Like guy all right. Let's do this hour, you what the fuckers, what the fuck buddies, what the bottlenecks what's happening. Man. This is my podcast w. It has been since the beginning since two thousand and nine established Two thousand and nine w g up mark marin, So this is exciting today yeah. These things happen. I don't know they're going to happen, but they happened. You know outta. Nowhere in this happened pretty quick. So I get a call or get a text. I get an email. I get a dispatch from a producer brendan mcdonald. who got a dispatch from of central talent, booking and all the son, it's like you want a smoky robinson next, eager in a couple of days or tomorrow? I remember how quick it happened, but abba quick them like smokey robinson,

course. I want to talk to smokey robinson. Okey, robinson of the miracles, smokey robinson and the miracles, smoking In the former vice president of motown records okey Robinson one The greatest songwriters of all time who wrote one of my favorite all time, songs ever, if not my favorite song, that smoke robinson, the smoky robinson that just released is twenty six studio, album called gas aims. I you can. always win with the titles. You know you make choices it's called chasms, solid okey music. Today, that right now, this guy still fuckin, a hundred per cent got it. road tiers of a clown tracks of my tears, those two right there The english beat version of tears of a clown. Is one of my all time, favorite songs? I listen to it a lot. I love it. I love

sacks on it. I love the pace of it. I love that guy sings it. I just love the Speed version of tears of complaint count bound bitterly people, but by bearing down down, but a little, You did to sack wacko ban and deemed dating anyway. There's something that's wrong. Obviously I dont want to be too obvious. You know I'm a fucking comedian, but It's just the beauty of that song, the beauty of tracks, my team. three long list. of amazing smokey, robinson songs. But I would say that tiers of a clown is almost genetically part of me. At this point. I you know I never know what to expect from these cats. in his eighties, and I did and I'll tell you man, he showed up looking spiffy, fuckin sharp any. Just was so quick and ready to I can you fuckin smokey robinson, I touch

smokey robinson on the show, crazy man, in other news thee. my black eye and the whole. Facing the scraps scratches on my nose are coming along their here Ok, it's coming, on all right are used in the past when it comes to your online presence, it might feel, like you just updated your website recently, but then he realize it's been a decade in your way. Behind the times, get yourself over to square space, dotcom, swash, w e, F and start making a beautiful website as everything you need for today, We created wtf pod dot com using squarespace, but that's just one example of how you can square space work for you, because if you need to used and share videos. You can do that easily with the square space video studio or maybe you want to have subscriber content like we do. You can do that with this course based member areas find out

visiting your site now they're interacting with your content with square space analytics and take advantage of the square space email campaigns to have your site visitors sign up, so you can stay in touch with them about everything. You're doing had discourse the complex debate here for a free trial and when you are ready to launch use offer wtf to save ten percent off your first purchase of a website or domain that squarespace dot com, slash wtf, offer code wtf! So listen! I am had pretty intense few days. Man so I get an offer to being a movie. It. movie about the order, which was a white supremacist group that Tom was one of the early ones are well. It's not like historical, like the K, K k, but it was really one of the early kind domestic, terrorist organisations it up in washington

in the early eighties, eighty eighty three, eighty four a combination of different types of militia, guys but yeah This was real. You know domestic is nazi shit, they were driven wit by anti semitic, literature and the. Why, anyway,. I'm not gonna give it our history of the order, but jude laws company is doing a movie called the order, and I read the script: and he's playing the investigator who eventually broke the case in ITALY. Though, the leader of the order was, in a shoot out, but what some of you may know the order for or know what they did the crimes that they did was if they assassinated a talk. Radio show personality name. Alan burg, in nineteen. Eighty four, this is like really before talk radio was thing and he was sort of lefty talk, radio guy, just a provocative, really eric bigger

Jeanne sort of found these seeds of tea radio the play that he wrote in the island burg, murder. I dont believe playing alan burg per se. Alan Berg has very specific typist, there's not a lot of him their recorded. But I had known the story- and I remember reading about it at some point in time, but really knowing the full scope of it, so I was for the role of Alan burke and it's really Why a few scenes it's it's him on the mike theirs Some of his rats being played in the car is a somebody's nazis. Send guys had killed him. There is some footage of him in the studio. As I said in a minute diner in him dry, leaving home and then him being fascinated in driveway with a machine gun, but For this role and

I didn't see how anybody else could play there. I thought that it was destiny that israel. Even if it's a small part, it's a pivotal part. This was the veto, your crime that this group of people was young I did for an dare. And also to be honest with you having done, you talk radio and having been a comic, who talks about things? The way I talk about them, the threat or the fear of the. Of me, being yo. The victim of violence because of You know what I say and how I say it has always sort of been in my mind. Then again, I you know, look I'm a paranoid person, but when I was on the the radio it was always sort of hanging there, given the nature of our country and in I'm being a public person and I remember having the guy from some website at the time because it wasn't as nothing was, is fluid.

In terms of social media back then in two thousand and four whatever, but we had the guy who created the like a jew watch website that was a list of all the Jews in show business So my anger was: let's get him. He was a nazi. My angle is: let's get him on and try to talk him into how amazing the list is in that it shows the jews are pretty amazing. In that light, think he's framing it wrong. It backfired you have their creepy, it's all crew, b, but nonetheless, my point is: there was fear in my mind, of being there a violence for being a public, missing jus with with left the sort of political and progressive. de as an end and also having a big mouth, It was all I always felt afraid in some ways and still do to a degree. So when the offer came to play alan burg and specifically albert being slaughtered. In his driveway. I had to do it

I didn't see any way not to do it. It felt like, while this is. I wouldn't say it's it's some sort of sir. Dip it is or where you I've. Why wouldn't I'd be the guy to play that, but also its away for me to embody and without my problem biggest sphere are certainly in the top three, and also to get into the I set of what that might have been like what that might have felt like what you know, the the sort of weird quiet event of being killed by a gunman at night in your driveway out of nowhere There is no war, there's no fight, there's no expecting it, but just this very strangely horrific intimate act of getting out of your car and being shot for What you believe in your

I've way by anti government terrorist organization who identifies nazis and your jew in america, so I was up in calgary over. A weekend for a few days and weep we primarily just shot. We just did the scene where burg is assassinated for his beliefs. As a media personality in america in nineteen, eighty four. Imagine you this. Is it the kernel of it? And now it's you know, it is it has momentum in our culture So, as a legitimate point of view within the republican party, the people that killed this guy is driveway Some of the same people.

many of the groups that we're affiliated with the order still function today. Area, nations, quits clan national alliance, so important to do and might be an import movie. I dont know when I got there, too calgary day, I had to it's weird because I I grow my beard. I grow my hair and I I was able to sort of do most of his look as if fairly hairy guy. Without doing much cutting some day things coming my hair differently in taking my glasses off again We did it still shots for. Would have impressed shot of him for the balkan war, of the order in their bunker oil in their clubhouse I got there. They were doing some sort of rally, so they added a couple, a hundred of extras all different varieties of white supremacist, nazis

kind of hanging around, and that realisation that this is fictional, but this is real. This is on the street. She had now out in public shit? Now and- killed a guy because He was a jew and pushed back the driveway nineteen. Eighty four in denver colorado drove down there and get caught him in half with bullets. And back then it was like holy shit, that's fucking crazy, but if this were to happen tomorrow- and it does happen, but not to media personalities, just two people sitting in houses of worship slaughtered. By organised white supremacists. Domestic terrorist killing, use because their jews- it's happened a few times last few years.

