Singer-songwriter Scott Fagan created a beautiful album in 1968, called South Atlantic Blues. But things didn't go the way they were supposed to. Scott talks with Marc about why the album and his career fizzled, how they were both resurrected, and how he connected with a son he never met, who is an accomplished artist in his own right. Plus, Marc delivers his annual Thanksgiving Day pep talk.
Sign up here for WTF+ to get the full show archives and weekly bonus material! https://plus.acast.com/s/wtf-with-marc-maron-podcast.
This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
All right. Let's do this, how are you what the fuckers, what the bodies, what the fuck what's happening a marked marin. This is deputy at this. Is my podcast? How are you look? I knows skimming. I know I know some of you might might be at home. He might be back where you come from back with your family holed up in old room, we do it every year and It's always well difficult for some people, but I think for some people it's going to be a lot more difficult if they even made the trip because While we had a major election a few years back, but this is another big ones very divided in it's gonna. Be here. For some families to survive it,
mean, obviously not you know, living by their god forbid, things can get that ugly, but I mean it to survive. the emotional bonds of family, no matter How trouble they may are? They may be without this stuff. If there's political divisiveness within the family, hoof man, It's gonna be rough out there for some people. I know it, I speak to it Lest I can't I'm not goin back, I couldn't go back there. I could go to florida because a work but there's a couple people within the unit. within the extended family that comes the thanksgiving, there have always been at odds with the now it's you know, it's there's two sides to this saying This actually more more nuanced, inhabited one when it comes down to it once I won the other side, didn't
there's a lot of vulnerable, sensitive, thoughtful, progressive people, out there that are now in shock and stuff and more vulnerable. Because now they have to deal with aggressive gloating. of the other side and that's hard, it's horrible. The aid? If I can speak today, nine conservatives who us into my show, if you have to in your family who are wounded by this situation and looking down the barrel, it four years of the to them that the best they can these is horrible, and that's not even being cynical for people if a certain way could I just say to you few conservatives, who is this:
It will have members your family that you're going to be seen today ease up the aggressive gloating, the condescension, the infantilism just just ease up right, help out here in this partition, our situation before I get into this too too much in. I don't even know how much did get into a, but did to speak from where I'm sitting in just a project, the possible horrors terms of arguments and crying and yelling and discomfort that some homes are going to be feeling? You know I I can only speculate but I would like to read cause sometimes I wonder what my place is. A broadcaster Inez somebody that a stew- the idea of the human heart in spirit you know and things why, when the chips are down and things get shitty, I sometimes wonder you know,
I do here, I know what I do. I talk about myself. I talk to other people about things that interests mean about their their life. but I get this email and in this is what keeps me going. Sometimes from a guy named robert. Just as thank you hi mark, I love your pride cast That's not why I'm email you! I wanted to email you to tell you! Thank you before I go went to it. I want to say I'm not doing this to get attention are either Have you read this on the pike s or anything like that? I'm email you because you made a difference in my life. I listened to your pocket, Every week, while I work- and I hear about them- people who email you to tell you thanks for various things, and I finally worked up the courage to email you, I was going through a rough time in my life when I was introduced to your pack ass. They couldn't, except who I was as a person and it felt like there was a giant hold. It couldn't be filled inside
I lost, who I was for a long time and that culminated in a suicide attempts which led me to being put in a mental hospital for short time when I got out my girlfriend, who am still with today, surprise me with your book attempting normal, because she knew I was a fan of the past and your stand up. I love the books so much your book and especially the two. I'm you take on each episode to delve into your mind and your honesty about yourself learning to live with who you are as a person help me feel. Ok with who I am and help me feel like I wasn't alone when I truly felt so isolated and alone that I didn't want to live any more. I can't describe how much leaf and hope I fell because someone else someone who had a real voice talked about many of the things I was feeling. Sometimes the things you said. and the things I've read, your book are actual thoughts. I've had it made a world of difference and I soon sought help.
After that, realizing that I couldn't do it alone and am a much happier person now because of it. But most of all you helped me feel like a real person. I truly think you are a special person and, as many people have said, You have a real way of humanizing in getting to the heart and soul, your guests and something truly special to me. happens? Every time you sit down in the garage for an interview as morning, you max Oh, I've never really been proud of my home state, but you make me the new mexican out this email Well hope all is well with the cats and please keep up the great work, much love, respect and admiration being sent your way, robert boomer lives. So I guess the thing that that that strikes me as you know, there's a lot of people. feeling isolated, but you know unfeeling alone or at odds On the wrong end of the thing by whatever but you're, not ok, you're not and I know going into thanksgiving you're gonna get beat up.
and you already were- beat up? If you have people it would give, political views in you, you know I'm talkin to one just kill or business done here, I'm going to be in Chicago. On December. Third, two shows at the you can got a deputy of pod dot com, a tour, slash tour. I think the first show is kind of hold out. The second show there still seats, but its work, in good there and I love to see I'm excited to go to Chicago I like going to Chicago. I like performing something's. And I get well, I mean I've. I've always liked it, but now it's like to do it? I gotta show up for the people that are showing up for deeper. and then just comedy just the way. I feel so new deputy have cap mugs your available tomorrow, black friday, from brine jones up in portland. These are the same mugs. I give to my guess: they go on sale at twelve noon. Easter, nine am pacific tomorrow november. Twenty fifth go too bright, our jones dot com, to get yours people of these
gifts is well what else? Well, look you know A lot of families are going to be tested. The relationships are going to be tested, it's going to be difficult at christ before this election. Even football could test relationships in families and just seeing the people once or twice a year contested it I mean it just it is it's it's different and I know some people were entering family situations where they're like why. Why did you both the way you did why. Why would you that guy or why you know, I mean I thought we had some basic understand. It is going to be a real test of the love that holds families together. It is because These divided so there's gonna, be a good show up around the turkey like glitzy. Father a brother, like a why the fuck would you vote away? You did and just ask yourself: is there make a choice?
who is for yourself, are they needy? Are they volatile? Are they self absorbed at a impulsive? Are they thin skinned early defensive our day? Many are they scared of change and and and instead of change, Would they make life miserable for other people to fight action, so they set in their ways. Are they her render sui terrified in an angry about tat about the possible of losing. Are they stubborn, that's a profile? that could go either way, but if you ever, hard time understanding wise old vote. The way they did. Maybe maybe look at that checklist and maybe ask yourself what where they always like that. Does it makes sense, even if you do I agree with it, either if it was a wrong decision. Does it make sense for that person that person always been like that. Maybe that'll, give you a little wiggle room to hold onto some love for some people that you may hate right now.
