Roger Waters wrote songs that changed rock and roll, organized them in ways that changed how albums were made, and performed them in ways that changed how concerts were staged. The Pink Floyd frontman tells Marc why he only now feels like he's getting it right. They also talk about his Pink Floyd bandmates, John Lennon, Neil Young, Eric Clapton, and the state of the world.
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This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
I thought I'd- let's do this, how are you what the fuckers, what the fuck buddies, what the fuck him years, what the fuck's theirs fuckin high mors, what's happening, I this is my show. This is my podcast deputy up. Welcome to it really big show today roger waters from pink floyd is here he was here he was the garage we talked about music. Mostly and it was pretty exciting. I get nervous with the legends with the towering legends of rock and roll, so that come up. It's been a refuge. is here at the cat ranch. Spinning been a rough few days as some of you who were following the struggle. or the process the slow moving towards the key, strain
the young buster kitten it's done, all are gone. I had it I was cut off and I believe it was the right thing to do, but it seemed to open up. Some I dont know eat you know when you have a few cats, which I do three indoor cats and one pharaoh outdoor cat things happen all once. I dont know how to take buster in and then what? is de la starry act in fact, here she was hiding in the closet, not eating, that's not good for a cat, That means, there's something wrong, so I tried to give us some food wouldn't take it. Then she to this end in cabinet, tucked herself into their hiding, not eating problem god dammit should I gotta bring buster and get his boss get up, and I get I gotta get the little feline fist of Yuri. That is, fond into a box as well and bring both these factors in.
Because you're some wrong? Where I guess at some point- and you have to accept that these cats are going to fade out pass on but so I get fond in the box and then I get I get buster in the bag and monkeys under the bed y see under them he's not eating. What are you fucking kidding me? Oh once gotta pick fond up in a little while monkey. My stay overnight, busters back just its aggravating to me, but I think that it's weird every time, a heading towards something big like carnegie hall. That's this friday! These itch thing start to cycle out, not enough. It's the power of my subconscious seeking chaos that I grounded in. I think these catherine pardon me, you know, I think fonda. Sometimes Yes, we fonda's, like this guy I yeah admit it. Just a you know: sort of tough defensive, distrusting feminine force. Its very aggressive
our I'll. That I got enemy. Monkey is a sort of kind of like nervous. Kind of scared. Little in a cure for I keep under the bed is with ardex of those two parts, my being or are sort of. nervous as we move towards this buster. What does he represent? He's got a crazy. in childish and just as he's got off and I'm trying to say yes grow in my relationship, so I think all the men. Is there I think it works out but you know how those cats are I don't know right now, but it's been a pretty pretty fuckin gnarly few days. I'm looking at a picture. I now know polaroid of my friend dave, bishop and myself from high school, I must have been in tenth grade, maybe using eleven in eleventh in front of a christmas tree. Now what in his house, and dave Away some you know that years ago,
recently size brother but mean David were best friends for years there in high school. So I remember this one time I dont member, why we went to santa FE there's a pink floyd story. I have two revolving around animals in one that important. Everybody was a you know. We go up for some reason. Maybe one of their for dinner both mean dave. I think it was after he got rid of his seventy three fire bird. The gold one, the eta chirac go as father only son, Yesterday I had a great sound system. I remember we we were there. We were in santa FE. We were a little drunk where smoking weed. We decided to drive back down turkey, an old fourteen began in the sandy as which is a quiet kind of lightless drive and there is a full moon. I remember where smoking a joint we're driving
repression have been driving, but that's whatever you now it happened back then I was bright. Fifteen is price. Sixteen seventeen gave driver's license when you fifteen there just cruising down that old down that old, back rode down of fourteen high late at night, full moon, that's the one We think lighting the environment and animals was playing pink. Void animals and this This time I remember outside If money and some parts of dirt side of the moon ploughing into the consciousness. This was the first time where I went on the fuckin journey that animals- and last time that I registered that goddamned guitar in dogs, those two guitar as it sounds like But that was it man, it was almost like transport of transformational full moon driving,
seventy, no one else on the road pitch black out, except for moonlight. Back behind the sandy mountains me my best buddy high when all the way through animals- and I think either one of us was the same again. That's the power pink floyd took you somewhere where there was a mental environment or a feeling endorphin rush, whatever it changed, your perception with or without drugs. Does the amazing thing about being while the other animals member I have, as when I lived in boston on Carlton street, off beacon, my roommate lance lance, my arm. grandpa was involved and there was a Your camera involved, where I had some sort of your camera. I think recorded the h, asses manson I, stoned on that shitty couch that shitty dark apartment with the cap, we're on us hi out of our fucking mind
Play there I played arrogant, tar landscape air drums to both aids of animals in that's recorded. I have not seen that tape. I dont know where that tape is might be in a box but it exists in the world me and lance stoned. playing air guitar and drums for the entire Duration of paint void animals and it was another great experience so happy its documented. Very one finds it. Let me know, and then The other important thing for pink floyd and myself is. I transition in time where you move through on dark side of the moon, where you moved through the bowels the alarms and then the ticker starts tempting to and then there and then those drums proposed the proper food aid due to budgetary debate. Bad backbone bone papa day
the kind of moment where, if you would somebody in a car- and you both listen to it, a both understand it or even, if there's for you. we just sort of looking at each other and you waiting you waiting to take your head. Off the wheel in place air drums boom boom about pink floyd, great fuckin band guys forget how fuckin great there and how much she meant to all of us. You know I'm talk two, so roger waters came over here and he actually talk to my neighbour got out of his whatever car use driving with the people who is with him, my neighbor was, I think they talked about plants, and my neighbour an idea who was now when I told him he would beside himself with a stupid, the interesting thing about pink floyd.