It still kind of like, doesn't quite right. MR for some reason that this is an organised front. So all that I'm just saying that you know try to get into this guy's world added drive this Visa view beetle had walked out of a radio station now had to pull up to house and get rigged with squibs which are we're done before as an actor. And you do that thing an interesting shot, the shot, me being shot having those blood packs blow up out my back shot in the front blown out, the back, didn't a couple of takes dropped into a puddle of blood was shot in a puddle of blood, sticky. when their cigarette dangling out of my hand in the puddle of blood eyes, open. I still owe me lying in a puddle avoid as down bergen. I go back a few weeks to do the talking to do

Some of the air on the mic work that he did. I think they're going to thread some of that through the movie, but I had to do it I had to do it? I didn't see how anyone else could do it or should do it. And to step into that event, realize that that event does can and will and does happen again and again. There were just last momentum behind it, then, but now there's out of organised momentum, as very scary. Two important movie. no, further resonate in a way that originated with me or we're out. Stand up to what's happening world today. to play a guy. American guy who spoke his mind on a radio ram in denver, not even a national radio programme and was.

Mode down in his driveway nazis by demand, the terrorists by white supremacist in america, nineteen eighty four It's important to know that it's bigger it's more organised more supported now then nineteen eighty four That now you have this sympathetic, leaning, gutted poet, a party celebrating people who massacre people in the street for reasons they think are appropriate. Who kill people and subways for reasons, they think are appropriate legitimize guns all kinds in the hands of almost anybody I don't know man not great. but it was an honour to play the sky, and am I gotta go back up in a few weeks and finish it so

change gears, I enjoyed being in calgary for a couple of days and been there a long time I went there years ago to do stand up. I can get a place called the black foot in and and I get in a lot of time and I and I watched a few movies yeah either either, I always get a little anxious when I'm waiting to be in a film and on? you had a lot of time in the room and I had I found some vague in restaurants. I go to supermarkets. I really had to think about what do I do when I go to other places I wander around, I go food shopping. I work for things to eat, that's about it and I watched her, I watched I watch once on time and am in how we would again for the fourth time still amazing keeps giving, I watch he'd again beautiful and and, I did a little reading, but also like it's weird you go to some place. and, and sadly, there firefly theirs

forest fires going on. I guess in Alberta and though it the wind is blowing it into Calgary. So like I got up their nose like oh, I know what this is was I gal a couple years ago in just over and over again down here in california, just that orange smoke hanging in the air just apocalyptic vibe, but day. We shot clear and that in the weather was pretty good and there's magpies everywhere. I to identify magpie a bird. Our know how, but I knew was a mac by those magpies in rabbits everywhere there pigeons in rats in other cities. So it's prettier just rabbits jumping around downtown. free and there's magpies everywhere are pretty stunning bert, so that was the upside of going up there in an and playing Alan burg and being slaughtered wisdom. buys in the rabbits in the the pretty good at the very good day The enemy, vague and food, I had an korean d in food right, so look smokey, robinson

when you really sit down and look at the catalogue of smokey robinson as a songwriter him, a performer, its mind blowing it's a mine, blowing life and he was fully engaged and fully entertaining and just a pleasure. The talk to I? U can get his new wreck gas, wherever get your music, and this is a conversation I had with the smokey robinson. I have a residency in vegas, oh yeah does it has been going on for what years normal? Allow just started last year which hotel where it at venetian and how that wonderful The most beautiful room in LAS vegas made up lay them all here. System is I carnegie hall, your whole in las vegas and what's it with what's the work schedule, you do please friday and saturday, two shows one

when one day or night, you must be great great I love it cause you know, like I said I live there do so you gotta who the musicians are where they come from where to who to bring in. I have my own band, and I have I have eighteen people who travel with me all the time. All the time. That's amazing here sound lighting, then fingers and honest occurred on chasms because I couldn't find personnel wisting you, nobody, every sound, so good. I've talked to her. I've talked to thundercats, now talk to and its impact and they're just seems to be they, sir. They very deep respect for you, primarily for that sound from the seventies that you kind of invented, I know you're on Anderson's record right, yeah, yeah yeah. I think I'm gonna do a charity thing with him tomorrow evening, here before, Town yeah my main arrangement and in production person area with you in italy, is a guy named David garfield. Who cares musician himself? He makes workers himself here.

so he hired musicians, basically that we work of where we have got a low, bow jackson junior here for anyone Antonia yeah. You know and sounds great yeah yeah yeah. We we have guys that we work with yeah. You know for years. yeah yeah. I mean them sounds great. The title is a little you'd. I, when I the titles. They are bold and was me where there were easy going with this, and I thought when I was in. The new record is there's a little bit of your whole found there in terms of sound. Well, yeah. You know that's what I went for yeah. I went for you know, some summer wretch or sound right the wood was just like a little modern twist on it yeah. Why me? Why be some of it, though? Like beside you, I mean you could have recorded that nineteen sixty yeah I wish I had I do man inside you is a song that I've always loved. I I a young lady, it gives in Chicago? He, and I was growing up in detroit

and one year this is this lead. You live two doors down the street me her niece to detroit and she was around the same age and she was from Chicago. And the flamingos were from chicago food singing who for many years and they had a new record I'll call beside you and we were in the confectionery down on the corner from my house and a bunch of us were near. He pleaded in and lovely from that moment on, and my only regret is the fact that I wanted either to hear my version before she died, but I didn't get a chance to play it for Gaza recorded, but having completed the vocal before she died, but she was the store today. You know we're together, so so in, and there was one of my favorite songs so that this is the is vitally needed on the record. Absolutely that's a long time coming here, a long time coming it's you know I learned about you and a wreath of because did you see the movie respect? Yes, I mean it

Oh okay, I'm wiser all right we're very good yeah. I played Jerry Wexler and I was almost in yeah. Why would they they want you to play with the no? No? No, no, no, my character. yet a moment. There was a moment where you may just m o dear in the last conversation that I am with the red men. Ironically yeah, we would walking. As you call me, she said baby, she said who do you to play you in my movie, I don't care be by means of the Jews and means of deal. there was a less conversation. Where we talk about that. You know, rather than in the movie. I had what that much time my girl get whatever you're in a movie. And I just I was gonna with my relationship with Aretha, how it was all of our lives, and we have noticed since I was eight years old. You know grew up together and all that I thought it was kind of slight