Any in like mother sisters were our, do they are they the type of person that that covers been apologizes, The guy that I just described Now I will maybe more have they always been that way. Maybe find your little weasel room for Captain I mean a lot of us are just in the processes of accepting the reality of what happened. We ve gone through a few stages, and- and this is a key and are you walking into something it's gonna rip open, wound again the wound of losing the wounded being terrified of the future and believe me, the people in your family. If they aren't, you know horrible evil people. They don't know, what's gonna happen, no one knows what's gonna happen and they might be good about it and, as I said before, aggressive gloating, condescension, infantilism, I e all those add up in certain instances to just bullying
hard to deal with, can be rough go, but take some time he needed boy step away, and I say this- you know outside of politics, have said it before. Thanks: giving step away, take a walk Look at your old hang out drive around. Remember what it was like to be a teenager when he had it all and frontier. since some music. Try to hit a reset try to get through it. Try to love, despite the anger, if you can Scott fagin his on the shows very interesting story got fagin today, a sort of masterful album in nineteen sixty eight called south atlantic blues, and it's been done Up and re mastered and reissued by by a saint Sicilian knows enlighten the attic records as a beautiful record it's an insane story that
everything was moving in the right direction and does shit didn't go. The way was supposed to anyone. two wandering after the the record tank, and it was resurrected in a very odd way. It's a it's an amazing story from a very gifted artists with a very unique passed any but he did. He was reunited with his son, who is who we didn't Oh, he never met the years and years later, Who is stephen merit from magnetic fields? and it's so weird cause? I talked to scott about it like David. There is even knew his father musician musician, but you know who he was. Until until much imelda much later in life and scottish mention here, you'll hear a dimension that when he heard the music that a sun made, he could hear himself in it and I listened to the magnetic fields, sort it for the first time, just the other night cause a murderer sent me their first to arms. They reassured and I can hear too
It was like genetic, it's fuckin, trippy man, but does us, It's gonna be on the show in a minute and it's a it was. Pretty beautiful interview cause like I'd, read an article about this record. I met the guy that found the record and got behind it, and here he told me about the guy and just was a fascinating, I'm fascinated with people that put one out there that is before monumental and then disappear for whatever reason and to have something kind of they re introduced. I gotta terry reed. Also light in the attic artists, but, like you, wait in the attic is very good label for this stuff, but but this scott fagan thing was just it was fascinating. It was fast to talk to him in the album is beautiful. It's really a really is, but that said, you can get. The album south atlantic was over a light in the attic grids in this is me talking to
the very wise and slightly beat up but tat beautiful scott fagin, the media has been in this time to two yeah. How are you stay until thursday? Do you like come out here? I live here for a while. I have been what year will lay many many gripes, many lifetime area, wait. What were you first came out in teen. Seventy two with my rock, I presume we did it the pilgrimage. Ah, I came up In eighty seven year and I came up other user later. Program design. I design data recovery programme for the music business and did it take
it did really when oswald misery cares and what's the angle, how does it work Well, originally, you may know that turn I'm guessing that its true of committee and as well butter The musicians are independent contractors. That's right! No coverage for treatment right, the real the d or my realities- that term musicians ever tremendous impact on the society. Yes, if, if we're trying to support recovery for the society, yeah supporting of reform musicians, I got sober and new york what year, nineteen near our your old timer made twenty four. You know that suddenly, it was the day chuck fallen. Nuts. Was, I haven't said there were that coffee at the counter,
No, no, no, no chock full of real nuts, not back off our geiger nemo group was chelsea. Riverside over was better known as china full of nazi at it and I was elected the chairperson yeah when then the first year, because they get that I needed more than most. I have any and so, and then I went back to ST thomas- was warm from the incidence of an alcohol related deaths and ST thomas' are impressive and in the states Texas had the highest yeah alaska. I believe that the and the virgin owns a double alaska, no kidding area. So when I was a boy there was no minimum drinking age we just drank from the very beginning and alcoholism is all over the place you aren't born we went when I was five and nineteen. Fifty one
So when you or I will give we'll come back around to the cause sober seventeen years myself, well good for you, the images that august night, some venereal good good good for your fuckin miracle nothin, but But you you know that the fascinating thing about your story, is that you were in this time where people are finding new music, that's really old music. I was brought up with a certain mindset about ina what music was in an in its at a certain, your life, you realise that its much broader than you ever imagined, so what Chris champion the man that that reissued, your record south at length, he's told me about you. I was like our that sounds interesting in any unites play this record. Unlike holy shit You know this, like is magical music from another time and nice things of a year and now appreciate why?
You know it's. It's sort of its its fastened to me, as somebody who is who struggled in show business as well for many years how- discuss or handle the story and what you went through. It is it's a the tale man in any, and you are pretty good well thirty, eight years clean and sober that helped he's been gone, Nineteen, seventy nine under banca fuddled area. Are you so Let's talk about new york city, you were born in european on any real recollection of oh yeah, sure yeah, yeah, I'm everyone at bellevue hospital appropriately mia, My my pop was a tender man around oh yeah like real bebop area we lived on fifty second street was nineteen. Forty five, forty six forty to fifty second street, which was jazz
right of an that's rather than the musicians or in this arm writers, everything right so till he came up with pres no shit letter. Yes and eleanor fagin. You know that if I dont know that is, I know, ass billie holiday, really a service. Playing with them. Well, played with them. He was younger than their men down and. No, they all had people coming up under them, so high. He was coming up under lester and and the unknown just the influence he had asked his influence on his home. playing blaster was like heavy influence on our pepper to our pepper, can shut up about lester young. Well, he was and you know any time you want to hear something- absolutely magical. This foreign, some leslie, and so did you so you grew In the at that time, yo hearing your dad practice being part of that people over the house.
