that shook what happened was when the fortieth anniversary Series came along the way that the reporter justified this. While she put a sentence in her story that said Louise and her husband, France's exile, shoe made lived in Massachusetts for ashore. Time, but there was nothing to substantiate that so I began researching it. There is no record of Louis Shoemaker ever having lived in Massachusetts at any time there are records of her living and Asheville with her husband. Those I could ever living in Beckley. Worse Virginia were her husband, love you with the travelling salesman I have a record of her living in Dallas Texas. Where she worked at Niemann, Marcus for a short time in the late forties

I have entries for her in Atlanta, where she worked in a department store. They are called riches. I have the nineteen. Fifty nine entry works It was working at Bonn marching of entry for her from the nineteen twenties. She was living in Russia, but I can't find any of these documents that other reporters her views the justified. Why Louise would have a so stern number that begins with zero. She never lived in Massachusetts. There are no records to indicate that she ever lived. There less use this as an opportunity to stop for a SEC to talk about a sponsor which is honey. We or shop online a lot, but did You know you can make online shopping even better. You can with honey honey. Is the free

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with no seemingly credible background to her. But let's talk about who you found in terms of her daughter, this daughter that everyone remark that look like her mother. Let's talk about her daughter, Christine and her background where this is an interesting development. In this entire story, somehow I had to make sense of the fact that there was this woman with a false colonel began with zero. I had to make sense for the fact that I found medical records or even the doktor Meda. In about a remarkably young looking woman when at the time it Louise would have been going to the sky. Sure was nineteen fifty one she would have been an her late forties. I believe so I guess you

I have been saying that you shouldn't you didn't say what age, but I would assume that he's talking at least thirty so and everyone else There were these comments and articles that we would reach. She looked round. A couple young Louise was remarkably young looking woman and I had to reconcile how Louise could be Louise, who could be sixty one when she is murdered her? Who could have disappeared suddenly from the face of the earth and nineteen fifty nine and and figure out how this body came to be on the side, badly, decomposed body, so The first thing I had to do was to fortunate, because I've discovered that Louise had been living with a family in the sixties,

and hinders near Henderson Bill in an area near Poor shoe North Carolina. I would just right outside Andersonville and that Louise had been very ill and end the people that I interviewed on that can and should be named right now, but they they indicated that Louise was quite ill and that shit at her own room in the back of the house and that where she stayed most time. Well, first thing about this. This makes absolute sense to me, Here's, a woman who night thirty one had surgery. She had cancer on her breast nineteen. T9 she's working on Abortion Department stores she suddenly just doesn't have an addressed anymore. I will make sense at all. She's going to live with this fact

a friend that she met a nineteen thirty one. Ok, fine Louisa, sixty one she's old. She has cancer she's a smoker shoes, living with his family. So why are late saying that she is at the Ravens Cross apartments? I dont quite understand. So I had a look back further and I I had to figure out: did there was there were rumours there was? A lot of talk about the the woman having a daughter but no one ever would name her. It was just a little tagline that came up and stories about the. So what I discovered is TAT Louise shimmy actually went by her first name Opel and her maiden name some nineteen sixteen shoe was a student and then suddenly she wasn't student anymore. She sorted just disappear.

And then she shows up in nineteen twenty two in a city directory net, so she's a trained nurse and now he's using her name? Louise Davis? The first thing it struck me is that to be a nurse you training and you probably need to graduate Highschool. So I verified all that verified that it would not have been possible for Louise to have become a trained nurse in two years and and why in the world, would she have dropped out of high school because there's no real. There's no record of river graduating the logical explanation for that is, as would be appropriate for back in that time, those that she became pregnant and she had a child under that the issue, she then began working at department stores. She had this one entry for when she was a nurse and

she, the pan, then start working a department store. So she obviously had this child. She married, a cell shoe years later and actual and then five? years later, bells living in Asheville, with his daughter Christine Christina, and I think it or Christina sorry Louise is not there and that's because there are the others starting this time when they're on the out they actually get divorced, and nineteen forty two so that I might my first thought was well Christine is, is the reason that Louise dropped out a high school. Christine is: is the daughter living with her father and ash and probably her mother, who just not recorded there at the time. So it is pretty obvious that that ways

has had this daughter. So then, I do a little more research and I discover Asia has a will- and He names he names these children, he house with his second wife after he divorces, ways and nineteen forty two, but then he names Christine and he gave ceased other children a few things, but he gives Christine all of these oil rights and and things like any like Christine is obviously extremely special to him for some reason, so I'm able to research and discover that that the Christine actually was born that then she went to live with a cell and West Virginia. He got divorced from his wife, then so you know it. These are the kind of things that you put together by sometimes not by exact Roy.