How many of you could recognise roger waters or david go more or the other guys. Oh I told that allows roger waters right no fucking way no way- yes, yes, so roger and I talked, and air tickets on sale now for its two thousand and seventeen north american tour, us and them go to roger waters, dot com or a e g lived. I come to see. Tour dates in locations and get tickets in right now, You can listen to me and pink floyd's roger waters it's nice to see a man. I appreciate you come and go to bed You know I always get a little nervous, really
I do I do when I talk to a certain musicians. and musical artists, because I had john pride in here of a few weeks ago. I listen to our youth, but brine fan, of course, how greatly that guy songs man minute how grazed the choir by it is great great right. You know you talk to a guy tat in and not unlike yourself, you have this tremendous history of music and any realizing that in a moment as it as a fan and also the guy's gonna talk to you like why there get caught up somehow ended. and then he started looking at fifty years, now of of expression and it sort of its an amazing thing in, daunting out at times. I believe you yeah. Do you look back tat your creative life? In think I, oh, my god. I use a good good look at I kind of live in the present. The idea. I think why,
ready a piece about the desert land show right you just and it was- I almost got choked up reading that peace. I'm doing tomorrow right an end like from what I found fascinating and not, unlike also the tour you did with the wall is that if you have a timeless piece of of art over time was sombre timeless idea It stays relevant by just kind of reloading the men for that already exists right, maybe Does that make sense here yeah, I guess so I mean you know it to him about the wall, and I did that for three years from on the road yeah, and so I'm kind of pretty over right mind you that we will finish three years ago MIA but you're, using a day that some of the wall, with a show you dont morrow right very, very little are really yeah. We do what do we do from the from the war we do break to? We do mother
you're able to make it fresh yummy, I'm just relating to the present yeah yeah yeah. We made a fresh show just for these five gigs. We did three gigs in mexico, the last one and in sokolow square, which was amazing here yet cause it's poor people, their rivalry right. So, instead of getting in rich people at the front, you get people who've been up all night haha we and the magic and exploit much where they appreciative that they love it. Oh yeah yeah, WU singing along and I was making an. I took it upon myself to make speeches in in mexico. Oh yeah, yeah about the disappeared. You know about the forty three kids and and fat. This twenty eight thousand people missing in the last is crazy. Man about half of them have disappeared on pennies watch na
I had a word with him, which was interesting because his palace is just to the left in this line of soldiers along the top standing there with rifles I am not suggesting I was in any danger, but there as with right, yeah, yeah and a lot of the local people said. Fuck me he's got some bulls on him to stand there and say that crap he did, but you you probably were in danger on some level. All it takes is one guy yeah on some level, probably the one guy with a gun air here who can disappear that is appearing on anyway. You know you only get one crack at this. As far as we know the life thing. Yes, you have to decide whether to stand up for them and are just let it whether to be real una on our right. Did you, always find that to be true about you. Do is something that you learned I mean was your area where you re, like I've got to do something else. I mean I was alone. When I was younger was quarter. I never had less conviction right,
in our went through my teenage is doing all the things that we did in those days going on all the most marches and, what were the marches then, at that I mean cause, I don't. I didn't grow up in england or older monster musume to try and ban nuclear weapons. Were I certainly to get rid of the english independent nuclear deterrent and an aim that we never achieved right? No one did, but there was some. You know great. People involved in that movement, so your politically active as a teenager yet, but you like, because I have no sense of that thing off before before you came over and I've talked to a couple of other people that that are around your age and grew up in england is at an end Can we we have no sense of real rubble and destruction from war, none theirs. oh collective memory of it. There's no historic memory of it and and someone
your generation, certainly does yet I mean you came up in the rubble. Do you have memories of it? Now I was too young for the rubble. I was born in forty three, so I have lots of members of the aftermath of world war. Two yeah, I stood a shower wrote something last week about something about the plaster bananas remain out of reach to the kids left behind on the beach. Is it was part of a longer musing have known something, but it reminded me that the first time I ever saw a banana. I was about five years old. Some so had been forty, eight or forty. Nine gray was no fruit anywhere, and am I remember, being offered
this kind of shrivel, small black thing, and I had a little bit of yellow showing through the black beard, and so I am one of those he I want one of those and pointing to the plaster bananas that were hanging up right. The ceiling of the gross greengrocers shopping. You can't. I'm one of those that made a plaster right, the good ones that that's why I want to buy, as that looked like a banana as had never seen a banal, and why you think that memory came from in terms of what you were. Writing maria together. I was actually it was stream of consciousness stuff about good. It was a mixture of memories of seeing a bloated. Floating in the marine in beirut in nineteen eighty or some time when I was there when I was back or maybe even I I was in beirut for the first time in nineteen sixty one or sixty two doing why
The first time I was there. I was just kind of hanging out ready on the beach with my friend. Will it if the place that you would go for a holiday notes, we had driven an old vehicle there with some undergraduates in the back of it from england yet, and it eventually gave up the ghost on the road to sk as we all do it my way or another is not just saw or poor or whatever his name was, Anne and we were therefore for some time before I decided to hitchhike home, which you could do in ninety sixty two but was at a journey that you took. I got what inspired it, where you like. Reading the bead nature you looking for think me why you know to go there of all places will work.
Algeria? We were on our way to Baghdad? Obviously, I'm very I'm going to court. You were in the country. These are not vacation options for americans or even vacation options for anyone anymore. That's true! Then they would- and that's where you when and where you are on your way, to back away to afghanistan, baghdad, yeah, yeah, yeah where everybody was going to smoke some hash yeah. I wrote some show stories later on about the there's one thing that happened to me in Beirut: I'll tell you know it's a. I wish I had the show story here, but I haven't so just tell you the bones of it. So there We, whether this is my friend willa anybody who's seen the film roger waters, the wall. He asked there's another old bloke in it with a beard and we sit and kind of philosophers about things on the side of a hill in the south of france my mate from then oh really were eighty na and we were in bed so and we would term kind of live. Rough, live off the local gay community.
You know, get free lunch, the echoes swimming about other. so which one day and some kid steals my shoes. Will you never go out of sight of your possible or your stuff yeah? But I was swimming and saw this kid still. My shoes wading through the surf airily difficult got out is gone yeah. insert into the crowd like they do in old, black and white movie and an I look I saw a cop well in those days the lebanon, in their infinite wisdom have cups whose only job is to look after furnace in a turk, because tourism, eco tourism, yet not anymore, not, but it was the knesset. the tricky to get his coat is you know, kids stolen my shoes, blubber above or below what we're gonna do or we're gonna go look for him, so we set off to look for the needle in the haystack yeah. Unbelievably, suddenly I see him. That's him yeah yeah, so the cop goes
Were you in his proper cup, with it lay scope, nostalgia bit ly you here and I m The kid looks it as an: he looks it and the cup seize him. Anna and the kid goes fly a fly around an event. She egoism, The cop obviously knows him. He has no every kid right on his beat right, yeah yeah, so he gives her a sort of gives in you can see. Resignation cup come so of jabber, jabber jabber, jabber jabber jeopardize the kids looking at the ground. You know bit sullen yeah. An eventually brother reluctantly takes my penny loafers off and put them down in the story, I think, is a places them in the neutral ground between us, yea and eliza, and the kid and the cup then waves him away with a sort of thing hanging down: kind of motion of his hand like go away. The kid disappears in the car. Now, I'm eighteen years old kind of oak spread.
You know you believe in law and order and all of that what the fuck is going on, you're letting him go. You know he stole my shoes, where's the retribution here and bub, and I get is a almost makes me tearful to remember at the cop suit of looks at me pityingly and for the first me speaks to me in English. I have heard nothing but job a sofa and he looks at me and he goes. He is poor. and I went in it, went into my heart. Like a dagger, I was at least clever enough to understand that I was learning a lesson ray. so I say at the end of the story. I say if when were very young and dumb as shit and know nothing about anything, if we, into our cop- we're very lucky, because it's in that moment that we start to learn about love, yeah, and it was very- it was a huge moment in my knife justin.
I remember that and that kid, when you walked away from that moment, where you can have jarred, suddenly had to rethink ever jurisprudence right and we own moral thought moral conditions and christianity and right and wrong and all the rest at his poor? You know this and fact hump in fact, I'm about to go on the road doing a tour next year, and the new tourist called us in them and its exact it's only about that is about lot. there's a line in the song build song from doubts over the moon us in them, which is why I have called the tourists in them which goes with without and who'll deny its what the fighting soul about another such people on fourchan,
italy? Almost everyone, will have denied that that is what the fighting sold about? Almost everyone, if you ask them, will suggest that the fighting is all about right and wrong about the fact that we're right and they're wrong and that their conflicting ideologies of some kind or that they want to hurt us and that's why we're fighting and my contention is that it's not about that at all it's about with without absolutely it's about distribution of wealth, and they don't even wait out how she resides in the uk. They don't even use the word class in this country in america right there's. No, there's no class discussion really not it doesn't really exist. I mean Bernie sanders, brought it up it. But this population and so ingrained with a fear of communist ideas. That day its existing there's, no poor people. There just Will they haven't had a fair break, yet the people of china
he's in the mexican sunday at an islam have prevented from becoming billion s exactly to somehow rose fat, assed its crept through the boy and also the cow. It is clear that at the end of the socialists like hilary and obama, these big socialists have really screwed them a it's a it's, a sad, angry horrible situation, and I think that that you know coming where you're coming from at least a conversation existed, I mean it may not have existed in the way that people are going to be helped, but there was definitely align absolutely. and in that line is not does not exist here, like that, politically she ran upon last week, desert trip that part of it is any school. Why at the good prevail. I haven't got it with me, so can't really but there's alone, and it says, defenders of the some bugs, and it's over it's about that passing line and the idea that americans are good.