Sitting in a rehearsal hold my sister and I am on the little folding chairs. While they did be bomb hours and hours if we weren't at the rehearsal over the dance, studio, where my mother and a twin sister were doing modern after all, congolese really outreach. Really, oh, yes, Are you grew up right in the middle of bohemia and new york and away well were very board my sister and happier appreciate. Had god love? What are they doing but I mean there was a natural for us in. Oh, I took very natural. He took it and then my pop couldn't resist were called chippies yeah, Everybody is term now I think that evolved into groupies wade, young sir
and so my mother, but when I asked my mother mud, why get diverge divorce Frankie? She said he wanted, does sunnyside up eggs every morning now that was later, she confesses chippies yeah and he concurred. anyway, we went off to the virgin around with a painter out like at what kind of abstract rail is a painter anybody of import. Well, he eventually came back in and made a good living as a commercial. Lord, his name was just and fletcher, so he will. He married day your mom, he didn't know he came back his mother intensity, come back and mary, nice, jewish girl, so he left I doubt that will be the caring and showing that he took his aversion. I know my mother under twin sister. He took him: ok, yeah they,
if they'd been on their own. Since I was sixteen and you know they, they were artsy, chicks and, and she had a steamer trunk full of seventy eight and off we went to a natural. He went to ST thomas. Yes, it Then our colony yeah yeah. What is it all right here I can say is that it means that term what was called the hour colony it was, built around a cloud. Pizarro. Ok, an abstraction and poet, sir. well known. Poets in those days would come and stay it totally. Twenty! Nine though this is, though the late fifties. Fifth, nineteen, fifty one, although they have been in place for a hundred years. Well, that's when you got there. Fifty one do you, I wonder, was it was dead? walcott around, not tat, thomas,
I'm trinidad. Ok, I knew I had the EU. I met andreassen fellow. He is in a great poet really here light. Trinidad do you know the archipelagos stretches from Venezuela, two key words: yemen, good with islands. I've made some pretty embarrassing mistakes, tat about islands, oh, I can get in the wrong island area. So your kid you're the artist colony. You got one sister, my sister do ya, have fallen and your mom and her twin sister and this guy, who doesn't hang around long yo now, what's lifelike, what's your mother doing he's a secretary, illegal secretary, yeah and dancer aha,
We were in the arts in their ah poets painters and and lots of gay folk was sir very attractive for gay people. Pollyanna many years also out, maybe where they could really be out and having life will know their of airline right. That's what I'm here yeah area so as a retreat yeah, and when did you start plant? I started singing my palm mother singer, alter beautiful beautiful thing: did you stay in touch with him all through your life or not? No, there were long blank spaces, my mother, married eight times eight times I'm assuming that not all great guys. Well, they were all alcoholic and she alcoholic absolute really like just born and bred
the men? Were you know that an adjective alcoholism go back to the first rotten mango on boats, you ve got all that it be gathered. The bug in your blood, that's yeah, so this whole thing your roof right. We were the only by children and the public school system I have many many years and an basically yeah she's, she was materially challenged. Yeah, we were, I dont, like the term poor butter. We were the pores white folks I had ever seen anywhere and yet this day, that's the fact, right, but but term there was a tremendous amount of love and acceptance by local folks. I nah does the little white boy, man calmly. We feed him something good.
Come now. It are we. As an extraordinary love bird of any material comfort, but a lot of hounds lots of love. Lots of acceptance pure very much doubt and then later on, I was a homeless teenager, and so I left high school in the tenth good why'd you leave home. I didn't left me and my mother was married to a local jamaican. Do a half who tried to murder me one, oh really rarely and but now. It is some people with addiction, sure she was strung out end and he was the light in her life, and here I am none though I don't doubt she loved me very much omen completely confident,
it's the way life was in that time anyway, so one quarter the three in the morning. I get empty free as this and I hit to the eastern and island. Then climb in the window of a porter reconfirm let no one landed in the laundry pile and and they embrace me and I lived there with them. A blunder, another market bunyan day and night yeah, and no so so. We are fairly multicultural. I would So in the singing a publicly wonders at so your star is a singer. First, public performance, was then and Augusta georgia, the Anthea masters tournament, the ass. I was The states on the road with my pop, who had the tick tactile trio, oh yeah, and they
all through the south sudan yeah one other gigs was the masters some country club there so we're in their sneak than that. And then only sixteen, so you got back up to the state. Well, I I came back and forth to states. I actually stole away on two airplane Do that anymore yeah it's a little more difficult, and what do you mean he stowed away? You are in your engine or a baggage, no, no, no yeah. The first one was our bear was in Saint thomas, had jumped over the fence he out on the airplane, which was calling for Alvey mcdonald will get on the plane, ride, alright I'll, be rv mcdonald yeah. He sat down next to a beautiful little tick and said if they ask tell them your husband. Of course, we will clearly not old
yet. Is it ok? This was big adventure right and we flew the porter rico and got off the plain and simple. we go on because, like lived in puerto rican out for a number of years and lifted, the porter can family. So it wasn't clear whether was irish or point thirty in the end, as I ran into for how young and old drinking dude here the bottle of rum in a paper bag who was on his way to your air and numb and recognise a kindred spirits, so we, some room together and and then I set out to find me next legged a trip which went down the stairs out to the top mac there was a stern airlines here being cleaned up and gas. May I went on there and jobs dash myself in the bathroom,
Damn? rolling down the the runway. This is flight ban. blood! Think I'm going to new york! Rack more, my am bound for baltimore philadelphia was november late november, yeah anyway, I came out and sat down next to a dude who was very nervous gay cat who was very nervous that he'd be accused of kidnap, and I was very pretty a very pretty kit. Air He was dead scared that he be queues of kidnapping mere molestation right. If we got to America he had on an island. That was no concern. It's a ratted you out! No, no! No! No! He was just scared. He was very up to have your flight and you made it. I did make it so while we made it to baltimore, and I d amount dressed in,
dongle reason flipped out pre psychedelic psychedelic shirt, m m brown as a coconut love, some no socks and some loafers is something on clearly not about two more boy here, but the police snag me thinking that I was there run away from adjuvants. Home in baltimore? I had them convince those of poker game. You had gotten on the wrong planners, possibly going to miami I I love langley there. Now you no nope know I'm lulling on asylum. to send me down to miami better- they called me dear mother and she loved her bonehead boy. And they went back. They sent me back. How'd. You eventually make your way into your own, a sailboat
I signed on as what we call a bill rat and your usage. No at eighteen. I get again when you could will he sd fifty foot sloop? But I you know I get in trouble with the law. I was early onset, alcohol. yeah and I was a little white boy that had the great reputation by and defend it right or I do know I'd be fish meal right. I'm sorry! I saw I had the reputation. I was singing people know that that I was a gifted singer and he had a band not not, yet. Ragged later he I put a blue were called earth. in that was in Saint thomas. Wait. So I was up in the states in augusta
and the pop was plain that thing and they told somebody is some fidel. Can we speak the dramatic soldiers? We call me fidel the fuckin bombed over from the island. Z has her. There was an hour good for fredo and revolution. Orient noble, get here you're, only radical radko cameos. Well, did you know he didn't play this comic cart, yet a little later fear he over through both taster, who was a bad guy here and and the whole explore whatever society man, it was terrible. Vienna and lots of those folks wound up miami, and now the right wing down in miami yeah so in early times young, due to a thinking no yeah. This is this is a great change for cuba and the apple