We I don't know the decisions that were made on that a yell in terms of that script in that movie. How did you feel like it? I mean it sounds like everybody was sort of around the corner back then well. mozilla man, you know I I you know. I've I've known jennifer hudson for city was on american idol, richer and I thought she did a great job, but it seems, like you know, in the neighborhood, you guys grew up in that The other was a lot of people around that one on did to do amazing work. oh yeah man a whole lot of people where I work for those are three. Three from Diana Ross. How our How well do I known Diana? She was probably one they moved into the neighborhood, Probably about eight years old- oh my god, you know I have known her since then. In the end, a wreath of how far away was that a wreath of norway. This is, I was eight years old, was right round the corner because of your know, photos down the street or run corner just by coincidence,

I guess it my hand happenstance here you know because a rethink end and her family moved in just before diana and around in here you know yeah, but rather in our group and the hood man. I grew up in ghetto and run in the middle of the ghetto vienne, though these two blocks nihilism, she called belmont and the new. ST adjacent to belmont was a streak of boss Boulevard yeah in the street. Adjacent to that was a streak of arden park here in Boston. Boulevard and park were right in the center of the hood man, but they had like these little art brick. Archway things the into the black they had grass there low islands and between the two sides of the street. Here there were the affluent people here right, intimate so readily there. Were she lived on basel move out the next block of over from me, because

they had money. He was one of the biggest breaches in the country I media, and so they, when they move, dna, moved they moved over more mobile and we Are we go to the house? I know the first I've went, there was one I met a rhythm and like those eight years, all we're what I'm one of my friends a guy named richard, cecil. one who was all long after we met her brother, her brother, yeah, yeah and, and we wanted to go see where they just moved into right? Then we go round there and they got all these. It is because stuff in the house and to me- and I hear a voicemail or somebody's playing a piano and I hit voice, singing amazing, grace and I mean singing, I don't mean just like a good singing. I mean singing and playing there, and so I go and I look in this little room and where the piano is, and that's rita She says she's. Oh, she said in a the piano damn near like she played when she was grow

and them they're like air singing amazing grace, and so that that's that's when I first met her We were lifelong friends and answer it sort of studying, and then no one of the guys in the in the group that I sang with their miracles here peter before I've read downstream from him. It matters, because the boulevard attempts live right over there. You know why yeah I was, it was color platter with people who were blessing of the be successful in his business, Well, I mean it's also ensure I mean I imagine that we. When did you start outside of? church or outside a hearing a wreath I mean when I always imagine that there is a lot of music going on oh yeah, that was all see there were fears groups in our neighbourhood right here in any way to sing who have we

there were some girls right, you really. What were they start would do up oh yeah, without when it was yet street corner at the recreation sooner at school right around the playground, you in school programme in and exit the house party here, wherever we can try to girl what a guy's again you're the best grew back in those days with the four tat they were called for aims, but come into best. You will going get a second place yeah yeah it now because I have two before before. More time before you know a gordy started the figure out a way to do that. competitive was I mean in terms of

just in the in the neighborhood around the singing group. So it was very competitive. We just like. I said we battle each other all the time and we would be a thing liking. The thing yeah you know, even if we just met on the street corner, it will be a thing. Yes indeed, and you met the miracles when how old were you when you met those guys well ron and pete? I met ron first met ron when I was about ten years old, a paperboy on my street, and he liked one of my nieces, my orders, is to raise me and because my mom passed when I was ten and my oldest sister come back in the house with her kids and she raiders. So what about your old man? My my so allow me early lived upstairs year which got to family flat at new. But anyway yeah so I was about eleven years old. When I met ron. Who was one of the guys because he had a paper and he'd like one of my nieces, he start comes out and we started talking about singing we did and then pete run introduced me to pete, and so I met pete when I was about twelve.

And then one of the guys who bob Bob and I were born on the exact same day in the exact same hospital in Detroit. I met him were fourteen. He starting with the group and then glottis brother lot. It was a girl in the group will gradually maya my first wife yeah and she was in the group and she got in the group because her brother was single with us throughout junior high and high school, and then we graduate from high school. He went to the army. So she came in step tankers. We had an audition go to we will wait, you it was it was it all vocal. Would you have me with everyone play something none unresolved, clear away. Yeah I'll do up in the air was. It is a when did the? When did you guy Wendy Marvin come in, Marvin came in. Like I said I agree with Finally, Diana moved away or moved away family move to a place called the boost to projects.

and and after we started Motown, we have been gone for probably about a year, so okay yeah and we gonna fob you saw in dinah. Call me it's a small garden group of single word regard primates and I want to come ST louis, so he can set up a model. Okay, so I said okay, so they came and sang for me. However, they will not. Let me sign them until they gradually my school, because we already had stevie stevie travelled. He had here. tutors and moved to blue? Now? As I see it, the law is guided school exactly where we had to wait till the graduated, whatever the graduated at them overdue motown, you know, marvin and Martin can anyone from right, game. Rhodesia mother was with them. Ok, milk is now getting ready to go into view dates. and we didn't have a musician who travelled with us here and in those days man you'd run into some bass who had no idea? What you mean

it wasn t solve a right. You can just trust a man, you know man, so I asked like a barrel marvin to go out with his, and so she said here- and I would ask members mother because he was only seventeen at the time was crazy and she started. He started travelling with his and he never went back at him in and from that point on man until march, passed away where I saw dad whenever was easy, see as you smugglers the top with worry so it, but So when do you like, when do you start because it is It does your songwriting start before Motown. I guess obviously You know one man, I've been trying to re songs, all my life, leah and poetry and you're all all my life since I was four and five you so what's it? What is the first on the youth a day, you wrote that in no way you knew was a song.

well, the first one that I wrote that I thought was a song. I was six years old and my my auditorium teacher. We we did stuff another toilet in in in elementary school, like please, and I was in a junior, legal and other stuff like that. So we did a play uncle remus you no longer injured, so we did play, uncle remus remus was all black folklore guy who told the key is how the animals got to be like the, why the zebra stripes, why the pier get occurred? To all that you know so I'm playing uncle remus in his play the year. So my teacher she had written this little musical thing on the piano that she played at the begin. The plea and at the end of the plague, and while we rehearsing one day, I will join us in this game was it cannot I submerged the music. She said maybe go ahead. I wrote them and she liked them. So she, let me sing it at the beginning of the play at the end of the play,

my mom, was in order, as you will recall that I was called border or george bush or net and buy it. I get my mama, but I've been to underwrite sounds all my life man and when I at bury. I met him quite by accident. I tell everybody: was god dacres? It was a god day because today, you Wilson was my number one singing idle. As a kid me, a was Detroit and I had all objectives as regards here- not only would Jackie Wilson's workers would wreckers that, even if I buy some issues today here I don't know who wrote it sure enough. Was interested in that year. I had all Jackie's workers, our sovereign written by berry, gordy they're? They got here so The data we want would audition for genuine as managers day does that we would never make it because those above the platters at that time and they had a girl, ass Zola, don't solitude was in the room she saying with the group and then

when he was a leading. Are you saying hi, and so there was the makeup of our group here, so they said, you'd never meet because we got the platters. We don't need another plateau soon. So I'm sorry you just happens there rather than singing songs of occurrences popular by other areas. We five thousand I ridden because we thought that if we did, that then do it I'll get it he's, got the material doubly sign up here now That is what I said was a god damn. It is very gaudy. Was there that day, just you new songs, Jackie Wilson, he looked so young? I thought he was way nor dish and we're ok. So after the audition was open in a new they very came out afterwards im wondering where we got the songs from because he liked to myself hussein five songs he'd like to make you which one you remember. One of them turned out to be the flipside of our very first recording a song called my mom and aunt told me yeah, and the other was a song. I cried out to be. The flip side of our second recording but anyway he like those two songs.