People are hard people to help rebuild the barn. You know we have the doctors note from long ago. I knew your power enough. The out free, meds, whatever you say this idea of helping your neighbor, whatever that entrenched in the idea of what the amount can dream might have been had it not been subverted by. You know, vanderbilt it'd be more can I can play others, and I think that's what you hear a lot in one thing, you will always hear- and you hear I heard it last week with the floods in north carolina that too in all the sun. When there's when there is a disaster at hand, your people come together. I guess in some ways they eat you have to bring them to the attention you have to bring the then attention of of the disaster that ongoing. Well, that's what I'm glad you ve said that war What I'm I'm feeling a need to try and bring to people's attention the fact that the disaster is happening now, but its global, always yet
it's been going on for a while, not just in the levies broken in your neighborhood. This is been going on for a long time and its happening all around us now and how it desperate important is that we arrange in our minds and try and help each other to understand that the less walls we have them. The more that we understand that there is no difference between us and them and that mexicans and american well, you have to face up to the fact that most united states citizens in the very near future again be of mexican origin, the demographics, a a terrifies, a lot of white people. Well, how fucking stupid is that I know you know yeah well, they they interesting thing to me about you. Obviously you continue to write. You continue to write poems impulsively, that if something comes to you you're, going to put it on the paper. Process it, and these de as it you're talking about you from the moment that you talk to them
Hop in you had your mind, blown that you all ideas! It run through that this seminal albums at are yours where it were were, were dark. sort of meditations on exactly these things, without the exact definition that you you, ve sort of rendered it down. This is the fight that it seems to me that this darkness of of of human endeavour and and and corruption which it's always been there right. now when you started working early on. I have to assume that shortly after you had this moment with the cop, you start playing music right Yet when I was already playing music well, you do and then what kind of music? What were you in? What was moving? You, music? I was just going. I was just about to go to college when you were going to study architecture, oh yeah yeah, we passionate about it now
why'd. You choose that thing not to be passionate about my mum, nokia. My mom said you, you can't I'm a traveling salesman. You'll get bored rigid and you won't make enough money to support that was the only other option travelling now no policeman she saw my might good policeman papa. She was here not quite an understanding of how I can remember looking at her and hoped it was pitying lie in the middle of the night. You know when I said come on, get real. If that is not going to happen before joining the man, are you fucking, crazy, a cop, a traveling salesman? These were your options. Your mother saw for you now. My mother didn't see my mother thought. Well, a cop. You know you could that could be appropriate career riley's no, but she she was desperate, that I should get some kind of qualification so that I didn't get bored
albright, which is fair enough. I and I would encourage anybody to pursue whatever if they can find something they're interested in. I would encourage anybody to and pursue it with, vigor and sure and in order to expand there and the best, and how did you grow up economically? What was your world my mom for a good week as a school teacher, sandy and she had a war pension which was pitiful, but because my father had been killed right in nineteen. Forty four So we were poor, Maria being you know, we always had enough to eat right and we always but while I was called kosovars number and its obvious freezing cold The winds there was an open central heating or anything like that. So you will cold till you got down to the kitchen, but did you see yourself as poor, not right? Because at the other interesting thing to me that I've talked taught in talking to british people who were
around then that you sort of This was your lot in life. This is where this is how you lift well, and we weren't poor around my grandmother. My mother's spent every sunday afternoon dawning soaks because we by new stuff. We mended old, stuff right, hiring my brother's close right and it was hand me downs, but poor people. when my mother was developed her social leanings in her left wing poet? She was doing teacher training and bradford in the north of england and there they were poor. She taught kids who all through the winter, walk to school. Six inches of snow with no shoes or nothing for real fate in bare feet. Me, ok, reach now to come to school? They were poor and I didn't have enough to eat. I met poor people here in this
country, fair? You know every everywhere I go with the warm. Whenever we do brick to anywhere always have local children to come and mining mime that bit, then and- and I was turned- get them from the most disadvantaged background. I confined anyway did a gig in san diego a few years ago, and I looked at these kids and I thought these not my kids at they are. So I found out that that they were the children of the executives from the arena. hu there till it would be fun for decades to be part of the shutter. So I went Furthermore, finally, some proper kid- with these kids turned up on a wet. These are more like it yeah. These are my kids. This is my constituency, but I knew nothing because normally the kids have rehearsed a couple of steps before they arrive- could ass in the mid day date. Oh yeah, so these kids were there and then we find we had about half an hour to lick women
shape which we too, as invasion who's in charge of these kids and those of nice blight lady. There whose name a compliment and so to answer is it? How did you find these children in this short speech? dr thompson yankee. So much, and I was just talking to and she said there. My clients and I went what you mean that your clients and she said there- my clients, I see them every day. Another. I want trying to rights and greater and anyway cut long story short. She drove him. She drove a van delivering for emails, these children who don't have enough to eat whose parents can't feed them, and this lady as part of the social services and every day she would deliver something to eat to each of these fifteen kids and you to too outbreaks of fucking heart in I did they have a good time.
oh god, yeah yeah, unbelievable. I mean the stories of of the children. The I've worked in a year with thousands and thousands over the years. They're are always magical and the the feel that this sensibility wasn't instilled in you by your mother's young work, of course, and she came to that later. Like you, she wasn't always that no, she up in a very, quite well off middle class family and went to boarding school. You know he had very little contact with her parents. In fact, as as that kind of victim, ryan model of family life You must have had her cot moment at some point. Absolutely Do you? What do you know where your father's politics, where he was. He was a poor kid in in county durham them in the north of england. His father was killed on the twenty fourth of september nineteen. Sixteen,
the war in the sun, some offensive in in belgium- and I so his mother, got a job as housekeeper to the local doctor, So he and my auntie Verna lived in the attic room. Now kid upstairs on their mother was the housekeeper and cook for the local doctor so they were in service? If you lie here so that through the how they grew up and he bay, he was bright, bigger scholarship. to the local grammar school and anyone to university to them university, where I think he studied divinity and physical education and when it done that it did teacher training and anyone We showed he had some gumption. He went to palestine in nineteen thirty four on he was there to thirty six teaching rogers school. Why did you come from white teachers we're here and they become one.