anyway, so were were there and gus. Then georgia in georgia, the idea at the masters tournaments right an ass We pop told this guy- oh yeah, fiddle a great singer. He says yeah lemme, hear him sing something yeah I'll, give him twenty dollars. If filtering so so I pretended to be able to pay play the standup bass yeah and I could fake it and so I sang I left my heart and san Francisco really play in the basement. with the trio and yet again we twenty dollars a half. That was it. Atta urine easiest money ever made them, and now the waitresses were winking here right The music to take it does. Is it so you go back. You start to ban trio. Color regions and work. I was at tat what was the music well, my favorite group was
drifters. Oh yeah, benny, king sure yeah, and there was an awful lot of calypso and latin influence, and that there was like under the board look under the boardwalk is one that there is, but it's at the way end after many king. Oh, it is so that we always stand by me. Down by me was bending king, the advantage harlan? Oh yeah, this magic mamma, you, the last stands via my guy on board, blew the f fabulous stuff on broadway, again choked up point roof, oh my god so many a year, So one so the little but an island mark me. I had one radio station sure and have the play music for everyone. So are our station played hillbilly music
voice of america army brass band, so it was a big expiate, expec community down there. There fairly large one that not just american, I mean the added their word european right and a visa saint thomas in particular, when a crossroads because of the harbour forever right. So All of that all of those are my musical influences and you'll hear it in and the work I do another. I'd, get mine eyes out the blues like every every the horn, section d got calypso in any got the army horrider you and then he got the sort of trippy kind of life. Go away. You sing like it's all in future, like what's really amazing it on the record is that you can hear benny king in a you re those spaces, yeah, yeah yeah, so about making was just a
master fraser. My party, I was a master fraser end and I've tried. Do you know to make it a sort of special to see your point that cast up with the urchins? Whether down an folk and re aware of all the flowers gone chair the hour and be sort of hackers. Can it up a little you caught the eye of a sort of montana lunch at the place to go down, he's here and down there in sochi, we bumped lips in and hips and resulted in and the child does stephen will widen idea exist. Until reason merit yeah. Anyone know magnetic field feel so that was of one I got. You are how old. Seventeen are you anyway.
But yeah. It wasn't no one night, I we! We were together for a few months not long enough to know he added a kid come on now anyway. So she went back to states the other people from the urchins went back and- and I saw assigned on as a deck hand on on the success to get up their pride air heading for the state to you can just go because you do your dad can get you anyhow day. You know you, you had to figure out how to get to work to get up there. What was the idea? Well, I've gone back and forth here so many times. Either on his die? Mommy mothers die our stolen away. The outer told you that it was too tired and become an ongoing coming every time I came up, he thought
Fidel dotes gonna go to school and get real, but I was real and were just in an entirely different. reality? Then islands right so So I came up on the success and got a gig singing in fort lauderdale ill house, pegasus of a small group of girls formed as scott fagin fan, club and scribbled up fifty dollars and bought me bus ticket to new york. Now, kids, too, oh yay, glad that you are a charmer. I was very pretty and I sang he. He he he really sweetly yeah. I'll do it, and I m, am I like them and they like me, any ended. That was the whole story Maybe there was some share jealousy in the fan club, and maybe the best thing to do is get rid of this guy
he get an new your area any, so one day that too, and my mother had a friend who had a friend of a friend of the ex wife of a cousin in law chanting whose and rope song, sometimes with a guy named doc, pompous or something. I doubt but he s so ended. She said: take this phone number and call when you get to new york, andrea, and I wasn't inclined to do anything that an adult suggested, but I took them. her with me not know you doc. Pumice was no I had I, many king album setting their rang. I never looked at the louvre get there, and I call this number here and there
Ok come on over. Let me see what you got is the guy not doc? No, this is how you got dogs many call em up area that the number my mother gave no doubt upon you, no kin doc pompous, that's what it call them well at the three times. before. I heard it really got a correction. Now, where was he when you went to see at the forum hotel on forty nine sweet just across the street from the bridge building and he was a big present sech a right. It was a big Presently they literally also riah. Here he was sitting naked, in the middle of a huge double bad here, wrapped up in a toga I mean the sheet the really lawyer smoking a cigar. Probably here so you is there he says come on. Let me see where you got lemme see what you got. So there is a piano bench at the end of the bed, yeah
were more children had ridden all these melodies and bloodline. His writing finery our later right behind them there and they had They re every magic, my right to road, teenager and low riva last vigo, vegas little sister, o kindness of anyway, Let me see where you got till I sit there and my little guitar and I sing and three songs and at the end he says, takes beat tell you what I'm gonna do. I'm your man sign it personal management, and assign is it a production can go downstairs. Give you a room come on back here. Let's get started really just like the anywhere what nineteen the few days
until nineteen and you had no at that moment, you still owe you a reckoning with well, not really, I I understood now that doc was an important songwriter but I had no idea of the depth of the catalogue, I didn't know anything about his partner, more human, nea and Morton. I became very close and darkened, however, Both know ever lived in a magical, parallel. The universe. down in ireland on the sale boat, with checks, blah blah right, you're pre hippy breathe freely. while we were definitely free spiraea and these were maybe the earliest date. Happy dumb Marianne duffy's was hippy central rang for the caribbean right just
fantastic fantastically so, as EU relationship evolves, so you get to work, you get your room yet, yet you get your management. He gets here. Whatever when I thought, of course, this is the way it was a happen. Of course it like that yeah I got a little lucky, but anyway I had no idea what a score So how did the relationship evolve between you know you and doc, and more, and I mean you go up there and when it start become apparent to you, Where did you learn well said? Go the room and come back here to get started yet so that's it The main idea I put my blood suitcase down in their basically sand and rocks in it. It came back again and dark was the central attraction and the forest hotel
sent me over to deliver. Yea did yeah this the build. This is the The demon runnion lived, a bulgarian, no damon when yeah he's right, and the browsing building scope. over there robs. I went over up to that Helen range, half all cases, the professional manager there ya go, introduce herself to Paul case blah blah. Let him show you round come back over and if doc was at a writing session, I was to participate in that. If there was a song to be demoed, I was the guy that sang it and sang it. Yeah yeah. They wanted me to get accustomed to working in the studio right away,
you know studios can be fairly stressful. Let clock is on the wall. Yeah, they got an hour. You met a comedy with three tunes in a studio in the brill building, know of and associated and above the metropole metropole was a ah interesting. Chaz bar ass, haven't avenue, yeah upstairs was associated, sounds lots, allows hits, were gently done most of the other, that the promise and shoes it's we're done there and and what leiber and stoller and stuff all of them yeah? So what was actually going on in the brill building when you went over there I mean this is what year is this nineteen sixty four? Oh, my god october later, I remember when you went over there was it: where did you feel the juice I mean? Was there a lock all yeah yeah? You know I leiber and stoller wrote every tune that doc and Marty didn't write.