He came out new struck of accomplishing wonder why hasn't morsels, absolutely not hundreds of them really amateurs twenty of them to bury their daily. Never said. nah? I'm tired, I gotta gold, he just listen. Equity me said many say your great reimer here, but back in those days, babe I would have four in one song, because the first verse nothing to do with the second verse how those are rammed up to eight sure, but he pointed out he started to mentor me on song. Writing that day, tell me the cylinder radio, any citizen was gonna, be assured book or short movie, or something that has authority millet, yeah yeah that died together. Ceylon yeah I've been trying to write all my life and that's what started that relationship? That's what started our relationship storytelling! That's it huh, because I think about it all the time, because I you know, I'm I'm more of a melody guy. So I got you know it takes. I gotta take another step, especially

in new or music. I mean your music in the oldest of me. I hear you talk you singing rang and hear the words, but a lot of time get caught up on a risk and if the music- and I got to go back and listen to the word. So I've been thinking about songwriting a lot, but that really is the key to it. It's a story: huh yeah man see, because when I write I'm going to write something that if I had written it fifty years before then yeah, it would have meant something to people he's going to mean something. Currently in fifty years from now he's got when we were here. We can tell a story that is relevant. Why I mean you know I from for me. I think europe like at least where the greatest songs ever I love you. I mean tiers of a clown as it is by far programme. My favorite son Thank you. I mean, I listened to your version and I am really I like english beef version too. Version of IE heard that one,

probably yeah. I've heard a lot of covers on that song, but it's it's it's more of a it's got a more a it's a different thing, but your version is just I love the words right now. You know I'm a comedian, so I can it speaks to me somehow. Well I have to I see any wonderful, that's all you do! Oh yeah, yeah when you we were having our christmas party. We had all the time in annually and motown, in all the others came to the party here, Marianna wrote it in here he comes in he's, got his tape. He's a man I gotta debut have attracted I've got, but I can't think of a song. So let us go forward. So I did and the first thing I was my palm, but are not don't don't don't die which is reading brothers, barnum and bailey saying so. I said I'm going to write some about a circus and when I was a kid when I was in elementary school one of my teachers, I I don't even remember who told us the story. yeah g, to this moment, what I'm doing this interview. I have no idea far. Yet it was real or just mythical here, but

colleagues, you was a great italian clown and people came to the circus to see em used the main focus that when they came to an end on the table were followed because secondary their party archie and he cheered him any loved him and so on software, and then the voters gesture and you cry because he didn't That kind of admiration from a woman so was very sad there by himself so to the clouds, the personalized yeah, that's that for an end and stages had the riff. He said the check it already that track this on the record, the one who gave me really so he had the whole saw. It already had all drag and it has to do with it- no yeah, he just didn't. Have it that's the way his brain worked? He just didn't have a song for it. So was he like? Is that with is that way. Stevie thought most

at the time I mean, like I dunno how many of those early songs he wrote, but I think he wrote a lot of his own songs right to see. The wonder is one of the most prolific musical people to ever live sure His music covers everything from gospel. two blue d, J asia to whatever you know he is so talented. Yeah so prolific, so yeah so you just thinks in terms of music yeah and what about the other work, like your tracks of my tears, a sort of another sad song from a similar disposition from similar digitization yet actual tears. I think my my guitars, we talked about earlier marv toppling yet because he came over the musical who, let us also media became popular. You know he was my right hand, writing pardner, eaves of greatest whenever the head, yet so anyway, it'd give me that that referred. He put his guitar riff on a tape and give them to me and he'd. Give me the referral tracks of my tears and I kept

this into a blot on the sofa I came up with the three reward for the course yeah, a good look, my face, your smile looks out of place in the closest seated trace. I love that could rhyme scheme is Did you gone enough here No, you did. I want to twenty As mayor one morning, ironically enough I'm looking at the and I'm shaven and the thought just came to me What, if somebody a cry so much into the dews left tracks in his face tat? Was it so? interactive ideas. I was able to finish this all within your shaven, so how, they come together? How does can't even imagine the energy and excited in just a daily insanity of motown. Add to begin Will you evidently you can't you described it perfectly

I mean to be in that energy are a bunch of kids, absolutely must be like. How does that get started? How to bear get started through very gaudy me. I tell people that all the time, because I am a farmer really a firm believer that every city. Town, low country, town every little village, wherever it is mere ratio, wise probably the same among the challenge that we enjoy ratio wise, but to differ. In detroit was we had very good. a guy with a high school education occasion, We cannot simply lana car factory and boxing and he said that he wanted to write muse and he wanted to make his music company, like assembly line at an auto plan. You come in just raw towel, like you said, the frame of Gaza come in and by the term. Get it in their land. They were car yeah. He wanted you to them

talent. So that was his idea. It was his idea. Come front door. Nobody knows you and you raw got a backdoor star how there was what he will know and he had the assembly. People had the writers, the musicians yeah, they get, it started becoming forces or five of us. There are men who those five people died in the very first day about down. There was very who is starting the company here there was his dear wife, a lady name, re norma there was a lady named Janey bradford, whose warmer mainstay she's still alive there at the company. Brian harlan of holland, those yolland here and me we're here so that finally voted and he's very set us said you guys. Body thousand my family to stumble, recognize me again we are not just gonna make black music we don't make music for everybody becoming This is where the world we're going. Music will some great beach at some great stories, and we always

want go out. Quality control, our music to make sure that Had those ingredients and that's what we set out to do Think we did you did it so at that time, when he says we're not going to just make black music. What was the black music of the time that he was up against the time? Was this you know to play it on the black stations. You had people, you know they were playing, while all the groups like the moon, glows, irs manager and the drifters, and also you know they all that and- and you know the bravery of like d- career ill will jude in europe. But that's domino. You just adds a low, rigid, invest our did cross over eventually, but you know that there are a lot of bans. It didn't. Are you absolutely in the end, the trick was the the structure of the pop song trick were To give them music yeah was to give the music that they could understand they gave Do you know Dr Martin. The king came to down.