But by the pieces of the puzzle around the entire thing. So you can see the big picture and it would make sense then that Louise may have gotten but also that might be a reason that Christine might be sick too and in fact Christine does die and nineteen seventy and for that they so she's, she's, very young and when she dies so Christine is probably sick too. But she was problem. The one Christine was probably the one who went to the hospital in Asheville, who had surgery on her breast breast cancer. And who was pretending to be her mother. She was probably using your mother's name because her mother had insurance. So that would make perfect sense to me your mother's in Atlanta, Christine, to the hospital for one Asheville. She has the surgery. The doktor makes a reference about Louise, who was born in nineteen. For being a mysteriously.

I'm looking and, of course, she's, not mysteriously young looking. She is she's, not Louie shoes, Christine pertain over your mother goose She has insurance, but that's how she's gonna pay for those, so that all makes perfectly good sense, but how to reconcile night, the nineteen sixties. So what happens when Louise disappears, while Louise goes to live with this family Cuz movies has L2 she's a smoker she's one thousand nine hundred and sixty one she's she's left a fairly hard life of working on her feet for decades and department stores and now she's, extremely ill and Christine still around town and She but Turner's Ravens cropped issue where the people who told me about Louise living at the farm, told

He also that Louise would give them hair permanence. There were these girls would get permanent, very tight. Curl something like that that when you're young, you sort of mixed up people that sometimes you you get involved with it. I'm thinking about how why wouldn't Louise, who was very, sixty giving a permanent and all this, and then I discover that that Louise allegedly at this very good friend. Her name was Hazel Macneil Hazel with a hairdresser and Hazel had a first floor apartment at the ravens crop departments will suddenly I'm beginning to think now. This is making sense. It wasn't. Louise, who is giving these girls see a permanence. They were young, Major Scott, the person wrong. It was Hazel who was visiting the ways with Christine the daughter and and then Joe Henry poem. Suddenly I went

discover this information I have he says: oh yeah, I went to see this issue may at the Ravens Croft apartments I went there once and got a shot of morphine for five dollars and I'm thinking, but Louise Shoemaker never lived at the ravens laughed apartments, but Hazel did that entire oh wait a minute, he went to hazels apartment. He just thought it was Louisa department and maybe Christine was still ill, and maybe she was getting morphine but more likely they were probably taken I'm a Louise's morphine that she was using the keep herself sedated. They were taking it back to the apartment and they were passing out shots for five dollars a pop and that in the end they got to know, Charlie environment because they were gay and there was a gay bar downstairs not far.

Way from the ravens crop department- everything was finally fall into place and if it made perfectly good sense that Louise and Christine looked enough alike, that sometimes Christine would pretend to be the waves. But when she did, people would remark about how remarkable young she locked. While they was Christine. Who was remarkable young at the time? It wasn't the lees, so it it it suddenly ages. All made perfectly good logical, terms how the rumours innuendoes Ashley did fit into this fairly seamless series of events are people just

living their lives and doing things that people do every day, and I could prove it all. I could prove every bit of it. I didn't have any proof for the stuff the people thought they believe, but I had lots of proof for, though the stuff that made sense about what was going on. Let's talk, bout. The boy friend said she meets and how serious that relations gap gets and what she receives from him tell us about This boy will end and I think that you need to understand them I'm gonna give one tiny little thing away, but it is excruciating important that you understand that there is a person in Henderson fail to this day,

living person who walks around town with a little box and his takes a great deal of pride in it and when he brings it out and shows that the people and raises ought takes the lid off? He says this is the finger of the woman who was found murdered and nineteen six well what the world is this man doing with his finger? Well, so it took me a long time to figure this. This part out, because there were a series of events that took place in the United States and the world for the pre these two years in nineteen, sixty four There was a major robbery in New York at the natural history, museum gaining mirthless serve Jack, Murphy, Alan another guy. Apparently,