Right and carol. King got in and get the governing kingdom right so they were, there were all over there, the area and dumb diamond. Well, now, it came a little late, okay, okay and and wasn't with the goffin and can was at a different producer or another male female songwriting than that curricle so those of those in power players. Certainly, if the though a fifties right- and jerry rag avoid jerry, wrote cry cry: baby yeah! I wrote pisa, my heart o my cat oil gas joplin. Just tour that whenever I fully share so very quickly. I came.
and with the title le cry down my tears, run dry and doktor ok come on, let's ride it so dark and martin. I wrote this cry: tell my tears, run jai, jerry rag of or you arranged and produced it with irma. Was now. Is it your eyes? The buy it now is that you are part of the writing screw it. While you were not idle, warned and my contributions year, god bless him, then they got me brighton, with ah- and it's a wonderful, wonderful record, you we hear it sometime The wrong said that it no longer beautiful, and this is you got twenty years old nineteen nineteen years old, the appended a tune with doc promise and more human. Well, I was living in the bushes before I got on that sailboat. I now debts is just a month ago, yet if you listen to the album, if you isn't, the sounded like woozy mean that the current of that styles,
I am writing alongside the calypso stuff and and some of the other beats you pulled up, you know from the caribbean. I mean there is a structure there. That, must all learn from, because what I did. I learned that structure from dokkan and mort You know when you're a young songwriter you get a little. dear foresaw a hawk and try to follow it, and yet and europe following the song here, you're, not clear about at the beginning. You don't know anything about a metal, yeah and god knows where it's going to end yeah and- and so they taught me very quickly. Well, when did those songs start coming together south atlantic blues, because that's the alamo now writing it right there in the forest soto to for a song that I worked on, there was the sound social hunted goose kay and those were songs that you're getting feedback from doc. And working a little bit more.
Morton. I wrote the tune and on the album, crystal ball: ok: the there's a minor. I co wrote a couple with the a young melody man. I've been sent over to work with doc, marked spent half of his ear and england with Andrew older men, those folks, the stones, yeah and and all kinds of other folks that all english music business then her more was part of no and come back and and and so no work much closer together in age and and when the split came, doc, docks, wife, fur dark and his wife were having trouble. Let out personal life took ms attention for quite a while and and
my mother was a homeless in miami. My younger brothers were and foster care, And- and I was there to do good work and change of world, but by god, rescue them here. So I couldn't for a go around. I can I, as that was your drive again, make some money to say voluntarily, yeah yeah yeah so worm So more deny you were riding the other end and Joe coolest yeah. Really wonderful kid from new haven mia actually is. His name was Silvio Martinez. I had a mother was a native american from Venezuela. Illiterate who'd found their way to the state and married a greek dude, yeah name,
cool it, so I can name cocalus, so they had changed them. Jose Silvio martinez to joker colors are so John. I were were riding part. Then vienna. up and down the street you. Yet how so little Here there the next place get a fifty dollar advance on it. Yeah hope they did something that and get immediately to work writing another one and there were seven or eight publishing companies we could hustled tones to and and you didn't get credit yo. Now you know, we know that we are you do not sell your songs. You you taken advance against royalties so you make money doing that fifty dollars a tomb, yeah
were living on the floor of a publishing company. Fifty seventh street yeah, I'm not allowed in their because clearly I'm a rascal s o winner bob hildyard company bob is a guy that wrote this fantastic song any day. Now how yeah chuck jack leah. Anyway, when bob came, I had to hide in the closet and at night we can't sleep. All we had. The eet was a bottle of tequila na ha anyway. Fortunately yeah yeah, so So what's good, so we wrote a bunch of really good tones, that before its hope, blues for the album so now wants. You got all the songs for the record. What was done it's for the record. Well, was apparently had only songs, leah and I'm living at
the Earl hotel down a village which is where people it makes, very little money live. We got off the the publishing house. Yeah I've got a move ass, our up the idea and gigging at a place called the coffee. Google, Algeria anyway there were three of us regulars at the cafe Google MIA other was richie Jimmy James and the blue flames, its jimi hendrix before chancellor chandler, grabbed him. So so work or work in that the cover go, go, get five dollars and night one night howling wolf comes through and I told him not a fan boy right just I'm just not. I mean I'll, be a fan, Frankie Lyman, where we have found for billie holiday guy, but
generally shared! That's not my on turkey and I relate so. Oh well and move comes to gear and does smokestack lightning another till you're, a man. So so after I actually decide, I'm gonna go thank him and can gradually mr wolf and is a giant in nine frito yeah, I and an end is any sticks. His pink here, which is the size of my wrist and that's what you're supposed to grab a high had taken india. So I did that and of course, at cured me for being a fan board for another ten years, it can help move, pinkie, yeah, yeah, yeah yeah, with gratitude, so we're to cafe go, go and her guard and a manager and folk rock folk.
