A guy. I would do this. How are you what the fuckers, what the fuck bodies, what the buccaneers, what the bug? The bodes! Well, that one was out rob though, is out I want out our relax mark. Ok, I will I mark mare- and this is wmd My podcast today on the show I talked to Cindy Crawford add the supermodel that was a dominant presence. everywhere on the planet earth for a decade or so when I was younger, not so young that I was impressionable, but for those of you who are you have probably in, middleweight thirties. I think she probably holds place there somewhere near will preview best enter just barely puber sent

brain that Cindy Crawford. Will she was here with me. She has a book out. It's called thus indy crawford of becoming so memoir with a lot of picks, and I talk Zinti crawford because I could lay you wanta and gravel yeah, I would like to sit across from Cindy Crawford and doktor. So that's gonna happen. When a while, you know denials of weird thing denial is is thing. We all have something. I think many of us whether we know it or not at some sort of survival mechanism. You can't take it all in Now you can either you closed closed. The valve down, shut, lends a little bit adjust the F stoppages yoke. Hannah If you lube all that with some mild denial to whatever degree of denial you want, we all got a little bit of it, even if we think we don't it's there and you know whatever the case, but this is sort of basic. basic denial. I know I kind of got into this gas weak situation. They have you got it

this new driveway Some you know: thou spend a lot of money on it. Rain pretty heavy the other day day before yesterday ended the rain doesn't gather. Sandbags are gone, drainage is work and find coming off the roof. There's the french drain in front of the speed of garage, beautiful, But couple weeks ago I mention that there might be an issue with the driveway because for a few weeks smelling gas out in front of my house. I called the gas company and they came over and there's two fuckin problem with it. There's a week inside the pipe between the house. Work goes into the cement into my new driveway down the driveway in main, both in the street the weak somewhere in there and the guy search draw. These squares. We're gonna do a camera into my new fucking driveway to get to the pipe and I'm like what I just got. The driveway can very easily have even enjoyed it yet and there you can drill a fuckin squaring do it, so I guess we got a guy. Gaga contractor fills it in my view.

be able to match the grain of car greed, like guy, does a pretty good job like it in their work, For you know it's our line and my e, but I just got it in that way, and it was in that moment where this sort of revelation that might be helpful. I don't know my first place that my brain would go in a situation like this, of course, shit happens to me. Why me that's that's where my bring us, but then I did this more processing and I'm ok. You know it's all gas line. They didn't know, maybe that you may be sure some loose when there lay the driver news who knows whose fault it is old pipe whatever, so I shifted slowly with sir. Minor fits of anger and rage. I shifted from why may too, you know what that's life happens better, it's better! If you don't know what the fuck is going to happen. He's. Just as they read draw my driveway lose a foot. You know I mean I've. Yes,

people have all the luck sure some people never have to deal with this to some people, just stepping just your beautiful piles golden. She had every day. Some people do, above all the luck by everyone he dies and those people you they're gonna die too. This is sean for it does not it yeah, I'm not trying to be optimistic about people dying. I'm just saying that. There's there's problems everywhere and that's why I so Now, why me that's? Why we're viewing that's my life? What does work Why me, but anyways the only way. That they will have to draw in the concrete, as if, if this guy could run a new line into the line and make the corner up because it hits occur. And then goes up to the valve. That goes into my house, and I know to go to work now was gonna happen of eyes, gonna come home to a justa, mutilated, destroyed, scarred and end hold new driveway or why you know- and I

for four hours, and I get home in there's a guy out in the street. in front of my house in a four foot de pole, that's about three feet by five feet. Yeah the size of the hole he's in the hall and I'm like what's up and he goes, I did it man, I ran the cable up. We we did it we're not going to have to drill and am like holy shit. what the I'm a more lucky ones, now that's beautiful go you doing in there. He goes wow this. down here that we got upon the new Then too is from my nineteen eleven and I figure out how to and unlike wait, wait. Wait you like this This infrastructure issue a serious shit like that Is it all the volume pipes they go all over this goddamn city in almost all cities that have any fuckin history to him

are our friend and early nineteen hundreds waiting conundrum who the hell knows so idea fix all that. Here's your answer yet doubt. You wait till they break one at a time and you just do some patchwork. That's how the infrastructure gets fix. Waving, we're gonna rip everything up to make everything safe in good now just wait it out so is vital. surprise you that's the infrastructure plan for america, a there ain't broke, don't fix it never does break I hope not to many people get hurt. Yeah yeah tell that to the people there is a gas weak up in the valley, just horrendous, so is what happened. This is a surprising think, as I just said that gassing they put a beautiful new valve and it now. No, if you ever get this feeling like when you get

work done and then there's it's just it's whole new, pretty thing, and you feel better about it that there's some party that thinks you achieve something it's ridiculous, but they I I want thank the southern california gas for doing that, but that you know I I do feel some part of me thinks, like I did thing gate, but I did nothing but even with that is what happened. So my water here of the pilot, was goin out dissolved in two weeks, kept going out throughout this year's guy. Come because I don't have one as those new pretty little boxes. The just does it by magic. I have an old style wider here. Kenmore but they you know, they have like a long warranty on and whatever. So. The guy comes over to fix the pilot, and then he leaves them that smoke gas smell gas out there. It's roots in the same room and the cat litter boxes and like fucking gassy smells gas. And here's the denial comes in, you know it's went on for days and I'm like whoa. What was going on? How can I let it go on for that long, even the other gas week? What is it well, you know how

Have they say like a lot of people when they get terminally ill, it's only because they waited too long to go the doktor you know do that you're just sort of land and doesn't feel too serious, Yeah, it's gonna, wait it out in a months later, tal over your body come in when he first, I thought it was just nothin. denial and away so I think that part me, like that's ridiculous thing about it, as mothers gas weak in the back room I kept smelling it. I kept walking and minus it in pardon me was like now, you know, maybe it'll It was just the heal itself, somehow, maybe or maybe just you know- maybe they're, just the you know where, where there's there's a not weaken the piper. Whatever you're just scab overrun yeah. You know it can get better, could get better. Call a guy's. The machine charge, the equipment he came over,

I guess I tied nothing that you don't know about nets, why you know we have a job being allowed to know about it. So now that's gone so watch. The dial could be dangerous and allowed away. Your house generally will not he'll itself. your body will, but you know you should then wait too long for sick that the point is that what I was working towards, what our recovery emails? Okay, this is really a couple now do another thing that will do subject line interesting. I've been tempted to write several times and have only listen to about five recent shows nothing quite thought right. Even bother to write it out, identify with you or a guest, compliments, etc, nothing quite fit, because I had a feeling that was more ambiguous at the end of each show, which made the happy thought I wanted to express seem dishonest than I realized five minutes ago what it was there's, no sir, for me to compensate for its the David's,

in our view, that seal that I never knew much about him, but I always liked them. After that interview. There were things about what he said now he behaved that left me unsettled finally realise that the lack of spin made the inner action real. That word is so abused. He parentheses and gave me a new view of him as a person with normal person laws. And that is what the unsettled feeling is at the end of several you're shows you have, let me see a part of the humanity of people whom I normally would only get to see the spin version of maybe I've, let myself be conditioned to looking for this spin version. Thank you regards chris okay, well yeah. This spin is interesting word for, but yeah me some people had there's a polished sort of. motion or version of people public. I think the public persona is what you're talking about when you say Spend and appreciate that that's a nice seemed. I appreciate that.