on some level on some level. Maybe so you, your mother, tells you gonna become an hour, a copper or travelling salesman and you go with architecture and then you'd drift into me, or you were active. We were you had the dream, I feel more like a student than a teacher, yet I have to say that's gonna be marching watching for the juneau. who she is mecca. She's, she's a nigerian singer, double in a K, a yeah and she's been very poor popular sort of in germany and in europe and is adopting or well well yes, and no yes, great and- and I mean You'Re- anybody listened, it's no point in talking about accuse. You have to see her. Okay, she, yes she's she's, very socially This is well, but when you watch a perform, she's got the most expressive face that economic and fantastic pipes- perfect, pavia, incredible
we're great run riot gray. I have no idea how she slipped post, my radar for this long, but when We sing. You can see that she is entirely in what she's doing at if for every second that it's going on, and so this is an absolute lack of artifice about it. Which is, I realize watching. Other artists who can do that price is a good example that actually no he's let each less there's more artifice in job pride because he's having got a stake. He's, got a stick and he has a great comment guys a great day every material and stuff, but yet, but that is what What one is aiming for is to somehow discover what it is that feel, feel express. With nothing getting in the way interesting, I think touched and but yeah, but when you're in that place, ye sorted out, you like. Are you gonna, be raw or you
be focused. Do you eat Do you know where would read wearing almost exactly the same ring? We are the turquoise Oh yeah, Zuni! Isn't that weird? You have ways weird that we're both were answered alma you get a new mexico. Now, a body in new york and nine sixty eight addiction zuni ring made is sunni definite. That's a trip Man isn't that with you. I know it's even weirder is at ring the reason I got this ring is I got my dad had a ring that look like this, and I have that, but it was too big for me, but I wanted one that look like that funny. When it Any somebody once in a shop told me that this ring is made by J, just explain listeners both wearing zuni so voice rang year with just like a little check, railroad viagra rid of to korea. That's while Roger I did trippy now. You like that, the odd man movements, be channeling, enunciate american we're supposed to be here
post a happier absolutely, but let's talk This expression, because I listen to like old, pink floyd lives like real old. Yet in like the winding I noticed, is that in order to realise the type of psychic music that was going to do whatever you want to call your music and to make it sound. Like music was of a feat of matter, it can confidence that either was innate or at that time. Must have realised that you're, all in what was it I was never the intellectual about it right. Of course, you know it's it's something that happened right. That development of what now I understand a lot more piano than I did about it, became more intellectual about my license. Well, what happened? was the the ban became popular
my major contribution to rock n roll. If you love me ever in some cases, songs, but it was really to develop the theatre of agreeing a rock. You know, which I did, most single handedly back in their saw metal, seventies and so to elevate the idea of the concept down completely. Will s true, though that had been done before, but now like you, you know their who sorrow, let's not forget, anything anyway, will ever be a bird but the physical thing I was, I was felt insignificant. You know, and somewhat inept real, yeah even even dead the huge records I mean even yet near that's interesting, so so have a sort of fear is suitable of an admit,
more recently over the years have come to realise that actually, I have quite a sophisticated musical brain the act and that I get a lot of things Other people don't notice what made you realize that gettin away from employed. I think No, I'm serious! I really think it was sooner. I think it was really important to go away when I did ya because what did you realize end that you'd gotten stuck in eight specific? While I was in a very toxic environment right? Where was around you know some some some people, well david rate, mainly who will who were like we turn a drag me down. There were always trying to not may off whatever that perch what year you're an artistic vision, yeah kind of how would they do that by
by claiming that I was tone deaf in there. I didn't understand music on the really yeah he's just a boring kind of teacher figure who tells us what Do you know about me, and I can't you in his own guitar, so there were stifler snotty there were very snipy, because they felt very insignificant. At that point, I think so yeah yeah, I think so, open them down? We I, those years that we were together whatever it was light socially, there is no question but that we win. We did some really good. together in your eyes, you all shared the vision? Absolutely well We didn't share the vision, but we shared the work right. You airs your vision, most of it. I wouldn't. I would even say that, ok by you- but
was, let's do about something else, no day it's interesting, mabel! Let's talk about this, the other levels of music. They began to appreciate, after that, that that allowed you to again that you realise how things about yourself, well? You know my friend edge inroad issue came up to me in what were of a year. It was nineteen. Seventy eight, and said do you know yeah. I had this libretto about the french revolution. I want I have not music in. I want any smote tomorrow, twenty or thirty go was here in andrea, another bottle, whiskey and mr to talk about it? so I wrote an opera due to his libretto and did you like it. I have no understanding of everywhere you a fan of opera. Didn't I do I was complete. I had no idea what I was doing so, but what I
but it made me realize we asset, given a page of text enough. How can remember the first page of this I sure am one. Oh, I suppose they show up with some called Gallop carpet dumb but dont and is a poetic kind of exposition of the latest. ages of the french revolution of the earlier stages of french revolution and what were they volumes that resonated way? But it's it actually, he eat. Describes them. The proletariat is birds reacts his main metaphor as way says. One day a bird was sitting in a bush and someone had it with a stick, a priest of noble dinner. The killer. Felicia Louie had done. I raised by one o, o better a priest of no particular Religion said you right not to the bird but to the stick,
a warrior of no particular house or side on give here than imported kilometre? Put the feathers of the bird on a sheer adjudged from no particular institution am decreed that the birds were not allowed to sing in the bushes one day is our shared: they change participate, but not all of them, but a few. It was the revolution and the birds sang in the bushes now's, the first pay, his things. So that's a lot. Man, that's big! It's a lot better as a big idea, yeah right yeah and this guy was actually catalan. He had crossed the pyrenees at the end of the spanish civil war, with his defeat, his father who was a general and the republican army and lived in a refugee camp for the first ten years and for the first ten years of his life, and it was of great and dear friend, of mine, rhodesia so anyway. So
right the same, but I did it lena light with a piano and an old selina string, synthesize regional syndrome and something or other I just started writing music concerning all the paths and then I felt Christ up again, look at no cost ruined in I see where people sit and and what was that like, I mean where it was great, you know being that kind of student to say, yeah, yeah, just and learning it all by looking and thinking. and then you had to write parts for orchestra yeah, absolutely, oh, my god. So then I then I I discovered somebody has become a really good friend of mine who was teaching at the royal academy in london who school rick, Wentworth and we're very close. I saw him. He was at desert trip last weekend and teaching composition there. An answer I said: do you want to help to one? With this on me, I need a collaborator. I know but go right there and I have to do. Right. I can hear it all. I've got it all, but we have to wait
you know how high does noble go? I have no idea what the range is. Advancing start writing oboe parts from beyond the range that they can actually put right right, and so we worked on an old atari program called no data, which is one of the very first computer programs for routine. Ah on a so little tenant screen here and then eventually, we moved on to logic and sabellius in europe and all kinds of stuff and and got through it, and the work is being performed about ten times as both now the first. I'm sorry formed hearing all those instruments playing your parts. I mean what was at experience of wonder. Well, the first time I ever heard the ocean playing it. We went in two abbe rode into number one,