eventually any aim. In the day came. He said I walked record my. I have a dream speech on Motown, we very flattered. He was why our case I wonder how would you guys recalled me because you're, doing with music what I'm trying to do politically What I'm trying to have laws passed about? He said doing it automatically with music you bringing people together and people love, because we were there, we did well places in Detroit mare when I grew up and where we started Motown. If you are black and you are in one of those areas, you better have some on you that says I will from his source or those of you in this area for some reason, if not of the police how'd you do they will go, neither will be whereas of arrest you Or harass you or something for being in those areas? Ok, we motor. But a year later we didn't written letters which would be. Did you

and he put a price on of let us now days if we had thought to keep them but which young people wish Donna will make him busy with doula, so we get to LA as we read the oldest is great and we put them on the sides. We don't even know what happened to them. You know but anyway will get letters from the white gives in those areas. Ok, we got your music, appear, so now we have it because if they did, they might make a stored away, but we love your music okay, so beginner a year so that we can learn. The parents in those years he was Well, the kids, listen to your music, so to see why so we heard it will of your music Thank you for making music that our kids could listen to. Those less would be invaluable man a wheel breaking down barriers we go to the south, that people want sat in a row. Why? One other sad or our urgent baby will stand wipe downstairs, and vice versa is when you do and show you never too

de twice nowhere look at each other already. You know we go back a year. So later this way was a black girlfriends and black boys are yeah, and they are dancing again and you haven't a good because we them a common love? We given them music, that he law tempted go to, russia, we have a coal or russia. You'll have to get out, stop the goal, but the people wanted to see them so We don't go to russia. They go to russia to come back to the smoke. guns. Real baby said we felt it everyone, but the people, love the music he and they knew it is so those early tours and we will be there hits automotive the very first. It was pretty the supposed man marvel at the moment. Is that started the ball rolling the avenue and in we signed a guy named, bear strong and he had hit

money. That's what I want the best thing that I gave you yet how do the birth, but first million cellarway shop around and shop around, was actually a song that I wrote for bear it because he had to say money? That's what I want. So you guys are all working together like going to deliver the goods slowly, absolutely out of the blue of its beauty was if we weren't stiff competition with each other but we also their health for each other. Everything going much further measures would be better. Whoever did it you know, so I wrote this offer. for buried and then- and I wouldn't I sang to bury. I said I got a strategy of a bear. Chaperone Thirty minutes to write me one. More than us Jim is enormous. I want you to think this'll us enormously, admin money, that's one little shop around! No! No! No! I want you. I love your voice and I want you to say yeah nah man. We went to family now yeah, but he finally say: hey man just go in the studio, cortisone you, you know, miracles gotta love your voice on it. I did. There she was abusing singer

So, as I wrote, Chaparral Just because you become a young man, ruby atlanta, our brown blow now? All I knew you had. I recorded like that threat comes out is not for at least weeks on the radio one morning the clock in the morning my phone rings. I pick up the phone smiled. Here is my very ass. A young man, I recognise your voice here he said- was how many men, as it was happening, said it locked in the I'm sleep was annulled. You he said app around won't. Let me sleep, I see what you mean: Did you give it a wrong treatment? He somewhat the sound and which is the beat, change a feeling of it gonna number one possibility It has been already over two women either he's an ogre is not as good it can be, and is a good song yeah, I'm going to fix it up here I said: okay, yeah I'll, see you tomorrow, he's not gonna. Let me right now because it appears

the clock in the morning he said: I'm ok, I've, gotta musicians. You get your group, how welcome this. Do you right now, while this is my my we gotta, do you clock in the morning. We ll go chaperone with his idea anyone know more first, the and seller and motor, so you took they took them. one that was out out rotation. Yes and you did a new one. In what way primary difference. The everything out every day with the rome endeavours not only different record altogether, so we just had a vision. Yes and that's the way he was yes, that's crazy. So like you know. You say when you were a kid, you go further with the rank ones asking you hear her singing in the other room. It seems to me like or obviously she's a wreath of franklin burmese to me at my town that happen every other day, well because people We're coming right, he's from all over the world here comes. To try to audition for motor at amaze here

and when you met Marvin Gaye did you were Was that, like I mean, did you feel that that guy was a special talent? Oh I knew he knew he was you know, modern came or does a guy named harvey fuqua yeah have, where was the founder and the leader of one of the biggest groups, who did I grew of listening to the kid via the moon, glows yeah. Ok, saw marvin lived in Washington DC and the moon rose and one of the members or iquitos like deadened, harvey hired marvin to take his place, and then the christmas party, once again he automotive, evocative christopher audio down, so they happen in the in the studio in the main studio down there in snake pit. They call your enemies too, his a piano down there, that we recorded with yeah and Marvin just went over to the piano these people. If we having a christmas party yeah and he's one of the pianist, sat down and started playing and singing This was all she has no

does it cost, getting around him. He could sing his as off yeah, okay, so so I was interested in him. You know then, how we introduce me to him in he heard the when it was. My first came to more down. He wanted. He said he was gonna, be the black frank sinatra: one thing standards. His first album was an almost standard interest. You know his first single ladys was MR san man. Ok, Oh yeah mister sandman yeah because, as I want to say here, but then we could see the soul the weird guy named mickey Stevenson yeah, who was our first and our director there yeah and mickey to my resent me. If you want to make a hit, you said we, you have to change are you doing here? Yes, they got to get and wrote the song stomach. Gonna fella

oh yeah, yes, yeah and then it was a hit but got mine, so modern started to become Marvin Gaye at that point, oh wow, and then I guess so, when you guys Wendy Our turin did you guys do the caravan thing in the world it's a bunch of groups on a yacht. Well, not necessarily the most. We caravan in cars, man, okay, mostly of the back in those days, man when you had to yeah he'd, be a line of cars and vantage it behind each other. Nobody really could afford a bus right. You know, but but yeah started doing in nineteen, the milk. renewing and nineteen. Fifty eight twa on your honor was a few pete. A few groups were we did the the first thing we did was a thing in implementing michigan with be became, and we did. and then we had a we recorded. This is

motel was just starting up. We we're just starting a. We were local sullivan, record that we put out would wake up, in very would put it with some international. Company for international distribution area, so we were at this time we had a regular on chess record scarred a bad girl this joint, very good sir. That sort of us a travelling, the first rudy professional show we ever did what was the benefit of him for taking off his way. One point on chests. Because we didn't have, we didn't have distribution and she has had that at the dhs at it. Yeah we didn't care. We were just in detroit flint and ann arbor, no shit, yeah, and she s authority establishing lose gallia oil with it very there, yet ETA jane right o we boost right, yeah, yeah, and so anyway, so that started us to travelling jailing in the first place, go to new york.