This is another touching when these are touching. Just some guy dot dot dot mark. I know a lot of people must contact you through this medium providing impetus commentary on your podcast, this really that at all. I just you are my netflix account under a title called think he pain as my first special for netflix. I didn't know what fuck. I was in for when I open this calmly special, but I decided to just try it out. I was going to give you about ten minutes. My attention, It wasn't me being judgmental against you. I just get a bit antsy on some things, watching tv is one of those things, so I press playin. It starts ten minutes. Twenty minutes time just goes by. for that ours, so that you are doing your thing. I wasn't me for that. Our I didn't have that target

the looming. Thunderstorm white cloud called depression, raining despair upon me for that hour I totally ignored that feeling of loneliness that you can only get when your girlfriend moves four states away from you, thus causing you to end the relationship, your best friend, that has been your right hand, man for close to six to eight years, just up and weaves, and it's just you and a cold bedroom by yourself in the basement of your mom and dad's house. For that hour I saw someone who I could relate to thank you since then, I've done into the research of comedy hicks, Bruce Carlin and even sam kennison, with his dont feed. Hungary, bit Ella, well congratulate you ve converted another mind idolizing. The great keep helping other Like me, man you're doing a lot, a damn good in this world. Just by being you, so you better keep that shit up talk to you later nate, boom lives p s. I was wondering if you could provide any input for practising guitarist got native to tricks of the trade yeah. Have fun,

and and thanks for the email made me feel good. Glad that you appreciate what I do I had to help out anyway. Can man hurried this one poorer lives, subject line shrinking have any other day. I think it was a strange pavlovian, a response to years of listening to dvd, have as playing guitar my family was in the other room and upon the completion of a needle riff I'd made up by played a bt cord, and then I Fighting overwhelming urge to shout bolder lives. So thanks mark, and for instilling in me the belief that woozy rifts and not in a turn around record, but in a shout of invocation to your cat mask I'm not saying I didn't like the response it amused me. I just wasn't up for the explaining that would have to happen. Love you mark, keep it up. Ok, buddy! That's from earth this when I found to be provocative, smells and mrs hello, mark your comments over the holidays, about how intimacy ranges from the sublime the grotesque, including

smelly stuff brought to mind. What I call the rule of shit. That's in quotation marks folks all the best things in life involves shit people, shit, catch, shit, dog, yeah baby shit food grows and she had no shit, no life things that shit or don't grow and shit. Maybe no matter so much money doesn't shit the internet may be shitty, but doesn't she had tried to preach the shit near your wife. It may be the product of something good or fertilizer, grow something good thanks for the end logic comedy wisely in connecticut you're. Welcome that was not a shitty email. So in preparation to introducing the guest. subject line wholly grisly adams, tribute high mark just look at the. You photos in this week's deputy, F email. So I'm wondering a if beard normally grows super fast because he's looking between two photographs, the one of them Nea might finally, one mean Cindy crawford

your beard normally gross you profess, be if you did the first interview a while ago or see if your beard, visibly growing during this second interview. Do too Burly flood of bruce banner like hormones provoked by cindy, oh my god, Crawford in your garage, good homes, Dan! That's what happened. It was awful, now a surprise. You didn't say anything. I just saw here. My you be read and my beard started growing. She said nothing, So let's go now to my conversation. Would Cindy crawford her book becoming is memoir with picks, Cindy Crawford and me now

If so, you drove all the way in from their mouths yeah, and that was bad. It just was longer than I alright. Then I well, I gave myself an hour and a half and it took an hour and a half I like to be early and do you like on the beach? I do really how I view of their We lived full time in malaga for twelve years. Isn't like I don't want you to go. There's like you coming here. It's like. I have to have pack a bay, I can't sleeping bag, but but it's it's sort of weird in isolated out terrorism. I read, I mean yeah, it is like the town like I've been there a couple of times you go to the store and just figure all you. People know each other out there. You kind of start to know but which is now it's. It does feel like a small beach town with very wealthy people wandering around there there's that, but there is also a mean there are. There is actually there is economic divergence

there you were highly because there is like those the mobile home parks right. So that's. Why they very surprisingly, actually a lot of people there really nice, my heart, I really yeah authority and there's another. They get the tournay knows, which is rife. Torn areas may be slightly windy, no torn it, but so the others diversity down down there and it's a great place for us to raise our kids, we like it's, not it it because it is out there here, you don't come in. town where I am much right, and so even for my husband and I we think are we really I need to go to that dinner now, want to say how so it s a kind of toulouse, friends, but you Ok, it's now, you know you make more malibu friend, you're, malibu friends become really important and right. You end up spending more time with your family, which was a conscious decision that we made may kids you have to, an end date, sir, you never there and you spend a lot of time at them. That's gonna, yeah dc bob dylan

walking around there. I have seen Bob Dylan they're, not for a while. I saw him a long time ago, like one of my first times the malibu at a party at santa gallons house, and he was sitting in a chair and I was just so surreal. Its funding have like those celebrity moment. Oh yes, I don't care who you are there still like certain people that are like? Oh yeah, for you like you, like, oh my, its bob Dylan or Paul. No man or people I address you call me when I did boy, I'm we're pretty big, celebrity yourself. I imagine it goes ways I imagine met bob was happy to see you now he's in pretty much in his own world that day so nice upon you, I saw Paul newman. Add a broadway show my hand. I was like disregarding my eyes of, but then actually had the opportunity to meet him with a friend of mine who is involved in his charity, and I got to hang on

in his trailer on a movie, and that was really cool, because then you know everyone has their like public persona right and it's nice, and you know you kind of have to do that to protect yourself two when you're her, but it's nice when you get to see people like in you know at home. in their own environment, where there were, they don't have the right, the facade of its legal and also that generation. Like he's passed away and bow, he passed Where are you now it's starting to happen that that crew by me, parliament was older, but like byways crew, now we gotta watch. I mean we're almost your ear low younger than me by, but you know those were our people yeah? They are our culture. I write either it so horrible, because you know I was, and it said the day with any start to think about your own trick. I now did you ever meet bo, when you are new york, come on mine must have I not have like that moment

it's hand that I remember right. You know certain people, you remember the first time you met them. You see them like. I remember, meeting Warren Beatty. I remember meeting jack Nicholson like he remember. You know, cause if there were vehicles- and I met him with her brits. Who is a photographer that I worked with a lot, did a lot of the big picture you yes and herb. Had he was a he loved and getting people together he would have. mom gatherings like thirty people, money or no. Here His l, I guy yeah, born and raised in store out now anyway. Right has two way, probably by ten years ago. So here is at his own retired have like these crazy barbecues, and it could be like Madonna, John, can Did you hear tracy? men are just like jack, jack Nicholson or more baby would be like such an eclectic group of people in her belly. Everyone loved her Then his mother would find a hold court