abbey road with a big orchestra and recorded three of the songs. When I was negotiating with solely with them, beat you happy to gulp who was them ceo of zani classical at the time and he decided to release and so I made some mates himself, full them out with a big orchestra to play to him. How, then he made me translated into English. It was all in french word. You pick up french, I saw no first, you have to learn because they live on the other side of the mouth you he also. We have to conquer them from time to time How would we know what could we do there? Women if we could not speak now,
but you learn french in school if, if you're, english yeah, that's the first foreign language, but it's luck I mean it doesn't always stick with people, but you know I've. I, my french is pretty poor, but I have a decent ear. So it sounds as if I can speak french right and you've been to abbey road before you know that studio, oh, my god, yea yea yea was the thing I used to sneak into number one and just play the piano or we have to to play a nine foot. Nonsense. Steinway in that room, amazing is magic I know that's the room where they did a day in the life of me, who you know the all the bagel kestrels were from ny. Is that room, so you had to we can while we were down the hall or we were in number three different corner waves, which would what would put all the You did all them everywhere, more or less, or certainly that would be, would be the first one in a paper at the gates of dawn, we were doing that and number three and the beatles were doing. Such a purpose in number two
and I made records in number to theater at here. We yeah we might. of the nerves, were whizzer a relationship or did you see how dare you it didn't fancy anew not even a little, They met John lennon once but to my huge, and that was in the control room at number. Two, oh really, and he was very kind of you- know, sobek and surprising a year now he was, it was quite snotty really well Why do I have to assume like so I write who'd. I talked like I can't like it always. Surprise me at that time. In london I mean Jesus. There were so many fuckin bands you're all across the street a minute here so I do. You know this coastal posts, but it seemed like everybody was like those shit. There's there's make fleetwood, there's peter green, there's John lennon, whatever they the around there's Jimmy page,
everyone around there may have been now you and I was in love how good nodded If you do, you have your own, there was some talk about. You know. Clubs in london, like the establishment and this where the rolling stones and beatles were all sit around doing wherever they did, but I I never did any of that or was party to any of that. Why, I have no idea, you were an interested. I too am I can't remember why not go with you. Go see music. At that time you weren't, you didn't feel like you're in the game. I used other diana music, but I didn't go see bans via a does so the rolling stones once said the gunman stay in cuban here they were on a package. And they were wearing the hounds tooth jack several in uniformed. Remember that when they were yet the above it, they call the bureau forms but yeah
While they were they were out. There were about fish on the girl who was on the bill, eddie cochrane, mia, lemme, not helen, wolf boat, leah, Helen shapiro, making most yeah I hear anything back anything well how we decided we ringing of howling warfare around the same time I went to the fairfield hall in croydon and they had these booze package's the aim overturning the england I used to go to and that that was like howling wolf line in hopkins, Sonny boy, williamson, hammy, necks and sleepy john estes bass. Incredible. I get this picture a wolf right there. There is year yet about that time, probably near so you're a booze guy here the idea because I was wondering at what point you departed from it,
Do you know what I mean like because you can hear some of it in the music, but then it sort of like it. It takes it's own life. We departed from it when bob close, who was the only bloke who could play anything in that year? you got a big slap on the risk from his mom and dad said you ve got to go to college, sell at bloody, strap and get united. Protect so the booze guy laughed and you are left to your own devices, the only one who could play. He was really good at it. He can still play plays classical guitar. But, oh really, oh he's really good. Bob close, that's with a K, K, a lower c stay in music, or did he did he get out of it and then come back now to keep her estate in music. As you know something to enjoy for his life. I have no idea what career hip to suit their work, as I was sort of wondering that, because pink floyd in and you have always seemed kind of mind, your own planet, like you know,
Didn't seem like there was a lot of crossover didn't seem like you were hanging out with. Other bands seem, like you know you right from very early on pink floyd joan thing. day. You know, and and sort of it's own world tina plan when plane with next week the air, if he reminded me, you said about mining here, and heart of gold went bang into my head, like that, and I thought I'm paying the bridge thing. Oh that's great. Yeah he agreed? They want him to do it for years and years and finally I can do it he's guided built his own world, you guys do you guys get along, I dunno, I have never took two. Why? Why why Why don't you you're hanging out? Who do you talk to? He came to one of our gigs once aha and david cornered him and and that bloke who goes oh fuck, you then I'm gonna sue right around my business, led back. I make a full added as up yet
I gotta play this bottle in a huge fan of since you know, buffalo springfield? What The one thing you guys have in common is that the music does. Indeed itself. I mean it's timeless shit, you know, there's no like it just stands forever without time. yeah but obvious well, yeah. I like to think that he was always really good at it, and it's taken me thirty, forty years to start to figure out how to write songs. When do you think they? You d really felt like you. Could I mean it is unjust yeah wait maybe you're just changing. Maybe something is changing in your heart. I mean you can't disregard the fact that you wrote some of the best rocks songs ever experience. Listening. You should say that, because they are and they're committed to all kinds of firm, emotional and political ideas right
yeah, and I agree that some of them are quite good and some of them are quite perceptive Maybe beyond what you knew at the time. You wrote it without another word, I'm twenty nine years old, my suddenly right taking away the moments that make up a dull day, ways to us in our friend my kicking around on peace. We could just like scribbling, like the bride s done, unlike in a private jets, are probably a few well, you know because it probably a few years later, I am well how wid to have that realisation that old twenty nine years old. For you figure out that you ve, missed the beginning of the race and then to write it down in a futile. slight. That is actually quite, but it's the unconscious sure. It wasn't like. I thought, oh now, I know how to write a song on your vessel. I am thank you yeah and a vessel haha yeah. Well that stuff eh, I mean do you feel I was. I was talking to somebody about
the kind of tone that that all those the others middle void records have there may be. I know we'll, say their dark and everything, but there's a comfort to that. And are cord there's a comfort to that atmosphere that that debt, that that sort of that mind, opening minor atmosphere that no matter how dark the content is to live in. That place is like a big warm blood, get of rain and Do you do you know where that comes from emotionally? Let me now that you're, through shifting and in how you are engaging in the world and how you your heart, opening in a new way. Do you find that that That period was was Can you were working through that there was a darkness it you haven't been able to shake a if I'd put it like that, I'd put particularly in terms of the music musicology but I think it may be true that if you go up with no me sick in your life. At all, you enter
radio in the house by there is never any music on it and you might into Saturday night theatre, you know with your mother in your brother and that this music ever anywhere near so you know almost the first thing that you ve here in your life is handled. Go singing the blues, not gay mitchell. Tommy, steel, but you know that yeah. It then, at some point, you realise that when you hear mollusca symphony, you can speak o Do anything except wonder at the effect that is half having on you. So so I beg I became aware of really well what music is beyond
it's pop music, jazz and blues jazz and blues, really write, jazz and blues was my introduction to suddenly becoming aware of you know of the complexity of all those minor cadences here that you hear in that bright, sad stuff, the right people write in adagio sooner and you go whoa and there's a whole world here, opening up in front of me and you can hear it as well. in in songs that people write, so it's all over dylan and write and send the beatles as well as cheryl, it's a it's actually all over popular music. If, if you've, you don't even have to search for it, you just hear right. Neil is just all over it yeah yeah, but it's like we're dead, that's a very specific atmosphere to live in, and I can't I can't quite disguise did because it resonates with me out another resonates with everybody, but blues and anon through what you're talking about in this minor reverse there there.