We were on the reach, our show at the apollo data and so jose soon, they are buying and we were terrible use the sheriff or the trouble. You know too nervous yeah and to the point where you know I thought the guy with the hook was going to come and take us off the stage at any moment. Yeah for richardson and because we went home and got ourselves together, because we knew that if we want to be professional things we want better than we were, who would yeah we aim, was it just nerves or was it just a matter of fact? Well, man, you know when you, when you, when you're interested in being in show business yeah when you're going in and you hear about the the eight oh sure in your way out the audiences are super good. Well, yeah, and they take people off the stage with hooks. And yours are newly yeah. No, you imagine going there as a kid eighteen years old having to face that crazy, yeah yeah, so its europa, the people ideas interesting, like you know you did

my guy re for Mary wells and then my girl, river temptation is now when How far is that that process work it s, something you zuyder bury decided or you working women. No, no, no, no! No one decides what one of the beauties of motorways. You were reduce or writer at motel, and you had a song that you thought fit. Any art is there if you want that out is ensured and that song and he liked it you. two recorded on them. Ok getting very saying. There was not a dictator visa, he wasn't it. He he run a company and he said he never worked like that was what was so made us so successful rear in august. Bear was still do your. Do. Try to get some wreckers out random people. Three had money morning, meetings in his office, started. Ninety am sharp, yet only

people in those meetings were the creative people. The writers and producers know sales. People know nobody else, just the right, and producers what we did was this week. I caught something supreme and I want to it's at a meeting next week. I bring it in and everybody listens to it and they say: okay, man does not a hit like that. You should do so and so and so on soviet inside and bring it back next week and maybe it'll be a hit. Our interests guess how we did the article at various points on their music just wasn't coping with ours. Yet you know right. He just you know he does it all so so he was never dictator said he would. This has got to come out and all that stuff, as also saw that was one of the reasons we were so successful. Man that requires a lack of vigo and appreciation of collaborative spirit. He a year that the network may motels oh papa, if one started modem it if he didn't know some about what he heard. Somebody who did

Let them do that yeah yeah yeah, so yet so now from the beginning, now we're? U? How did the was their partnership? We were partner, company from the beginning. I was part of eventually will not in the beginning, not anyway guinea Hugo airbus's eight hundred hours, it was easier. It's always been his company, but eventually I had to share it. How did it change? Why did it change in from Campbell and the motown hamlet of Motown? Well, the first or there we ever release record on Lee. I will just local. I miss artists ended up being on united out of new york, because york record broke out. So big locally was a guy, My johnson, more jobs and had written a song. He in Beirut, Zaga come to me here and recorded. That's all. at the time Debbie Reynolds had a number one record in the world. A song called tammy's in love, yeah, so Barry rather than putting it on the mortality which is apparently will

He wanted to label to sound like something popular, so rather and tell me how the tim la yeah, and so that's our town, la labour, came out before okay, so that was just a basically a subsidiary of mocap mosley was the company, was a company, so tamra was a available that was meant to sound a little more poppy. it's a little more familiar in and then and then that just that gets swallowed up by motown. Eventually, nah never got swallowed. It just stayed it's here for a while, it stated all while we had the company yeah yeah. It was that there was always time it was always town or what what? What? How did you decide? What to be a motown want to be on time? Why would you let the sales department deserve it really if we had a hard work it out on mulch all the time just put it on Tele yeah, it was damaged below soul. That is wrong. When did the wended motown get the distribution necessary not to have to go to other labels.

Of robbery. Every job around came out. Oh yes, he read with bashed him in the face: three times in a row? We always oppose man. Money does want to warn you gotta shop around here. Then you go back in those days, especially if you were black yeah did choose one. You pay you at all right. You anything you anyway because to see what you're going to do. If you have another rugged in my pay for first one, you know we bombarded him began forward it because when you network a common area and wait, wait, wait now in europe best friends, with a wreath of through all this right. Yes and she's, not on motor, know her father one letter wheel motor and was that did you guys have conversations about a young written? I don't want to hear father would let her be more dark, as we were fledgling And he wanted to be with somebody that was popular with international distribution, understood it. She was a great singer yeah, you know, so she went over to columbia and she sang standards of and then work for your lindbergh yeah, she's, saying standards but ridiculous

in the phone book and have been a hit. You know what I'm saying: yeah but she's, saying standards, and then that didn't work so finally is armored. Oregon soon got, go: do atlantic atlantic in we the rank of right and then wax organ movie, jerry yeah. You know that not knowing no embryo ear? So When do you become like you, sir? You move up, araby move up, but you become a partner motown right, yeah, and then you you, you actually were vice president for one of my first four year overruns laws we added after nineteen sixty three year I became a vice president. Nineteen sixty three and others were by until we saw a lotta, so why and with how does it shift? You know you being so alone, even the miracles, and then you know you, you know stepan away from motown. How does that? I guess it's two different times, but what was decision around doing solo no one man. like us here, I've been vice president, since nineteen sixty three year I would

and from the miracles in nineteen seventy two yeah. Ok, while I was at home, I touched. I had two two jobs. Actually I was very I got a sound from that we're of doing there. in producing for other people, not just a miracle to me. I was making money from there. The other guys in the group were not. I tried in court because I was tired and I tried to encourage them. To write some songs. I put the names on sizes, though they would have some other income you know to to to to like when I was at home. When I was at home, I was working in because I had a job because I was bipolar motor yeah. You know so I was always working so and and and and like I said that that was my first wife. she was a girl in a group, and why

he's traveller role, which road going back an average of thirty one nighters stuff? You know the area, and and so we will have some kids eventually we're seven miscarriages? Oh my god. hoping on rule terrible final, my eldest son was born. Here and. two years later my daughter was more so I don't want to be with my kids, like that. I want to see them. I wanted to be on the road or more yeah I wanted. I wanted to see them. Take their first steps here say their first words and all that you know right. So I told the guys in the group I said I'm going to retire. They laughed at me you can't even get us is. Workers will resonate much. I loved it. Yeah! Sorry, oh yeah, my right ok go go. We will see you later so then. I was really crucial area and here which is of a clown Joseph o, connor, nineteen sixty seven. It was on an album of the miracles and me ah and

in nineteen seventy one, was getting ready to retire. a young lady who worked for more down in england headed record. That album playing in the office on a record player and tears of a clown on. So she goes markers, A guy named peter, was running out offers other than england at the time he copied scipio. This is a hit we should put his out over you Peter agreed put it out over the years. The first number one week we ever had in the uk start spread out all over europe? You know We had another record ready to go here in the united states at your prayers he's another. Now we were not dismal clown here here to this date, grounds, the biggest single record I've been attached to now. Can you guess what because all over the world, so there he's. Gonna save in also

if you're, you definitely now retired now so now agreed with him. Like I said they were my brothers. I want them to have as much stockpile should they got bosnia, so for another year and by doing at your items, you guys were devised somebody. So the audition guys from all of the country they. Finally, came up with is getting bill griffin from baltimore and build. Travel with us for about six months before I retire, to watch the show every night and so and so forth and then I retired, with the intention of never being stage again. That was Thankee. Seventy two! Yes! Well! never being or state again. That was my thing. A bill state Wasn't I had done everything a goofy. Do we had done it three or four times we were all over the world with a I'm done we have to hear? I am done. I will never be on stage again. Ok, so started, is very moved more down. At los angeles, I started going offers every day and doing all that when I was

detroit. My office was designed to inject new talent, when I moved out to LOS angeles where she okay may see my best friend and will make you to financial office. So I was signing jackson getting and all that you know at first it was great max. I am doesnt corporates november that would go up corporate meetings with evil. I travel go to new york ever covered. Maybe I was oh, madam vice of do my by federal, go about doing yeah yeah, I was climbing the wars, But will you write song? I was writing songs, yoga! You didn't leave! You know I was climbing the walls mckay. I guess. Miss being or stage being in showbiz and the mercosur you're going on a big loser, and I Why would without want a little clubs? in the evening I left our budget to see somebody stage where our supper. inside

but I didn t come away until burying your anybody can I wanted. I think I was given up I feel that being the vice president, that it was allowed to tell anybody I was just miserable is that you know like to check my tears to what I'm saying, I'm living that Finally, one day there came to my office a man. Is that what you do it favours? It worries once you get a ban megawatt and get of here I say what yeah he's a yeah because you miserable and when I say you miserable makes me miserable, I don't want to be miserable, so I need you to get away from me, so I did I got a bad ones to have recorded a glass door mellow that was my debut back into showbiz. That's all and when you were goin out like when your miss born you gonna out to used workin. We again sort of. I guess you re a motown still bit. the music. It changed a little bit right. Yeah change, change, yeah! Well, you see in guys at that time we like damn. I gotta get back in