and lives mafia shirley here, so it was called and dizzy. Why that is so weird that, like that expired of being at a party like that or being anywhere with that type of group of people, because I realise not longer than they We can only hang out with each other at sight. They can just you know, I mean they. They can't. Be among the regular population that easily so for them to be Notable among a group of people it has to be people like them in a way. I think there is something about like you feel like you, your guard down right because it's kind of like you know everyone is invested in what have you know like that, would have in vegas days and make the area in now its change because every I mean anywhere, you go. Everyone has a cell phone anywhere, you go, you could be being filmed at any time and again, avanti empty. I sense a swipe bit of anger and well it's just adorable. I think that's part of the reason like it's not so much that I come always like models or p

two or celebrities our people to write, but it's because of that you, like you, I would love to be able to just go. To the beach and no one and be irregular, person ripe and there's like the one eighty it with the cell phone right, that's trying to get a bad picture. I mean it's it's it's like a gimme that age, that's the worst of it right. Well, we'll get good ones by now seems like the bad ones are a more interesting mar. Probably they get more for better get. Will you a problem like a year ago that leaked photo right. It wasn't leaked and retouched. It wasn't just it wasn't a real picture lobbying, but then came up with this whole idea that no pictures real, if you think about it, because sure it's a representation Yeah, it's like saw manipulated its mediated. It's an image bits.

where the light is you know like I was saying to someone like if I'm doing selfies of myself and I take it and I go oh the lighting's terrible. But if I go like turn, for the window, the writings better, that's the one, I'm in a post here, it's the same me right, yeah area, so oh yeah, the moments where you I just realized like pictures, are not what it was Is that what happened? I don't really know. Actually it just got out in the world and no it didn't just get out in the world and no one actually knows, but I think the photographer doesn't even know I mean I'm still friendly with him. I still work with him and but he He said he didn't know, and he actually was really upset about it because it used to be when you do how to shoot right ninety nine out of the hundred pictures are probably not that great right, but I'm and then they would at those those are end up in the trial, and then they would pick the best one right. now with ditch at all like some one- and this is what I think might have happened,

is someone might have walked by the monitor cause like azure, shooting, now running up to a big man right away and taken a picture from the monitor you. Can you know, look we retouch all the time to make us look bad sure the temple or a bag under your eye or beauty of the euro. You can also photoshopped make people not lead course, and the tom over. Showed me the, though that, while corn on court, the real imagine I mean it gets. It depends what monetary awry aren't you norman? I dont even know so really, It really made me just realize the whole thing is illusion, good and bad, but wasn't he like the the wasn't a tricky in the sense that you know from what I understand, I'm certainly not trying to stir anything up, but but like that, there was sort of this championing of, you know, why would Cindy be? You know uncomfortable with this image of her without being touch up. She so amazing, sierra, women saying and then you have to be like what's intrusive, it

I didn't say anything because I didn't there. There was outpouring from women who were like you know, she's. Like us and or whatever, and I dont want to reject that at all, but it same time. It wasn't corn on court, real, more or b. I dont know what I want to get into that dialogue at an unfair. in ITALY there might have. There was certainly people who who genuinely were chow bidding me, but there were also the snark you people of the world and mark if there were an so little kind. I just I just didn't because I was like what can I do. To go on good money, america and pull my shirt up and go. That's not what I look like I didn't know, and even there depending on the lighting they couldn't. I could retouch abs. I could have a six pack. With high definition now to hide by good lighting. Yes, it's really all about lighting sure it's all about light. It is right it totally as and where was I was,

Your book- and it seems like in terms of your talking- lighting that the book is more of a it's almost like a tribute to the photographers you worked with, while others there's a big section, which is honouring those guys that were my mentors, both good and bad. I mean some some other photographers. I learned hard lessons from here but most of all I learned about modelling and other life lesson so one section of the book and it's called the image makers. Those are the guy is that really shaped me not only as a model, but you know as kind of a woman and professional a really yeah. That's because you did you you can't it wasn't your and its expectation to be a model. I didn't even know it's a real job. I mean I drew up, you know a very small town outside Chicago my arm, town, well, It was surrounded by cornfields, but there was a university there. So it's it was kind of it's a small town right it was a small town.

Your dad was what he was once when I was we work for my my grandfather. She was a missing machine. Ass, dear fanny was an electrician, then he was a glaser which we used to think that we all my sister. He worked for dungeon doughnuts facebook, he'd made glass, won't glaser. Glaser puts glass in building. Ok, ok I think that's what he tells you. He really was glazing the donuts, so he's a working guy. Yes did a lot of stuff and my mom didn't work. While we were really little and then she went to work like in a doctor's office. So you know we were definitely and you know, lower class working working class allergy, I only what one sister I have now. I had an older sister I sought here I have a younger sister and I had the young Yes, the nerve hamley was a brother who died, my nervous, we were all kids, but he was the young. As you remember you, I was ten when he died. I farmer yeah was devastate

for my whole family and only when I had my own kid. Could I understand how that much then for my parents, because you know you knew it was sad, but I ride only ten and you re using your life. Kinda right on the other. I don't know how my how my mother, when like over me. That's like I. She I always have been on issue that has been one of my heroes but after becoming a mother, my seven realizing how she just like got up the next day and made breakfast for the other three of us, because because we were arr right. She had to she had to the depths of the grief. I couldn't really wrap your brain around now. It's awful, but are they still around? My sisters are yeah. I just saw them at christmas and your folks know my map I actually have to grandmother so come. Ah, yes, one is most republican animated. She just her. Ninety seven,

and she lives indyk help. So with my aunt and then my other grandmothers. Ninety three and she lives by herself in floor does she drives? She does. I ramona. If lessening you're, very an amazing know. I went to visit her in the spring and I was like so who cleans your house. She goes. What do you mean? Who cleans my house? She goes I do, but I can only do one room a day now she breaks it up just amazing, good generic yeah, so it'll a while. Grandmother's with my parents is america's last jess and you're, and you and you have you're on good terms with everybody. I am I mean, I'm I've always yeah, I'm on great terms with everybody. Even if there was a I'm with my dad that it was more disconnected just because you know he was the one who really left my mother and I was in mid our high school. Are there not together now, and I think

you know we were man at my dad and we were very protective of my mother and I do think looking back part of my dad's kind of acting out was probably his grief over losing his son, he just reenter in a different way than my mother. Did so there was like he was, have no doing business here and other yes, the air. He knows. I ve talked about this on a radio, how sorry dad, but we worked hard to have a relationship now and we never word had no relationship. Is it like, like yelling and screaming no or like where we didn't talk for five years, but we've gotten and then we we always talk. But now I I I guess I lost respect for my dad and and then we had to come back together in a way. Where am item and my dad's great anyone who meets might have their like he's. The greatest guy of he is very true. Those guys who act out are usually very jargon is Acta.