comedy comes in and after my said, he comes over to me, says scott. I've got this I know guy blah blah blah blah few sign with me yet be bigger than presley in six months here and I manage buffy saint Mary so bigger than presley was interesting to me. Yeah those who are sceptical about about when he said he had buffy saint Mary here now. Is it just where design Joe. I sought out loved lavender my gun, you familiar I am familiar with it, but not in that way. I mean it was before my time, and maybe I didn't. I didn't know what the magic was. So I don't have- and I don't have any experience with it. Well, she was a really pressing singer na. See the person that wrote universal soldier and- and
codeine and yet a bunch of stuff, but it wasn't a singing near she's a native american, I think it a cree. The girl is fantastic, completely magical. Looking here, the sexy is looking check to me here. My were, though, wonderful p bottom. So what you know about the singing overboard I thought you was a great singer to buy confessing the area that was way more primitive. For me. That saw her manager approaches
It says in six months I'll be bigger than Elvis presley, and he said. Where do I sign at night and I well what when he said, I guy Mehmet baviaan, very bright idea that I might meet hey out of office, whether eke out. That's it that's what drove yet! Oh, you did drove me alone. I have to confess awful out of my work has been driven by affection for wenches and vice versa, ma dialogue and wenches to their faces. Well. Well, oh yeah. I call him everything, then only anything yet many times. Even Mary will have five children with four women for different women have been married once a hooker but this is how we do it in the islands and is how you do it. So, yes, I would,
I signed with them and and we got to work on south atlantic glues, yeah told her was executive, produce weapons of lending blues, he brought in elmer gordon too to produce it. so where wherein there and and Elmer has is beautiful, weather the girl. That's coming the rehearsal gee, I'm going down the way, www place meeting Omer were morgan out vocal stuff and I unknown. I ran off with almost girlfriend get good It says for the night he aches for the night time went: okay, anyways, the redhead, oh god, you're beautiful, beautiful new york girl,
users girlfriend yeah and look at a lark, music's, music, buddy yeah. I hear you and you're not going to yeah. I guess so. Boy aged spoke, that a smart guy unworldly other dates, got pregnant anyway, you're not alone, and I'm not sure it damages is what it is and that just in those days just the slightest hint of passion would take over yeah. It's I happening anymore well It takes a little more passion from losing me mine. Now, anyway. So so I humble miss, oh for thou merlin lord almighty, we get back to a working relationship, shit yeah. elmers coming to the music and committed to doing a job at some dude. Here he was really something
and then another check comes in a picture of his wife was is a beautiful blonde woman, from Ohio who was real crush she'd runner from her husband to come, see, elmer and and movie wound up together. Elmer takes another shot? So what happened after that will guide he or decided to go back to ohio does, and so I have to try and cancer, with Elmer again. How many may weeks were between these two just a couple weeks, There was the imperative of finishing the record, not making it easy anywhere. So as I say, the elmer
don't bring anymore. Women are a happy and I say: well what can I do to make it up to you? We will we went to see janis Joplin together at the andersson, theater, and maybe it's nineteenth seven, while sir, What can I do to make it up to you and me look that me and those talks Gary visage yeah? I said what can I do awaited Gallagher, falcon self. I did well known. I can do that by. Are you really I'm sorry anyway? So so we to give elmer a special consideration, thanks for four overcoming his outrage broken heart and and doing such a good job with south to be continued on a dead is still around her. Nor You know we we became great,
and then we were great friends. Just I mean, maybe I guess he knew look I you know. I can't plain it other than realistically, I would follow a czech anywhere near welcoming period happens three finish the record. We finish the work, her beautiful record you both now it special yeah yeah yeah, most folks around or thinking this is this is this is a really good so I apple records as holding it so there are trying to decide between south landed blues and james tailored first album, yet and down, and it's going on and on and on and on and on
there's a there's, another very hot label at the time and verve forecast, which is the focus global yeah and jerry shown bomb as the present that labels on that level, all of them- of all tim harden or all of the blues, project every area. So jerry shown mom is the head of the label. He says I want the record I'm going to be the new present at two echo and I want to take the record with me away my first release at outcome. They were do they did so records and drifters were on many king so guys? Yes, I'm with em yeah, yeah, fuck apple, we we gotta move Jimmy, I Asher
and dumb and god bless the beetle. But problem not a fan boy not die. First, no pink, shaking with John Paul Georgia Ringo, wont load, you can download- are taken pinkies yet with them. eating a malaria wait they impaired. My brothers are and foster care near my mother's homeless, woman in key west here, or dinner key or of yet always sign with that call and and and tat thrilled. I mean this is really gonna, be something and needs: those the record and bang jerry, never come to turn on his own contract after you signed with actual so booth, is gone off to qualify to land where I dont know very apologize, Well, I've never seen him again now probably felt bad about it.
So jerry's gone, so our album, as now stuck with the without trial and no support Well, no I mean the last thing anyone's going. Gonna do has promote the previous, though the other guys. the guy there was an ever their urine and plus they have their own favourite right. It so get lost in the middle. Well, it was released but term There was no. There was no promotion. Blab look at anyway, so Where would doubt have yields? No I've heard it. I heard you yeah so so I felt, of course, deeply upset above you think gee. I ever gonna build right, this minute, good songs! Again, am I ever gonna get another deal, and I can't rerecord need these zones for seven. reason blah blah blah
and our advance against royalties stopped and bloodless, so so no money, no tour known animal Amy and a baby, no moving. I record to siblings and struck her mothers, homeless, yeah baby holy shit so so fortunately we'd interested to build, cries alaska. Who was a it, was the lawyer that wrote this business of music one and two and three and a great great lo everything lawyer reactor and he got a deal for us, some at tommy, rolando, music, Tom the lander was a big musical show publisher, so were so were signed as writers, their joel musicals. Well, we're gonna write songs, within the first week or so
The professional managers that serve J, Morgenstern and frank military yeah. What Here are materially get familiar with it So on there, with the guitar sing and Joe just written a sancho, hideaway yeah, really nice powerful tone, not the instrumental right and and so jobs does it am. I want you to hear that, sir, when you to hear this, We're workin on a rock opera played some important owed so Joe convince them that the song I'd away is piece of a rock opera. That word again, yeah good hustle that do you was a beauty. its overwhelming, though they here I'd away in it's terrific and you know so well, They they have the heart, oh team. Here all the rest of the guys were much older and establish you can pay oh yeah I'll get
yeah. So the kids eaten you get money to your siblings, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, okay, and when I got the advance for signing with the with Atco, I bought them each a bike. my sweden, I went home. I took my sister back here and we made a triumphant tour of the bar. A child and a mug and and bought the boys, a bicycle each and really well your mother months somewhere yes, no! No were somewhere near if you're in iraq opera. Well, so now we're writing a rock opera that has never been Iraq operate. This point there has been no rock opera, there's been
I thought about writing a rock opera late. I've never even seen the musical exemplary. So was I install right so in the theater and now guides bell now: Jesus Christ, you know Tommy none them nothing anyway, so one so weird discussing what we're gonna write and blood love. The you know with this is a anti war time. Yet people We are out on the street yet protests in my partner nine, trying to make change in the world. So what we design we're gonna do is is tell us. Story of the music business. What it like what it really does the arduous? What did the impact it has on the society nea? What kind of coward Cars are shaping everyone's deston and you ve got a lot of fresh bile gear, wigan a right this then, and and
it's gonna, be the follow up to the two. south atlantic blues yeah, and it's gonna change the music business. Gallagher fuck you and yeah- oh yeah, yeah a whole lot of that here soon. Also yet really. anyway. So so we write this fabulous pisa work there, not a entertainment here. This is, and and and and exposure of the dishonesty and ridiculous characters that to that that run the ship air. So we have in much the score and and Vicki sue Robinson and I are are doing the vocals dancing and the tunes yeah Vicki is our our dear dear friend.