Something like it. What what is it like? It somehow play cates the sadness and elevated to almost a good thing yeah and one it's. But it's it's also an emotion of the that it's the emotion is connected to the mathematics of one character, Musa yeah, but it's but but also you suddenly discover the you know it's like an John talking on your program, John Prine, joking and he's talking about aloe in there, which I at LA I performed at the newport folk festival last year, cause it's one of my favorite songs here in the whole history of everything, and you hear him talking about how you know who's delivering laundry to an old people's home, and he would talk to that. I did that as a kid you dare. I did the laundry delivery thing that smell of crap pace. You know he s hampers of stuff from old people, some syncing yeah it it. It definitely connects you to the trends
it's transient, never life of life yeah! Well, that's the whole archivo of those records. Some of them yet like I'm, I'm fascinating that, obviously one, the great songwriters ever, but you you also like you know you like neo. I imagine you like the band new. Like those guys live, home became a friend Well not really can become a friend. I knew him write a fella, huge affinity. Hyena went up. There are a couple of times towards iraq or wherever yeah. I yeah, no citizen, huge attachment, but if you were in broken role in nineteen sixty When big pink came out, you just went fuck me everything. Changed overnight. Suddenly, nothing The same really our absolutely. What was it exists golly, because I've heard it was it was them gathering together in a room with all get all this stuff together, without a huge amount of
duration of him and planning and the ban playing together and it was about. I think it was about the sun acts of open plan. Recording and I m, and also the fact that they had live on and aunt em. So the sound of the kid is complete in light the sound that anybody else it ever record the drums rose were taken the jazz tradition will hit was summer at the bag. You know the guy was probably doing things with complicated and clever, and what that, basically, the kit was recorded with you know, to talk mike's dry route, couple of usd seventy servants over two or even or even tiny amount, yeah here and really what was going on that list of any importance was down at the front with dizzy glass beads. yeah whoa, whoever it was right, planks exponent, trumpet right and since it was all going on
you didn't get. Do you didn't there? Wasn't any of that right, foot that right, your heart out, everytime, you know he hit it. and the answer. Suddenly, the eight there was a war. I dunno agenda who engineer those records or what, but they were different. I note run granted one and everybody after that, every but everything change I've only heard one I mean I read that I read clapped and talk about it that, like once that happened, like how to rethink everything that you know that he actually felt like will now now it's been done now what but that's very eric, so defeatist, You guys are buddies. Yeah keeps going man. He keeps going deeper and further back sometimes interesting ways. I mean we're, not claiming, I think it's having problems now with his fingers and na nerves and listen that now that I think Keith is too says dylan
finding their way into yeah how your fingers pray good, I'm, what I'm pretty fair, that's good, your dango phantom. Did you like the way he played here? I easing like such a sweet presents man here, great voices. They call sing too. The southern ass an amazing, and here they were absolutely and richard emmanuel as well. My guide, an oil slick. I mean I didn't know. I only the mai metric a bit of woods autonomy, must have been an ally in the seventies. You some seventy five. I was yet through one of my men divorces, and how many had? Let's not go there, how many kids, three yeah, how they don't get us get one one of them's in my band, that's great my eldest son. What's he play an graham? Is is it funny proudly residing in you get it
yeah. He is good at it, otherwise it wouldn't be in the way it did. He did grow up around it. I mean we, He was, he wrote. A piano, oh area is always was and now you gotta, do you have a? Are you married now? No, I'm, not okay, I'm single yeah, yeah how's that and it's gone quite well. Okay That's it that's good! Seventy three right here, ok, being single thing. I did foreign deeply deeply deeply in love about a year ago and I'm not gonna talk about that, except to say that that has opened up fresh horizons. We're here some have written, some loves so being in love is different than it was before or with all due respect, I'm sure any ex wife's. Why mean that's something that evolves? You know the depth of that kind of thing, you let go of as you move along sir hope, happy with it
You know we might, as will go back and have somebody shoot us so these so there's gonna, be some love. Songs is what your saying yet that will arise and his new. Do you think so? Yeah, it's never been my forty, it does, it feel deep. Does it make you feel and secure vulnerable to do it that doesn't make me feel insecure and vulnerable. I mean I think I've doesn't, but I mean to write about it, no, no I'm a real right about during our love. Does so you are you fucking kidding me scared, Yet right it is a god, my god yeah you open yourself up to the arresting it's the it's. It's the parties, most kind of dangerous thing that anybody can do. And that's why and that's you known personal level with a woman and.
but it points the way, may be to the fact that there is only one path worth walking in life and that is to attempt, as insofar as you can, to open yourself up to everybody else's way. You know if you eat it. That is that is the mission is to discover how much you can open yourself. So this is a tearing arrest of humanity of that war. Yeah yeah. Exactly do you feel like because I listen to final cut the other day and you know you brought up lenin and I think that you know there's sums Some songs on their that have the intensity emotional intensity of of some stuff that he did post beetles, I saw a common thread there of trying to resolve that anger.
Style, but me mate. I mean if you recognize some similar intensity. There is a huge compliment I accept. I will accept her because you know that first album that he made with mother on it until ok, I may not like just thinking about that's all just thinking about that guy, you yeah. did you feel that you are working through similar kind of emotional, letting go or or or you not, I think, absolutely upset. I probably aids. Every man experience too soon degree or another, but I feel as if my experience was. Maybe we are quite close to his lawyer. Absolutely late. We above that grow up without fathers. Yet anyway, yeah yeah. I know people that that does weaver a darkness, a whole daddy, is aggravated in and seeks to put it into the world. Yet here do you feel
getting a little closure on that. Well yeah, because you know this old bloke, who I met in in italy, Harry schindler, has become a good friend of mine is ninety five years old. Now he he saw me on tv in italy a few years ago and he decided to find out where my father was killed and he actually got the local people. Though it's town called a premier near rome, to build a monument to my father, and we went nonviolent violet few years ago, in fact, two thousand and fourteen really very the eighteenth, which was the seventieth anniversary of my father's death. We actually unveiled this monument and so that those was very moving and very cool, but I think that
you know I've kind of worked through that year, so much how much more concerned now and with the general picture yet, and so I'm quite involved politically with a number of things yay amber, but but I brought something with me I'll share with you. If you want your own art, because it's bit long now, let's do it, you want me to be. I love it. Okay, is it a poem? It is beautiful. Alright, in big fact. Our is called. Is this the life? We really want. I'm very concerned with the idea that were perpetual war, where I can hear all his millions fingers all over the world hitting the escape, but now for fuck's sake no way and wert seek in no way no way are you kidding, I get yet it's the Thinking about talking to you and in talking to people in general, is that When you actually have a conversation, nobody turns away right
I'm sure you're right, but they would say on those Reader time now said this it's no longer a conversation. Now he's going to start telling us your roger waters, I had I had sir Ian Mckellen in here and he did a shakespeare monologue and people would not they loved it. I love him always great yeah yeah, This is the right. Then you for my friend we did a human rights evening once and he was asleep on the floor in the corridor. I had to step over him to get you to this day which is really great or how cutlass alright. I wrote this I dunno ten years ago or something I wrote this during the bush cheney years. So if I'm talking about bush and cheney is because it was then but nothing really changed, do add you ever consider do published the poetry I mean. Did it do? I will. I will at some point a deaf. look, how many of the problems become songs, one one which
When the time comes and the low state dawns and the air of the piper warms the high crime, if the old country, when the holy writ blows like burn paper away and wise, I concede that there's more than one way more than one path, than one book more than one. Fishermen more than one hope when the I can't remember the rest of it is crystal clear, brooks turned into a son. I did at newport last year when, when the cats of being skinned and the fish for being hooked when the masters of war are almost as no more when Alfred stake there? Whisky outside on the porch, raise a glass to that comrades who carried the torches we will have done well if we are able to say, as the sun settled