You gotta have a little game exactly exactly, but that's good. So you know you worked it out at me. I think just my what you have living long enough in having your own life- and you know when you really don't need your parents for anything practical that you know it's really up to you to make a right exactly. exactly- and I you know I saw you I think me having my own, like you said I didn't need. Like my financial right, appendant right from my family, I have been very young and in fact I was helping you know, is it that that shift it sure which switch to the other foot at at one point where I was helping them, and but that does help you I mean look I like You want your story, book wedding in an marriage, and you do want your daddy The answer is in your mommy to always be there to give you a hug and that doesn't I

work out that way, and then you have to figure out the real live version of those relations right, yeah so worse, it is either Sometimes you get mad at like the film industry or the songs, because they paint this on realistic vision. of what life is supposed you. How like relationships, aren't supposed to be hard who were at that any relationships harm My dog is hard, sometimes you know also. I get the same thing. It's weird I mean I don't yeah. I've had bad relationships but like when an animal gets fucked up, you're like oh or just like. When they do annoying things, you can be annoyed and you can still love things and be annoyed by that. I just have to buy new carpet because of him. You have to buy a new couch by the same. Why it's interesting that you know it it might and gets a lot of a little bit of flak for for creating an illusion of of war,

people are women should be in right. I mean you dealt with that early on as well to you here, but I think that going back to earth idea, for I mean if what I came through that whole, the thing with that sure a year ago. What I came to realize is that photography is an art, yeah and all the choices the photographer makes from. How does he? Where does he put the light when does where does he put the camera? One angle: when does he click the shutter, which one does he choose to say? This is the one that represents my right. I've vision, it's an art, it's not so like. If an a painter paints, a picture of your beautiful woman, you'd uncle that's an unrealistic or irish rail rye women. Where I can't live, it's like it's their fantasy version of whatever their painting sure, and that is what photography and fashioned photographer arose as well, so it should really be taken too

early, and I think that I mean now. Everyone knows because, even like my fourteen, your daughter knows how to face tune, something for her snapchat or were you gotta? Get can't can't you then unsnapped instead, I grow home. So I dont use snapchat chapter and when my parents, like mine, now not to let me have one thing: exactly: that's instagram, all of a sudden became not cool because the moms were doing it and now my daughter's, like I'm so over instagram, and I'm like I just finally getting it. That's why I'm leaving that having a facebook and twitter seems to elude most grown ups, which is good yeah. I think the people. I know that use twitter is more for. Like news like what's happening right in the sector, I write road. I get asked from it Is it for my ego, validation, I'll get constant. Nice have constant feedback from strangers. Say is good. When I understand we say about that, and also like, I think that it seems like you

generation of of those first that wave of supermarkets for an ye. I thought you were different. then most models right. You were not emaciated, you were you looked healthy you. It was like a new all new thing here, but you know fashion. In fact the pendulum. Its owner and go from marilyn monroe between eighty and learn the idea you everything in between so like our generation, it was about being. Strong and having a real body and back only go one place which is back to a cape moss You know who was like a deer and headlights and been that's, but that's you know, Kate eats she's. Not right. Does how her body looks, and I mean for me what, where I think fashioned should be going or you know, though, how fashion is portrayed is more all encompassing pick that kate moss can be beautiful. An marilyn monroe do now like that or that its everything like it

firstly now that I have a daughter, and I see her watching. What's you know, I in in the moment she's fourteen yeah. That's when it all happens, rice, which is very much watching like gigi and kendall, jenner and cara lobby, carly class and others people, and I see how she's measuring herself against them, and that's why it's important to you. Have a broader because not everyone is five. Ten everyone is. You know some girls like now it's funny. Like my generation, it was like you didn't want to big booty, all of a sudden the cause of the you know the popularity of the card. Now, that's in style, which is great if you have a big booty, but now these girls that don't now they feel about you know it's like it just crazy. It's like

relative relative to the trend at the moment. Yet so when you were what was the plan, though, when you were a grown up in that little town, I mean why you were I mean you, good student right and you are like on the trajectory for some other yeah. I was saying I was good at school yeah I mean it's a scale school. It doesn't necessarily correlate to learning. Well, it correlates to learning they put in front of him, but I you know like I did I do see like school is like I have a good school like you gimme material, I can retain it fairly easily. I can refer to take any artists of one, though in the study yeah me I mean I didn't, have to kill myself. I did the homework, but I was a good student and then I die did feel at a certain point. I and I talk about it in my book that at there was a student teacher who, like at the end of her four month student teaching, our class she gave every like a war like that, she made up Lang most likely. Whenever wherever and she put on my feet

miss america, and it was funny because it wasn't something I ever cared about being miss america. But what was impact felt me is that she she dreamed big for me. She it was like planning the seed like while, like someone else thinks that I could maybe be miss america, I am allowed to dream big brother. I think you know kind of map, midwestern protestant meant Quality is like the sky is falling, save for a rainy day now do save Dante chances is very different than the way my husband was raised in new york, and so this was like. Oh, oh, that I can dream big so then I started thinking I wanted. I knew I wonder, do something so the biggest jobs that I could think of at the time were nuclear physicist, just bryce sounded good sure and first woman president. And then in high school, when I graduated and I got an academic scholarship into northwestern, but I had to go into engineering,

so I dislike chemical electrical. I picked chemical. Well, I'm gonna chemistry, but I didn't know what was next, but that was a way for me to go to school. Free and while I was figuring it out and then I only went for like the first half of fresh near and then my modeling career really took off, and I left like in high school. There were you, like you know, you must have been high, you We. What were you doing eyes, gui driving around give bad boy. Friends. Did you I'm not agree? high school. I haven't. I went out with the quarterback, you know why you're that girl, but it wasn't like in my school, the judges. Why were you not that? I know I was generally not the quarterback. I was a guy gonna fuck, who is girlfriend? I was a little bit like in my school, like that. I was not my in like the. If you haven't you know, in group ratio earlier. No, ok because otherwise adamant. No, no! No! I wanted them, but they are also.