and so we we entrust abner bronfman, the owner of sea whims, and so we ve got them on board and blah blah blah and before we know wherein an anderson theatre. Where would seem jazz? Joplin, yes, doing rehearsals and we're on our way to the ritz theatre on forty eight between broadway and ate them ah, and this peace is gonna change the music business and- and it's gonna be the follow up to south alone blues here and if they didn't get south atlantic blues. They're gonna get their thea anna and so do the the producers want certain changes, as so they can pre Gets the right the ladys are common on sir, on wednesdays and tuesdays a mandate yeah they're nice lay.
these very low here, theatre, lady, yes and that's a fine, yeah. I know, but it wasn't fine in that time. In that moment now, you guys had something to do. No, no we're serious and that's how we wouldn't make the changes they want to share You're, so so, was doing the lead and and so we were fired and barred from the theatre. The director Who was our co writer robbie robert green mall too? gone on to do wonderful things with the with brave new films he one it's doing. He is the guy that did the burning bed and the love canal and all that stuff And, and so were barred from the theory bring some neighbouring Joe Friedman in who was an early directive. Hair TAT make it an entertainment,
and they fire me and bring bury boss, took in whose theatre got here and making our picture and- and so they go back into rehearsal on this score. really really very good. We had the best cas imaginable. My under study was richard gear Yeah yeah peter Alan played the manager, no kin yeah, Jackie robinson, no carter. These are great, If the graves are you so you do, you can go in the theater, but you still rotating yeah, yeah, roberta's, flame and angry air. Robert's father is a psychiatrist. His mother is a psychologist. Robert is, Live it so cool is, and I are trying to talk our friend download but come on, man, we will figure it out.
Peace and love, love, blah blah roberts as fuck that shit I'm gettin haven josie why you can't be ironic. That is a fact that shit, I'm using my anger, is father. The psychiatrist said I told him they all. You got a direct that anger that anger, oh, really move your long here as mother concurred with that. So I Robert used at erected sublimated that anger towards becoming successfully as it does, that come on, I'm gonna get even I'm gonna get successful role. When one a totally with the eight misbehaving, fiercely with no coward yeah yeah anyway. So he wound about the centre theatre group here damn and gordon davidson was in new york and- and I was invited up to his hotel room to sing the score
for which I shall soon here, so we we came out here and did it at the pilgrim unrighted or that seventy two yeah yeah go over? really well I'll get, but we didn't get it recorded wooden. joan I will immediately fired from, a writing gig right and dropped year. I dropped from my deal with the epic that was after acca, yes and no recording exists of it. Well, we did a little less recording honour on a whirlwind, sack and cosette a very rough in which I tried to clean up yet, not long ago in new york, who understood your long time, trying to get it cleaned up and I got a call one day or email from you know.
As a parallel universe of broadway collectors. Yeah. That's all that exists in the universe. Is people let collect broadway stuff, yeah. So one of them called me, just as we are doing. than a recording the song. Can I have what are you gonna blow I said no there's no recording said oh yeah, while a guy just donated his collection to the library of congress and there's a recording as soon and it turned out that terms. A dude had stuffed a cassette, in his inside over her pocket and recorded net theatre there in its fullest snuff, folds and burkina near enough. It's there. You know yet I dont want to me my legacy in the library of congress because it to our pieces sung through national dialogue right and I brought this dude in and stuff
in all this square dialogue here, blah blah blah stuff that is too amusing to the tuesday, afternoon, layers with another reason, the actual way after gets on recorded sound, and I will anyway, so I wrote the like call the library of congress and they sent it on me and I have at their next to the california recording and- and I think that to Chris campion candidate out. I think that, gonna get it re released. So you do that. You do this soon and that doesn't go so not only did not go it sunk. My career, We were fired and barred and and and bang so we were back to were hustling tunes and and after the experience of soon cook, who was never wrote, another song, and what did you do? Well,
it songs and- and I sang in and mark fuck em, they're, not gonna. Turn me around they're, not gonna. Turn me around no, I've been at it all the time here, all the time out there, singing writing some of every grateful in the world. I have four five children and take care of him than theirs. there's nothing. I haven't done, except so we'd near dope, and yet don't do that but term, but some of everything. What is europe? What was it? moment of clarity. You know I a child and grandchild of alcohol here. So I do life and these eight marriages and my mother's swore war. I wouldn't
be like that yeah. I will never be like that right. I won't be like them and when I, when I discovered look, I had juice next to the bed, I could wake up in the morning without Joseph their cigarette button there too bad for them here how other cockroaches too bad for them. Here I mean member their died and I couldn't get over a mean. I couldn't after you, maharajah new york, yeah. I was an island doing a gig here we came back the second. There were back and he comes running up. I ever mike twins, lillian archie, their mother's name is any here running up said certain abner mud, so We go down there and she s gone couple.