Well, I know one thing: a demo got to get back into it cause. I didn't think it was going to be possible for me to get back into right. So Think a date on two, because You know that record Is it a boy I mean I don't know when it's shifted did shift with Marvin Gaye in the seventies is at what changed the nature of of rmb, the sound of it I don't know that achieved shifted with him necessarily, but I noted What's going on This moment still my favorite out about all here, with him when he was riding it. Maybe you know He told me that small god is right. miss adam. He said the causes baby, I'm sinew beyond what god is rightness, will you listen to it? I can bring because of prophecy. What he rode on. That elm is more pointed today than it was when the album came up here prophecy

so anyway you're so I Did he just chains No, you change berries, my own music, because mama was our successful right at at an motown you here and there was totally against him doing. It's going on. Why? Because he thought The protests reckon it wasn't thin marvin's image and marvel. Don't lose bands coming out with something like that for modern. You know, like I said his first record was stubborn kind of fellow knows who he was stubborn Martha now. Many said the emperor is: are we about veal for just that for an ending up. It's it's, it is. it and was his only in very bo made a bit yeah and bear lost big time big make them, because it feels like you that lead that change com you're. In a way do I it did he s prophecy yeah ended it How did it make you think about your music where

well, I did want to do a concept album. That's why my first question realm was a concept album right and it was hooked together through the wind and and and and and and yeah you know, yeah. So but yeah and I had no idea- was going to become what it has become common radio format and all that you know I wasn't thinking like that. I just thought: ok, I'm like an issue which is more than a quiet singer, but I'm going to it by storm yeah and yes, ooh, that's a great idea or well that's cool! That's interesting! Because what is going on and comes out in nineteen, seventy one and you were you were talking to him through the whole process and the end. There was something personal and inquired about that record in a way and it had a lot of textures and it was a constant load. Yet it just flow so that you know so that planted a seed. I bet a little bit right: yep, and so how was? I can you guys? pretty good friends, your marlon, yeah, really good friends yeah and when did you start kind of common unhinged,

after finding out his relationship with his dad here he probably still I didn't know that you left your mother was dead. Would you mind me What did relationship with his dad was like we never talk to They are really how it felt like that. If we had talked about. I've might helped him here Did you hear he started to unravel as a child. This is dad was a whole. Another gonna dude stare was really deep unease ownership, yes, so so so it then it just kind of blew up way. Yes, obviously by, but the quiet storm record? This is the record that allow these young guy site as the begin, of their sort of awareness about almost new kind of music I'll. Take it that sort of defined. You know your approach to up till now. Here

and the primary difference was. It was a concept record, but there's something they call this the smooth approach we ve always been. I guess I don't know I know that she would you say you were smooth when you were younger. I I don't know what to do. You know define myself as your, but I always thought that I guess I thought that I would never allow a singer like that's why I came with the wide thing. Quite so have them We acquired storm at year. End then, that the end, then you sort of you you just got back into release in the cellar records. Yes, and when do you hit the wall. which was it like. When did your wife spiral out of control, it started to spiral out of control. In about nineteen eighty. At the end of nineteen eighty one at the end of nineteen eighty one and was out of control

tell me of nineteen. Eighty six, oh yeah, ok yessir. Now what happened with me was. I have never been a drinker, yeah and weed. Is and always was my drug of choice, yeah here so I have always been like just for the lack of a better term athletic yeah cause. I always play sports and run marathons. All that kind of stuff like that, so with we'd always had that control of it. added I can have the greatest weedon will not smoke it for a year. Yeah, just you know just cause I I had to and because I was always running and doing different stuff like that yeah So one year I was one of my friends. I will not call his name the popular man and he has some coquet yeah. Now, where I grew up, I had seen every danger.

cain: hill, jockeys prostitutes, blah blah all in my neighborhood, some in my house, shirking you don't so yeah. So but anyway, I never bother with cocaine skokie, he puts it in one of my joints. Ah, ok here, I spoke at I liked it sure beginning of the downfall, sure, ok, so I get it was. I was loving that so much I was doing it all the time you went down. Two hundred twenty two pounds: yes, skeleton you know just use your mind to know. I never lost my mind. Would I guess if it did, if I've known all that, like yeah, but anyway I was just and all the physical things that will happen to me and happening to my body area, and I was Killing anybody because I was afraid I was afraid to even go to the doctor, because I knew he was going to say. Oh man, if you just come last week, I could have saved you, but it's too late. Yeah but anyway another microbes friends, came and got me

one sunday night man, and he had heard about it because it wasn't publicized cause. I was very hermit with but myself. At the same time, Marvin was spiraling to write yeah yeah but you're in different places. Yeah we were in different places, but but I didn't really start of spiral spiral until he got killed. You know Yeah, I didn't really you know, because he and I used to do it together, sometimes sure, but I never snorted cocaine or did the pipe or dd. Three basing it I never did that I just did we never really, that's all you. They were just put it on cigarette smoking area. but anyway, yes but anyway I didn't spiral out of control till he was dead. Do you know what it is and anyway, and what you friend said certainly helped. You someone can help. You kay when he said man. He said you know what, is this a copy of my family, new and very new. They all try to help me, though some are pray for you

so pray over me and he took me to appear The next night, with a minute call me up to the platform I never you're, my livelihood never seen merely she she whispered, My ear she says. I don't know you when I know you. she's in most of these people, probably don't even recognize you in his church cause? You look really bad idea, man, I let the horrible Two, but a year ago I was my prayer, closet, praying name came out of my mouth. Smokey ramsden. She said now. I said lord out, dunno smoke erupted under the miserable Nor the to me will you prevail If you don't. he's gonna die and have a strong smoking. Okay, hey you out his work out you up at night. I know about.

Startled me all stopped observed with physically, in that I hadn't or anybody on oath I'd, never said it to any one on oath. She told me thing, every symptom, everything about my stomach. think about the shortest of. Of course she told me all that bring in my ear did she passes out she raised up. She said The lord is powerful in your spirit, you, those bridges Could you hear now so I tell everybody I was healed. I didn't go to the hospital I've been. I've never been in. Raised like that. I was healed because god sent me there that night to be healed. Does not, I wouldn't be talking to me I guess far gone I was I was I was out quite a moment. I did it for two years. I speak now, it churches and and gang meetings in schools and Allah, and what go to do. We have a man I, people in air.