its goal that were really like considered like the hottest one. Were more like the cheerleaders like the little I'm still friends, with really good friends with two of em. where to the cheerleader. Yes, and they are twins I was friends with them, but they were like the homecoming queen. They were cheerleaders and all that. But but I was friends with them, I had a great time in high school, but I also did have some alike the more like the the calculus friends. dinner, I kind of like a few other than what you there's more through both whirl yes and then I graduated and Yan and nice. I was already modelling and high school toward the end for what, and Chicago. There's a lot of catalogue, their sides, darted marshall field, sierra yeah. I couldn't I mean think about chicago. Is you can have a working career as a model there? I could have I am, and I met several women there were few years older than me that you know they were working,

every day in doing catalogue and had like a normal midwestern life here, but you, we're gonna be. Involve you weren't gonna. Do those big right? You know campaigns how soon after you started this market. Thanks to your light, just just at his school when he started now. I started so my my senior year of high school, I was, I was working pretty a lot already and what you'd go on the weekends to shoot? I would go I I did my highschool ass in the morning right and then I would drive and chicago, and I would model probably three or four afternoons a week. How long did it take before your like I'm gonna, be on vogue. like reminded me realize, like I'd serves of this is the hierarchy. This is the job of this is this is the biggest you can get here? yeah. Well, what I notice is there was this one photographer in chicago victor script, mesquite alive and I'm friendly with him now, and he was like the big fish there. If you were working with scrub nevsky in chicago, you were doing like the best jobs that will august,

ass. It was like I magnin. He actually shot este lauder too, so he shot town and country did shoot some national things more than these other guys and I was working for him every day but I noticed when he had got really good jobs. He would fly in the new york girl and that's where they were called the new york earls. Unlike the chicago girls, we get to eat lunch. We had like our own little place that we much better in new york. Girls got to eat with victor, they got to where the best clothes, nor are they a better idea of life. Eamon was married to diego asia, I'm dyin to wear Andy Macao. There was would come in. They weren't. You are Likewise, I wanna be a new york girl because they got all the debate. You know they got them, read it like royal jeer, so I didn't think about vote, but I did think a pair

I I think I want to be a new york girl, so that kind of didn't been overnight and me. My new york agency would be calling me her whitworth elite time. I wasn't ready to leave like I felt very so you are assigned with a local agency and with a lie. While I was with elite in Chicago okay, so they snapped you up pretty quick, they just want to get everybody yeah. So what Then there was a lead and forward more mean, and that was that there was a few. but those are the big players and right time awe, and so this guy viktor, you, you didn't. You know how quick Did you sort of take to the camera? I mean you. Obviously you you look the way you work, but I mean there's a whole process. now. You're learning, still learning are much better model today than I was, and am I let's say you know payday Joe, because I'm

confident. I know how to work in front of the camera. More you mean it is, there's a skill to modeling as well as just a genetic. You know sure that you won the lottery well, yeah, there's and there's different skills to there's like runway and there's other things. To do. Much of that I did yeah yeah because, like I have this weird connection to it, in that the my first wife quit modeling and she was pretty good What are you became that guy added but but she was, she went into comedy in india's show business enough and away from me so I became ash. I give you the one that scared the model away, but but what we Interesting to me, though, was that I I think she could have had a pretty good career. She was in italy with our money and doing runway stuff, and but the lifestyle just was like she couldn't, it was devastating to her. It can be, and I think one of the things that save me will my mid west

upbringing, but also I did not really start spending time in new york in europe until I was twenty already so I had and I saw It- you know- graduated high school- have that, like in my pocket money, I was now torreon, I gotta reveal that gave me a certain amount of self esteem. Salvatore smarty, as my I think I would I shared with another guy. There technically. I was co valedictorian, my baby, it's kind of David olive. I know you didn't make the story then I went to westerns, I have had experience of a freshman in college run. I lived in chicago on my own for a year and a half for I moved to new york. So by the time I moved to new york, I was I mean I thought I was thrown around twenty I'm here I was, I had had more Then, if some of the some of the other women- and I know that started modelling and they were like shipped off to milan, when there are fifteen right, I think they had Your time we re at being, you know,

look, there's a lot of their is pitfalls in any big eyes, and will you just seems like there is that it's pretty brutal on your maintaining europe. You know what you think is what you are like yeah, in the eating disorder thing was a problem and and also your drugs become a problem and in the fact that you know you're really seen as in some. It seems to me in some circles that you're you're sort of seen as playthings for rich people right well, David Fincher. I am a fan They are also, and we were talking about It- he's like your agenda. Models was the first time the meat had. hey above was, but it was so like the one I meet You know there was something it's it's like what I tell models you now, it's like look there You, like your models, fanny

Someone asked my advice. Unlike what this business will use, you you better use it back right. You need to be clear about what, for you right, because it'll take like like like anything right, so you need to be prepared to, say no and then use it back when opportunity does presented itself and not get like. I We say- and I again I say the book model- is what I do not who I am right. I think a lot of people, comes who they are and they lose their identity. Because I like what I noticed- and these are just my observations from the little experience I have is that you, you know people, jack, so much andy and jesse looks alone or whatever they want. So, if you don't have to volunteer much of anything you can just move through right, there's a weird power, but to that I imagine it could become pretty tragic because you insulated and you realize

you know what are they really reacting to, and who am I really right well and by the way, if you think it's other than the soup fishes, you're, kidding yourself, don't get jobs, does you're nice or that you show up on time or whatever you get or you're smart you're, either selling the product or the magazine or whatever it is or you're not write it. It doesn't matter, you know, like people always say by casting couches and I'm like turning to think you could sleep your way under cover of vogue like it you're either going to sell the magazine right are you're, not you, ve got. It makes sense to the one. So when they ask you back here, it's because, You saw this right because they liked you write, you saw them it is aimed for them. So they're not doing you a favor, I matter. If you send flowers or don't sunflowers, I mean it's nice to saving radio for opportunities, but its business here, you got it. You gotta know that here and you have to realise like it is. It is brutal, like you are totally being judged on how you a communist job is one of is so so like you have to be kay without an end it, I think, depending

how you were raised and depending on how young you are and what other aims esteem boosters you have in your life can be brutal, but you ve got a lot of people fall by the wayside. Imagine what it tragedies are. No, I didn't my husband always he's making. Like your son, I even you because, like I, don't do drugs, so I'm completely oblivious their people are really popular. I can't believe you can see that like why, so I will help you to I think so, because and also because I wasn't that girl people weren't offering it to me, I know was just like I guess it was going on I'll come on. No honestly, when did you get to new york in eighty I move their full time and eighty six, no, I wasn't really so, but you started going there why eighty four wheel that war, interesting as a lot of that shit. What sort of a little tapering off and a little more quiet, yes you know, I keep dancing tyrian

before. In all that shit was over yeah yeah. I never went to studio. Fifty four while I know I've, been in it as a space, but I never went there like when I was in new york. But now and lime wide an area. We also my ad we're hungry right now in this area and it raises dancing. You know I mean I honestly hetero nasty zodiac knows an area. Emma was the other one line lie. I ran them. Why wait there? I do drugs all those places in other, even dance, junior pagoda, Pegasus yeah that was fun, for sure yeah it was what was it was? There was a theme there. What was it? It's like an university yeah yeah. That was right. It wasn't too big. It was like, like a huge club where you just get lost. I just remember when I was like cause. I we are literally around the same age that when that was going on

you know, I would go at these expectations in you. Get there like she's, not a crowded room. You mean a thing when they are safe. Yet it's always on new year's eve s place is here, it is. Is it always exhaustingly when Noah people did there? You don't talk. So if you don't talk, so. The on going a crew of people were, how are you gonna, have fun yeah yeah, that's me, but you must have like not only like when you talk about nicholson and these people certainly running in circles where, like how close were you with the other? Who is your group? I know it was who were the group of models that you girls here with no unlike overseer. Turning to write an linda angeles, dynamic, Campbell, Stephanie see Marta Deanna petites, I've been there is elliot, who was you know what was and still is? they close friend of mine, you guys, like rock stars, you were like you, it was like it was like super models and athletes.