down on the loss final day that we never gave in that we did all we could, so the kids could go fishing in crystal clear, brooks That was a programme that I set to music zeinab record. You get the gun, yeah? Maybe I will we worked on it, but I am working with not your gun rich and we worked on it a little bit to suggest a person has suggested a person caught in it, which I think's improved. It because it was all lie flat and b flat, so he said why not put d I didn't want telling you this like it. I like guitar talk right. This is this: is this now? Ok, here we go is this: the life we really want the com, sceptre than average guy is patently absurd. This too much differential in the heard just look bush and change
and look at you and may it's like comparing shakespeare to reality. Tv is this: if we really want being murdered by these clowns are children rushed in rubble. Are we definite the sound of medium miles or moving in apparent unity spewing the mantra of the free to plan the neo land safe in their bomb proof, less free to send our sons to all our sons. Of course, not less free tibet and pillage to fill the family volt free to claim it. okey doke and really know that for fear drives the mill The modern man, fear keeps it's in line. Fear of all those foreigners fear of all their crimes. Is this the life we really want? it surely must be so, for this is a democracy and what we all say goes, we all say: kill bin laden killed saddam hussein killing. On collateral that might get in the way kill. All the dogs and shopkeepers kill all the copper smith's
everyone who cross chooses to be on the evil list, kill everyone who doesn't want to be a acolytes, kill everyone. Who disagrees that. What we say is right: it's going to cost us even so ready has in fact, but no prices too heavy to keep the faith intact because we, but in freedom, human rights for everyone. Well, every That is except the ones we need to bomb. And if some of them are children seem a bit forlorn snarleyow fault they I chosen somewhat different to be born anyway, I'm sure they all agree its success when we ve killed all insurgents and tighten up the mess even though they may be crippled, rushing underground they'll, be happy. When democracy is the only game in town, they can help to build a basis. They can wash your fancy cause, they can service or local needs and pick up joints and bows their religion, their religions, wrong. I'm sure they'll get the hang of it catch on before too long, then
I watch baseball, they can build a disneyland. A pizza and mcdonald's drink bourbon start a band. I know I know no alcohol, the towel heads don't drink. What the fuck they'll soon get used to. It will teach them out. Ring. I digress. I'm sorry. What was my train of thought? Oh yes, now I remember is this: what we all ought to be devoting our resources to to spread this rotten, create teaching their dead children avarice great Was it truman capote, who famously railed? It's not enough succeed. I need others to fail. Is that if we really want to set herself at odds with every other species, not to mention other gods. I don't think so. in general my experiences? in that ordinary americans, when asked to site that dream conjure in existence where they can raise their kids without the chief of blowing other people's gets debates. Is it
machination. Is it too much to suggest that there It is over their and our leaders in the west are driven not by trying to achieve peace in our time, but by something else by something altogether. Less sublime. Call me a cynic, but it sometimes seems to me that some of them are more attached power than to peace. Just supposing for a moment that they're for the cap that they're looking out for number one building up their stash. What better way to divert attention of the poor than an axis of evil and a good old fashioned war I economics, when o one as every schoolboy knows. War is good for business and diverse this from our was it so unpatriotic complain about a lot when our brave boys they're in the desert getting shot a man if the money that we are spending on the war, was used instead to rebuild dikes and hope, re the poor to research cures for cancer and fund institutes to delve in
ways of helping people less well off than ourselves to secure our docks and airports and power stations when the disaffected in our own and other nations, from expressing their attachment to some vengeful data, in self immolation. waiting you and me, or is it power that gets them being able to decide how to divide up the cake who should live. Who should die to have it that is As a rule, the sexy tanks and planes got you now. I got you first reliving boyhood games. Why don't we just stop them. Why don't we get tough, take to the streets in million, say enough is enough? Why why it's obvious? Because actually that's you and me, that's all of us, because actually we on the blacks and whites, Chicago's, asians, every type of ethnic group, even folks from Guadeloupe, the the young, the toothless hags, the super models, actors fags football stars.
in bars, washerwoman, tailless, tarts, grannies grandpas uncle sounds for Relations homeless, tramp's clerics truck clean his aunts, maybe now ants, because it's true that an stunt have enough. I q two different she ate between the pain that other people feel and well. For instance, cutting, leaves or cooling across window seals in search of open, creakle tins? So like the answer we just dumb is that why we don't feel o c or are we religious numb doubt on reality. Tv so every time every time inside mind the guided bomb, the ricochet, the gatling gun, the tomahawk? The phantom mary arch, are, if score the idea, the full cellar, the cluster bomb with rice to go every time the cut falls on some forgotten foreign life, Rest assured. It is because we did nothing to
then to masters dedicated as they are not to protection of the weak, not to democracy, that we nothing to prevent their headlong dash to maximize the bottom line. So what, if anything, to do well I understand that, every day, in many small but central ways we get to Jews, enslave went to the bottom line, with all that implies dog eat dog gaudy. God did I mention freedom fries anyway, we, get to choose, or so we're all led to believe well now into o o eight election year, who knows it may well be too late, but just suppose just suppose if we or vote and we can start to bridge gap between what we all have become on what we all just might have been the gap between the blind and blinkered, greater washed, the laughing stock, the butt of universal scorn- and
mathilda and roth, and grace and pride and leadership and light. and beacons shining in the western marred by both the old world and the third safe haven for the loaded, claims and constitutions written fair on parchment is ago, when equality, fraternity liberty were rocks, Cobb did in an earth emerging from a dark rage. I do believe that we, can spread our wings. Take flight renounced the darkness of the marketplace, reach out across the idea? Lugs abyss bracer longing to be kinder. I and have more fun and garnish less the money lenders nests and touch. And sing breathing relish of our new unfettered selves. The law, in that we all agree that standard issue kicking in our door, tapping phones, rendition, torture
boarding, and the rest the random shooting down on london underground of someone's nephew from Brazil. However sky, the powers that be alien to our beliefs, and so should be confined to memories of hitler's reich and, of course, to uncle Jos gulags capella goes so are we babe is that we need to be protected from ourselves that left unfettered? thrashing we might hurt ourselves that they, the chain, is Putin's bush his black eyes, no less born and all their heirs in all their ruinous, bankrupt, fearful crap, that they should somehow have the power to keep us at each other's throats, impotent straight jacketed squabbling over dimes groats like influence in swaddling clothes, fuck them. Enough. They have had their time a new day dawns
and we will not be swirled in their crime. Yes, I feel good right if you're going to read it yeah, I'm finished it's so of a bit my is ago. Really it's not. It's thought it's heartfelt yeah. What's what kind of sick is that its eight years old I said, suddenly, videos to o o eight, so that must have been the obama has the right, and I worry, a coach other when I dropped confetti sank, photo boma, oh yeah, and I'm glad I did because burn larger, think his his legacy will be looked upon with pride and yet He did his best. He definitely does. As she knows, hands are tied, obviously, and we're not quite sure by who right there is. some somewhere and in those back rooms somebody is tying the hands of good men, of course,
sober and we will maybe never know, but that's why it's so important to applaud edward Snowden, for instance his great hero of the republic, in that he gives the rest of us have at at least a slightly fairer chance to examine what is going on behind the locked doors and to not abrogate our inclusion in the process, why thank you always knew what it was its did. Not let capitalism be diminished ever I mean that's, that's what they're protecting? Oh, that's! That's their plan, well yeah. Well, but as far as we know it, it is a short step from you know, an amendment ten twenty went out to all out total fascism and a complete police state. When nobody has it, and it's always insidious in its grip,