Who in doing it in georgia hall. I wasn't a word then without anyone it because he just drop dead in doing it for ten years and twenty I mean I don't know how I do. I have no idea how yeah, but anyway so you're, so you know I was healed and, and I haven't had, any drugs is a meal. I d need six. Oh yeah, why I guess it s model. We know what they are net so was that too I told my family I do, but why was it anyway? What community smoke? Your diet, call the cops. Yet The area goes cause, they killed absolutely, but before that way, Did you bring your brought up in the church or no. not exactly yeah not exist,

Like say my mom passed when I was ten remember. My mom was one of the church people yeah, but my mom was also one of those women, never cuss you out in an innocence in a new york. Second, if you got down wrong yeah, you know what she would do, or three dabs a week and then like she was in the the the george choir ended, The past a meetings are what out assuredly nero son. Is you made me, go to sunday school dams, If my sisters were there to take care of me, she made me go back to church with her at night right now, man, I was terrified of church. I was Finally, I am no ray a real church koreans in algeria. Cause. I'm a little boy- and I see see in in the baptist churches and in the black churches, doses of shouting and fallen law and dancing around and falling on the floor, and they come in revived with smelling salts and other that used to scare me to death.

I was terrified, so I guess it's going up in I. When I got to the point was I didn't have to go? I didn't, I think you think, as it was in my case, so many ino arm be singers or people of your generation can a site that music as being the of where their music comes from will is too. I think that enough. You just gonna talk about the music. She I think at all all american music. This includes country western wherever it all. America, music stems from the cotton fields from black box vienna, then begin have gotten all they could do it in a tinge of those harm in saying in breyer, lord novice, so that derived into the blue and blues derived into be india pop and all you know. So I think it all stems from there yet but I was now's, not a kid who wanted you to saying in georgian ran out into the air If I get because, even though I was born of what we the blame, you definitely did by, but

I get there on the new record. You fill me up is kind of a gospel song. It will I guess go either way. Yes, there you go yeah, you you, you, you hit the nail on the head, because that's exactly what I wanted it here. Ye go either way yeah! Absolutely. When I try to leave that for all the songs. Yeah you gas These people do really well well. Why you gotta get some cause. I knew would be controversy. I knew it controversial because gossamer, because people he's a chasm. don't you it was orgasm sure yeah. Get all wisdom orgasm, you know euro the subject of one of gametes online. Was it girls, it has we they were chasm and he's eighty three, you know I have never stopped loving sex.

good. I hope it'll ever get to that point then really really yeah. I hear people, it is sixty or fifty two well well gosh one thing about sex, I'm sixty years old. Well, I dunno what happened to you, but it was well yeah. This is a pretty sexy record yeah, so I left everything open for your own interpretation and now it's. This is the first album since what since two thousand and the first album of original material that did one a while, I was with the ogre put amazon beer you really want me to do. album, so I did have one called smokey and friends, and that was fun right. Yeah yeah it was fun with friends and stuff, yeah and and and and and the christmas album. Right but now, but the original materials away waving was yawning, I've been

working man, you know, do concerts all the term right. You do. The idea, tat the new lifestyles and I've been riding a right all. The idea here is a genetic awhile yeah. I did took a while it. Why did you know, while five, usually what was it his hold me back. It wasn't just did that. The fact that I wanted to be, whereas, when I who did here only back to it. Yeah I could say. Ok, I gave it all got right here. It's a great big. Thank you for is very important because it is the first a region. The material album that I've had a long time and at my age you know important that I come with something I thought people would take too. You know sure so I had to listen to it a thousand times at work on and work on and work on it hard on your ear. Until I until I feel like okay, this is it this album yeah here and now.

I feel like it? Do you? Do you look back at your other stuff? Indeed, do you have sort of favorites? You know I d or is like what's happening now. What's happened there He is what has happening now is what's happening, yeah yeah, I I I'm not going to rachel, see people think of another, though the mistake that a lot of people make when you're making music is how do they music you know, and especially if they had something, that's a really big hit. You know they don't try to outdo that so time. Is you know a dear I just wanna does some music that I enjoyed it feels good to me. Did I think, would the attention of a people and in and then I just people would like it well, I think it's great great and is a nice in a variety of the type of music you ve always done, and then on our an honor meeting. Is my pleasure

on the ball engaged. What a great conversation chasms is new record is available wherever you get your music and if you could he's hang out for a second. Folks, I know you're busy. That's why I want to help you make the most of your day by hooking you up with factor america's number one ready to eat meal kit skip the girls. Restoring cut out the chopping, prepping and clean up as well factor has fresh ever frozen. Meals at are ready and minutes just and enjoy and then spend the time you saved on all the other things you're doing this spring, you can choose factors, die, vision, approved calorie smart meals or try their protein plus meals with thirty grams protein or more, preserving, no matter what your diet is factor is designed for you. I change What I'm meeting recently and you can do the same with factors delicious many options for a variety of lifestyles from veggie. The kido too vague and more you'll get four meals with everything you need to meet your goals head to factor meal

dot, com, slash wtf, forty and code, w t have forty that's four zero to get forty percent off your first box, that's code, w tia, forty, factor, meals, dot, com, swash, w tia forty to get. percent of your first box. Five years ago I had just moved into this house in one of the first guests I had in the new garage was Josh rolling. That's apis nine fifteen, and you can listen to it right now for free and whatever podcast app you're, using how long you been sober five years but great but I had five years and then I had three

especially what happens when fires are able to identify. Why you decide that moment that the back alia, oh yeah man? It was absolutely fully conscious decision already yeah seriously. It was like a yeah yeah. It was. It wasn't like here these guys in the rooms, though, like I don't even know what happened, but before I knew what I was in the bar. I was drinking fuck it and you're like how is that how's that possible? I knew I made an absolute conscious decision to fuck it up even more because I appreciated the destructive did he have it all yeah yeah more than I liked sobriety at that point right now, it's very different, yet it's very different. What do you think change? I don't know- and there was no major like that moment of clarity- or I I saw my grandma she was kind of she was on her apparent death bed. She didn't die until later here and I went in there

after halloween and I had been kind of harming the whole taken care. Grandma thing in a family was around and all that brother and I were going to go, see her, and this was like the tenth day or something yeah and and Then I went out and to have a nice halloween with my wife there and then that turned into all kinds of shit when you end up with del taco. You know something's wrong. You don't have time to get sober if it's late at night del taco, not even paying attention to what's around now just great now either you see this sign kind of through a brown out or a blackout and you're like what does that say so no, tom You know you're a doomed again, that's episode. Nine fifteen with josh brawling, you can get all devotee of episodes ad free with a w tee of puts subscription. So just go to.

Lincoln the episode description or go to deputy pod dot com and click on them You have plus here's some riff fidget.

the lives?

monkey and nevada getting is everywhere, hmm hmm.