With some sort of correlation between the it seemed the popularity culturally yeah. It was a moment for models for sure where it was like, and you know I I I do talk about how that David, fincher and freedom. Ninety, I bet he did for george Michael riad likes. I don't like that really cemented that whole that was framed yeah. I now before your eyes during music videos before he was able to manifest his dark vision by that Were you taught? You grew belt relationship with hammer. You got to know you. I actually had done some commercials with him. Real yeah he's gonna. They all start doing commercial, irish, Eric videos and then you know so give it certainly taken it. Oh yeah, the ice, good films, so you and you think I was sort of the beginning of the year- the rock star and get a home and aided it, because just culturally was going on with mtv and music and fashion, was colliding, and also at the time you

it wasn't my now, where there's like five hundred channels on right at him. It just cable was just coming in. All of a sudden. There was more hunger for content. Yes, it was it. It was a chance because- and I talk about like on mtv before I did house of stamina- tv. The only fashion you could see on tv was also clench cnn, which was it already. I mean amazing that fashion was being covered on tv, but it was being covered in a very cnn sterile covering the elections in vienna right up and then with empty, we did it in a very mtv kind away, which was more um. You know we relationships because of me with designers and with great photographers and sub. So we could cover cool things, but we do in a way like you know it to democratize it and make it like showing Naomi campbell puddings at cream on or going to seers with Simon, the bonn and in an end you know just kind. making fashion, not so a leader.

Right in and also I think it was probably won. The first true reality shows right. I mean I don't think they were really do scripted drama yet highly I you know, we know that there have their bit scripted, but I mean that the humanizing element, yes of of this service, areas and seemingly snobby relate industry with, because model like- I don't you know, I've been duped like you know, I I you know. Each other is something there is a fine line there, ere, you you guys are our kind of them freaks nature in a way nothing like an athlete like yet we're not exact. That's what I mean like you. You know when you see like a model. There's a moment you, oh my god, there's one of em like I used to give rise to ice, to live on sixteenth, and unlike a third and there was an apartment where all these new models worthy mile apartment yeah right and I would why would walk outside it?

like I, was like witnessing some endangered species or some unique species, I'm like some unique adam, like yeah, look at walking on the street right, but but I think that people make that assumption that that new you geyser are you know snobs or don't? personalities and that show was the first to really gonna get behind that yeah and then it is The motto of that show became used for all for a lot of different inaccuracies. Yet, but we, our friends I mean I'd like any bit are any office right, their sire, you really are close to, or are some that you are entertained. but maybe wooden wanna. You now complication then there's some that you really are annoy. You know that you just roy your eyes out or whatever it's like it's it's. You get the gamut of you everything. It's like you know, no more and no less than if you took a hundred people. He area neuron ray of light

when people say liking, comic, seem to have more drugs and alcohol from them. I really have you looked at plumbers or anybody. I re, I mean every basis the union. the issue is frightened. You with other people. Right I mean, may I certain careers foster at there's access in a different way, but now I mean I am still friendly with you know, like I just did issue with claudia her oh yeah and naomi campbell for bomb and was amazing, was because now especially claudian. I like we have families heads that the kind of competition is over like we both one right. yeah. Ok is kind of like it's, it's like we could just enjoy other as women. My heart, it wasn't like that we're being twenty years old, unlike backstage at a show and like your checking out. Yet everyone

checking each other out because we're all just in secure young women right leg out? You have the runway. You mean yeah, like that girl. Changing that stage rising in your everyone just wearing a tiny thanks. You really, you can't hide and everyone's like can you to go out and I felt like it was really nice reconnecting with claudia sooner over years, but we has spent, They together mean a lot of time in the dressing room, and it was just like just talking like girlfriends like heads and ends and school and travel, and- and you know I have that with Chris turning ten? I have that with my friend gale, so Mary to that? Don't make irons and there still together, that's good here since resting on people. are able to manage a marriage. Yeah she's, a great woman in very she smart and she's, very philanthropic, and I'm in oh she's, a she's. I think she might be five years younger than me, but I'm

feel like a little bit like a big sister, I'm proud of everything that she's done in life beyond modeling, because muddling as a great platform, but it's kind of like. If that's all it is for you and you don't take it, take advantage of it then than yours, it's like you know, I don't wanna, be I'm turning fifteen month, and I dont want to be that woman like trying to be twenty five one and fifty I had a great twenty five by a great twenty. I too great a thirty. I want to have a great fifty integrate. Fifty five, you know I don't want to be nostalgic. My glory days, I mean I celebrated. I am my honour them myself the great barrier, but I dont want to be stuck. There was someone turning fifty in as somebody who you still is visible. Your culture in hand and dealing with. Yeah. What women deal with at fifty in the idea that you don't wanna yelp tried I made Look twenty five or whatever you want to accept your aid. I would like to look twenty four saying. I dont want to try

like our eyes right now, look twenty five! I just did that would be ass, but do you do Is there a way, because I like again going back to the reaction to that photo whether was real or wasn't real, you no part of the struggle for e, serve of cultural exe. As an older woman is, is real right, like it it's hard here's the thing I have to think there was an certain age and I think growing up in the midwest, a thought of as much longer liberia pay one year. Fifty you can just like It rightly whatever I want right, I'm like gonna, but first of all that the world doesn't work. That way now, because, like I said, there's with the self on camera, when you're done starbucks. So I would be very exciting for them. If you just wait yourself, they would be. This is the best thing ever look my husband militia, but, but I bet on it,

their hand? There is like all these incredible women like Jane fonda or howland, Mirren or veolan by that I mean like one. I just I'm thinking of the people sought are evolving luxury area and they, I think, I'll, look amazing young, I may they looked beautiful liking. It available beautiful further age. They looked third beautiful women, but I think the aging thing, what I'm learning for me anyway, is totally an inside job. You cannot it. You know, because look if you feel good about yourself. It doesn't matter if a hundred people tat you re an end in the opposite is also true like if you feel good and someone doesn't like. I don't know why, but you gonna. You feel so. I feel like four me it's just figuring out how I want to be in that. Next chapter of my life and and I'm in that's my project on me really that its I didn't know this

I, but in doing the book I thought yes, celebration in whatever, but in somewheres? Where way a weird way, I also see it's like the end is like a book mark on that part of my life, because I've done it, I did the monolithic mere I mean, of course, I'm stuck in to my picture taken because I've made can caroline I have or make a watches I have and your cindy Crawford well an eminent that's part of what I do that you might job so, but I dont want to have to be like trying to do like cool editorial Point you're like you're like eyes on her to open I use a silly. You know- and I have like this fourteen year old daughter who was like I always these are, and I wrote in the book I'm like she has my old hair. She has my old legs. I want them back now. She said you know, I just see her blossom being and I wanna I wanna leave room.