creeps up. Yes, it was insidious in germany in the thirties when national socialism were and- and this is the national trumpets and feels a bit less insidious but its- and just as dangerous exploiting the anger, the despair in the hopelessness of people that feel like there world is going away, yeah and and and and the and the method for taking over the state and for it becoming a totalitarian police state. Is always the same and it is always the identification of the other as the enemy right. So in trump's case, it's the the chinese and the mexicans and islam, and who were it, doesn't matter who is in a way with sure that hitler, it was the Jews and the communists send the I is but he had a physical deformity or whatever it might be in turn a sexual somewhat, but I won't
together? We have to have that desperate, angry popular that you have to have a population that fills defeated, lay at the german state after the treaty of versailles and and said they were in it. So what you have in the states now what everybody standard of living is falling as like a free full I am, and also where the freedoms that are enshrined in your constitution, the area the bill of rights are being slowly eroded and taken away from here, if they decided now today. If they listen to this thing and they go off his step, I they arrested tomorrow under the loss in the united states of america. I could disappear tomorrow. and you would never hear me again. I wouldn't be allowed a phone call to Anybody know lawyer no representation, nothing. I can. It is now legal, the government, if they decide to take me
or any us citizen of the street under the threat of terrorism, terrorism. All I have to be. Six spected being and my position on Beady s in Israel, palestine. It's really is to do that, the I just send you back to england yeah. To me that do not raise an idea and we're here Hopefully, that would be a mistake, place whatever you know? I mean we can laugh about it. But what will It's scary is that the law exists the arm. Why, on that, why hasn't the patriot act being revoke ia wise way as the executive branch getting more and more power? Why it now legal for the president of the united states to kill you as citizens, with drones somewhere in the world. Why? How is that possible
that well. I think it has a lot to do with. Like you know, on the record amused to death, I guess you took the title from postman's book yeah. You read that book. Of course yeah. Why mean those that's how it happens like I, I my copy of it out because it was one those books whereas, like oh my god, it's all here I'll the answer. This is why it's happening it's all here. You know in this book because I pulled it out and is underlined in unlike this is how you do it the area so distracted by get now that the the same at the same pace at their taking these freedoms at you talk about away their tenfold. Giving us more things to be preoccupied with that. So so did People don't see it as it is affecting their life known, are done and that that, due to cross that gap, how
it's affecting my wife, I'm ok, we're in the garage I'm going to go eat something after an uncomfortable yep. This is the greatest country on earth and it has the best of everything and when you tell him, no, it doesn't and noise and it's the richest. It's got the most weapons. Kills more people than any one else, incarcerates more people, but it doesn't have the best means of health care. or education or any of the things that other people in the well think of fundamental indicators, of a just so have I healthy and civilised society. You don't have em right, you have, but you have a huge number very, very poor people. You know why, if the richest country and how is that possible how's it simple that you don't look after your veterans when they been off me out whatever the wars water about award right? How is that possible? Not quite sure, but I think a lot of people in this country, don't believe that we are here
I think you're right and I think that did that's. That is turning out to be the majority, but I dont think that majority, as no or acknowledge their own quality of life had been chipped away? Well? Well, listen! This is this is why it is important to understand and that the system of government is broken, that congress is for sale. And that you are in really really dire straits and yet somehow need to organise yourselves to figure out how to get this thing back. On the rails, so that it's not a runner training will here's out here is how the most people respond. It's like I'm guy, I sounds like it. I'm busy, but it seems like you're you're you're motivated in that the messages one of energy in its aid and love? Absolutely you know when you see all these people drowning in the mediterranean youth, neither throw your hands up in her on site
gave them the fuck out of my country that gonna take my job or you can go what is going on. Why is this happening? What is where they live. I e syria say to take a good example and inhabitable and why do we want to throw more bumps on it? You know: are it's a fire? It's a raging out of control. Far. What are we going to do? Let's throw gasoline on it or drop bombs on it? That's obviously not the answer. We need to start addressing some of the broader issues. I think the broadest issue is with without and who'll denied, that's what all the What the fighting all about, I think that's the main issue that we need. I was already us talk about something else and aid people don't want to hear this rubbish. No, no, it's not rubbish. It's important and it's you know. You know what I just realized when you saying it ended in being that I did political talk. Radio for like two almost two years is that the weight that
happens in your heart. When you talk about this is, is it's a weird mixture of I'm not doing enough and hopelessness? and it's very easy to turn that in on yourself than to actually say I'm going to go. Do that something it's a lot easier. For me to relieve that feeling by eating some cake, and that's it that's a sad and We of how exactly the consumer culture play. Catesby If there are enough people that are ok bursts of people who were in horrible shape, then the ok people don't think it's a problem. with software next week's reformatory, changing a at all from the one you did last week. You will you do Dropping pigs on the wing put one into really yet for what why, for theatrical reasons
light we? This is part and the chauffeur anyone. Anyone who says oh sweet will remember where we have like battersea power station and add the chimneys come in three in three dimensions: the chimneys thirty four high come out of the top of a model of the building right there is there and deployed in it, takes about half a minute to deplore this huge chimneys lots and lots of noise and careful sovereignty. Areas were, and it's a great theatrical moment today, I started singing pigs on the way and I've realized that it would be much better theater to continue the sound effects that are going in the cord, which is beautiful. I mean a trip calif and a clair brothers and who made the court system it's fun. It's really wonderful outlet to not do pigs on the wing, which is just bloat singing with an acoustic about, but to keep the theater and go straight into dogs, so the
so that very scary, you know you gotta be crazy. You gotta have a real need, comes out of that theater right right, so I have to drop pigs on the wing, but you're going to keep the chimneys of fuck yeah the gym, and it's just magical people just their jaws full. So that is my I'm a lover of le they'll go getting back to what you feel with your contribution to modern rock music, which was the theatre of it here then, you know your natural to opera in a way you ve been doing opera along so when, started to really focus on that stuff like you know, there was no limit getting what you want to get done done on a theatrical level, any really it sort of paid creatively and also Making its mark on. You know just leave The battle was it: he owed people, we're like holy fuck yeah,
The thing about is, though, and which have have seen as the years go by. Is it's not your conscious, throw money and you know build some, right you I can see that the trick is having the idea right. You can do the wool show unless you think off. good idea, let's build a wall between us in the audience which is a stupid. It's the idea, the another anybody's ever had to her, and yet is probably the strongest. I do that anybody will ever have in terms of of Rock'N'Roll. This is that, well who is even in that whose even in the league of actually doing theatre with with the depth and and message and metaphor- and you know arc who it other than he really nobody about life They did by using mount fisher and united. Throwing money at it and put and paper and unpeopled. Did
naming no names. A lot of other bands here have produced spectacle right spectacle. Well, that's different! Well, it's still something no yeah, it's silent. You makes it makes the brain the endorphins go, but it does make you go like oh what the fuck yeah yeah, you want some of that year. You do well, I do What's great talking to man? Thank you. I'm a very nice talking to you happy birthday, John bright for guidance to have didn't, seem to want to talk about them. As much as I think we ve got there nothing. We a nice conversation by why things is great to meet him, because you gotta, remember, have fucking great, pink floyd really is deputy pod dot com thrashed tour for my dates, upcoming, nashville chicago all of them,
our real enough. Another time, let's play a guitar and get out here for those of you who care stratocaster, five reverb for quaker dispatch, master knower go now Andy earthquake or goes decker. The the. The the the
and the and the and then the both our lives.
Transcript generated on 2022-09-05.