The climb down through some windows at the natural History museum late at night, it was they were just open. And went in, and cracked all the glass display cases and stole bunches of jewels and Jones, including the stuff, our sapphire India that along Ruby something called the american Eagle Diamond, which was the largest uncut diamond ever found that the United States at the time had been found in Wisconsin, and Then they ran after Miami. Well, so in nineteen sixty five these guys are caught and there

these things are worked out so that they will give back or tell people how to get back some of the jewels that they stole and to make a long story short guess who is involved in helping to the recovery, Edward Stanton, our mysterious private investigator from Miami who is good, buddy to a share of clay who shows up in Henderson Bill, and course by now, I'm like scratching my head. Wait a minute wait, a minute. This is becoming way too crazy. I've got a private investigator from Miami who doesn't make any sense. Why he's involved in a small town murder who a guy who gets involved in helping the New York Police Department, recovery Jones that were stolen from a museum and what the world is he doing in Henderson Bill trying to solve this crime, but also

what is she doing getting involved in these Johnson and things like that there is one drop where they try to recover some of the gems that actually fails again. To make a long story short. Not all the Germans are ever recovered to the most important ones: the Delong, Ruby and the STAR Sapphire India are recovered, but the Eagle diamond is not recovered and the Eagle diamond is, they believe, Davis, and, probably rightly so. It was a law uncut diamonds. They believed that it was probably so often and it was cut into smaller jewels and nobody would ever be able to figure out what had happened to it. Well, ok, so I got these holes in my story and somehow I've got to

you're out why Edward Stanton is involved in a crime in the little time out of town, but also he's involved with. These recovery of these tools and researching a little bit more about the small. Town of Henderson Bill and, honestly, I think Jessica, Fletcherwood love the small town, because I've never seen so much stuff on an andreasen counting the year before trouble murders. This man was arrested, his name whose Harry Henry Sentner and he was living in a motel and he when he was arrested. He was using five aliases one up was a real estate, developer or other aliases who he was using and he was recovered with black well over a hundred thousand dollars worth of precious chums, combat

find out Harry Henry Sentner, and my research was a very famous international jewel thief who use various aliases have been in prison prided himself on never having a gun, but he had also set up a counterfeiting, using some of the money or from some Joam said he had stolen down away and he set this up and salute North Carolina. Down the road and it was very successful, There were manufacturing, very good twenty dollar bills until they were caught, and that was actually out. They discovered Harry with all these Jones because he had financed at all, so we ve got Harry. We ve got Edward Stanton and we ve got jewels and we ve got Louise and and her fingers been cut off, and this

higher on earnest shut up inside of her and the most obvious solution to this, is that Harrigan reset nor who was a ladies man. He hed, multiple wives, all over the country, children all over the country, Harry Head, as I discovered, had gotten a hold of the eagle diamond. And he had gotten the whole of this, because Edwards phantoms wife who he was on the out with and who was part of the failed Jem recovery, the first drop and of actually got pictures of her, the back of her head sitting at her Cadillac and a parking lot in life magazine. So this is this is all true. She just disappears.

Oh, she disappeared with the Eagle diamond and she took the Harry Harry knew how to cut diamonds, but he also new people who could do cutting for the diamonds that we're very important that he was a very confident with those on the Eagle diamond got cut and he gave he did he and Christine he developed the relationship with Greece, Christine Shoemaker. She was a fairly wild child and he was pretty wild Listen to one they developed a relationship. He gave her an engagement ring The engagement ring was one of the diamonds cut from the Eagle diamond when it was discovered that the diamond had been taken somebody in top,

I am, and I'm not going to go into that is now, but I do think I know that was decided that they needed they wandered back. It was theirs, they decided and that's why Edward Staten was suddenly involved. He had discovered, but Harry was up there. He had discovered the hairy, probably Where he had been found with all these Jones Harry probably the one who had the diamond sure enough when big they got up here. Grants which a took place and you have you can read the book to discover exactly how it happened. But when Louise Shoe made was confronted by Edward Stamp nodded stem, but a man that he hired name Wharton Gay she had the ring that Harry had given to

sixteen on her finger, and that was all Lawton Gay needed to, though that was the ring he was looking for. That was the diamond that he wanted. So they hauled Louise, the bedroom of that farm, the man who the farm took Louise's car, parked it out near the river and left it there and the ways was discovered a few days later, dad her skull, cracked, open her finger cut off because they couldn't have gotten the ring off because her hands were so swollen and attire iron push up inside of her, because what Lawton Gay didn't realize he thought that Louise was actually Edward stands wife, who had gone missing, so he did that.