like. I don't want to be competing with my fourteen year old daughter, sure, and you want to be a good role model yeah yeah, it's it is, but it is I'm not there yet, but that is kind of like My mission, I feel like at this point in my life, is making that transition into into a fit europe when they are being cut, over the year a higher and now we're their points in your career, where cassio modeling obviously does work out as long as it has for you, for everyone were there like, because it seems like you You were very your business indeed, but there must have been times where you're like fuck. This isn't going to last forever, what do I gotta do now. Well, when I started in five years was like forever and model years right here. So when I moved to new york a twenty, it was like ok, but what am I gonna? Do I'm twenty five I'm in here the have like the back up plan and I thought well, that's one because I dropped out of here Sometimes I can go back to school unrivalled on rom.

probably no more. When I want to do and then at twenty five things were still full When did you get married? The first time I was twenty six year so dear? How do you have you a crack at that experience. I was young, I didn't think, with young now right that I was on an icon I didn't really for you always how long that lasts. The mare I was with richard for like sixty, But really I ask only married for two years: are you guys, for instance, for friendly, but I mean I think one time ago, I think here I mean it's almost like he's gone back to being like richard gear. Again like a stranger, because I we don't really see each other, but in asking, if we were friends, I mean part of the problem in our relationship was that we were problem We were a lot of other things, but I dont know if we were ever friends, oh, like peers because was young and he was richard gear and and

as I started, kind of growing up in growing into myself right hard to change the dynamic of a relationship once you're already in it, you know yeah it locked into those patterns. Tat is triggers in whatever weirdness you have that we have a motion elite, that's what brought you to gear and that's why? When people ask me you know, advice about this. I've been with randy now, like almost twenty five years and saying loud, our cash overt, we met. I guess we have. We ve only been married seventeen years, but we ve been together like rio and I say, but you know I think why randy and I really work is that we were friends. First, like I never pretended delight baseball or asian or whenever you know whatever the version is. I because I trying to really like meditation. I liked meaning but I'm not sure I would have gone, and I mean it's

there were great experience, but you know rights like it's that thing where you're you're on that first date in their like you're, like I love bad ray you and you're like and then six months later there, like that's gonna, baseball game and you're like a hit. His ball and there like what so when, When you are with a friend and you never did, banning all really showed like you're flaws from the beginning, or I wasn't trying to impress randy raw and he wasn't hidden limit. We got hooked up, but we had to go to a wedding together, but not as dates just like he was shot, only make us. I don't want to go into a model. He was you have it at the time he emmy model briefly here in college, to make money and meet girls. I think, but he already had his first bar at the time always a restaurant georgia and he had a bar at the whisky and really I mean it the paramount ok, the wizard hotel, yeah yeah yeah. So we,

Matt and he didn't wanna really go out with me us. He was dating another model and I was like my friend whose wedding it was like when you one of these three guys, and I knew the other two and I was like I'm not going with them. So I'll. Take this unknown door. Number three was randy, but he was late. Picking yeah. I was like you Wait like I was yelling at him. Like the first time. I met him, which was good because then, when I yelled at him later on, he wasn't already exists in the yeah exactly. I know this well, alright, so so twenty. You were like what am I going to want to twenty five twenty five kept. It was like my career was like still going great. I had to met a contract and, among you know, is still working times. I was like ok, this could maybe last till thirty right. Thirty same thing I was like give it five more years and then I started I did have kids and I definitely when my kid really little. I Definitely that's when we moved away and I did pull back a little bit, but there was still I had contracts. I had things that I was

being hard, you move your lifestyle are really I think I just felt like it was a better known better better for us rise to raise kids. Like you can have be yard area. Do not like I don't know you don't chose it s over where you grew up. Why We were. I wasn't even on an option. Randy groping europe solely of either been new yorker alone. We we both just decided we like delay. you're saying basically is that for as long as you're you're selling magazines or selling make up or whatever you're gonna work pet he's all right, yeah and you kept being asked back yet and so each is kept yeah and then knew, though you did you at some point you how much like, when you see You know your modeling can take me. You ve got to take from it. Where is europe? wait where You know you worked with somebody to sort of kind of become a better business person or out of that sort of happened. Just who partnership, I think a lot of

is my main. I was always a good student, so, like your around my people, marketing advertising and if you just pay attention, you can learn a lot and then you know I love at a certain point, I left my mile agent c and went with like while william morris it, I'm in the now see a because in a model agencies, especially back. Then they they only looked at you as a five year career. and if it wasn't new, one of their other models was gonna, get a drive like egregious churned. They weren't to developing career right. they re using it, and I think that that is changing in the oil industry, but at the time they were not there yet right. Oh, I switch to an agency at here who really help me like, for instance, when I first started working with omega watches the agent that I was working with our whole thing was like look, we don't want to sleep together right. If, together it married, make her three or kind. However, I learning to and then

I knew they were investing in me and I would invest in them and that's kind of how I've approach my business for the last twenty years. It's like, I want to just do little things here. things here unless there, unless I know what I'm getting on rights and minimum at its word in the end, you tried acting I I wanted to be an actress right and we gotta try when your model right. Well, ok what do you do? What did I did? All the funny thing is the first time I ever even hadn't any thought about my acting We'Re- was working with richard avenant and he's like my friend magnet. wants to meet you in what you'd come on for him for a movie and he's too, when we finish the shooting discovered he s office or whatever, and I mean I knew who might Nicholas was, but that had it. It never had seen him before never had read. Aha, like never did theatre now nothing. So go and he hands me like the sides which I didn't even know were called sides at around, and he is I can you read these

I literally am like yet muslim blah blah blah and he's like to his credit use of unease like well, you can read and I realize when he said that what he meant was act them, but he didn't say act there I said read so to me: I'm very little offers- and I read this- I didn't go so well the movie during the luxembourg and then had done and then I got you called in on a few are dishes for stuff, and sometimes I would go, but mostly I I didn't, have an acting cogent, acting class or anything, but then, I did do one movie, because I knew the producer joel silver and he's just very persuasive, any like you're dynamically, and he just kept like make sweetening the deal to a point where I was like I'm an idiot. If I don't do it right, It was such nightmare in a lot of ways, but it was also.