and so let me mother your more Does anyone else bottom, but I you know I've been on a long gig in the islands and and drinking hard and and and when she died, and I just somehow You know a tolerance grows near the ears and then suddenly collapses, and there you left stronger. Your left addicted with no ability to tolerate or process at near, so that was estate drug course. I didn't know that right, That was a stay day. I had lost my tolerant, but I was addicted to the substance. and I couldn't get over. I mean people were. I couldn't write that song. I can concentrate enough to write. people were wanting
me to do work come on scout dual vocal here for us love, love, love, butler and I realized tat I had become doubt- which I despise most and I'm standing, In the window, we had the beautiful all bounds on one windows around the corner sums, and then with my twins in my arms there a year and a half old or something and I'm thinking I should jump out the window and and and I got so disgusted with myself for my grandfather by the way had
after his car in front of a train and committed suicide, when my mother and her twin were nine years old and and they'd never gotten over it. So I'm thinking this and I'm saying, and I'm completely disgusted with my cowardice, I'm thinking to kill myself and and and and and fact all these children forever, rather than confessing, that I'd become, strung out on the juice and had to let it go. So I did I did that whether I never laughed again whether I never sang again I was gonna, be more for these children, then my people had been for me any day and by it the two miracle, and when did you find out about stephen merit
oh yeah magnetic fields, I'm in oxford, mississippi we do enough. May the mother of my youngest near my youngest. girl here holiday and I she's gone two oh miss eyre so my ex wife, Annie cold, I sure do get on a radio saying you're as fodder. What's gonna happen. So warm barely stephen was on fresh air carrier, terry grey area, and had announced that to his father was scott fagin. He never reach out to you know he already. I think that was reach out that was so a friend of an these had heard this and
I told Annie and Annie went ballistic, even though she's my ex wife, and I'm with that, no woman and no child yeah, look people love each other share and and express it in this dangerous toys and have no animosity towards anyone, and the fact is, I failed every one of them here that every one of them thought I was it was the man who was going to change. Your lives clearly is going to be successful and I and I disappointed every one of them so and I wish to god that I hadn't disappointed them and I hope to god that I can do something to change everyone's going forward. Anyone who reads this kid saying europe, father so on so
I call the track down and they put me in touch with a booking agency in chicago red rider assumption on they put me in touch with Claudia danton, whose stevens manager and a drummer in the band great great woman, and so we began the corresponding you in favour and he's a he's. A great musician is too but I have to tell you the muse doesn't start with me right. My pop was of great singer right and I a great tenor. Mfa. You didn't know this sunday, yours and answer your emailing and with the house it unfold outvoting so and button.
the father's mother yeah was an orphan girl from scotland and was a ballroom singer or people that died in the spanish flu. So the music goes back on that side, then the other side, and- and so there's this kid. So we start this correspondence and They're just releasing this album. Sixty nine love song yeah. So wherein oxford mississippi, which is a interests implosion, I been admirals falconers from yeah, yeah, yeah, really interesting areas and the greatest little bookstore in the south is right there on the square near and they have a little ice cream power. Upstairs is router. You little dish a little dish of ice, clear. I take mine, little girl holiday there and we sit there and books and cape verde, iceland. here anyway. So I went to
a little record store there and bought this album, sixty nine low, so yeah. and I put it on and it was these changes feeling every one of those tunes every one of the songs seem to me like something I'd started an finished. Yet why I wouldn't turn it way. I would have taken it this way and news is, singing in my baritone. He I couldn't freakin believe I couldn't believe it in the year sixty nothing cell. For god's sake, and did you did you like the record? Well, I did because he's a great writer and- and I I'm scared, what I like that vocal till the here and now have relationship with them, so
A year to later we got his mother involved in the relation to bolster Who now is that women in the islands raises the yet the flying with the area for formats so he was actually planted on the houseboat in Saint thomas anyway, so we're doing a movie about dark promise, and and I was invited to be part of that and I went to new york for some did some and our views and dead, maybe some ten minutes in the film or something and so they're going to do the premier at lincoln centre, yeah, so
I said well this my beard interests in time for them, because the mom knows doc, promise and- and- and I hear the same structure you are talking about in my songs then his own. So I hear and influence of that, whether it's real, not that that I hear the near outside so I invite them to come to the premier and by god, sitting there and- and up comes this perfectly straight looking woman and her late sixties who the hell is that this is a I used collar, lotus, blossom diamond island each year to year actually in english teacher and and the name is out,
now, and then here comes a kid that looks surprisingly like me sure not lessened erasing were here o o with a bodyguard. He had brought a bodyguard along very funny. I mean he use has looking view the boarding, maybe does god knows what I might need a kidney or something anyway. So we we met in and had a great time match and then we met again when it opened in the movie down in a theater down and east village,
and a lotta email and- and we met again at a couple more times and spend a fair amount of time with the alex and we email back comments ha that's great yea. will do some work someday. Well, that's a great story. Man in india survived in yourselves and he doing good things for the sober people he still make. Music in this record is rediscovered as front. And and- and I think that most of my success can be traced, the fact them My mother made me promise to always be nice, how's your voice, good, holding up and yet surprisingly, well, I've been singing. I do vocalize over time. Great, been singing all do these years
and I m really I'm really happy to say it is really a meanness. Little graphs. From deal with you. I shouldn't ever do not allow non idea. I was curious here messes with the pipes but yeah, thank goodness marco, oh yeah, in his good taste, god is, is a hell of a story. I'm sure is a lot more and I'm just happy that you have. This turn happened you know you you definitely paid you do me. well you know. All I did was do my best and be nice and by god to find new. That was the key to success. I d done long ago. Well, thanks for dark enemy, my pleasure thanks for having ok, I get their record. It's beautiful! You can do that today, yea, it's nice and I'll. Take you someplace and it'll be sweet on thanksgiving
so again- go to wtf pod dot com for you, wtf pod needs goes wtf, pod tour dot com. I got upcoming dates in the spring, but summer. Third in Chicago also come back tomorrow, check your bike. High speed for some new, we got some surprise is every friday for the rest of the year so check out. I think you're gonna like it here. Go into the box that. I didn't even know existed play. Guitar could be nice, so make a nice. she'll make it shall lean in yeah, the
the? I screwed up a little abbe thanks giving bomer labs.
Transcript generated on 2022-09-04.