Because he wanted to get back at her for leaving his friend Edward stand. It was a mistake and it wouldn't have how and if he had known the truth about it, brought they recovered the stone and They were led to believe that you show me- was there for some unknown reason that nobody will ever ever figure out and they and out of their way to make sure that nobody dared and eight covered it up and they kept covering it up and when Joe Henry Farm confess that kept covering it up. They just didn't count on me coming along, I'm afraid. Now. What is the? What does the horrible truth about Christine she hears things in a small community, again she's conducted herself

had a real wild life so far and in dealing with the various people. What is the horrible secret about what she hears and what does she put in the way you given the advice from her friends Christine. I she does not have a death wish. She Harry has been arrested, Harry's been sent to prison further for the cap her fitting scheme The ceiling of the tools, and so she stood up, this ring and she's going about her life and all of a sudden, Vernon and Charlie go missing this week in July of nineteen sixty six and. Then suddenly there see stories that she's hearing about how they are looking for the woman and her ring- and

and she realizes somehow she comes the conclusion that they are looking for her then the name Christine apparently does come up in some of the stories that are repeated to her that she realizes that this ring on her finger maybe more valuable than then she realizes ever ever was So she decides that her friends talk to her and she makes a decision that if these people want her, somebody's gonna have to be sacrificed or she's gonna be dead, because she has something that they want. So vague hatch, this plan that, because her mother is so ill,

that it would make more sense, but her mother should die rather than her, so they go out to the farm. Her mother's got her morphine theirs. They shoot her up with the morphine. Christina puts her ring on her mother, Louise his finger, so that they'll see the diamond. She goes through the purse. She exchanges identifications including hers, because see Christine, had lived and Massachusetts at one time.

I'm not exactly sure why or win, but there is a driver's licence that is discovered with the body that says Claremont tariffs. Now the police tell us that a ten percent though, but there is no Claremont tariffs in Henderson Bill, but there is a Claremont Terrace in Berlin Massachusetts and that's where the social security number, starting with fear of three four, was issued. That's the one that's on the death certificate So all of Christine of Identification goes with Louise Louie or Christine takes all raises identification, and when a lot gay comes out, he doesn't know the difference. He's never seen this person before he just knows you looking for further remarkably young, but

woman who has a ring on and and he's supposed together and do what We asked you to get the ring back, so Christine basically sacrifices her mother in order to to live and that's what happens. Louise was killed credible Those bearded authorities well along the way in this. This is the painstaking for you to get to this point. To get to this point of investigation, where you I doubt this incredible information about her daughter and the motive and the reason behind this entire murder Along the way, you provide all kinds of source documents to back up this and slowly but surely reveal what we just mentioned in this interview, but also that very interesting as this sub confession and the peace

better at his confession, have nothing to do with law enforcement just to corroborate some of the claims that you make in some of the statements by other people. You put this together and you have things like the W J Burgess Confession where, where he goes to his he's, a witness to these murdered or before the murders, the old tell us a little bit about Jimmie Dale J W brought here, and also what the niece heard from her from our as talking to her brother. That night, which was bird, is envy the niece

They are awakened, knock pounding actually at the door, and her mother goes to the door opens it and the mothers brother, the sneezes uncle. I standing there is covered with blood covered with blood and his her mother just goes crazies, oh my god, oh my god, and he comes in and by but at this point all the children, the three children are awake and their listening as Burgess goes into this story, telling about how the triple murders just took place and who was there and the names of people that were assisting or who got involved and help move the bodies from from this one location, because the murders did not take place at the lake. The murders have played in this area

hotel place called shovels cottages and he details to his mother. What's happened and he's scared to death because he has participated in the US and he got drawn into it and help move the bodies. And now he's gonna leave town, but it's all so, but neat rights all this down later and she gives the notebook to me actually the notebook of recasting that an I got much more that I will eventually reveal when I, what can about its essentially a confession,