a blessing, because which movie is called fair game, really baldwin, william, bold and ah, but that at one point the director stop talking to either one of us. So that was like hard, because There is no direct area, so mad man, like that, my trailer was bigger than his or her utter. Now, like you, didn't, have a green emanated. I always at director exactly he's ease number has never done another movie, all yeah. He He was a first time director and really- and it's funny cause I'm friends which all but, unlike I can't believe you that to me put me with the first time director because it was like when someone throughout minos single swam and you run know how to swim in every guides and are used to having people behind camera that knew what they were. Do yes, but it was a gift in the sense that it enabled me to go. I'm not comfortable. I like being in front of the camera as myself or as some version. self, and I like the story telling a fashion photography, but we

give me lines, and I can do if you give me lines that are me talking like I'm here for four hours time. Totally. Look in the camera do that when you give me mines were I'm trying to be someone else here. I just It is just not. I feel completely uncomfortable and I don't like it just doesn't feel to media and I was able to let that go. That's good suggested the one movie yeah and was it did it? how do you get a written? Ah, oh my god. I got realistic at pan got panned rosa hard diamond. Do you feel her now, I was only no. I was fully expecting it. I mean I'm nuts bids. I knew I was setting a myself. You know and a truly undertaken. I wasn't I don't I don't like they acted like it was the. Or movie ever made. I'm not sure that it was yeah, and I'm not sure. I was the worst, but I certainly was in over my head and they had a role that big of a role but I was only mad because one journalist I was playing

a lawyer- we really are, movie. So the matter when I did, but I was a lawyer in the beginning in the movie and they really, as if cindy Crawford could be a lawyer, and I was like I'd be a lawyer if I wanted to be a lawyer that were the only thing that piss me off. Like the rest, I was like a horse Unless I wasn't just really the wavering interpersonal like I am, I could have been avoided if the right, so let's go through idea before we act. But up let's go on. Could you have work with some amazing photographers? I do like the idea of you know many like richard Avedon you just mention is: is a genius really of photography? and you did a lot shoots with me. I yeah now wait. What do you take from working with a guy? Like that, evolved. Certainly his Professionalism, but I think what I really learn from lebanon was. I did my first though cover with him and he he would shoot with the old cameras that we have to go under the cap

after a very slow process. It's not like click. Click, click, click, click with no kidding, so he taught me how to bring energy to your face right. Your expression have a thought in your eye for that second, that he was going to yeah, that's what I learned from and what about the helmet newton. How many you did some proof, racy stuff right with him. Yeah I mean if you without mad you're. Exactly what you're doing that's how he is in our governance, his vanity right, but was something when that happened. You know cause that was before playboy and you knew that it was going to be a lot more maybe not that issue in a way, but my his vision now was at something you were excited to do was excited to work with helmut new. Do not so much the fetish. Impertinent was for vogue, so you knew it was like it couldn't

It wasn't like way home, it wasn't helmet, saying, hey, come, do some figures for my new book, which could be you know any like. I am I right in the book that I always teased him. Many wasn't putting a saddle on me, but I like his bit? He loves women. He sees them is very strong and very powerful, but also like not ashamed of, ignore sanitize woman are sanitize version of a woman, sexual rationality, royal jake's risk here. So I and he's a good director. He knows what he wants. You know you're gonna, look amazing, so I loved working with him and he's got a wicked sense of humour and you know, and as did his wife, was sometimes around and it just I loved working with him. we're the like out of all of them and the irving pen into these guys. I dont know stephen my there mysel were like with like Did you work on photographers that just did shitty after

point we only working with the best or rather more than once now you know. Of course you have to work. I mean look at a certain. well, you're, not working with anyone who isn't at least good, but you have the people that you feel photograph, you better, you like their style better. It's it's hard, I only ever left one job once in the middle of it. And it was because the lighting was so bad. I look like a jack o lantern and I just call my agency and it was like some german catalog or something- and I was like no no amount of money that they are paying me that it's worth it I said you gotta get me out of here and they did credit but normally, and especially at the more that you gain power as a model, the bigger that you get it becomes collaboration like if I dont like something I'll say really like that. And then the work with you, and they know that you know it like a lot of photographers of say, which side is better for you or what do you want to do? You know that yeah

at with them all. Well, it's I do Please say sometimes that looks weird if it's not showing our requires a weird shadow or whatever haroun, so you, but you do and that's that gale part of modelling and the experience of it like I've. actually now a lot of the photography, I'm working with our younger than me row. I can. I can be like well or they'll, say I this is so. This is so evident but every time we got to work, were real guys who shot with on film. You know now. That's gonna did all that stuff all pay a wow and outside of the book. What what is the the cindy Crawford industry up to you got go and well I have a scheme. Caroline then I started cash almost ten years ago is a really good. I use

driving bulgaria, because I united collaborated with the doktor in paris that I was his client, so I'm ready for yeah. I knew him. I've known him since those twenty eight and make up It has introduced me to him and we started the line. We start working on it when I was thirty, I've when my revlon contract was up for renewal and I decided to do my own thing. I am you're going to go you're going to be a little guy up against the big guys well, and it was just that I wanted. I dunno ready. It was time for me to where you unhappy with their products no It's just you're a model for them you're a spokesperson for firm, its different, like creating here thing area. I was ready for that and then I still relationship with omega watch this I have a furniture line really that doesn't sell. We don't have a partner in in the southern cal area, so no one here knows but its biggest sick. What to call it's called syndicate.

well really yeah. So I do that now. But what but what you are now when you say you do that I mean do you. They they show you what they're working on and you're like. I like that and I'd say my role is more of editing or you know, but I'll I can send in like. I could say here I really like marx does take a picture of it. Can we do something like this yeah you can? You can go to ikea yeah, so you know like that's the way that works and that's been fun and again it's at the thing I like about the home business I dont want requiring me to be twenty five on the cover of vulgar exports illustrator. It can grow with me sure and then- no I'm a mom and my husband, and I really like mine. How much I like it. Will we tend to buy houses and or build? houses and then you know, fell on em up and solomon. Yes, flippers we're not total flippers. But

I know it's something he really likes it, an he's very good at it, and so I'm kind of his I'm get dragged along right. You get to pretend you grace bog, be how aid as you like you did. I just don't like it when I'm living in right now, we're having a situation, ran living in a project and though that's hard but you're, getting your making your house getter exactly and he's you guys about success with that with the real said: yeah right is it still in the restaurant? Isn't he actually on the two key le now called cossiga with george clooney, oh yeah that's been going great. Really. I must have killer airbag kilos spokesperson. Now we hang out with the cloning we do. He seems like a good Please tell me he's a good guy like a great guy. I lies not disappear. that's what I always say by george, like everyone. He has such a great image and he lit totally lives up to what he's funny he's smart he's. Age, great army, great movie, star yet becker guy and the wife- no she's my mean we always

joke when were around them. All that, like were like the dumb hollywood at people. Do you know what I mean she's like really smart, so well, I'm glad that you've brought one over yeah. Exactly was great You too thanks. That's our show folks thousand jack with Cindy. I do need to clarify one thing: well some you know me well enough to know what I was talking to sydney that I that my first, why was a model? She was not she was an actress and now she's a therapist. It was my second wife as the model. Neither one of them would ever listened to my show, so I don't feel like I'd be offending them about. I apologize to both if I did, and also for everything else. From the point of no return, I'm starting to swear horse.

I warn you