I was told to as overheard now I cant use that necessarily as the main source of proving something. But what curious about it is that it corroborate what Joe Henry Poem says and was even particularly interesting is in. Purchases confession. He names a guy named gonna case, in Joe Henry poems confessions the police list Danny case as someone who is witnessing Joe Henry poems confessions, but on a case is not part of law enforcement. He's a hoodlum he's a visa is a crook he's a criminal, and yet he

two other guys? One frank, frank by forget the other guys they are. They are witnessing Joe Henry poem confessed to killing Charlie Glass and Danny case and the other guy. According to data view, Burgess were part of the crime, so I have corroboration now that tells me that the crime did indeed place, shovels cottages, but the bodies were moved that a vehicle sheriff Kirkpatricks has a vehicle from Wildwood Florida, all the stuff that I've been told by sources about this man from Wildwood Florida who, I know now works with Edward Stanton to carry out this crime everything

corroborated by various confession. So what I had initially was lots approve, but I didn't have enough to tie it altogether but when I began to get these confessions, I began to get the information that corroborated everything and prove that what had been what had happened in nineteen sixty six wasn't anything like what the police or the newspapers reported to the general public fifty four years ago, totally different crime. That's been covered up for all this time. Now you name this person, this truck driver from Florida in this book, but I

I ask you is this interview on one of the wind down: this is the volume one of this. So what are the plans for the continuance of of the story? Tell us a little bit about that sure. Well, I have to tell you that I am. I guess unfortunate, that I have basically a story that similar to a foreign birds saga or a book about like Hawaii, that Jean Michel wrote hundreds and hundreds of pages of characters and things all came together and ended all that, and so what this truck driver turned out to be, and he was actually he was

aim to me by one of my sources, but I I did not have the proof that he was involved in this, because this truck driver, his name, was Lawton Gay. He was actually much much more than a truck driver, that's just Law enforcement knew him, for he was probably one of the most horrible men that I've ever come across, He may be one of the worst criminal criminals as ever loved that nobody knows anything about. So I think I say in my book that he may be looking up at me from his home in eternal hell taking pride and

replacing him in the annals of crime, but so be it. He I think he deserves to be vilified, and I have you no resources that tell me some the crimes you don't, but I have a feeling that most of the crime that Lawton Gay ever did a good place for will never know, but he was involved with organised crime. I mean the list goes on non. So basically, what my plan is to this book focuses on two years: nineteen sixty six to sixty eight, I'm going to then focus on a period from nineteen. Eighty two, eighty six, because I received FBI files for lot, engage in some of the other crimes that he took place and which was clearly particularly all, and then go back and start building up the story from the beginning. I like a night

hundred when Louise's father goes to work at the built more estate and Asheville for Short Vanderbilt, and her being born and everything that kind of her life and then branching off into Charlie's life and Vernon shipments life and how all these characters had lives that merged in nineteen sixty six and then after that, beyond that what happened to them afterwards, because I have to tell you that Harry had were Sidney, Edwards, Stanton, Lawton, Gay, their lives were just as entry. Sting and crazy after those crime, as they were in nineteen, sixty six and its a fascinating story, I'm I'm really looking forward to em. A telling everybody more about it. Absolutely will be certain to have you back on them

The continuing story of this were true story of the nineteen. Sixty six Henderson Bill Triple martyrs. I want thank you very much for coming on and talking about this book. Then one thousand nine hundred and sixty six Hendersonville triple murders for those people that want want to take a look and purchase this book, as we talked about in the beginning, tell them how they might be able to go to this specific book because As you explained, you did initially put out another book profits not available, right now so for people to want to get this book. The true story than eighteen sixty, excited and fill triple murders, tell us about the Facebook page if they can go to to be able to take a look. At your spoke about a facebook pages. Nineteen shook with one nine six. Nineteen sixty six Henderson Bill trouble murders and the Facebook address. I guess at nineteen. Sixty six hinder should go and see for not your life

so they can go there and they can click on the link that take shape. To where you can find the book on Amazon, unfortunately handed out another bookstores, and because of our pandemic right now Maybe a little while people can also if they wish, they can email me Terry Neil at Gmail COM, are why any l, a gmail dot com? And if you Amazon. I think probably the best way to find it issues to type in my name, parents, writers and Neil, you are a and c and then right centres are. Why are a show in and last name Neil anyhow? So there are three ways, and hopefully a few cant find it. You can still contact me through the Facebook page of e mail address.

Well, thank you very much for coming on and talking about the true story. The nineteen sixty six Henderson triple murders and we look forward to the next The aim of this with anticipation, thank you very much parents. Rynason Neil. It's been a pleasure thank you very much when you have a greater say you do good